How Can Technology And Data Innovate Equine Welfare?

Show Notes

Dr Emmanuelle Van Erck, and MSD’s own Equine Marketing & Technical Manager, Blaise Scott Morris, team up to teach us about innovative technology and data-driven equipment that can change the face of equine medicine as we know it.

We ask Emmanuelle how she became interested in the application of technology in her practice and why she is looking at data to move the profession forwards.

We discuss how data is a fantastic tool to improve your horses' training and explore reasons why there has been resistance to using data-driven technology in the equine field, despite the clear evidence for improved welfare in sports.

Our guests explain how this technology can be implemented by general practitioners and clients, and how an app could support the bond between the owner and horse.

We then move on to discuss the technical innovations happening at MSD and, as someone at the forefront of equine innovation, what Blaise’s job really entails on a day-to-day basis.

Blaise explains how MSD’s new thermal microchip is empowering owners whilst improving safety for both vets and horses. By developing innovative products, we can revolutionise the way equine healthcare works.

Useful Links:

Equine Sports Medicine Practice https://www.esmp.be

Equimetre by Arioneo
https://training.arioneo.com/en/racehorse-heart-rate-monitor-equimetre-flat-harness/

HomeAgain® Thermochip®
https://www.homeagain.co.uk/about-microchips/thermochip

MSD Research Bursary
https://www.msd-animal-health.co.uk/company-overview/research-bursary/

Join us each month for a new episode of The KBHH Equine Vets Podcast and stay informed on the latest developments in equine health and wellness. To get in touch with the show, please email [e-mail].

What is The KBHH Equine Vets Podcast?

Welcome to The KBHH Equine Vets Podcast, brought to you by MSD Animal Health.
 
Join our expert hosts, Dr. Ebony Escalona and Dr. Naomi Mellor, both experienced equine veterinarians, each month as they bring you informative and engaging discussions about all things equine health and wellness. 

The KBHH Equine Vets Podcast is aimed at vets who want to know more about how to look at things differently in equine, from what ‘flexing’ could mean as an equine vet, to the latest technology developments and looking after your own wellbeing. Ebony and Naomi will share the exciting developments within the equine world that our guests are leading in. With a focus on looking at life in equine practice through a different lens, our podcast will feature interviews with leading experts in their field. Whether you are a seasoned equine vet or a GP vet looking to expand your knowledge of equine medicine, our podcast will provide you with valuable insights and information.

So, join us each month for a new episode of The KBHH Equine Vets Podcast and stay informed on the latest developments in equine health and wellness. To get in touch with the show, please email [e-mail].

Blaise Scott-Morris: Hello and
welcome to the KBHH podcast

where we are looking at doing
things differently in the equine

industry, from new technologies
to equine behaviour to wellbeing

within equine practice. We've
got something for you. So sit

back, relax, and I hope you
enjoy the show.

Ebony Escalona: So we're here
for another exciting episode of

The MSD podcast where we're
exploring doing things

differently in equine. And when
Naomi and I, Blaise, putting a

little heads together to think
about the things we wanted to

bring forward. The woman that we
are about to interview

definitely struck a chord.

Naomi Mellor: Emmanuelle Van
Erck who runs equine sports

medicine clinic, and she is a
European diploma holder in

equine medicine. She is the team
vet for multiple Olympic

eventing and showjumping teams.
She is an all round superstar,

as well as an amazing
communicator. And we really

wanted to get her on today to
talk about the use of tech and

data in equine practice. And
because she has been doing some

fantastic work. So Emmanuelle,
welcome. Thank you so much. It's

great to have you with us.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: Thank you
so much, Naomi. It's great to be

with you and Ebony, I follow all
the things that you do. And I'm

really excited to share this
with you. I think we're living

super exciting times. We've got
access to technology like never

before. And I think that we
really need to take the most of

it to our practice to make our
lives easier and probably more

interesting as well.

Naomi Mellor: So how did you
become interested in the

application of technology in
your practice?

Emmanuelle Van Erck: Before my
life in practice, I used to work

in academia. And it was a time
where you had to run horses on

the treadmill to be able to do
exercise tests, because you had

to hook up the horse to
electrodes. If you wanted to

have an ECG, you had to use your
regular endoscope to do dynamic

endoscopy. And then all of a
sudden, these wearables started

to appear. So we had telemetry
ECGs, that you could hook up on

the horse, you could use
overground endoscopes, you had

watches that were normally
dedicated for human athletes

that you could kind of tweak to
give you information on the

exercising horse like speed and
geolocation and things like

that. So that really stirred my
interest because it was my exit

from academia and excuse to
start my own private practice,

because I had all the tools now.
And I could get rid of my link

to the treadmill. And of course,
in the beginning, we were using

devices that were made for
humans. And so all the software

that went with it, we weren't
talking about smartphones at the

time, that was 12 years ago. And
the software that you had was

pretty difficult to navigate.
Each time something new could

improve the easiness with which
you can gain the information was

to me super interesting, because
I started by collecting speed

with a pola watch, and then ECG
with a televet. And then I had

to sync the data. And it took me
a lot of time, when you get back

home after a long day on the
road, the last thing you want to

do is sit in front of the
computer and try and merge all

that data.

Ebony Escalona: Incredible. It's
such an amazing time, isn't it?

We're living in a time where
stuff is developing. So So what

kind of data are you looking at?
And why? Like you've just said

there about speed and ECG. What
else is kind of happening that

you're supporting the marginal
gains of incredible athletes at

Olympic level with the altcoins
and the humans, it'd be lovely

to kind of hear about what's
going on there.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: In human
sports, exercise testing has

become compulsory. So if we're
looking at applying it to

horses, you want to know how the
athlete functions. So that if

ever the shifts away from what
is considered the best or the

norm, then you can wonder why
that is? Is it because he's

overtrained? Is it because he is
undertrained? Or is it because

there's a subclinical disease
that's lurking in the background

and we get cues on how the horse
feels by measuring a number of

parameters. And so I think that
the really basic parameters,

like speed and heart rate, give
you two really important

information. Speed gives you an
information on the workload,

what amount of work is my horse
doing? And then the duration as

well, how much time is he
spending at this particular

speed? And then the heart rate
gives you a really sensitive

measurements on how the horse
reacts to that workload. If the

horse has cardio respiratory
condition, pain, or any kind of

painful condition, then his
heart rate will be abnormally

high as well. Because it's
imposes a stress on the horse,

it helps you to follow not just
training, it's really a very

interesting way to record subtle
things that you might not see in

an obvious way when the horse is
standardised exercise.

Ebony Escalona: Yeah, that's
subtle way. It's it's almost

like it's personalised with
healthcare part, which I just

find so fascinating. Because
that individual might be sitting

on a bell shaped curve that
isn't normal for maybe you know,

the rest of that horse
population, but actually is

performing at a good level or
not as the case may be. Yes. I

mean, I became super fascinated
when I did my PhD looking at the

gut health of horses, in racing,
and just realising Yeah, we're

at the tip of the iceberg. When
it comes to data we can collect

there for personalised dietary
stuff, you know, or, or

antibiotic treatment, etc.

Naomi Mellor: Yeah, it's
amazing. It's amazing. I

remember you touching on your
capacity from looking at your

data, to be able to predict
which of the elite horses in the

teams you look after was going
to perform the best. And you

knew you said you knew in
advance at the Olympics, which

one you were pretty sure was
going to win? Which one wasn't?

Can you just talk a little bit
about the sort of trends you

were seeing? And how you knew
that? You know, you've obviously

got an amazing Emmanuelle
crystal ball there. But can you

just talk a little bit about how
you can make your future

predictions and, and what sorts
of things you're looking at to

to know that in advance, I
guess, because I think people

don't realise that you can not
only look historically, but

potentially look forwards as
well.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: You're
trying to draw a picture with a

lot of different elements. So of
course, your clinical

examination is, you know, the
basic, you've got anything that

you see that could be a sign of
a problem, then, you know, it's

no use setting off doing loads
of exercise tests, because you

already know that something is
wrong there. If we take the

example of Olympic horses,
there's a lot of politics as

well, because the person who's
going to select the horse might

not like this rider or that
horse, doing exercise tests as a

way of setting the same
standards for everyone, and

seeing how the horses fare over
a standard test. And so it might

seem paradoxical. But if I take
the example of show jumpers,

they're not optimally trained
for what we asked them to do. If

you look at their day, they're
usually going to the walker a

little bit 15 to 30 minutes, and
then there'll be ridden for an

hour and then the rest of the
time they spend doing nothing in

a box. Not a lot of them go out
to the paddock because horses,

you know how they are, they can
get a little bit naughty, and

then hurt themselves. The riders
don't realise, you know how very

standard their training is.
Walk, trot and canter. They

never jump at home. They seldom
go uphill and downhill or go out

to the seaside and canter in the
water or things like that. But

it's very important that if
you're trying to build up the

horse's body for a particular
competition, you need sometimes

to go into the higher intensity
of exercise. And I know that for

injury reasons, they don't want
to do that and jumping the

horses, but they could very well
go out and canter on a cantering

track, or yeah, go up and
downhill because these are

exercises that are really good
for the power muscles that they

need to go over the jumps. Doing
the exercise tests prior to top

level competitions and allows
you to see a little bit what

everybody's been doing in their
own garden. And then compare how

the horses are doing and one
related to the other. If you're

doing that well in advance
several months in advance that

allows the rider to get a chance
to adapt. And if the horse is

not progressing, then ask
yourself why I think an

important part of animal
welfare, because you are

choosing the horse that is fit
to perform to go out and do his

best performance. Now I've been
working in sports medicine for

25 years. It's taken me almost
that long to convince riders

that they should do for the
horses like what football

players do or rugby players do
or swimmers do, which is take

care of their own health and
whenever they see that they're

in the red zone, kind of slow
down and maybe recover. It goes

also the other way. We've had
eventing horses, where we

thought that a particular horse
was coping well with his

training, and then you look at
his parameters, and you can see

that he's really low. So we're
not starting to bring that horse

to the interesting work zones,
he's really under worked. And

you can say, well, we know maybe
you can push that horse a little

bit more, and then all of a
sudden, it becomes the best

horse in the stable because he,
he was undetected, before we got

these tools to measure.

Naomi Mellor: Just finding it a
bit too easy. Yeah, it's

amazing. Because one of my kind
of big burning questions, I

guess, that I often have is why
given that every amateur human

athlete, whether you're a
runner, or a cyclist, or

triathlete or whatever,
everybody has a Garmin, and

everybody's tracking, your watch
tells you when you need to be in

recovery, it tells you when your
your detraining, or even as

amateur athletes, all over this
in human sports. Why do you

think there's been such a
resistance to do anything like

this in equine, because I've
come out of working in racing,

and I cannot tell you how little
is done, I still find it

remarkable that even now people
involved in any equine sport,

are probably looking at this
data on themselves, but have no

idea about their horse. And I
was wondering what your take on

that was and why you think it is
that we haven't adopted it more

readily?

Emmanuelle Van Erck: Yeah,
that's a really good point.

There's several explanations.
The first one is that horses are

such phenomenal athletes in
comparison to us that they don't

require the same amount of sweat
and tears that we put into

training. Horses train really
quickly and detrain very slowly.

So they're remarkable athletes.
So I think that that's one of

the points. The second point,
and you pointed that out really

clearly is that there is a
reluctance to change. We've been

doing this forever. So we're not
going to do any differently. But

I think seeing the success of a
system like the equimetre from

arioneo has given me some cues
as to why that is, and it's

because it wasn't tailored to
the trainer's needs or the

riders needs. And it was too
complicated to use. If I take

the example of the equimetre,
that is a device that allows to

measure loads of parameters like
speed, heart rate, ECG, stride

frequency, stride length, a lot
of different things. I think the

what really was a game changer
was that this system reads the

horses chip. And so you don't
need to connect the device to

any computer like we used to
have to do. Here, you scan a

check number, you automatically
have the horse's name, and

everything is automatized. So
you just need to put a girth

underneath the words a saddle
connected to the equimetre. It's

not at all time consuming. It's
very user friendly. What are you

interested in? Are you
interested in you know the speed

over a furlong? Are you
interested in how the horse

recovers. And so they've been
working very hard on doing a

simple platform, everything is
then streamed to the to the

cloud. And, and you've got all
the training with all the

horses, you can compare a horse
with itself over time, you can

compare your horse with all the
other horses of the same age in

the yard over similar exercises,
or when they were on the same

racetrack, etc. So it gives you
a lot of information but in a

very simple way. That's really,
really exciting because it is

going to allow us to do what has
been done for human athletes. So

it's following the training. And
then when you have things that

are abnormal, you can get like
signals saying, you know, you

should look into this exercise
because this horse, this horses

exercise is really getting worse
and worse. And maybe we should

look into it and see why this is.

Ebony Escalona: Yeah, as someone
who, unlike the three of you who

have been involved with
competition horses, very, very

high level. I've always been
involved in the welfare aspects

of horses and actually what I'm
hearing now and haven't even

thought about it is actually how
this data can be such a good

welfare piece of kit, not just
finding your gold as it were.

It's that welfare piece of kit,
isn't it? If there was using

general practice or using
working animals in other

countries, scenarios and
cultures? Is there a subtle

problem we can do something
about? Or is this horse unfit

for purpose, this gives you
actual evidence, not just, I

think you should try a different
horse. It's like saying, you

know, this is data. And I think
that that having that data

that's so clear, I think that's
a fantastic thing to have.

Because it yeah provides that
very clear evidence from a

welfare point of view. And I
hadn't Yeah, I hadn't really

thought about that.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: I think
it's gonna be really important

for the future of sports because
there are a lot of animal rights

movements that want to ban
sports and horses. And I think

that will really be a mistake,
because I see horses everyday

that love what they're doing,
and would be miserable if they

were left in a box, doing
nothing or in a paddock. Right

now we're doing some work with
different racing authorities

that want to improve the way
that they look at horses during

training and the Hong Kong
Jockey Club has been investing

quite a lot of money into that
trying to prevent the horses

from having injuries, cardiac
arrhythmias, exercise induced

pulmonary haemorrhage, we've had
in France, a horse recently that

had, you know, was performing
poorly during training, and not

gaining any weight and really
trainers, he said I don't know

what's wrong with it. But it's
not conditioning like all the

other horses. He's He's not
getting into condition, we

looked at his ECG that was very
arrhythmic at the peak phases of

exercise. And then when we
investigated, he already had a

primary cardiac problem. It was
compatible with lower levels of

exercise, but not with what is
requested of a racehorse. And so

thank God, you know, that you
have identified prior to the

horse participating to a race,
because probably he might have

been injured during a race
because of that underlying

condition. So he was retired, he
now belongs to a very nice lady

who just rides him for leisure,
and he's a happy horse. And

everybody's happy because the
trainer also does not have a bad

reputation for running horses
that aren't fit to run, and

hasn't lost money and time and
training for a horse that could

not have coped with it on the
long term.

Ebony Escalona: That's how I
have a very, very expensive

lawnmower in my own home. He was
one of my research horses, and

he came home with me.

Naomi Mellor: And you're so
grateful for him every single

day.

Ebony Escalona: My bank balance
isn't but I am.

Naomi Mellor: No, no, no. And so
Emmanuelle, I just wanted to

wing this round to kind of
practitioners because I think

some people might be listening
to this driving around thinking,

okay, so it's fine for fancy
Emmanuelle and her Olympic

people, or it's fine if you're
at the Hong Kong Jockey Club,

and you've got all this money,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So

but I guess, be thinking about
more first opinion applications,

how do you envisage that,
whether it's, you know, things

like the Ireneo forms of data
collection with the Aqua metre

or or anything else? We've been
talking about? How would you see

the work that you do being
implemented by by practitioners

at the cold face I guess, and
and can you give us any tips or

thoughts on that as well?

Emmanuelle Van Erck: Sure. So,
we talked about the Equimetre by

arioneo. But there are lots of
other connected devices that are

really exciting, and that allow
you to follow your patients,

your equine patients from a
distance, you're an ambulatory

practice, you can't be next to
every horse like a practitioner

that would be in a clinic could
could afford to be. So it's a

way of giving responsibility to
the owner and saying, Well, this

is a device to survey your
horse, it could be like a

connected camera, you have
little cameras that are very

easy to place in the horses box,
and they've got with artificial

intelligence. So they're not
going to give you 24 hours of

footage that you know, you're
going to look in accelerated,

they're going to pick up the way
that the horse stands how much

time he spends lying down, if he
spends too much time lying down

or being agitated, then it will
give you a signal to say, hey,

something's wrong. So instead of
staying next to the horse and

wondering if the call is gonna
go one way or the other, you

could use that. You have other
systems that do the same thing,

but without video footage, where
you evaluate the horses heart

rate, respiratory rate,
temperature level of activity,

because they have inertial
motion units that tell you what

he's doing. And there again, if
you've left a horse that you've

seen for colic, and you're not
quite sure how it's gonna go,

then you can place that piece of
equipment on the horse for a

period of time and then you'll
get called whenever it's

necessary. If you're looking at
active horses, it's also a way

of teaching the owners how their
horses are. So there are some

simplified systems for riders
where you've got an inertial

motion unit on a girth, for
instance, and you can evaluate

basically, how much time the
horse spends walk, trot and

canter, left hand, right hand,
if he's symmetrical in his gait.

It's not a lameness locator in
any sense, but it's just a way

of, you know, recording what's
happening. It's a way of

creating a link between the
horse and the rider, a kind of

insights into the horse into the
way the horse functions. And if

something is off, because these
systems can also record your

sessions on and on, then it
gives you a link to your vet. I

think it's going to give a lot
of vocal power to the horses.

Ebony Escalona: Yeah, and I
suppose as well, it's a vocal

part of the horses. It's, it's
deepening our language with

them. But it's also supporting
the bond isn't it between the

owner, the horse and the vet.
It's and it's also a supportive

of of compliance, which is only
ever a good thing in this day

and age, but actually acts as a
real conduit doesn't it for us

all to like co agree on what's
actually happening or what we

think is happening, or we assume
is happening.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: Another
thing that might be useful as

well, because we're talking
about compliance. And we're

working with another company
that is testing these little

pods, that measure general
ambience, that also gives them

an alarm whenever there's too
much dust, too much co2, too

much humidity, how the
temperatures evolving, that

gives them hard core objective
evidence of what's wrong.

Naomi Mellor: On the farm animal
side now, farm animal clinicians

spend a lot of time doing herd
health planning, it's all about

preventative medicine. And the
kinds of modifications you're

talking about are through data
acquisition, and planning and

giving people that those kinds
of clear strategies on the

welfare side, on the
environmental side, on the

training side, which is so much
more around preventative health

care, rather than firefighting a
problem. And it really strikes

me that as we move towards tecjh
and data acquisition, that is

what we're going to be doing
with a lot of horses. And

actually, that's a great bond to
have with the owner, but it is a

different relationship to my
horse has cut his leg, let me

phone my vet.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: Exactly.

Naomi Mellor: This is so cool. I
think it's so interesting.

Ebony Escalona: It's bringing
the science back to the art and

science of veterinary medicine.
It's wonderful, because it

allows people with veterinary
passports to not only be that

clinician, but to use that
scientific brain that they also

might want to be using you
become the analyst again, you

get to, in some respects, use a
bit of your research acumen in

daily practice. And I think that
that's a lovely way to be

flexing your mind as well. So
it's a it's also giving your,

your brain something else to
think about and a challenge and

a problem to solve, which is
something that we all kind of

crave, I think as a profession.

Naomi Mellor: Well Emanuelle,
thank you so much for joining us

today. It's been an absolute
pleasure to chat this through.

I've really enjoyed hearing all
about it. And I know it will

have been really useful for
everyone listening. So, Thank

you so much for your time. We
are super grateful.

Emmanuelle Van Erck: My
pleasure. It's been great

talking to you guys.

Ebony Escalona: I'm gonna report
back on how Albert and I fare

with our data collection.

Blaise Scott-Morris: Many thanks
to Emmanuelle for that really

interesting look at what she's
doing. And now on to Blaise from

MSD.

Ebony Escalona: Well, we're
quite excited because we've got

one of MSDs own in the hot seat
today haven't we Naomi, which

we've been wanting to, to pick
her brains.

Naomi Mellor: I know. She's
somebody who has been deeply

involved in this project from
the very beginning, bringing

together all the wonderful
people that you have been

hearing in this series. And we
are absolutely delighted that

Blaise is with us today. Hello,
my friend. How are you?

Blaise Scott-Morris: Hi, guys,
it's good to be here.

Naomi Mellor: It's good to have
you. She is the equine marketing

and technical manager at MSD.
Blaise, just tell us a little

bit about yourself. What does
that job actually mean? Because

I think when everyone has a
fancy job title, it's always

useful to have a clarification
of what you actually do.

Blaise Scott-Morris: Yeah, it's
a big title. So I'm a

diversified vet. I came out of
practice about eight years ago

into like a more traditional
industry vet role. And then

whilst I was in industry, I was
like ah I want to learn more

about business, did an MBA and
then came across to a marketing

technical role about three years
ago. And that literally means

that I oversee the marketing for
that equine department. And

that's traditional marketing and
the forecasting for all our

products, but I also still get
to do the technical side of the

products. So that's talking to
r&d, that supporting practices,

that's going out to practices
still, which is what I really

love. So I still get to go out
and see people who are real vets

so yeah, so it's quite a broad
roll but it means I get to

indulge quite a few passions of
mine.

Ebony Escalona: I love this with
this diversification Blaise, you

know and doing the MBA and being
in a company where you're

working with r&d, you're clearly
someone who's interested in

innovation, interested in in
technology, interested in what

what we can do next to support
animal health, veterinary

professional life. So what does
that innovation or being at that

forefront mean to you personally?

Blaise Scott-Morris: For me,
it's always been about not

leaving behind my roots as a vet
and sort of giving back. So it

is literally looking for ways
that we can either improve

animal health, or that we can
improve vets life and health, as

well. And it's how do we support
that, which sometimes if you're

looking at, you know, one of our
pharmaceutical products, you

could be like, how does that fit
in, but it's more bringing it

all together. And as you said,
in the innovation and saying,

Okay, well, we've got this
product, you know, it would

really be nice to maybe team it
up with this other ability. So

can we do that? And being part
of MSD, we have this big

overarching, it's very
corporate, the science of

healthier animals, but that sort
of fits in because you can go to

them and say, This is what we've
got, this is what we want. Do we

have the capabilities? And we're
always expanding and buying new

businesses, so sometimes it's
like, no, we don't, but wait, or

no, we don't, but we do in
cattle, go and have a chat to

someone else. So that's the
beauty of doing what I do. And

innovation is that it might not
even be pure innovation as such,

it might be adaptation. So it's
nice to be able to have the

ideas. Sometimes it's a flat.
No, that's ridiculous. But it's

it's that's the beauty I find of
working for a massive company. I

know it's not for everyone. But
I do get to hold on to those

values and then try and
intersperse that with the values

of the company.

Ebony Escalona: That cross
pollination as well Naomi, you

can hear that currently, like
the cross pollination between

you're not just there on your
own trying to fix the problem,

you've got a whole team of
experts in their own field.

Naomi Mellor: I really liked
what you said about not leaving

behind your roots as well,
because I think sometimes

wrongly, people think that when
you leave practice, you've

stopped being a quote unquote,
proper vet, which I know is

something that you, Ebs, have
come across a lot with your work

in VSGD. So it's really, really
lovely to hear that. Blaise, do

you want to just talk to us a
little bit about what

innovations you've been coming
up with recently at MSD? I know

that we've now got a thermal
microchips on the market, which

is very exciting.

Blaise Scott-Morris: Yeah. So we
launched thermo chip, HomeAgain

Thermochip, at the end of last
year at the end of 22. And so

the HomeAgain Thermochips were
actually a company we acquired

and they have the technology.
And so they were, we then took

it forward and launched it. And
at first, I was a little bit

like, Oh, what is this? I came
back from maternity leave and

basically got handed the
project. But then I started to

see that, okay, it's essentially
a normal microchips that would

read as a normal chip that any
reader can read. But then

essentially, it will also read,
a horses, or cats and dogs

because it works for them to,
temperature from at the site of

implantation, which initially
can be like, Oh, it's not a

rectal. Obviously, we were very
used to rectal thermometers. But

then if you looking into the,
into the science of it, you

realise that it's not about
being a rectal temperature, it's

being about building trends.
It's about empowering owners to

be able to take a little bit of
control of their horses health.

And then there's also the safety
aspect, particularly in equine

practice for vets, you don't
have to be bothering about a

back end horse. Obviously, these
chips that hopefully they can't

go into horses that already have
a chip. So it's foals, it's

getting them into foals now for
a few years time. But you know,

in hospitalisation situations,
which could be a foal or an

adult horse, they, they have
massive health and safety

implications for the vets and
just ease of use as well. And

then for owners, we're out there
at the moment, trying to speak

to a lot of breeders and
professionals around getting

these into into the foals so
that then they have a health

snapshot, essentially, of the
horses on their yards. And

there's a bigger piece we're
looking towards around

biosecurity events, hopefully
for the future. Because the

temperature and the ID chip
number, they're bound together.

So you can just read
temperatures as part of your

passport checks upon entry.

Naomi Mellor: That's so cool,
because actually think about

like the EHV outbreak in Spain
in showjumping. And not that

that could have been avoided.
But if we were looking at their

chip when they arrived and
you've got the temperature

ingrained into that just gives
you so much more information

about those horses when they're
coming in.

Blaise Scott-Morris: Yeah, and
what we think is baseline might

not be baseline for that horse
and we'd already know that

because it would have been taken
at home or on the yard and for

the future. We'd love to
obviously go once we've got more

data around it we'd like to say
a Shetlands temperature is

normally this, a thoroughbreds
temperature is normally that

and, and so wouldn't necessarily
avoid every situation but you

could always say well, that
horses half a degree of lwhat it

normally is, maybe they need
isolating for two days, three

days. So yeah, it's it's there's
definitely wider applications to

it in every part of equine
industry. I see.

Ebony Escalona: There's just so
much scope there, we could

probably talk for half an hour
on each one of the points you've

just raised there. But how are
we monitoring it? It's all good

and well having the chip but
then, you know, how are we

empowering the owners, the
carers to actually monitor how

do we enhance that, that kind of
personalised monitoring and then

support?

Blaise Scott-Morris: It's an
ongoing process, getting the

chips into the horses is also
the first step. And then the

readers Bluetooth the
temperatures, and you can link

them up with an app. And we're
also working on like a behind

the scenes piece about how this
obviously data is managed, as

well. So that you know, there is
a future peice around being able

to provide health trends and
that sort of thing. And the

getting the chips into the
horses and getting this launch

is just sort of the first step
on our journey.

Naomi Mellor: That's super cool.
And you mentioned apps there,

which I, just exploded over the
last couple of years, everybody

has an app for pretty much
everything now. And I think we

would all be in agreement that
there's so much useful stuff

happening in the app market. How
do you envisage the we can

enhance that relationship
between vets, animal health care

professionals, nurses,
practices, and owners or

trainers of horses as well.

Blaise Scott-Morris: So I think
as you've probably alluded to,

it's a digital piece, because we
have the technology or we're

working towards the technology
around you know, an owner has a

phone, can input data about
their horses health, which I see

in a long term somehow transfers
to the practice, it allows them

to see what's going on, when I
was talking about thermal

chipping, the first step for us,
I envisage a future around

technology for MSD, and are
supporting that interaction

between horse owners and vets
and the data we can help them

collect. And it's around, you
know, helping horse owners to

understand if they do need to
call a vet, spotting signs

earlier, that sort of thing. It
definitely sits around a digital

interaction, and exactly what
that looks like right now. It

could be an app, it could be
whatever the next phase of

digital transformation is, it's
exciting to think the

possibilities are quite wide
right now.

Ebony Escalona: It's lovely to
say these things. And when we

think about them in that kind of
future sense, they sound great,

but there's so many steps to get
there. You know, with your

experience, how can we be
encouraging practice owners,

organisations, veterinary
professionals, to keep iterating

and developing themselves in
their own practice in the way

that they work in what they use?

Blaise Scott-Morris: I would say
my first, it might be a plea, is

be open minded, like when the
thermochips were presented to me

when I came back off mat leave,
my first thing was like, Oh,

what, oh, is this a yes? Or is
this a no? Like, I wasn't sure.

And then you look into it. So I
think the first thing is be open

minded. Not everything is going
to be right for you or right for

your practice. But it's, it's
making that time to look at it

and say, do you know what, this
could really work. Everyone's

got different pulls on their
time, and pressures that they're

under. And obviously, we know,
the whole of the vet industry is

under a lot of pressure at the
moment. So it's finding those

things that are really going to
help you find efficiencies,

provide the best level of care
that you can, and also work with

your owners. Like most of our
owners, one of the joys I got

from being in practice, was
sometimes working with my

owners, there was some I didn't
get so much joy from, but it's

that collaboration piece as well.

Naomi Mellor: I think that's
perfect. It's exciting. I think

the future is exciting. You
know, we we spoke with

Emmanuelle about the sort of
future of tech and data and data

gathering and analytics in
equine practice and how she's

using them and how we might be
moving forward with that, from a

clinical perspective. But I
think, also from that horse

health, owner relationships, and
more hands off approach, I think

as well. It's really exciting as
to what we can be doing with all

of that. And I think you guys
are leading the way on that one.

Blaise Scott-Morris: That's the
hope, the vision.

Ebony Escalona: The other thing
excites me on top of that, I

agree with absolutely everything
Naomi said, what excites me, the

little researcher in me is like
it, we actually have access to

real whole face data for
research that actually helps to

improve the field side, stable
side, not some theoretical thing

that's not anywhere close to
actually the horse and how it is

used. And for me, I'm most
excited about the research that

can be done by practitioners.
And so many veteran

professionals would love to have
more say in research, but it's

too far to go into the
traditional academic realms.

It's not possible. So I feel
there's also collaboration

between our researchers, our
specialists and our general

practitioner actually having a
say in the research that they,

the questions that they really
want answered. And I find that

so exciting.

Naomi Mellor: Yeah, 100% Me too.
I think the future with data and

tech, and research is just
enormous. I mean, there's so

much data out there already.
It's almost like theres too much

to harness. And we don't quite
know what to do with it yet. But

I think that is going to become
clearer over a period of time.

And whether that's through
projects supported by people

like you Blaise, or
practitioners on the ground in

conjunction with academics and
universities, I think there's

the future is exciting. And the
possibilities are kind of

endless, really, which is super
cool. If listeners of this

podcast are keen to be thinking
about how they can do on the

ground research, I think that's
definitely something that we

would love to hear about either
through MSD, or, or through VSG,

as well, that, that piping up
with ideas is how things get off

the ground. And I think if
people have got them, then

certainly there's places to go
now where you can put them out

to people and that things can
happen, which is so cool.

Blaise Scott-Morris: 100%, we
run a research bursary for,

well, students and nurses and
vets in practice, in general

practice, that's obviously a
little piece of funding and

support from that. But as you
said, you know, the data we can

potentially collect in the
future is almost mind blowing.

And not being a data analyst.
Yeah, that the ways we could use

it is really exciting, I think
the possibilities that it

presents to us.

Naomi Mellor: And that listeners
is the beauty of podcasting

because we had not discussed
that. And I didn't know that MSD

had a research grant for
practitioners. So there you go,

if anyone feels like getting in
touch students, nurses or vets.

That sounds very cool. Where can
people find out more details

about that Blaise?

Blaise Scott-Morris: So it'll be
on the MSD website. It's also on

our LinkedIn pages. There is a
specific link, which I will put

in the notes for this show.

Ebony Escalona: Look, I think
you can probably tell, all three

of our voices got more excited
and rapid by the end of this

podcast, because we are three
women and equine veterinary

practitioners and stay
versifiers and diversifiers that

really do care about the future,
the future of innovation, the

future of animal health, the
future of our working lives as

veterinary professionals and I
think that was just a lovely

vignette Blaise, showcasing not
only what you as an individual

and veterinary professional
member within this wonderful

global community, but also, it's
so lovely to hear culturally,

what MSD are really willing to
trial and take to the fore and

collaborate. And you know, with
even that research piece there,

it just goes to show you're
looking at it from all angles.

So I'm really really excited to
keep watching this space for

MSD. And really excited as well
to hear what our listeners are

going to have after the back of
hearing not just this episode,

but all the episodes we've
recorded have all been like, we

would just love to continue
these conversations. So massive

thank you Blaise.

Blaise Scott-Morris: 100%.
What an amazing show. Many

thanks to today's guests. If you
want more information, have a

look at the show notes or drop
us a line at [e-mail]