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Episode Summary
Get ready for an inspiring conversation about growth mindset, career transition, overcoming imposter syndrome, the power of mentors and feedback, and more. So sit back, relax, and let's dive Beyond The Job Title with Julie Fox!
- (00:00) - Intro | taking control of your own story
- (03:09) - Laid off while on maternity leave
- (09:10) - Shift from victim to growth mindset
- (12:21) - Transitioning into tech without tech experience
- (13:58) - Discovering customer success through mentorship
- (15:54) - Don’t let rejection stop you from what you want
- (22:01) - Nobody has all the answers
- (24:45) - Transitioning from an individual contributor to a leadership role
- (27:08) - Take a pay cut but have a plan for your next growth move
- (33:06) - The importance of team feedback for growth and improvement
- (34:44) - Scaling customer success
- (40:31) - closing
- (44:02) - Don't hesitate to seek help while on your journey
- (45:23) - Outro
Julie’s Bio
Julie Fox resides in Indiana with her husband and their two children. She currently holds the position of Senior Manager of Customer Success at FloQast, a premier company known for its accounting workflow automation software tailored specifically for accountants. Before joining FloQast, Julie served as the Manager of CS at Greenlight Guru. Outside the realm of technology, she has demonstrated her leadership capabilities by taking on significant roles, including those of VP of Services and Director of Operations.
In 2023, Julie was honored as one of the Top 25 Creative Customer Success Leaders. With a forward-looking vision, she aspires to be part of speaking engagements and podcasts over the coming years and aims to mentor a greater number of individuals. Julie is not just an accomplished professional; she's a fervent leader with a dedication to scaling teams and nurturing individual growth.
Connect With Julie
🎙About The Podcast
Join Cesar Romero, as he shares the stories of trailblazing underrepresented SaaS founders, executives, and professionals who have broken barriers and achieved remarkable milestones. Whether you seek inspiration, mentorship, or actionable strategies to advance your career, our podcast is your go-to resource.
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Creators & Guests
What is Beyond The Job Title | Underrepresented Career Stories?
The lack of diversity in tech can lead to imposter syndrome, bias, and a sense of isolation that hinders your growth and ambition.
Welcome to 'Beyond The Job Title Podcast,' where we shine a spotlight on the journeys of underrepresented tech professionals and allies within the SaaS industry.
Join us as we delve into the personal development and career insights that have fueled their success.
Discover the stories of trailblazing underrepresented SaaS founders, executives, and professionals who have broken barriers and achieved remarkable milestones.
Whether you're seeking inspiration, mentorship, or actionable strategies to advance your career, our podcast is your go-to resource.
Tune in to gain valuable insights, build your network, and navigate your tech career journey with confidence.
Subscribe now and take the next step toward your own success in the world of tech.
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Julie Fox | BJT21 - Main
[00:00:00] Julie: There's so many layoffs happening. And in that moment, you just feel completely broken and you feel like you've lost control because something happened to you. And I think that's where, for me, this was when I made the decision to change my career and to make a big switch into tech.
[00:00:16] Julie: And that was my way of taking control of the story was that I. I was in a career that I was good at. I was well connected. I knew that I, that was kind of my easy button was going back to that career, but I wanted, I didn't want this just to be a negative story of something that happened to me. I wanted this to be the moment where I took control, where I took the story back and found a career and an industry that I was passionate about and that I loved.
[00:00:44] Cesar: Hey friends. Welcome to another episode of beyond the job type of podcast. I'm your host since our Romero. And in this podcast, we share the journeys of successful [00:01:00] underrepresented tech professionals. With the goal to inspire you and bring you the mentorship and resources that you need to advance your career. My guest for this episode is Julie Fox. Julie. It's a single manager of customer success for flow cast. The leading provider of accounting, workflow automation, software built by accountants for accountants.
[00:01:22] Cesar: She was also recognized as a top 25 creative customer success leader in 2023. And she is passionate about mentoring. And. Helping people with. The own personal and professional growth. And in this episode, We dive deeper into her. Transition into tech. And we talk about. Why it's important to have a growth mindset in everything you do. Her career transition overcoming the imposter syndrome. The power of having mentors and receiving feedback and so much more. Thank you so much for joining us. And I hope that Julia's story of resilience and growth. Resonates with [00:02:00] you as much as it did with me.
[00:02:02] Cesar: And as always, if you have any feedback, suggestions, or requests for future episodes, please feel free to reach out. I value your input. And the goal is to deliver content that provides value. To you.
[00:02:15] Cesar: Now here's my conversation with Julie Fox.
[00:02:20] Cesar: So Julie, welcome to the show. I'm excited to have you here and dive deeper into your story. And I wanted to start off with One of your period of moments, before you made that pivot into tech and you wrote about this on your LinkedIn profile about, you know, you were on maternity leave and this was supposed to be a moment where you connect, you know, with your child and take a moment to be with your family.
[00:02:51] Cesar: But then, you know, you found out that you were essentially getting let go, like getting laid off. And what goes through that moment? what was,[00:03:00] what do you feel like in that moment? And, you know, what were some of the, things that, that came up for you as you, as this
[00:03:08] Julie: unfolded?
[00:03:09] Julie: Sure. Honestly, this is one of those moments that I feel like has made its way into my core memories because I remember the moment when it happened. I remember exactly what I did after it happened. And I just remember in that moment, just feeling completely defeated and I was mad, I was angry and I'm not an angry person and.
[00:03:31] Julie: I remember talking to my husband and one of the first things that he said, because I'm sitting there in the parking lot, just crying and telling him what happened. And I remember him asking me some key questions. And one of the things he said was, you know, are you crying and upset because your feelings are hurt?
[00:03:48] Julie: Or are you crying and upset because you're really upset about losing this job? And I realized that I, it wasn't a career. It wasn't a job that I was overly passionate about or that I loved. [00:04:00] I, my feelings were hurt. I was frustrated and I was embarrassed and I was sad about the situation and I was mad about the timing that it happened because like you said, it was maternity leave.
[00:04:10] Julie: This was supposed to be my time. For my body to heal, for me to take care of my family and for me to immerse myself in this new world that I was coming into as a second time mom for through that experience. And I felt like that was being taken away from me and it was through a lot of conversations and reflection.
[00:04:30] Julie: And I, a lot of, I guess, advice also from other people. I had a lot of people that immediately, I mean, as mad as I was, I feel like my family was even madder maybe, And everybody kept saying, you know, you need to take legal action. you need to deal with it in this way. And I just felt so overwhelmed by the concept of that because as a recovering newer mom, having just recently given birth that, that I only had so much energy.
[00:04:56] Julie: I was giving and needed to give energy to my [00:05:00] family and to my new son. I needed to put energy into my future of what am I going to do? what is my future going to look like? And I felt like going down a big legal battle or something like that. The only thing that was going to do was kind of keep me stuck in the past.
[00:05:16] Julie: And so it was through that, that I really kind of made this decision of, you know what? I want to put my energy into right now and into my future and I'm going to move forward and I really needed to take control of the story. I needed something positive to come out of this experience. And I think that's something that a lot of people can resonate with right now that.
[00:05:37] Julie: There's so many layoffs happening. And I mean, it's, it is devastating. And in that moment, you just feel completely broken and you feel like you've lost control because something happened to you. And I think that's where, for me, this was when I made the decision to change my career and to make a big switch into tech.
[00:05:56] Julie: And that was my way of taking control of the [00:06:00] story was that I. I was in a career that I was good at. I was well connected. I knew that I, that was kind of my easy button was going back to that career, but I wanted, I didn't want this just to be a negative story of something that happened to me. I wanted this to be the moment where I took control, where I took the story back and found a career and an industry that I was passionate about and that I loved.
[00:06:24] Julie: And Immediately, I had this gut that I wanted to get into tech and it's interesting because I had been in commercial real estate where I had been interacting with tech companies as my customers. And so I had been in their spaces. They're really, I mean, this was pre COVID. So the very fun, exciting energy and cultures that I would kind of walk into.
[00:06:46] Julie: I don't know if I knew that much about what the tech world was other than. They had really cool office space, and I knew that it was just kind of this, there was this buzz, this energy and excitement in these spaces that I would [00:07:00] walk into that it wasn't just cool furniture and cool ceiling treatments.
[00:07:04] Julie: it was the people were excited, happy, and I just. I wanted to be a part of that. And so the more that I looked into it, the more that I learned about the tech community and the tech world, what really drew me in was the level of innovation. So what I found in it, it wasn't just the innovation of the product.
[00:07:23] Julie: I mean, that is, I mean, I guess that by. By definition, almost the definition of tech is that it's constantly evolving. It's constantly innovating. And I liked that because I do like the idea of that constant, constantly striving for better and refinement and kind of, you're constantly going after something you, you never kind of, you're never exactly going to reach it.
[00:07:44] Julie: And so that part was inspiring to me, but what I really, especially I think was drawn towards was the innovation of the people. So this idea and mindset that. There was so much development around the teams and the people. And you look at[00:08:00] how tech does sales, how tech does HR or customer success. And it's, it is.
[00:08:06] Julie: Unlike any other industry, because I think it's really, there's such a point to developing people and coaching them. And again, you're never going to get to a point to where you're like, all right, I've done it. I'm here. I'm the best I can be. You're going to keep getting feedback. You're going to keep evolving and keep taking on new challenges.
[00:08:25] Julie: And I think that part was really inspiring to me. So many
[00:08:29] Cesar: avenues I want to take here, but one thing I want to mention or echo is that it doesn't matter what happens to you, you know, despite the setbacks, we always have the power to give meaning to it, right? To decide, is this going to serve me or hurt me?
[00:08:50] Cesar: I think,it's a valuable that what you mentioned, but you decided, you know what I'm going to use this as a stepping stone into the next step [00:09:00] in my career. And I'd let it,slow you down. and that's so important. For people to remember. Especially in this economy where, you know, things are tough out there.
[00:09:10] Julie: you always, I think it's easy to feel like the victim. It's easy to feel like these things are happening to you. And one thing that I can say as somebody that, you know, I've worked for many different companies and truly all of my experiences, the good and the bad, they've made me better.
[00:09:28] Julie: They've made me who I am. And I think that's something that maybe comes with time Honestly, maybe a maturity, but getting to that realization that I can go through really hard things and I'm going to be better for it. I think that to me has kind of shifted my mindset from being this victim mentality to really more of that growth mindset of, you know, throw it at me, whatever you've got, I can take it.
[00:09:52] Julie: Whatever the challenge is, I'm going to, it may be hard in the moment, but I'm going to get through this and I'm going to learn, I'm going to grow along the way and I'm going to be better [00:10:00] for it. And I think that's where. For me, these types of experiences really have been transformative in my life. not just professionally, but even as a mom of how can I get through tough stuff that happens?
[00:10:12] Julie: How can I get through the ups and the downs of life in general and recognize that it's, these aren't things that just happen. These are things that help build you and shape you. How did you
[00:10:23] Cesar: decide on customer success? And do you still think that
[00:10:31] Cesar: Pivoting into tech or getting into tech is a good idea, considering, you know, the current state of tech right
[00:10:38] Julie: now. Yeah, I love that question. I guess I'll answer the second question first. I cannot imagine anything else. I... I live and breathe tech and the customer success community in this world. And it's I have found a part of myself and I truly can't imagine doing anything else.
[00:10:58] Julie: And it's interesting because I work [00:11:00] with, a company, we. We serve accountants that our customers are often accountants are in accounting industry. And so we often hire people with that background. So instead of hiring people from customer success, we hire CPAs, controllers, different levels.
[00:11:17] Julie: And I feel like I have a lot of people that are through the interview process are kind of vetting this out and trying to figure out, you know, this is a change in my career. Is this something that I could see myself doing or. You know, is this going to hurt me if I go off of my current career path into something new?
[00:11:33] Julie: And for me taking that leap of faith coming into the world of customer success, it truly changed me. I mean, it just kind of opened up my eyes to a whole different world. And so it's definitely something that I know we're going through challenging times. I won't. I won't sugarcoat that it is a tough world out there in the tech community, but I think that's where resilience is created.
[00:11:56] Julie: I think that's where, people that are able to kind of [00:12:00] work through this and make it through and continue to stay in tech, will be better for it. Absolutely. as for finding customer success, Oh man, my journey to get into tech was hard. So I made the, as I mentioned before, I made this decision and I was adamant about it.
[00:12:16] Julie: I was going to get into tech. And as I alluded to, I didn't really know what that meant. I didn't have contacts or people that could pave the way for me or make introductions. And so that journey of finding a job in tech. It wasn't easy. It's not like I just made the decision and all of a sudden had interviews lining up and people were begging me to join their teams.
[00:12:38] Julie: And it's interesting because I feel like that, that was frustrating to me because I came from a job where I was a VP of services. I had previously been a director of operations and I felt like I had kind of earned. I'd gotten to, I don't know if earns with the right word, but I'd gotten to a certain point in my career and I felt like making this transition was going to be easier [00:13:00] for some reason.
[00:13:01] Julie: And it wasn't, everybody kept saying, you know, to get into tech, you need tech experience and that it just doesn't make sense. how do you do that? I need somebody to take a chance on me so I can get tech experience. And through that, I spent a lot more time. networking and talking to people and getting to know them and understanding what their roles were, what drives them, what makes them happy, what they like most about their role, what they don't like, and on all that stuff that I did actually interviewing for companies because I really didn't know what I wanted to do.
[00:13:32] Julie: And I didn't want to, my concern was, or my fear was that I would interview for the perfect company and the perfect Role maybe even, and somebody would ask me what I want to do. And I wouldn't have a strong enough answer because I would be like, I don't know, I can do anything. Just, you know, put me in coach, just give me a chance.
[00:13:49] Julie: And by being that generalist that they would be turned off and I wouldn't have a chance. And so I really spent a lot of time. Getting to know and understanding [00:14:00] and trying to figure out what type, what size and stage and product or industry I wanted to work in within tech, as well as finding the role of customer success and that segment.
[00:14:12] Julie: And Truly, it was through a mentor. It was through a mentoring conversation where I was talking to somebody and they were almost interviewing me, asking me a bunch of questions around what I enjoyed most about my past experiences and what I didn't like, what motivates me, all of those types of questions, and it was maybe in those last five minutes of the conversation where they said, Hey, you need to get into customer success.
[00:14:34] Julie: And candidly, I didn't know what customer success really was at the time. I. My brain translated to customer service and I, that was something that I had not explored and honestly wasn't overly interested in. And so I looked into it and the more that I learned, the more that I fell in love with it. And that really helped once I was able to narrow the search of, okay, this is it.
[00:14:58] Julie: This is specifically what I'm [00:15:00] looking for. again, it still wasn't easy. My first company that I worked. With in customer success, they, they actually denied me numerous times. And it was through that, that I was really able to show definitely a high level of resilience and creativity. but it was kind of through that, that I feel like I became more and more sure of what I wanted to do and who I wanted to do it with, and it was through that experience that ultimately they were by the timing and the stars lines where I was able to join their team.
[00:15:32] Cesar: What is the, one of the most creative things that you did,to stand out?
[00:15:38] Julie: Oh, my. Okay. So the very first time that I reached out to this company that I wanted to work for, I at first, applied for a non customer success role because it was a, this was prior to that conversation where I had found customer success.
[00:15:54] Julie: So first step was I applied to a sales role. And [00:16:00] immediately, I mean, within probably a day got the dreaded rejection email. And so I was frustrated because at this point I had, I kind of had this company on a pedestal because I had talked to a couple of people through networking and everybody that I talked, I kept hearing this name pop up.
[00:16:16] Julie: And so I knew that it was a really interesting and innovative company that I wanted to work for, and I just wanted to get. I wanted to get my foot in the door in some way or another. And so again, I felt I guess to backpedal. So I got the rejection and I got back on LinkedIn, started kind of scouring and figuring out, do I have any connections?
[00:16:39] Julie: Is there anybody that I know? I didn't. So I ran across an email, a, article that the CEO had written, and it was about mindset coaching and something that they do at their company. And it really intrigued me. And so I reached out to the CEO and referenced the article was talking through kind of my own [00:17:00] experiences, different things, and mentioned to him and let him know that, hey, I recently applied and, there wasn't a cover let there wasn't an ability to attach a cover letter.
[00:17:09] Julie: So I ignored the fact that I was rejected. I just said, Hey, I recently applied. I'd like to share a cover letter. Who should I share this with? And so he gave me the email of somebody I sent the cover letter. And that was kind of what started that. That was, I guess, step one of the creativity of at least getting me to an interview.
[00:17:27] Julie: And then once I started talking to them, they were very kind, but they were. Very open with me that they were, it was a newly forming customer success team. So they were very young and they really needed somebody that had the experience of building out a customer success team and department.
[00:17:45] Julie: And that wasn't me. I had no experience. And so they let me know that the timing wasn't right and everything. And I think through that. That's where I'd say the next level of creativity started coming in where I just was absolutely relentless. So [00:18:00] if they said no to me, I would immediately follow up with different questions of what can I do differently or what type of experience do I need?
[00:18:08] Julie: And what I found was that they truly, they needed somebody that had a specific experience because they were earlier stage. And so instead of just saying, okay, Goodbye. I'll maybe we'll cross paths someday in the future. I remember responding to them in a way that said, Hey. You are my dream company. I am, I'm not going to go away.
[00:18:31] Julie: I'm going to keep coming back. And so I said, you know, I'm happy to go to a different company and get the experience that I need so that I can ultimately come back here. Or are there any other roles within your company that I could potentially get my foot in the door, start getting experience and learning the product and the industry and learning about your customers with pivoting into customer success.
[00:18:53] Julie: And so that was something that. I just kind of kept giving them different options of, Hey, would you consider this or different [00:19:00] things? And just letting them know that, again, I'm not going anywhere. I'm going to, I'm going to keep coming back. And then ultimately I did get a job at another company and this is not a story that I'm particularly proud of, but it was the right thing to do ultimately for my career.
[00:19:16] Julie: but I got a job at another company and. It wasn't in a customer success role. It was kind of got my foot in the door with a sales team and. When I got that job, I immediately reached out to the company that I was kind of that pedestal, company that I wanted to work for. And I reached back out to them and said, Hey, you're going to see on LinkedIn that I got a new job.
[00:19:38] Julie: I'm, I've accepted this. I'm going to this team. And I said, I just want to remind you that this doesn't let you off the hook. I'm doing this so that I can ultimately come. Come to your team and just kind of sent that one last, one last try. And about a month later that I, after I was into this new company, the, one of the co founders reached out to me of the other company and [00:20:00] said, Hey, you're going to kill me.
[00:20:01] Julie: I know this is terrible timing, but we're ready for you now is, are you interested in talking to us? And I was just so embarrassed to go to this new team and explain to them. And, but I was honest with them and let them know that. Ultimately, it wasn't the right fit and it's better for us to part ways sooner than later.
[00:20:20] Julie: Obviously, the longer time just would only make it harder. so again, that was what eventually led me into this role and I started as an individual contributor and then was able to work my way up and improve myself over time. I love that.
[00:20:34] Cesar: where does your drive and relentlessness come from?
[00:20:38] Cesar: Because, you know, it takes a very driven and relentless individual to go through rejection after rejection, after challenge, after hurdle. Especially in this, current 2023 economy. And where does that come
[00:20:55] Julie: from? It's a good question. and I don't know if I know the answer to that, honestly.
[00:20:59] Julie: I [00:21:00] think some of it is who I am, innately. I think some of that has been built. Over years of experiences and possibly even just how I was raised, I think I was raised in a family that, that really encouraged, participation and excellence and really giving it my all throughout kind of childhood and through high school and sports and different things like that.
[00:21:23] Julie: So I do think that some of those experiences really shaped me.
[00:21:27] Cesar: One, one of the, other most common challenges when someone wants to pivot into a new career, into a new industry, Is imposter syndrome, right?
[00:21:38] Cesar: It's like the feeling of men. I'm not good enough, you know, and I wanted to ask you, you know, what are your thoughts on imposter syndrome? And if you had someone, you know, someone in the audience that might be looking to pivot, whether to take or another industry on a career, and they're experiencing that imposter syndrome, you know, what advice would [00:22:00] you have for them?
[00:22:01] Julie: I think imposter syndrome, I mean, it's very real. It's something that I think most people can say at some point of their journey they've felt. I have felt it numerous times. And
[00:22:11] Julie: for me, what I have, I guess, found, especially as I've Grown in my career and grown as a leader is that this is gonna sound a little bit weird, but we're all somewhat imposters nobody knows exactly what they're doing or has all the answers and I think when I started to realize that like that was the reality and that's okay That's when I stopped feeling imposter syndrome Because earlier in my career, or earlier in my journey, especially being a newer leader, I really felt like I had to have all the answers, and I felt like an imposter because I didn't have them.
[00:22:50] Julie: Now I know I don't have the answers, and I recognize that's part of being human. That's part of being a leader, is going into [00:23:00] these unknown territories. And figuring it out and the first thing you try may not work, but you have to learn from it and you have to be agile and be open to feedback and moving fast in order to continue to learn and grow from these experiences.
[00:23:14] Julie: But I think that's where. Something that could have felt like a weakness at one point could have felt like, okay, I don't have all the answers. this makes me less than I think being able to understand that it doesn't make you less than, and it's more so how you deal with that. Do you, you know, early in my career, if I didn't know the answer, I would go straight to Google.
[00:23:34] Julie: I still go to Google often, but I would try to shoulder it all on my own. I'd try, I would, I never wanted to anybody to see me sweat. And so it was like, okay, let me figure this out on my own. And then I'll just do it on my own. And that's completely opposite from what I do now. Now, if I don't know the answer, I'm loud about it.
[00:23:51] Julie: I am talking to people and really leaning into the customer success community. And I've met so many people in that way [00:24:00] where I'm reaching out to them and saying, Hey, I'm trying to solve this, or my team is struggling with this. How do you handle that? Or just reaching out to people that I respect and getting their opinion and learning from other people's experiences is how I've been able to flip imposter syndrome into something that, that I really think is.
[00:24:17] Julie: A strength of mine, which is leaning on my community and leaning on outside resources and creative thinking so that I don't have to figure it out all on my own. I
[00:24:26] Cesar: love that when you make the transition. From being an enabling contributor to a leadership position, what was there any trade off that you had to make when it came to how you approach the.
[00:24:44] Cesar: The work.
[00:24:45] Julie: yes, I think so. I think that. When you are an individual contributor. You are spending a certain amount of time doing, I guess, being proactive or doing things that you want to do things that [00:25:00] get you excited, but you're spending a lot of time doing things that other people are telling you, you need to do.
[00:25:06] Julie: And I think that was probably one of the harder transitions for me was. Putting the time in of really understanding what the current processes were and why and living through them before I started providing my feedback, because I was somebody who I wanted to just quickly say, Hey, how do you guys consider this?
[00:25:25] Julie: What about this? Can I try this? And, first of all, that's just a little bit annoying when somebody comes in immediately trying to change everything, right? It's also not fair. And it wasn't, it wouldn't be fair to me or to our customers for me to just immediately try to blow things up. And I needed that time of living in the role and being in the role in order to understand how the team worked, how our different interactions and the cross functional interactions were with our customers.
[00:25:53] Julie: And so I think that was a struggle for me. And I think again that imposter syndrome of just not knowing all the answers [00:26:00] and I came from a space where I felt like I kind of knew all the answers and where I felt like I, I had a pretty good sense of what to do and why and how to do it. And. I mean, I even years into customer success still, I think that's hard to go into constantly new territories where there's no playbook for this.
[00:26:21] Julie: And even if there was, it's probably not going to work because every company and every team and industry is different. So it truly, what works for one person may not work for me or may not work for my team. And so I think that's been definitely a learning lesson and being able to be okay, I guess with that feeling.
[00:26:42] Cesar: Yeah, absolutely. One, one thing I just remember, and I want to make sure we, we covered this because that stood out to me when I was, doing a bit of research on your profile, the way I understand it, right? Your first year in tech, that first job, you took a pay cut,to join the company [00:27:00] because whatever, your lack of experience in tech, but what you did differently is that you created this, I guess you would call it a growth plan.
[00:27:08] Cesar: And that is unheard of, right? I don't think I know a lot of people that would be so proactive in, hey, okay, I know I'll take a pay cut, but here's my plan on how to get to the next level. And Yeah, what did that come from? And what was your approach to pitch it? And yeah, I'm very curious about that.
[00:27:33] Julie: yeah, I love that. So this is actually something I've done throughout my career a few times is when not necessarily. Even when I'm taking a step back or a pay cut or something, but just as I'm going into a new opportunity, I know myself, I have big dreams. I have very big ambitions of what I want of the impact that I want to have at any company and just in general, in my career.
[00:27:56] Julie: And with that, I like to. Look a [00:28:00] step ahead or multiple steps ahead of, Hey, here's where I'm going to start, but here's where I want to go, or here's where I believe I can go. And I think that is something that starts and is part of the interview process. But as I definitely in the negotiating or as I'm accepting a job, there are times where.
[00:28:20] Julie: in the instance that you referenced where I was taking a pay cut and I was going from being a executive to now being an individual contributor and a new industry and a new world and. I really didn't have any, I guess, negotiating power because I hadn't proven myself a day. This is completely new to me and I recognize that, but at the same time I knew my worth and I knew the value that I would be able to provide them ultimately.
[00:28:48] Julie: And not to say that it was going to be necessarily day one, but I knew that ultimately I would be able to have a larger impact. And so that was a conversation that, that I had that I guess. In lieu of [00:29:00] traditional negotiating, really to have a conversation around my growth trajectory and plans, as well as, you know, how do I get there and one of the best ways that you can get there is not only by being loud and noisy and saying, Hey, here's what I want, where I want to go and having that conversation up front, but it's also by getting feedback.
[00:29:22] Julie: And I knew that. I wouldn't be able to get to where I wanted if I wasn't getting the feedback that I needed from my leadership. And so that was something that we came up with a plan of how, you know, I just had questions and talk to them about, you know, how often, what is your typical review cycle with.
[00:29:43] Julie: Employees. And so it was more of an annual cycle. And so it was like, okay, what can, how can we create our own so that I have ability and access to, to get a more formal review and be able to get that type of feedback more [00:30:00] often so that if I'm doing something that's not getting me on the right path.
[00:30:03] Julie: I want to know that immediately. I would like, let me keep, let me at least move in the right direction. And so I think that was a really important part of it was just having a conversation around not just where I wanted to go, but also how I would get there and being able to receive feedback. And it's something that I'd say most leaders would respond to that saying.
[00:30:23] Julie: You know, we'll have weekly one on ones or biweekly or whatever it is. And, you know, feedback is important to us. So you will, you'll receive feedback in the moment real time. But what I have found in reality is that not all leaders are great at providing feedback and they're not. It's not to their fault.
[00:30:41] Julie: Maybe they've, maybe they've never been trained on it. Maybe they've never been coached on how to provide feedback or how to professionally develop teams. And so that was something that I really wanted to take into my own hands of having not just a more formal. review cycle, but also creating that, that plan for [00:31:00] myself of kind of the 30, 60, 90, Hey, here's what I'm going to do.
[00:31:03] Julie: Here's what I'm going to accomplish. And being able to show them, Hey, I'm doing it. Or, Hey, here's where I'm, here's where I've started to pivot. You know, I originally said I was going to spend a lot of time here and I really found that I'm needed here. And being able to check in with my leadership to say, is that okay?
[00:31:20] Julie: how do you feel about this? Is, am I prioritizing appropriately? And I think just being able to make sure that where I was spending my time and energy was in a way that was benefiting the larger customer base, as well as the larger company and team. Is what helped lead to that fast growth because it wasn't just, Hey, how can I be the best at my job, but it was more so because if anything, that may have kept me in the individual contributor world a little bit longer because they're like, Wow, you're really good at this.
[00:31:49] Julie: Keep going. And, you know, we'll keep giving you promotions and raises in that world. But, I really wanted to show them that I could have an impact that would. Be more strategic, [00:32:00] more transformational to the customer base and to the company
[00:32:04] Cesar: is very important, right? And you're right. You know, most of us are not taught how to give it and how to receive it as well.
[00:32:12] Cesar: how do you define feedback in any advice on how to take or how to give it back? that is effective.
[00:32:22] Julie: Yeah, absolutely. So I think there is with anything, there's coaching to be had on it. And that's something that I am very grateful that I was with companies that did invest in teaching leaders and teaching teams how to both give and receive feedback, because it's not something that is, this isn't a conversation just for the leaders that are listening.
[00:32:47] Julie: This is a conversation for everybody. truly. As even a peer to peer, being able to give feedback, being able to receive feedback is. really important. And that's what sets apart people that [00:33:00] are good versus people that are exceptional, being able to be coachable and being able to lean into that feedback.
[00:33:06] Julie: And so I learned there were a couple different methodologies that I guess over the years I've learned. I think. The biggest part of it, it doesn't necessarily matter which methodology you're following. It's more so that you're having a conversation with your team about giving and receiving feedback and building out that culture from the beginning and helping them understand that this is coming out of a place of good.
[00:33:29] Julie: This is truly coming out of a place of care of, hey, I care about you so deeply that I want you to be your best. Because I care, I'm going to push you, I'm going to give you feedback, and I'm going to, continue to help you improve and coach you, and we may have some uncomfortable conversations or uncomfortable kind of mock calls or things like that, but it's, I would rather have those uncomfortable call or conversations one on one than [00:34:00] with a customer or something where you're going down a path and continuing to do something in a That isn't helping you be your best.
[00:34:08] Julie: So I think that's a lot of it is just kind of having the conversations with your team and understanding the why behind the feedback of, you know, this isn't just something that we do because we're checking a box, but we're doing it because it comes out of a place of care and because we want to help our people be their best.
[00:34:26] Julie: Love
[00:34:26] Cesar: that. Julie, what are some of the trends in tech and customer says That you're paying attention to that, that you're tracking and, or perhaps write something that most people are overlooking that maybe they should be paying attention to.
[00:34:44] Julie: So I have spent a lot of time and energy definitely in the last many months on the topic of scaling and digital CS and.
[00:34:54] Julie: It's something that I think I took for granted at my last company because we truly built with scaling in [00:35:00] mind from the beginning. And so even as a smaller team, we were pretty quickly building out our processes and templates and our ops teams and in a way that helped support future scaling, as well as our education to our customers and both internally and externally and our community.
[00:35:22] Julie: And at my current company, we. We have a world class team, we are absolutely exceptional at what we do, but so much of it is dependent on one to one interactions. And so that's where I have just become obsessed with the topic of how do we scale this? How do we not just say, Hey, how can we digitize this?
[00:35:46] Julie: How can we pull back humans? But, Hey, how can we actually really put the focus on. Improving the customer experience by helping bring them together. How can we bring our customers together in a meaningful way [00:36:00] that not only alleviates our team because it's less one to one meetings and more of bringing customers together, but actually is beneficial to our customers because they're interacting with each other.
[00:36:11] Julie: They're learning from each other and able to kind of grow that community in that way. And. As I look at the digital side of things, this isn't a, I'm not looking at this from like our. Lowest ARR customers or pay what customers don't need a person. And it's really, what are the things that we're doing today and how can we build out the resources and how can we anticipate these triggers or these moments that could happen or what could go wrong and how could we actually prevent them from going wrong in the first place?
[00:36:45] Julie: how could we stop the cycle by really creating resources and content and in digital motions to get in front of the. The things that we know are going to happen. And so I think that's been, it's been a [00:37:00] really exciting challenge for me because I am still managing my team and kind of working with them in that way.
[00:37:07] Julie: But also almost refer to these sometimes as my beta test is where like my team, we're constantly trying new things and really getting creative and getting thinking outside the box of what the current process is or how we're currently doing things. And starting to peel back of, hey, how can we do that?
[00:37:26] Julie: How can we scale this? How can we do this in a different way that better serves our customers and also allows for our team to be more effective? but maybe not necessarily fewer resources, but just different resources. Yeah,
[00:37:42] Cesar: that's how you stay on top of the game, right? Especially with everything that's happening with AI and all the advances in technology, right?
[00:37:49] Cesar: How can you leverage that to better serve the customers? and I'm a big fan of, Jay and Nathan and what they're doing with the gain, grow, retain [00:38:00] community. You know, there are big. proponent of, digitizing, you know, customer success. and, yeah, you know, that's, I think that's where it's headed, right?
[00:38:10] Cesar: If you want to get a... Advantage in the industry.
[00:38:14] Julie: Yeah. It's really interesting to me because I would say if you asked me a few years ago, I would've thought that digital CSS was,I mean the way that it was, I guess being done or the, where the focus was, like if you gave me a choice of, okay, Julie, you can either lead.
[00:38:33] Julie: Enterprise level teams, or you could build out digital CS and different scaling motions. I would be like, Oh my gosh, I want enterprise. that is that to me felt like the more specialized, that thing, just because it was like, okay, I want to be working with our highest air, our customers. And I want to be able to.
[00:38:53] Julie: Really impact them in this way, and I think the whole definition of digital CS and scaling has really [00:39:00] evolved in these past years as well as people's perception of what it is and the level of not hierarchy, but I would have thought before. I've had people before think, Oh, you know, you want to build this out.
[00:39:14] Julie: Sure. We can get you some associate CSMs or junior people to kind of help create this type of stuff. And now it's no, if I want to build this out, I need the best of the best on our team. I want the SMEs, the product managers, the senior CSMs on these projects, because this content, these.
[00:39:34] Julie: These motions and programs that we're building out, these are going to impact all of our customers and they are going to have such a transformational impact and it's really implode amplifying, I guess, the voice of these really strong, solid individuals. And so I think that's just been an interesting thing is seeing people, especially on the individual.
[00:39:54] Julie: Like contributor side that previously kind of shunned the idea of digital [00:40:00] CS or of being on kind of these emerging teams as being something that was like, Oh, okay, I'll start here, but I'm going to work my way up to enterprise someday as kind of being the longer term goal. And I'm seeing that flip a little bit of people really understanding that there's a specialization and a really.
[00:40:18] Julie: Creative side to scaling motions and being able to be a part of building that out is something that is it is hard and it is exciting and it's really fun and people are more and more people are wanting to be a part of that.
[00:40:31] Cesar: Yeah, it's exciting. Julia, this has been, I'm so inspired by your journey.
[00:40:35] Cesar: You know, just, how driven and relentless you are and how giving you are as a leader. And I'm excited to see, where you go and how you grow. and I would love to wrap up the episode with what I call A rapid fire around where basically ask you a question. and you give me your top of mind 30 second answer.
[00:40:55] Cesar: okay. Awesome. Well, first question I have here. is there a book that comes to [00:41:00] mind that has had a particular impact in your life or in your career?
[00:41:05] Julie: yes, I will. I'll give you a few. I know this is not rapid fire and not what I should be doing, but switch. which is about kind of change management, amp it up and five dysfunctions of the team.
[00:41:17] Cesar: Those are great books. I read two of the three dimensions. so happy. Awesome. Next question. in the last, I would say six months to a year, is there a particular Investment that, that you've made, whether it's a relationship, a physical thing that you bought that totally enhanced your productivity.
[00:41:39] Cesar: yeah. any investments that you've made recently that have made a difference?
[00:41:43] Julie: Okay. one of my favorite purchases, which is a service, not necessarily a purchase, but I have had organizers, professional organizers come to my house and they helped us with our move as we moved into a new home.
[00:41:56] Julie: But then they keep coming back because, My kids and I keep [00:42:00] messing everything up. And so they keep coming and fixing everything that we mess up. But that has been really incredible to kind of shift the mindset from what more do we want to buy? And instead say, you know what, I'm content. I'm happy with what I have, but I just want it to be organized.
[00:42:14] Julie: I just want it to be, Accessible in a way that we can use it better. Yeah.
[00:42:19] Cesar: Yeah. I love that. You know, as a parent of two girls, you know, keeping things organized. It's a challenge, right? But it really is when things are organized. It's crazy that I don't know about you, but I can think more clearly, you know, like you feel like there's room for more, right?
[00:42:36] Julie: Yeah, absolutely.
[00:42:38] Cesar: Awesome. next question here. any habits that you are working on or developing,in the recent year?
[00:42:47] Julie: Yeah, so I, I started my new job, actually last Halloween, and that for me was a real reset in owning my calendar and my time. And I owe some of this [00:43:00] to just really good leadership that, that allows me to have kind of the flexibility and autonomy, but also to the fact that I live in an Eastern time zone and my company is mostly in California.
[00:43:10] Julie: So that has allowed me to get back into a practice of working out every day and really prioritizing that, that morning family time working out. And then by the time I'm. Sitting down. I'm still sitting down hours before I guess most of my colleagues. but I think that's really allowed me to just having that time where I'm starting off my day really focused on my family and focused on my own health and wellness has been really healthy for me.
[00:43:39] Cesar: I love that. It's important to make time for self care so that you can serve others. And last question here, Julie,any last words or takeaways that you have for people in the audience that, you know, come from underrepresented backgrounds, and they might be looking to pivot into tech or maybe grow into [00:44:00] their careers in tech?
[00:44:02] Julie: Yeah, absolutely. I love that question because I think it truly takes a village and we're all in this together. And so my biggest piece of advice is. To not be afraid to reach out to people and ask for help. that was one of the biggest ways that, that I got my foot in the door in tech and found my way to customer success was asking complete strangers to go to coffee with me or to give me advice or.
[00:44:27] Julie: Asking them to make recommendations or, introductions for me. And so that's something that I spend a decent amount of my time. My out of work time is mentoring and coaching and working with different individuals. And so just recognizing that we're all humans. I think it's easy to look at somebody on LinkedIn and think, Oh my gosh, so you mentioned Jane Aithen earlier, and he's somebody that I had on this pedestal as.
[00:44:50] Julie: not not a real human. And then I got to know him as a person. And I mean, I've had times where I reached out to him and said, Hey, I'm building out this business case for how we scale, can I pick your [00:45:00] brain on this? And he immediately was like, here's my calendar link. let's chat through this.
[00:45:04] Julie: And I think just not being afraid to ask people for help and support as you're kind of going through whatever stage of your journey you're in.
[00:45:11] Cesar: That's an amazing advice, Julie. thanks so much for joining and sharing your story. I appreciate you. And, yeah, looking forward to doing another episode and catching up down the road.
[00:45:21] Julie: Absolutely. Thank you so much.
[00:45:23] Cesar: all right. I hope you enjoyed this episode and thank you so much for listening all the way through. I appreciate you. And I hope that you get some valuable information that you can apply to our personal and professional life. If this story resonated with you and you would like to support the podcast.
[00:45:46] Cesar: Please make sure to subscribe. So you don't miss out on any future episodes. Thank you so much for the opportunity. I appreciate you. And I look forward to serving you in the next episode.