"Stories of Healing" with Shawnna

One of the most challenging barriers to overcome when contemplating attending Milestones is the priorities and responsibilities people leave at home. When you have people depending on you, it can feel selfish to walk away from your life for 30-90 days to focus on yourself and your healing.

Today on the Treating Trauma Podcast, we welcome Milestone's alum Shawnna, who candidly shares about the barriers she overcame as a mom of seven children to attend both Onsite and Milestones. Shawnna shares how the healing hospitality she experienced enveloped her and gave her the permission to do the most selfless thing she's ever done—prioritizing her healing in a season when she needed it most.

Mentioned in this Episode 

2:56 - Shawnna's Onsite and Milestones journey
4:21 - How growing up in a restrictive religious environment impacted Shawnna's view of therapy and herself
7:39 - Shawnna's first days at Milestones
9:59 - The importance of safety in trauma healing
11:10 - How somatic therapy impacted Shawnna's trauma healing
13:30 - Navigating faith through trauma therapy
15:29 - How Shawnna overcame her resistance to Milestone's healing hospitality and learned to ask for what she needed
21:33 - The ongoing lessons from Milestones that Shawnna takes into her work as an educator
24:04 - How Shawnna's community supported her journey
26:53 - Shawnna's biggest Milestones takeaways
28:59 - Shawnna's encouragement for someone considering Milestones

Creators & Guests

Host

Christopher O'Reilly

Christopher O’Reilly, MA, LPC, serves as the Vice President of Clinical Services for Milestones. Christopher has an extensive career running residential and outpatient programs specializing in trauma, addiction treatment, and detox. Within a nearly 20-year career with Caron Treatment Centers, he honed his administrative and clinical skills, overseeing residential programs’ full range of operational and therapeutic functions. Christopher also served as an adjunct professor at West Chester University, teaching mind, body health.

Host

Mickenzie Vought

In her role as Alumni and Community Relations, Mickenzie is responsible for serving Onsite, Milestones, and Onsite Wellness House alumni communities. She is also integral in furthering Onsite’s mission to design and deliver transformational experiences that optimize life and build meaning and value into the human experience. You may recognize her voice or face through the various hats she wears representing the Onsite brand as the producer and co-host of the Living Centered Podcast and host of Onsite’s emotional wellness webinars.

What is Treating Trauma Podcast?

We all have moments where life is hard, yet some of us have had to endure more than our fair share of pain, hardship, struggle, and trauma. Through in-depth interviews with our clinicians and trauma experts, this limited series explores how unresolved experiences from our past can interfere with the demands of our present, impact our relationships, and hold us back from the future we want to live.

If you or someone you love is struggling with behaviors associated with unaddressed trauma, Treating Trauma offers a unique look at how various healing methods and trauma treatments can offer a path toward recovery, growth, and wholeness.

Mickenzie Vought: 00:05

Welcome to the treating trauma podcast. Join us for this limited series of conversations with our clinicians and alum. Together, we'll explore the pillars that support the Milestone's innovative recovery that works. These conversations are an inside look into the approach, expertise, healing, hospitality, and community that make up the Milestones experience. Let's jump in.

Mickenzie Vought: 00:34

Welcome to the Treating Trauma Podcast, friends. Today, we have the incredible honor of getting to sit down with Milestones alumni, Shauna. Shauna joined us and just shared her story, and I loved how normalizing it was. For me, especially as someone who has a lot of people and things and priorities pulling at me, I really resonated with her story of how she knew that she needed to do this work and had to make some hard decisions to say, I'm going to prioritize my healing so that I can show up for all the people that need me in my life. So Shawna is, as you'll hear, the mama of multiple children, and she leaned into this work.

Mickenzie Vought: 01:17

She reached a point within her own grief and trauma where she knew she needed something more. And I was just so incredibly grateful for the way that she showed up in this interview, and she offered her perspective. She shared some of the narratives that were holding her back and then just how she was cared and held throughout the entire Milestones experience. I was really impacted by it, and I'm so grateful that she was willing to sit down with us. Christopher, what about you?

Christopher O'Reilly: 01:45

Yeah. I totally agree, Mickenzie. I mean, I I feel honored to have been in that conversation and her wisdom, her strength, just her clarity on what's important in life, and she's just a walking testament that, like, the healing journey is possible and it makes you stronger and can lead to beautiful things. It was it was such a great conversation.

Mickenzie Vought: 02:10

Absolutely. And I think what I loved also is at the end, Shawna shared how she's not just keeping this healing for herself. She shared the compounding and rippling effect that this healing had while she was at Milestones and how she's going on to serve and help others find hope and healing. I really hope you enjoy this conversation with Shauna. Let's jump in.

Mickenzie Vought: 02:35

Welcome, Shauna. We're so, so excited to be having this conversation with you. And I'm wondering if you would just kind of give us the gift of introducing yourself. Who are you? What are the roles that make up your life?

Shawnna: 02:48

I am Shauna Combs. I am a wife and a mother of 7 really amazing kids. And I'm a teacher, and I'm a child of God. So pretty much describes me.

Mickenzie Vought: 03:03

I love it. And can you kinda give us a snapshot of how you are familiar with on-site and milestones? What has your journey been like?

Shawnna: 03:13

So my journey started like everyone else in a in a therapist office

Christopher O'Reilly: 03:18

Mhmm.

Shawnna: 03:19

Which was incredibly difficult for me culturally to even go to a therapist, but I did. I had a huge amount of grief, and loss and trying to understand myself. And so I had a therapist that I I went to see, and while I was in therapy in that process, they as she introduced me to On-site and said, you know, I really think the healing and trauma program would work really well for you. And so that's kind of how On-site started. I started like everyone in the beginning of therapy where you're just not sure how you wanna begin or what you wanna do.

Shawnna: 03:59

And she definitely said go to on-site, and I was like, that's not happening. Like, that sounds too scary.

Mickenzie Vought: 04:04

No. Thank you.

Shawnna: 04:05

Yeah. That was way too scary.

Mickenzie Vought: 04:09

What felt the most scary about it?

Shawnna: 04:11

Well, I mean, we go back to that, like, obvious introduction of I have 7 children. So

Mickenzie Vought: 04:17

Yeah. It feels like a a very large barrier to overcome. Right. I went to a program before I had children. So my I've tried I've been trying to convince my husband to go for a couple of years, and he's like, no.

Mickenzie Vought: 04:30

I'm not leaving the children. So I get that. You said it, like, culturally, it felt kind of foreign to you. What did you mean by that?

Shawnna: 04:38

I grew up in a very restrictive religious environment. And so k. To be, like, really frank, like, when anybody would ask us of a question, we would say, I don't know. I don't know. Women primarily were seen and not heard ever.

Shawnna: 04:56

Yeah. You didn't feel any feelings, and you were really put on this earth to serve. And so I was really good at the whole thing, like, I'm okay. I'm okay.

Christopher O'Reilly: 05:10

So hearing that, I'm so curious, like, was it, overwhelming your first on-site program or, like, what was that like for you?

Shawnna: 05:21

I couldn't even sit in the chair. I couldn't. It was very difficult for me to, like, be in a room. And I think that the crazy thing that I now, like, really know in my soul is that when you enter that room, you're also in entering to a room of, like, such connection and truth and you're bare. You know, your feelings are literally on the outside of you.

Shawnna: 05:43

And you can't really tell anybody at the moment, but you don't even realize that that's happening. And so it it it was so overwhelming in that sense. Like, that I was I almost it was the unknown that was scary. And bless the therapist that had me, miss Debbie Reed. Bless her.

Shawnna: 06:01

So, but she was phenomenal.

Mickenzie Vought: 06:04

So you did your healing trauma program, and then how did you get introduced to milestones? Was there another step between that? I can't I think you told me maybe. Did you do the life after loss program?

Shawnna: 06:15

I did. So I did the healing and trauma program, and, like, 2 weeks later, I came back and did life after loss. So they were back to back. And that was definitely by, you know, recommendations of, you know, amazing I mean, just amazing therapists and everyone that was at on-site really, saw that I was struggling. Even when I couldn't see it, they created such a place of safety where I could be as vulnerable, I mean, more than I'd ever been in my entire life.

Shawnna: 06:44

And so my okay went to, oh, okay.

Mickenzie Vought: 06:48

Yeah. That's a good distinction.

Shawnna: 06:50

To do something. Yeah. And so, I was introduced to milestones, and I went home and then came back to milestones, that following Monday Right. Which was a lot. But to be really honest with you, I don't even remember, and that's how I know that, like, I wasn't I wasn't in a good place.

Shawnna: 07:11

So I don't remember even the 3 days or I think it maybe was 4 days I was home and then back to milestones.

Christopher O'Reilly: 07:21

So you really did 3 programs back to back?

Shawnna: 07:24

For sure. Yeah. I call them I I look at them now as like lifeboats. They just kept putting a vest on me when I was trying to take it off, and it was it's literally what saved my life. Yeah.

Mickenzie Vought: 07:36

Tell me a little bit about those first couple of days at Milestones. What was that like leaving you had kind of, like, left your 7 children a couple different times in a short amount of time, and and then you were here and kind of in the depth of what I make up is a lot of grief and a lot of emotions. What was it like kinda coming into the community?

Shawnna: 07:56

It was overwhelmingly welcoming.

Mickenzie Vought: 07:59

So It's good. We like to hear that.

Shawnna: 08:01

Yeah. Everyone is in a different, like, part of their process. So you've got people that are leaving and people that are coming, and there wasn't a single person who didn't stop to introduce themselves. And they did it in such a, kind and gentle way. I stood on that porch.

Shawnna: 08:17

Actually, I sat in the chair, and I can remember the same chair I sat in. And I probably sat there for a good part of my first day. And it was just they let me adjust. They let me breathe. They let me soak it in.

Shawnna: 08:31

And I literally was, you know, around such beauty and nature and I just needed a a minute to breathe. But everyone was so welcoming to the point that, like, I almost, you know, like, everything was handpicked. Like, I feel like I look back and I'm like, the therapists that I had were handpicked. The room I was in was handpicked. Like, they it was the details that I look back now that, like, really did provide the amount of safety I needed in that in the moment that I needed it most.

Christopher O'Reilly: 09:03

Yeah. Shauna, I've I've had, milestones guests say things like, how did you know to bring us all in at the same time? Or how did you know this or that? And, you know, we are very thoughtful and like assigning therapists and things like that. But there's something larger at play when it comes to, like, communities that are there together at the same time and all that kind of stuff.

Christopher O'Reilly: 09:27

But I love that you had that sort of sense of things.

Shawnna: 09:30

And these the roommates I had are still lifelong friends. Like, we still connect. They know my children. We show up for each other, and I think that that there's a beauty in that. There is beauty in in the pain.

Shawnna: 09:42

There is.

Christopher O'Reilly: 09:43

Yeah. Shauna, you said earlier, kind of like the cultural difference of just like coming into a space where there's like, honesty and truth. I think it was when you were describing the, the first program. And what was your like internal process of like settling into that? And just like maybe your defense is kind of dropping and like maybe speaking out more, being more vulnerable.

Christopher O'Reilly: 10:09

Like I'm curious, like how being in that environment for an extended period of time, like, kind of impacted you in that way?

Shawnna: 10:16

I go back to, like, the safety part of it. I didn't know safety. I think that in my mind, I had created safety, and the safety that I had wasn't truth. And so, again, I go back to, like, the therapist, you know, that tip toe, they're tiptoeing, and they definitely had to with me. My defenses were strong.

Shawnna: 10:38

My protectors were even stronger. And I remember looking at Debbie Reid and I was like, when is this gonna stop hurting? And she very bluntly looked at me and said, when you start to feel. And I and I now know that, like, I needed to feel it both. Yes.

Shawnna: 10:59

Your heart is a huge part of it, but the somatic grief that I was holding on to, my body was holding on to amount of grief, and it still is. I mean, it's a process that you have to you have to do, but I still have some pretty strong protectors some days.

Mickenzie Vought: 11:14

Yeah. Oh, yeah. We talk a lot about somatic, but what do we sometimes we think, like, what does that actually mean? So, like, what was the actual specifics of what your therapist led you through that helped you connect into your body and get out of your head?

Shawnna: 11:26

So I can tell you, like, in the beginning, all of it was woo woo to me. Like, this is this is crazy. Like, I literally I remember thinking at one point, like, this is too much. Like like, it's just too much. I didn't understand how a walk was gonna help me.

Shawnna: 11:43

I didn't understand how movement was gonna help me or tapping or, you know, learning the love hug or 5 senses and breathing or box breathing. I mean, these are all things that I've now taught my children to do, you know, when they're upset, and it's huge. Your body is responding almost way before it's caught up to your brain. So whether that's, you know, from all of my training and understanding now more is that it you know, women hold it in their guts. They do.

Shawnna: 12:15

And so your stomach is hurting, you know, in that vagus nerve. And I love that the education that I received beyond which I'm a researcher by nature. So that education I received along with actual doing, was huge to me. Like, I could comprehend, like, what they were asking me to do even though I thought they may be off their markers. But at the same time, like, it was so good.

Shawnna: 12:42

You know? I remember, Tory explaining it to me that it's like a window that's it keeps being shut, and it shuts tightly, but somebody keeps locking it. And so no matter how much you lift on it, when you're activated, you can't lift you're not gonna lift it up until you start to move it out of your body. Or the poor time that I left, Betsy, who is was my home therapist. I left her dancing to Taylor Swift's Shake It Off one time all by herself because I thought, this is bananas.

Shawnna: 13:12

But now I would totally dance with her in any room and understand that, like, that's movement out of your body. The more you get it out of your body, the the more your mind actually can comprehend what's happening.

Christopher O'Reilly: 13:26

Yeah. Love that. So I I know Mackenzie asked you about your first couple of days at milestones. I'm kind of curious, you know, what were some of the highlights of your milestones experience? You know, I think people have different types of experiences that lead a big have a big impact on them.

Christopher O'Reilly: 13:42

And I'm curious if you could share with us some of what you remember.

Shawnna: 13:47

A huge highlight is, you know, coming from religious trauma. It's it's huge to be met in such a spiritual way and really understand that there is a place where you can go that your heart's always needed to go, and you can be met there. And it's not necessarily of the same faith background. I was met spiritually with, you know, different faith backgrounds, and that was such an experience for me that I I can't even tell you, you know, down to long conversations on a porch. So those are things that, like, I didn't realize how much I was racing through time and how much I was losing actual time that I needed, just to slow down, which I I totally do now.

Shawnna: 14:35

You know, taking 5 minutes to yourself a day literally changes your whole, train of thought. And it's really sitting either in silence or, you know, whatever people choose to do. You know, whether you're reading a book or you're doing a devotional or, you know, you're just sitting and, I don't know, listening to the new Taylor Swift album or something. You know? You're doing something for yourself.

Shawnna: 14:58

So I Yeah. Choosing yourself is the hardest thing you can do. And as a mom, it's very difficult. So if I can do 5 minutes a day, can I add 6 minutes the next week? Can I have 7 minutes the week after that?

Shawnna: 15:10

Until you add it up. And then also that connection and relationship. I wouldn't be even thinking of the 2nd career that I went into realizing that not only my story matters, but I can sit with somebody and share that space with them and and meet them in their story as well. And I may not understand it from their experience, but I can sit with them in that experience and and know that that's that's also peace to them. So Mhmm.

Shawnna: 15:40

I do definitely love that I that I took a lot of peace from milestones I did.

Mickenzie Vought: 15:45

I think that's my favorite thing about the group experience is that what you were sharing about of I can sit with you in this situation. I can sit with you in this pain and not have to completely understand what you've gone through Because you can see the threads of yourself and other people's stories. And that's the greatest gift that I got from my on-site experience. Another thing that I didn't realize the impact of until after I had left was there was a taking care of me that I didn't expect. Like, I am very individualistic.

Mickenzie Vought: 16:17

I like taking care of myself and, and to be in an environment where I didn't have to make decisions and I could just focus on myself felt really good. I wonder for you as a mother of 7 and and as a woman, and I know coming from my own background and evangelicalism, like, I I bump up against this belief that I should be serving others. So what was it like for you to be a no milestones? We really try to take care of our clients and create an environment so you can just focus on your healing. Was that uncomfortable?

Mickenzie Vought: 16:47

Did was it like a breath of fresh air? I just wonder what that was like, for the all encompassing thing that I know comes at milestones for you.

Shawnna: 16:55

I fought it

Mickenzie Vought: 16:57

Yeah.

Shawnna: 16:57

100%. Like, I fought it a lot. And even in the defensive fighting part of it, I was still met with love and caring. I was still met with, you know, it's okay to not be okay. You know, if you don't wanna do this right now, it's okay.

Shawnna: 17:14

We can revisit it. You know, I wasn't as a mom, I'm horrible at remembering to eat and drink, and I think it was the first time I realized that I could go hours without eating and drinking. And so, you know, having, you know, meals that were prepared and, you know, there wasn't anything like if I said, could I have a grilled cheese? They weren't gonna say no to me. They met me exactly where I could.

Shawnna: 17:44

It was that simple. It started with, like, simple request or, like, simple things to be met. And I think that that's when I was like, it's safe enough for me to ask for help. And, you know, I I'm always gonna say I have the most amazing therapist there. Kim Speck was one of my, therapists, and she I remember it was the simple act of telling me that she was walking to a trash can that I'm always gonna remember in my head because I needed to know where everyone was in the room.

Shawnna: 18:14

And that simple act of telling me where she was going and that she wasn't, like, leaving me was incredibly important, and that that felt like somebody meeting every need I needed.

Mickenzie Vought: 18:29

I love the idea of, kind of building that muscle and starting with small things of saying, like, can I have a grilled cheese? And then continuing to build that muscle to say, I need help with this thing that feels too big for me to hold myself. I think that's what I make up.

Shawnna: 18:42

What's crazy is we tell our children to do that. Right? So we raise our kids to ask for the things that they need and not really realizing how wounded my inner child was and that I wouldn't have asked for anything ever. That I would it was so much easier for me to do than to ask.

Mickenzie Vought: 19:00

I relate to that.

Christopher O'Reilly: 19:01

Yeah, no, I was just thinking we're talking a lot about, you know, kind of like leaning into or settling into the care that happens at milestones and just the support. And and I gotta say that it's such a gift for the staff to be able to provide that. It's just it's so meaningful for them. I'm also kind of curious to kind of balance that out. Like, I would like to think that like milestones also tries to empower people to step into their strength to step into their own and be responsible for their healing and their growth, but also obviously with support.

Christopher O'Reilly: 19:37

So I'm, I'm curious, like, from a sense of empowerment, like, what you learned about yourself, or what experiences did you have at milestones that kind of are more in that category?

Shawnna: 19:47

I learned that it's okay to ask for what I need.

Christopher O'Reilly: 19:52

Yeah.

Shawnna: 19:53

Even if it can't be met, I can't ask.

Christopher O'Reilly: 19:56

That's right.

Shawnna: 19:56

And that emotions are real, and I may be having a 10% day. Marie Marie taught me that. She was my adjust therapist, but she taught me that I can have a 10% day and to learn to kind of have that connection with people to say, like, I'm at 10% today. I'm gonna need you to I'm gonna need you to reach me at that 90.

Mickenzie Vought: 20:21

Yeah.

Shawnna: 20:21

I'm gonna need you to pick that up. And I think that I love that I've transferred that to my kids. Yeah. So when I can tell that they're having, like, a 10% day, you know, I'm not I love that I can say to them, hey. I've got that 90%, so don't you worry about it.

Shawnna: 20:39

And that might be simple, like, they have the dishes that are chores. Right? And I can handle the dishes. Like, no big deal. Like, I could probably do those with my eyes closed blindfolded.

Shawnna: 20:48

They don't they, you know, they don't realize that, but I can. You know? And, like, work relationships and even in, you know, marriage, you've gotta be able to to have the days where you just can't. And then you have the days where you can and you I now know the importance of when I can hold space for somebody and when I cannot hold space for somebody. And that's hugely important to me because I was such a doer.

Christopher O'Reilly: 21:14

Mhmm. I

Shawnna: 21:14

was such a, let me fix it all. I can fix that. Let me fix it. And it's okay to not fix things. It's okay.

Christopher O'Reilly: 21:21

Yeah. I love that. It's like half the battle is knowing that you're having a 10% day and then asking for what you need on those days. It's really cool.

Mickenzie Vought: 21:31

I wonder you've talked a lot about, like, I've gotten to teach my kids this, and I've gotten to bring this into the work I do. What are some of the other tools and skills that maybe you didn't realize you were building at milestones and now that you're kinda out, you look back and think, oh, I learned that at milestones or that was a seed that was planted. Do you have any of those moments, I wonder?

Shawnna: 21:49

So as an educator, I work with kids of so many different emotions and and just, like, educational barriers and that. And, you know, I I learned the importance of somatic release. I did. And so, you know, when I'm have a classroom full of kids and they're having a bad day or an off day, I I can do a box breathing with them. I can stand with them and do that.

Shawnna: 22:14

My favorite exercise is to ask a kid, what do you need to hear from someone today? Like, what is it that you need to hear from someone? And I'll tell you, I did that note cards exercise a couple months ago and I ended, like, with tears in my eyes. And some of them were like, I need somebody to tell me that they're proud of me. I need somebody to know that my voice is heard.

Shawnna: 22:37

And, you know, there was other ones like I need somebody to give me 5 more minutes on a video game. You know, like the silly ones. And there's something about looking into a child's eyes whether they're your own child or somebody that I've been gifted for that moment in time to be safety for them and say to you, I'm so proud of you. I never heard that growing up. So and the first time I heard I'm proud of you was at On-site.

Shawnna: 23:04

Wow. So and somebody looked deep in me and said that, like, I'm really proud of you.

Christopher O'Reilly: 23:10

That's huge. Words words are so powerful. Sean, was was your husband involved in the process? Did he have a chance to do the family program or any, I'm kind of curious how the milestones experience may be impacted, like, outside of just you, but, like, the relationship.

Shawnna: 23:27

So no. Not we didn't do any kind of the family, parts of it. So, he was obviously at home with the kids. Mhmm. And, I have an amazing church family, and so they really stepped in.

Shawnna: 23:42

And they, you know, showed up like as if I wasn't even, you know, gone. They kept them busy while I was gone, so that was such a blessing. But, yeah, he I mean, like, he was obviously supportive of of what I needed, and he knew everything that was going on. And there was so much loss so quick for me that he he was so, like and he'll say it. He was like, I was so ill equipped other than just to love you and to to know that, like, you know, you needed to do something different.

Mickenzie Vought: 24:18

Mhmm. I think often, if there's someone that's listening today who is in a relationship with someone who's struggling, it's hard to know what to do. I've noticed in my own life is when someone has given me that gift, I can give it away to other people. So have you been able to say those hard things to someone to come alongside them in a hard time and kind of say, like, oh, I know how important this is?

Shawnna: 24:39

Oh, for sure. For sure. I think that having a faith background, I think it's really important to be able to meet people where they're standing. And, you know, I guess I should back up and say it wasn't just my therapist. It actually started in church.

Shawnna: 24:55

Somebody saying, you know, like, you seem really sad. And so stepping out of that, like, boundary level you know, it's really easy to ask somebody, are you okay? But we don't always know what to do with a response when they say, no, I'm not. And so I remember saying, somebody asked me, are you okay? And I said, I I don't think that I am.

Christopher O'Reilly: 25:17

Mhmm.

Shawnna: 25:17

Yeah. And then that person showing up and saying, well, whatever needs to happen, this is what I did. And they went to see that same therapist and was like, let me let me introduce you to the path that I took. And so anytime anyone is struggling, my first thing to say is, you know, like, I understand that, like, the stigma of therapy seems horrible and very, like, prob maybe out of touch for you, but what I can tell you is there's something beautiful about having another human witness and mirror to you that, you know, as moms, we feel crazy most of the time, period. Yeah.

Shawnna: 25:59

And so to not feel like you're actually crazy because that's kind of what society tells us. You know, any emotion that we feel that's not in the box Pretty and buttoned up. Yeah. You know, it's it's it's not okay, and I think that I have so many people that just sat and cried with me, including therapists. You know, they could feel the same things I was feeling.

Shawnna: 26:21

And I always say, like, I don't let anyone cry alone. So I'll sit and cry with them, and I may not have anything I can offer them, but I what I can offer them is a safe environment.

Christopher O'Reilly: 26:33

Mhmm. Mhmm.

Mickenzie Vought: 26:34

Your presence. That's beautiful.

Christopher O'Reilly: 26:36

Which is probably the most valuable thing you could offer somebody, you know, be able to do that. Wow. What would you say just, when when you reflect on those 3 back to back programs in that period of in your life and just, and it's a big question, but take it in any direction that makes sense. Like what are some of your biggest takeaways like from that experience and, and think, you know, what are, how it has impacted you and hopefully propelled your healing journey, things like that. Like, what what are some of the bigger takeaways would you say?

Shawnna: 27:10

The mom I am now is the mom I needed growing up. So I think that the the huge connection is and, you know, one of the most amazing conversations I had with my kids was that apology of, like, hey, guys. I was floating. Floating through existence. And this doesn't mean, like, you don't have memories of your children or anything like that.

Shawnna: 27:35

It just means, like, you can be engulfed in the amount of grief and pain and and trauma and generational trauma that you don't even realize that you're kinda floating above everything. And so the mom I am now is so much more present and I'm so much more intentional with my time that I spend with my kids. And no is a whole sentence

Christopher O'Reilly: 28:02

Yeah.

Shawnna: 28:02

When it comes to that. And I just I'm so incredibly blessed that I also get to share the gift of motherhood with, you know, also raising other people's kids as well. We've, you know, done foster care for a long time. So being able to to love someone else's kid but also meet them where they're struggling too is exactly where I feel like I was met in the process of on-site. I just I was a mom who was really struggling to understand, like, the absence of myself.

Shawnna: 28:34

And so to truly know myself is probably the most profound gift I could have ever asked for. That that authentic self is huge and that my story does matter.

Mickenzie Vought: 28:46

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Shawnna: 28:47

It's not it's definitely still writing, obviously. Yeah.

Christopher O'Reilly: 28:51

Yeah.

Shawnna: 28:52

And that it doesn't stop at on-site. You've gotta keep moving forward and you've gotta keep doing, I think it was Carlos who says it all the time, the next right step.

Mickenzie Vought: 29:02

Yeah.

Shawnna: 29:02

You gotta do the next right step. And so I even say that, you know, to my students. Like, listen. Whatever you do in life, just do the next right step, and it you will be fine. You will be fine.

Christopher O'Reilly: 29:15

Wow. So huge.

Mickenzie Vought: 29:17

I wonder kinda as we're rounding out, if you would share your encouragement to someone who might be considering milestones. I loved how you said do that next right step, but I just as someone who maybe is in that place and thinking, I don't know what to do next or how to do that, what would be your encouragement to them?

Shawnna: 29:34

Do it scared. Do it with fear. Do it for yourself. If you don't have kids, do it for your future kids. If you do have kids, This is the chance for you to do it for yours do it for you, which will then largely impact who they become and who they are shaped to be.

Shawnna: 29:56

And also do it because your story matters. It does matter.

Christopher O'Reilly: 30:00

That's great. Because I I I think, expanding the context, meaning like, do it for future kids, do it for your future self. Like, cause I think sometimes people struggle with, getting a sense that they're worth it, that anything will change, you know, cause they haven't had that kind of experience. So I think that's a great piece of advice.

Mickenzie Vought: 30:23

Mhmm. Well, I really appreciate your willingness to kinda just chat with us and and show up and use your story to help other people. We're really, really grateful.

Shawnna: 30:31

Thank you so much for having me. I'm I'm really hoping that it will reach a mom's heart, and lots of women out there to choose them and themselves, and that's a gift.

Mickenzie Vought: 30:42

And I love how you're taking your healing and helping other people. I think that was what I was struck the most when I was talking with you. I was like, we have got to tell our story because I just love that you didn't just keep it for yourself. You're like, okay, great. Me and my family, we're doing better.

Mickenzie Vought: 30:55

I brought a ton of healing, and that stops it. And you're like, no. I gotta keep moving this forward. So thank you. Thank you for being committed to growth.

Christopher O'Reilly: 31:02

Yeah. So good.