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Building a business shouldn't mean losing your mind.
Strategy, Solutions, & Sanity is the real-world business podcast for owners and leaders who are serious about scaling — but don't want to drown in chaos while doing it.
Host Samantha C. Prestidge cuts through the noise with practical insights on hiring, delegation, team building, operations, and leadership for family businesses and second-stage entrepreneurs.
(No vague "10x your mindset" fluff here — just the strategies, systems, and sanity moves you actually need.)
Each week, you'll get short, actionable episodes that help you untangle the bottlenecks, lead with more confidence, and build a company that runs smoother — without losing the heart, hustle, and humanity that made you successful in the first place.
Whether you're navigating early team growth or getting ready to finally step out of the daily grind, this podcast gives you the tactical tools and real-world advice to build your business the smart, sustainable way.
👉 Follow Strategy, Solutions, & Sanity for practical strategies to help you lead, grow, and actually enjoy your business again.
📍 Welcome to Strategy Solutions and Sanity, the show for owners who are done with chaos running the show. If you're trying to lead with confidence, build something that lasts and not lose your damn mind in the process, then you're in the right place. I'm Sam, your host and a business and team strategist. I help make the messy parts of business feel manageable from hiring people who actually get things done to building systems that won't blow up.
The second you take a vacation. We're gonna figure it all out together. So let's bring the strategy, the solutions, and most importantly, the sanity to your business.
📍 All right everyone. Welcome to Strategy Solutions, insanity. This show is all about showing how business can sometimes be messy. We gotta be vulnerable. Sometimes you fail and you can fail forward and, and bring the the strategy back to get your sanity back. So today's guest is Paige.
We, she is. CEO of a amazing marketing agency here in Colorado, tree Ring Digital, and I'm just super excited to dive into some things. Thanks for joining us today, Paige.
Yeah, absolutely. I'm looking forward to it. It'll be fun.
Yeah. Yeah. And so right before the show I was telling Paige, I'm like, oh, wow. We haven't connected one-on-one in a while.
And our past couple guests, I was pretty like. I was pretty sure what I like, what they were gonna say about like, what drives them insane in business. But today I feel like it's a total curve ball. So I'm, I'm trying to dig up all my impromptu skills right now. Uh, but let's just kick off with like Paige.
What drives you insane or like, what was a specific moment where you like lost your sanity in business, whether that was internal with team members or with yourself or external with a pain in the ass client. Oh man,
there's, you know, I wanna say there's been a lot, and at the same time, my bus business is enjoyable.
And some of it just comes along with, I think, right off the bat. You know, one of 'em that we've really, really worked hard on through the years is just how much like clients come to us and they're just like, I got this, I'm gonna handle it. And it's like. No, like we're putting crap out the door because of what we're receiving and like that piece just drives me insane when that was kind of where I went from like just strictly doing websites and letting clients handle the copy.
To like, I can build these in my sleep, like this is so easy, but it doesn't mean they look good. It doesn't mean like what we're putting out is a good website because I'm so limited by the photos that I'm receiving by the content that I'm receiving. And you can only do so much when that's happening. And so then that's when it was like, all right, we're gonna take that on now we're gonna get that off the client's plate so that we can keep moving.
And then, you know, same thing with the marketing. My site's not con uh, converting, it's not working. And I'm just like, it drives me insane of like. But what are you doing for marketing? Nothing. Hey, hey, now let's start red flag. So, you know, like we've really used those moments though of like what drives me insane and to like, how do we continue to develop and deepen the company and improve what we're putting out so that we do know that really, really good stuff is going out and we can stand behind it instead of like.
You hired me for a task like congratulations. That's what you get when you hire, you know, at the time of freelancer. And you are like, no, no, no. There's a reason you're working with us.
Yeah. Oh my gosh. And I feel like that is a trap that actually I think a lot of marketing agencies can fall into. And also I think consultants in general.
And what I mean by that is like, I think it's sometimes it's very easy for us to just focus on like. The boxes to check the deliverables, right? Rather than really stepping back to like, okay, what's the value we're supposed to be bringing? And like, what is that mission statement, right? And then when you have that kind of backed up bird's eye perspective, that more visionary perspective, then you can say, oh, then you can pivot of like, okay, the customer needs this, or the clients need this, the market is missing this and here's how we can fill it.
And I think sometimes, way too often, marketing agency or consultant or whomever. You get stuck in those tactical things and the deliverables rather than like, what does the client actually freaking need? Right. Right. It sounds like that was the evolution for you e
Exactly. Absolutely. It was like, because we would also get the one-off calls as we as grow, that was growing the company as far as, hey, I wanna do SEO because someone somewhere told me I need to be running SEO.
And it's like, to your point, I can check the boxes. I absolutely can. But it doesn't mean that's actually what your client needs. You're just hear or what you need. You're just hearing all of these things and just grasping for something instead of like having somebody actually listen to, but what are the goals?
What are, why are we doing this? What are we actually trying to achieve? What does success look like for you? So when we can start having that conversation. Then it really, really improves what we're able to output for the client and deliver those actual results instead of like, congratulations, you have a slightly higher page rank now because that's what you wanted, but you're not getting more leads because we didn't, you know, do exactly what we needed on the other side to make that happen.
Or you are getting that website traffic, but it's not converting. It's not doing, yeah, exactly. Yeah. The pager went up and it's not converting because we didn't actually pay attention to the website. We just listened to you. Yeah, and that's, you know, I mean, I think as any business owner, it's. Really taking that control back from the client and like, we are the experts.
There's a reason you're talking to us. There's a reason that you came to us, your, you know, area of expertise is not this, insert whatever industry or, you know, consulting mm-hmm. Company you're talking to, and like really ask the right questions and have those conversations to even see if it's a good fit.
But it is our responsibility as the vendor to make sure that they're getting what they need.
Ooh. And on that note though, I, I'm just gonna make a big assumption and maybe I'll land on my ass, but I'm gonna make a big assumption of like, maybe some hiccups and what I can see for clients in your guys' kind of sales process, because I would imagine, because I know you guys also work with larger companies, right?
Mm-hmm. And so, um. I'd imagine for some of those leaders and the, the people actually making that buying decision, they're, they don't understand like the weeds of marketing, right? They're very removed from that knowledge base. And then you're coming in saying like, okay, you said you wanted X, Y, Z, but actually like, you need this if you wanna achieve these goals.
And I'm sure for them they kind of feel like. Are you just saying that, are we scam? Like are you trying to like just fluff up this quote, invoice me a bit more because it can feel so elusive or abstract for people. And so how do you really combat that?
I think, you know, one, we really pride on education.
Why are we doing this? What is the deliverable? You know, what are the expectations that, why am I choosing this over that? Sure. There's a lot of options on like, which social platform should we do Google ads or seo? Should we run pre-roll? You know, text ads. Like there's so many ways that that strategy can come together.
And so it's really like, does this make sense to you though? Like why? We're suggesting this is really the way we, you know, try to go about it. Instead of like, no, this is the way it must be done. Same thing. We're not gonna just say, here's our cookie cutter package. Go at it. We're gonna really like, okay, cool, you have that running and it's working.
Let's not disrupt that. Let's figure out how we can pair with it and bring in these extra services then that you do need, and make sure that they're aligning with what's currently in place instead of disrupting, you know, an entire process. Just to, to your point. An invoice, right? Mm.
That's all, that's always my concern.
Like whenever I've brought on anyone for marketing and I'm small, right? So like my stuff is not, I don't think that complicated, but I've brought, I've brought people in for like copywriting and social media and like all these different things and I'm like, oh, sometimes I just go with the specialist, like, you have this one lane so I know you're not gonna like try to rip me off in these other areas.
But then I miss out on someone that does understand like that big picture. And I'm like, I don't know. How the heck to evaluate that big picture. So then I'm like, oh, I know you just do emails, but like, will you look at this website analytic thing? And they're like, I could, but do you want me to? Right.
That's, yeah, that's the hard part is like, do you choose a specialist in one section and then try and piece together this like all star team of everyone doing something different and no one talking. Or do you work with a company that's maybe a tiny bit more generalist? And also though, has the team and capacity to like bring in and have those experts at that conversation without you having to go hunt them down and actually look at, hey, what do these analytics, they're not just related to, you know, my website because.
That's what analytics is tracking, but like, what is it saying about the marketing and are we setting up our marketing appropriately to be tracking the correct analytics? And a lot of companies aren't. They don't even wanna install analytics unless someone somewhere installed it along the way. Right. And so, you know, the more that it, it really is a hard decision for people to make of, are we bringing in an expert who fully understands this industry, but maybe only one or two areas that I, you know, like need help out of five.
Or a company that can really come in, look at the big picture and actually help implement and execute as well.
Yeah, I mean it's just decision fatigue 'cause there's so many damn options out there. But there's also so many people that were like, it's COVID. I've done like two things on Instagram. I'm a social media person.
I'm, it's like, you definitely don't have like Paige's wealth of ex expertise. You should not be doing this. Right. Um, okay, so I wanna back up. A little bit and kind of take me back to like early days of Tree digital and kind of like did you start out solo? Did you always have a partner and like how did you grow your team along the way as you saw like the need to pivot and evolve with your services?
Yeah, no, that's a great question. So I started Truing Digital 16 years ago. I was doing architecture at the time. Um, had been in Iowa for a year at a design build firm. And I enjoyed it. I loved watching a design on paper or on the computer getting built into an actual home you could walk through. I mean, really cool.
And then, um, that though through the economy was not the right time for architecture. So I just like, why don't I switch gears to lands? Uh, um. To land surveying and I moved out to Boulder, Colorado. And uh, same thing, not a great time to still be in that industry in 2008. Um, so I was just really like a hard down and like, what do I do?
Like I've been laid off twice. This isn't working. I am not getting the full, full enthusiasm that I want out of this. And so, you know, do I go back to school? What do I do? And, uh, I just decided. Let me just start teaching myself web design. I don't know what it is. I don't know why I don't, but it's always been something I've kind of wanted to dabble in.
I'm like, oh, it'd be cool to build a site sometime. So, um, I started just teaching myself how to code, how to do that, do doing freelance work, working the Craigslist gig system like a beast. And after about a year or so of that, I, uh, turned it into just like I didn't even have time to post ads anymore. We had such a good referral.
You know, system going and clients coming back and everything. And from there, just one service at a time. As far as like. But I hate writing content, but I, you know, can do graphics. But I stall and I procrastinate and I see that that's not really where I want to be spending my energy. And it's the last task I do.
Let me hire that out. So we really started going through, you know, what is it that I want to be working on? What is it that I don't wanna be working on? How do we bring that, those experts into the company and then really start freeing up my time to focus on that area of expertise? And that's what we've done, is I've continued to hire.
You know, grow is keep the people and what they wanna do. I've seen it myself. If I don't wanna be creating social posts, the other person I hire in that seat that's supposed to handle something in marketing and doesn't wanna do analytics, they're not gonna do analytics. Well, don't put them there. Right.
And so really use that mindset too as I continue to grow And yeah, it's, it's my own company. I'm the only owner. So, you know, definitely had to get through some mentors and business coaches and advisors to really. Help through that growth process as well. 'cause I didn't have, you know, another co-owner if you will, like to bounce all that stuff off of.
Oh, I, my, my husband is the self-imposed co-owner, therapist coach. Listen to me vent. He is that for all the things. Um, but I don't want people to miss like. And I, I believe, like so much of success comes from simplicity, right? And so I don't want people to miss the simplicity of like, your success. And how large is your team now?
Uh, 15. 15. Okay. And what I mean by simplicity, I don't mean that it wasn't challenging and that you didn't work hard, right? But there's two like fundamental pillars that you have here. One, provide value. Listen to what the clients need. Pivot, like obviously stay in your lane. Like you're not pivoting from marketing to process improvement.
Right? Right. But you're, you're pivoting and involving to fill the market gap for what your clients need and where your expertise is. And then you're also very aware of where you should sit as the CEO and like you delegate, you hire you, you don't allow things to procrastinate for too long without making a decision.
And those two things are like, that's all you need. Business. Right. But it's really hard to do. Yeah, it's really hard to do. And even myself, like I teach people how to delegate and like manage their time and like not procrastinate on shit. And like my own personal to-do list is really long because it's not easy to do.
So you said you brought in some mentors and coaches. Was some of that around being able to let go or can we dive into what some of that was on? Is that too personal?
No, no, you're good. Um, for me, letting go hasn't really been the issue. Like I understand what we're doing. I have been in every single role in the company, so like I can talk the talk, I can have those conversations with people and say like, no, it needs to be done this way or change this, or whatever.
Right? And so I've just learned like a lot of times they're better 'cause they actually enjoy it. So like, get it off my plate, why not? Sometimes I struggle and I'm like, remind them like. If you're looking for work, just ask. There's always more work. Sometimes I'm just sitting on it and like I just need that little nudge of like, Hey, I'm a little slower light right now in the workload.
Is there anything else? Because yes, there always is or something, whether it's for the company, for the client, some, you know, whatever that looks like. So it wasn't so much that. I think for me though, it was taking some of those major steps. I'm growing. I don't have operations and leadership behind me.
What do I need to be doing? I'm growing and I'm terrified that I need to cover salary for a second person. Can I actually afford this? Right? And so, oh, now we need two people. And so having the, you know, mentors or the business coach behind me to say, we've ran your numbers, we've looked at everything, we've looked at it together, you are understanding it.
It makes sense. Yes, you can definitely handle and afford this. Let's keep going. And so it was those types of decisions and whatnot that would be, or. I also found, and I'm sure a lot of business owners can relate. You take things much more like personal or emotionally as the business owner when things come up.
And so for me it was also the like, well, I wanna sit here and defend everything on why I did this and why it's correct. Sometimes I need to have that outside set of eyes that doesn't have that emotional involvement to go. No. Hmm. Let's approach it this way. Let's see how that goes. Let's you know, not over justify, but let's address.
And so that was another huge, huge piece for me as I was growing the business is like, this is my baby. Everything is riding on it. What happens when? And so having an outside set of eyes was really, really helpful for me. And now I'm able to go into a lot more of those. And I've even said to the team, like, you guys take all of that off of me now.
You have it handled. I don't really have a lot of calls with clients that are, you know, Hey, this is going on. I have questions like the team's got it. And so now when those things come up, I see myself in that role of the advisor, right? Being able to go, all right, let's take a step back. Why don't we present these two options and let them decide what that is worth from a value side as far as cost instead of like, whoa, we don't wanna quote that.
'cause that might be too much. Let them decide and they're like, oh, I didn't, okay, cool. I didn't think about it that way. Right? And so it's allowed me to be like, okay, now that I'm not the one trying to justify all the work and every reason we did things, I can have that outside perspective and look at it with the team, and they really appreciate that.
So it's a really good, you know, connection that we all have. But it took a lot of time to get
there. Yeah, I mean this is the evolution of like solopreneur no team 16 years ago to now a team of 15. You're really the CEO um, but yeah, like, oh my gosh, there's times when. I mean, I even remember like way back in the day, like when I was an executive assistant or like even like supporting leaders or project managers or anything, and if I messed up it was like, oh my God.
Like, like it was so personal. And now with my team I'm like, it's all right guys. Like, it's not the end of the world. Like there's never been like. A wildlife disaster emergency from like this one data point being wrong, like we will just adjust and move forward. Right. And so call it out, tell
the client like, Hey, this is what happened.
But yeah, like let's talk about it and don't go at this alone. You don't have to.
Yeah. Yeah. But I, oh my gosh. Also, on the personal side, like there are times if I lose a deal, I, and I am going to my husband, like obviously God wants me to fail. He doesn't want me to have a business. And my husband's like it was one client.
Maybe they just weren't the client for you, and then a month later I'm like, oh yeah, I see why. Maybe like, this is good. Didn't work out. It wasn't. Yeah. Oh my gosh. But so what are o are other moments where you, I don't know, kind of catch yourself being proud of like the mentor and leader that you've become for your team?
I think it's in the moments that I feel really proud about, like the mentorship that I've become or like the leader in. Just like how much the team does feel they can come and talk to me about what's going on and. Having those conversations. I always laugh on the backside, especially now that we're like much more remote and what that looks like for our team.
And I'm like, I don't think our clients really understand to the extent that I am still involved and aware of all of the things going on in some capacity. And I think because it's all remote, they're just assuming like, oh, they haven't even talked today. Like they don't even, Paige doesn't even know what's going on with the company.
Right. And it's like. Oh no, we're probably already like back and forth four hours ago on a topic on what's going on. Or you know, like if they're stuck it's immediately like, Hey, this is what's going on. What do you wanna do? What's up? And so I think, you know, the fact that they feel comfortable enough of like, I'm gonna look on my own, but I know that like I've got her back there to help if something comes up.
And like I've always tried to create that culture of like. Don't sweep it under the rug, it's gonna come back 10 times more than just us addressing it right now. Or I always tell the team, I don't wanna get the call and be blindsided. So if a client's in a spot where like, hey, they're not quite understanding, or it's starting to hit that boundary of like back and forth where you can tell, it's a little, I don't wanna say heated, but you can tell like, we're not getting the progress that we need.
Something needs to change. Tell me now so that when I do get that call, 'cause I will be the next call. That I can understand and be able to come in and defend you, but if I'm caught off guard and just like, someone's like, Hey, mm-hmm. My website hasn't been working for, you know, four days, blah, blah, blah.
I'm so upset. No one on the team wants to fix it. It's like. No, I've seen every email go out the door for the last four days telling you everything that's going on, but I already knew this call was coming, so how do we, you know, go about it? But it is, as an owner, a CEO, like if you're kind of blindsided on something of, you know, a client just calling you upset and you are so disconnected from the company, you do get emotionally charged immediately.
And so I think the ways that we can deescalate that is just, Hey, tell me what's going on. Where's the client at? Nope. You got it. Keep going. I trust you and, and really encouraging the team.
Mm-hmm.
I've got you. Keep going. You're just following process and procedure. You're doing nothing wrong. Don't let them tell you you're doing something wrong.
And if they call me. They were doing their job. It's exactly what they were supposed to do.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, 'cause even when you are removed, it's always, it's still your reputation on the line. So there's still gonna be like that emotional charging to it. What I appreciated about some of the things you said was you didn't just tell them like, I don't wanna be blindsided, let me know what's going on.
But you gave examples of like, this is what a flag looks like. And I remember years ago when I first started my, my agency and really stepping into like the leader role with the virtual assistants that I have. I'd say something similar of like, okay, let me know if like you ever need help or like if something's going wrong.
And then like, they wouldn't always flag things and I'd get calls from the clients and I'm like, why did, like no one tell me this beforehand? And I had to learn like, oh, you, we have to really give specifics of like if you feel this happening. Or if you like, you're questioning X, Y, Z or you don't have clarity on this, that's what a flag is that you should pull me into.
Mm-hmm. And you laid that out for your team and now they're very clear on like, okay, what do we have to really raise to Paige's alarm versus like, I could figure this out on my own.
Or me learning to back off, you know, like, Hey, yeah, I saw the email. I'm gonna, I'm gonna let them handle it for a second.
Like, you know, they, the client needs to build trust with the team and to know. They do know what they're doing and I can't just swoop in saving the day every single time there's a little thing. And so sometimes too, just like, okay, just gonna let that email sit for a second, let them handle it. They'll come to me if they need more.
And you know, it's amazing how many come in and go right back out. And I never hear about it. And it's like, okay. Cool. You know, and so you can really start to gauge too, like, how's the team doing? Are we producing what we're supposed to, is customer service living up to the expectation that I set for the company?
'cause it's a very, very high expectation as far as, hey, this is how we communicate. This is how we, you know, understand what the client's wanting and understand. Technology's confusing. There's a lot of parts to it. And so it's not their fault that they don't understand. It's our job to tell them. This is why that's happening.
This is what can be done in the future, or this is how we're fixing it so you can understand why that happened and like what could happen in the future kind of thing. And so, you know, like it's those pieces. So you know, not. I really, I, I find a good balance of not being like, so removed and I don't want to be so removed and at the same time Yeah, not like stuck in every single day to day or every, you know, little email with the client back and forth of just kind of questions or uncertainty.
Yeah. And so you, and on that you said, you know, you kind of like you, you let the, the client figure it out with the team and if they call you, they call you cool. Like you already know what's going on. While you were learning to back off, were there times where like you jumped in and like called the client right away?
I'm sure absolutely. Over the years, like for sure. Yep. What's going on? What do you need? What's happening? Um, you know, and there's other times that it's like I am just gonna insert myself back into more of a project management role, step back in, try to see what we can do. It's. Always funny how clients change when I do get back into a conversation compared to, you know, maybe how they're treating some of the team.
And so that's another space that we had to navigate with just in general with growing or just with clients and client sizes and whatnot of like. I, you know, I can't be in every single client meeting. Yeah. But I also can't be working with clients that are changing their attitude when I'm on a call compared to when my team's on a call.
We need to have that consistency across the board that you are treating everybody with the same respect and not just like. Oh crap. Okay. Page one. We're gonna totally change how this is so good.
Behavior. Fuck,
button up. Yeah. It's crazy when it happens. And I mean, definitely I had to go into that sometimes with certain clients of like, lemme just get on with you guys and we'll just crank through this and knock it out.
And, and I'll tell them like, you're not doing anything wrong. It's, you know, it's a communication breakdown someplace, or it's a way that this is happening, or let me bring my expertise back in. Let's do what we can to figure out and get to that end goal instead of just like, Hey, this isn't a fit, let's walk away.
But you know, like really explaining to the team, like, maybe this is an area of improvement that I noticed, or no, the client's just having a bad day. Let's just do it. We can to keep it moving along, you know? So, really. Having those conversations too with the team so that they can learn and grow or, you know, take the things personally that they should and take the things, you know, and let 'em go and leave 'em behind if it's not something that really is that big of a deal.
Yeah, I mean, but that goes back to like your, your service attitude, right? You said customer service expectations are super high and I, I. Profoundly respect that. And I like, sometimes we just have to explain to our team members like, yeah, this person's having a bad day. Like what can we do to just move forward from this?
And obviously, you know, if a client is a total peta, like maybe we just need to like end the contract or something. Right? But there are times when. You know, like you just, you have to give that compassion. Like, and, and then that client ends up being a very loyal client. Like you gave them that grace, uh, and then they're like, okay, they understand me.
I can work with them. But also on that point. Of like the areas for improvement. I've also found with some of our assistants, like sometimes it's not just that the client is like, oh, Sam is the owner, like button up or something. But it's also that the assistant is not presenting themselves in a way or maybe having that level of communication and boundaries.
To get that person's respect. Obviously in a perfect world, respect is always just given. You don't have to like claw and earn for it. But like we're not, in a perfect world, people are people like sometimes like the vibe you give off is like not gonna grab their respect right away. And you have to teach them like this is how you present yourselves.
And it sounds like that was part of your mentorship with your team as well.
Yeah, absolutely. I think, you know, going into marketing calls and going over marketing reports and analytics, you know, like it's a call that I'm always on still, because there is, you have to go into those with the competence. If you're going into a marketing call going over reports and conversions and you're like, so then, yeah, we had like, you know, 2000 people visit your website this month and then this happened.
The client's like looking at you like, is this good? Is it bad? What's happening? What, what does that even mean for me? You know? And they just start, what, what are you even doing for me as a service? And it's like, while they're amazing at what they're producing, they haven't gained that confidence yet to really present that to a client.
And even for me, I'm sure if I looked back or could, you know, more of it was on Zoom younger, but like. That I too would be like, whoa, how did I get by some of those calls? So it's one showing them like, here's what we can do, here's how we can change that conversation of like. That's a great question. Let's go back and ask about that and like, let me do a little more research and get back to you.
But everyone just feels like they have to have all the answers right then and there in front of, and so you know, when we can coach through on what that looks like. And you had kind of asked that question earlier of like, what makes some of that leadership or that team so strong and it really is that like.
I'm here to help. I want the best out of both the employees and for our clients. And so if that means we have, you know, an extra 30 minute phone call one time or a, you know, meeting of like, Hey, here's some ways that we can go about that. This is what the client's looking for. Let's focus on that. Or you've got this, go into this with confidence.
I have full faith in you. You got this. It, it does help them over time. Then start to develop and build that up and then you start to go. I trust you on these phone calls. I can back off now.
Got, yeah, you can do your thing. Go fly. Little bird learning.
What do they need to really thrive and grow and, and really help encourage them to get there instead of like, you don't know it, let's keep moving.
Let's find someone else, or No, no. Like I, I just have to keep handling all myself. I can't delegate these things out. 'cause they don't know. It's like, no, they just, they haven't been there before. You know, they haven't seen the hundreds and hundreds of reports or the hundred of website errors that we've seen over the years, like.
I've seen just about all of 'em, and so it's a lot easier for me to go into those conversation with clients than someone who's, you know, built 30 websites and has no idea why something's happening. It's like, no, you're not gonna be able to troubleshoot it, but let's work through it together so you see why that's happening.
Then next time you'll have the confidence to fix it right away.
Yeah. I feel like I need to like segue or digress a little bit here because you have such an, an unfazed kind of a persona and I was recalling like we were at a networking event and you were like dealing with whatever calls, but something was happening like right before, right?
And I'm like, I can tell a little bit that like something is happening. But like overall, like just your, how you hold yourself. I was like, it doesn't seem that bad though. But then like you were like, oh yeah, like this is happening. And I'm like, oh, okay. Like she's stressed. I need to leave. Yeah. You know, but like overall, you just have such like a calm, collected, like, and like, that's not, I mean like I can be calm and collected obviously, and like certain.
Certain moments, and especially with clients, but overall, my personality's just like, ha, right? Like you're just like, alright, let's get through this. Uh, here's how we'll improve and like, it'll be better next time. And I think I would, I would, if I was your team member, I would just so appreciate like that presence in my day-to-day life.
Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I, you know, someone said the other day, I think, you know, we had a client issue and I was just like, Hey, you know, we're taking a look at it. I'll get back. She goes. I'm not a doctor. Like this is totally fine. We're you can get to this like in the next several hours or tomorrow, right?
Like it is not a big deal and I'm like. Finally someone you know gets it and is literally calling it out that like, I understand a website down, it's our first and top priority. I don't care what we're working on, we're all hands on deck. If a website's down, if a contact form's not working, we have that right front and center above anything else because we understand how much things impact the client and their business.
Revenue and the things that perception of how the company is ran, we understand all of that. So it is important, but when you've seen so many things over the years, you start to realize. But this little thing not showing up on mobile quite properly compared to an entire server being down. Which one is more important and what does the priority look like?
That's something we're like. We don't have a ticketing system or queue where it's like first in first out kind of thing. We look at every single client, every single effort that we're running and go, how is this impacting? What is the urgency? So when clients are coming to us with like, everything needs to be done and fixed immediately.
That's overwhelming for a team, especially, you know, the size that we are, if you had every client coming with everything as urgent. And so I think over the years, yeah, having to learn. This can wait. This is totally okay to put it off for a day or two while we address something different that is more, or that was higher priority, that has a very strong specific deadline compared to that.
And so that's a one way that it comes on from that calming side of, no, when I first started, it was 16, 20 hour days of like everything that came in today better go out today. Everything that came in today better go out. Right? Like I made sure everything was addressed. Immediately. And then over the years it was like, this isn't sustainable, not just for me, but for a team.
It's a big ask to ask a team to touch everything, every single day. And so learning, okay, how do we calm the client down to go, we're on it, but what is really the priority? And how do we, you know, piece that together with more calmness? And if I was a frantic business owner, we wouldn't be in business if I was just jumping at every fire that everyone came to us with, like.
I wouldn't be able to hold the team, nor would we be able to keep the clients. Right. Like it really is like you have to lead from the top and like, Nope, that's fine. I'm telling you we're gonna do this one tomorrow. That's fine. And it's okay if they come back and if they call me and say, why is it not done?
I'm the one that told you. So. That's already handled. Don't even worry about that phone call.
Yeah, you're the bad guy. And I think all that goes back to like something we, you, we talked about earlier, like really understanding value. 'cause you can't, because effectively push back with the client, and I don't mean pushback and like challenge, but just kind of ease their concerns at least on like what's urgent versus.
Not that big of a deal. If you don't really understand the value that you're bringing, if you're still stuck in that tactical deliverable place, then yeah, everything's gonna feel like high priority because like, we're just focused on like that scope of work rather than like, okay, what does the client really need?
And like, what's the value that we're producing here? And like, I, I can't imagine you having those conversations and prioritizing with the client and with the team without that. Perspective?
Well, yeah. I mean, like, are you on maintenance or not? Like if you're not, yeah, and you just called us out of the blue because something went wrong, like I, I can't address that as immediately as clients that are on a maintenance service that we know we're taking care of.
We've touched the site in the last, you know, couple days, a week, whatever. And we're fully aware of everything that's happening. That's a faster fix. Those clients are going to make sure that everything is running really smoothly. But again, if I'm blindsided with the call outta the blue of why my site just go down and I haven't heard from you in a year, we gotta figure out where that's getting into the pipeline.
You know, we'll, we'll handle it, we'll take care of it, but I can't jump at that fire because you haven't been doing the proper maintenance through the long term to know that we could have prevented the fire. Mm.
Little upsell there. Anyone catching that? Like, not even on purpose, but gotta have our marketing people with us on standby.
I mean, people do the same thing with like a virtual assistant. They're like, Hey, can, like, can we do this? And it's just project based. And I'm like, yeah, you could do project if you don't wanna commit, but. They are told to have priority for the retainer clients. Mm-hmm. So if you wanna do project, if they're available, cool.
If they happen to not be available, you, you're gonna wait in line, my friend. Right. And that's just how it is. Right. Like, I'm sorry. Right. But, okay. So let me, let's do a quick transition. We talked earlier for like the moment that you were losing your sanity was really around like. Understanding like what does the client even need?
They're asking for these things. You're in website, you don't do copy, but that's not getting them results, et cetera. Right? And so really understanding how do we continue to evolve and knowing the strategy of just like big picture value and things. And so looking at what's next, where do you see like the next big evolution for you guys?
And are we, is it. And I, I'm gonna like kind of do a little bit of an answer here of like, I think when AI came about, it really took over a lot of marketing stuff, right? Or we thought it was taking over and now we're seeing a transition of like, okay, people have calmed down for like AI in the marketing world, and now what can AI agents do?
What can it do in like the sales or operations world? Um, so I'm, I'm just curious, like really what's next on the horizon for marketing, or at least for your guys' team. That's
a great
question.
Uh, as far as like what's next for Truing Digital, you know, you've also, tech is changing constantly and there is a bit.
I think for us on the AI side, it's more implementation into websites, not so much how do we get into like all of the code, the learning, the teaching, and all of that aspect, but how do we use it as a tool to improve. What you're doing as far as systems and processes, right? And like organization and how do we really start to be running a more efficient company by letting the, those tools work for you.
But there's always those, like to your point that hold back of, if I get on a website and there's a chat and it's a bot, I'm still screaming at the bot. I know it can't hear me. I know that it does not understand, you know, any of it, but it's like. That's not the experience that I wanted from that client or that customer, or I mean, um, the company.
Company, you know? Yeah. It's like, I really want to talk to a human right now. Like that is what I need. Oh, you can't call us either. I'm gonna go find a different company. You know, like, I'm gonna go and find someone who will do this. So you have to really pick and choose what is that audience, and is this something that can be done?
Or how hard is it to get out of the bot and into an actual human? And what does that look like? And so I think, you know, AI is something that we. Really do look closely at, I mean, same thing, there's so many out there now that are like auto respond to reviews and it's still like a hit and miss for us from a marketing side where it's like, but isn't the whole like point of responding to a review, like the genuine business side of like customer service and thankful and all of that, and not just like, yep, we hit a button and a bot wrote it and we didn't have to do a thing and we, we didn't even know the review came in really, you know, like.
No, that we can't have the business on autopilot to that extent. It's the same thing with running Google Ads. You shouldn't have AI running your ads while you're just letting money fly out the door, right? Like you still need somebody going through what does this look like? Who's been viewing this for years and looking at that expertise to say.
Why are we going after Words for Nails when it's a, you know, a nail salon and not a construction company? Why are we going after, um, you know, auto repair when we're trying to do autos? Like whatever, like there's still variations of the same words that can drastically impact how those results happen.
Where are they at in the buyer process? From an SEO keyword research side to a, um, Google Ads side. You still need someone to say, does that actually make sense though, or is that word way off in left field from a buying decision? It might apply to the industry. But not for where they're at in the process and journey.
So, you know, we are keeping a really close pulse on AI and like, where does it fit? When do we bring it in? When are clients still paying us for the hands on personal expertise? And that's what we're offering compared to, hey, if you want ai, like this is what we'll do over here, but this is how it's gonna change your output.
Which one are you wanting? Right? So that's a bit of what's on the horizon is keeping track of that for us. We're back to how do we stop the fires? How do we prevent what's happening, um, before it gets too late? And a lot of that is what we've noticed is there's so many tools out there. There's so many platforms, there's so many vendors, there's so many hands.
Involved in different processes. There's turnover, especially now at a higher rate than we've ever had over the last 20, 30 years at companies as far as you get one person in and they'd have the handbook for the next 20 years, a new inside and out. We're seeing that 1, 2, 3 years turnover in a lot of companies, and so.
What we're looking at is how do you have access to this? How do you log in? Who's the one that set that up? What's going on with your logo files? Do you even know where they're at? Does your team know where they're at? If they needed to send a document out the door tomorrow, are they sending the right document?
So we're coming in really looking at more of that digital asset management side to say. Hey, how do we make sure your contact form doesn't stop working? How do we make sure that you're not getting in trouble for a DA compliance? How do we make sure that your logo files are what you need and that everyone knows that you don't have 50 different colors floating around online when you're setting up all these different accounts, you know, and really looking at do you actually own your social profile?
An intern set that up or a VA set that up in place and never hand over ownership. And so we're really coming in with more of our digital asset management side and looking at the entire picture of a company's digital footprint instead of, Hey, is your site pretty? Hey, is your marketing working? But are all of these things in place to really make, make a successful footprint?
Yeah. What's awesome about that, about that is that we've evolved from like, okay, what, what made me insane and how did I fix it to now? What could possibly drive me insane? And how can we be very proactive in preventing that insanity? Right. Um, and so I wanna touch on, on a few things that, that you said there really go, going back to ai, like I absolutely think like AI should be used to kind of elevate what you're doing.
Uh, I don't think it's at the place to replace. Anything. And I think that's like all, like the language I'm hearing is like, oh, in five to 10 years this is gonna be obsolete and AI is gonna do that. I'm like, okay, well they've gotta change a lot for it to, to get to that point. Like it still needs quite a bit of human oversight and Yeah, like if, if I call a company and then it's an AI thing, like I've already looked online.
Right, like I've already, like your AI agent is just telling me what your blog help article said and like, and so I'm just screaming representative and they're like, I'd love to get you to representative, but I need to know more. And I'm like, I just wanna tell this story one time to a real person who can get great.
It's not like you're
recording it, that you're gonna like pass it along with an AI recap and then all of a sudden the rep automatically has everything you just vented, right? Like no. Not happening.
Yeah. I'm still repeating myself. And so like, like that human element to business I think is increasingly getting more and more important.
And like even we had a panel, um, the other day and we're talking about marketing and sales and like, what are you doing? And everything came back to it's relationship building. It's everything has to come back to relationship building no matter what you're doing to be more efficient. It's like, well, how are you really focused on the people that you're serving?
And, and I love the, the emphasis that you and your team have on that.
Well, yeah, I mean that's, we've seen it more and more too. I mean, we used to be strictly like B2C marketing for the most part. And you know, the more and more that we're seeing B2B come up because of the relationship building or just how do we nurture what's already in our system with relationship building and you know, like yes, it's always been a word in marketing, right?
But not to the extent that people are finally like. Who can help me build these relationships, who can help me put that funnel together and pipeline and what does this look like to like, have a process in place to actually stay in front of and top of mind, whether it's a client, a strategic partner, a you know, um, potential client, a lead, whatever that looks like.
And it's, it's more and more people are Yeah, coming of like, how do I do this? And to your point with ai. You got to the output because you knew, like you put the prompts in. Mm-hmm. And so to your point, right, like sure, it might get you to an answer you're looking for in the long run, but that wasn't without somebody continuing to create the correct prompts or training it in the right capacity to get you there.
And so, yes, to your point, like it will handle some things, but it's gonna be a little bit yet before it fully replaces. These certain things because you still need an expert in that area to even understand what question to be asking.
Yeah, well even like to that point, it's not just about like the kind of front loading and training it, but there's still like it, like while you're using it, kind of coming back and like for me, like I've been using it for years and, and I mean I'm experimenting with more AI now, but like specifically around chat, bt if I like just.
Turned off my brain and I just took whatever it had. Yeah, it has a whole bunch of information about my strategy, my messaging, my ideal client profile. But there are times when it just gives me something and I'm like, what is this? And I'm like, you're being too agreeable. Like you need, like, you like I need something better than this.
I need something different than this. And so if you're not still having that oversight and continuously prompting back, it's gonna fall apart. Like if I posted some of these things, people would be like, Sam don't know shit. Like
what
is happening? You
know, my favorite prompt, I was like going through something and I mean, I can't say how many times.
I'm like, stop using m dashes. Like just stop. We don't wanna, we know we don't want, well, I don't
use dashes like in my, like even when I'm texting I use that for sure. I'm like, so people keep calling me out on that. I'm like, but it's also part of like how I write. But I get it. I get it. But I like went to
chat one time and I was doing something and I was like.
What am I gonna say next? And they're like, I have a feeling you're gonna say to not use M dashes. And I was like, so why are we still using? I'm like, why didn't we start with that? You clearly knew without me even saying anything, what I was gonna come back to you and say needed to be fixed. You answered the question a hundred percent correct.
But, but I mean, just, I mean, to that point, right, of like. I can tell you all these things, and sometimes you still need to remind them, I can't have you talking about, you know, this, that doesn't apply to this client, that doesn't apply to what we're trying to create. Like, or they get confused, like, well, at one point you talked about.
Post exit or you know, post transaction stuff. And now I'm trying to figure out how that goes to exiting and what keep 'em separate. It's two different things going on. I don't need you to cross those. Right. And so it does start to try and figure out like all of the information we're providing it,
how do we keep
them separate?
Well on that note also, I used to be super polite 'cause I was like, who's secretly like reading these logs, right? To improve it. I used to be really polite and now I'm just like, why are you sucking today? Why is this not what I need? You know? I'm just take a
break. We'll come back to this tomorrow, you're ready to go again.
Yeah. Or all the things I wanna say to other people that God's like, Hmm, you don't wanna do that today, Samantha. I'm like, I'm just gonna take it out on this robot today. So, yeah.
Yeah, it's, it's interesting how it works. Or just calm me down please. I know this is not how to say this, but can we, this is what I want to say.
Give me the PC version, please.
Yeah. Make it sound much nicer. Like, don't make them feel bad, but they need to know they messed up here or something. Right? Yeah. 📍 Oh man. Okay. Well this has just been such a wonderful, wonderful conversation. Thank you for joining us today, Paige, and for everyone listening in, we'll catch you next week on Strategy, solutions and Sanity.
Thank you.