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You’re tired.
Not just physically; though yeah, that too.
You’re tired in your bones. In your soul.
Trying to be a steady husband, an intentional dad, a man of God… but deep down, you feel like you’re falling short. Like you’re carrying more than you know how to hold.
Dad Tired is a podcast for men who are ready to stop pretending and start healing.
Not with self-help tips or religious platitudes, but by anchoring their lives in something (and Someone) stronger.
Hosted by Jerrad Lopes, a husband, dad of four, and fellow struggler, this show is a weekly invitation to find rest for your soul, clarity for your calling, and the courage to lead your family well.
Through honest stories, biblical truth, and deep conversations you’ll be reminded:
You’re not alone. You’re not too far gone. And the man you want to be is only found in Jesus.
This isn’t about trying harder.
It’s about coming home.
Hey guys. Welcome back to another episode of the Dad's Hired podcast. I'm glad that you're here. Before we jump into today's episode, I wanna thank my friends over at Classical Conversations for sponsoring today's episode.
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Chris, super excited to be hanging out with you today, man. For our audience, maybe just tell us who you are, what you're up to these days, a little bit about your family.
Good to see you, Jared, Chris Witt. I've been doing camp ministry for three decades now, 26 summers as full-time, and then nine years on a board of the same camp. I left outta Texas. I was working a place called Sky Ranch. Uh, we had camps in Texas and Oklahoma and Colorado, and. Day camps. And I just love, I love the ministry.
I, a mentor of mine says it's the most effective means of sharing the gospel and a life of faith with the most receptive hearts. And so it's typically for younger kids, there's nothing more potent than camp. It's a powerful tool. I thought I had left it, I was working in the church as executive pastor and got a call from WinShape and I, you know, I'd eaten those donuts.
Camp was awesome. Uh, but man, I. Sometimes it's a young man's game and I just thought I, I was done with it. But Winche was this unique combination of our collection of expertise that seemed special and that God could do something unique here. And so my wife and I, we are boys, are both grown, married, I'm a grandfather now, have my first grandson, Declan, and uh, my son starts as a pastor.
I'm at a church in Mississippi this week, as a matter of fact. And so. Our kids are grown empty nests. We've done that thing. We felt like we had one more adventure in us to come move to Georgia. So we left Texas after 50 some odd years, dude, and moved to North Georgia and you would think it's south is the south, but it ain't.
Texas is its own thing, but we love it. We love it here. So that's me,
Texas. Yeah, it Texas. It's like you moved to a different country if you've been that that long in Texas. Yeah. You guys in Texas start to convince yourself you're like your own country. Hey. I mean, I know there's all kinds of like.
I acknowledge it, stuff behind that.
I acknowledge it. And, and to make matters worse, I'm an Aggie. So talk about two groups of people who can convince themselves. Uh, we are a unique breed of human. There you go.
Yeah, man. The Texas breed is, uh, it's fun. I love Texas. Yeah, dude. So first I want to hear about like the camp stuff and what you've seen God do in that way and how dads can get involved in all that stuff.
But I'm, I'm just curious. You're just like one step ahead of a lot of guys who are listening to this podcast right now. Like you, you've sent the kids off, you have a, you have adult children, you have a grandchild now, which I'm so looking forward to those days. Like that's the prize. It's awesome. I'm looking forward to,
so
great.
I actually, I was just talking to my wife about this the other day. We've heard it said a lot, and actually her mom tells us this a lot, but like, the love for a grandchild is so unique and so different than what you experienced, like. Right now it feels unimaginable, like how you could love your grandchild in such a special and unique way that's kind of beyond or different than you love your kid.
Like, I don't know. Can you put some flesh on that or speak to that at all?
Yeah. You know, a, it's awesome because you can stir the pot and then walk away and let them deal with the, that's
awesome. Yeah, yeah,
yeah. I don't know if it has something to do with, you're seeing the generations, you know, where you're becoming your father.
You're seeing a generational expression of your life and Yeah.
Yeah.
I don't know if it's that, I don't know. I don't know if it's the, maybe some of the burden is removed from you a little bit. The stress of, and you've seen your kids go, I like to say, I've answered all the questions whether they were the right or wrong answers.
I've answered all the questions you are asking as a father right now. Mm. And I've seen it play out and it is what it is. Mm. So maybe some of the stress and it's just you're able to. Purely appreciate the child for who the child is and who the, and actually who the child's going to be. So I think, I think maybe that's an interesting thing.
I've never thought about that way. I would say it is very different though. The love is, um, I don't know. When I first heard my boy's heartbeat for the first time, I always thought, you know, I'm, I love superheroes. My dad was a football coach. I'm, I'm like, let's, let's go charge the mountain. And I always thought I'd be the kind of guy that would die for someone.
I always wanted to hope that I would be that guy. Like when I heard my child's heartbeat, Caleb's heartbeat the first time, I was like, I know, I know I will die for that. Like I, I don't think you can surpass that kind of love. Right. Greater love has no one than they, and I'm like, I would lay my down my life for that.
But there is something also wonderful about seeing your children, your son. Become a dad. Mm-hmm. And my boy told me, 'cause they got pregnant their last semester of seminary. That was not the plan.
Yeah, I'm sure. Yeah.
And he was stressed about it, but he told me, uh, it's, he declan's a year old now. And he said, dad, I just, I never believed I could love someone like this.
And I, I wouldn't trade any of this for the world. This is the greatest. And it's, so maybe that's part of it is. Seeing the generational thing, seeing your son take over, having some of the stress removed and of worrying going, you know, the kid's gonna be okay.
Yeah.
But as a parent right now, you're worried a lot about how your child's still gonna turn out.
You're telling me dude, every day. Every day thinking about that. There's gotta be, yeah, I think you're right. There's gotta be a lot of layers to it. A lot of, you know, there multiple things happening in your heart as you see that. I think the generational piece. For me, it feels like that's gonna be a big one.
You know? 'cause I'm thinking so much about my grandkids, my great grandkids. Like when I'm trying to pour in to my kids right now, I'm hoping that I'm gonna see some fruit of that in my, my grandkids and great grandkids and beyond. And so I think just seeing, like just actually seeing it, you know, like a little human that you've been thinking about and praying for for decades
mm-hmm.
Is like, there's gotta be a. Ton of power behind that. Yeah. What did you do as you're reflecting back, you're watching your son be a dad now reflecting back, what do you look back on your own journey as a dad and think, man, I'm glad I did that. Or is there anything's like, I wish I would've done that.
Yeah, it's not anything new.
I think it's timeless. It's built into culture and the DNA of every culture and in the DNA of growing up, it's benchmarks. Milestones, those moments that we took, I had manca at the end of every summer with my boys. Mm-hmm. And we went away and, and we had time together. And again, it, it was at leisure time, making it intentional, making it centered around things they love, but asking life questions.
And so they, there was this rhythm of, of conversations that would happen at these specific moments throughout the year where I would introduce 'em into other men that I admired and I would introduce them into. Mm-hmm. Not just go somewhere and do something fun, but hey, here's a group of people doing something intentional.
Let's learn from them and let's have a conversation about who you're becoming, the Robert Lewis stuff from raising a modern day night. Mm-hmm. You know, this idea of mile markers along the way and giving my boys measurement moments every year to say, Hey, I see the man you're becoming. You are on your path to becoming a man, but here's the things for you to continue to work on, and creating that vocabulary.
I see it playing out with him now as he's making plans for Declan. My boys. I did a lot of things wrong, but my boys always knew where they stood with me. They always received an apology from me. They always knew I wasn't perfect. They always see, saw me wrestling with my own flesh. They always knew where they stood and where they were headed, and we had common vocabulary.
Several things that I just said over and over and over and over again have played out, especially when they got into college and became really started facing the harder moments of life. So. One of the things I always said over and over again was, Hey, you have proven in your life that you can solve a problem because we worked on it as a kid and I saw you do it, and I point back to moments.
So you have everything it takes to solve this problem. You just have to keep moving forward. Take the next step. If you'll trust your best instincts, the ones God's given you, and reject the ones you know, get you in trouble and just take a next step forward. There's always a way. There's always a path, man, I've said that a million times to my boys and it's walked us through a lot, but of challenges in their life.
But I'm gonna tell you that started when they were little, having that, those very same words.
Does that make sense? Makes a lot of sense, man. I actually, so we use the word problem solve, or the words problem solve multiple times a day and, and right now it's like my 2-year-old says it, so she just literally yesterday spilled her cup of milk on the floor, dropped off the counter, and her first reaction was problem solve.
And she just ran over and grabbed the towel. But yeah, trying to set up that same stuff like. Eventually you're going to be 20 something and the problems are gonna be bigger than spilled milk. Nothing.
Hey, can I
But yeah. And can I tell
you too, uh, 'cause you got me thinking. So writing letters, like texting, as much as I hate phones, I love texting.
I will consistently my boys, I look at what Paul did for Timothy and what, and it letter writing was a ministry and texting is our modern version of that. And I send my boys. Periodic texts. I always end 'em with keep moving forward, you know, love and admire you. Mm. But just as I have thoughts, I send them to them and we have this stream going.
And in fact, just the other day I was coming back from a camp in Costa Rica, one of the. Community camps we do there and I'm flying in one of those little, I hate 'em, those puddle jumpers. And I mean, we took off Outta the jungle and I'm just the, the, yeah, yeah. And I'm had reading a book and I took a picture of a page about patience and I know both my boys, you know, we could wrestle with that.
And I was just writing them this. And I've done this a million times, but as the plane was going, I felt like I suddenly had epiphany. This feels like the last text I'm ever going to send them, but I got excited because I was like, I know they've got a million of these, and they've expressed back to me that those come at good times and are meaningful to them.
And so again, I think just consistently, consistently communicating, pushing, thought and insight towards your boys, even when you think they're not listening towards your kids. I know that working with kids my whole life ignore their face. You may think they're not listening man, but they are paying attention.
They're listening and just keep pushing communication at 'em. Keep pushing thoughts and ideas in loving ways and encouraging them throughout. And I think texting has been one of those powerful, Paul, like Paul Timothy. Things that I've, that I've done with my boys that they have expressed to me has, has been a lot.
So
that's really good, man. That's actually really encouraging. 'cause just this week I was having what felt like a lecture moment with my. I'm like talking quieter. 'cause I know my door's open. Yeah. And he's right. But I had kind of a lecture moment with my 12-year-old son. His face, I'm just like, dude, are you listening to a word I'm saying?
You know, just not listening to a thing. But the next day he was implementing Yeah. Some of the things that we talked about. Yeah. And I could tell he was making personal decisions and choices to do the things that we had talked about. And so I was like. Just hearing what you said, like ignore the face. I think that's it.
Yeah. Maybe we should just title that the, the podcast. Just ignore the face, man. 'cause that's really helpful. Dude, I, I have more questions that are just spinning in my mind real quick. Yeah. What you're talking about with your kids, so much of what you've already described in just a few minutes we've been talking about is like really intentional parenting as a dad.
Even little stuff. It's, it requires intentionality to do that. Was that, did your dad or did somebody teach you that? Or was it a reaction to what you didn't have? Or combination? I said, wow,
man, I see why you do this. Those are great questions. Great questions. My mom and dad grew up extreme poverty. My dad grew up in a shack that his dad literally built out of RC Cola bottling crates.
Geez. Wow. Um, one room they all lived in, he slept in a lean tube behind it, extreme poverty. He was a big guy, happened to be great at football, and he found out about this thing called a scholarship, and that got him out and he became an educator. And so my parents were, I would say they were raising us in, in like provision mode because they, they were so poor.
They really, they broke that poverty cycle in their family. Even though they were educators, they still. Got out, you know, so to speak. But what, here's what I will say. My dad was a coach though, and the game of football was our life. There was intentionality in him as a coach and how he taught. When he taught us the game and talked about the game, he talked about what the game does in building who you are.
He never talked about, yeah, winning was a thing, but for him it saved his life. And it taught him this and showed him this. So he always saw it as a, an experience that can transform you. He always saw himself as raising men through it. So I definitely saw the intentionality of my dad. And how he coached football to an end that had nothing to do with the final score, if that makes sense.
Yeah. So I definitely saw that in my dad
for sure. You know what's crazy about that? So this, I'm not trying to like drop names here. Actually, I met Ben Roethlisberger outta Winchester Oh yeah, yeah. Last year. And he and I just hit it off and we've become good friends since then and we had a chance to spend some time together recently, and I watched him as a dad and do that guy the way that he coaches.
That's this. His kids. I'm like, I told him, I'm like, dude, you need to come back. He's been on the podcast. But I'm like, you need to come back on the podcast and just talk about that. And I don't wanna like spoil where we're gonna go with that episode. But what you're describing with what your dad did is exactly what I saw Ben do with his kids.
He is in coach mode and they feels really safe in that mode. Like they know the rules, they know the boundaries, they know who dad is and their role. And it just was like, I'd never seen anything like it. It was next level. When you're describing that with your dad, I'm like, that makes sense. And I think if more dads saw themself as a coach for their family, like we would have, we'd have better families.
Well, here's, here's the thing though, I had great mentors too, and one of them said, he said to me early on, everything you do is going to add to or take away from the message you want them to receive. Mm-hmm. Every little thing you do, just live each day. Understanding everything you do is gonna add to your take away from the message you want them to receive.
They're gonna leave home with. And so I had another mentor tied to that who, uh, taught at West Point, and he talked about the concept of know, be, do, right? And so the idea of, they were used to train military, you know, how to know how to be a soldier, to know what words like honor, duty, encouragement to do the things that were required of a soldier.
But at some point they got away from teaching them to be the essence of the things they were teaching them. I mean, they knew how to do it, but they weren't, they knew what courage was. They knew how to do courageous things, but they weren't courageous, if that makes any sense. It was the missing be. So I would add to that, yes, I think we should coach our kids, and that's what I think my dad did, coached me to be someone not to do something the doing.
And I think a lot of dads are trying to have their kids do something. Yeah, I want them to do this thing successfully. And build a home, have a family, make a good living, be a astronaut, whatever it is the thing you want 'em to do, but really you're coaching them, the doing of those things. You're about crafting their essence of who they are.
Yeah. They may be want to be, do something that you never wanted to do with your life, and that's okay. I see Dads forcing their sons to do the thing they wanted to do. Yeah. It's like that's really not your role. Your role is to figure out who God created this one to be and help them to be that. So does that make sense?
Coaching towards
Yeah.
Who they're gonna be, not what they're gonna do. I think
that's so good, man. That's so good. Yeah. We, we try to say a lot in our family, like this is who we are as a family. Yeah. And this is who we are as followers of Jesus. So this is what Jesus followers do. This is what the LOEs family does.
Yeah. That's good. And I think that's trying to get to that be this is who we are, not just what we do, but this is who we are. Can you get into the weeds a little bit on those? What'd you call 'em? Manca? Yeah, man, because we had John Tyson on, he does write a passage stuff. Yeah. And what you described, it sounds like some of that, actually a lot of what you described sounds like a lot of it, but like when did you start that?
How did you plan them? How far in advance, like for dads, they'll, that'll be really helpful. Just to give us some details. How did you actually do these trips and what did they look like?
Well, again, I didn't create any of this. I met Robert Lewis and early on and all that, raising modern day night stuff.
Got into that. I got a group of dads together and we just created something called the Adventure Club, and it's just a group of dads that were trying to raise boys and we planned stuff for them to do.
Even that, like the intentionality to meet other dads. Yeah, and to get together and plan stuff to do.
And you just described that as like, oh, we just got this guy, but that's a big deal. Big deal. Like big deal. Most dudes aren't doing that. Yeah. So you, what'd you get? You found these guys at your church?
Yeah, I was friends. The guy I worked with, he knew a couple of guys. I knew, a couple guys I met at church.
We had boys the same age. I. Similar ages, and we just got to, and I planned them and, and we, you know, boy Scouts is a fantastic, you know, on paper it's just this, it's giving boys mom markers things to do. So we'd like, we're not gonna do scouts, so let's, our local chapters were struggling and we just said, let's just plan stuff.
And so, and let's give them, let's give them a list of things that we think it means to be a man. Let's talk about those each time we get together and let them see us interact with each other. So it was.
Hmm.
Simple things. You know, we did gutter races one time and you know, we planned camp out trips. We did have one.
We did one. What's
a, what's a gutter race?
So you get like a gutter. Uh oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And you seal it up, put water in it. You build little boats and you blow the boats down the Yeah. Yeah. And the boys built it all. And then we did the races. Um,
how often do, sorry man. I'm gonna go in the we once I'm on purpose.
Once a month, you met as, uh, club as the dads, or months month you met with dads and sons or kids,
dads and boys. The, we all met together once a month.
Okay.
And we had milestones, so we told 'em, Hey, here's habits that men who are growing up to become the men they wanna be, are doing in their life. Mm-hmm. And so, reading scripture, serving and looking for opportunities to make other people's lives better, encouraging mom.
And the other women in their life, you know, a list of things like that.
I love that.
And we had little journals we gave them when we got together. We talk about it. What have you done? Have you accomplished? You know, yeah. I, I did this and I, I, you know, I read my bible, I did this bible study, uh, you know, whatever.
I helped mom do the dishes one night, and so they would track it when they did those things. And we had these, this simple stuff, you know, we had leather strands and we had these little cool stone bead things we found. Oh, then you earned a milestone. And they would collect these milestones, and the idea was, you're on your way.
Our mascot was the roadrunner. And that's 'cause I grew up in West Texas and Roadrunners are a feisty little bird man. They can kill a rattlesnake and they're unassuming. And so I'd always say if roadrunners feisty, little bird, tough guy kind of thing. So, and also we're running down the road to becoming a man.
Yeah. So we track that, we talk about it, but then Mo we play and we do that at the end. But then once a year we went on a, a manca. As a group, it was basically a retreat and we'd go fishing and we'd play games at night and we'd cook stuff. Do the stuff that you just play with the boys, make up games, all that.
Yeah, but we had a ceremony, and again, this is Robert Lewis type stuff, you know, I had all the boys stand on one side and all the dads stood on the other side. So we were kind of a circle. But guys, it said, okay, boys, you're on your path, as you know, to, but you're, this is the circle of men. Now, you're not in it yet.
The circle of men is standing here, but you're on your way to becoming a man. You're not there yet, but you're on your path someday. You'll step over into this world to become a man. And, and each dad would share something that was important about being a man. Something he'd learned that year about being a man of failure he'd had, but it's something he'd overcome.
Okay? Now what we wanna do is now every year, speak into your life and tell you how you're doing. And so each dad would've written something up and we would not speak to any physical accomplishments they did like that you or, or even academic, any of that stuff. We'd speak to character. This is what I saw in you.
I saw this in you and I, I saw that you had an e moment of integrity. I saw that you had this tremendous kindness from my oldest son. He's not an athlete at all, like terrible. He's king of the nerds in the best way possible. But man, that guy's a risk manager. Like he sees the hundred ways you're gonna die when he walks in a room and he figures out the 10 ways you're gonna avoid all that.
And he's an organizer. And so I would say, Hey, I saw you this year. I see how your mind works. You care about people and you're cautious and, and the world needs that. Every great organization needs risk management. And like this is superpower you have. And I saw that. I'll get emotional.
Mm.
Ah, don't make me talk about this stuff, Jerry.
Um, sorry, I, I'll cry at Coke.
Co. Emotion don't mean No, dude. I'm getting emotional too, just thinking about it. Yeah.
But yeah, speak that into him and said, so you've made progress this year. I clearly see you're on your way to becoming a man. Stay the course. Here's a few things I want you to think about for this year.
And then we give them a token for the year of some, not a token, but some sort of gift. To commemorate that year. Yeah. And what they'd done and that they were on a path and that was all culminated eventually, uh, in two things. One, I moved and I left those guys. And so we started doing the vacations, just me and my two boys.
Mm. It just, life worked out that way, and they got older and it made sense. So I would go do the same thing with them. But it would be a trip we'd go on just the, the three of us. But I'd always preface it as you're getting older now, Manca, we're gonna start having mans size conversations. Mm. Eventually there's gonna be one where it's just you and me and we're gonna have a big man size conversation.
And so that was the one where we had the talk. Mm-hmm. You know, and, but it was in the context of a bigger thing. So we'd go away for a whole week, you know, I don't know how much in the weeds you want to get into it, but we, I themed it around them. Hmm. And I like my oldest son, he loved, not an athlete, but we loved the Mavericks and we loved Dirk.
And so he loves comic books and superheroes and the mavericks and action figures. And so we, we had our Maverick week and we went away to Dallas and we went to, or we went up to Oklahoma to the Toy and Action Figure Museum. It's a weird little spot, but it's super cool. Came to Dallas, went to these comic bookstores.
We went to a Mavs game the Night, Dirk. For the first time broke whatever scoring record he broke.
Oh, nice.
But as throughout the weekend, I would say, okay, we're gonna stop now. We're gonna eat this, his favorite food, but we're gonna have a man sized conversation. I wanna bring up a topic. And he was ready for it.
And so we, we would listen to stuff as we were driving, we'd talk about it. How old was he? So this was going into middle school, going into junior high. So this would've been, wow. Fifth grade. Wow. Um, and I think that's an important transition moment. Yep. Sixth grade now for a lot. Yeah. Fifth and sixth grade.
Somewhere in there. I did it two different ways for the boys, depending on who they were. But going to junior high is like this next phase for you. Caleb is different.
Yeah.
And the rules are gonna change and the things people care about are gonna change in relation, you know. So there was that one preparing for junior high or middle school, and then the next one was going into high school, similar type thing.
Hey, it's a different world coming now. Let's talk this through. And then going to college, we had another one. So that's kind of how that played out.
Hey guys, hope you're enjoying this episode so far. Just wanna pause for a second and remind you, our goal here at Dad Tired is to help you fall more in love with Jesus and help your family do the same.
We have tons of resources to help you do that, but one of the best that we have is called our Family Leadership Program, and I want to give you an exclusive offer to join that program just for being a podcast listener. If you go to dad tire.com, click the Family Leadership Program. You can learn all about what we do and how we help men lead their family well.
But you can also, when you go to checkout, use the promo code podcast and then I'll actually give you a hundred dollars off. We have no other discounts like that. We'll give you a hundred dollars off the program. You can jump into a cohort and immediately start to apply these things that you're hearing on the podcast today.
Again, go to dat tire.com, click the Family Leadership Program, and then use the promo code podcast to get a hundred dollars off our Family Leadership program. I love you guys. Let's jump back in. As you were reminiscing about the, uh, those moments and you got emotional, like, what nerve did that prick?
Because I'm a grandpa and this is what happens. She, you get all emotional testosterone levels go down and I think, I just thought about Caleb in particular and there's a lot of life that happened after that. Mm-hmm. And lots of cha, very hard moments We went through. Every parent, you're gonna face some crisis, existential crisis with your kids.
Mm-hmm. And I just think about that moment and how those conversations, how we came back to them throughout it and how he made it. Mm-hmm. And my son, he's gonna be a, a student pastor. Tomorrow's his first day with his students. I don't know, I just had a moment there of going, gosh, that kid. Who is so fearful of life has gone on so many adventures and just faced that fear head on.
And he gone to Japan on his own and lived there for a while and he's, he's lived up in the mountains leading kids and he's a cautious, fearful guy. But he's, I just got excited 'cause I'm just thinking about all the risks he's taken and now he's a father now. And I don't know, maybe I just was thinking about culmination,
you know, it feels good, dude.
Yeah, dude, it feels good. I can't imagine, bro. I was getting emotional as you're describing it, because I was thinking, you know, I didn't grow up with a dad. Like what you described, what you're doing with your boys is the furthest thing from what I had growing. I had nobody to do that. And I just think like how, even for guys who had their dads around, who just had totally unintentional dads, just men in the house who were present but not really present.
And they just wander. And you just like, who am I? Yeah. Is it okay? I'm fearful and I have tons of shame. 'cause I'm always, I feel cautious and I see other dudes being brave and I don't feel like I can be brave, you know? And like nobody speaking. And for a man, particularly a dad to say, I see that in you.
And this is who God has made you to be. And God will use this for your good and for his glory. Like to just give such deep confidence into a man. And now you've seen the fruits of that. Dude, it's gotta be really powerful.
You wanna something, you wanna hear something crazy. You know, we hire college students.
That's what camps are all about. And we hire 'em from all around the world. And I remember one time back at Sky Ranch, we had a, a group of men, our college staff, college guys, we had probably 300 of 'em at the time. And we ask them this question, I want you to raise your hand if another man in your life. Has ever looked you in the eye and helped you understand what it means to be a man and told you that you are a man, that he has looked you in the eye and said you've arrived.
You are a man.
Yeah.
Uh, we had out 300, I promise you. Maybe two, maybe three guys raise our hand and say, so you're right. Like, you know, we're just living life with 'em. We're, we're disciplining them, we're correcting them. We're trying to get 'em into the right schools or on the right team. All that stuff.
We're not. We're not coaching them, we're not helping them to be, we're just making sure they do. Yeah. And I had another mentor of mine tell me, discipline should always be for the child, not to the child. Mm. So you're not just, it's not about, it's about growth, not control. So you're not trying to control behavior, you're trying to help them grow as a human.
And part of that is, is helping 'em understand what a man even is and is expected of them and what it's not. 'cause they're gonna get a lot of cartoon character versions of what a man is, and that's all bull.
Right.
It's like, hey, let's talk about the biblical concept of a human first and what you're supposed to be, and let's talk about a man.
The expression is, and then let me show you that I see it in you when it's happening,
man.
So,
well bro, you know, we went on so many tangents. We didn't get to anything that I was planning on talking about, but I really, I think it was where God wanted us to go and yeah, dude, just really, really helpful and encouraging stuff.
I know like you're in the camp world, this has been your professional career life. And a huge part of that is giving men the intentionality to have these kind of moments with their kids. So even though we didn't get to talk about that, like maybe just as we wrap up our time here, tell us some opportunities where guys can find intentional moments like this where they can get their family or their kids away and set up.
Being in an environment where these kind of moments are set up for them to succeed as a intentional dad?
Yeah, I think I'd do that. So let me just say this, I am a believer. Camp is one of the most intentional environments and putting a family in it is transformational. So I'm here win shape. We're here to build families, to strengthen individuals and families.
Do that through marriages. We do that through our in. So that's the parents. We do that through camps. So that's the kids. But family camps bring all that together. We do them. You can go to winshape.org, find out about our family camps, and I'd love to have you be a part of them. We do family weekends. We're doing a cool thing with you coming up Labor Day.
Can it wait to have the dad tired folks here in Georgia and see what God does there? Mm-hmm. I would say I'm, I'm here to say they'll find a family camp. You can go to Disney World and you're gonna be in awe of what man can do and you're gonna complain about how much money you're spending and the kids are just gonna.
Be distracted like squirrels and it's gonna be a great memory and they're gonna love it, man. And you're gonna spend a lot of money on that. Or you can go to a family camp where people are gonna craft a week of intentional moments for you. And quick story. The simple version of that is I think we have become the biggest boon for hammock.
People who sell hammocks in the world because we have something called Eno time. Eno is a form of hammock. And so there's just all these hammocks everywhere and we encourage your fans to just go to the hammock and do nothing. Mm. Tell make up jokes. Tell stories as a kid, listen to music together or just lay in the hammock and and whatever.
And our families, we hear from them all the time. They go home and they're buying these hammocks, and this one dad's like, Hey, I actually realized we had some freestanding hammocks in our garage that we just never use. We went home, I pulled 'em out, they're rusted up. But I got the kids and they were so pumped and we refinished them and painted 'em up.
And we set up a, an eno time in our backyard. And now we just go out there and we shut everything down. We don't have our phones and we just have Eno time. And that's camp. Camp can help you to get in that rhythm and that mode. But more than that, Greg camp is gonna think about the things your child needs to be experiencing in you.
And Robert Lewis always said they need to see your character. They need to hear what's important to you and the values, and we're gonna give you an opportunity to express that. So one of the things we give you is a, a key chain with these questions that you can carry around and recognize those moments like, you know, time where you can pull that out and say, let's have a good conversation here.
But there're also therapeutics, so there's parents out there, families that are really struggling and we had a family this summer that, I won't go into the details of it 'cause I wanna respect the privacy of the family, but they're okay with sharing in general that. Yeah, they have had it, let's just say it, the worst kind of tragedy you can have in a family.
They just experienced it, got to camp. They were grieving, they were hurting. You just tell when they got there, they're just, they just weighed down. Hmm. By the end of camp, father came up to our, our camp manager, uh, Mike McGuire and said, Hey, I just want you to know something. We laughed together again for the first, my children had lost the ability.
To smile and hold, but just being here and when you guys came out with on Pizza Night with those stupid mustaches on everybody and singing that dumb song and, and just, you know, time and, and blobbing at the lake when, you know, I looked like an idiot falling into the water. We just all laughed again and it has just changed the demeanor of our home again and brought some light back into it.
So, geez. I'm telling you, go to theme parks, go to sporting events and all those things. You're not gonna get that kind of experience that you can get somewhere across the country. There's wonderful family camps. We have one. We'd love to have you, but find one. Go to it. There is no better way to own your leisure time for the betterment of your family than going to a family camp.
How's that for a commercial
family camp, man? So good, bro. Yeah, I obviously, you, you said it and you've worked with other camps. There's a lot of great camps out there. I'm a huge fan of Win Shape. I mean, just every time I've been having the opportunity to go maybe once or twice a year for the last several years for different events and um, just incredibly impressed.
With the way you guys do things. So yeah, like Chris said, find a camp, but if you can go to a win shape wine, come on. They're so good, so, so, so good. We'd love to have you.
Yeah. Alright brother. Well I appreciate you so much, man. And uh, again, I know we, we took, like, I I started asking you about fatherhood. I love it stuff.
We went in a different direction, but, uh, love it. I trust that it's what God wanted, so thank you, bro. So good. All right, thanks, Jared.
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