Maximum Lawyer

Watch the YouTube version of this episode HERE


Scaling a law firm can expose every weakness in your leadership, especially when hiring moves faster than your judgment. In this episode of Maximum Lawyer Live, Tyson Mutrux sits down with family law attorney Elise Buie to talk about what she calls the hardest year she has had in more than a decade of running her firm. Elise shares why taking on too much herself, making leadership hires too quickly, and ignoring misalignment created more chaos than growth, and why the experience forced her back to the values that actually matter to her.


The conversation gets candid about direct feedback, employee conflict, resilience, and the complicated reality of leading people who need different things from you. Elise explains why she now thinks of people as art, why alignment and qualifications both matter in key hires, and how parenting six kids shaped the way she coaches, gives feedback, and accountability. If you are growing a firm and finding that the people side is becoming the hardest part, this episode is a reminder that leadership is less about having the perfect answer and more about slowing down, staying clear, and learning how to lead the person in front of you.


What You'll Learn
  • Why Elise believes speed caused some of her biggest leadership hiring mistakes.
  • Why culture fit is not enough if a leadership hire lacks the qualifications to do the job.
  • How direct feedback can reduce resentment, drama, and unclear expectations inside a team.
  • Why scaling exposes people and process weaknesses that were easier to overlook before growth.
  • How Elise's 'people are art' mindset changed the way she approaches management and accountability.
  • What parenting, resilience, and Socratic coaching taught Elise about developing people instead of rescuing them.


Timestamps
  • 00:00  Tyson and Elise catch up during a chaotic week
  • 03:10  Elise describes the hardest year she has had leading her firm
  • 04:55  Why speed creates bad leadership hires
  • 08:35  Direct feedback, conflict, and saying the hard thing
  • 17:30  Why key hires need alignment and qualifications
  • 18:55  People are art: rethinking the hardest part of leadership
  • 24:30  The outside hire that exposed a leadership mismatch
  • 32:55  Buielding a culture where employees can give the owner feedback

🎟️ Get your MaxLawCon tickets: maxlawcon.com
🔍 Vet your vendors: beccaslist.co


Maximum Lawyer helps law firm owners Buield businesses, not jobs.

Resources:

Creators and Guests

Host
Tyson Mutrux
Tyson is the founder of Mutrux Firm Injury Lawyers and the co-founder of Maximum Lawyer.

What is Maximum Lawyer?

Maximum Lawyer is the podcast for law firm owners who want to scale with intention and build a business that works for their life.

Hosted by Tyson Mutrux, each weekly episode features candid conversations with law firm owners, business experts, and industry leaders sharing real strategies and lessons learned in the trenches.

If you're ready to grow your firm with less stress and more support, this is your next must listen. Subscribe today.

Tyson Mutrux (00:00)
Elise Buie, how's it going?
Elise Buie (00:02)
Good, how are you?
Tyson Mutrux (00:03)
It's so funny. You're talking about it's been kind of crazy over there. As we were like the starting soon screen was on, all my lights went out. I was like, oh, my gosh, what's happening here? So I don't know what happened. I had to scramble really quick. But it's good to hear from you. It's good to see you.
Elise Buie (00:26)
Yeah, you as well. It's been kind of a busy, hectic year. I feel like we haven't connected a lot at all this year.
Tyson Mutrux (00:35)
No, well, talk about hectic so my dad yesterday had a lung transplant uh so he was yeah so it's been a crazy week it is oh no so a week ago he goes into the hospital uh because they're like they said we want to stabilize them it was this was all planned by the way this this isn't like a last minute like the last week has been pretty chaotic but They knew he they put him on a list about a month and a half ago, and then his lungs were deteriorating pretty quickly. So let's put you in the hospital just so you're stabilized. And then Friday, the doctor says, Hey, I think in two weeks, within two weeks, you're going to have a set of lungs. And then on, let's see, I'm trying to go my days together. So Sunday night, they tell him like eleven, fifteen, they call him, say, Hey, get ready we think we got a set and then wow so they do all the prep on monday and then you know yesterday morning they they gave him some lung so he's stable now i we haven't saw him but he's still sedated until today but it's it's crazy i don't know if you've ever gone through that but it's a pretty it's no that's but it's wonderful but scary at the same time
Elise Buie (02:02)
It's wild, actually. I mean, the only time I had to deal with that was on the reverse side, which was, you know, really sad. I mean, one of my son's friends was killed in a motorcycle accident and all of his organs went to other people. So, you know, I was involved in like that whole process with the mom of getting that all figured out. And, um, It was kind of wild on the other side, too, to see where these organs were going and what they were going to be able to do for other people. Do you know, in such a really tragic time for her and her family and, you know, my son and his friends. But yeah, so I mean, medicine is miraculous, like in many ways.
Tyson Mutrux (02:52)
It completely is. But tell me what's going on with you, though. Like what's you've had a busy year. So what's what's new? Give me some new stuff.
Elise Buie (03:03)
Gosh, it's been so wild. I mean, we had a year with the firm that was probably I would say the hardest year I've ever had. So we're eleven and a half years into this. And I mean, it was a combination of things like I had an attorney go out on. maternity leave, but it was like the fourth child. So one had just come kind of recently. So I was like, yeah, I'll just take that docket of cases. I'm not going to share it around, like thinking, you know, that's kind of like the good leader thing to do. That was probably not my wisest decision to take on a full docket of litigation cases. Like it it meant like getting an apartment in another area so I could get to court quicker if need be. So Doug and I are like managing three locations now, which has been kind of dicey. But, you know, just the the reality of trying to run the firm and do that. And we made some really poor leadership hires that just did not work out. And obviously I have to own those. And but that, you know, creates its own set of problems and so I don't know it's been one of those years of like really coming back to what matters to me and like what do I care about and you know really having to make some tough decisions aligned with what I do care about and even if that meant sending myself into chaos so yeah it's been you know as it always goes lots of learning lots of growing through mistakes and, you know, just life.
Tyson Mutrux (04:48)
What do you think led to the leadership decisions that you made? The ones that you weren't so happy with?
Elise Buie (04:55)
Um, speed. It's always a speed thing for me, at least it is always a, when I'm like, okay, we need to hire somebody. Um, we, we just make mistakes. We do not do the diligence necessary to really get to the bottom of people. I mean, you know, I have such a strong belief in like, I mean, your core values matter so much. And like, if the person is not aligned with your core values and I have come to appreciate that, um, I am fundamentally a resilience girl. I grew up in a world where I did not have things handed to me. I did not grow up with a silver spoon in my mouth. I grew up working hard, doing hard things, like, you know, really valuing the dollar, valuing, you know, just the work and all the things. And when I find I hire people that are like, they tend to have more, um, I don't know, like princess lives. Do you know what I mean? Where they come in, we fall apart. We are not aligned fundamentally on things that, um, That really make a difference in our firm because, I mean, I fundamentally care about the well-being of the people in my office in a way that somebody who just has never lived like paycheck to paycheck or whatever can get. And so they're just tend to be more like, oh, yeah, whatever. If that doesn't work right, you know, we'll fix it later. I'm like, what? We're talking about payroll. Like, no, that's not a we'll fix it later problem, you know.
Tyson Mutrux (06:36)
Yeah. it's interesting. Um, so I had this conversation, I don't know, a year ago with this barista at the, at one of our local Starbucks because she's like always working hard and everything like that. And so she and I sat for a little bit. We talked about like, cause she comes from like a very blue collar background like I do. And so like same thing you're talking about where it's like, where you got to work for everything kind of a thing. And she was, she was talking about how frustrated she was with some of like the coworkers. Cause like they don't have that same mindset. And I, I have found that I have I kind of have issues with employees that don't have that same background because like it's the same thing you're talking about. It's like you're so used to fighting and rolling your sleeves up and getting the work done. And it's like when you hear I luckily I don't deal with it because Kristen is very good about dealing with Chris, but like with things where like. Sometimes where I feel like it's more of a soft issue where you could just work through this. You're okay. It's no big deal. I don't deal very well with those. Have you found that you're the same way?
Elise Buie (08:00)
Oh, big time, Tyson. I mean, big time. It's a real struggle for me because people will come to me and they'll tell me something and I'm thinking - OK, what what is the problem? Like, what are we talking about here? You know, and I'm just like I'm like, I think you could like go talk to that person or you could, you know, get it figured out. And so that's so funny. Like, have you found that younger employees, they won't talk to each other about things?
Tyson Mutrux (08:34)
Oh no, it's hard. I think direct feedback is really, really hard for people.
Elise Buie (08:39)
It's funny because I mean, as you know, like, you know, we raised a brood of six. So like, I feel like feedback was kind of an important part of, you know, when you have six teenagers in your home, let me assure you feedback is happening regularly, whether it's constructive or not is the whole other conversation. But do you know what I mean? Like we had to teach them. I was like, I cannot talk to your brother about his toothbrush like I got no time for that I mean you want to talk to him about where his toothbrush is every day and how that drives you crazy feel free like I mean put his toothbrush in the toilet for all I care if it's in the wrong place like do what you got to do to move the thing have the conversation like let the person know and so when people aren't able to have those conversations it's foreign to me because I'm just like And I get told a lot, like, they're like, at least you're, you know, you're blunt. And I'm like, okay. I'm like, and the problem is what? Just like, wouldn't you rather me just like tell you what I'm thinking when I'm thinking it rather than create some drama in your head later, you know, about whatever.
Tyson Mutrux (10:04)
Just give me the medicine. You know, just give me the medicine. You know, like, yeah. Yeah. So our policy is like if employees are having issues with each other, we get them in a meeting. So we get them on a Google Meet and we just get them in a meeting. So people kind of know to expect at this point. I don't know if that's even the right way. It could be the wrong way. How do you all deal with that internal conflict? Because that's tough.
Elise Buie (10:37)
Yeah, I was going to say I wish we did that. I'll have to investigate that under Washington employment law. Oh, yeah. I have the craziest laws I have to follow. I mean, Washington is kind of wild where people can just bring up, you know, what I would perceive to be just really small issues. And I mean, I have to go through investigations and like look into things and I'm like, really? I'm like, this person just said like, you know, the motion was riddled with errors like like that to me is a fair thing to say. And, you know, but it'll be like, well, that was kind of hostile. And I'm like, really, that was hostile. What? Oh, yeah. That's a lot of, I mean, there's a lot of stuff. I mean, we figured out, no joke. I mean, this is no joke. The other day, between team members' salaries, outside HR contractors, and my employment attorney who I will, I mean, I've had her for years and she told me, I don't know, four years ago, she's like, Elise, you need a line item in your budget, two hundred and fifty thousand dollars for the you can't make this shit up stuff. And so, I mean, I have said line item and like all combined, it's over four hundred thousand dollars I pay for an HR function in a large sense, which is wild to me.
Tyson Mutrux (12:08)
That is crazy. That is crazy. So I quoted you, and I made sure to say maybe I was misquoting you. When I was talking to Kevin Chaney, it was like six months ago, and we were talking about employee benefits or something like that. I remember you and I had a call one time, and you said something about how if someone is on leave, I think it might have been maternity leave, you cannot contact them at all. Did I quote you correctly? And I even said, I may be misstating what Elise said. Is that true? You cannot contact them at all when they're on leave?
Elise Buie (12:48)
Oh yeah. I mean, that's my understanding. And I mean, recently we had a situation where somebody was on leave and I mean, we really needed to ask her something and people would come to me. They're like, at least call her. I'm like, I can't. And so like, I just had to, I was like, we just wait until the day she comes back and we see what happens the day she comes back. I never, Oh no, I would never reach out to somebody on leave ever. Yeah. So it would be kind of interesting if we did that as law promoters. You cannot contact me. Oh, my God. The one time I mean, one time I was full on like, OK, I am out of pocket. Do not reach me. I was like in the Antarctica and I thought I was not even going to have cell service. So I didn't even know. Well, of course I get contacted. Somebody has had like a medical emergency situation where, I mean, they were really needing like fiscal help. Like, you know, at least I need help. And I was literally in Antarctica, like, you know, figuring out how do I transfer ten thousand dollars to somebody, you know, like from this boat in Antarctica. And I thought the same thing you just did. I was like, what happens if I actually go away sometime? And.
Tyson Mutrux (14:17)
When was that trip? I didn't know you went to Antarctica. That's amazing.
Elise Buie (14:22)
Yeah, it was awesome. I think it was in 2023. That was my my year of peace. But yeah, 2023. It was amazing. Antarctica is amazing. You should go.
Tyson Mutrux (14:35)
OK, so 2023 was the year of peace. What was 2024? Do you remember?
Elise Buie (14:42)
I don't remember. I don't remember, actually, but it was not as peaceful as 2023. For sure. 2023. Literally, I have such fond memories of and because twenty twenty two was what I thought was my most difficult year. But then now 2026 has surpassed that. And so, you know, it's just always I feel like it's just always learning things like. And I mean, even when you think things are going along smoothly, I mean, there's so many things that happened in 2026 that, you know, I mean, obviously I'm sure I could have done better. I don't mean that. But, you know, people retire, people go on unexpected medical leave, people end up injured and they need surgery and they're going on medical leave and then. You know, you end up in a trial where the court is like crazy as can be. And you're like, whoa, what are we even doing here? You know, and just, you know, a lot of things and that you just and, you know, stuff with, I mean, our own kids. Like, I mean, I had a kid kind of had a personal thing last December right around Christmas. And it's been pretty unresolved for a long time. And so that is its own level. You know, like I can't necessarily control all those things. But when all of a sudden you add them all up and it's like, oh, whoa, those are like nine big things you dealt with this year. I'm like, all right, this has been a wild year.
Tyson Mutrux (16:22)
So Marco is going to talk about... Like 2025 was his hardest year. And I think it's interesting because you see a lot of these firms. I'd say 2024 was probably our hardest year. I had to I had to sue an employee. It was a big deal. Like, you know, he was on the leadership team. He was a he was a friend of mine. You know, that that sucked. I wonder how much of this has to do with like us, I guess, because we're all scaling. You know what I mean? I wonder how much of it has to do with that.
Elise Buie (17:03)
I mean, I think it has something to do with that for sure, because I think like we were talking about the speed of hire. I think sometimes when you're scaling, you're thinking, oh, OK, I need to do this next thing. I need to do this next thing. And so sometimes you just do not give yourself the time to really dig in. And I mean, I have come to really believe some of these key hires like you know, your second in command kind of hire, maybe your legal services director, somebody who's really going to look at all that, the work going out of the firm. I mean, it takes like time. I mean, it can take a year, eighteen months to bring on somebody who is actually aligned and qualified. I mean, and I think that there's this idea, like if we get them aligned, somehow the qualifications will come and it's like, yeah, no, that doesn't work. Like they actually need to be aligned and qualified unless your goal is you're bringing on somebody and you're truly Buielding them up and you know that and you're all into training, mentoring, hiring them coaches, doing what you need to bring them up. I'm a firm believer in bringing people up In our firm, but you can't always take somebody and be like, oh, well, you're so aligned culturally. Let me put you in this leadership position and this is going to work out because I mean, it doesn't. And I have found a lot of people, they don't enjoy the leadership part. They don't enjoy the the peopling and all this stuff. I used to joke and I would say people are stinky onions. That was my, my before. Now I've decided they're art. People are art. And I don't like all the art I see. And nor does anybody else like, you know, it is complicated and it's textured and it's buried and it's some is real expensive. Some is not like, I mean, and so I now think of people as art and which is, I think helped me.
Tyson Mutrux (19:16)
Yeah. I think it's a beautiful way of putting it. I love that.
Elise Buie (19:21)
Yeah, well, it's been really helpful. And because for at least for me, the people part of this work is by far the hardest part of it. I mean, it is just by far the hardest part. And I have spent so long holding up my mirror and being like, okay, was I too blunt? Did I, you know, not say good morning enough? Like whatever, you know, all the things are that I do. And I started really questioning myself. And I actually went to a therapist after a bit. And I was like, all right. I was like, it's taken me two hours to write a note to someone on my leadership team. That's a problem. I'm like, you know, I am tiptoeing around this person like no way. other. And, you know, my therapist was like, send me all your writings for the last six months. Like, let me see what we're talking about, you know, which I thought was fair. I was like, you know, maybe I'm a psycho person in the closet. So I sent it to her and she was like, oh, Elise, this is not a you thing. She's like, you have got to like, you know cut this and move on and like let it go and so she taught me like even with my mirror to do a vibe check like not spend all my time beating myself up about things and just be like elise were you like having a normal day you know what i mean like were you acting your normal self. And if so, you're probably good. You don't raise your voice at people. You know what I mean? You don't say disrespectful things. But sometimes I think people have such a problem with accountability and they just become so defensive. But that defensiveness can start to feel manipulative. Do you know what I mean? After a bit. Yeah. And, yeah, I just find the people part to be so fascinating. And unfortunately, probably for most people, I literally can tie them. I'm like, oh, OK, you're like my son, Eric. OK, I got you. I'm like, I know about you. Or I'll be like, oh, you're like my daughter this way. Like, OK.
Tyson Mutrux (21:42)
That's funny. I do the same thing. Yeah. I compare managing people to parenting. It is very, very similar.
Elise Buie (21:50)
It's so similar. A hundred percent. It's so similar. I mean, it's so similar.
Tyson Mutrux (21:55)
Well, just like parenting, the kids change over time. The employees change over time too, right?
Elise Buie (22:01)
A hundred percent. Not at all. No. Which makes it so much harder.
Tyson Mutrux (22:06)
It makes it so much harder. Because, like, I thought you were this person, and now you're this person. Now I've got to change everything.
Elise Buie (22:15)
Completely. Well, you know what's so funny? I mean, I will never forget this. My son, Eric, the one who's in the Marines, he's still in the Marines. He called me one time, like the one time they can call you from boot camp. And he called me and he was like, damn, mom. He's like, I had no idea how hard this leadership stuff was. He was like leader of his like boot camp platoon or whatever. Yeah. And he's like, you know, I got some kids here. I've got to like sit down on the rack with them and like really talk to them about how bad their life is, what they've been through and like really, you know, get down and dirty with them to kind of motivate them. He goes, then I've got other guys who they, they need me to scream and curse in their face and like, really just yell at them and he goes and they're never gonna do it unless I do that he goes then I've got other guys that are like this is all so dumb so bureaucratic and he goes so I've got to like explain to them the context of why we're doing everything help them understand why their intellect might be getting in the way right now of them achieving what they want to achieve and he was like this is complicated it really is complicated
Tyson Mutrux (23:45)
It's interesting that he could reflect on that and recognize it, though. I don't think most people can do that. That's really impressive.
Elise Buie (23:53)
Oh, at nineteen. I was so impressed. I was just like, OK, parenting win over here in boot camp, you know.
Tyson Mutrux (24:01)
A hundred percent. Yes.
Elise Buie (24:03)
Because I was like, look at you, like actually realizing how different people are and how motivating them looks completely different from person to person to person. Totally.
Tyson Mutrux (24:13)
I do want to ask you about the leadership one, the issue you had. Was that someone that you had promoted from within and that you were trying to groom to be a leader? Or was this something you brought from outside?
Elise Buie (24:29)
It was an outside hire.
Tyson Mutrux (24:31)
Interesting. Okay. Cause I was, that would, would have been my guess. I would have been very, very surprised if it wasn't a very good fit once you had sort of promoted them from within. So like, what do you, I guess, what do you think the, if you, was it a mistake on your own part to hire the person? Like, where did you miss it? I just wonder, like, if you, have you dissected that? Cause I'm, I'm so curious since you mentioned that part, I've been really wanting to kind of dig on that.
Elise Buie (25:07)
Yeah, I mean, I think it's a combination. I mean, I think that person brought a lot of value to us in certain areas that, you know, obviously I'm super grateful for. And then I think the thing that probably, I mean, probably it's more me thing, like I get over my skis in thinking like, okay, look, this person can do X, Y, Z. So that means they can do ABC and X, Y, Z. Do you know what I mean? Whereas I really should have stuck with just X, Y, Z and been like, that is what they can do. And I think that for me, I just realized about myself, I cannot work closely with somebody that I cannot be frank with. just flat out. I can't do it. I suck at it. I mean, I, I really do. And I mean, I, you talk about leadership, like parenting. I mean, I am so frank with my kids, like about things like, and I mean, they would say sometimes too frank, like, you know, I'll just be like, yeah, you suck at that. You know, like try again. Maybe you shouldn't do that. You know, try something else. Like I was not that parent that was all like, let's get all the participation trophies and let's, you know, like I was so that parent that was like, I mean, you're playing lacrosse, carry your own damn bag, figure out how to get to practice. Do you know what I mean? Like I'm definitely a, a much more like, you know, y'all need to Buield resilience kind of thing. And so no doubt that's just who I am. And so I think when I work with people and they tend to be either, uh, super sensitive where I'm literally tripping over every word. I just can't do it. It feels so inauthentic to me. And I am the worst when I just can't be my regular self. And so when I'm spending time writing something, trying to tell somebody that the report they gave me is filled with errors, But I'm trying to say this in all this like flowery, lovely language around not trying to hurt somebody's feelings. I'm like, can I just tell you, like, I'm really busy and this report is filled with errors. And could you go back to the drawing board and check in with me by the end of the week and let's see? what you're struggling with. You know what I mean? Like,
Tyson Mutrux (27:45)
That's interesting. I don't think I've ever had a situation like that. I don't ever want to have that situation. Cause like, that sounds terrible. Cause like you can't give them the feedback that they need to succeed. That is not easy. That is tough. Wow. I mean, you really have me kind of thinking about maybe I should be a little bit more like that, though, because I'm I'm I'm more on the blunt side like you are, where I'm just very direct. And I wonder because sometimes I'll say things in a leadership meeting. And so Christian's like the barometer I look at. I look at her. I'm like, OK, am I going too far with this? And I'll kind of see her face kind of squint like like. So I do wonder if maybe I'm a little too abrasive at times. I don't know.
Elise Buie (28:40)
Well, and I'm going to say something, and it's probably not politically correct, but I'm going to say it anyway. I actually think this is less of a problem for men. I think you guys do tend to be able to just say stuff more directly. I think it's just kind of, you know, at least historically, how, you know, y'all were raised, you're around sports more. Like, it's just how it is. Do you know what I mean? Like, y'all grew up with coaches saying things to you directly more. Whereas I feel like women, we tend to be a little more prickly about these things and we expect things differently. I mean, I will see things, I mean, just very bluntly, like there's these women groups like with filled with thousands of lawyers, thousands, like eleven thousand, fifteen thousand female lawyers. And somebody will put something in there and it'll it doesn't even seem at all disturbing to me. And there will be a thousand comments attacking this person for like what they've said. And I'm just like, wow, whoa. I'm like, where did that come from? And, but, and I just, you don't see that same kind of thing, or at least I don't, when it's mostly men talking. I mean, sometimes people will say things like, you know, they'll, they'll say something and, and it'll, you know, bring up some conversations. I don't mean that, but it's, it's a different vibe. And, and I think that it's, yeah, I don't know. I think, I think women have a different dynamic that we navigate. I,
Tyson Mutrux (30:21)
I, I think, I feel like, um, and guys, we kind of tend to barb each other in person too. Like, like, Oh yeah. Yeah. We will, we'll kind of give each other like the jabs in person. Like it's a little, I wouldn't do, I it's, it's funny. I probably wouldn't do that to a woman. Like the way I, I kind of, I'll barb a guy, you know, like it's, I think there is something to what you're saying. I completely, there's also, there's another problem I see too, is like, I, so I'm pretty direct with things, but I, employees are they they have a really hard time being direct with me and i ask i beg them to me too i say hey you cannot hurt my feelings and it's interesting how during the like the our quarterly meetings i will like say like hey we really gotta get down to the heart of this issue and if it's something with me you just gotta tell me and people will be like walking on eggshells like i'm And I'm not, it's not, I am very blunt, but it's not like I'm going to fire you because you gave me a bad opinion or something. Not at all. Not at all. So it's, it's interesting. And I wonder if you have that same problem where like, do they walk on eggshells with you whenever they're trying to give you feedback?
Elise Buie (31:52)
A hundred percent. Like, and you beg for the feedback. I mean, I got the most amazing feedback a few months ago from Raina, who has been my COO for years. She's now in law school. She's still working for us a little bit, but, you know, she's been my second next to me in command for years. Yeah. Raina gave me the most amazing direct feedback. I could not have been more grateful. Like I was just like, this is so helpful. I think about it almost daily. Like, cause there's things that I'm doing and I do like better now because of it. I'm like, look, yay, look at me. Like here I am taking her feedback and doing better. There's other things I'm not so great at, you know, I'm still working on and you know, but yeah, She has been one of the only people that is able have been able to just say directly, super directly, like whatever she thinks. And I I mean, I beg for feedback. I did have a paralegal who. So before I took over this docket of cases, I hadn't worked closely with her at all. Then I took over this docket of cases and started working closely with her. And she definitely was going to Raina and being like, you know, I'm scared to tell Elise this, that, and the other. And Raina was like, just tell her. Like, she'll handle it. She won't even be upset. Like, I promise you, just tell her. So now, I mean, our relationship is night and day. I mean, and it has been, it's so improved. But I mean, she'll tell me anything now. She'll be like, Elise, I gave you a to-do list. Why didn't you do it? Like, you know. Yeah. I need you to do this. Like you need to move these cases. And I mean, she just is, it is the most beautiful thing. If I could get every single human in my office to be that candid with me about things, it would be joyous to me. Absolutely joyous. Because I mean, I hate to admit it, but I mean, I know my faults big time. Do you know what I mean? Like I get them. I know them there. I mean, I have six little humans who walked around holding up a mirror, you know, for thirty years being like, Mom, you do this wrong. See, look, you know, Mom, you do this wrong.
Tyson Mutrux (34:29)
Kids will tell you. They will let you know. They wear their hearts on their sleeves.
Elise Buie (34:35)
They do. I mean, it has been really helpful, though, as mine have come into adulthood and they're all in professional settings, working and stuff. It has been so helpful to... Bring to them like some of the things I see in my firm. And because they'll sometimes be like, oh, yeah, I could see that. They're like, you know, mom, you act like a robot in this way. Like, you know, they probably don't understand that you are actually trying to help them you know, by not giving them all the answers all the time, like you're really trying to grow them. They were like, used to do that to us and we hated it, you know, because I, I mean, when people be like, mom, how do you do this? I'm like, I don't know. How do you do it? Like, you know, there's Google, go figure it out. Like,
Tyson Mutrux (35:32)
Yeah, I ask my kids all the time. They'll ask me, why is this? I'll say, why do you think that is? Every question is responded to with another question.
Elise Buie (35:43)
A hundred percent. That's the way to go. I mean, I feel like, I mean, the other day I was working with one of the associates in my office and we were having this back and forth. And I literally told her, I said, my Socratic brain is getting exhausted because she just kept coming back to me with these like little quips. And I'm like, girl, if you think I'm giving in here, I was like, I'm not. I'm like, I'm like right now my Socratic brain is tired, but give me tomorrow morning and it'll be raring to go.
Tyson Mutrux (36:21)
I'm stealing that line from you. That's good. That's a good one. Well, we're over time, so I want to make sure we're respectful of your time. I wish we had another two hours because I could just do this. Are you coming to the conference?
Elise Buie (36:38)
Oh, yeah, for sure.
Tyson Mutrux (36:40)
Fantastic. Okay, good. We'll have plenty of time to chat at the conference.
Elise Buie (36:45)
Yeah, absolutely. Well, thanks for having me, and I hope you have a great day.
Tyson Mutrux (36:50)
You too. Thanks for chatting with me. This is great. I really love talking to you.
Elise Buie (36:56)
Absolutely. I have to go do jury duty now. I got called to a jury again.
Tyson Mutrux (37:02)
I know. Document everything. Document everything. This is so awesome. I want to be on jury duty so bad.
Elise Buie (37:09)
Oh, I get on juries a lot now. I mean this will be my third one.
Tyson Mutrux (37:15)
Never, never been called.
Elise Buie (37:17)
I'm convinced. I have a secret. I'm convinced I look one way in the county I live. And so they think one thing about me, but then I show up and I'm exactly the opposite of what they think.
Tyson Mutrux (37:32)
So you have to tell me that theory in person.
Elise Buie (37:35)
Okay. I'll see you later.
Tyson Mutrux (37:37)
See you, Lisa. Bye, everybody.