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Mental Selling: The Sales Performance Podcast is a show for motivated problem solvers in sales, leadership and customer service. Each episode features a conversation with sales leaders and industry experts who understand the importance of the mindset and skill set needed to be exceptional at building trusted customer relationships. In this podcast, we get below the surface, tapping into the emotional and psychological drivers of lasting sales and service success. You’ll hear stories and insights about overcoming the self-limiting beliefs that hold salespeople back, how to unlock the full potential in every salesperson, the complexities of today’s B2B buying cycles, and the rise of today’s virtual selling environment. We help you understand the mental and emotional aspects of sales performance that will empower you to deliver amazing customer experiences and get the results you want.
Welcome to Mental Selling!
[00:00:00] Donna Horrigan: It’s really those meaningful connections and understanding needs and how I can serve and a strong partnership, that’s what gets me out of bed. So I do think if you do the right thing, the results will follow, but focusing on the results isn’t inspiring.
[00:00:15] Patty Gaddis: Sales is a long-term, long commitment of a relationship, so you have to do the activities to get things done, but you have to show up, be prepared, listen intently, ask a lot of questions, and you’re there to help them solve a problem.
[00:00:34] Hayley Parr: This is Mental Selling, the sales podcast for people who are dedicated to making a difference in customers’ lives. We’re here to help you unlock sales talent, win more relationships, and transform your business with integrity. I’m your host, Hayley Parr. Let’s get right into it. Welcome to the Mental Selling podcast, brought to you by Integrity Solutions, where we dive into the mindset and skillset needed for high performance sales leadership. October is Women in Sales Month, and there’s no better way to celebrate than by hearing from two of Integrity Solutions’ own sales leaders — women who embody what it means to lead with integrity, inspire others, and drive growth with purpose. We’re thrilled to be joined by Donna Horrigan and Patty Gaddis, who bring decades of experience in sales, leadership, and client success. Collectively, they’ve led national sales organizations, coached teams across industries, and built trusted partnerships that drive growth through purpose and values. They embody what Integrity Solutions stands for: integrity, authenticity, belief in people’s potential, and the conviction that when sales is done right, it’s about helping others succeed. So let’s get started. Donna and Patty, welcome to Mental Selling and Happy Women in Sales Month! So excited to have you on the podcast.
[00:02:12] Donna Horrigan: This is exciting.
[00:02:14] Hayley Parr: And that’s why this episode is going to be absolutely golden for Women in Sales Month. The three of us obviously know each other quite well — we’re all from Integrity Solutions — and we wanted to bring the two of you on to celebrate Women in Sales Month. We all know each other quite well, but I’d love for the two of you to introduce yourselves a little bit for the audience to get to know you better, maybe touch on your journeys into sales — what first drew you to your careers in sales and what’s kept you passionate about it. Donna, maybe you go first.
[00:02:46] Donna Horrigan: Sure. I grew up an extrovert and I was a connector just naturally — all about people. If I was ever in a room, you knew it if you listened just a little bit. And so people always said, “Oh, you’d be great in sales.” Well, yes, you do need to relate to people and get along — it’s obviously bigger than that, which we’ll talk about — but that’s kind of what drew me in. And what kept me going was really once I got into sales and understood what and how I do what I do for the people that I get to partner with. It’s really about helping and serving others, being their partner and solving problems, being a thought partner to talk about potential. And that’s really exciting — and then seeing it through to a successful outcome. So it keeps me going every day.
[00:03:31] Patty Gaddis: And for me, I came kicking and screaming. I did not want to be in sales.
[00:03:35] Hayley Parr: Really?
[00:03:36] Patty Gaddis: Yes. I had a very negative perception when I came in. I came in from a service perspective. I was going to serve customers, and then I had a revelation when I was leading a service organization where they said, “You need to start driving revenue to keep the organization pushing products.” I just didn’t like it. But then all of a sudden, I had a conversation with a leader and they said, “Your team is in the best position. They know your customers, they’re trusted, they solve problems for them every day. That’s what sales is — you’re just helping expand that business.” And a light went off. I realized it was not what I thought sales was going to be. And since then, that’s changed my perspective. Then all of a sudden I landed a sales position, and I’ve been in it longer than I’d like to say.
[00:04:23] Hayley Parr: Well, and we hear those negative perceptions about what it means to be in sales quite a bit at Integrity Solutions, and that’s something that we work hard to overcome. I can see how hearing that, but then having the right conversation at the right time, was a bit of a defining moment for you. Patty, any other key moments or challenges, for that matter, that either of you can point to that really shaped your sales or leadership journey up to this point?
[00:04:53] Patty Gaddis: I mean, I’ll expand on that. When I was being asked to sell and didn’t know what selling was, or didn’t have the tools to ask the questions or to dig deeper, I was doing something that was unnatural. I was doing something to people. And when I realized that I was really — it was an extension of who I am — of service first and really helping people, that changed it for me.
[00:05:16] Donna Horrigan: And my defining moment was personal, but it absolutely impacted my career. I had waited longer than I had hoped to become a mom, so motherhood changed me. Up until then, it was about my career trajectory — becoming a sales leader, having the biggest job of my career. And then I became pregnant, and my choices all changed. I stopped being a leader by choice and decided I wanted to be an individual contributor because it gave me more flexibility and freedom to be a mom. And in doing so, I was able to be a leader without the title, because I still have great ideas, I still care, I still support my colleagues and my boss. I manage up a little bit — and they usually appreciate that — but becoming an individual contributor allowed me to still succeed in sales. I don’t need the title to feel fulfilled.
[00:06:04] Hayley Parr: I’m really struck by that example, Donna, especially as we recognize it’s Women in Sales Month — and that’s such an inherently female experience, juggling motherhood, well, parenthood in general, and being a leader. And how you were able to take your unique experience in life and build the career you needed with the flexibility at the same time. You kind of landed in sales — I imagine something that might have played a role (and you can tell me otherwise) were the people you surrounded yourself with: the mentors, the sponsors, or some of those key relationships that had an influence on your career path. Anything there that made an impact on how that went for you?
[00:06:53] Donna Horrigan: Yeah, it’s interesting. It wasn’t when I was a mom, but before I became a mom, early in my career, I worked for a woman who was just absolutely fabulous at doing what we talk about in Integrity — and that is seeing the potential in others before they maybe see it in themselves. She took me to a national conference to get exposed to the kind of work we do with others who are doing similar work all over the country. When we got back, she asked if I enjoyed it and would I like to go again next year. Of course I said yes — it was amazing. I worked at a little firm in Connecticut, didn’t really leave the state much — long, long time ago. She said, “Great, I want you to be there too, only the only way I’m going to bring you is if you get selected to be a speaker.”
[00:07:36] Patty Gaddis: Because…
[00:07:36] Donna Horrigan: It was all like-minded people in the similar industry sharing their successes and journeys. And as a sales leader, she knew I had created a lot of solutions for my team and for myself that others were challenged with and needed advice on. She thought I had something to share that would be of value to others nationally. And the next year I did get selected and I did speak — and it was simply amazing. And I never stopped, because then I really liked the stage. But if she never challenged me to do that, I may have never done that. It clearly established me in the industry and allowed me to truly grow in ways I never thought possible. So yeah — one person can make such a huge difference.
[00:08:21] Hayley Parr: Yeah, sometimes you just need that push. You just need the right person believing in you. That’s fantastic. What about you, Patty?
[00:08:29] Patty Gaddis: Absolutely the same thing — just being pushed outside of my comfort zone on different opportunities I’ve had to work on, or traveling overseas, speaking, writing articles. There’s always been somebody behind me pushing me to do something different and something new. It always gives you pause and gives you stress, but then in the end, when you do it, there’s pride and so much that comes out of it.
[00:08:53] Hayley Parr: Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. When I think about where, as a woman — not in sales but in marketing at Integrity Solutions (those two functions are very closely interwoven) — when I think about where I’ve drawn my sources of confidence and credibility, a lot of that has come from my relationships and the people that I surround myself with. They say that you really are a product of the people in your circle, in your bubble. What are some of the other lessons the two of you have learned about really building your confidence and credibility as women in sales?
[00:09:31] Patty Gaddis: It goes along with confidence and credibility. When I was put into a leadership position, again, I was a horrible leader. I had no experience in leading. I was a high performer, and so I was a command-and-control type person — micromanaged. And it was a mentor that saw how hard I was working and how stressed and uncomfortable I was, and they said, “There are different types of leadership. One is you’re tactical and you are managing the business. Then you move to coaching, and then you go to more strategic leadership.” They said to me, “Where do you think you are?” I said, “I’m managing — I’m just in the weeds all the time.” And they said, “Why do you think you and others don’t move to that next level?” I said, “Because people don’t know the difference.” I felt like I was going to get far because I was working so hard and helping everybody succeed — but what I was doing was really disempowering people. Instead of building performance, that person guided me but also empowered me to help others. It was a huge change, and it helped build credibility among my team and helped build my confidence that I didn’t have to do everything. I had confidence in others that they could do that too. So that helped build them and build me at the same time.
[00:10:48] Hayley Parr: And give you time back in your day.
[00:10:50] Patty Gaddis: Yes! Sometimes we look at each other and we just feel like we need to take on everything and manage everything. That was a big gift for me — seeing those perspectives of leadership, and also taking a step back and knowing what was in my control and what I could manage, and then helping other people develop so that I could be free to do other things.
[00:11:11] Donna Horrigan: And for me, confidence and credibility come over time. You need to put it on for size and try it — work with your customers — and you find over time that you are sharing valuable insights and information and you’re getting that feedback. But also similar to Patty, you’re not alone. Ask for help. Sales can be a lonely profession when you’re out there interacting — obviously you’re with your customers and talking to them — but it’s a solo adventure. Sometimes you need to phone a friend and just say, “Hey, I have this idea, I have this client, I have this difficult situation. What do you think?” Patty and I do that all the time with one another now, and it’s great because it makes all the difference in the world. You don’t have to have all the answers, but you need to own it and work through it with others. So I think working with others is a big part of building confidence.
[00:12:01] Patty Gaddis: I thought when I was younger that confidence — both Donna and I have a lot of personality — and so I felt like I needed to use that personality and manage the room. What I learned was that that really was not confidence; that kind of showed that I didn’t have confidence. Instead of sitting back and listening to others and asking questions — getting an understanding of that, that I didn’t have to own the room — was powerful and helped build confidence and credibility.
[00:12:32] Hayley Parr: I mean, wasn’t AID, Inc. an eye-opener when you realize how little listening actually happens in the early stages of typical sales conversations?
[00:12:43] Donna Horrigan: What’s cool about listening too — it’s not just listening to what’s being said, it’s listening to what’s not being said. Especially in selling, there may be a lot of things that a customer’s thinking that initially they may not be willing or ready to disclose, and it just takes time. But sometimes you can sense something — maybe others can do it too — but I think it’s part of a woman’s intuition. It’s like there’s something more there. And when you continue the conversation, listening is more than just hearing what’s being said — it’s being aware of what’s not being said.
[00:13:16] Hayley Parr: Absolutely. And that’s a great segue to the next topic, because you both have shared such great insights about your sources of confidence and credibility. I wanted to tie that to how your values — and really the core values at Integrity Solutions — drive how you lead and how you sell. Values like integrity and authenticity. What does that look like in your day-to-day work with what you’re doing here at Integrity Solutions?
[00:13:45] Donna Horrigan: For me, at this point in my career, with age comes wisdom. I can’t say that I wasn’t like this earlier, but I’m really just very authentic in who I am and how I show up and my desire to serve — it is my being. So I don’t have to think about it. I want to honor my commitments. I want to be of service to the people I interact with. I want to make sure I’m providing value, and I want to do the right thing for the customer. That’s what guides me and drives me every day. And I think customers can tell when you’re really authentic and you care genuinely.
[00:14:19] Hayley Parr: Hi there. If you’re listening to this show, it means you believe in making a difference in your customers’ lives and are looking for tools to grow in your career at the same time. At Integrity Solutions, we’re changing the stereotypes about sales training in ways your customers will feel and experience every day. If you want to learn more about how we can help you and your team, go to integritysolutions.com.
[00:14:45] Patty Gaddis: Yeah, I think mine starts with purpose — showing up, being prepared, doing what I said I was going to do, following up, and really trying to represent the best interests of my customers and of Integrity so that we can help them meet mutual goals.
[00:15:01] Hayley Parr: I see that in both of you — and so many of the folks we work with. We have such an incredible team, and it’s what makes working for Integrity Solutions so special. Speaking of perceptions of what sales is and what it isn’t — it can have kind of a negative connotation sometimes; it’s often seen as purely performance-driven — so how do you navigate that or balance things like results (because at the end of the day, that is the job) with relationships and values as you move through your day-to-day and stay true to those values?
[00:15:36] Patty Gaddis: I mean, with results, you have to have the activity to get the results. I also feel like sales is a long-term, long commitment of a relationship. You have to do the activities to get things done — that’s the performance part. But you have to show up, be prepared, listen intently, ask a lot of questions, and you’re there to help them solve a problem or overcome a challenge or help them drive their business. All of that comes into play.
[00:16:09] Donna Horrigan: I heard this in another context, but it applies: oxygen is needed for life, but it’s not what gets me out of bed in the morning. Similar to business results — the business won’t survive without them, but that’s not what motivates me. It’s really those meaningful connections, understanding needs, how I can serve, and a strong partnership. That’s what gets me out of bed. So I do think if you do the right thing, the results will follow — but focusing on the results isn’t inspiring. Not for me.
[00:16:38] Hayley Parr: I’d like to shift into the impact you’re making on others, especially as we recognize Women in Sales Month. I want to talk about how you’re really looking to empower or mentor women in sales. How do you see the next generation shaping what sales leadership looks like in the future — with things like AI changing everything? What does that look like in terms of mentorship and leadership in the future of the role of the sales profession? Maybe touch on what role women have played in your own development and how you plan to pay that forward. Any thoughts in that regard?
[00:17:19] Patty Gaddis: Men and women have played such significant roles — but women especially. I think moving forward into this next generation, this generation is so passionate about making change and impact, and I think that’s going to drive women in sales even further. And also, when you look at AI — you’re still going to need that human component and that human touch. So it’s not going anywhere; it’s probably going to need to show up even further. We’ll have the data, we’ll have the analytics, but we’ll still need to have the conversations.
[00:17:50] Donna Horrigan: I swear every comment isn’t going to be around motherhood, but I had a boss — who’s a dear friend and colleague now — but at the time hired me when I was six months pregnant. In my generation, that didn’t happen very often. But she knew I had the skill set needed for the job and she was still willing to hire me knowing I was going on maternity leave. It just speaks volumes to being seen and valued, and I want to make sure I do that for others because we have a place in the workforce. Yes, we are child-rearing — but the two are not mutually exclusive. Somebody doing that for me meant the world, and I want to make sure I do that for others and help anyone I encounter reach their full potential and see their value. Even just providing advice and guidance on a project basis — I was talking to a younger female colleague earlier this week about something, and I said, “Have you thought about this?” It was just a little thing from my perspective, and she said, “That is going to help me make this business case so much better.” It was a tiny thing, but it was a natural add that helped her be successful. I’ll just continue to do that.
[00:18:57] Patty Gaddis: I love mentoring and giving back, especially to college women who are just leaving school or trying to get their first job. It’s fun to be able to help them — helping them figure out what their path is going to be. I didn’t know I was going to be in sales, so maybe taking some of those steps away and making it easier for them to make that connection.
[00:19:20] Hayley Parr: On that train of thought, what is some advice you would share with women — or really just anyone — early in their career who are just starting out or thinking about a career in sales?
[00:19:30] Donna Horrigan: For me, it’s about tooting your own horn with grace and humility. Sometimes we do great things, but everyone’s not there to see you or see the results of your effort. It’s okay to talk about it, especially if you share what you learned in the process and what you might do differently going forward. Other people will learn from you. I think in general we shy away from doing that — and it’s okay. There’s a right way to do it, but it’s okay to talk about, “Wow, this happened and it’s really great and I want to share.”
[00:20:00] Patty Gaddis: I would say the biggest thing that anybody I mentor or talk to — recent graduates — my biggest piece of advice is your network is your net worth. You don’t just get on LinkedIn and connect with everybody in the world — it’s an investment of time. You make investments in your partner, your children — you have to make investments in your professional relationships as well. It takes time and effort, but it pays off.
[00:20:26] Hayley Parr: I really like that. I’m an extrovert as well, but for some reason the thought of networking events early in my career was a struggle. I had a hard time putting myself out there, finding the right events to go to. You don’t want to just go and feel like you needed liquid courage to approach someone. But early in your career — what value do I have to bring to a conversation? Who would want to talk to me anyway? What do I have to talk about? It comes with experience and time, but it was intimidating. It took some really great mentors. And Donna, your story that you mentioned about being hired when you were six months pregnant — I had that exact same thing happen to me. I got the chills when you told that, because it was one mentor in my life who took a huge chance on me knowing I was going to have to take an extended leave. I was far enough along that I needed the leave before I could even start the job. She took a chance on me, and she was, to this day, one of the best mentors I’ve ever had. I credit her for so many things in my career. Women do great things because we help each other out. Just thinking about the themes of this podcast — another really great piece of advice that I like to share every chance I get is to not apologize so much. Reframe an unnecessary apology as gratitude. So rather than say you’re delayed in responding to an email for something beyond your control, reframe that as “Thank you for the flexibility” or something to that effect. As a chronic people-pleaser, that was kind of game-changing for me and my communication style. There are all these things that can be unique to the female experience — hurdles we sometimes have to overcome to get to certain points in our careers.
[00:22:35] Patty Gaddis: That is such great advice that should keep being spread. That’s our first go-to all the time — to say “I’m sorry” or apologize. That should be repeated over and over again. I love that, Hayley.
[00:22:42] Hayley Parr: Got it, Patty. This conversation, this episode — I’ve been smiling ear to ear. It’s been so heartwarming, so inspiring. What an amazing way to celebrate the two of you, everything that we’re doing at Integrity Solutions, and to celebrate Women in Sales. Thank you so much for your stories, your wisdom, and your leadership perspectives. Before we wrap, I’d love to finish up with a few quick, fun questions to wrap the episode and the celebrations on a high note, if you don’t mind — a little rapid fire, celebratory close. You saw these ahead of time, so you had a little bit of time to think, but don’t feel like you need to extrapolate too much on your responses. A woman who inspires you most?
[00:23:26] Donna Horrigan: Sara Blakely from Spanx.
[00:23:29] Hayley Parr: I was going to say—
[00:23:29] Patty Gaddis: The founder of Spanx, yes.
[00:23:31] Hayley Parr: Excellent.
[00:23:32] Patty Gaddis: And a dear friend of mine — she has inspired me and pushed me. She’s a woman in finance and she’s running the world.
[00:23:39] Hayley Parr: Excellent. A leadership or sales book you’d recommend to the Mental Selling listeners?
[00:23:47] Donna Horrigan: Dare to Lead — Brené Brown.
[00:23:50] Patty Gaddis: Of course we have to say our book, because Listen to Sell is a great book — we have to say it! It’s an awesome book. And then another one is Let’s Get Real or Let’s Not Play — that was a game changer early on in my career for making that transition.
[00:24:06] Hayley Parr: Another good one, Donna. I just picked up another Brené Brown book — I think it’s the most recent one. I’ll have to shoot you the recommendation.
[00:24:13] Donna Horrigan: Atlas of the Heart.
[00:24:15] Hayley Parr: Yes! Her content is just so authentic — it just resonates. So great. One unique trait that women bring to the sales profession?
[00:24:25] Donna Horrigan: I would say collaboration (over competition).
[00:24:29] Patty Gaddis: I would say empathetic listening. I think that’s what makes us different.
[00:24:34] Hayley Parr: I see both of those strengths in the two of you. Your proudest personal or professional win?
[00:24:41] Donna Horrigan: I’ve got to go personal again on this one — because I have raised a fearless 25-year-old daughter who is chasing her dreams and making it happen, and nothing brings me greater joy. She allows me to coach and mentor her whether she likes it or not.
[00:24:58] Hayley Parr: Oh, I love that. Congratulations — that’s incredible.
[00:25:01] Patty Gaddis: Thank you. And I’ve kind of gone the same way. I have three wild and crazy boys that are grown and flown, and they supported me through a lifetime of work. They wouldn’t be where they are if they didn’t learn from what I’ve gone through, and vice versa — they teach me something every day.
[00:25:18] Hayley Parr: Oh, I love that. They both have incredible mothers and women to look up to in their lives. What great answers — that’s amazing. Last one: what’s one piece of advice you’d like to leave the Mental Selling podcast listeners?
[00:25:35] Donna Horrigan: Mine is: create your journey. Don’t settle. Find your people. Surround yourself with the people who will support and see you realize your dream. It’s possible — so make it happen.
[00:25:48] Patty Gaddis: Mine — sales can be for everyone. So much points to sales being for extroverts or “people people,” but I am finding more and more every day that that’s not the case. It’s the introverts too — the ones who are intent, listening, understanding, helping, and driven. So if you are not naturally an extrovert, that doesn’t mean that you should be excluded from sales, because you might quite naturally fit right into what sales really is.
[00:26:16] Hayley Parr: That’s such a good reminder. Thank you. Thank you both for the leadership you bring to Integrity Solutions every day, for the example you set for women in sales everywhere — and of course, for coming on the podcast. Long time coming — we could have gone on forever! We’ll have to have you back. To our listeners, thank you for joining us today. Please follow the show, follow each of our guests on social media, on LinkedIn, and continue to share and engage with this episode. And Happy Women in Sales Month to both of you and to all of our listeners — to all of the lovely female sales professionals. Thank you both for coming on, and we’ll chat soon.
Thank you for joining us on Mental Selling. If today’s conversation resonated with you, be sure to subscribe, leave a review, and share it with your network. For more insights on how to go beyond winning deals and build real customer relationships, visit integritysolutions.com. See you next time.