Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Podcast by a Panhandle Surf Angler for all anglers of any level. We will talk weekly to guests that are anglers and also industry professionals. I want you to walk away from this podcast with some knowledge either refreshed or new for you to become a better angler. Though it will start in the Panhandle of Florida, it will be around the entire United States so we can all learn something about fishing in different regions.
Brian Demo (00:00:01):
This episode of Finding Demo Surf Fishing is being brought to you by the sinker guy. Head on over to the sinker guy.com and take a look at all the stuff that chip's got going on in the Sinker guy garage. Need to get your hands on Sputniks. It's in his name. He's got you covered there. Maybe some terminal tackle. Got that stuff easily for you to get your hands on. Hmm. Something about the Bruno rig. Yep. Fishing rigs. Plenty of 'em. The thing's been catching quite a bit. Also, the entire setup to get your hands on for mortician rigs and pieces like that. So, lots of good stuff to get your hands on if you want it, you really can. Not too hard. All right, well this week we're getting into it and I hope you're ready, cuz I know it's gonna be fun.
Brian Demo (00:01:10):
All right, welcome to a new episodes, a new week. Hope you're doing well wherever you are. And you've been catching a bunch of fish This week. We're doing a little digital road trip up to North Carolina and we're talking with a name you've probably heard of before if you've been fishing ever in your life. Yeah, we're talking with Mr. Tommy Farmer. That's right. Carolina Cast Pro. You can find all his other stuff. His information in his sale market office. Let's see here. Shop Knowledge, lots of pieces all put together on his website@carolinacastpro.com. He doesn't need a big introduction. World champion Castor. Lots of people have gone to his seminars and come out saying, yeah, learned a ton, super successful, feeling great about it and utilizing the knowledge that he's shared with them and they're being successful. So, I hope you're ready. Hope you got your notepads out cuz it's gonna be a good episode. All right. Well, without further ado, welcome to the show, sir. Thank you for coming on.
Tommy Farmer (00:02:06):
Glad to be here.
Brian Demo (00:02:08):
So you, I love the background here. I'm all looking at, I was like, nice, like North Carolina flag some signatures. I see some plaques. And knowing what I've heard and seen about you all this, I'm, I'm guessing that might have to do with some of your competitions back there. Is that what those are in citations?
Tommy Farmer (00:02:26):
Yes. citations are on a different wall, but this is just a portion of, of the the plaques and awards that I've won through the, not years, decades now in competitive casting. The North Carolina flag behind me over here is pretty cool. Little piece, I took a flag when I went to Belgium 2008, and I got all the casters. There was like, I don't know, a hundred and some casters from like 15 different countries and I got as many of 'em as I could wrangle up to sign the flag. So it's a pretty good memento for me personally. And it, it, it hangs prominently on the wall here in the shop. It's a, it's, it's just a fun reminder of where I was, what I did. And it was it was a good time.
Brian Demo (00:03:10):
This, I mean, world famous is always a, a great thing to be able to say, but here it is right here. You mean Belgium in a competition? Got all the other ones out there. I mean, that's where everyone got together. That has gotta be great to look back and see some of the names and go, oh yeah, I remember. Yep. That was good.
Tommy Farmer (00:03:26):
Yep. It w it it was absolutely a great time. Went to England. I've been to England twice. Belgium once competed in five international world type events. And I, I I, I'm gonna correct you, you said world champion. I actually finished as high second in the world in 2006. So never made it to the top of the world rankings, but I did. I'm like, either I lost count, either seven or eight time national us distance casting champion. I've held all the records for throwing sinkers a long way, which since have been broken by, by, by, by young studs in the casting world. But I I, I had 'em and it's just a, it is been a, as my wife puts it as a hobby, gone while
Brian Demo (00:04:14):
. That's actually really well said. I mean, yeah. That, that could fall under for fishing too, so I love that. Oh yeah.
Tommy Farmer (00:04:22):
Ab ab Well, it is an extension of fishing. You know, I started surf when I was young in my twenties, and I think we're gonna get into all that, but, but it, it evolved into a, a very competitive thing for me. I became obsessed and, and just ha had to see just how far I could push it and how good I could become. I got a late start. I didn't even get started in competitive casting clubs in my late thirties. So I was casting literally, especially in Europe, I was casting against guys that were half my age. And it was it was, it was a lot of fun. I guess I was an elder statesman at the, at the time, even more so now. .
Brian Demo (00:04:58):
That's great though. World travel to do a competition like that, that's gotta be so much fun. And you're right, we are gonna get into that. And matter of fact, let's just go ahead and kick this pig. Tell us your, your story and what got you into fishing.
Tommy Farmer (00:05:08):
Well, I started, I, I, I, I wasn't, didn't fish as a young man. As a matter of fact, when I was a kid, I had way too much other stuff on my plate, especially growing up as a, a hippie child of the seventies. There were a lot of other things that I was interested in, in instead of fishing. But when I got into my twenties, I, I caught the bug. I started to surf fishing and and really, really liked it. I, I, I've cut my teeth down here in southeast North Carolina stretcher beach. It's called Carolina Beach and Fort Fisher, about four miles of drivable beach. And, and I, I just really became hooked. We'd go down and, and actually go down and spend the night a lot of times just, which is pretty cool because this stretch of beach, Fort Fisher is a famous Civil war battleground.
Tommy Farmer (00:05:54):
And and I I I, I'd be lying if I didn't say that. I saw some rather creepy things out there in the middle of the night. But hey, that's, that's, that's a story for a different podcast, . But yet the, the obsession hit me in my twenties. I fished through my twenties into my thirties and I guess my mid thirties myself and a good buddy of mine, a lifelong friend. We've been friends since fifth grade competing in everything from Lil league baseball, arm wrestling, racing our muscle cars, chasing girls through high school. We were on the beach one evening and I threw a cast. He threw a cast. We both claimed victory. He said he threw farther. I said, I threw further. So the, the next week we met out in a field, local fairgrounds. And, and Tony, he proceeded to take my $20.
Tommy Farmer (00:06:41):
We bet. And, and he won. And he took, he took my money. And that just kind of started a session. We found out there was an organization that put on tournaments, decided to go give our hands a try. And I, I was, I was not good. I, I started out at best in the middle of the pack. I mean, I think I threw like 450 feet or something and walked out to my sinker and watched guys literally walk 300 feet past me to get to their sinker. And I, I knew early on I either, I either needed to buckle down and learn how to do this or find another hobby. So it, it quickly became an obsession that that lasted many, many years. So that's, that's kind of my, my backstory. Basically a fisherman got started, became obsessed with distance and just took it as far as I was able to take it.
Brian Demo (00:07:35):
That's quite the trip to get there. Did you, did you pick up a mentor along the way to help you with casting?
Tommy Farmer (00:07:41):
Oh, I've had quite a few mentors. I, I was, I was actually lucky ear early on in the competitive casting side of it. I, I was that guy that just irritated the heck out of all the more experienced casters trying to gain knowledge. And early on they really didn't want to give it up because they were afraid that giving that knowledge up would be basically providing somebody the tools needed to beat them. So they didn't wanna give it up. But, but, but eventually they did. I I, I got in their good graces and, and I actually was mentored by several people here in the United States. I also, a name out Mr. Joe Moore helped me a lot. Jerry Valentine helped me a lot, bill Kennedy. And then I also was lucky enough to be mentored. I went to a, a couple of seminars put on by some British guys who at the time and still are among the very best casters in the world. And Peter Thne, Roger Mork. These guys took time with me. And I guess I'd have to say Peter Thayne, who's a British champion, castor, was the one who first really saw potential in me and, and got it through my, my hard head, how to actually use proper mechanics to execute a cast. It's not just about flailing as hard as you can. There's, there's a lot of mechanics that go into it. And so yes, I, I was lucky blessed to be mentored by some of the best casters in the world.
Brian Demo (00:09:12):
Outstanding. I mean, I, I've always said it, you know, when you get into a new industry, if it's something you like, get a mentor, there's nothing wrong.
Tommy Farmer (00:09:19):
Absolutely. Abs. And, and that's one thing that I, that I've tried to do. And I, and I still do it to this day, I made myself a promise back then in, in the late 1990s that if I ever got good at this, that I was not gonna be the guy to withhold information. So I, I, I freely spread it. I, i, I spread the word to whoever wants to listen and and wants to learn.
Brian Demo (00:09:42):
That's awesome of you, sir. That's, and I mean, I'm very thankful that you do that and I'm thankful for you being on the show to be able to share with that as well. . So glad to be you doing world travel. You, you've been up and down the East Coast plenty of times. I've seen some of that after all this time. What type of fishing do you like to do now?
Tommy Farmer (00:10:01):
You know, I, I've done quite a bit of basic surf fishing and I used to fish mainly for Bluefish and Sea Mullet and Table Fair. And then in 1996, I think it was on my very first trip to Cape Haters, to Cape Point. I'm, I don't know if you're familiar, but it's a, it's a very famous surf and spot. My buddies and I got up early cuz we had heard there was a drum bike the previous morning. We got up early, like 3:00 AM went out to Cape Point, got on the beach about four, and I had an old pin power stick and a bill spinning reel. I think it was like a 8,500 spinning pin. And my very first cast into the ocean at Cape Point, I caught a 45 inch drum. So I was pretty much ruined. I was done. I, I was toast.
Tommy Farmer (00:10:51):
And that started a, an obsession, which I still have today, which is drum fishing. That, that's the type of fishing that I like to do. If, if you see me on the beach fishing for sea mullet or, or small table fair, what I'm doing is fishing for bait. I, I'm, I'm, I'm catching the smaller, smaller fish. Sea Sea are great. Yeah. I think you call 'em white. They go by many names. White Sea Mullet. They, there's, they're, they're known by Kingfish. They're known by quite a few names. But if you see me fishing with those, I'm fishing for bait that, that's to cut 'em up and put 'em on for drum
Brian Demo (00:11:26):
. But hey, you have a plan after all that experience, so totally understand that one right there.
Tommy Farmer (00:11:31):
Yeah.
Brian Demo (00:11:32):
What is your favorite thing about fishing?
Tommy Farmer (00:11:36):
To me at this point, it's the challenge and the thrill of landing a big red drunk. Now, typically that's done in the morning, in the evening during the day. It's a relaxing sport. Hobby, watch, whatever you wanna call it. You can sit down on the beach in a chair and just relax and chill with your friends. It's a, it's a great way to spend time. I really do enjoy all aspects of it. Relaxing on the beach and then being in the battle. We, we call it the Congo Line at, at Cape Point. There, there can be, there might be 10 people fishing on this little piece of real estate, or there might be 200 people fishing on this little piece of real estate. And and it's really, it's like a, it's, it's almost like a orchestra or a dance.
Tommy Farmer (00:12:24):
When, when everything's working well, it's a beautiful thing, but it only takes one or two people that are throwing, not, and you hear, probably gonna hear me say this later in the podcast, winning Rome, do as the Romans do. But, you know, if, if everybody's throwing eight ounces in bait and it's drifting slowly, throw eight ounces in bait and, and just slowly don't, don't be the guy with a, with a two drop bottom rig and four ounces of bait, tangling everybody up. But but that, that is, is, is the thrill for me is landing a big drum and relaxing and targeting the big fish.
Brian Demo (00:12:58):
Sounds like a lot of fun. And the pictures I've ever seen of Camp Point throughout Hatteras have always been a uhuh, a shoulder to shoulder going after it. But everybody works well together, it looks like. Yep.
Tommy Farmer (00:13:10):
And that, that's the thing. And, and a lot of the guys, you, you've got two different groups really of people. You've got the, what I'll, I'll call the locals or the experience guys who, who absolutely know what they're doing. And it doesn't take long when you step out there to be able to pick these guys out. And, and, and just quickly on, on advice for people that, and it's not just Kate Point, it's anywhere. But when you step to a new location and you're trying to figure it out, don't, don't be that guy that just bust out there and, and, and, and tries to show your way is right. When in Rome, do as the Romans do, watch, observe, learn, and you know, a couple of hours spent just standing there or sitting in a chair watching can be very, very valuable. And you know, just, just, just watch, learn, and observe.
Brian Demo (00:13:57):
Great advice. And hopefully, hopefully one of y'all take that to heart, especially when you go into a new fishery. Doesn't hurt to learn before you start playing. Yep. With all the traveling that you've done and all the great things that you've played with in fishing, what is a bucket list fish that you want to catch in life?
Tommy Farmer (00:14:14):
Tarpon, that's a fish I've never caught. I've never caught a tarpon. It's something I wanna do. I, I I, I would love to, to hook up land and get pictures with a hundred pound taron. That's just, it's kinda a goal. It's just not, it's, it's unfulfilled at this point. I think I've hooked them, but I've never put it on the beach. , ,
Brian Demo (00:14:33):
I hear they're quite the challenge to get to the beach as it is.
Tommy Farmer (00:14:36):
So yeah. That's, that's what, that's what they say. I can't speak from experience cause that's, it's just not, not been on my, I've not done it.
Brian Demo (00:14:44):
Very nice, sir. Well, this is one's kind of a weird one and I'm very interested in how you're gonna answer it cuz you have done a lot of travel. Where would be a dream place for you to fish that you haven't been yet?
Tommy Farmer (00:14:56):
Mexico, probably fishing for a rooster. Fish. That's something, that's all that's right there with tarping on my bucket list of fish I want to catch and haven't done. But I, I think based on, and I had an opportunity about 10 years ago, and I, I had, it was a conflict of scheduling. I couldn't do it. But I, I wish I had gone, I wish I had gone and done that. Cause the, the, you know, the, the crew, the group, the guys that that asked me to go were successful. And just the whole, you know, the whole thing of getting on a, you know, a little four wheeler and, and you know, going however many miles down the beach to find the spot and landing a fish. It, it, it's just a, it's a bucket list item too.
Brian Demo (00:15:34):
Well, I look forward to seeing the post there cause it sounds like you're already Yes, this will happen and I make
Tommy Farmer (00:15:39):
This. I bet it does. Yes. Yep.
Brian Demo (00:15:43):
Well, this one's gonna be a little bit of a challenger for you, I think. What has been your favorite fishing memory?
Tommy Farmer (00:15:50):
Well, that's, that's really pretty easy. When, when I started going to Cape Hat in the 1990s and I was in my thirties. I've got a brother who's, who's older than I am, he's 16 years older than I am. And a cousin who is his age. They were, they were like brothers growing up. And I was much younger. Was never in with them because I was a kid. By the time, you know, they were graduating from high school. I was three years old. I mean, I was just, I was just a boy. But spending time at Cape Hats fishing with my brother and cousin and the other guys that came in our group. Cause we had six or eight guys, we'd run a big big house, go fishing every fall. And, and just to have that opportunity to bond and, and get to spend time with and know my brother and my cousin really is probably, they're probably some of the fonds memories that I have. It was it was really, really good times. And they were in, you know, typically we'd all, we'd all pile in, chip in and rent a big old ocean front house and, and sit on the deck and, and drink till 3:00 AM And, and those, you know, those, those memories are, are very as, as clouded and foggy as they are. They were, they were great times.
Brian Demo (00:17:01):
. That sounds like a lot of fun. We're gonna move into the the fun part of the show here, of getting the knowledge. So this is the tips, tips, tricks, and knowledge piece. And this is about your personal fishing, however you'd like to answer it. Mm-Hmm. . So let's start at the very beginning. You're gonna go fishing. How do you plan your fishing trip?
Tommy Farmer (00:17:19):
Okay. It used to be back in the day, back the days I was describing in the nineties, we would take our best shot at a week out of the year. We would pick a week, usually late October, early November, rent a house. We were, we did it months in advance. So we were adding the mercy of the weather gods, you know, what we had when we got there. I've evolved quite a bit. You know, my business now kind of revolves around trips to the beach. But what I do now, I still in, in the fall, I'll rent a house there for a month, basically move to Hatteras, setup, shop, do my thing. While I'm there in the spring, typically I, I watch several things. Number one, you know, start with the time of year, spring or fall. Water temperature.
Tommy Farmer (00:18:09):
Water temperature is very important, especially if you're chasing red drum. You wanna in, in, in the spring, 63 degrees or so, rising temperature, that's where you want to go. And then in the fall, it's the opposite. When the, when, when it starts dropping, it gets into the set. Low seventies, that's really when the drum fishing starts also very important or wind direction and ties. Typically where I fish at Cape Point Southwest Wind is king. That's what rules there cause of the way the, the geography and the, and the shape of the beaches at that point, that, that pushes the, the warmer water in and brings the fish and the, the bait and then the fish in. So yeah, and then tides, tides are important too. The my personal favorite is, is falling tide. And if you can catch that near dawn or dusk, in other words, if you're an hour before dusk and you hit high tide, you're catching that falling tide through dusk or through dawn. That to me has historically been the best. Now, does is, is that hard and dry? Cut and dry? No, I mean, I've called 'em on low tide. I've called 'em rising and fallen. It doesn't really matter. But if you're playing the odds, high tide falling around dusk or dawn is gonna be your best, your best opportunity. Especially when the water, water temperature's, right. And the wind . Yeah.
Brian Demo (00:19:39):
Yeah. That, that piece, it's always that trifecta. It never, never seems to fail. But it's
Tommy Farmer (00:19:45):
Absolutely,
Brian Demo (00:19:46):
It, it's been interesting learning about the tides on the east coast side. I fish Jacksonville and, you know, up and down that side, when I go to tournaments, and I've talked to a lot of people on the Atlantic side that always said, tide, tide, tide, tide, tide, tide tied, tied, tied, tied. They, they do not, y'all don't mess around with the tides. It's bottom two, top two, bottom two, top two. And it's always,
Tommy Farmer (00:20:06):
It just depends. It depends on what, what you know, what you're restricted to. A lot of times, if you're there with family and friends, and one thing that, that, that hits me a lot. I don't, I don't mind fishing at night. And you know, especially if that high tide is falling right at or after dark, those few hours after the sun goes down is often the best time. But then, you know, sometimes you have family restraints and people wanna go get dinner, people wanna do this, that and the other, and, and it kind of pulls you away. But, but, but if it's strictly, if it's strictly fishing, the yes tide, tide in wind direction at, at Cape Point, it cannot be stated strongly enough how important that southwest wind is. It, it really, really is. And guys will watch, excuse me just a second,
Tommy Farmer (00:20:58):
Guys will pay attention to the winds. And when you get that southwest wind that sets up blows a day, gets your attention, blows the second day con consecutively really gets your attention. If it, well, third day they're on the beach because it's had enough time to set in and push the bait and the fish in. And you know, it's, it's cool cause you can, you can, you can watch these schools of fish and one of the more frustrating things is when you're on the beach and you see the birds working and you can see the water boiling red and gold from, from these drums, you can see it and you just can't quite reach it. That's, that's frustrating. But if you got patients, they'll come in.
Brian Demo (00:21:39):
That sounds extremely yeah, that, that's, that would be top five for frustration for me right there. That's, oh yeah, it's, it's not fair .
Tommy Farmer (00:21:47):
Yeah. Then, then you start, then that's when you start trying to cast harder. Not smarter, then you end up blowing your reels up.
Brian Demo (00:21:53):
Yep. that's bad. Well, it has been 22 minutes here, ladies and gentlemen. So you know what that means. It's time for you to make sure your bait's still good.
Brian Demo (00:22:09):
This bay check is being brought to you by Ninja Tackle. Go over to ninja tackle va.com and take a look at all those fun ninja dagger rods. You guys know I love 'em. I've got the seven footers. I got a couple of those that I use for inshore and I use at the beach to throw lots of fun there all the way up to 12 footers. He's got different ones in between the eight, six has been on fire in the panhandle region lately, catching Jack Kraal right from there, throwing lures. It's a great series. You need to get rigs. Yep. Matt's got 'em in there as well. Or if you're in a firearms ninja tactical, he's got you set up there for any kind of Glock accessories, other firearm pieces. Ninja you tackle va.com. Go take a look at all the fun stuff and you, you won't be disappointed. So now that we've talked about that with your planning of your trip, let's move into the spot. Location spots are very important. And I know with the Cape you, you've definitely got holes and you've got all the pieces there, but how do you, what do you look for when you're picking a spot to fish?
Tommy Farmer (00:23:02):
Okay I'm gonna step away from Cape Point because Cape Point is, okay, you're not really reading the beach. You, there, there is, there are nuances, there are cuts and slews and bars. But basically you go to the right hand side. If you got a a right to left, drift set up, you throw out and you walk with the bait keeping it in front of you. So that kind of takes that equa outta the equation. But if I'm on the beach and I'm looking for a place to fish, I'm gonna ride the beach at low tide. Okay. Low tide is key because you can see the structure, you can see the cuts in the bar, you can see the slews, you can see how many bars you're dealing with. Sometimes here in North Carolina is typically two. I know in Texas, sometimes they go three bars deep down on the Gulf Coast in Texas.
Tommy Farmer (00:23:46):
But you wanna find structure, you wanna look for kind of, kind of the holy grail. And it's what swimmers are scared to death of. It's what draws surf fishermen in. That's the rip tie that what that is indicative of is a break in the bar. It's a cut in the sandbar, it's a gate, it's a door, it's a highway in and out from the deeper water into the slew along along the beach. So you wanna find that cut in the bar. And, and the only way you're gonna do that really is riding the beach at low tide. Now, now you can, when there's a little much water in there, if you're patient, you can ride the beach carefully observing the beach, looking at the sandbar zone. If you're riding along and there's, there's waves breaking, breaking, breaking and breaking over here, and you see an area that's dead, there's no waves breaking.
Tommy Farmer (00:24:40):
Stop and observe. Watch it for five minutes. If it's continuously, no waves breaking, that's deep water. That's the cut in the bar, that's where you wanna set up. It takes a little more time and a little more observation when the water's deeper than it does at low tide. Cuz at low tide a lot of times you can see it clearly. But, but you can still find it. But finding that break in the bar is key. So I'm not sure the beach is in Florida. I don't know how much riding you can do on the beach, but in North Carolina there's quite a bit that you can. And that is one of the best tools at your disposal is get in a truck ride. You know, with gps you can put in coordinates and and and know where to come back at high tide if you want. Or just find the spot set up and stack and and just enjoy it.
Brian Demo (00:25:28):
So one of the videos that you posted for the North, you were fishing the North Carolina Beach Buggy Association Tournament last year. Okay. And you were changing locations and driving down the beach and you, you stopped at one and there weren't too many people fishing it. And you said that in your video, you're like, Hmm, surprise, nobody else is down here. But you had really broken down a great rip current breaks in the bars and you were just talking, look, I would fish here, here, here, and here. And you gave all that information in that video.
Tommy Farmer (00:25:56):
Yeah, I was judging. I I was actually judging on the, in the tournament that at that point in time, and when you're judging, you're basically on free time until you get a call. Then you gotta, you gotta scurry on down to where the fish has been caught. But I, I was just riding the beach and I know I saw what, what, you know, looked to me to be just a outstanding spot. So I, I just stopped and gave a little tutorial on, on what I see in it and what you can, what you can look for and find, because what you see at low tide versus what is there or, or visible, that high tide is completely different. And if you don't know it's there, then you, you'll, you are ride right by and never and never see it. And it could be a potential really good spot, productive spot to fish.
Tommy Farmer (00:26:40):
And, and when you find those cuts in the bar, and I'm sure we'll get to that in, in a bit, but when you find it, you've got a slew running, I call it a slew, a a cut or a gut, whatever you wanna call it, running parallel to the beach sometimes no more than a 20 feet out, 30 feet out. You've got that, that parallel slew. Then you've got the, you've got the cut in the bar. What I like to do, if I'm, if I'm hunting, if I'm searching for fish, I'll throw one, one side or the other of the cut in that sl no more short ride, short cast in, in the sl. I'll put a second bait in the mouth of the cut, one side of the other typically. And then I'll bomb one. I'll, I'll let it rip, I'll, I'll cast it as far as I can to the backside of the bar.
Tommy Farmer (00:27:28):
And cuz typically that's where the predator fish are hanging out, waiting for the bait fish coming in and out of that sl. So and then you can, you can narrow that down. I always leave a long ride out. Always leave it out. And if you then you can kinda see whether they're more hanging in close in the slew or whether the fish are more active in and out of the cut. So it it's really just a matter of, of spreading the baits out, finding where the fish is productive. Yeah. You already
Brian Demo (00:27:59):
Led us right into the next one there about
Tommy Farmer (00:28:01):
Not I did, I looked down and realized that, that I had, another note I've got here is about, about casting and, and I've had people tell me so many times they'll say, Tommy, we appreciate what you do, but it's kind of a waste because the fish are always at your feet. They're right there, they're in that first slew. Well that, that is not necessarily the case. Mm-Hmm. your numbers, your production numbers are gonna be higher in that slew. You're gonna catch more small fish. But if, if you don't have the capability to cast far, okay, if that tool is not in your tackle box, you're never gonna know the, the fish can be there and you won't know they're there until a long caster shows up in Boza. You don't, you don't, you don't even know the fish are there until somebody fo gets there who can reach those fish.
Tommy Farmer (00:28:53):
I've got a, a story I don't know, it was probably six or seven years ago now. I was at Cape Point. It was not a very productive day. There wasn't a real good drift set up, left to right. There was probably 15 people standing on the point proper. This is a dynamic place. It changes shapes all the time. I mean, sometimes it's a nub, sometimes it's a long skinny point. This was a long skinny point. There was about 15 guys standing on the end. I walked right up there and said my hellos and just, just bomb one out. I hit it as hard as I could. And as I was walking back, letting the slack out of my, outta my Rio, getting a little bit of overrun out, I was, I came to the end of the conga line. There was an old timer standing there and, and he was belly laughing.
Tommy Farmer (00:29:34):
He was laughing hard. And he said, you know, you just overcast overthrew all the fish, don't you? And nobody was catching anything. Now these guys, they were just talking. There was no catching going on. He said, you know, you just, you just threw past all the fish, don't you? I said, maybe. So I said, I don't know. And but no sooner had the words gotten outta my mouth, pardon that, that I hooked up and, and I landed a nice puppy drum, probably 26, 28 inches long. And and, and proceeded to catch drum on 13 out of the next 14 cats I caught, caught. Drum drum, drum drum. Nobody else was catching anything. Pardon? A friend of mine another guy, good fisherman, good castor named Ryan Young, he steps up and, and he said, Tommy, he said, is anything going on? I said, there's a hole out there.
Tommy Farmer (00:30:26):
I said, you got a bomb to get to it. He threw one out, boom, immediately hook. He hooked, he hooked up. Ryan and I were catching fish. This went on for, I don't know, however long it took about 14 cast maybe an hour or, or or so before that was over. These same guys, the guy that was laughing was saying, will you please cast for me? , will you, will you take my ride? Will you please cast for me? Because they couldn't reach it. So the moral, really the moral of the story is you need to check, you need to test the waters, you need to test short, medium, and long. If you don't have the, the capability or the tool in your tackle box to throw long range, then you won't even know the fish are there. I mean, they can be there laughing at you and, and you don't even, you don't even know it. So so it is a, when people ask me about distance and now point, it is, I tell 'em it's just another tool. It, it's like your favorite lure, your favorite bait, your favorite reel. It's just something else in your tackle box that will help increase your ratio with the added bonus that often the bigger fish are out there at range.
Brian Demo (00:31:32):
Yeah. The, the, I'm trying not to like be giddy about this cuz I've seen it. It's, there are so many times and I've seen like we're all fish in normal range, short, medium, long. And then next thing you know, you got that one guy that can do the super cast and yeah, he picked it up. So that actually happened the other day with when I was fishing with Chip, he was down here and mm-hmm. I wasn't getting my long cast in. I've unfortunately lost a little bit of my cast distance with my lack of fishing. I
Tommy Farmer (00:32:01):
Can, I can help you . I can, I can help you ,
Brian Demo (00:32:05):
I'll take it. But Chip, you know, chip was launching it and he was, he was, he got a limit. I, I was a bit short and I also had a bad, bad read, but it didn't matter either way. But yeah, even one, just one can be that difference maker super long.
Tommy Farmer (00:32:20):
Absolutely it can't. And you don't know you, like I said, you don't know what you don't know. And if they're out there and you can't reach him, you don't know. So it makes it easy for that guy that says you're wasting your time and effort. Cause they're always right. Your feet. It's an easy excuse for him because he doesn't, he, he can't reach 'em, so he doesn't know.
Brian Demo (00:32:38):
Right. Yeah. Well you talked about the casting. So let's move into the rigs now. I know like you said, you like going after the drum, that is your happy Yep. That that is your one there. What type of rigs do you use and how do you set it up?
Tommy Farmer (00:32:52):
As far as a rig it's pretty basic. I use a drum rig. There's two, there's two types. There's a standard drum rig and then there's one that's called a cannonball rig. Which is basically a ba your, your standard drum rig with just a, a stretch about three foot long of of heavy mono that you use as kind of an additional shock leader to and, and it allows you to, to it, number one, it eliminates the need to use beads. And it also allows you to really hit the cast without worry without worry about snapping off. So as far as as as rigs for drum, it's gonna be your basic Carolina style drum rig. Now if I'm s fishing I'm gonna use a basic two drop bottom rig. Maybe it be, maybe not depending on, you know, spawning season and whether, you know, there's, there's row out there or not. But, you know, a two drop bottom rig is it can be successful in many, many applications, smaller hooks and yeah.
Brian Demo (00:33:55):
I'm glad you blew that last part, the smaller hooks thing, cuz I wanted to ask you about the hooks. So you normally you know, I go drum fishing and I hear different people will say, oh, you need a nine ot, or you need a six ot, you need a 10 ot. You, you want these big hooks because big fish, big bait and all those pieces on the double drop. Totally understand what you're talking about with the smaller ones there. I normally fish with a size six or a one OT depending on the day. Yeah. Now what do you all use up there?
Tommy Farmer (00:34:20):
Well, it, it, now I, I will freely confess to what I'm good at and what I'm not. I am not a expert sea mo fisherman because I, it's just not something I spend a lot of time doing unless I'm hunting for bay. Now, a smaller two or four hook is what most guys use. And, and there's a a guy that, that makes rigs for me that I sell on my web store salesman called a river rig. Which I can grab right quick if you wanna see one. But it's just a basic hand tied rig using smaller hooks. They are they're, they're, they're very successful here. I sell quite a few of them.
Brian Demo (00:35:00):
What's the name? So I can link it back and people can look for it in your shop.
Tommy Farmer (00:35:04):
Give me three seconds. Sure, sure.
Brian Demo (00:35:10):
So this is the fun part about cameras, ladies and gentlemen. We can do it this way. It's not like the regular podcast where you have to pause it. Hey, I'm
Tommy Farmer (00:35:15):
Back.
Brian Demo (00:35:16):
. Alright. Right. What do we got here?
Tommy Farmer (00:35:19):
It's called a River R Oh, lone Ring. And, and the reason it's not for fishing in the rivers, the guy who actually came up with this his nickname is River, that's what they call him. And he started fishing this and he was very successful when many others were not. But this is it's called a Long Range River rig number four hooks, see if I can get it in there. Close where you can see. Yep. Can you see that?
Brian Demo (00:35:44):
Yep. See it Good. Yep.
Tommy Farmer (00:35:45):
Yep. I've got 'em, got 'em on my web store. They're very, very good for, for sea Mullet, Pompano, what I call Panfish. And I I I've got a complete line of rigs that I sell on my web store. So so yeah, that, that's gonna be my choices of rigs are gonna be drum rigs or basic two drop bottom rig for, for the smaller fix.
Brian Demo (00:36:09):
Okay. And what about for, so with the drum, the Carolina rig, what size hook do you recommend?
Tommy Farmer (00:36:15):
Well, it, it is funny. Hook sizes are gonna vary. Eight eight all in one manufacturer is gonna be different from another Eagle Claw versus a Gama Godsu. They're not necessarily the same, but I'm typically fishing eight alt or nine depending on, on the hook. I want a big enough hook that, that a large drum and, you know, here we're talking 50 plus pound fish is, is, is is not gonna get lost in there. , you know, he's, he's gonna, he's gonna feel it. And so, so yeah, I that and I know guys that fish tens, there are guys that fish tens are guys that fish smaller and, and, and it, and it's, you know, you can have success either way, but, but just based on experience, that's, that's what I have found to be best
Brian Demo (00:36:59):
Understood on that. So when the cargo line, cuz it is good concurrent down there and North Carolina does have very fast moving tides and lots of good pieces there. Yep, we
Tommy Farmer (00:37:07):
Do.
Brian Demo (00:37:07):
Let's talk about the lead at the bottom of the line here. What kind of sinks do you like to use and what have you found to be the successful ones in the North Carolina region for you?
Tommy Farmer (00:37:16):
I've been doing this a long time and I've seen it kind of ebb and flow. I, I have always been and still am a pyramid sinker kind of guy. Now, one thing that came in, it was really popular for a long time, was what they call the frog tongue sinkers kind of flattish, funny, a little bit funny shape, and, and they were okay. But when you're fishing a drift, and this is, this is the important thing, not so much as what your sinker is, but back to the winning Rome, do as the Romans do kind of thing. Look, observe, see what everybody else's throwing. Typically at Cape Point, it's a eight and bait kind of thing. If there's current setup, if current's moving eight and bait. Now if you're, if, if everybody else is throwing eight ounces and you step up with a five ounce Sputnik, okay, everybody's throwing eight ounces and slowly drifting, slowly drifting, walking and staying in front of their line, which is critically important.
Tommy Farmer (00:38:14):
You throw a five ounce nik out there and it sticks. Now everybody else is drifting along and running into your line stopping. And then when one person reels up, you have got a, a cluster of epic proportions. You might have four or five, six guys tangled up and one guy, poor guy out there with a flashlight trying to untangle all this stuff to the point that he gets frustrated and starts cutting. So, so the the important thing is not so much what you are doing, what your preference of sinker is, is to match what everybody else is using, especially in a drift type circumstance. Don't be that guy. Everybody's fishing eight and bait. Don't be that guy that jumps out there with a four ounce two drop bottom rig and shoot straight down the beach and then reel in without what you know.
Tommy Farmer (00:39:03):
And, and even if you're, if you throw it and this, this is something else that gets people, when you cast out, you don't cast necessarily straight. If you're in a conga line and you cast far and you cast left, it's not a problem. You might cast over four people. All you gotta do is walk behind those four people and insert yourself in the line at that point so you're, you're not above or below anybody else. And just, just find your place in line and then stay with the drift. It's a, it, it, it's a thing of beauty. It's, it's like a choreographed dance almost when it's working right. And when it's not, it's a train wreck.
Brian Demo (00:39:41):
I, I'd seen the Congo line, I did not know about the other part with the drift. I Oh
Tommy Farmer (00:39:46):
Yeah, yeah, that's, and, and if, if it's, if it's not drifting, if there's no drift, there's typically not a Congo line because the people who know know that you need that right to left Southwest, wind drift set up to really be productive. Now you might catch a, a straggler catch a stray drum, but as far as the schools coming in, it, it's probably not gonna happen unless you have those conditions. And when you have those conditions, you have to be able to, you gotta be able to process it cast and then move you keep, keep the line, keep slack out of your line, keep keep your line taught. And as it rolls and as it drifts, you just stay right with it. And it's, it's like you, you, you start at the right, you drift. It might take you five minutes to, to drift the whole way.
Tommy Farmer (00:40:29):
It might take you 15. And when you get to the other end, when you get to the point proper, you reel in, walk back to the other end of the line and start over. And it's so it's, it's, it's pretty cool. But I, I do fish pyramids, I have found, if I'm looking for it to stick a three-sided pyramid sticks better than a four-sided pyramid. That's cuz it's got more flat surface area. Four-Sided tends to roll a little bit more a little quicker. The frog tongues, they, they drift, they don't drift quite as fast cuz they got the more pancake flipped as they're going through. So it just takes a, it just takes just takes practice and experience to know which is gonna work better for you. But if I'm out there and, and 90% of the guys are throwing eight ounce four sided pyramids, I'm gonna throw eight ounce, four sided pyramid, I might cheat throw a seven because that allows me to get out past them.
Tommy Farmer (00:41:19):
And then I'm not involved in the tangles and a phrase. So I, I'm drifting faster, so I'm walking behind these guys holding my rod up. So it, it, it just it just depends. But, but in, in most cases, again, I'll say it, when in Rome, do as the Romans do, don't try to reinvent the wheel there and, and don't, and another thing, and this is, this is a different kind of a different topic, but at, at Cape Point, don't, don't be the guy that steps out there with Brady Line and, and I'm not, I'm not cracking on Brady line. Brady line is, it has, its absolutely has its place. And that's in most fishing, fishing situations with a spinning rip Brady line is great but just not there. And the reason why is tangles are inevitable. You are going to tangle with your fellow anglers.
Tommy Farmer (00:42:07):
And if you, if you're that guy and, and, and, and you, you're fishing braiden line and you get a little bit of a tangle and then you think you, you might not even have a fish. You might think you guy, one of these other guys might have a fish or it might be somebody down there yanking on their line because everybody's tangled up and you rear back with, with with braiden line, you're gonna start cutting mono like hot butter, like a nice through hot butter. And, and, and you won't, let's just say you will not be a popular guy. So
Brian Demo (00:42:35):
I, I've, I've heard so Matt Pool had actually told me, he's like, Hey, come up. We'll we'll go out there. And Matt said, you will take the braid off of your line before.
Tommy Farmer (00:42:44):
Yeah. You, you, yeah, yeah. You won't, you won't be a popular guy and but you, yeah, and I'll extend the same offer if you want, if you wanna go fishing Cape Point, I'll, I'll, I'll, I can, I can hook you up.
Brian Demo (00:42:54):
I just wanna fish North Carolina and thankfully come on, we'll be here pretty soon. So that's how I'm all for that piece. . Well this is actually working out well in our timing cuz now we're at 43 minutes ladies and gentlemen, which means it is time for another bay check.
Brian Demo (00:43:15):
It's the second bay check of the episode and hopefully you've caught a bunch of fish by now. Hopefully you're having the best day out fishing cuz that's what we all want for you. What's the word we really care about? This bay check is being brought to you by Diaz Custom Tackle and over to Diaz custom tackle. And take a look at the different style of equipment that they have. Hooks. Got 'em to buy plenty. You can get 'em in bulk orders if you want. Beads floats, no problem. Jigs, teasers. He's got 'em all in there. Lots of good pieces to get your hands on through the website. If you're a rig maker and you're looking to par partner up with somebody to get wholesale pricing on that, reach out to DS custom tackle and see if they've got something available for you. Ds custom tackle.com get your order in today.
Brian Demo (00:43:52):
So when we've talked about the sinkers, we've nailed in the big pieces there and, and I can see what you're saying about the three, the three-sided not doing as much I've seen with the wobble there and the pancake with that one. And you primarily go pyramid. Have you seen some people just like, look, they're die hard for a bank or a cannonball or, you know, this sinker is what I've gotta use. When you're in that sort of situation in North Carolina fishing especially shoulder to shoulder, I, is it everybody tries to stay to the same style? Or is it just within the same parameters?
Tommy Farmer (00:44:25):
At at when you're, when you're at the point, when you're Cape Point, you, you need to be on the program. You need to be doing what everybody else is doing. Now once you step away, and when I say away from Cape Point, you can be a hundred yards right or south or a hundred yards north of the Congo line and you fish what you want, you're not, it's not gonna be a problem cuz you're not gonna, you're not gonna cause tangles and, and issues with other fishermen. So if, if, if you like a, a bank sinker, if you really want a lot of motion and rolling with your, with your sinker bank, bank sinker is fine. Sputnik sinker if you want, if, if your gear is not really set up to throw the heavy weights, but you still need it to stick, throw a five ounce Sputnik sinker, it's gonna grab as well as an eight ounce pyramid would stick.
Tommy Farmer (00:45:13):
So, you know, once you're away from the crowd, you can pretty much do what you want. And one thing that I've learned is that people, fishermen have very strong opinions about what works for them and what, what works and what doesn't work. And what what I've learned is that they're not wrong. If it works for them, then, then there's nothing wrong with what they're doing. I I, I like it when people are, are open-minded enough to continue to learn. I I, I've been doing this a long time and, and I, I try to learn something every time I go out. There are there are guys at at Cape Point, there's some of the best surf, my opinion, there's some of the best surf fishermen in the world that fish that spot. And when I say in the world, it's for that type of surf fishing for that specific type.
Tommy Farmer (00:46:01):
I mean, there's guys out there who can really, really cast, who really knows, know how to read the water. And, and to this day, I watch those guys. I observe, I, I see what they're doing and what can I do to to improve my catch? What can I do to get better? There's one guy, I'm not going, not not going into names, but there, there's a guy who is, who is well known for for, for drum fishing. There, there's a little competition. They call it the man, it's unofficial. But at the end of the year, the man who has the most drum, you, you, you're it, you're that guy. You're that guy for the year. But, but I watched this guy and, and he had this little habit where every time that he was getting ready to cast, he'd walk out to the water, take, take a little bit of salt water in his right hand and, and just splash it on his reel.
Tommy Farmer (00:46:51):
And, and I, and I watched him and, and again, I'm gonna say he is one of the best fishermen that I've ever known. And I watched this guy and I watched it and, and a lot of people look at him as unapproachable cause he's kind of up, up, up a little bit of on a pedestal. But, but I walked up to him and I said, dude, I said, I said, I gotta know. I said, I do everything in my power to keep salt water off of my equipment. I don't wanna touch him. And, and I said, but I watch you, you do this every time. He just laughed. He busted out laughing. He said, Tommy, he said, he said, it's just habit. He said, I like my line wet. He said, I don't want, I don't like casting Dr. Dry, which I'm the opposite. I want it as dry as it can can be so I can get the best grip I can. But he said, it's strictly a habit. He said, there's no reason for it. So, you know, and, and the point being that I don't care who you are, you can learn. And, and if you shut your mind down and you don't, and you think you know everything, that's, that's, that's when you stop growing.
Brian Demo (00:47:47):
And I'm, I'm, I mean, not pointing fingers at any angler individually, but we have bad habits of that in this industry of I know what I'm doing, I'm good. Oh yeah, there's too many people that won't adjust. And you gotta be, you gotta be flexible in this. You can only make you better.
Tommy Farmer (00:48:01):
You can only make you better. And then, and then it's up to you to call the information. If you, if you think that this is, is, is worthy and you think that this is, is good information, then go with it, add it, add add it to your tackle box, add it to your arsenal. And then, you know, you can always discard what doesn't prove to work for you. You know, if it don't, if it doesn't work, don't do it. If it, if it works for you, then hey, you, you, you've added a skill.
Brian Demo (00:48:28):
Well, when we've been talking about the travel and pieces, let's move into this one here. Okay? If you're gonna go fish somewhere new, what what do you do for planning to get out there and fish?
Tommy Farmer (00:48:39):
Okay I'm gonna take it as kind of, we talked about already. I'm, I'm gonna, I'm gonna read the beach. I'm, I'm gonna, I I'm gonna use, if, if I don't have local knowledge, if I don't have somebody there to guide or to help me to understand the fishery then I, I'm going to, I'm gonna go, I'm gonna default to what I know. I'm gonna try to, to get on the beach at low tide. I'm gonna try to find that spot. I'm gonna find that cut because that's going immediately. That's gonna increase your odds. If you've got a, if you've got a gate, a door, a, a superhighway coming from the backside of the bar into the slew, your, your odds go up immediately. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna use that knowledge. I'm gonna try different Bates, I'm gonna hit the local tackle shops.
Tommy Farmer (00:49:25):
I'm gonna say, look, I said, you know, I'm, I'm not, I, as the old saying goes, I ain't from around here. I, I, I I need some help. Will you tell me what I need to do? And and, and what I found is that almost any tackle shop that you go into, they're, they are willing to help. Most of the guys want to talk. Most of the guys want to, to freely give information. Now, every now and then you run into a tackle shop that they're gonna, they're gonna tell you whatever you need to hear to spend more money. But, but for the most part, these guys just wanna help you.
Brian Demo (00:50:00):
Yeah, I'm loving that about tackle shops nowadays. Haven't, I've only gone into one where I was like, you know, you really wanna ring the register? All right, we can do this. I got time
Tommy Farmer (00:50:07):
.
Brian Demo (00:50:09):
All right, so the last one before we start moving, our last two questions, and then we'll move into the casting piece here. Okay. How do you adjust your tactics for fishing when the bite isn't on fire?
Tommy Farmer (00:50:17):
Okay. the number one thing for me is to be mobile. If, if it's needed, don't be afraid to change. As you, as you, as you're riding up the beach and you're picking these slews, often they'll be a cut, a hundred yards cut, 150 yards, another cut, and you, and you, you've taken your best guess when you were reading the beach at what's gonna be the most productive. Well, if you're there and the fish aren't there you can't catch 'em if they ain't there, . And so, so don't be afraid to move to that next cut that you've already scoped out. You know, you know it's there. Don't, don't be afraid to make that, to make that change. So ch don't be mobile, but also what we talked about earlier in setting your bait, short, medium, and long.
Tommy Farmer (00:51:07):
Utilize that you, you've got to be flexible. Change baits, for goodness sakes, if you, I, I've been out there before and, and, and my favorite, we're gonna get into this, but I, I like cup mullet. That's what I like, especially the cob size mullet. We call 'em cob mullet, size of a corn cob. I, that's my favorite bake. But if it's not working, it's not working. You know, try, try shrimp. Try up here you can often get menhaden. Try, try a different bake. Throw out your light rod, catch whatever is out there on shrimp or sand. Please catch whatever small fish are out there. Here it's gonna be sea mullet, Virginia mullet. Croker Croker's a really good bait. Cut it up, throw it out. See, match the hatches. They say just don't be, don't get shoehorned into dog garnet. This is how I do it. This has got to work. Be flexible. Change, change tactics if needed. Change locations, change tactics,
Brian Demo (00:52:08):
Ex excellent, excellent pieces right there. Alright, so on your paper, I know that it is backwards here. We're gonna do this one, and then we'll get into the casting. So, with seasonals there and the Carolinas obviously we, we deal with the same thing in Florida, you know, too hot fish don't wanna play too cold fish don't wanna play. Yeah. Yeah. You gotta find those middle grounds. And you mentioned water, temperature and wind on that. Yep. Have, have you noticed, what is your high season and what is your, this is horrible. We're not fishing season.
Tommy Farmer (00:52:34):
Yeah. for me it is, it is pretty cut and dry. Now. It can change, it can vary by weeks, depending on, you know outside air temperature, whether we've got a cold snap, hot summer, cold winter. But for me cape at, at, at Cape Hatteras sometime in often you'll have a drum run in March mid to late March. That'll be early, then it'll die off, pick up significantly in April and into, and sometimes through May. So basically spring spring is a great time up here. The the fish, the, the bites are more intense. More a a lot more fish are caught very quickly up here in the spring than in the fall. So, but, but then again, it's, it's, it's water temperature and wind direction. In the, in the spring, you get a lot of Southwest wind, and as that water temperature's rising, the fish come in, they start to bite and feed.
Tommy Farmer (00:53:32):
Fall is kind of the opposite. September can be, okay, you've gotta really pick your, your spot. Pardon me. You gotta pick your spots. And a lot of times further north, the north beaches are gonna be more productive earlier in the season because the water cools off quicker the further north you go. And then as you advance on into October and into November, they tend to move down more toward Cape Point and Okra Co, which is another great place to fish. So again, for me, it used to be picking a week outta the year and just, just, you know, doing, taking the best shots you could, but, but now try to be a little more selective and go more based on tide, water temperature, and wind direction,
Brian Demo (00:54:14):
Good pieces of knowledge right there. Hopefully that'll help you guys for, if you're looking at planning to go to North Carolina, now you have an idea of a little bit of a window. And one thing I do love about North Carolina fishery is it, it's a lot like here too. You get so many different species off there. I mean, yeah. Oh yeah. You get the mullet, the sea white, and you know, you get Pompano, you get blue Bluefish
Tommy Farmer (00:54:32):
Pomp. Pompano been hot here lately. I hadn't got into 'em, but they they've been hot. Yeah. Big, big nice Florida pompanos, what I call 'em there. They're a big, you know, 2, 3, 4 pounders.
Brian Demo (00:54:41):
Yeah, I've seen one. I think I saw one six, or I was, yeah.
Tommy Farmer (00:54:44):
Oh, yeah, I think I saw that too. , that's a nice Mike's fish. That, that, that's dinner for several.
Brian Demo (00:54:50):
Definitely is . Oh, so much, so much cool stuff. But that's the fun thing about the Carolina is, you know, people instantly go, oh, you gotta fish just the points. Like, no, all of the North Carolina shore is really decent
Tommy Farmer (00:55:02):
Fishing. There, there are a lot of people, there are a lot of people who either used to fish the point, got burned out, don't wanna do it anymore. There, there are a lot of people who, who will tell you, I'm not going there. I don't enjoy combat fishing. I don't wanna do it. They'd rather find a stretch of beach somewhere out on the miles of beach, since you can't access and drive one. They'll, they'll do what we've talked about. They'll ride the beach, they'll pick their spot, they'll find the cut, they'll find a slew and, and, and sit. They don't, they don't like the, the pressure and the intensity of fish and Cape Point, because it is different. It's not as, as, again, as the old saying goes, it ain't for everybody. And and, but, but for me, I, I, I personally love it.
Tommy Farmer (00:55:43):
I love getting out there and getting in the middle of the mix. And, and it's, it's, it adds another layer to the challenge of the catch when you do it through 50 or a hundred people. When, when you're, when you're the guy that lands the fish in a crowd like that, or the absolute best. And this happened to me in April. There was really nothing going on. And, and, and there were guys, and a lot, you'll see this at Cape Point, guys will stand at the ready, they'll, they'll stand along the beach, either at their truck with their rod baited up in their, in their, in their rod rack or holding the rod. They're just, they're socializing until that first fish is caught and then it gets serious. Well, I was that guy out there. I was soaking, babe. I I I had just got there and, and talked to everybody.
Tommy Farmer (00:56:26):
Nothing's happened. Nothing's going on. So I bomb, I bomb a cast out there, and it, it was almost a splash bite. It was on, I mean, as soon as it hit, I hooked up and landed it, I think it was a 49 inch drum. It was a, it was a nice big fish. And anyway, I landed the fish as I was fighting the fish, I turned and looked back to my right and what was one or two people fishing on this stretch of beach south of Cape Point. I looked, and there must have been 75 people, and I had already worked my way down. I was able to land the fish, but then I became the observer watching these guys and, and, and, and, and just a couple of more fish were caught. So I got my fish on the beach, and I stepped back and watched . So I, I didn't, there wasn't enough fish there for me to get back into that melee, but had there been fish, I would've been back in the mix. It was just a, it was one of those free things, but, but the, just the change from nobody fishing to everybody fishing on One Fish Co. It was pretty cool.
Brian Demo (00:57:25):
It's, it sounds like it
Tommy Farmer (00:57:26):
Yeah. It's, it's, it's a unique place. And, and if for, for anybody who hasn't fished it, I, I recommend it highly, but do it with an open mind and willingness to learn and willingness to watch and observe before you jump out there.
Brian Demo (00:57:40):
Great advice. Well, let's do the final bait. Check it because we're gonna get into some serious nitty gritty here when it comes to casting. So I like
Tommy Farmer (00:57:47):
The way you do the bait checks. It is like, every 20 minutes, just like fishing you, you need 20 to 30, and that's it.
Brian Demo (00:57:55):
I've had a lot of people mention that, a part of the show, like, oh, 20 minute bait check. And it's like, good. It got stuck in your mind. That's what I hope.
Tommy Farmer (00:58:02):
Unless it's a then I'll give,
Brian Demo (00:58:05):
That's not moving anywhere. Yeah, definitely. Good. All, let's knock this check out.
Brian Demo (00:58:16):
This final Bay check of the episode is being brought to you by the Kids Can Fish Foundation. Go over to kids Can fish.net and take a look at the awesome programs that they are doing down there in St. Simon's Island, Georgia with these kids. All of your donations, whether they're the charitable contribution or for the fishing the red running of the Bulls fishing tournament that'll be held this fall. All of that goes back in and they set up these camps for kids, cast net clinics, fishing clinics, rods reels, every kid learns something and goes home with gear. And that is thanks to your contributions that do that. So go over to Kids Can fish.net, take a look at all the fun things there. If you're gonna be at the tournament, I will be there. Smitty from Smitty Surf Fishing will be there.
Brian Demo (00:58:55):
Salty from Salty's Pompano rigs here in the Panhandle, US three, we're all heading out there. We're gonna fish in the tournament. We're very excited to be out there, and we're glad to be a part of that. The Kids Can Fish family. So go take a look at the website and, hey, if you're gonna be willing to come fish the tournament, it's a lot of fun. And it helps out these kids. And like, they always say more tackle boxes, less boxes. Good stuff. So now let's move into this piece. Let's get into the Let's talk casting. You have the art broken down into five fundamentals, and that was something you started telling me about. Let's break those down and can you go through 'em for us?
Tommy Farmer (00:59:28):
Okay. when I, when I started I've been teaching and casting lessons for probably 15, 18 years now. And, and early on it was just a kind of a hodgepodge of, of, of what I felt, what I, what I thought I was doing, right? And, and it is an evolution over time. And it took a while for me to actually become a good enough teacher to get my process across the people. But I guess it's been five, four or five years ago now, I hired a professional production group. And, and we came up with the D V D, and it's called the Comprehensive Guide and Power Casting. And, and, and in that D v D I've broken it down into what I consider to be five easy to follow fundamentals. And it doesn't matter your age, your, your health, your conditioning, if you'll follow these five steps, I promise you that your distance is gonna improve without additional effort.
Tommy Farmer (01:00:34):
You're not gonna have to cast harder to throw farther, if that makes sense. And, and, and the way that I look at it, I kind of, kind of start from the ground up. To me fundamental number one, and its number one for a reason, is your footwork. If you are, and, and, and I, I'm an observer of people, I ride up and down the beach, and if, if somebody's baiting up and they're getting ready to cast, I'm gonna stop my truck and I'm gonna watch. I'm not watching to ridicule. I'm not watching to, to, to try to nitpick somebody. I just like to see what people do. You see a lot of things, you'll see that probably the classic of all is the guy that gets a running start and he's, he's like taking jogging down to the beach and then, and then, and then throwing.
Tommy Farmer (01:01:18):
Which, you know, and I, I understand that the, the, the, the somewhat twisted logic behind it that if you got forward momentum going, it's gonna help you get a little additional distance. But what it does is complicates your footwork to the point that you can never do the same thing twice. So when I teach footwork and, and I love to, to, to do these seminars and, and, and lessons out on the beach, because I take a rod butt and I draw a giant circle in the sand with it, right? I'll stand, stand in one spot, draw a giant circle and add the water. I write 12, and then I'll, I'll, I'll pencil in. 9, 10, 11, it's a clock face. And, and this works extremely well until you get with the younger crowd who were raised digitally and have trouble reading clock face. And then, then you gotta, you got you, as they say, explain that, Lucy.
Tommy Farmer (01:02:10):
You gotta, you gotta explain it. But you or you orient your footwork so that your right foot is at clock face center where the hands come together in the clock. Okay? Your 12 o'clock is your target. So you place your left foot in line at 12 o'clock, okay? Shoulder width apart. Now that's, that's gonna give you your alignment to target. That's not the best footwork stance to start from. So if you take that left foot, and this is a right-handed cast, if you take that left forward foot, leaving the right foot at the center of the clock face, move it over to between 10 and 11. In other words, you're opening your stance like an open baseball stance to about 45 degrees. What this does, and I, I'll, I, I'll do my best to demonstrate. I can't really, cause you won't be able to see my feet, but this, this is the only prop that my wife will allow me to have, is just a stick.
Tommy Farmer (01:03:08):
That's all have, but I'm, I walk up to the water. Can you see me okay? Yeah. Yeah, you're good. If I walk up and I'm facing the water straight ahead of me's 12 o'clock, well, I'm on my, my right foot. I'm gonna leave the stationary and I'm gonna set my left foot in line with my target at 12 o'clock. Okay? Now, this is, this has got my alignment, this has got my directional target set. What I gotta do now to be able to functionally move through the cast, I'm gonna take my left foot, move it over to about 10 30, anywhere between 10 and 11, basically 45 degrees off of your target. What this has done is allowed me to open up and turn my body through to get my chest facing the target at the end of the cast. Okay? So it, it is opened me up and allows me to turn through from here.
Tommy Farmer (01:03:55):
I'm gonna rotate back at my hips, get my arms in the right position, and, and, and without moving my feet. Now I'm not, I'm not going, I'm not jumping, I'm not stepping, I'm not moving either foot. I'm gonna do a body weight transfer from 80% on my right to, to at the end of the cast to 80% on my left, kinda like a golf swing. I'm gonna end up on that toe, but I'm, I'm, I'm here. I'm gonna rotate through and finish the catch, okay? So my feet don't move. I have a body weight transfer. I'm here with my weight on my right foot. As I turn through my chest is gonna rotate to, to target my body. Weight's gonna go to my left, my right foot. In an ideal situation, my right toe will be barely touching the sand, kinda like a golf swing when they end up on that back foot on with the toe.
Tommy Farmer (01:04:44):
But you want to get through without taking a step. Now, if you take a step, and this is one of the biggest flaws in casting period, even guys that are good do this, they'll hit and they'll step through with that, right? They'll take a step through what happens. One of the, one of the important fundamentals we're gonna get to in a minute is the pull with the left hand. If you're stepping through, you're falling forward, okay? You're falling into the cast. And what that does is shorten that stroke. If you're, if you're pulling from here to here and both feet are on the ground, you got that full stroke. If you're falling into it, you have shorten that stroke. Does that make sense? In other words, you're here. If you do it properly, you got this. If you're falling forward, you're basically shortening that stroke.
Tommy Farmer (01:05:25):
So you wanna keep both feet on the ground, transfer weight from your right foot, right, right leg to your left leg as you're coming through. If you find yourself stepping, the fix to that is to plant that left foot firmly and push back. That'll keep you balanced. That will stop you from falling forward. Ideally, you don't wanna fall forward. You don't wanna lean back cause you lose power. Either way, you wanna generate the power, come through, finish high. So that, that's number one. Now is the that's the footwork. Fundamental number two is your body. Your footwork is the foundation of success. That's the way I refer to it. It's number one for a reason. It is the fundamental it, it is the foundation of success. Number two is your body. People think that you cast a hundred percent with your arms. People think, well, I'm throwing my arms, I'm throwing my arms.
Tommy Farmer (01:06:17):
Your body is the, the, it's the engine. Your body is the power plant. Your body is what provides the energy through the first 90% of the cast. Your arms are gonna be passive through the first 90% of the casting, very active at the end. So with my body, I think of it as a spring uncoiling from the ground up. In other words, I'm here, my footwork is set. I rotate back at my hips. I get my arms extended out. We'll cover that in a minute. My arms away from my body now starting, and I have a, a saying, I call it right hip to target. In other words, if I'm here, the first move is gonna be my lower body, my right hip, turning to the target that allows the sequence to be proper. What you don't wanna do is this. You don't wanna start with your upper body first.
Tommy Farmer (01:07:05):
You wanna start with your lower body, hips, torso, chest, shoulders, arms in that sequence. Your arms are the last thing to come through. It's like cracking, whip. The arms are the last part to come through. So we're here, rotate back at my hips, arms are extended. I'm gonna start with the lower body and exaggerating that move. It doesn't have to be much if it just has to be first. Okay? So here, lower body first torso, second chest gets squared to the target and finish the cast. So it's like an uncoiling of the spring from the ground up. And if you get outta sequence, it doesn't seem like much, but on, on a casting field, in competition, it can cost you 50 to a hundred feet by being out sequence. Wow, we're, we're here. Rotate back at the hips, right? Hit the target to start right hip, torso, chest, shoulders, arms.
Tommy Farmer (01:08:01):
So we're here. Boom. So execute. Okay, that's fundamental. Number two, fundamental number three is your arms. Okay? Your body's the engine. Your body's what powers the cast. Your arms are the connecting rods between the engine and the stick. Your arms are passive through the first 90% of the cast. This is probably the hardest thing to get novice, or actually the worst one is the experience. Casper, the guy that's been doing it for 30 years, he can't change his, hard to change old habits. So if I'm here and I rotate back, my arms are gonna be extended from here to here. My body's driving the bus. My arms are not, my arms are passive. They're along to the right. So I'm here to here. You see that? I'm here to here. Body is driving that bus. The last 10% of the cash, your arms become very, very active.
Tommy Farmer (01:08:57):
So I'm here, I'm here. From this point, your arms become aggressively active in the punch and pull. We're pulling from here to here, punching from here to here, basically done properly. My hands are switching places in space at the end of the cast. So we're here, we're here. Notice the position of my left hand. My right hand is now where my left hand was with a hard pull and a hard punch. Start slow, finish, fast, punch, pull your arms. And here's what happens. 90%, at least 90, probably higher number than that of fishermen, when they cast, they get, they might do everything right. So they get ready to go, and then they start pulling here. They start pulling from way down here instead of up here. Your left hand should be between your eyes and your target. And your target is not the sandbar or wave.
Tommy Farmer (01:09:54):
Your targets are spot in the sky, 45 degrees above the horizon, over that spot on the wave or the sandbar. So your left hand should be here, you should be looking at it. And then boom, you should swap spaces with right and left hand. What happens is people pull from here and then punch. They basically use their left hand, very little if at all. And it takes no more effort to pull from here to here than it does to pull from here to here. That makes sense. So they're pulling low and in, and they're taking away a large percentage of their power by doing that. So full work, foundation of success. Your body's the engine that drives the cast. Your arms are very important, but you have to come in with the power at the right time with your arms, which is late. So we're here to, to demonstrate the whole thing.
Tommy Farmer (01:10:46):
I got my footwork set, rotate back at my hips. Arms are extended. This is very important. Imagine you're giving the rod away to somebody. Stick your arms out away from your ca from from from your body. I should have led it with this, but I'm gonna throw it in there. Now, the secret to long distance casting, and this is node Ps. People, when I say those words, people start rolling their eyes. But this is the secret to long distance casting. It's learning to put the rod and hence the sinker through the largest arc that you can generate accelerating through that arc, finishing with a burst of power and speed late. If you tuck your arms in, you have killed your arc. You don't have an arc. You have, you have shortened it down to nothing by being here. What you want is arms out, rotate through, get here, get to that arch is as big as I can make it.
Tommy Farmer (01:11:36):
I got, I, I was blessed with a lot of natural strength, but I was not blessed with long arms. I got stumps. I got short stuy arms, so I had to learn to use them. You wanna get here and execute through the largest art that you can generate. If you're here, you've got no arc. If you're pulling in here first, before you hit it, you're shortening your arc. You wanna do everything you can to keep that arc as big as possible. And, and the secret is learning to get your arms. To this day, I still, I start having trouble. I'm like, okay, dummy, give the ride away here. Get it out away from your body. Cause that increases that arc. And it's an immediate increase in distance. So we got the put word, the body and the arms. Those are the physical fundamentals. The, the, the, the fourth fundamental is acceleration.
Tommy Farmer (01:12:29):
And I'm, I'm gonna sit back down for these, this one acceleration of the cast. A lot of guys, when they're surfing, especially when they say, okay, I gotta throw this one out past that second bar or out backside of the first bar, they just try to brutal, just brutally smash the rod as hard as they can. And what happens often is that their, their thumb on a bay casting reel, their thumb is not physically strong enough to stop that spool from spinning underneath. Does that make sense? And and anybody who has ever done that and squealed like a girl looked down at her thumb and it's burnt white, that they know, they, they know that, that they know the problem. And what that is, is where you're trying to accelerate 4, 5, 6, even eight ounces of lead before it is in motion, you've gotta allow the sinker to get into motion before you apply the real power.
Tommy Farmer (01:13:34):
And that's where the arms come back in. If you're waiting till you're here and here to hit it, that sinker is already, if you're throwing the ground cast and sinker is already up off the ground, it's already moving. It's already in motion through its arc. It's moving pretty quickly. You can apply all the power in the world without burning your thumb. That burnt thumb means that what that is, that burnt white on your thumb is a combination of burnt flesh and melted monofilament. . That's what it is. And that's why it hurts the way it does. It's not going, you're not gonna go to the er, you're not gonna, you're, you're not injured, but it's gonna ruin your day. It's gonna mess your day up. So learning to start slow, accelerate through this arc we're talking about and finish fast will prevent that from happening.
Tommy Farmer (01:14:19):
If you, I I, I got a an analogy, a story that it really works well with guys, especially car guys. But imagine, imagine that you are, you've got a, a sports car, you've got a Corvette, you got a Ferrari Porsche, or in my case a old, old gto o you're sitting at a dead stop. You, you're, you're not moving. And in front of you is a long sweeping left-hand curve. Okay? You got two objectives. Number one is to get from the dead stop through that sweep and left curve as quickly as possible. Your second objective is don't wreck the Ferrari. Okay? You don't wanna crash it Now from a dead stop, you got 600 horsepower under the hood. Are you gonna put your right foot down on the accelerator to the floor to start? Are you gonna do that? No. No, you're not.
Tommy Farmer (01:15:10):
If you do, your wheels are gonna spin. You're gonna put your Ferrari in a ditch, okay? You failed your objective. What you do is you, you, you, you roll off, you start slow, you accelerate. And as you get into the apex of that curve, you nail it. You got traction, your wheels are gonna stick. You're not gonna spin. You're gonna come out the, the other end of the, the fast as possible. Well, Cass is exactly the same way. If you try to nail it from the start, your thumb is not physically strong enough to hold that spool from losing traction and spinning under your thumb. That hence the burn, monofilament and flesh. But if you start slow, accelerate through this art and finish with the birth power and speed late, that sinks in motion. It's, it's like hitting a moving target. It, it's easy.
Tommy Farmer (01:15:54):
It doesn't hurt your thumb. They say, and I'll say that the, the, the best casts are effortless. And the reason the best cast are effortless is because you have got that sinker in motion, moving through an arc before you apply that finishing power. So acceleration is fundamental. Number four. And it's, it's very important. Now the, the last fundamental is a number. And it's something that a lot of fishermen, even guys that have been doing this for, for many, many years and decades, don't understand. And that's, that's the number 45. It's 45 degrees, and it comes up over and over and over in, in casting for distance. The first place that comes up, and we've already talked about this, is in your footwork when you're setting up, when you set your, your right footed clock face center and your left foot at 12 o'clock, and then you take that little step over to the left to 10 30, that's a 45 degree offset.
Tommy Farmer (01:16:52):
That's 45 degrees from target. So that, that's the first place that, that it comes through the second place. The number 45 degrees comes in as your target. Your target is not, again, it's not the sandbar, it's not a wave. It is a spot in the sky, 45 degrees above the horizon. Now, what happens is, guys say, oh, 45 degrees, that's not that much. That's down here. No, if you're, if you're flat at zero and 90 degrees is straight above, your head is halfway between those two is higher than you think. Yeah. And the only way to get there is to look at that target. You've got to look where you want to cast. You gotta pick your directional target. Go 45 degrees over that and, and, and apply your power to that target. That is your spot in the sky. When I'm teaching, when I'm giving lessons, I, I, I, I, I hope for a partly cloudy day so I can pick a cloud and tell 'em, you think it's down here, but it's really up there.
Tommy Farmer (01:17:48):
That's, that's where you're trying to shoot for. So your target 45 degrees in the sky. The second, the second place that's very important, and I'll demonstrate this one, is sticking the rod. What I mean by that, when, when you finish your cast, you don't wanna do this. And this happens a lot. I see this all the time. Guys will finish and they'll come way down here. And the rod actually be tip will be pointing at the sand. The line will go through that last guide and be angling up. Cause if the sink is going in the sky, what you wanna do is stick your, stick your rod to that point in the sky. So we're here, boom. You wanna finish with the rod pointing to that 45 degree spot in the sky. If you over rotate, if you come down here with it, cause you've tried to hit it so hard, then you think, oh my god, Tommy said, don't do that.
Tommy Farmer (01:18:35):
And then snatch the rod back up. If you're throwing a bay casting reel, that'll set up a power wave in that line and go run right back down to the spool, poofed cause of burness. So what you wanna do is stick it. Boom. That does a lot of things. It probably the most important is it stops tip wobble, what we call in the industry recovery time. And high modus carbon does a good job of this too. When you hit the rod, boom, you see the rod or sit out there and, and wobble. If you, if you stick to that spot in 45 in the sky, it'll stop. It won't have a lot of that wobble to it out there. And, and again, high carbon helps with that also. So, and, and then the last, the last area that 45 degrees is, is really important.
Tommy Farmer (01:19:23):
Imagine the arc that the rod's going through. You're seeing guys cast sidearm. They're throwing down here dangerous. I don't wanna be that guy down the beach when somebody's throwing sidearm. It's very dangerous. Straight overhead thought cast. Very accurate. Okay? It's probably the most accurate cast that, that there is a straight overhead thumb. But your arc is smaller with that cast. The perfect angle, the the most efficient and effective angle is coming through a 45 degree. So I'm not coming through flat arm or flat, flat sideline. I'm not coming through straight overhead. It's halfway between those two points at 45 degrees. So I'm here, and that rod is coming through at a 45 degree angle angle. It's not changing planes or changing direction, otherwise, we're not here. And then changing into an overhead. Th i, it, it's coming through the one steady far. Does that make sense?
Brian Demo (01:20:19):
It does. The only one I always wondered with that when you're coming through that 45 is the getting the shots straight versus 45 and a continuing left.
Tommy Farmer (01:20:28):
Okay? You, you are correct. The the overhead thum is the most accurate cast when you get away from that being side armed or 45. There's, there's a timing element and the, and what you have to do, lemme get my head back in here. What you have to do is get the get the, get the timing down so that your release point is on target. It's almost intuitive. I mean, if, if you, if you, if you come through and you cast and your sinker flies to the right, more than likely you're releasing early. If it flies to the left, more than likely you're holding on too long. But, but those, those things, if it's just a little bit, say if you're throwing and you're consistently five, eight degrees right of your target, you can adjust that. You can fix that by shortening your drop.
Tommy Farmer (01:21:15):
The drop is the distance from the rod tip, the tip guide to where your sinker is dangling. Your beta is dangled, but your cast ready, that's called the drop. That needs to be the same every time you cast. Then you can make this adjustment if you're consistently off to the right, shorten it about four inches. Everything in the cast will happen faster. You'll come through quicker, and it'll be on target when you release. If you're consistently throwing five to eight degrees left of target, exactly the opposite, add about four to six inches of drop. It'll slow everything down and bring you back on target. So when you're dialed in and your cast is, is correct, you can actually use your drop link to adjust or adapt based on direction. And that can change from day to day based on how you feel, what's going on in your, you know, your body. If you're having extra pains, it might adjust a little bit, but you can absolutely adjust your direction based on that if you're consistent. Now, if you're throwing 20 degrees left, 20 degrees, right, you got other fundamental issues you've gotta work on first. But, but once you get it dialed in that, that 45 degrees coming through is gonna give you the biggest arc. Going back to the secret of power casting, that 45 degree arc coming through is what's gonna give you the biggest arc and hence the best cast as far as distance goes.
Brian Demo (01:22:38):
I never would've thought that rig length would make such a difference with that. That is, that's pretty impressive right there.
Tommy Farmer (01:22:45):
Well, it's just, you know, it's like I said, early on, I, I, I became obsessed is not even really the right word. It became a dominant force in my life. I had to become the best I could be at it. I, I can't explain why. I don't know. It just, it just obsessed me. And once I had a taste and, and started winning tournaments, and then I think it was 2000 and it was 2004 or five, what was the, it's on the walls. 2005 was when I first broke the United States distance casting record. Now I reset that record about a half a dozen times during my, during my run. It became a, a defensive mechanism for me. I didn't want, I didn't want to lose that. I didn't want to, I didn't, I didn't want to, to, to fall off that pedestal. So I fought hard to defend it.
Tommy Farmer (01:23:37):
And and, you know, inevitably Father Tom wins. And and, and, and I did. But it was a, it was an obsession. And all those little things are, are items that I would go to the field and work on. I I would set up a camera, every single cast in, in practice. That's what I've got, like 350 YouTube videos out there. And, and 90% of those are just me casting, just practice, not, not tutorial, not instructional, just me, where I would videotape this stuff. And early on what I would do is videotape it and, and, and share it through YouTube to my guy buddies in the UK and get them to critique my cast to figure out what I was doing wrong. But, but after enough time, I, I, I was able to self-critique and, and, and learn. But, but all these little things and, and breaking these five fundamentals down is really where it's at.
Tommy Farmer (01:24:28):
And then guys say, well, that's just tournament cast. And that doesn't really apply efficient. Well, it does. What, what we've talked about those five fundamentals, all that is, that's teaching you the proper way to hit a cast. You can take that to the next level you've got. And once, once you learn that, once you learn those five fundamentals, you can apply that to any casting style, whether you want to throw a a regular beach cast, we call it a hatteras cast, a ground cast a tournament style ground cast, which is a very effective cast. Or even the full long tournament pendulum cast. The finish is the same. It's all about getting that sinker in motion, coming through the art and hitting in hard lake. And once you get dialed in, then, then your accuracy pretty much comes and, and, and you can make whatever little adjustments you need to make.
Brian Demo (01:25:17):
Well, thank you very much for sharing all of that, because that was a ton of great things that a lot of people are gonna, you know, I already know we're gonna start seeing stuff after this episode of like, so 45 and what a little this , you know, it's gonna help people out. And that's key. So thank you so much for sharing with that, sir.
Tommy Farmer (01:25:31):
That that's, that's, that's my, my what I call the five fundamentals of, of power casting. And and as a shameless plug, Carolina cast pro.com, d v d, it's on there. It's got everything in there from the five fundamentals to demonstrating different cast to real tuning. Just a lot of different, different things that I learned over the, you know, 20, 20, however many, 25 years now that I've been doing this.
Brian Demo (01:25:55):
Yeah, you might have a few years of experience that people could probably learn from just
Tommy Farmer (01:25:58):
Yeah, but I'm worn, I'm worn out. .
Brian Demo (01:26:03):
Well, it's, I, I watched I believe it was one of your recent ones. There was a recent tournament you went out and cast and somebody had launched it well over I wanna say it was close to 400 mm-hmm. . It was like, it, it was just un unreal numbers of like, good lord, that thing can fly.
Tommy Farmer (01:26:22):
So yeah, that was last weekend. We had a tournament. And one of my, and, and, and I'm actually, I'm proud of this. One of my I, I will us loosely use the word student because this guy came to me and, and, and asked me, and I helped him. I gave him all the information that I could. And now this guy is the best caster in the country. His name is Ryan Lambert. And, and he, oh my God. See, I, I'm, I was old when I started. I was 38, 39 when I started my first tournament. And I guess I, I, I was, I had one advantage. I was blessed with natural strength, but you know, I was never that superstar athlete. But Ryan, this guy's like six foot three or 4, 250 pounds, ex-co collegiate baseball pitcher. So he's got the whole package. Yeah.
Tommy Farmer (01:27:09):
He, he's an athlete. I always wondered, I always wondered what would happen if a real to god big strong athlete got in his sport? Well, I'm learning. But he he, he kills it. But it, it is, I I, I've got a lot of pride in the fact that I helped him. You know, I, I, I, I helped smooth his technique in, teach him what he needed to do. And the doggone scariest part is he's not there yet. He's not there. He's broken. He is now the United States record holder, and he, his, his technique has got plenty of room for improvement. So but, but, but yeah, that's the thing probably that I enjoy the most now above all else, is helping other people learn how to cast. That's the thing that I enjoy the most, hence, I've, I've talked myself, horse .
Brian Demo (01:27:55):
Wow. Well, good news is you only got a couple questions left, and then you're Oh,
Tommy Farmer (01:27:58):
I'm good, man. I'm good. I got water.
Brian Demo (01:28:00):
Perfect. All right, so let's go ahead and get into the last questions here. What acknowledge would you give to a brand new angler starting out to phish?
Tommy Farmer (01:28:11):
Be patient. Learn. Don't try to, don't try to, to impress and, and, and be something you're not. In other words, don't try to walk out there and immediately want respect and expect people to, to to, to believe that you're some kind of God's gift to angling. Be patient. Take your time. Learn, pick people. You mentioned the word mentors earlier. Pick people who are successful at what they do, and ask them questions. What I've found is a lot of times people who even may have the reputation of being standoffish are not wanting to talk. If you, if you break it down to the least common denominator, which is fishing, and you and you, and you ask them questions, and you're polite and, and and friendly in your approach, they wanna share their knowledge. And if you will, if you will just be patient, ask questions, learn, and, and don't.
Tommy Farmer (01:29:03):
But in the process of doing that, don't be that guy. That's the pain in the butt. And, and I admitted earlier, I was that guy when I was trying to learn to cast. I, I was thirsty for knowledge, and I was trying to learn, and I was a pain to a lot of people. But and, and, and thank you to anybody that sees this, that, that helped me. But try not to be a pain in the butt. And finally on that, I would say, don't spot burn. Don't, don't, don't catch a fish. And, and, and immediately plaster, you know, all over social media. Now, if you catch a fish and you're at Cape Point and you post a people a picture, everybody's gonna know where you were. It's not, it's not a big deal. But if you gotta, if you're, if a friend has graciously taken you to a secret spot and you catch a fish, and you're all pumped up and excited, and, and, and you take pictures, and in the background of that picture is a certain tree or, or, or a certain piece of structure of jetty, while anything, people go, no.
Tommy Farmer (01:29:57):
And then the next day, that spot's going to be flooded with, with people. So don't, don't spot burn. And and, and again, just be patient, learn and and don't give up your buddy's fishing spot.
Brian Demo (01:30:09):
I mean, it's not like when social media, we have people that would ever tap your picture and start zooming in and
Tommy Farmer (01:30:15):
No, no, no.
Brian Demo (01:30:16):
I know where that is.
Tommy Farmer (01:30:17):
My god, things have changed. I, I, you know, I, I came up in through the, the whole era when I started fishing, you know, there, there, you know, we didn't even have cell phones and, you know, which was great. You'd get down on the beach and not be bothered for however many hours, but, but now you're in constant contact. And social media has made it such that everybody is, you know, you're connected all the time.
Brian Demo (01:30:38):
Very much so. That is for sure. Yeah. I'm gonna go with this one. What do you think a reason has been for such a surge to surf fishing?
Tommy Farmer (01:30:48):
I can tell you from, based on being a kind of a specialized tackle supplier, you know, my, my thing is I supply tackle Roger reels to surf fishermen. Believe it or not, COVID was a huge boom for surf fishing. I remember when Covid hit in 2000, you know, April should be a prime season. My sales fell flat. I wasn't moving anything. I thought, oh my God, this might be the end of, of what I'm doing. And then they opened the beaches back up and people will learn. People realize, Hey, I can social distance, I can go out on the beach. I'm not around people, and I can fish and have fun. It was an absolute boom for surf in 2020 and 2021 were the best years that I've had as a as a, as a tackle salesperson because of social distancing and getting out and away from other people.
Tommy Farmer (01:31:45):
And and it seems to have carried on. People have, have now realized not only is that a good way to social distance, but it's fun. It's, it's a lot of it's, it's a challenge and it's a lot of fun to do. So I think that recently that, that's probably gonna be the biggest thing that that I would say that has helped is, is, is, is the covid situation, because people can get out there and do their thing and, and, and, and, and not be bothered. Plus people worked or they started working remotely and they realized they could take their laptop, they could go to the beach and work and, and, and call it work, and then you know, end up fishing too.
Brian Demo (01:32:24):
Yeah, those are, those are the days, weren't they? Oh, I can telework from here. Well,
Tommy Farmer (01:32:30):
Absolutely
Brian Demo (01:32:31):
.
Tommy Farmer (01:32:32):
Yep.
Brian Demo (01:32:35):
You kind of mentioned this one in I'll ask it again to see if there was many, anything else left. What do you recommend to someone coming to your area to fish that's never been there before? Does, before they even put a line in the water
Tommy Farmer (01:32:47):
Again, watch, observe, and learn. When Rome dos with Romans, do ask questions. And, and if you're fishing a location, say like Cape Point doesn't have to be Cape Point, but anywhere there's current and you gotta drift and, and this is, this is a I'm gonna call it a, a fundamental flaw in tactics. People cast and they stand there, they'll sand spike, they'll put their, they'll put their rod and, and reel in a sand spike, and then they'll go make a sandwich. And, and this current does what current does. And in 15 minutes their, their sinkers on the beach, you know, 50, 75 yards down the beach. And if there's anybody fishing down there, that's an immediate tangle. You're not, you're not making friends like that. So if you're fishing an area that, that, that is drifting, there's a couple of tactics that you can use.
Tommy Farmer (01:33:37):
You know, number one being heavier weight, whatever, it takes the whole bottom. But the, the thing is, if it's drifting, drift is not bad. Drift inherently is good because you're covering more ground with one cast. So if it's a, if it's a right to left drift, walk down the beach, a hundred feet, cast out, and then walk with your, with your rod, stay in front of your line, keep the slack out. Don't dummy, don't snatch it so that you're, you're constantly reeling in. You don't have any line out, but, but just follow it. Follow it, stay in front of it. Don't be the guy that stands here in the in the line takes off down the beach. Yeah. You don't wanna, you don't wanna do that. You won't make friends and influence people that way.
Brian Demo (01:34:17):
You know, I haven't really dealt with it so much drift fishing here. Cause I mean, the current here is not Yeah.
Tommy Farmer (01:34:26):
Putting up, put, put whatever weight on is necessary to hold, right?
Brian Demo (01:34:29):
Yes, yes.
Tommy Farmer (01:34:30):
But
Brian Demo (01:34:31):
The idea of, you know, if we've got a westward current, it's perfect for us. I mean, you throw it out and you just walk the beach. Just,
Tommy Farmer (01:34:37):
I would do it. I would do that versus, I mean, it would change, change tactics. I would try that. I would, I would throw it out and, and just let it, let it do its thing and just stay with it. And and as long as you're not, you know, encroaching on somebody else's sacred spot beside you, then then, then fine work the drift. It's, it's a, a very successful tactic at or around Cape Pats.
Brian Demo (01:35:01):
Oh, I'm gonna have to try it here sometime, that's for sure. So the final question, we'll get you outta here. And this has been great, Tommy. Thank you so much for this. Yep. What's next for you?
Tommy Farmer (01:35:11):
Well, I, I guess I, I'm just gonna keep doing what I do. I'm I lo I love my job. I, I'm blessed to be able to, to do what I do and to help other people number one, improve their catch, improve their casting ability, and put high quality rods and reels in people's hands. I, I'm gonna tell you this opportunity for the shameless plug my company, my business is Carolina Cash Pro. Carolina cash pro.com. I've got a complete lineup, offish rods, everything from a light eight foot inshore, half to one and a half ounce rod all the way up to a 13 foot, eight to 12, which is a drum fishing machine. Probably my best sellers in, in the Florida market. My best seller's gonna be 13 foot three to six. Super high module is carbon fiber rod, I'll put it up against anything out there as far as performance.
Tommy Farmer (01:36:05):
I've got 11 foot, I've got a 10 foot, one to four, 11 foot, two to five, 11 foot, three to six, 12 foot three to seven 13, three to six, six to 10, and eight to 12. And then I got a 12 foot eight, four to eight ounce. So I pretty much have the whole lineup covered. I am 10 highs carbon fiber Fuji, K guides on the factory built rods. They, they perform, I, I, I put 'em up against anything out there. When I say that, I mean any, anything out there and, and, and typically come out even or ahead. So Carolina cash pro.com, let me help you. I really, I, I probably, my best seller is at 13,003 to six. And the reason it's my best seller is Florida Pompano fisherman. And I, and I really want to expand my business in Florida Market. So look me up, guys. I'll be glad to help you. And comprehensive guide to power casting, d v d Carolina cast pro.com.
Brian Demo (01:37:05):
Well, those have been great. Thank you so much, Tommy, for everything, the knowledge you're welcome of being so open with all this. And hopefully, I know it will. There's no way this doesn't help somebody out there. And yes, if I am coming to North Carolina, I will happily let you know. Hi. I'd like to have you come whip my for a little while and enjoy some good conversation and walk the beaches. We try to drift. That'd be fine.
Tommy Farmer (01:37:23):
I would just be, I just, I'd be honored to help you get better. That's all.
Brian Demo (01:37:27):
Well, much appreciate it, sir. We'll definitely talk soon and we'll see you next time.
Tommy Farmer (01:37:32):
Okay?
Brian Demo (01:37:33):
All right, sir. All right, ladies and gentlemen, you've been listening to finding Demo Surf Phishing. I hope this podcast help you cuz I know it helped me. I, I mean, I've got a whole list of notes here and it's gonna be great. So again, go back over to Tommy's website, carolina cast pro.com, lots of stuff from the shop, things to get there and also the D V D, he explained, he basically breaks it all down for you and shows you right there. We only went over the five fundamentals in a very short segment here on the podcast and there's a lot more detail with that. So lots of pieces there. You can also look at his YouTube channel. Lots of information. Like he said, he's got videos on there he was using for critiques from his friends and other people. That's still stuff for you. Always game day knowledge, right? We're always looking at footage, trying to find a way to get better. So hopefully this episode help you. If it did, don't forget, share it out there cuz somebody else could also use it. You've listened to finding demo surf fishing. Great seeing you. I'm outta here.