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Flip the Script with Vic is a sacred space for real conversations with real women 🩷 Hosted by Victoria Nielsen—intuitive healer, mama, and space-holder for the divine feminine—this podcast amplifies women’s voices through raw interviews, intimate solocasts, and unfiltered conversations on motherhood, mysticism, psychedelics, ancestral healing, spirituality, identity, and more.
What began as a personal exploration is now a communal prayer: a gathering place for cycle-breakers, mothers, mystics, creatives, witches, and wild ones redefining what it means to be a woman in today’s world.
Every episode is an invitation to remember that your voice matters. That your truth matters. Together, we walk in beauty, become the prayer, and flip the script.
Hello, hello, hello.Welcome to the latest episode of Flip the Script with Vic.It's your host, Victoria Nielson.As always, I have some of the most amazing women that I get to share with you all, that I get to just blab with, connect with, reconnect with.And one of those beautiful women today is Kat White.She is a breathwork facilitator, a mentor, a former marine biologist, and we were in the same cohort of breathwork training.God, it feels like that was so long ago, Kat.I know.I'm like, "How many years was that now?"I'm trying to do the math.I know.I think- Was it 4, was it 4 years ago?Yeah, something like that 'cause it was '22, I think.Yeah.So we, we were both trained, um, underneath Eva Johanna, who is fantastic, Academy of Breath.Uh, I think we maybe even did, like, another program of hers together.But I'm just really excited to get to catch up with you because you're doing really cool stuff, hosting retreats, and you just have such an interesting story and beautiful energy.I still remember the aura portrait that I created for you years ago.And if you- That was, like, so one of my favorite things.Oh, I love that.You guys, we might, I might have to put a, a link to it in the show notes 'cause Kat just, I mean, was, like, so majestic.There were, like, dolphins, like, all of this marine energy, and then it was like, "Oh, duh, of course, like, you're a marine biologist."And I don't think I even knew that at the time.Yeah, it makes sense.Um, but it was, it was really cool to feel all of that come true, come true, come through.So tell us then, what is the story of Kat?Like, don't leave out any details.How did you go from marine biology to breathwork?I feel like that's a bit of a jump.Yeah, it, it is.So I, I still technically am a marine biologist.I still actually do work with a nonprofit here in my area, um, studying marine mammals, so whales, dolphins, porpoises.So I'm, I'm literally like every girl's 8yearold dream, uh, in terms of the job that I get to do, um, which I'm incredibly grateful for.But yeah, it was so funny when you did that portrait for me 'cause I don't think we'd even talked about, 'cause I was really, you know, focused on building my breathwork business, and so I don't even think the marine biology had come up in conversation yet, and I was like, "Oh, of course this is what you channeled.This is actually what I do."Um, yeah, so I grew up in a really small island in northern Scotland, and, um, I grew up in the Shetland Islands.So that was incredible for being able to be out in the marine environment.I mean, that was our view.That was, you know, you can't go more than, like, 2 miles from the sea there because it's a really long, narrow island.And so I was exposed to marine mammals from a really young age, and that was just my passion.I was obsessed with it.I would, like, I had my little ID book at, like, 10, and I'd be like, "Okay, let me see if I can figure this out," total science nerd.Um- I love that.Like, "Is this this starfish?"Oh, yeah.Uh, yeah, that was me.That's soThat's fantastic.My kids now are, like, obsessed with dinosaurs and- Yeah, oh, man.yeah, know all the names and, like, all the, like, um, I'm fascinated.So I can totally see, like, little Kat being like, "This is the, you know, uh, the, the formal name, you know, this is like, or the scientific name of something," and just being so curious and adorable.I love that.When did you move from Scotland?I had no idea you started all the way over there.Yeah, so I, I was born in the US, moved to Scotland when I was about 5, um, and then I moved back here permanently in 2014, um, actually to, to pursue the marine biology stuff.I got a job out here.Um- Was that a culture shock?Honestly, no, 'cause I've always been really close to my American side of the family.Okay.So it's, it is a different culture for sure, especially I live on the West Coast of the US, so it's a lot more, like, relaxed here.But honestly, this is my, this is my spiritual home.Like, this is where I feel at home.Um, that's one of the reasons that I love it out here and I wanted to come back here is I had the opportunity to do an internship in this area when I was in, like, my third year of university, and I was like, "Oh, this is what people talk about when they talk about, like, feeling at home."Like, I'd never felt that before.I'd always been like, "My family's my home, my house is my home.This place is cool, my friends are my home," but, like, I'd never felt a physical location pull me like this one did.So incredibly fortunate to be able to be back in this space.And, um, yeah, so that was, that was, like I said, that was kind of my start was I really did pursue the marine biology side of things, specifically marine mammals was where my, my heart was.I wanted to study dolphins.I wanted to, like, figure out how they were communicating and how they were talking.And so, you know, I did go into marine acoustics and photo ID, so- That's a thing?That's a thing, yeah.Yeah, I know.So and it's, it's funny 'cause like, again, in hindsight, I'm like, "Oh, the connection with sound and breathing and, like, how these things come together, how we're all communicating, um, how can we communicate with one another?Are we using frequencies?"You know, so a lot of that is actually part of my background.Um, and it really wasn't until I moved here, I'd always been interested in health and wellness, um, from a very, very young age, but just on a personal level.And I was diagnosed with an autoimmune condition when I was 16, so really had to s- kind of pay more attention to my health and really advocate for myself from a young age around what I wanted to happen with my body versus not.So I think that really set me up well for diving into health and wellness as an adult and kind of really exploring that more fully.Um, and when I moved here to pursue the marine biology stuff, that was really the first time that I wasI mean, I'd lived as an adult before, but that was the first time that I felt in my mid-20s like, "Okay, I'm not at school.I'm not living, back with living with my parents.I'm out on my own.This is me living my adult life, and I get to create the life that I want."And really, you know, building in those health and wellness pieces, um, was really, really important for me, especially working a lot, and we built a nonprofit from, from scratch.So, like, IIt was a lot of working long hours alongside doing that, and so, you know, that really was a priority because it wasn't for a long time.You know, I- I really did burn myself out in a lot of ways and had to circle back to, "Okay, what am I doing?How can I better support my body?"Um, and that just led me down the rabbit hole of, you know, the- the more I got into it, the more interested I became, the more I wanted to share that with other people and support other people in, "Hey, here's how you can follow your dreams while also supporting yourself along the way.It doesn't have to be either/or."Exactly.'Cause we were never taught any of those things.Yeah.And, you know, you and I were both, I feel like, raised in the- the hustle culture of, like, be a girlboss, work really hard, you're gonna get where you wanna go.And, you know, some of that was true, but, uh, a lot of us created some really bad habits, or I did anyway, you know?And so, I love that we're all coming back to kind of, uh, the same ancient tools that are really practical, really helpful, and really actually make us present in our bodies again.Because, you know, I don't know about for you, but I feel like there was so many years of finding myself- Mm-hmm.and listening to that external validation or needing someone outside of myself to confirm things that I didn't know how to listen to within my body.And so, it sounds like you, from a young age, like, you know, had your sovereignty, knew your boundy- like, boundaries.Like, kudos to you, because I feel like that took me a really, like, long time to get to.But I love hearing all the steps of your story, because you're right, they weave together now, and like, without each thing, you wouldn't be where you are today, you know, leading cohorts of- of breath work at retreats, and- and everything that you're doing, you know?What was theWas there, like, a specific moment, I guess, during kind of the, everything going on with your autoimmune, that you felt, like, a shift or a click?Um, you know, I- I feel like, uh, a lot of my clients that I talk to, they get to a moment where they're like, "I was just tired of my own shit."Or like, you know, "I- like, I was tired of feeling so bad, that I finally started to make the changes."Did you have any kind of moments like that, um, before you really started taking your- your health and wellness into your own hands?Yeah.Yeah.I mean, I think for me, it was- it was twofold actually, which is kind of interesting.So, when I wasWhat- what precipitated the autoimmune condition coming on was actually my mom passing away when I was 16, so that stressor really was- was what launched myself, la- launched my body into that autoimmune response.And what was so fascinating, again, in hindsight, but even in the moment, I remember being, at 16, with no, you know, no real awareness of health and wellness, no awareness of spirituality and energetics.I was raised in a very religious household, so that was all taboo, you know?We don't talk about any of that.And I remember having this moment when I was lying in bed and, like, couldn't move, and just thinking, like, "This is literally my body telling me, 'You need to stop and deal with what's happening.'" 'Cause I wasn't.I was very much in shutdown.I was like, "I want to ignore everything that just happened and pretend to be normal."And I remember just consciously having this moment of going, like, "Wow, your body is so smart, that it's literally forcing you to stop right now."And so that was kind of the first layer, I think, for me.And then, you know, post that, I wasI'm- I'm really, really fortunate, in that I- I don't have too many, like, long-term impacts that I, that I deal with on a regularIt doesn't really impact my life on a day-to-day basis, which I'm- I'm so grateful for.Um, but I think that was the first layer, and that really opened me up to more of the energetic side of things, of just the wisdom of the body, and just really becoming aware of like, how intuitive I was and how intuitive my body was.And when I listened to it, hey, maybe if you listened to it, you could've avoided all of this, um, that you went through, and it was necessary.I'm really, really grateful for that experience.But I think the second layer on top of that was then, you know, going through university, uh, quote unquote, "Achieving my goals," right?You know, getting the degree that I wanted and, "Okay, I'm- have this qualification.Now I can go do this thing."And then hitting up against that same thing, you know, doing the job that I wanted, but then hitting up against, "Hey, your body's giving you these cues that you're pushing too hard, you're doing too much, you're burning the candle at all ends, and you need to stop and slow down."And that was, I think, really once I'd moved here, living that kind of adult life and suddenly realizing, like, "This is not sustainable."Like, "I can't keep doing what I'm doing right now, or I will go back to that first point."So it was, it was kind of an interesting, like, multilayered process, I think, for me to get to that point of saying, like, "All right, time out.We gotta, we gotta make some changes here."Well, I feel like most of us, right, have to see the cycle at least a couple times, or I do, you know?Yeah.Like, I, I don't recognize it right away, but it's the same.Our bodies are always, always, always talking to us.And our energy is our responsibility, truly.It's no one else's, you know, um, they're not gonna come in and save us, or they're not gonna really be able to.Like, you have to be the one that alchemizes, and you have to be the one that listens.And the universe is gonna send you, like, little nods until it has to give you a really big nod, you know?Like recently, I had a flu turn into bronchitis, and, like- Hmm.I needed that message from the universe of slowing down, and also, the lungs are, are how you take in life.And I needed- Yeah.that message too about, like, being present, like, truly with what, you know, was in front of me.And so if I hadn't have listened, like, it could've gotten much worse.But hey, maybe I could've never had bronchitis to begin with, you know, if I had just slowed down to start with.Um, and we are always in that co-communication, that co-creation with the universe.And I feel like you, you realized that at a young age.Do you think that's because of, like, your studying of marine mammals and realizing, "Hey, they're all connected, but also, like, they're not very different than us.Like, we're doing all the same things, um, you know?They're doing it in the water, and we're doing it on land"?Yeah, yeah, 100%.And I think, I think, like you said at the start, I think I'd always viewed those 2 worlds in my life as being very separate.Like, here's my interest in health and wellness and breathwork, and here's my interest in marine mammals and science.And I'd always kind of partitioned the 2.But I think as I've gotten older, and I had some really beautiful reflections actually from a friend of mine once going like, "Oh, I can totally see the through line here.Like all you're doing is you're studying, like, the ecosystem of the human body or the marine mammal body.Like, that's the exact same thing.Like, you're doing the same thing in 2 different areas."And both of these are with the intention of increasing the health and vitality and resilience of the being, whether it's a marine mammal or a dolphin or whether it is a human body living and existing in this world.And so I think, yeah, absolutely, I've always seen us all as being and all beings as being very interconnected.Always loved animals, always been really connected to the wisdom that they can bring us and just observing nature.Um, so yeah, I think that was absolutely a big part of that for me.I love that.And when it comes to the breathwork, had you had a ton of experience with it before you decided to go get certified, or had you worked with Ava before or anything?Like I, I know I personally, I found kundalini yoga first- Mm-hmm.before I found breathwork.And I really liked the breathwork style, like kundalini kriyas, and so that's what really drew me into wanting to get, like, the breathwork training.Um, and then, you know, go on to the advanced practitioner training, because then you go down the rabbit hole of, like, the human body and, like, all of that.But d- had you experienced it before and you were like, "Ah, I know I want this," or were you one of those that just was like, "I'm trusting that I'm being drawn to this, and, like, it's gonna be amazing"?Um, little bit of both.So I, I had a really strong ping at the start of 2022, like breathwork, breathwork.It just kept dropping into my awareness.And so actually, one of the- I was in, like, a women's circle at the time, and one of the ladies in there had actually recently gotten certified through a different certification program.And she was like, "Hey, I'm gonna be leading some virtual sessions.I'd really love you guys to show up, because I don't have a following yet."And so I was like, "Yeah, sure, I'll, like, you know, come support you or whatever."And it was really intense.It was more of a holotropic style that we were doing, so it was really intense, and I was not expecting it.And it was one of those where I was like, "Okay, I'm feeling pulled to breathwork.Let me do this.I wanna support her.This is perfect."Roped my now-husband into doing it with me.I'm like, "Yeah, let's do this breathing thing together," and both of us afterwards were like, "Whoa, that was a lot.Okay."And so I actually was like, I had to take a step back from it for a minute, because I was like, "All right, like, let me- I need to, you know, integrate what just happened but also, like, go through, okay, is this something that I want to explore?"'Cause it was really powerful, and I think it actually surprised me with how powerful it was just in the physical body.Um, but continued to have that ping, continued to have that pull of just- I just couldn't get it out of my field.And so I think, you know, I started doing some more sessions.I started kind of attending these virtual sessions with different people and just intaking different styles of breathwork, and I think I found Ava- she was doing some kind of, like, 30-day challenge, and I was- I was like I think that's how I found her too.I think, like- Yeah, I can't believe it was.it was what I originallyI don't remember what the theme of it was, but I just remember- Yeah.I was, like, Googling "breathwork people" at the time, and I was like, you know, trying to figure out, like, okay, a- now all of a sudden, I'm realizing there's different types of breathwork.Like, I didn't know that when I started.I was just like, "Breathwork, I don't know."Um, so I, I did the 30-day challenge with her, and it wasn't- I don't think it was even centered around the breathwork, but we were incorporating that into everything we were doing, and I loved it.Loved it.And so I think that was- after doing that with her, then I jumped into one of her masterminds, actually, before I did the certification, 'cause I think- Was it Catalyst?Were we in Catalyst?It was Catalyst, yeah.Okay, 'cause I was like, wait, I thought we were in Catalyst together.Okay, that makes sense.Yeah.So then maybe I had done my training first.I don't know, it was all around the same time.Like, I did multiple things- Right.with her back to back to back.Yeah, same, same.So I did that first, 'cause I actually never had any intention to become certified.I, I honestly was like, this is just a- And I was already a health coach at that point.I'd gotten certified as a, as a holistic health coach, so I was like, "That's great.I'll just do this for myself so that I can hold better space for my clients, I can, you know, manage my stress levels."And the deeper I went into it, the more I practiced, the more I was like, "I can't not share this.Like, that's"I c- I can't, I can't, you know, gatekeep this but I wanted to make sure that I had a really solid foundation.I wanted to make sure that I went through a training that I was reallyI understood how to hold space for clients through that process.So, that was when I eventually dived into, um, Academy of Breath with her.Yeah.And- And then now have like multiple other certifications in breathwork at this point-'cause ex- like you said, it's a rabbit hole.So once you start going down that rabbit hole, it's like, "Ooh.""There's-" But I love- "so many places to go."Right.But no, but I love that you wanted to hold space really intentionally because I feel like almost that first session that you had with that person, like she probably didn't know that actually she should've warned you, like what could happen.And you know, anyone listening, if you've never experienced breathwork before, it's, it is almostThey call it holotropic breathwork, this certain style that i- is a little bit like hallucinatory but you're like not reallyIt's, it's just arousing.It's very arousing to your nervous system and you can have different reactions.You can have tingling in your hands and your feet.You know, you can have headaches.Like you can have stomachaches, things like that.And I think it's really important as breathwork teachers to, to share that i- it may not always be comfortable and that that's okay, that actually it's part of the experience sometimes that, again, like these physical sensations you're feeling in your body are energy moving, um, you know, or are helping you shift something.Um, so IAre there any other like, not misconceptions but likeI think that was just a really good one to share of like sometimes when you go to a breathwork teacher, if they are not as well versed as someone like Kat, like ask.Like, "What am I gonna feel?""What is, what's gonna happen?"Um, because then people get scared off or they don't wanna do it again because they were like, "Whoa, that was a lot."Mm-hmm.Um, and the different styles I think matter too because I don't even think I'd heard of holotropic until after I had done something, you know, and like that one, the transformational breathwork is what they call that one a lot, um- Mm-hmm.is very different than just like sitting and doing breath of fire.Right.Exactly.Yeah, and I think that was a big, you know, that was a big catalyst for me to actually get certified is because I'm like I, I feel the power in this and I know there's something here for me but I want to bring this to people in a way that feels supportive and empowering, not like, not like this initiation or hazing that you need to go through in order to get to the next level, 'cause that often, I think, is how it comes across.And the number of people, I can't even tell you the number of people who have come to my classes and s- and come up to me afterwards and gone like, "Thank you so much because I did a breathwork session weeks ago, months ago, years ago and it completely "I w- like you said, they were completely scared off because it was, it was so, it was so overwhelming to their nervous system in that moment without really a lot of, um, awareness building first that they were, they were really overwhelmed and kind of scared of the whole thing.And so there's been a lot of people who have felt the pull but have actually kind of had the bounce back of like, "Oh, I had this experience that really wasn't supportive to me and now I'm not sure if I wanna touch that again," but there's so much value there.And like you said, just even naming that, that like, "Hey, this is gonna be energy moving through your body.Understand this is what you might experience."Really informing people, right, so they can make a conscious and aligned choice for themselves and letting people know there are multiple different styles of breathwork.Like there are styles that will support you but it might not be the mainstream one.It might not be the one that you see online all the time.Or the one that's like quote unquote sexy, you know?Like- Yeah.'cause it's really, it's not.Like when you're really doing like a good like breath of fire, fists of anger, like you're panting.You're like, "It doesn't look good."Like, you're really like-you know, just like letting yourself out there but the, the transformational breathwork, like I, I've had moments sometimes where like INot that I feel like I'm not in control of my body 'cause that's not true but I did have a moment once where like my neckI must have moved something really big in my neck and, uh, my neck just automatically kept going- Mm-hmm.side to side.And I am a breathwork facilitator.I understand how this works.Like I had a mo- moment of like, "Is my neck ever gonna stop doing this?"You know?And I was like, "Yes, Victoria."Like, you know, "It's going to stop eventually but like don't fight it.Just let yourYour body is naturally doing what it is meant to do.Your, your body naturally knows how to expend energy, move through energy, and that is through shaking.That is through repetitive movement.That is through, um, sensations that just maybe don't feel normal to you," you know, um- Yeah.and can be kind of overwhelming or scary.Uh, and, and this is not to scare anyone off breathwork, but I think this is an important conversation to have, because I too have had too many clients that walked into rooms, that they didn't know what they were getting into, and they didn't understand, um, and sometimes, yes, you are gonna go in a session and breathe for an hour.But sometimes, like, more is not more in these situations.Sometimes, you can get just as much and, like, if not more from, like, a shorter breathwork class, I feel like, than some of the ones that are, like, hours long.Mm-hmm.Yeah, and like you said, I think this is, this is in no way to scare anybody, but I think it's just, again, it's around that empowerment piece, and, and giving people that permission to, like you said, ask questions.You know, I think nobody wants to be the one that's like, "Hey, I have a question," you know, but in front of 40 people.But like, hey, ask the question.And I think, you know, I love that you shared your experience with, with the neck movement, because I think that is also really the importance of working with a facilitator, right?When you have someone there with you guiding you through, holding that space for you, it's a different level of support.You can have that person beside you saying, like, "Hey, I see you.You're safe.It's okay.Let this energy move through.Your body knows what it's doing."Like, just having that support and that, that guidance is so powerful, especially if you're new to breathwork, right?Having someone there to support you, hold the space for you, um, you know, bring you out gently if you are, you know, having a little bit too much of an activation response.They can bring you back to that grounded state.Um, so I think just really, yeah, just being discerning, and there's so much there forI truly believe that there is, like, breathwork is an incredible resource for everybody, but it'sAgain, it's just that informing and educating people on, "Hey, there's multiple different kinds.It doesn't have to look like this person's practice.Your practice gets to be your practice, and what is supportive for you right now, and that's gonna change and shift over time too."Exactly.Again, depending if you're pregnant, you're not pregnant, how you're feeling that day.What, what would you say are some of the biggest misconceptions maybe that you have seen, either in the spiritual co- coaching and holistic wellness space or around, like, breathwork and, and some of the kind of different things that we teach?I think, yeah, I think, you know, kind of in the, in the wellness space in general, but also I think specifically in the breathwork space, there is this misconception that, like you said, more is more.And it's especially for women and those who identify as women, like, it's, it's not.And really moving with that seasonal, I know that's a lot of what you talk about with your community too, but, like, allowing your body to move in seasons, allowing your body to trust where it's at right now.Like you said, maybe last month that transformational breathwork session, that breathwork detox session felt incredible, and you loved it.Maybe this month your nervous system needs a little bit more support, and maybe this month you're doing a really grounded alternate nostril breath every day, and that feels nourishing to you.So, I think, like, there's this idea that we need to add more biohacking and more things, more, always more things and more pieces for it to feel successful, in air quotes.I think a lot of times what is the most nourishing practice is simply the pause and listening to what your body needs right now and then having the tools to pull from and say, "Okay, right now, what feels nourishing is going for a long walk with my dog," and that's it, and that can be enough.So, I think there'sIt's getting away from a little bit of that, like, it almost feels kind of like the '90s bro gym culture to me-where it's kind of like, "You have to be doing these stacked sets, and you have to be doing whatever."You're trusting yourself.Like, I gotta habit stack it, make it the most efficient thing possible.Yeah, and I love the idea of that, and that works for some people, but I think, again, there is this tendency to then feel like you're not, quote unquote, "Doing it right," if you're not hitting all these steps and getting up at 4:00 AM and doing a 3hour wellness pro- protocol.Like, that is not real life for most people, right?So, just again, like, allowing that space and allowing that individuality and recognizing that what you need right now ismay well look different from what someone else needs.It may look different from what you needed yesterday and letting that be okay, and really just, yeah, just creating space around listening to ourselves and trusting what comes up.And I, I love that you're sharing that, 'cause it really reminded me of a retreat breathwork session I held once where some of the ladies were totally new to breathwork, and they almost were comparing their experiences to those around them.They were saying- Mm-hmm.like, "Oh, this woman is over here crying."You know, this 0 this woman was over here, like, shaking and moving, wh- and she felt bad because she was like, "I think I fell asleep."Like, she kind of, you know, like, she was like- Yeah."I don't think anything happened," you know?And another woman was like, uh, she said those exact words, "Am I doing it right?"And I really want all of us to, like, just get rid of those words from our vocabulary.Like, whatever's right to you is right, and to exactly your point, Kat, like, we have to start trusting our intuition, trusting our bodies, and trusting ourselves, and know that not every experience is gonna be like, oh my god, life changing.But that doesn't mean that it didn't serve its own purpose or that it's not- Mm-hmm.moving you forward on, like, your path and in your journey.Like, we, we can't have every single breathwork session be a transformational aha.That's just not how it works, you know?Like, to experience those high moments, you have to experience the low moments.You have to experience the in between, um, and it's a muscle like anything else.So, like, if you're super new to it and you don't know how your body is, is gonna respond to it or how it's anything, like, that's okay to let it be what is.And if that means you fell asleep, likeBeautiful.I still believe you receive when you fall asleep, you know?Like, it's what you needed.Yeah.Yeah, 100%.Yeah, thank you for sharing that, 'cause I think that is such a valid point, and I- one of my mentors always says that.Like, no breath work session will ever look the same as the previous one.So every single session you have is going to look and feel different, and there's value in every single one.Just because it's not this- y- like you said, it's not this massive cathartic release, or it's not this, like, "Oh my gosh, I just know exactly what everything in the world is.Everything's in alignment."You know?Like, just because it's not that, some of the most profound sessions that I've had personally have been really quiet sessions.Like, there wasn't any big release.I was just in flow, and I was able to receive exactly what I needed and again, just really, like you said, getting away from that perfectionism, which we're taught, right?This is not something that is, you know, coming out of nowhere.We're- we're really encouraged to continue to think in that space, so I think really giving ourselves permission, being curious, letting it be playful, letting it be a practice.And I- I love when people tell me they've fallen asleep.I'm like, "Oh, you just did a conscious reset.That's all."Like, y- you're like a c- computer.You just needed to power off and then, like, power back on.You weren't really asleep.You were just resetting yourself, you know?Oh my God.So there's value in all of it.I'm gonna steal that.Like, that's- but it's so true.It was like, the body was like, "I'm gonna reboot."Yeah, okay."Doo, doo, doo, doo, doo, doo, doo."Like, "Time to come back online."Yeah.Speaking of reboots, you are hosting a retreat in Costa Rica very soon.Tell us all the things.So I am- I am not technically hosting it.I'm going- Oh.I'm going to one.G- going to one?Yeah.Okay, well I'm just manifesting that you're hosting 11 day.I'm going to one.I mean, that's the plan.That is the plan.Yeah, I do- that is on my bucket list for this year.I really would love to start, um, actively hosting retreats.But yes, I'm going with one of my breath work mentors, actually, um, and a couple of my- my friends from that breath work community that I'm part of in Costa Rica.So that's gonna be a really powerful experience for me as a practitioner.Um, I'm really, really excited to see what that holds and just exploring that- that deeper space of being able to be in connection together.I think it's so important, you know, especially those of us that are facilitators, coaches, healers.W- we need healers too.Yeah.We need coaches too.We need retreats too.You know, I feel like we can get so caught up in, like, the hosting of things that it's- it's really nice to be the receiver, and actually, I think the best practitioners have a mix of that giving and receiving because we know that, well, A, we can't pour from an empty cup, but B, it- we can go deeper when we have someone else holding the space for us.You know?SoYeah.Eh- that's just unparalleled, I feel like.Yeah, 100%, and I think that is something that- that I guess, actually, you know, speaking to your previous point, like, I think that's another misconception, right?Is that, like, we as facilitators have to always be the one holding the space in order for it to be, you know, worthy or in order to- for us to feel like we're doing something that's supporting our business.No, absolutely not.Like- like you said, some of the most profound and the most expansive experiences for you as a facilitator, as a coach, as a mentor come from being the receiver of that experience, because then you know how to bring that to other people.So like you said, not only are you then feeling fuller and more able to give because you've supported yourself and your nervous system first, but you also know how to hold that space better because you've been there.I really feel like we get initiated along the way because th- the universe is like, "Oh, you're gonna teach this to other people?Oh, cool."Like, "Hold my beer.Now you gotta go experience this, this, and this."LikeYeah, 100%.100%, yes, and that has also been my experience, for sure.Every time.Yeah, sometimes you're like, "An- another initiation."Like, "Okay, fineIf I have to."Yeah, I think it was- I think it was Ava who shared that in one of our- one of our sessions, but, um, sharing that yeah, if you're gonna- if you're gonna teach something, start to notice, because that's gonna show up for you in tests.You're gonna start to experience a lot of up-leveling yourself around that, which requires you to be initiated a little bit.Um, and so I think, you know, for me, moving into this next phase of my business, holding retreats, holding space in that different way, this is my initiation, to really, "Okay, let me go receive that medicine.Let me go receive from these people that I trust in this incredible place, um, and see how I want to bring that to life for other people and see what medicine there is there for me to receive first so that I can be ready to do that."that.Is there anything else about breathwork, life, otherwise, that's just on your heart today to share with listeners or to chat about?I feel like you are just such a beautiful wealth of knowledge and such a channel, if you don't already, like, feel that you are.I can- I- as you were talking this whole time, I'm like, "She's channeling.This is beautiful."Yeah.Thank you for reflecting that.I- it is fun.I think that's one of my favorite things about breathwork is I- I go into, like, a completely different place.I've had so many people come up to me.I teach classes in my community here, and so many times people come up to me afterwards, they're like, "Oh my gosh, that one line that you said, like, could you repeat that for me 'cause that really landed."And I'm like, "Nope."I'm like, "Sorry."I don't even know what I said.Yeah, literally, I'm like in- in the most, you know- I- I don't know how to phrase this, but like, "Yeah, that's- I- that wasn't really coming from me, so I'm really glad that it landed and you took whatever you needed to take from it, but, um, no, I can't verbatim that back to you."Sorry.But it's such an amazing place to be at, right, to be able to hold that space and just be that channel for the wisdom and guidance that needs to come through.For whoever's present there, that's always my prayer before I go into a breathwork session is that, you know, let me be able to be a pure and clear channel for whoever is there and whatever they need to receive, and that truly, for me, is- that makes everything worth it.That is the power of this practice, is that it's you doing it, it's your breath, but having that guide and facilitator there to support you and help to facilitate that experience allows you to just go that much deeper.Absolutely.Well, thank you so much for joining us today, Kat.I- I just love chatting all things breathwork and- and just getting to reconnect with you and share your story.And where can folks connect?Where can they schedule time with you?What is the best way to get in touch?Yeah, uh, thank you for having me, first of all.This was such a, like, serendipitous reconnection too.It's been so fun to- Yeah.to- to touch base.Um, so yes, you can find me on Instagram.That's where I'm the most active.Uh, my handle is @nourishedrootshealth, all one word, and you can find lots of information about how to work with me on my website, nourishedrootshealth.com.I am opening up spaces for my new somatic membership, um, called The Expansion Portal, so that is gonna be live.We were gonna start in winter, and then I realized, like, "That is not in alignment."We're starting spring, so you know, in real time, readjustment there happening, but, um, yeah, so spaces for that are open right now.We're gonna be launching in spring, and come join us there.We're gonna be moving through breathwork, really working with the seasonal energies, doing energetic forecasts and updates, um, lots of space to check in, build an aligned community inside of that space as well, so I would love to support you and welcome you in there too.Yay, and everything will be in the show notes, guys.Thank you so much for listening.If this conversation resonated, please like, share, subscribe, rate, review.Give this a listen again and again and again, or share it with other women so that they too can receive this medicine, receive the perspective of breathwork.And if you are looking to expand your intuition and connect even deeper with yourself, my group program, Akashic Awakening, that was supposed to start this week, is now moved to February because kind of same energy-but also, I was stuck in New York yesterday, so, um, we- we pivoted, so doors are open for that.There's still time to join.Um, you'll learn to access the Akashic records, and we'll move through your chakras.We'll do breathwork every single week, um, and connect in aligned community, as Kat said, so thank you guys for being here.Thanks so much, Kat.Be good to one another.I'll see you next week.