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Creating a design concept for a kitchen or remodeling an outdated bathroom requires an understanding of the products and services available to those looking to undertake such a project. The ProSource Podcast breaks down the home remodeling industry and highlights the merchandise and experience that it requires to achieve your vision. Join ProSource Director of Digital Marketing Content Kevin Devine, as he speaks with those who facilitate the ideal project and offer valuable information for how to choose the ideal products and services that transform your ideas into reality.
Welcome back to The ProSource Podcast.
My name is Mollie Thompson.
I am with ProSource and I'm sitting here
with Evan and Micah from MasterBrand.
Thank you guys both for joining me today.
We're actually in the producers office
today in person.
So if you're watching the video,
you see that?
Thank you guys for joining.
If you don't mind giving me
a little bit of background on your role
and what you do for
your brand, that'll be great.
Yeah, sure.
So, again, my name is Evan Pittman.
I am lead product
and brand lead for a short time in Kemper
and Mid-Continent portfolio.
So I get the opportunity
to kind of figure out what we want to do
as a as a product line here
for the next 2 to 3 years and, and develop
our, our product roadmap, so to speak,
and develop that product strategy.
I've been with the company now for 15
years and, yeah, excited to be here.
Thanks for having us.
Yes. Long journey for you. 15 years.
My name is Micah Northcutt.
I support our product and marketing, teams
within the dealer channel.
Gotcha.
I also, support
some of our dealer programs.
Okay. Loyalty, that kind of thing.
But, again, only been with the company
for three years.
My background is more on
the transformation side.
So, process and product and etc..
So from a, expertise level,
I lean heavily on Evan.
Hopefully I provide a little bit
of support on, idea generation.
Perfect.
You said you're in marketing as well.
That was like music to my ears
because I'm also in marketing.
So we probably align a little bit on,
how we do things.
So I know you just mentioned
we're talking about these brands.
Can you give us a quick background
on these brands and their role
within the master brand family?
I know master Brand is massive.
I mean, if you if you go to your website,
there's like an entire list, a portfolio
of brands under you guys.
But what about the specific brands?
Should we be talking about today?
Sure. Absolutely. I'll take that one.
So today we're talking about Schrock,
Diamond, Kemper,
within our dealer channel, which is about
5000 locations, across the US of
everything from pro
sources and keyboards to,
mom and pop small dealerships.
But within that channel,
these brands are the largest portfolio,
the largest product line.
And so we think of them kind of as,
as the core.
They are the, to use a baseball term,
they're the utility infielders.
At some locations
they are the entry level product.
And so they need to be simple and easy
to use.
Yes, in some locations
they are the trade up.
And it's a pretty broad product
line as well.
So you can do a lot of things with it.
But in some locations it's the trade off.
And so we have to maintain
a lot of optionality at the same time
and capabilities within these lines.
So, it's a really important brand.
It's needed some attention.
And we are very excited about what we're
going to do here in a couple of months.
Perfect.
And hopefully we can get a sneak peek
on what that looks like here soon.
What was the starting point like?
What made you you just mentioned that they
needed some attention for a while now.
Some more attention, I guess.
What changes were first implemented
when going about this process?
Yeah.
So do you mind if I tell a story?
No, I don't hear.
So coming coming out of Covid
2023, the the market,
the industry was starting to settle down.
We shifted from
just trying to get cabinets out the door.
Yeah, right.
That's the state
everybody was in to stepping back
and being a little more introspective
to say, okay, we've got gotta
we have slapped a bunch of Band-Aids
on our product lines to get through
these Covid years. Yeah.
How are we situated for the future?
And so late 23, early 24,
we identified several things, right.
We needed to make some improvements
on the product side.
We need to make some improvements
on quality.
We also realized, and this is sort of
the crux of what we're talking
about today, that our pricing
and the way that we were pricing in
the pricing overall had become messy
for lack of a better word.
So, I'll make it brief
and we can dive in throughout the podcast.
But throughout 2024,
Evan actually led a what
at the time, we were calling as simple
as a simplification effort.
We had 12 pricing tiers.
It was hard for a designer to use.
And so we just looked at, okay,
how do we simplify this?
Yeah.
At the same time we were going to
designers, we were running focus groups.
We were talking with lots of different
individuals.
One of which, and Inman is a
is a resource designer.
She's wonderful
and is on our design council. Yes.
So we spoke with him and we realized
this pain point
is much bigger than we thought.
And so we've spent
we kind of paused that simplification
effort went back to the direct,
whiteboard.
And now, eight months later,
we are launching something
much, much bigger than a simplification
effort.
No, that's awesome that you have a council
full of actual designers,
that work at Prosource, for example,
I have actually virtually met.
And, and she's a sweetheart
and she's very good at what she does.
So it's cool that you guys are actually
getting that real world feedback.
You're not,
guessing or maybe speaking to people
that aren't even in the situation
that you're dealing with.
But yeah, I, I imagine
a lot of brands can probably relate to
with the aftermath of Covid
and just how hard those times were.
12 pricing tiers,
can I imagine, be very tricky to navigate?
And I feel like all we want in the world
is, is just like, simplify every process.
How has SDK M's positioning
evolved to better serve specifically?
We talked a little bit
about process designers, but how does that
fall into, resource trade Pro members?
Like builders. Interior designers?
Yeah.
So I think overall,
when you're looking at this and everything
we're trying to do is make these programs
easier to understand.
Yeah.
To to arm those designers
with more confidence as you're
sitting in front of a consumer and trying
to explain the differences here.
Yeah.
You know, there are many
and so we've got to just make, you know,
really make sure that we've got something
that that's that's easy to articulate.
And so what we hope to do is, provide
a product solution
that, again, is simple to understand.
You can start there.
And then hopefully what happens
throughout the course of all of that,
is it it simplifies the entire process
for everyone involved.
And so now that designer
who may have avoided the whole program
to begin with, can now really unlock
a lot of the value that that's there by,
being able to access a lot of that now.
You know,
yeah, we've got a number of things
we've introduced
in being created over the past 24 months
that, I think we'll really start to see
the potential come through
since we're making it much easier to
to step in. Yes.
Yeah. Can I build on that?
A little bit, I think.
100% agree with everything Evan said.
And I think, though, as in our minds,
when we went through this
transformation design, the designer was
the core of what we were thinking about.
Yeah, but there's a lot of benefits
that carries over to the consumer
and the benefits
actually are pretty similar.
So, tying back to the story,
I didn't quite finish it.
That's on me.
But the feedback that we received
was really threefold.
Not only were we too complex, yeah,
but we were priced too high,
which meant either we were noncompetitive
in the market or it took a lot of
discounts and national promotions
to get to a competitive price.
Or and if I, if I put my,
professional hat on the,
the part of these product lines
that require customization
were priced out of reach
or the value from the core line
up to the, customer,
the more semi-custom
line was too high of a job.
So how does a pro benefit?
I really in two ways.
As we reduced that complexity, we made
the pricing much more logical and simple.
So now if you've priced a kitchen
and you want to change one thing
the designer couldn't in the past
couldn't confidently
say you want to change the species, it's
going to change the price.
This amount, you want to change the door.
It's going to change the price.
This amount the designer couldn't.
You couldn't have that sort of one choice
price change matrix
that all exists today.
So it's much easier to
to make changes and understand quickly
the impact on the end consumer. Yeah.
The second is if you want to build a home,
you want to build a remodel
that requires
those custom heights and widths.
The the price to get
there isn't quite as much of a stretch.
You know, that's great.
I know you guys have been also holding
trainings for resource designers as well.
I've seen those trickle through.
And does that fall in line
with kind of the transformation
that's happening with Master Brand,
or is that something different?
No, that falls right in. Okay.
That's what I thought.
But I wanted to make sure, because I've,
I've actually been the one pushing
those out to designers, with the RCB team
to try to get people to attend.
And they've been filling
up. People seem very excited.
Designers, yeah, we I know Master
Brands has had to add
more training dates for our designers
to be able to attend.
So it seems like a lot of our resources
owners are really happy
with this transformation.
Like we've said before,
but master Brand is huge,
and all of our showrooms
have master brand in some capacity.
So I just I know
this is an exciting thing for not just.
Yeah, our designers, but like, those
designers trickle into our trade pros.
Because if it's easier for them
to work with master brand,
it's just going to make the whole process
with the trade pro easier as well.
But I think you hit on an important point
to of of the training
and some of the things we're just
providing in terms of tools to help smooth
this transition, because, you know,
we're we're fully sensitive, in fact,
that this represents
significant change for the designer.
And it's not always good. Right.
And and so some people,
you know, kind of brace and you know,
especially as we are rolling out
a brand new language, so to speak,
within our brands, that's hard.
But we believe, you know, in 12 months
we're going to be in much better position
to be competitive in the market.
That is that's amazing.
We we met in March of this year
with our sales leaders
and presented this concept.
And that's so it's very rare
that 6 or 7 months ahead of time,
we're thinking
about the change management.
But this is a big enough.
This is a big deal. Yeah.
And so we've we think we've pulled out
all the stops on this one.
That is awesome.
So how is SDK
plans, product lineup or design philosophy
shifted alongside,
the brand repositioning?
Yeah, I think,
you know, this gives us an opportunity,
kind of a reset, so to speak.
You know, I think what you have,
you know, in many cases you've got three
different series within this short
time and camper portfolio.
And they've been built as such over time.
It's been a little disjointed.
Well, we now have had the opportunity
to kind of reset and build
in a lot of logical connections now.
So it's much easier to move up
and down the portfolio.
But you know, one thing
we've we've certainly kept in mind
is that we need to stay on top of the
latest trends, and we are doubling down
as an organization
to make sure that we are focused on
exactly what consumers are really after.
And so, yeah,
you know, there's a renewed focus
not just to simplify,
but also to make sure we're
we're providing the things that consumers
are really after.
No, absolutely.
And we you spoke a little bit about,
you know, switching out a finish,
from the designer perspective.
Were there any like trending finishes
or like additional smart
storage features that have been added
to the lineup for these brands?
Any like specific maybe types of products
that have been out of that?
You can maybe sneak peek.
I don't know
if there's an officially launched yet,
but any that you can speak
on, would be great.
So we're looking at this from,
you know, we've got a big pricing aspect
that we've got to tackle.
And we know it is.
Mike, you mentioned earlier,
you know, it's overly complex.
So we were trying to simplify all of that.
then there is a, you know,
kind of a known culture piece of this
which you know,
we've got a common language
that we're going to throughout our master
brand brand.
So you learn one, it's much easier
to transition to others.
And then lastly,
you know what we try to do
is really clarify some value proposition
within each of these series.
Define exactly what these series are
and then make sure they're they're aligned
to what the consumers are asking for
and what they're seeking.
You know, what
they would expect at those price points.
And so, we've added some some features
and really that
no additional price, but things I think
people will be very excited about.
You know, the incorporation of,
of hardware in our semi-custom portfolio.
You mentioned, you know,
do we have, new and exciting finishes?
We do.
We've got three new finishes
coming out this year. Awesome.
I think you can say what they are. Yeah.
So the the designer training
is in two days from the recording of.
Oh yeah. So this will come out
for a couple of weeks. Perfect.
So maybe a first exclusive
sneak peak on this.
Yeah.
So, so we've got a tropic finish that.
That's exciting.
And it's a light blue that I think
is going to closely aligned with the
trends that we're seeing.
We have a nice
dark blue that that's available right now.
And I know you see my customer
bring that to our, semi-custom, line.
And then we've got a greenstone,
which is the next evolution of a really
a light finish.
And so we're very early stage.
We're very excited
about what that's going to do.
So that's great.
Seems like you're touching kind of all
points of what's trending right now
with cabinets.
A lot of blue is going on right now.
So that's very exciting.
speaking of these,
this collective of brands,
how do they differentiate itself
within, like, the rest of the brands?
We're not really talking about today,
but there's a ton more
that master brand has to offer.
How do those that differentiate
from each other?
Is it just the popularity or
or is there really an emphasis on these?
No, I can, I can take this one.
So they differentiate,
I think, in several ways.
In our industry
there's differentiation on across
competitors, across product lines,
in the customization capabilities of
what's really driven at the plant level.
Gotcha. Right.
The the color choices that you choose
to put in.
And plants that can do
custom color have specialty capabilities.
So you've got your
some have somewhere anywhere between 3
and 25 standard finishes.
And then you can you can
differentiate them on customization.
So there's a lot of different variables
in this industry
as I'm sure our listeners are fully aware.
But in our portfolio,
these four sister brands,
I'm gonna answer it in two different ways.
One, we are actually fixing
some of the differentiation,
some of the negative differentiation
through the common
nomenclature that Evan mentioned.
We actually don't want there
to be different
differentiation
in the names of the product clients.
Right.
We want to be a base 30 a b 30 2BA, b
30 in every MasterBrand brand that you sell.
So when you get started in our mantra line
or our nest or Mr.
Craft Line, We have a plan right now
for mantra to move into this common
nomenclature as well.
But but through this common nomenclature,
we think we're getting rid
of some of the negative differentiation.
Yeah. The positive differentiation.
We think of our
our portfolio as a spectrum.
So these sister brands partner
very well with our mantra line,
which next year we'll move to common
nomenclature okay.
And from mantra
they share a lot of the same finishes,
obviously the same door style,
but then you move into an entree
or a vibe or an echo
and you get a lot more options.
Then you move from those lines into
our trademarks are distinctions,
choice and signature.
And you get custom
hyphen with you get custom color.
You get a lot of additional options.
Bloom hardware,
but you still don't
have the full customization capabilities
that MasterBrand can bring.
You don't have the full finish
capabilities that MasterBrand can bring.
And so that's why as a as a dealership,
you may want to bring on a star marque
or an Omega or a Dura Supreme.
Okay.
To really take those capabilities
and those customizations
and the box design
as well to the next level.
Gotcha. Yes.
That makes a lot of sense.
You talked a little bit too about, budget.
How it's, more extensive
now with this transformation.
Can you speak a little bit more on that?
Like, will there be, three tiers
or like there like a lower tier
mid range, high tier?
I feel like that's
usually how that happens.
But I just want to learn more a little bit
about how
the budgeting is going to be with
with the options that'll be provided.
think what you're describing is
we call them series. Yes.
Inside of yeah.
Schrock,
Diamond, Kemper and Midcontinent. Yes.
So it gets a little complex.
I'll keep it as simple as I can. Okay.
We have two core series
is that we sell across the whole country.
Okay.
The first series you will know
as entr'acte or Vive or echo or Pivot.
That line has,
Evan could list off exactly what it has,
but a fixed number of doors,
a fixed set of finishes.
It's robust, really good quality work.
We've got a great plant in North Carolina.
Another one in Indiana that's making
these products, doing, doing great work
inside of those plants.
You know,
they are built for a little bit more scale
and so we can keep costs
down in those lines.
Gotcha.
However,
we also have plants out on the West Coast,
and another in Illinois
that has similar capabilities.
Builds the same box, the same finishes,
but with a little more capabilities.
And so with that, we can brand customized
that with gotcha and custom color.
They don't build quite at the same scale
as the others,
but it is the same Schrock portfolio,
the same Diamond cabinet.
And so that's our series two.
You're going to know
those ins trademark distinction,
just as I have already mentioned that,
and then
so those are really the two core series
we sell nationwide.
There are some additional series
attached to those that are.
So if you're on the East Coast,
you may get access to a series three
that has even more customization.
If you're on the West Coast, you may have
access to a full to a full access line.
Okay.
That is the same finishes
colors attached.
But that's kind of how
we think about these.
These series is and yes,
that makes total sense.
As we're kind of closing out
this episode, I want to learn more about
when we can expect these launches,
to come out specifically.
I know
we talked a little bit about it today,
but when can they actually be expected
to be in showrooms or start popping up?
Yeah, absolutely. Great question.
So very excited about this.
It's going to hit the market
on October 6th.
So that that's coming up
and we're not just a little few short
weeks away it seems.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's crazy because we've been
working on this for a long time now.
Yeah. It's
nice to see this come to fruition.
And we've got more exciting products
coming out early next year.
And so we've got a lot to be excited
about.
We're we're really hoping that excitement
translates to to prosource
their designers and in the market
know that that is fantastic.
So keep your eyes out.
Sometime in October 6th you said.
But I'm sure,
it might take a while
for some of the showrooms to fully adopt
into getting all of these up.
For people to see.
Last question I have for you guys is
how do you expect this transformation
to impact its role within MasterBrand,
the family of brands
and the industry at large?
It's kind of a loaded question. Yeah.
I mean,
I think this full, full disclosure,
I think coming out of Covid, these brands
have struggled to find their place,
their home, their future home.
Yeah.
They are historically very well known.
Yes. Very, strong brands. Yeah.
I think in our portfolio, over that same
period of time,
mantra had a really strong,
value proposition. It's continued to grow.
I think this is what these brands need
to come back to the place
they formerly held in the market,
where when you look at
at this price point,
this what we call semi-custom
or value
semi-custom price point in the market,
those are the go to brands, you know,
because they've got the same quality,
the same, strengths
that they've always had.
But now they are easy for a new designer
to use.
Yeah, they have easy upgrade capabilities
for that designer,
for that customer that's ready to
push a little bit upmarket.
We're very excited for this.
I don't think it changes
what they are in the market.
Yeah, I think it changes the power
and the ability for them
to meet that expectation that the designer
and the consumers always had.
Yeah, it elevates
them even higher than they are.
And for any trade pros
listening to this, it making it easier
for your designer or your account manager
just makes it way easier for you as well.
So definitely go into your pro source,
ask about some of these changes.
Ask what MasterBrand has to offer
if you're on line,
is it MasterBrand.com?
or where can they find find you online?
You can find us at MasterBrand.com.
Or, to find most of our products,
you'll look underneath, the brand itself.
Yes. Portfolio of brands. Yes.
There's there's a lot to look out there,
which is impressive.
But thank you guys
so much for your time on today's podcast.
We appreciate you guys coming on.
Sharing a little bit
about what MasterBrand has to offer
in the next coming months.
Very exciting.
And I'm very happy for you guys.
Thank you for the opportunity.
Thank you very much.
Thank you for joining us today
on The ProSource Podcast.
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