Dream Home to Construction Nightmare Part 2

In Part 2, Chicks in Construction hosts Mikki Paradis and Jessica Abreu continue examining the ongoing dispute involving Minnesota attorney and content creator Dylan White, known as The Dad Chats, his wife Suzanne, and the builder of their custom home.

According to allegations discussed in the lawsuit, the Whites reported recurring drywall cracks, nail pops, floor movement, subfloor deflection, elevated moisture readings, and other concerns they believed went beyond an ordinary new-home punch list. The builder disputes the allegations. 

But this episode is really about what happened after repeated repairs didn't provide answers.

Mikki and Jessica explain why fixing the visible damage isn't the same as fixing its cause. When a drywall crack keeps returning, moisture keeps appearing, or the same problem requires repair after repair, it's time to ask a different question: Why does this keep happening?

That's what Dylan and Suzanne reportedly began doing. Instead of relying solely on the builder's warranty process, they brought in independent specialists to investigate specific systems—including flooring and possible water intrusion. The episode explains why homeowners may need a flooring specialist, building-envelope expert, structural engineer, geotechnical engineer, or forensic inspector rather than expecting one person to diagnose everything. According to the lawsuit, the Whites allege that after they began bringing independent experts to the property, individuals associated with the builder appeared when inspections were taking place. The complaint includes allegations that an inspector was photographed or recorded from across the street and that members of the White family were photographed or recorded without their knowledge. These allegations form part of an invasion-of-privacy claim and are disputed by the builder. 

The episode closes with lessons homeowners can take from the dispute regardless of its eventual outcome: recognize patterns, bring in independent experts when necessary, document recurring problems, keep important communication in writing, and don't confuse repairing damage with identifying its cause.

This is an ongoing legal dispute. The claims discussed in this episode are allegations, the builder disputes them, and the court has not made factual findings establishing the allegations discussed.

00:00 – They believed they were being watched
00:35 – Welcome back & Part 1 recap
05:00 – Inside the lawsuit
08:00 – Why recurring repairs matter
09:00 – Moisture & mold concerns
10:30 – Did they fix the cause?
14:00 – Looking for answers
16:30 – Hiring independent experts
19:00 – Moisture testing
20:00 – Why specialists matter
23:00 – Independent experts vs. the builder
26:00 – Don't diagnose your own house
29:00 – The story takes a creepy turn
30:00 – Surveillance allegations
33:00 – Photos of the family
34:30 – Invasion of privacy claim
38:00 – When trust breaks down
40:00 – Document everything
42:30 – Is contractor licensing enough?
45:00 – The single-point-of-failure problem
49:00 – Are homeowners adequately protected?
51:30 – What homeowners should learn
54:00 – Share your construction story

Creators and Guests

Host

Jessica Abreu

As a social media expert, Jessica has a knack for identifying what makes each business unique and translating that into powerful, engaging content that resonates with clients and customers. From crafting tailored strategies and managing accounts to recording on-site content and boosting engagement, Jessica and her team handle it all so their clients can focus on what they do best.

Host

Mikki Paradis

President & CEO at PDI Drywall Inc. Mikki founded her first construction company, PDI Drywall Inc, in 2005 while she was still a student at NC State. After growing PDI into a multimillion dollar company, she has become an accomplished entrepreneur, speaker, and advocate for innovation in business and leadership. With a passion for empowering others, she has built a reputation as a forward-thinking professional dedicated to driving growth and fostering meaningful connections. Known for her dynamic energy and ability to inspire, Mikki is deeply committed to creating positive change in her industry and beyond. Whether through her entrepreneurial ventures or speaking engagements, she consistently challenges the status quo and encourages others to reach their full potential.

What is Chicks in Construction?

You plan your renovation with excitement, trust your contractor, and hope for the best...until things start going sideways. That’s when most homeowners realize they didn’t know what they didn’t know.

From permits that were never pulled to “contractors” who ghost after demo day, the construction world can feel like a maze of hidden costs and shady shortcuts. Too many homeowners end up confused, overwhelmed, and out of a lot of money.

The Chicks in Construction Podcast is here to change that. Hosted by Mikki Paradis, a licensed general contractor with 20+ years of experience, and Jess Abreu, a homeowner turned construction content creator, this show breaks down real renovation horror stories and teaches you how to protect your time, money, and home.

After building a multimillion-dollar drywall business and helping countless homeowners recover from construction nightmares, Mikki is on a mission to make sure you go into your next project informed, not blindsided. And Jess brings the perspective of someone who’s been in your shoes and now knows exactly what questions to ask.

Submit Your Construction Horror Story: https://chicksinconstruction.com/

58 - Chicks in Construction
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Jessica Abreu: [00:00:00] So up until now, we've been talking about construction, warranty repairs, independent inspectors, trying to figure out what's wrong with the house. And then all of a sudden, dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun. It turns into something that honestly feels like it's out of a movie.

According to the lawsuit, the Whites began believing they were being watched. So walk us through what happened.

Mikki Paradis: Dude, Well, hello, and welcome back to another episode of Chicks in Construction. I am your host, Mickey Paradise, and this is my amazing co-host.

Jessica Abreu: Hi, I'm Jessica Abram.

Mikki Paradis: This is the podcast where we tell you construction horror stories, things that happened to other people.

Maybe it's your story that we're reading out loud. And the point of this is we point out the things where things went a little sideways, things were a little sus. And it is, in a perfect world, gonna help you, the homeowner who's watching this, or the future homeowner [00:01:00] who's watching this, know what is normal in construction and what is not, what is on the up and up, and what is a little sus.

So really, it's just con- it's just true crime, construction edition. That's what we're here for. We wanna help you have better experiences with contractors and tradespeople. Whenever you have to do something for your home, we want you to feel m- more confident in going forth and finding the person, and being able to sort them out, and making sure they're the right person, that they're licensed, that they have all the qualifications.

You will find that here. So that is what we exist for. Now, this is a part two, to be continued, of our last episode, which was covering the story of Dylan White- Mm-hmm ... who is a content creator/lawyer. I do feel like his credential as a pretty big-deal lawyer does matter. So if he's a content creator/lawyer from Minnesota [00:02:00] who h- he goes by the handle @TheDadChats.

I've been following him for absolute years. He's a delight. Him and his wife, Suzanne, um, do it, kinda do it together. It kinda just started where they talk about their kids and, um, couple years ago, they built a custom home. It went sideways, and now they're sharing their story- Mm-hmm ... with everybody, and we want to share the story with you.

We have to do some legalese and legal woes, and all the other things so that you understand that this is an ongoing case. So none, nothing has been proven. These are allegations that the Whites are making against the building company. The building company is denying all of the allegations and saying that none of the things that the Whites are saying is true, so we wanna be very clear with you guys that this is we're just sharing the tea.

Yeah. We don't know [00:03:00] which tea is, is the hot tea and which tea is the cold tea. We don't know which is the iced and which is the hot. We just know we've got the tea. We wanna share the story with you because I do think regardless as to whether things are true or not, there's a lot that can be learned from their experience.

And honestly, some of this is just wild. Wild. So where- Mm-hmm ... we left off in part one was we shared about basically how we got there. So they, they bought the house. They had a ton of cosmetic issues that were reoccurring. So that's where we pointed out where reoccurring issues are something that kinda should- Mm-hmm

should, like, get your ju-jus going, should get the, get the- Spidey

Jessica Abreu: sense ...

Mikki Paradis: the Spidey sense. Thank you, Jess. You're welcome. Get the Spidey sense going, where you're like, "Okay, you know, we've had to call the builder five times about the same problem. It keeps coming back. Seems like there might be something more than just a cosmetic issue."

Mm-hmm. So they, they had gone through this route where they kept, you [00:04:00] know, going to the contractor and saying, "Hey, you know, come fix this, come fix this, come fix this." In the beginning, the contractors seemed like they were happy to do it, and then when the k- issues kept reoccurring, they were a little bit harder to, to nail down.

Um, we had left off where they had a bounce house in their basement. Now envision a much smaller version of the bounce house that you have in your mind. It looks like a little... It's almost like an indoor trampoline moment. In their basement, so basement's here. First floor's here. The kids are bouncing in the bounce house in the basement, and the first floor is moving to the point where things were falling off- Hmm

the, the, the shelving. Like, r- their house was rattling because of something happening on the basement. Just that is not exactly how load works. That's a weird transfer of load. There's something off [00:05:00] with that, just straight up. Like, it's just, that's just weird. Yeah. So we left off there. Mm-hmm. So now we're getting to segment four, which is inside the lawsuit.

Jessica Abreu: All right, so now we're gonna talk about the actual lawsuit. Because when I hear that they are suing the builder, um, I don't really know exactly what that means. So what exactly-

Mikki Paradis: Yes ...

Jessica Abreu: are they claiming?

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, I, I really wanted to get into it because there's some interesting, there's some side balls or... Side balls?

No. What is side?

Jessica Abreu: I don't know what you're trying to say.

Mikki Paradis: Nobody knows. Just, like, just some interest, curve balls. Curve balls- ... guys. The ADHD medication is not working. I am so sorry to report that. There are some curve balls in the things that they are alleging. So the complaint is extensive. One of the central themes running throughout it [00:06:00] is that the Whites allege this wasn't a handful of cosmetic issues.

They allege there were systematic construction defects affecting multiple parts of the home. Some of the major allegations include significant and reoccurring drywall cracking throughout the home, extensive nail pops that allegedly continued even after repairs, extensive squeaking and movement in portions of the floor system, subfloor deflection that they believe exceeded what should occur in a newly constructed custom home, elevated moisture readings in multiple areas that raised concerns about water intrusion and building performance, numerous finish defects that they contend reflected larger underlying construction problems rather than ordinary punch list items.

The lawsuit also alleges that many of these concerns were rep- repeatedly brought to the builder's attention through the warranty [00:07:00] process. Again, the builder denied these allegations.

Jessica Abreu: Mm. So one of the things I noticed when reading through and hearing this list is that it wasn't, "We found a problem," it was, "We found a problem.

They came and repaired it. We found the problem again." And I think that's an important distinction.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, it's a really important distinction because construction professionals think about repairs differently than homeowners. Just, like, it just is. If I patch drywall and it never, the crack never comes back, great.

Problem solved. If I patch a piece of drywall and the crack comes back, I'm no longer foc- focused on the drywall. Now I'm asking what's causing the movement? That's exactly why repeated repairs deserve a closer investigation. Mm. Not because repeated repairs automatically means somebody did something wrong, but because recurring symptoms often [00:08:00] suggest the original cause hasn't been fully identified.

Jessica Abreu: Mm. So another thing that really stuck out in that list was the moisture- Yeah ... discussion.

Mikki Paradis: Yep.

Jessica Abreu: Because we know and we have discussed numerous horror stories- Yep ... that moisture can be a really big deal. I

Mikki Paradis: mean, moisture was our first podcast, our horror story. Right. Our first Homeowner Horror Story was a insane story about water intrusion.

So- Go back

Jessica Abreu: and watch it.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, you should go back. The very first one. You will see a very big difference in quality.

Jessica Abreu: Don't come at us for that.

Mikki Paradis: Don't. It was our first one. Give us a break. So moisture is one of the most destructive force- destructive forces in a home, which we have covered. . According to the complaint, the Whites alleged independent evaluations identified elevated moisture readings in several areas of the home. Now, an elevated moisture reading doesn't automatically tell you what's wrong. It tells you something deserves further investigation.

The [00:09:00] question becomes, where is the moisture coming from? Is that an active leak? I mean, construction moisture that never properly, it dried is an issue. Um, is it condensation? Improper flashing? A plumbing issue? Until you answer those questions, you're still diagnosing, not repairing. That's why moisture matters, um, are such a valuable tool.

Wait, sorry. Wow. You would think I don't have my glasses on. Let's try that again. That's why moisture meters are such a valuable tool. They're often the beginning of the investigation, not the conclusion. And I don't know, like, what has fully come from this, but I do know in some of their reels or, um, content they- they've put out, they actually brought in a mold-detecting dog.

Mm-hmm. Which is a thing. So mold is so widespread, and there's so many different types of mold that they now train dogs to smell m- for mold. [00:10:00] That's awesome. Like they do, like, drug dogs- Mm-hmm ... and cancer-sniffing dogs and things like that. So I don't know what came of it, but I know that they went so far as to bring in, into a new construction home, a mold-smelling dog.

Yes. Now, again, we don't know more, huh? Yeah. But it was a big thing. So.

Jessica Abreu: That brings us to our homeowner teaching moment number two. Numero dos. All right. So if someone says that they repaired something in your home, they say they fixed it, I want you to ask them one more question. How do you know? So did they test it?

Did they verify the source? Did they eliminate the cause?

Mikki Paradis: Yeah.

Jessica Abreu: Or did they only repair the damage? Because those are two completely different things.

Mikki Paradis: And that, like, I see, so it... So much of this story reminds me of the house in Atlanta that I went up. I went to Atlanta to investigate, 'cause they were, they bought an [00:11:00] existing home, and were having so many water intrusion issues.

Like, literally every time it rained, they would have water coming out of the light fixture in one of their bedrooms. It was ridiculous. And so, like, they started out where they would just have somebody come and repair the drywall. And then, you know, when they kinda reached out to me, they were like, "We've had this drywall fixed five times."

And I was like, "Dude, you could have it fixed 500 times." Like...

Jessica Abreu: That's not gonna stop the

Mikki Paradis: water from getting in. It's not gonna stop. Right, and the, the problem that I see in this situation is some people that would come and repair your drywall would tell you, "Listen, I could fix this drywall, but you have a water problem.

I'm not gonna fix it until you fix the water problem." Mm. But some people will just come and fix your drywall, and be excited about the fact that you're gonna call them again, and you're gonna call them again, and you're gonna call them again, because they're gonna keep getting to make money off of you.

So any time you have something [00:12:00] repaired, you wanna know the cause. Don't just say, "Hey, can you come fix my drywall?" I need to know what caused the leak. Mm-hmm. Like, we, we had a leak in, um, in the, in the townhouse, which is brand new. Um, and the plumbers came out and they took the t- the toilet off w- the guest bathroom, and it was fine.

It turned out that there was a leak

from the en suite bathroom, which was, like, the literal opposite side of the house. And so why that matters is If they had just come and m- moved the toilet and been like, "Well, we don't see the problem, so we're just gonna put the toilet back and we're gonna repair your drywall," that would've just kept happening.

So when they were just like, "Oh, we don't know what it is," I was like, "Well, you're gonna figure it out." Mm-hmm. So I didn't just say, "Oh, okay. Well, you can't figure it out. That's fine. Just fix the drywall." I was like, "Nope."

Jessica Abreu: That water's coming from somewhere.

Mikki Paradis: Figure it out. You need to go find it. Like, it, because we have those, um, those things in our water tanks that turn the water blue to help keep the toilets clean.

Oh. And so it was blue water, [00:13:00] so it was literal wastewater, and I was like, "Absol- absolutely not." Of course. We're not pulling one toilet and going, "Well, we can't figure out what it is." I was like, "You are not going to be done here- Until you figure out ... until you find the leak."

Jessica Abreu: Mm-hmm.

Mikki Paradis: So, but so many times they just come in, they fix wh- whatever you're cosmetically seeing, and it's not at all addressing.

So any time you're having work done at your house, you absolutely want to know what caused it, how did you fix it, like- Mm-hmm ... get the technical terms so that you can look it up later. And one of the things that I'm seeing, especially in this whole lawsuit thing, is the level of documentation that Dylan and his wife did is really what...

Like, you can see the lawyer in him. Mm-hmm. Like, he had emails. He had, you know, he had d- like, documents out the ying-yang, and that's a really important thing, too. When you're having repairs and warranty work done on your house- Have your own documentation. Don't just rely on the builder's documentation- Mm[00:14:00]

of it. So that's, like, a little side note. So we gonna go into- Thanks ... segment five.

Jessica Abreu: All right. So when the Whites stopped looking for repairs and started looking for answers.

Mikki Paradis: Mm-hmm.

Jessica Abreu: Okay, so this is the part of the story that really stood out to me. And from everything that we researched, it doesn't sound like Dylan and Suzanne immediately jumped to hiring lawyers.

Mikki Paradis: Even though Dylan is a lawyer.

Jessica Abreu: Even though he... Yeah. I mean, but he's not this kind of lawyer. No, he's

Mikki Paradis: not. '

Jessica Abreu: Cause, you know, you wouldn't have a real estate lawyer doing your murder charges. Facts. They all specialize in something different. Um, it sounded like they spent months trying to figure out what was actually wrong with their house.

Yeah.

Mikki Paradis: That's exactly, and, and they really did. Like, they didn't just, like, jump to this builder has built a defective house. Mm-hmm. It was, "Hey, okay, what's going on?" They kept going back to the builder. And honestly, I think this is one of the biggest lessons homeowners can take away from this entire story, is that according to the [00:15:00] lawsuit and public reporting, the Whites didn't immediately assume that they knew what the problem was.

They started looking for answers. Um, and, and as, as their concerns grew, they kept looking more and more. There was this one point, um, in... I think, like, this is where Dylan realized, "Okay, I can't rely on the home builder anymore. We're gonna have to bring in independent experts." He said that especially with, like, the water intrusion-

Jessica Abreu: Mm-hmm

Mikki Paradis: he called the builder. The builder said he was gonna send an inspector out And so they, they, like, make time in their schedule for this inspector to come out. The guy comes out, he takes, like, two pictures, and he's like, "All right, that's all I need." And the- Dylan was like, "W- what? Like, you're supposed to be inspecting- Mm-hmm

the water intrusion issue. You took two pictures. Like, what do you mean that's all you need?" And he was like, "I'm not inspecting the wa- I, I work for the builder." So the builder didn't even, like, hire a [00:16:00] professional or bring out the subcontractor or whatever.

Jessica Abreu: And he didn't even tell the guy enough information to know to lie.

Mikki Paradis: Right. Like, he didn't even go that far to be like, "Whatever he says, just go along with it." Like, he was like, "No, I just..." Like, he was basically, like, the intern. Right. And he just came, and he was like- Oh, my God ... took some pictures. Like, "Hey, placate this homeowner and make him- Mm ... feel like we're doing what we said we were gonna do."

And I think that was where, um, where it kinda shifted. So he began bringing in independent professionals to evaluate specific issues instead of relying solent- solely on warranty repairs. Um, and that was a really smart decision. Because when you're trying to determine whether you're dealing with a cosmetic issue or not, or a larger construction problem, you need independent information, not assumptions.

Jessica Abreu: Mm-hmm. And one thing I found really interesting is that they didn't just hire one person to go through everything. They hired different experts to look at and evaluate different areas of their home. So why don't you walk us through that?

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, so I was, I was very proud to see that they, they first, [00:17:00] they h- brought in a floor expert.

So, um, according to the lawsuit and the reporting, one of the first outside professionals they hired was a flooring contractor. Um- They were brought in to evaluate the, their flooring concerns. And according to the complaint, the flooring contractor allegedly described portions of the floor system and concrete slab work as being among the worst they have ever seen- Oh my God

in a new home.

Jessica Abreu: In a $1.2

Mikki Paradis: million home. Right, 1.2 millions. Millions of dollars. Now, that's obviously a very strong statement. Um, it is an allegation contained in the lawsuit, and the builder disputes the allegation. I don't know if you're seeing the level of cover our ass that we're trying to put out in this podcast.

But to be clear, that is an allegation, and the builder disputes that allegation. But here's why I think it's important. The Weitz weren't just saying, "We think something's wrong." They were [00:18:00] starting to seek opinions from professionals with experience in the spec- specific system that they were concerned about.

Jessica Abreu: And that's something that most homeowners don't think about. Yeah. And like I wouldn't have thought about, you know, originally, is I would just keep calling the builder. Yeah. Because, like, they built the house- Right ... so, like, they're the ones that

Mikki Paradis: should be able to fix it. And also, like, your first, your brain goes to, "I'm not paying somebody."

Like, this is, you built it, you fix it.

Jessica Abreu: Yeah. Like, you broke it, you bought it Right.

Mikki Paradis: You built it, you fix it.

Jessica Abreu: You built it, you

Mikki Paradis: fix it. Like, so I completely get why, like, your, your brain would not go there.

Jessica Abreu: Right. But so I'm really, um, proud, gonna take this into consideration if I ever, you know, have ... if I ever build a house.

Yeah. I'm probably never gonna build a house. I don't make enough money. Yeah. But they started asking, "Can someone independent- Yeah ... tell us what is happening?"

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, exactly. And that, th- like, at that point, they can take it a step further. So according to the complaint and the r- and the reporting, [00:19:00] they hired an, an independent inspector to investigate concerns about possible water intrusion.

Mm-hmm. I think that's where the mold det- detecting dog was brought in. Mm-hmm. That ins- inspector reportedly identified multiple areas of elevated moisture throughout the home. Now- Mm-mm ... let's be very careful here. Elevated moisture readings doesn't automatically mean defective construction. It doesn't automatically mean mold.

It doesn't automatically tell you where the water came from. What it tells you is something deserves further investigation, um, and that's another piece of the puzzle. One of the things that I, like- Structural engineers exist in the world f- for a lot of reasons. And especially, like, when you bring in a structural engineer that had absolutely nothing, they have no skin in the game, right?

Right. Like, they didn't do the structural drawings on this. Mm-hmm. They don't... It's like they're just gonna come in, and they're gonna use their engineer brain to be like, "This, that, or the other." Okay. [00:20:00] So I have a buddy who is a forensic structural engineer.

Jessica Abreu: Oh.

Mikki Paradis: And so he was brought in when the, on the World Trade towers.

Mm-hmm. Like, after the failure. 'Cause, I mean, I don't think they were built thinking what was gonna happen was gonna happen, and, like, we built for that. But they wanted to understand the failures. And so, like, this guy is so, like, mega mind. He could literally... He went to the site and, like, was able to look at the components of the structure and understand, like, at what point it failed.

Wow. So, like, this, i- he has the coolest stories, because he k- he ki- kind of, like, he does, like, CSI, but construction version. So he comes in, and he's like, "Okay, here's what's going on." So the f- n- I know that, because I've worked with him. Mm-hmm. So it's one of those things where it's like that does exist. And when you're dealing with something as serious as this- Mm-hmm

you [00:21:00] really don't wanna rely on, on the builder's people. You really wanna have somebody to come in and do that kind of- Mm-hmm ... inspection and say, "Okay, here are the things that are going wrong. Th- I am this level of a professional. I am telling you, here are the problems, and here's how it can be fixed."

Mm-hmm. So that is the best thing that you can do for- you, if you were to find yourself in this situation.

Jessica Abreu: Yeah. So hiring an independent expert-

Mikki Paradis: Yeah ...

Jessica Abreu: that matters.

Mikki Paradis: It really

Jessica Abreu: does. And I actually love that they did this because I think that homeowners assume, just like I said before- Yep ... if I hire the builder, they gotta come fix it, and that they are the expert.

And we are finding out they are, in fact, not the expert, um- Yeah ... on all things. They're-

Mikki Paradis: Apparently ev- half of the country is fine with general contractors just being managers and not having any experience at all. I don't think if ... Like, in this story, how does that make sense? Mm. Mm-mm. Like, make that make sense.

Nope. You're, you have no [00:22:00] experience. And a- actually, to, to rebuke one thing, Dylan is not saying that his builder doesn't have any experience. I actually think he stated that his builder has a ton of experience, which s- on some level, makes this worse. Mm-hmm. Because again, like, what are we always telling you guys?

Like, vet your people, make sure they're experienced, make sure they're licensed. He was licensed, he was experienced. So this is very similar to the Jake Malback story- Mm-hmm ... where he did all the right things and still ended up in a really crappy situation. So if you, you check all the boxes and you still end up here, like, this is the, okay, well, here's what's next.

Um, because every professional has a different role. So like, I think about going to the doctor. If your primary care physician can't explain what's happening, they send you to a specialist. Construction should work the same way. A flooring contractor understands flooring systems. A building envelope consultant understands water intrusion.

A [00:23:00] structural engineer understands structural behavior. A geotechnical engineer understands soil conditions. A forensic inspector specializes in identifying the cause of failures rather than simply repairing damages. No one person is an expert in everything. Mm-hmm. So when a problem becomes complicated, you often need multiple experts

Jessica Abreu: and I think that's an important distinction. Hiring an independent expert a- doesn't automatically mean that you are preparing for a lawsuit.

Mikki Paradis: Right.

Jessica Abreu: What it means is that you are simply trying to understand what is happening in your house.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, and I think 100%, if you find yourself in a situation like this, you absolutely need to hire somebody that's n- just not connected to any of it.

Mm-hmm. Um, like I... The, my friend in Atlanta, like that's what they... They were just so tired of all the back and forth and all the back and forth that they just said, "Listen, I'm gonna pay you. Please just come tell me what's wrong with my house," um, from somebody who [00:24:00] doesn't have any skin in the game. Mm-hmm.

Like, I didn't build the house. I didn't sell the house. I didn't own the house. So it's like, let's just, let's just see what the major issues are. And in that case, they, there were very- Mm ... very serious issues. So good information benefits everyone. If the builder is right, independent testing will confirm that.

If the homeowner's concerns are valid, independent testing may identify issues that need additional attention. Either way, you're making decisions based on evidence, not emotion. And I think one of the things that I think about is if I'm building a house and I'm, I'm coming, I'm standing on integrity- My homeowners come to me, they have a problem, it becomes reoccurring.

I as the builder, after the second or third time that this has reoccurred and there's, like, I'm, I'm c- like, my homeowners are coming to me with c- some kind of some very serious concerns. Mm-hmm. I am not hesitating to bring in a structural engineer. I am not hesitating t- on my [00:25:00] expense as the builder, because I'm standing on my integrity.

I'm standing on my name. I am standing on, you know- Mm-hmm ... putting th- th- that this is my, my reputation, and it matters to me. I am, I am going to bring in somebody to evaluate what's going on. If, if I know that I didn't cut any corners in the building of this house, why would I not?

Jessica Abreu: Right.

Mikki Paradis: That's me as a builder.

I'm not saying anything about them as a builder. But I'm saying me as a builder, if I, if I were to find myself into that situation and I knew I had not cut corners. Mm-hmm. Something is obviously wrong here. I'm gonna bring somebody in to find out what is wrong so that we can fix it, and it doesn't become the homeowner's responsibility.

Jessica Abreu: Right.

Mikki Paradis: But that's just me. So red flag number three is don't diagnose your own house. Mm-hmm. I think as we have discussed. One of the biggest mistakes homeowners make is trying to become experts [00:26:00] overnight. They watch three YouTube videos, read a Facebook group. Mm-hmm. Maybe they watch our, our, a podcast or two of ours, and suddenly they're convinced that they know exactly what's wrong.

Don't do that. Your job isn't to diagnose your house. Your job is to recognize when something doesn't seem right, then bring in qualified people who can help you determine the cause. That's exactly what appears to have happened here. The Whites went from documenting cosmetic concerns to hiring independent professionals as they tried to determine whether there was a larger underlying problem.

Jessica Abreu: Yep, so that's homeowner teaching moment number three, okay? If you think that there is a significant problem in your home, don't hire one person and stop there. You need to hire the right person. Yeah. So if you think that there's something structural, you call a structural engineer. If there's water intrusion, call a building envelope or moisture expert.

If it's [00:27:00] flooring, call someone who specializes in flooring systems. The right expert can save you thousands of dollars by identifying the actual cause- Yeah ... instead of simply trying to treat the system.

Mikki Paradis: And it might feel like w- I, like, this is so expensive, but again, like- Without knowing, it, it's like having a surgery for something that might be wrong.

So it's like not doing the diagnostic work to find out what's going on, just like, "Oh, let's just cut you open to see what's in there." Mm. You could end up spending a lot more money fixing what people think is the problem than just hiring the expert from the gate and them being like, "All right. Here's the problem.

Here's how you fix it." Mm-hmm. It seems like, oh... 'Cause I think, like, the average structural engineer, depending on what you need from them, can be like 500 to, like, $1,500 to, like, come out and look at something and come up with, like, a plan on how to fix it. And that, listen, that's not short money, but at the end of the day If you're [00:28:00] spending $500 here to fix a problem, and $1,000 here to fix a problem, and $500 here to fix a problem, all of a suddenly those small little amounts start to add up, and you would've been better off just hiring a structural engineer.

Jessica Abreu: Yep. And so one thing that really surprised me while researching all of this is that even after hiring the outside experts, the Whites still didn't have all of the answers. They were still trying to figure out why all of these different issues were happening.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah, exactly. And that's something homeowners should understand.

Finding the cause of construction defects isn't always immediate, which is very not satisfying. Mm-hmm. Like, you wanna know. You wanna know. But sometimes it's like putting together a puzzle. Every inspection, every moisture reading, every repair, every expert opinion adds another piece until the bigger picture starts to kinda come into focus.

Jessica Abreu: So now the story takes an unexpected turn- Yeah, it does ... that I did not see coming. So up until [00:29:00] now, we've been talking about construction, warranty repairs, independent inspectors, trying to figure out what's wrong with the house. And then all of a sudden, dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun. It turns into something that honestly feels like it's out of a movie.

According to the lawsuit, the Whites began believing they were being watched. So walk us through what happened.

Mikki Paradis: Dude, like, listening to Dylan talk about this, like, he... 'Cause he's, like, a funny guy. And so, like, when he's... Again, I've told you guys, like, he's a great storyteller. And so, like, he, when he's telling stories, he's really animated and just, like, very jovial.

And so he starts talking about this part of it, and, like, the serious lawyer face-

Jessica Abreu: Mm ...

Mikki Paradis: comes out. And, like, the lawyer tone comes out. And, like, he's, he's not telling a story here. He's, like, he's in-

Jessica Abreu: It gives me, I, I- Yeah,

Mikki Paradis: like, a

Jessica Abreu: little bit ... all the creepy goosebumps- Yeah ... have come back. I, I- Every single time I read- Yeah

or hear about this.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah. [00:30:00] And so, um, this is probably one of the most unusual parts of the entire case. And again, everything we're about to discuss comes from allegations contained in the lawsuit and publicly reported information, so do not come for us. 'Cause listen, we broke anyway, so you can't get blood out of a rock-

as we've discussed. The builder denies any wrongdoing, but according to the complaint, the Whites allege that after they began hiring independent experts and documenting issues with their home, they noticed individuals associated with the builder- appearing whenever inspectors were at the property. One allegation that has received significant attention involves an independent inspector who was evaluating the home.

According to the complaint, the Whites alleged someone associated with the builder was parked across the street, photographing or recording the [00:31:00] inspector while the inspection was taking place. Now, at first you might think, "Okay, well maybe it's just a coincidence," but according to the lawsuit, the Whites alleged it did not stop there.

Jessica Abreu: It honestly makes me so uncomfortable. I know. It just like, thinking about it, like happening myself- As a girl mom- Yeah ...

Mikki Paradis: like, ugh.

Jessica Abreu: No. I mean, I would also, I'd be real quick to get my husband to go out there and talk to him. Or I would just go- Well- ... you know, with a bat in hand. Um- I'm

Mikki Paradis: just saying, we solve a lot of problems with guns around here.

Jessica Abreu: I don't own one. Probably for a good reason. Jess

Mikki Paradis: is not Southern enough to own a gun.

Jessica Abreu: No.

Mikki Paradis: She's, we, she hasn't been here long enough.

Jessica Abreu: Nope, I'm still a Northerner. Guns are bad. No, I don't really think that. Um, because one thing I kept asking myself, if I hired someone to inspect my house, why is someone sitting across the street recording them?

As a homeowner, that would make me uncomfortable and uneasy, and I for sure would go outside and ask for answers.

Mikki Paradis: Oh yeah, no. Like-

Jessica Abreu: I ain't just sending [00:32:00] back.

Mikki Paradis: The level of like ma- mafia mob boss vibes that gives is like, como que? Like, what are you talking about? And so apparently they are now building a spec home direct- in the lot right next door to Dylan.

So, like, they're always watching them. There's always people there. Mm. Like no matter what they do. So according to the complaint, the Whites allege that eventually, and they eventually discovered that members of their family, including their children- Nope ... had been photographed- Mm-mm ... or recorded without their knowledge while at their home.

Those allegations became part of the lawsuit through the invasion of privacy claim. Now, it's important to be very clear these are allegations, blah, blah, blah. The builder denies any liability, disputes claim, arrests, blah, blah, blah, the lawsuit. So the court has not made any factual findings. Basically, this is what our lawyer says we have to say so that we don't get sued.

One of the things [00:33:00] that Dylan mentioned, and this is- Like, I, 'cause I'm just like, "Why?" Like, why do you need photographs of their children and of, like, videos of their children?

Jessica Abreu: Intimidation.

Mikki Paradis: And especially, like, ugh, gross.

Jessica Abreu: Mm.

Mikki Paradis: Gross. Especially w- the, Dylan notes that some of the photos and the recordings were when the kids were in their bathing suits.

Jessica Abreu: So how do they, how does he have the recordings?

Mikki Paradis: Because through the lawsuit they had to, um, what is it called?

Jessica Abreu: They had to hand over their phones.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah. Well, they had to hand over all the documents. So, like, there's that part of the lawsuit where, like, everybody has to- Mm ... give their evidence. Like, this is the evidence I have, so that you can kind of p- provide a, a counter to it.

Got it. So in the discovery period of the lawsuit, they provided, they had to provide that they had these videos and these photos, and they were videos o- videos and photos, some of them of their kids in their bathing suits.

Jessica Abreu: Somebody [00:34:00] would be getting it right about now.

Mikki Paradis: Right? I'm just like- Mm ... y'all, you, y'all lucky you're messing with a civilized man, okay?

Like- Mm-hmm ... Dylan White be a civilized man who's gonna, in a civilized way, take you to court. I'm just like, you try that round here. You try it. See what happens. Like, just see, see how long you're alive.

Jessica Abreu: Oh, my God. Mm-hmm. Nope. And, um- So in the courtroom, why was the invasion of privacy included? And it surprised me, but, because I expected it to be a breach of contract, maybe negligence, construction defects.

I didn't expect an invasion of privacy claim to be included. Right.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah. It's, again, again, just, like, wild turn of events. Like- Mm-hmm ... you think it's just gonna be, like, a construction claim, and now it's... And it gets, it, there's a lot of tit for tat in this e- between the two, the two of them. So according to the complaint, the Whites allege that the, the conduct went beyond a disagreement over construction quality.

[00:35:00] They contend that there... They contend there were actions that invaded their privacy by photographing or surveilling them, and people coming to their home without their consent. Whether those allegations are true, , ultimately proven, is something the court will decide.

But legally, um, that's why invasion of privacy appears in the separate claim. It's not about drywall, it's not about floors. It's about alleged conduct that the homeowners believe crossed a completely different line.

Jessica Abreu: And honestly, whether you're a contractor, a homeowner, or somebody listening to this podcast- Mm-hmm

I think everybody can agree to one thing, that your home should be the one place, I mean, there should be more places, but it's at least the one- Right, right ... most special place where you should feel that your family has privacy and safety. [00:36:00] If I thought that somebody was sitting outside my house recording my kids, I'd be a little shaken up, but also I own a bat.

Mikki Paradis: Right. She owns a

Jessica Abreu: bat.

Mikki Paradis: Watch out.

Jessica Abreu: Um-

Mikki Paradis: She owns m- multiple bats 'cause her pl- kids play softball. Watch out.

Jessica Abreu: Yeah. Those hit, those hit hard. Um, but regardless of what was happening, um, with the dis- um, construction dispute, like people should not be- No ... taking

Mikki Paradis: pictures. Like, absolutely not. Like- Like, that's just-

Jessica Abreu: There's gotta be a line- It's absolutely insane

somewhere in your moral code. Like, where is that line? Like-

Mikki Paradis: And, but I think you're actually right. 'Cause like, I, too, I could not figure out, like what was the purpose of this, but you said it, and obviously we're, this is alleged. Alleged. We're speculating. But 100% intimidation, because this guy is a public figure, but he has been very intentional of not showing any photos of his kids.

So- Oh,

Jessica Abreu: so even when he talks about them, their face

Mikki Paradis: is not- Yeah, even when he talks about them, he does not show photos of [00:37:00] their faces. Like, you know how some people are very- Mm-hmm ... like very-

Jessica Abreu: They don't like

Mikki Paradis: their kids, yes ... open arms about that. They don't. Like, they'll post pictures of their kids, but they'll put, like, a star over their face or whatever.

Mm-hmm. Like, some people are- Like a emoji, yes ... very cautious of that. And so he has, he does not, like, while him and his wife are public figures, their children are not. Mm. So he does not put, post photos. So I

Jessica Abreu: think it- Oh, that would make me even... That's another level ...

Mikki Paradis: it, it gives it more of, like, that we're trying to intimidate you.

We're letting you know we have pictures of your kids. And I'm like, you lucky you in a civilized place. Because in the South, that, that's when I call my neighbors, and we go get the backhoe to dig a hole.

Jessica Abreu: And some endangered flowers- I'm not saying for what ... to put over it.

Mikki Paradis: Right. I'm not saying why we're digging a hole, but I'm just saying-

Jessica Abreu: Get some

Mikki Paradis: pigs

we do know how to operate heavy equipment. We're not the people you wanna mess with. So let's go to red flag number four. When the relationship completely breaks down. So here's something I want every homeowner to pay attention to. [00:38:00] Construction problems can often be fixed. Communication problems can often be repaired.

But once trust completely disappears, everything becomes harder. According to the public record, by this point, the relationship between the Whites and the builder had deteriorated significantly. Instead of working together towards solution, the dispute had evolved into litigation. For every homeowner listening, that's the outcome you want to avoid if possible.

But listen, at the same time, we also talk about the fact that sometimes that's the only solution that you have. Mm-hmm. Like, I totally understand, 'cause th- this house was... I think they started to build it in 2024. They moved in in 2025. So they've been living in the house for over a year. And so I completely understand.

Like, there has to be a point where enough is enough. If you've been having consistent issues for over a year, [00:39:00] yes, it is always... And, like, all of my lawyer friends, like my cousin Amal is a lawyer. Mm. And, like, whenever I call him about some shenanigans, he's like, "Miggy, of, I, in all things, you want to avoid actually l- like, going into litigation."

That's why so many people, like, settle and- Mm-hmm ... all, all the things, because litigation is expensive no matter who you are and no matter what you're suing over. Like, it's expensive. And, you know, people who sue each other in general aren't friends afterwards.

Jessica Abreu: Yeah.

Mikki Paradis: You know? Like, you get, you get that cease and desist letter, and it's like, well, you don't exist in the world anymore.

Mm-hmm. You know? So, you know, at the, at that point, like once you're in litigation, you know that, that that builder is not gonna be the person who's fixing your home. And so the ... You try as hard as you can to get that builder to honor, you know, their warranty, to honor what they built. But at some point then it's just like, okay, we going, we going full-on lawsuit.

Jessica Abreu: Mm-hmm.

Mikki Paradis: So if [00:40:00] your relationship with your contractor begins breaking down, this is really important, I think this is something that the Whites did very well. Start documenting every interaction. Keep communication in writing whenever it's practical. Stay respectful, stay factual, avoid assumptions. And if needed, bring in quality independent professionals early.

The goal should always be to resolve the problem, not simply win the argument. And another thing too that I've, I've just had to learn to do in construction, because a lot of things happen on the phone or a lot- Mm-hmm ... of things happen in person. So when you have an in-person or a phone conversation, if you didn't record the phone conversation, um, send a follow-up email just saying, "Hey, um, you know, just to, just to cover what we talked about

Jessica Abreu: today."

Mikki Paradis: Per our conversation. Yeah. Like per... I, I try to keep it really light, like w- 'cause I don't want people to think I'm creating a, you know, file to like, a [00:41:00] cover my ass file. But like, listen, I'm always creating a cover my ass file. Yeah. But so I try to come at it like, "Hey, you know, today we talked about this, that, the other.

Am I forgetting anything? I feel like there was something we, else we talked about. What am I missing?" So that kinda gets them to engage with you a little bit- Mm-hmm ... and it makes it seem less like, hey, I'm creating a doc- a record of our conversation, and more like, hey, did I miss anything? And then that gives you that piece of like information where you're like, all right, now I have- Mm

it, it in writing what we talked about, and if they respond, then you have it where they agreed to it.

Jessica Abreu: Yeah. Brad does that all the time at work.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah. It's, it's really sad that that's like the world we live in. Yeah. But like you kinda have to do that.

Jessica Abreu: Yeah. Like-

Mikki Paradis: People get Hector with that all the time. Like-

Jessica Abreu: Per my last email.

Yeah.

Mikki Paradis: So c- because Hector does not email, nor does he text. Mm-hmm. Like, you're getting zero, you're getting a goose egg from Hector in, in form of a, of a written correspondence. He does not. It's not

Jessica Abreu: happening. He does not have the typing thumbs.

Mikki Paradis: And no, he does not. Absolutely [00:42:00] not. He has special trash thumbs.

He does not have typing thumbs. And people get him all the time with that because they'll have a conversation, they'll agree to things, and then they'll go back on it, and he'll, he'll be like, "But they told me they would do it." And I'm like, "Babe- People be liars. Mm-hmm. Liars be lying.

Jessica Abreu: All the time.

Mikki Paradis: All the dadgum time.

Jessica Abreu: So one thing that surprised me while following Dylan's videos is his frustration eventually became about something much bigger than his house.

Mikki Paradis: Yes.

Jessica Abreu: He started asking questions about the entire system, not just how did this happen to us, but how is this allowed to happen?

Mikki Paradis: Yes, which brings us to the post on TikTok that is going viral when we recounted Dylan's frustration with just how easy it is in his state to become a general contractor.

Hmm. And I think it's an important distinction. As the story progressed, Dylan started talking [00:43:00] publicly about what he learned while researching Minnesota's licensing requirements. One of the things that really caught people's attention was his claim that becoming a licensed residential general contractor in Minnesota is surprisingly easy.

In one of his videos, he says that, in his view, all it took was about $50 to obtain the state license after meeting the required steps, and he questioned whether that process does enough to protect homeowners. Um, so, like, his whole thing was, I think we've discussed it- It's a, it's an open book test. Mm. He was like, "So you're getting...

Let me get this right. I take this open book test, and if I pass it, I pay $50 to become a licensed general contractor, and I don't need any other experience." He, he noted that electricians, that plumbers, that all the, the, [00:44:00] all of these other people that are doing really important things that could be dangerous not only require you to pass a test, but they also require you to have a certain amount of hours, like as an apprentice, or hours working in that field before you can just willy-nilly be an electrician.

And he was like, "I don't understand how all of these other trades require there to be a license, require there to be, you know, more than just I took an open book test and passed it, but to be a general contractor you don't." He also pointed out the other trades that don't require any kind of licensing, and I do think this is a fair point.

It is kind of wild that framers don't require licensing. Hm. 'Cause if you think about it, they're literally framing the entire structure of your home.

Jessica Abreu: Is it because they assume that the structural engineer and the general [00:45:00] contractor are the ones who are making sure of that?

Mikki Paradis: Right. So, so-

Jessica Abreu: So

Mikki Paradis: somebody has

Jessica Abreu: to

Mikki Paradis: in the comments, let me just tell you what the comments are gonna say. That's what the building inspectors are for. And listen, in a perfect world, sure. But like saying it's fine that this framing crew doesn't have any responsibility or requirement to know- what they're doing, to know about load transfer, to know about w- like, the building code, the requirement.

Because framing is very, is very heavily covered in the building code. Like, you have to frame things per code. Mm-hmm. And yes, an inspector's job is to catch that you framed something wrong, but it seems like, okay, so we're saying there's only one catch. There's only one person in this entire building of a home that people- Mm

are gonna live in that are required to [00:46:00] catch mistakes, and it's the inspector. The general contractor doesn't have to know what they're doing. They don't have to have experience. The framer doesn't have to have a license, doesn't have to know what he's doing, doesn't have to have experience. The only person who's required to catch that is the building inspector.

Mm. Ask Jake Mulback how that went for him. Look that up. Pittsboro, North Carolina. The inspectors passed his home despite the fact that it was wildly structurally unsound. They passed those inspections. So to all the people who are gonna come in the comments section and be like, "That's what inspectors are for," that is a single point of failure.

You're putting this entire home in the hands of one person. That seems like a really bad move. There should be multiple points where if somebody fails here, somebody falls back and they're, they're gonna inspect or they're gonna catch it. They're required. There should be requirements for more than one person in this situation [00:47:00] to know what they're doing.

It just seems ridiculous to me. And, you know, the level of comments that we're gonna get are gonna be spicy, but I don't care. So Like, Dylan is expressing his opinion and his frustration about everything that he's been through. And I do think he has gotten some pretty spicy comments too, because I think as I've said- Mm

uh, I watched one of his, like, this is after he got off his soapbox about the general contractor, how easy it was to become one of those. He talked about being a home inspector. And in the beginning of that video, I thought he was talking about, like, building inspectors. Mm-hmm. And so I made a comment, you know, a home inspector is a very different thing from a building inspector.

But to be fair to myself, he was really talking about them in the same way. And so I- Oh ... really thought, like, we talked about this on one of the last podcasts. Home inspectors have absolutely no [00:48:00] liability. They have absolutely, like, everything that a home inspector is doing is a visual inspection. A building inspector is a very different thing.

You have, you, to be a home inspector, you don't have to have any experience. You don't even s- in some states you don't even have to have, like, take a course or have a license. Building inspectors have to have a wild amount of experience. They have to take a crazy amount of tests. They have to- Gotcha

really know what they're talking about. So there's a huge difference. So I made that comment and he responded to it, but not in a nice way. Well, it wasn't that he wasn't nice. He was probably frustrated with the amount of comments that he was getting. Um, and he pointed out that that's why he was, said it was a, he was talking about home inspectors.

And I responded and I apologized, but he did not respond back. So there's that. So that's just, like, this is his experience and I do think he's getting, um, a little [00:49:00] frustrated with it, but I completely understand why this experience has caused him to start asking whether the licensing system is adequately, adequately protects customers.

Because I think at the end of the day, it really doesn't. I think if we've learned anything over doing this podcast for almost two years, it's that until there are things that exist that exist specifically to protect homeowners-

Jessica Abreu: Mm-hmm

Mikki Paradis: It is, it is ridiculously wild that a general contractor, you know, is not only, only required to take this test.

Doesn't, is in... Well, we know 17 states don't even require you to have a license, as Jess in our last podcast covered. Yep. Um, only, what was it? Four or five states require you to actually have experience to be a general contractor. The rest is just the Wild Wild West, and that is insane when you really think about it.

It's like if you equate building a house to having a surgery, and [00:50:00] I know a lot of people are like, "Oh, they're not the same thing." How are they not? Like, this is a home that you're gonna live in. This is a home where if systems fail, you could be breathing in mold that is toxic and could give you cancer.

This is a home that if something fails, your house could set on fire while you're sleeping. This is a home where if something fails, it could literally collapse if the s- if the wind blows the right way. How is that not just as serious as a doctor performing surgery? Why is it okay for us to expect doctors and lawyers and people doing very serious things- Mm-hmm

to have licensing and experience, but we don't expect the same for the people building our homes? That is nuts to me, and I understand Dylan's frustration. Because when he pointed that out, I was like, damn, he ain't wrong, which, you know, a lot of people disagreed with. Yeah.

Jessica Abreu: I think that there's a lot of people who connected with him be- because before this, I [00:51:00] honestly never thought about what it actually takes to become a general contractor, except in North Carolina I know that you have to take a test.

Mikki Paradis: Yeah.

Jessica Abreu: I just assumed, oh, the state must have really strict requirements.

Then I watched his videos and thought, "Wait, that's it?"

Mikki Paradis: Yeah. No, it's insane. So we're going to kinda wrap it up here. There is a lot more that goes to this guy's story. There's a lot more that, that is, is gonna happen 'cause obviously it's ongoing litigation. But the thing that we want you guys to know and to be the most clear about is that, you know, when you are having consistent issues with a new home that you've purchased or even with y- a new renovation, when, when you're having the same problems, when multiple systems are failing and your builder's not taking that seriously, when they just come out and they're repairing things, they're not finding the, like diagnosing.

When they're not taking it as serious as you feel like they should be taking it, you need to just trust your gut. You need to listen to the fact that like, okay, something feels really [00:52:00] wrong with this, and we need to bring in somebody outside of this circle to figure it out. And it's not like, oh, I'm building my case 'cause I'm gonna sue this builder.

It's I wanna know what's going on in my house, and a lot of times that just needs to be somebody, a third party that's just not involved, that doesn't have any skin in the game. When you are having multiple failures of the same time, and you're having to re- repair the same thing, I don't care what the builder's telling you, that's a problem and you need to look into that.

So obviously, this is ongoing. We will definitely keep you guys informed as to what happens. We'll, we'll give you like a little play-by-play on the upcoming podcasts. But we want Dylan and Suzanne and his kids and family to know that, like, we get it. This is what the entire podcast is about. I think so much of his posts are about his frustration and I, you know, I'm watching these posts, I'm going, this is the entire reason why the podcast exists.

Mm-hmm. Because homeowners like this need to [00:53:00] know that this behavior is not normal. Yeah. It is not normal for your, your general contractor to not take a very huge quantity of concern seriously. It is especially not normal for your general contractor to be videoing and recording anything that is happening at your house.

That is not normal.

Jessica Abreu: No.

Mikki Paradis: Um, w- I think one thing that also happened was they tried to, the builder tried to get, um, an injunction, a temporary injunction put on them to not talk about the situation.

Jessica Abreu: Oh.

Mikki Paradis: And it was thrown out because it was a... Like, they're not saying anything that's not true for them. Like, they're not making up lies.

Jessica Abreu: Right.

Mikki Paradis: And so it was a First Amendment issue, so they, they, the builder was not successful in getting him to, to shush it. So we will keep you guys posted. I hope this story helps you guys all feel like it's not just us, like we're all... A- as you experience this, you, you find yourself asking the same questions.

[00:54:00] So if you have had a crazy story, we want you to share it with us. You can go to chicksinconstruction.com. You scroll down a little bit, and you can share your story, and we will share it with the world. Because we want other people to learn from any mistakes that you feel like you've made. Or maybe it wasn't a mistake you made, you just got screwed over and you want people to, to, to know about it- Mm-hmm

so that it doesn't happen to them, because learning the hard way is overrated. Overrated. So Jess, where can they find us on the socials?

Jessica Abreu: On Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn, it's @ChicksInConstruction podcast. On TikTok, it's @ChicksInConstruction.

Mikki Paradis: All right, guys. We'll see you next time. Bye. Bye.