I Used To Be Crap At Sales

Ep. 13 - I Used To Be Crap At Sales | James Ski

Building Your "Sales Confidence"

In This episode of the "I Used To Be Crap At Sales" Podcast, our host Mark Ackers sits with one of LinkedIn’s top global sellers who knows exactly how to shatter sales obstacles and fuel unstoppable confidence from doing it himself first hand - James Ski.

After all, who could possibly be more expert in building confidence in sales, than the founder of Sales Confidence itself?

What is I Used To Be Crap At Sales?

Even the most prominent voices in Sales were crap at Sales once.

Join bestselling Author, Founder and Sales Coach Mark Ackers as he speaks with successful Sales professionals about their early Sales struggles, and how they overcame these challenges to become the people they are today.

Mark Ackers: Welcome

to the

podcast.

Here's a

sneak peek

of what's

coming up

in today's

episode.

We've got

the

top global

seller for

LinkedIn,

2016, 17

and 18,

with a

social

selling

index of

97 out of

100 ski

James Ski: is

abbreviation

of my full

surname.

I'm half

polish.

Did not

Mark Ackers: know

that.

Yeah,

what's

your full

surname?

Did you

used to be

crap at

sales? I

did, how

crap are

talking?

James Ski: I

was

pretty,

anxious.

So I did

door to

door,

which was

knocking

on doors,

persuading

people to

get their

milk

delivered.

I remember

my very

first day

in a phone

based

role,

literally

given a

phone book

by a

former

mechanic

who turned

sales

manager.

And I

remember

that first

dial that

I made,

and

literally,

I was

shaking,

right? And

when that

person

picked up

the phone,

I hung up.

I didn't

even

speak. I

could not

speak. I

was so

nervous.

Mark Ackers: Once

ranked the

world's

number one

social

seller,

being

number

James Ski: one

was

important.

It wasn't

easy to

become

number one

global

biller.

You know,

like I was

depressed

when I

joined

LinkedIn,

and no one

knew this

at the

time, but

I was so

depressed

that when

I was

getting

introduced

to people,

I was

walking

around

offices, I

was so

uncomfortable

with that,

because I

had such

high

anxiety. I

was so

depressed

that I

would

literally

hide

myself

away from

people

because I

couldn't

handle the

interaction.

Mark Ackers: And

it's nice

that you

take the

time to

help

people,

and maybe

you come

to a place

of that's

the help

you wanted

to have

earlier in

your

career.

James Ski: My

great

mission is

to help

people

with their

confidence.

If you

believe

more in

yourself,

if you

back

yourself

more, you

do more,

you

achieve

more, you

earn more,

you get

the

partner

you want.

And

actually,

my great

mission is

to help

people

with their

confidence

is just

happens to

be that be

that my

profession

is sales,

and that's

what I'm

known for

right now.

But longer

term is

it's

helping

people

with

confidence

is what's

really

important

Mark Ackers: me.

I can see

why you

and Simon

get on so

well. What

a great

story.

Maybe one

day I come

podcast,

hey, maybe

let's

start

where we

always

start.

Then with

a yes, no

question,

did you

used to be

crap at

sales. I

did. How

crap were

talking? I

was

pretty,

James Ski: like

anxious.

So I'll

give you

this the

story of

my first

phone

based

sales

role. So I

did door

to door,

which was

persuade

knocking

on doors,

persuading

people to

get their

milk

delivered,

right?

Which?

Still

ridiculous,

but the

milk

delivery

man

industry

was going

like that.

You know,

retail

buying

your milk,

and Tescos

and other

name

brands was

going like

that, but

we were

persuading

people to

get their

milk

delivered,

and that

was very

difficult,

but I

remember

my very

first day

in a phone

based

role,

literally

given a

phone book

by a

former

mechanic

who turned

sales

manager,

and I

remember

that first

dial that

I made,

and

literally,

I was

shaking,

right? And

when that

person

picked up

the phone,

I hung up,

I didn't

even

speak. I

could not

speak. I

was so

nervous,

and that

lasted for

like, a

week. And

so it's

actually

interesting

when I

look at

new SDRs

or sales

people

starting

now that

crack on,

and I

think

you've got

no idea

how scared

I was and

how crap I

was in

those

first few

weeks of

phone

based

sales. And

normally

Mark Ackers: asked

like, what

point of

your

career

rushes to

the front

of your

mind? But

it feels

that's the

moment

that sort

of lives

rent free

in your

head, so

James Ski: to

speak,

completely.

I mean, I

was so

nervous,

so afraid,

was

getting,

you know,

tongue

tied on

all the

conversations.

Didn't

know how

to respond

to people,

didn't

know what

to say

back,

didn't

know how

overcome

objections.

It was a

car crash.

Why didn't

you just

quit? I

was very

motivated

to be in

sales and

business

for a very

young age.

I always

had, I

harbored

ambition

to run my

own

company or

companies,

and I'd

read a lot

biographies,

a lot of

self help

books, a

lot of get

rich

books, and

every

single one

of those

books

pretty

much said,

you know,

if you

want to be

successful

business,

you need

to be

great at

sales. So

I wasn't

going to

let you

know the

anxiety or

the pain

of those

initial

weeks on

the phone

stopped me

from

pursuing

what I was

setting

out to

pursue.

And also

background.

I have a

sporting

background.

I was a

high

performance

rowing

athlete,

and you

don't

quit, you

navigate

overcome

challenges,

and you

improve

every

single

day, and

you become

the best

version of

yourself.

And so

even if

you're

crap

today,

like if

you put in

the work

and you

learn, you

iterate,

you can

become

great.

Mark Ackers: Can

I share

why I'm so

excited to

have you

as a guest

today? Go

on. You've

been in

sales for

a long

time.

You've

been

there.

You've

done it.

You've got

your hands

dirty.

You've got

experience

of selling

by the

nature of

your

career.

You've met

ridiculous

amount of

sales

professionals

and and

leaders.

You'd have

heard the

horror

stories.

You'd have

seen the

big

success

stories.

You built

sales

community

that was

thriving,

and then

got hit by

COVID, and

then

you've

come out

the other

side of

it, and

you fly

the flag,

as I said

in the

intro for

mental

health,

you also

make me

laugh a

lot,

right?

Like the

quick fire

round was

hilarious.

And in

this

episode,

what I

really

want to do

is get to

know how

you manage

those

situations,

the

stories

that

you've

learned

stresses

that come

with a

role. And

I think

anyone

that's

listening

to this

podcast

now, like

just has

to stick

around,

because I

know this

is gonna

be a good

episode

that is

gonna be

filled

with like,

highs and

lows.

Let's

start with

a bang,

right?

Let's hear

some of

your

biggest

howlers.

First of

all, if

you just

remember

being a

quota

carrier at

LinkedIn,

there must

be a

Howler

there.

That's

worth

sharing.

That's

funny.

Hello. I'm

Mark the

host of

the I used

to be crap

at sales

podcast.

Thank you

for

listening.

We called

the

podcast

that

because

it's true

and all of

our guests

say the

same. As a

sales

leader,

you would

have been

crap at

sales

once, no

doubt, but

that

changed,

and now

you're

responsible

for a

team. It's

your job

to help

that team

get to

where you

need to

get them

to, but

also it's

your job

to develop

and grow

them as

sales

professionals.

Here's the

problem,

you don't

have the

time. You

are too

busy with

other

competing

priorities,

and I get

it, but

that

doesn't

mean your

sales team

should

miss out.

It doesn't

mean they

shouldn't

fulfill

that

potential

and grow

that's

where we

come in.

If you'd

be curious

to hear

about how

we're

working

with

organizations

providing

their team

with

expert

coaching

on a one

to one

basis, get

in touch.

Be happy

to have a

conversation.

Well,

James Ski: there's

a couple

interesting

anecdotes

from my

time at

LinkedIn,

so not

many

people

know it,

and it's

actually

the one of

the few

things

that is

not listed

on my

profile.

But prior

LinkedIn,

I worked

at a SaaS

company

called

huddle,

which was

a very

well known

British

enterprise

collaboration

platform.

It's kind

of a

competitor

to Box or

Dropbox.

They

became the

success

stories,

and huddle

did not

but it was

a great

environment.

I actually

set up a

company

after I

read Aaron

Ross' book

Predictable

Revenue

called

outbound

sales

limited.

That was

my very

first

business.

Started

consulting

companies,

and it

didn't go

well. I

ended up

hospital,

had a

breakdown,

and then I

joined

LinkedIn.

And so

fortunately,

is one of

the best

companies

in the

world, and

I was

depressed

when I

joined

LinkedIn,

and no one

knew this

at the

time, but

I was so

depressed

that when

I was

getting

introduced

to people,

I was

walking

around

offices,

it was

open floor

plan each

day. You

could sit

wherever

you

wanted, so

everybody

would mix

it. I was

uncomfortable

with that,

because I

had such

high

anxiety. I

was so

depressed

that I

would

literally

hide

myself

away from

people. So

I couldn't

handle the

interaction.

So there

was this

real

struggle

for me for

about six

months.

And one of

the funny

moments of

that and,

you know,

people

really

don't talk

about this

in sales,

but I

remember

literally

leaving

the office

one day,

calling my

dad, and

then I

called my

mom, and

this is

how it

went. I

called my

dad, I

said, Dad,

I don't

think I

can handle

this

company,

LinkedIn.

It's too

difficult.

I don't

know what

I'm doing.

It's not

working.

And His

attitude

was, like,

you know,

if you're

not adding

value, you

need to go

some Okay,

fine, dad,

you know,

I called

my mom, I

said, Mom,

like, you

know, I

really

don't

think I

can do the

job. And

she's

like,

well, if

you quit,

how you

gonna pay

the bills,

you know?

So I had

these two

versions

stories,

and

luckily, I

didn't

take any

of their

advice, or

I didn't

quit, at

least

anyway. So

that was

like some,

some kind

of the

pain side

that I

experienced.

The other

thing was

this

social

selling

index,

right? I I

made it my

goal to

become the

number one

LinkedIn,

globally.

And this

is also

annoys me

slightly,

because

this is an

ego

talking

thing now,

but no one

really

talks

about

this,

about me,

like I was

literally

the number

one on the

planet at

one point,

and I set

myself

this goal

to become

number

one. And I

started,

like in in

the

hundreds,

and I'm up

against

all people

that are

in sales

LinkedIn.

There's

like, 3000

people.

And once I

started to

get into

the top

50, I

started to

call round

the other

people in

the top

50. So

like, I

would call

the Dutch

guy or the

American

guy say,

Hey, my

name is

James key.

I'm based

in London.

I want to

get a

score of

97 out of

100 How

did you

get to 90

out of 100

they're

like, Oh,

I've done

this. Done

this and

this. So I

used to

hack away,

and

eventually

I cracked

the top

10. And

anyway,

when you

get into

the top

10, it's

intense,

because

you're on

all day,

every day,

posting

content,

trying to

figure out

the

algorithm.

So a

couple of

things I

did. I

found out

that some

of the top

10 were no

longer at

LinkedIn,

so I

called the

administrator,

and I

said,

Listen,

those two

people

don't work

anymore,

so can you

remove

them? That

bumped me

a couple

of places,

right? So

that was

quite a

funny one.

And then

we got

into,

like, the

top five

at this

point. And

I called

all of

them, and

I said,

Listen,

I'm coming

for you,

like, I'm

coming for

number one

spot, so

you need

to move

aside. Let

me know

what's

going on.

Some of

them, you

know, took

it in

jazz. Some

of them

were like,

No, that's

not going

to happen.

Basically,

completely

figured

out how to

crack the

code. I

even tried

to call

the

product

team in

the valley

to find

out what

the

algorithm

was to get

100. And

basically

someone

told me,

and don't

you, Ryan,

I don't

know how

close they

were, but

basically

someone in

product

says you

cannot get

100 out

100 we

just don't

allow it,

so don't

bother. So

I kind of

took that,

and then

eventually

I became

number

one. And

honestly,

it was

winning an

Olympic

gold

medal. I

was so

high,

literally,

I was

buzzing.

And we

used to

have

scooters

in the

London

office, so

I jumped

on the

scooters

and

started,

like,

going

around

everyone

telling

them I'd

made the

number one

spot. No

one gave a

shit. No

one cared,

literally,

no one in

my team,

no one in

London.

They had

interest

in it. I

emailed

the CEO of

to tell

him that

I'd become

number

one. Jeff

Weiner,

didn't get

response.

I emailed

all the

executives.

I got a

few like

responses

from them.

But I

think what

was, what,

what's the

takeaway

from that?

One, you

know,

achievement

and

success is

really in

the eye of

the

beholder,

and it's

what is,

what

matters to

you, and

that

mattered

to me, and

it was

important

to me, and

I achieved

that goal,

and I got

personal

satisfaction.

But the

other big

lesson is,

no one

cares

about your

success,

no one,

not your

parents,

not your

wife, not

your kids,

no one.

You really

have to

define

your own

success

pathways.

Because

when I got

that goal

and I was

promoting

it, it

didn't

matter to

anyone.

And then

the other

thing is,

I got so

hyper, and

I'm

bipolar,

so it

really

didn't

help that

that year,

you know,

I was so

buzzing of

getting

number

one, I had

like, a

hyper

manic

episode,

ended up

hospital.

That was

actually

the year

it was

2016 that

I first

came to

more Perth

outside

Newcastle.

So it's

kind of

ironic

that we're

talking

about it,

because I

was so

happy, so

buzzed off

the back

of it, and

then it

led to

kind of

other

behaviors

that you

know,

added a

bit of a

meltdown.

So, you

know, it's

a bit of a

long

story, but

a couple

experiences

that I

went

through at

LinkedIn,

it's

Mark Ackers: an

incredible

story for

many

reasons,

right?

Like the

determination,

the ways

in which

you seeked

to get to

the next

level. And

I think

I'm always

sad for

you, like

you say

you didn't

get that

recognition

that you

wanted,

but I also

am pleased

for you,

because it

meant more

to you,

and that

feels like

that's

what

mattered.

Why that

out of

everything

you could

achieve?

Why was

that the

thing that

you sort

of become

obsessed

with? You

James Ski: know,

I grew up

in a an

environment

at my

school.

School. I

grew up in

Windsor. I

went to a

school

called the

Windsor

Boys

School,

and

they're a

top

performing

rowing

school.

And you

know, the

philosophy

there is

that you

train to

become

number

one, you

become the

best of

the best.

And so it

instilled

in me to

want to be

number one

in any

work

environment

or in

business.

In life,

I'm

actually

much more

chilled

now. I

don't

really

need to be

number

one. I'm

comfortable,

you know,

sitting in

the ranks

whatever.

But back

then, and

when I was

in my

early

stages of

my career,

when I was

LinkedIn,

being

number one

was

important.

It wasn't

easy to

become

number one

global

Biller,

you know,

like, and

doing 10s

millions

of dollar

deals,

there were

some mega

stars at

LinkedIn,

so it kind

of felt

like a way

that I

could get

recognition.

I think

there's a

part of me

that likes

to be

obviously

recognized

for

something.

That's an

ego thing.

I like to

noticed. I

like to be

seen. I

attention.

And it

just felt

like that

was the

way that I

could show

people

that I'd

overcome

challenge

and I can

achieve

something.

Do you

know why

it's

actually

it's hit

me now, I

think,

having

joined

that

company in

this

depressive

episode,

and no one

knowing

about it,

eventually

came out

and told

people at

that I had

this

bipolar

disorder

and I'd

been in

hospital.

And

were

amazingly

supportive,

amazingly

supportive.

And I can

just think

back to my

managers

and HR and

people

there a

lot of the

time, the

self

stigma

that you

have

around

mental

health, my

kind of

body armor

is like,

you know,

what? I

might have

a mental

illness,

but if I'm

number

one, you

can't

challenge

me. So I

think

there's a

lot of

like, you

know, a

part of me

that feels

upset that

I have to

live with

this

illness,

but if I'm

number

one, or

I'm

recognized,

or people

know who I

am for

being

great at

something,

then then

they look

past the

bipolar

part and

think, Oh,

he's fine.

He's a

good guy,

and he's

top of

what he

does. So I

think I

have this

constant,

like,

motivation

outperform

other

peoples

and show

myself as

successful

person.

Because I

guess a

part of me

doesn't

feel like

that, you

know, like

feels like

I'm

different,

and feels

like I

have this,

you know,

illness,

that means

that I've

caused my

family and

my kids

and other

people

challenges,

and no one

really

knows that

other than

me. You

know

what's

happened?

And yes, I

do talk

about it

publicly,

but I

think, you

know, it's

a, it's a

good way

to kind of

protect

myself, to

say, Yeah,

I'm

bipolar.

But by the

way, I'm

the best

at what I

do. So,

you know,

don't dig

me out for

being

bipolar.

Or, you

know, if

you look

at media,

and you

look at

TV, and

you look

at film,

and you

see some

of these

bipolar

characters,

and it's

extreme,

and so

when

people

hear I'm

bipolar,

they

immediately

say, well,

he's

probably

like that

guy, or he

must be

like my

uncle, or

on me. It

doesn't

matter.

We're all

individual,

you know,

like, it

doesn't

matter who

you are,

what your

background

is, we're

all

individuals.

And, you

know,

that's

just

probably

something

that's

driven me.

There's

lots to

break down

there.

Mark Ackers: First

of all,

just

applaud

the

honesty. I

think the

thing that

I'm sort

of picking

out from

that, like

the

themes,

is, is

that need

for

approval,

is that

feeling

like you

have

something

to prove,

and it

feels like

you've had

that as

far back

as you can

remember,

um, but

also you

said

you're far

chilled

now it

doesn't

affect you

as much.

What's

changed?

Well,

James Ski: I'm

37 now,

you know,

last time

I was in

hospital

was four

years ago,

COVID

happened.

I think

that

impacted a

lot of

people,

quite a

few things

I wanted

to achieve

when I was

a teenager

or in my

20s. And I

feel like

I've had a

pretty

good life.

And I

think I've

also

achieved,

sorry,

I've also

not

achieved a

lot of

things,

and I've

realized

that that

doesn't

matter

either.

And, you

know,

getting

your

number,

you know,

for the

year, is

nice, but

it doesn't

matter.

You know,

getting

that next

car is

nice, but

it doesn't

matter.

Like, I

think I'm

just, I

just value

people,

relationships,

experiences,

children,

you know,

health

much more.

Whereas I

think I

came from

a very

black and

white

mindset

that it

was

winning or

nothing,

or it was

hitting

120% of

target or

nothing,

or it was

earning

100k a

year, or I

wasn't

good

enough,

and I'm

just not

like that

anymore.

Like, do I

believe in

my head

that I'm

going to

continue

to grow,

develop,

extremely

successful,

and, you

know,

achieve my

dreams? I

do, but if

I don't,

it's not

going to

bother me.

Do you

believe

that it

won't

bother

you? No,

honestly.

I mean,

like, in

the sense

that,

like, I'll

be fine,

like, I'm

not going

to be

depressed,

right? If,

is what I

mean. You

know,

let's say

I don't

know which

is one of

my goals,

you know,

one of my

goals is

to get

sales

confidence

to its

first

million,

and then I

want to

get it to

5 million,

and I want

to get to

10. It

would

bother me

that if I

can't do

that, but

I'll just

move on,

like, I'll

something

else.

Mark Ackers: Do

you think

your. It

in you to

know when

enough is

enough. I

James Ski: do

think now

I do

again. I

wouldn't

if you

asked me

that

question

five years

ago. No, I

was

clueless.

I didn't

really

know, you

know, it

was all

like,

anything's

possible.

There's no

limit on

anything.

Just keep

going more

more more.

I really

don't feel

like that.

I honestly

do a lot

of this

for fun.

Like, I

working

hard, I

achieving.

I like

making

money. I

sales. I

closing

deals. You

know, as

long as I

can

sustain my

family and

my some of

personal

ambitions,

like, it's

a game,

really,

isn't it?

Like, it's

just a

score

card, you

know, a

million of

this or 10

million of

that, what

does it

really

mean?

Like, it

doesn't

mean

anything.

So I just

think,

like, it's

just, it's

part of

the game.

And like,

yeah, I

would like

to be able

to, you

know, add

that onto

LinkedIn,

CV,

whatever.

But if I

don't, I

don't feel

any I

don't

think I'm

a bad

person or

worse, or

didn't

achieve

anything,

I'm just

trying my

best. Is

Mark Ackers: that,

because

you've

realized

no one

else

cares.

James Ski: That's

the bottom

line. You

know, it

no one

does care.

And it's

really,

you know,

quite

harsh, but

it doesn't

so what

matters to

me,

therefore,

is all

those

things I

just said,

and, and,

you know,

from a

point in

time, you

know, the

money

matters,

and then

it doesn't

matter,

like, you

just move

on, like I

said, it's

a game,

it's the

levels.

It's like,

I don't

know what

games you

played

growing

up, I used

to play

like Tomb

Raider, or

like Grand

Theft

Auto, or

the these

strategic

games

where you

had to get

to the

level.

Once you

complete a

game, you

just move

on to the

next game.

And if you

don't, you

just quit

or you do

something

different.

Like, it's

just, I

don't

know, it's

just like

fluidity

of life,

isn't it?

It just

everything

moves on.

I think

that is

also quite

sad, isn't

it? You

know, they

always

say, oh,

you know,

when you

lose

someone,

oh, well,

you know,

you've got

to get on

with it. I

think, oh,

that's

bits like,

No, I

don't want

you to get

if I die.

I don't

want you

to get on

with it. I

want you

to, you

know,

grieve me

forever.

But that's

not

reality.

You just

got to get

on with

it. So I

think

that's

probably

philosophy

nowadays

Mark Ackers: when

you talk

about

forever,

and that,

I think

forever,

for most

people, is

like 100

years. I

think when

you think

about,

like deep

time,

James Ski: billion

years,

whatever,

there is

no end.

There's no

end, this

is it.

Mark Ackers: There'll

be a point

in time

where your

name is

never said

again. You

never

thought of

again. I

can tell

where your

face, I

feel like

that's

bothering

you a

little

bit, and I

can see

why it's

getting

comfortable,

that isn't

it. And I

think

realizing

that no

one else

cares,

it's about

what you

want to

achieve

and making

the most

of the

friendships

you've

got.

Obviously,

your

children,

your

family up

to see

your dad

this

weekend.

It's about

making the

most of

now and

getting

too

wrapped up

in the

game. So

you gotta

be able to

put the

game down.

And, and

that's

James Ski: another

thing I

used to

be. I

mean, even

jokes, I

think, in

the Quick

Fire,

like, you

know,

what's my

alternative

to what I

used to

be, that

guy that

would work

seven days

a week,

right? And

I really

didn't

have a

purpose

outside of

that. And

I would

always

say, I

enjoy it

and, and I

did, like,

I didn't

bother me,

and it got

accelerated

my career

and my

earnings

and stuff

like that.

But there

is more to

business

and life

and

success,

you know,

I do it.

For me, it

all

integrates,

you know,

like,

today's

been fun,

it's been

business,

it's been

friendship,

and then

I'll see

my dad

later and

his wife

like so

for me,

that's the

freedom of

being a

business

owner. Is

that you

can choose

where you

want to

be, where

you want

to go, who

you want

interact

with, and

I think

that is

like a

real

that's

priceless.

That's

like that

priceless

experience.

But what I

definitely

have

realized,

especially

spending

time in

mental

health

hospitals,

is that it

really

doesn't

matter if

you're

wearing

Hugo Boss,

or you

know

you've got

a petite

Philippe

watch or,

you know,

you're at

the Monaco

Grand

Prix, or

you're

watching

the TV the

Grand Prix

on Monaco.

So, like,

one of my

life goals

was to go

to Monaco.

I've been.

It is

incredible.

I want to

go again.

But

actually,

you can

watch the

whole of

Monaco at

home, and

most

people

have got

access to

a TV, or

can find a

TV. So,

you know,

really,

it's just

finding a

way to

enjoy life

experiences,

isn't it,

but you

have to

choose

those life

experiences,

and you

have to

decide

what

matters to

you,

because

again,

what you

do, what

you

experience,

doesn't

matter to

anyone

else.

Mark Ackers: So

I really

enjoyed

that sort

of passage

conversation.

We just

had feel

like we

didn't get

the

Howler.

Let's talk

about,

look, you

run events

business,

right?

That must

just come

with so

many

opportunities

to muck up

right

events.

Tell us a

couple of

stories.

Well,

there

James Ski: is

one, and

you, you

were

there. So

the very

first SAS

growth

conference

we did at

the

Olympic

Park, I

didn't

think

you'd tell

this

story.

This is

really

funny.

I've got

to and the

stress of

putting on

an event

is insane.

There are

so many

moving

parts, the

speakers,

the

attendees,

the

sponsors,

the venue,

the food,

the

logistics,

it is an

incredible

amount to

manage.

And you

know, at.

This

particular

event, we

had an AV

set up,

managing

the the

site and

the

presentations

for the

speakers,

and just

as I was

walking on

stage to

open up

the event,

everyone

in the

audience

started

laughing

hysterically,

and I

didn't

know why,

but what I

didn't

realize is

that the

AV guy's

laptop

that was

connected

to the big

screen,

his Porn

was coming

up on the

screen

behind me.

And so

someone

points it

out to me

on the

stage. I

get

flustered.

Everyone

start, I'm

like, It's

not me.

And

everyone's

like, of

course,

it's your

porn. And,

you know,

so that

completely

broke the

ice for

that, that

event, and

that was,

you know,

it turned

out to be

very

funny, and

that was

quite an

interesting

moment.

You know,

I've had

events

where, you

know,

speakers

have not

turned up,

like I've

had events

where the

very, very

first

sales

confidence

event was

supposed

to be

held. And

I've got a

bug bear

at this.

So I'm

going to

say it was

supposed

to be held

office in

London.

While I

was still

working at

for

various

reasons,

politically,

24 hours

before the

event, I

was told

that I

wasn't

allowed to

go ahead,

and I had

100 people

coming,

and I had

no venue,

so I had

to call

round and

hustle,

and I

found a

venue down

the road.

So I had

to inform

everybody

that was

coming to

the

HQ in

London to

go London

to go to

this other

venue.

Anyway, we

got to

that

venue. And

the reason

why it was

available

24 hours,

with 24

hours

notice, is

there was

pneumatic

drilling

going

outside.

So if you

watch the

very first

sales,

confidence

events

event on

YouTube,

all you

hear is

drilling

over the

speakers,

you know.

So I've

had

examples

of really

bad food.

Take the

COVID. I

put 25,000

pounds

deposit on

person

venue.

COVID hit

I lost my

deposit.

You know,

there is

been

absolute

hell at

times. And

you know,

people

come in

like, I

don't

know, or

late, or

they on

the day,

like, Oh,

can I sort

out my

mate? And

I don't

realize I

have 1000

things to

do, and

they turn

up, and it

all looks

great.

And, you

know, the

experience

is great.

And, you

know,

genuine, I

have been

fortunate.

I think I

was

talking

about this

with

someone

today,

actually,

on the

call. I

really

care about

people and

people

having a

great

experience,

and I

think that

is what

resonates

and why

people

have

enjoyed

the events

over the

years.

Because,

you know,

they get

to know

me. I like

to have,

you know,

good time.

I have a

lot of

bands, a

few jibes

on stage,

but

ultimately,

I do want

you to

feel great

about

being in

that

environment.

But you

know, a

lot of

things

have to be

in place

to make

that

experience

good.

Mark Ackers: I

can

imagine.

And I

mean,

obviously

some some

horror

stories

there, but

it feels

like,

understandably,

we can

look back

and laugh

now, but

yeah, I

remember

you

walking up

on stage,

and I

remember

you

saying,

it's not

mine, it's

friends.

This

pornography

coming up

on the

screen.

And what I

remember

more than

anything

else, is

several

hours

later,

we're in

that bar

four

quarters,

and I

can't

remember

who

started

the chant.

Wasn't me

guilty of

just James

ski, his

mate likes

porno.

Just

everybody's

singing.

James ski,

his mate

likes

Paulo.

James Ski: Do

you

remember

all the

champagne

left over

and we

ended up

spraying

outside,

like that

was so

funny that

night.

Yeah,

Mark Ackers: that

was

honestly,

such a

good

event,

such a

good

night. And

you're

right,

like, that

was

obviously

a horror

story,

really,

but you

know, it's

not, it

broke the

ice. It

was really

funny. It

was really

memorable,

and you've

got what's

really

important,

a funny

story for

life out

of it,

like you

stood at

the event

with

however

many

hundreds

of people

porn spa

in the

background,

and you're

trying to

say it's

not yours.

Everyone

thinks it

is. Most

organizations

equip

their

sellers

with all

the

technology

they need

to be

successful.

Technology

that

trebles

the amount

of emails

they can

send,

quadruples

the amount

of dials

they can

make,

technology

that

enables

you to see

accounts

that you

should

prospect

into,

phone

numbers at

your

fingertips.

Technology

to make a

sales rep

efficient

with their

time.

Here's the

missing

piece,

actually

making

your

sellers

better at

selling

better at

their

profession.

That's the

missing

piece. All

this

technology

is really

helpful in

speeding a

wrap up,

but none

of it

actually

helps the

seller get

better at

their

profession.

That's

what my

sales

coach

does. We

work with

the

individuals

in your

team and

you as

their

leader to

help them

become the

best

versions

themselves.

We have

coaches

that work

with

sellers

tactically,

from

outbounding,

Discovery

calls,

demos,

negotiation,

closing,

you name

it, and

mentally

impostor

syndrome,

anxiety,

stress and

weight of

targets.

Our

coaches

have been

there and

done it

and had

success in

those

roles,

obviously

by now.

Get your

sales

confidence.

You have

met so

many sales

leaders

and pros.

Um, there

must have

been a

number of

times and

you talk

about

people

just

messaging

you and

asking for

help, etc.

But there

must be a

number of

times that

people

come to

you with

problems

and

situations

that they

need help

with. Take

me through

some of

the like

the

memorable

things

that sales

leaders

have come

to you

with

problems

and

needing

help,

yeah.

James Ski: I

mean, it's

been

interesting.

I think,

you know,

reputationally

And

arguably,

you know,

I'm

probably

one of the

most

connected

to sales

leaders in

the UK.

And I

think in

recent

years,

particularly

after the

tech boom,

post

COVID. You

know, when

every

digitalization

got

accelerated,

everything

in SaaS

was

booming.

You know,

sales

leaders

were

winning.

Was great.

And then

obviously

we had the

crash and

the

redundancies

and the

cuts and,

you know,

the drive

from VCs

efficiency

and

profit.

Hello,

like, you

know,

business

has got to

profitable.

And

really,

you know,

a lot of

VPs and

sales

leaders

lost their

jobs. A

lot of

people

considered

fractional

and

flexible

working.

There's a

lot more

of that

now

available.

But you

know, when

you've got

high

outgoings

and you're

used to

high

income,

you need

to find

your way.

So I think

you know,

particularly

the last

1218,

months, a

lot of

sales

leaders

have

reached

out. You

know,

they've

not been

in work

for six

months,

and it's

really

getting to

them, and

they lose

their

confidence,

you know,

they're

struggling

understand

how

they're

not

valuable

someone.

Their

imposter

syndrome

starts to

increase,

and they

think,

well,

maybe I'm

not right

for this.

Maybe

sales

isn't a

career for

me, and

I've

noticed a

lot of

that in

2024 and

the back

end of

particularly.

And so for

me, I

would like

to think

of myself

as like a

confidence

boosting

mirror. If

you talk

to me,

you've got

a problem,

or you

don't

think

you're

doing well

right now,

you're not

good

enough. I

just want

to point

out all

the great

things

about you,

to remind

you that

you're

fantastic

at what

you do,

you're

going to

successful.

You will

figure it

out, and

you will

get there.

I'll give

you a

prime

example.

Like, you

know,

we're

doing

this. We

offer at

sales

confidence

2.0 I'm

kind of

coining it

right now.

We help

companies

hire

salespeople,

and we

help

salespeople

get jobs.

And I had

a guy on

assessment

day the

other day

for

graduates.

He was for

looking

for an SDR

role. He

was 35 and

he wanted

an SDR

role. And

afterwards,

I said,

Listen, we

need to

talk like,

what's

your

situation?

Give me

the

background.

And he

gave me

the

background.

He had

some

challenges,

life,

family,

business.

And he

said, You

know, I

transitioned.

I've kept

doing

these SDR

roles.

Every time

I've got

an SDR

job, they

keep

telling

me, I'm

gonna

become an

AE. I've

led teams

in the

past, but

it's not

happening.

I said, So

what are

you

applying

for right

now? I

said, I'm

applying

for more

SDR jobs.

I said,

No, you're

an AE. In

fact,

you're a

leader.

But you

know, if

you're not

quite

comfortable

and ready

to go back

leadership,

like,

focus on

an age of

and he's

like, God,

you're so

right.

What am I

doing? And

sometimes

just, you

know,

people

need that

little

confidence

boost or

little bit

of a

reminder

that

you're

good. And

I have

experienced

it where I

just,

especially

when I'm

depressed,

like, I

just

forget

what I've

achieved

and what

I've what

I'm good

at. And,

you know,

you

wallow,

don't you,

and you

just then

stop

putting

yourself

out there.

So yeah,

that's,

that's

kind of

anecdotally,

some of

the things

I've seen

in the

last 1218,

months.

Mark Ackers: And

it's nice

that you

take the

time to

help

people, if

I may.

Maybe it

comes from

a place of

that's the

help you

wanted to

have early

on in your

career.

Completely.

What about

yourself

now,

though,

like,

obviously,

you're a

founder of

your own

business?

Well,

mobile

business.

We go back

to that

intro that

was bloody

hard work

to get

through.

Yeah. Who

do you

turn to?

Obviously,

mentioned

Simon

Squibb,

but I'm

guessing

he's not

someone

you

couldn't

contact.

Regular,

sure.

Yeah. So

who, who

do you

turn to

for help?

Because

it's quite

a lonely

place

being a

founder.

Yeah,

James Ski: it

is. It's

interesting

one. Do

you know

what I've

struggled

with that?

I actually

have a

list of I

call it my

dream 20.

It's a

list of

what I

consider

the most

interesting,

successful

entrepreneurs

on the

planet.

I've

actually

met half

of them,

pretty

cool.

Like, you

know, I've

got photos

with them,

and I've

interacted

with them,

and I want

eventually

meet all

of them,

and I go

on their

courses, I

read their

books.

Like, it's

a good

question.

I mean, to

be honest,

I have to

well admit

I'll call

out. I'll

call out.

You know,

your co

founder,

Kevin,

like he,

over the

years, has

been

someone it

doesn't

matter if

I'm doing

well or

I'm not, I

can just

chat to

him and he

he will

just hear

me out.

And so I

think I've

built out

a group of

people

who, at

any time,

I can just

call them,

and it

doesn't

matter if

it's good,

it doesn't

matter if

it's bad,

they're

just

giving me

that time.

So I think

I've built

like I

wouldn't

say it's

one

particular

person. I

would say

it's a

group of

individuals

who know

me, know

history,

know my

challenges,

with my.

Mental

Health.

And, you

know, it's

really

nice,

actually.

They're

just happy

to hear me

out and

just happy

to say,

well, you

know, take

your time,

think it

over. And

so, yeah,

it's a

group of

individuals

that I've

got to

know over

the years

who I'm

comfortable

sharing my

challenges

with, as

well as

some very

mates that

I'm happy

to talk

to. So

let's talk

Mark Ackers: about

this list.

You say

you got 20

people on

there.

This feels

another

social

selling

index

thing,

where for

you, you

want to

achieve

it. You

want to

take it

all off.

You've met

half.

Who's if I

said that

you can

only meet

one more

person on

that list.

Who is it?

It's

James Ski: Jamie

Foxx. So

he's an

actor,

rapper,

musician

in the US,

and he his

story is,

he talks

about, I

think it

was la

that he

moved to,

and the

way he

ended up

getting

on, like

Kanye West

albums and

certain

collaborations,

basically

used to

throw

parties.

So he

became the

party guy.

obviously,

being the

party guy.

Everyone

wanted to

go to his

party. And

when he

was at the

party, or

he would

host the

party, had

a studio

like this

in his

house, and

he'd say

to Kanye

West and

other

people,

Hey, do

you want

to, do you

want to

drop some

beats? Do

you want

some raps?

And they

would come

into his

studio,

and then

he would

gift them

some lyric

or gift

them some

track that

he's built

on. So I

just think

he is

like, this

is nothing

to do with

sales,

really, or

nothing. I

mean, he's

a very

successful

businessman

as well,

but I just

like his

approach

to how

he's built

his life.

And when

you read

about it,

like it is

really

about

being the

host. And

I've done

that with

sales

confidence.

I've been

the host.

So people

have come

to me.

Come to

your

house.

Yeah,

people

come to my

house.

Now, I

want

people to

come

there,

their

stories,

their

challenges,

connect me

opportunity,

feel

welcome,

so that I

can build

that

network.

So I think

it would

just be,

he is

probably

celebrity

crush,

like in

that

world, and

I find him

hilarious.

I think

he's super

switched

on it. I

think he's

quite a

good actor

as well.

But yeah,

I think

just the

way he's,

you know,

created

his brand,

and how

he's built

his

lifestyle

and

business,

I really

like so

Mark Ackers: what

a great

answer.

Obviously,

I was

expected

to be

someone. I

say, well,

let's give

a shout

out. Let's

tag him.

You never

know. But

obviously,

that's,

that's

quite

different.

Jamie Fox,

I've got

one

similar,

you know,

um Arnold

Schwarzenegger,

James Ski: good

show.

Mark Ackers: Do

you know

what I

mean?

Conquered

bodybuilding,

it's been

the army.

Conquered

movies,

conquered

politics.

His book,

the best

autobiography

title

ever,

yeah, best

autobiography

title.

Total

Recall.

What a

great

title. I

James Ski: just

think, you

know, he

is such a

great

example of

discipline

are 100%

and also,

if you

have a

goal, go

and get it

and you

can

achieve

it. Like,

actually,

my hair's

going on.

And just

thinking

of what

he's

achieved

in his

lifetime,

you know,

I'm sure

if he

really

wanted, he

could have

become

president,

like, you

know,

without a

doubt,

right? You

know, even

his wife,

I can't

remember

the exact

story, but

he married

into a

political

family,

you know,

I don't

think he's

with her

anymore,

but, you

know, like

it is, it

is, like,

how you

make

choices,

how you

navigate

life, like

it is all

possible,

right, if

you put

yourself

in the

right

places,

you know.

So he's a

great song

and, you

know, and

people are

gonna, you

know,

probably

switch off

at this

point. But

I actually

rate

Donald

Trump for

what he's

able to

achieve,

like like

him,

loathe

him, hate

him. You

know that

is a guy

that sets

his mind

something

and

literally

goes for

it.

Regardless

Mark Ackers: what

you think

of him, he

has

captivated

enough

people to

vote him

into the

White

House, and

he's going

to do it

again. So

yeah,

regardless

what you

think of

him, what

he's

achieved

is that

branding.

But with

Arnold

Torsten,

it's kind

of just

remind me

what you

said.

Like, if

you think

about the

levels in

the games,

complete

the army,

put it

down.

Completed

body

building

put it

down.

Completed

movies put

it down.

Politics

put it

down. You

know, just

like that,

constantly

reinvent

himself

and going

after

after new

things.

It's all

about

people

inspire

us. So at

your

events,

you always

have,

like,

three,

four

speakers.

How many

events you

reckon you

run? I

mean,

yeah,

hundreds.

A lot.

We're

talking

like close

to 1000

speakers.

I've spoke

up,

certainly

one of

yours.

Like, five

years ago,

the cold

calling

one, yes,

I think I

did a

second

one,

didn't I?

Yeah, I

spoke the

STR survey

recently,

yeah, six

months

ago. So I

spoke a

couple of

yours. But

when you

look back,

and this

is hard,

because

you've

obviously

had like

speakers

who

inspired

you the

most, Oh,

wow.

James Ski: There's

been some

amazing

stories,

you know,

that I've

heard over

the years,

and often

the most

inspiring

ones have

been SDRs.

I've loved

seeing

SDRs get

up on

stage, you

know,

limited

experience,

but loads

of energy,

you know.

So there's

a guy

called

James Hall

that runs

snowflake.

He had to

have his

leg

amputated

because he

got cancer

Christ.

And you

know, he I

actually

worked

with him

at huddle

back in

the day.

And he. Is

phenomenally

grounded,

successful,

repeatably

successful

sales

leader.

And like,

I think

his talk

about the

snowflake

journey, I

think he

said,

Don't

quote me

on this.

It would

be on

YouTube.

But I

think he

said,

like, his

ARR target

for a mere

for

snowflake

was 1

billion, a

billion

dollars.

Like, you

know, it

is insane,

like,

those

numbers.

So, like,

his story

was

pretty,

pretty

incredible.

But you

know what

Shelly

Lavery,

she, yeah,

she's the

co founder

of Jiminy.

I think

she was a

drama

school

girl or an

actress,

but she

did a

really

good

performance

about,

like, you

know, the

importance

confidence

and

believing

yourself

and like

that. That

was a

really

good talk.

Like pre

COVID. I

was there

for that.

Well,

yeah, the

Andes

hotel,

Mark Ackers: yeah,

I really

Shelly.

Shelly,

you should

come on

this

podcast

we're

trying to

sort out,

James Ski: yeah,

definitely

get Shelly

on. She's,

she's

amazing.

Her

husband,

Tom, she

runs Jim.

We need to

go. Really

great

couple.

The third

person. Do

you know

what I've

seen him

today, so

let's give

him a

shout at

Tom,

Boston.

Yeah, so

pre COVID,

he came on

and did a

piece

around

personal

branding

and the

power of

video when

he was

early in

his career

at sales

loft. And

you know

what? I

think Tom

has grown

into his

role. Do

you know

what I

mean, like

he now

just seems

like the

comedian

the

character.

And I

think he's

had that,

I actually

think he's

had to

work on

that, that

I don't

think it's

supernatural

for him

when you

spend time

with him

one to

one. And

so I think

he's a

good

example

of, do you

know he's

put

himself

out there,

consistently

and

continuously,

and ended

building a

phenomenal

brand for

himself.

And you

know, like

he's just

very

funny. So

yeah, he

would be

my third

so, so

those are

my three.

James

Hall,

currently

snowflake,

Shelly,

Lavery,

Jiminy and

thirdly,

Tom

Boston.

Mark Ackers: Great

listing.

Is the key

to being a

good event

speaker.

James Ski: Great

question,

actually,

because a

lot of

people get

it wrong,

being

succinct,

not

pitching

yourself,

throwing

up your

background.

No one

cares if

you're on

my stage

at sales

confidence,

you're

there on

merit.

Trust me,

like I

speak to a

lot of

people

that want

to be on

sales

confidence

stages, I

don't let

people on

there, so

you have

to you are

already

there on

merit. So

just

deliver

value.

Also it's

entertainment.

I think

people

sometimes

forget

that it's

not just

about

getting up

there,

delivering

facts or

achievements

milestones.

It's about

entertaining

audience

that's got

a listen

for you

for seven

minutes,

because

that's the

time we

give

people. So

I think,

you know,

having

that

succinct,

well

structured

talk where

you can

entertain

people,

make them

feel

something.

So I kind

of had

this

framework

of, think,

feel, act,

make the

audience

think

about

something,

make them

feel it,

so they

actually

feel

something,

and then

get them

to go and

act. If

they go

and act on

the advice

or lessons

that

you've

given

them,

you've had

impact on

someone's

life, if

they just

think

about it,

it's

great.

Yeah, you

could do a

good talk.

You

haven't

impacted

them

because

they go

and take

action the

next day

or that

evening

based on

what

you've

said.

You're a

great

speaker,

Mark Ackers: and

without

knowing

whoever

you're

about to

think of,

talk to me

about the

biggest

sort of

car crash

you've

seen on

stage, and

how can it

avoided? I

don't

James Ski: want

to swear,

but very

dry, very

boring.

You know,

had 100

slides.

Was

looking

down for

the whole

talk was

behind the

whatever

the

staging

area was

really

didn't

excite,

didn't

energize,

didn't

engage. It

was pretty

pathetic,

to be

honest.

And I

think it's

disappointing

when

someone

has such a

high

profile

and they

can't get

up and

communicate

in a way

that gets

people to

think,

feel and

act that

Mark Ackers: feels

more like

that's

just who

they are,

though it

doesn't

feel like

they're

saying you

can avoid

James Ski: I

don't

know, it's

a hard

question.

I mean, I

was Nia

was

talking to

me earlier

about, you

know,

traits of

salespeople.

I believe

everybody

can train

to be more

likable. I

do. I

think

there are

just ways

of being,

and I

think you

can

therefore

practice

to be an

entertaining

interesting

speaker or

turn your

story into

something

that you

know

resonates

with

people. I

think it

takes

practice,

and I just

don't

think that

particular

person has

got enough

self

awareness

to realize

that

they're

not very

Mark Ackers: good

at it.

What are

some of

the things

you can do

then to

become

likable.

likeability

James Ski: is

making or

helping

people

feel good

around

you,

right? So

complimenting

someone on

something

they've

just done

for you,

or showing

gratitude

to someone

warms you

to that

other

person,

they feel

good that

you've

done

something

for them.

Well.

Prioritizing

someone's

needs

before you

being

light

hearted.

You know,

not being

serious,

not

getting

down to

business

straight

away. You

know,

being

relaxed

around

someone,

making

someone

feel

comfortable.

The best

analogy

is,

everyone,

I hope,

has got

someone

you know,

when you

go into an

old

person's

home, or,

you know,

your

grands,

and they

offer you

a cup of

tea, and

they chat

about your

day, and

they want

to know

how work

is, and

they just,

there's

like a

softness

to them,

you know,

they're

not hard,

they're

just

loving,

polite and

friendly

and

likable.

So like,

if you can

create

that

warmth

with

people.

People

will think

you're

likable.

Mark Ackers: And

may I just

take this

time say

thank you

for coming

into the

office.

You're

doing a

very good

job. Can I

get you

another

beer

anytime?

Let's talk

about,

like, the

mental

side of

sales. And

you have

spoke

about a

lot

already,

which is,

which is

great. I

love how

open,

honest you

are about

so many

people

would not

share what

you've

shared,

and it's

okay not

to, by the

way,

because

it's a lot

totally,

Oh,

absolutely.

But talk

to me

about

sales. You

know, like

a mental

I've like,

sales is

obviously

taxing.

It's

anxiety

inducing,

it's

pressure

filled,

and even

more so

when you

run your

own

business,

just walk

through,

and it

feels like

you've had

a lot of

experience

in terms

of, like,

education

and help

from

people.

Like, what

do you do

to manage

some of

the

tension

that this

profession

brings to

you?

James Ski: For

personally,

you know,

and a lot

of these

are common

commonalities

or cliche

obvious,

like, you

know,

exercise

is a big

deal for

me. I do

try and

run three,

four times

a week.

And now

back on

the river,

rowing in

a rowing

boat,

which is a

lot of

fun. I go

to the

gym. So

that's

really

important.

Sleep is

absolutely

critical.

Consistency

on sleep

is super,

super

important.

Getting

what you

need, but

just

getting

enough of

it on a

consistent

basis, is

really

important,

also not

being

super

attached

to the

outcome.

If the

discovery

call

doesn't go

well, so

what if

you don't

close the

deal? So

what? Like

you know

your boss

is telling

you need

to get a

deal done

by this

time. If

it doesn't

happen. It

doesn't

happen

like I had

this

thing. I

had my

first son

when I was

only 24

which was

reasonably

young, and

I remember

some of my

managers

used to

email me.

This was

before

slack,

urgent

call me

back, or

urgent you

need to

go. No,

nothing's

urgent in

business,

what's

urgent is

if my the

mother or

children

calls me

and my

son's

injured

and He's

hospital,

that's an

urgent,

that's

emergency,

really, in

business,

there's no

there's

nothing

urgent, if

I'm

honest,

like it's

important

and you

can get to

it, but

it's not

urgent. So

I hate

that kind

of use of

language

around

people.

And I

think, you

know,

it's, it's

not being

attached

to the

outcome.

Yes,

striving

for it.

Yes, put

the work

in. If

you're not

someone

that

doesn't

put the

work in,

that's not

good

enough.

But like,

if it

doesn't

happen, it

doesn't

happen,

like, just

let go,

move on,

move to

the next

one, on to

the next.

So I think

you know

your

mindset

and how

you kind

of, you

know, look

at things,

is really

important,

and you

know what?

actually

is funny

enough for

all the

content I

put out

and the

personal

stuff,

which I

think

people

have

different

versions

of me or

seen

different

versions

of me,

I've read

listened

different

versions

of me. I

actually,

I get very

few people

that are

like, I'm

struggling

in my

number

and, you

know,

because

you've

done the

survey and

we've done

the

reports,

most

salespeople

are not

hitting

their

number,

but I

don't

think

they're

dealing

with it. I

honestly,

I think

there's a

crisis in

sales, if

I have to

say that

out loud

right now,

where

there is

epidemic

salespeople

not

hitting

target,

and they

don't know

what to

do, and

they don't

know who

to turn

to, and

they don't

know how

to talk

about and

so they're

not. It's

just being

ignored

because

most sales

people are

not

hitting

their

targets.

So I don't

know where

they're

going,

because

they're

not coming

to me,

either as

much as I

thought

they

would, or

at least

if they're

coming to

me,

they're

not really

sharing

what's

going on.

So yeah, I

think, you

know,

there's a

lot of

people

trying to

cope with

this

themselves,

and you

know, you

need to do

some of

the things

I've

talked

about.

That's how

I do it.

Also, I

have a

well being

team

around me.

I talk

about this

in my

book, How

To Build

sales

confidence.

So I have

psychologist,

I have a

psychiatrist,

I have a

personal

coach. I

have a

coach. You

know, all

of these

people,

plus some

key family

members

and

friends,

know

what's

going on

in my

world. Can

give me

updates.

Can share

with me

that I

might be

getting

ahead of

myself, or

I don't

seem quite

right, or

I'm

behaving

differently,

and that

just means

that I can

monitor

myself and

stay as

well as

possible.

It feels

Mark Ackers: like

you really

have just

built a

great team

around you

to help

you and.

Most

people

don't have

that

luxury,

like you

say, and

they don't

know who

to talk

to, don't

want to

some

people

probably

don't even

identify

that.

They've

got these

problems.

That's

true. What

are the

warning

signs if

you're an

individual

to look

for? I've

James Ski: never

quite

experienced,

but I

understand

the

concept of

it, you

know,

like, I

think they

call it

Monday

blues, you

know, if

you're

really on

a Sunday,

getting

anxious

about

Monday

morning,

sitting

down in

the sales

meeting or

getting on

the sales

call, and

you are,

you know,

your heart

beats

racing,

you're

stressed,

you're

distracted.

Your

family's

not

getting

their

attention,

or your

partner's

not

getting

your

attention.

Because

you're

stressed

about

Monday

there's a

problem.

You need

to speak

someone.

You need

to a

professional.

So I think

if you're

anxious,

waking up

in the

morning,

going into

work, if

you can't

turn your

laptop

off, you

know,

especially

with so

many

people

that

hybrid now

work from

home, like

they're on

their

laptop

till eight

o'clock,

nine

o'clock at

night, you

don't have

to do

that, but

you feel

like you

need to. I

think

you've got

a problem.

I think if

you are,

you know,

abusing

alcohol,

drugs,

other

things,

you've got

a problem.

If you

are, you

know,

afraid to

be honest

about your

pipeline

to your

manager,

you've got

a problem.

So I think

there's a

there's

number of

things

that you

need to

become

aware of.

And if

you, you

know

experience

that you

you need

to speak

to a

professional,

and then

you need

to start

thinking

about, you

know, are

you in the

right

company?

Have you

got the

right

manager?

Like,

where can

you get a

system?

And this

is why,

you know,

I know

you're

not, it's

not really

the

female,

but this

is why

having a

an outlet

of a coach

critical

because

they're a

third

party.

They're a

person

outside

your

organization

that's not

going to

hold

judgment,

not going

to take it

to HR, not

going to

bring it

up if

you're not

ready to

bring it

up. And

it's

amazing

what can

happen in

those

sessions

where

someone

can just

open up

about

their

challenges

and get

honest

feedback,

direction

and

signposting

to maybe

other

expertise

thoughts

or people

that

Mark Ackers: can

help them.

Where do

you think

you'd be

if you'd

never had

access to

external

support

and

coaches?

James Ski: Probably

be in

hospital,

you know,

like, if

I, if I

didn't

invest in

my well

being

team, if I

didn't

invest in

coaching,

if I

didn't,

you know,

look after

myself.

It's quite

extreme to

say this,

but I

could have

been

institutionalized

into the

point

where I

know,

because

I've met

them,

where you

just don't

leave

hospital,

you're

just in

it. That

is where

you live

like and

that is

scary. And

you know,

I could

have lost

businesses.

I could

have lost

relationships

if I

didn't

invest in

myself.

Because,

you know,

some of my

behaviors

that that

led to my

hospital

admissions

were, you

know, not

healthy.

So, you

know, it

can, it

can cause

a lot of

problems.

And

Mark Ackers: like

you say,

that's why

having

someone

external,

judgment,

safe space

in sales

and

personally,

as well,

completely.

Yeah, you

shared

some of

the things

that you

you do.

How much

exercise

do you

get? A

week

James Ski: physical

exercise,

probably

four or

five

hours.

Mark Ackers: How

much sleep

do you

get?

James Ski: Probably

8989,

Mark Ackers: that's

good.

Yeah,

that's

good for a

man with

three

James Ski: kids.

Oh, well,

I don't

live with

my kids.

You know,

when I've

got them,

it's

probably

less, but

yeah,

generally,

eight,

nine

hours.

Mark Ackers: If

you're a

manager,

what are

the

telltale

signs that

someone in

your team

might be

mentally

struggling?

Avoidance.

James Ski: They're

avoiding

honest

answers or

what's

going on.

They're

not

telling

you about

home life.

They're

not

sharing

what's

happening

outside of

work.

They're

avoidant.

That is a

real

telltale

sign that

someone's

struggling.

I think,

you know,

you have,

I don't

know,

opportunities

to come,

bring

people

together

in the

office,

and you

invite

them over

to hang

out, they

don't

come, you

know.

Lola, I

need to

finish

this. I'm

busy. I'm

busy.

There's

something

going on.

You know,

they're

struggling.

They're

they, they

are not

responsive

as quickly

as your

other team

members on

Slack or

other

things, or

usually

it's a

change. So

someone's

super

responsive

all the

time, and

you've

known them

for six

months and

now

they're

not,

something's

going on,

someone's

typically

slow, but

now

they're

responding

really,

really

quickly

something's

going on.

It's some

kind of

change

that's

happened

where you

need to

stop and

pause,

take

notice,

and you

need to,

you know,

delicately

address it

and bring

it up with

them.

Let's

Mark Ackers: move

on now to

confidence,

which you

know is

something

that you

obviously

spoke

about as

well, and

that has

led to

you.

Hello,

sounds

confidence.

So those

that are

listening

won't see,

but I've

got a copy

of James's

book in

hand. This

actually

the one

that you

gifted to

Nia.

Mine's at

home. I

had to buy

mine. Nia

got hers

for free.

Yeah.

James Ski: What

do you

think she

got

signed.

She

Mark Ackers: got

signed as

well. She

devalued

it. Talk

to me

about

right? How

did you

write this

book? How

did it

come

about? I

James Ski: have

a few

books in

me that

I'm

excited

about

writing. I

really

want to

tell the

story on

my bipolar

journey,

but I want

to tell it

in the

right time

again,

probably

the ego. I

want to

achieve a

certain

amount

before I

tell that

story,

right? So

I want to,

I don't

want to be

judged on

it. I

don't want

to reveal

some of

the, the

bizarre

adventures

I've been

on, as I

like to

call them.

So this

book

really was

in the

making for

a long,

long time,

and then I

just

committed

to that

goal. And

I said,

I'm going

to write

this book.

And I, you

know, had

help. I

had

someone

help me

write it,

and it was

really

important

for me to

own sales

confidence

globally.

Like that

concept

that sales

confidence

is a

philosophy,

a way of

showing up

to work, a

way of

approaching

your

lifestyle

and the

pillars of

sales

confidence,

or how to

build

sales

confidence

as the

book is

called a

split

between

your

mindset,

your well

being and

performance.

Most books

talk about

sales

tactics,

how to

cold call,

how to

write

emails,

how to

medic. You

know, I

can't

stand

medic.

This is

going to

go down

well, you

know, it's

just like

it's so

rigid,

it's so

robotic,

it's so

on, people

friendly,

right? But

I get it.

It has a

framework.

It works.

And, you

know, I

know the

medic guys

and girls

love it,

but it's

not that's

not my

vibe. I'm

a, I'm a,

genuinely,

I'm fluid.

I'm a bit

of a

maverick.

So, so

firstly, a

lot of

books talk

about

performance,

really,

this book

focuses,

and it

probably

could have

just been

mindset,

but it

really

focuses on

mindset

and well

being. And

mindset

really

talks

about

things

gratitude.

You know,

it took me

till my

30s, and

still, I

started

being

grateful

for where

I've been

and what

I've got

in my

life. You

should be

practicing

that every

day. It

talks

about

manifest

manifestation,

affirmations

and

visualization,

like, how

can you

create an

image so

that

you're

motivated

every

single day

to show up

to your

your job.

It talks

about

healthy

eating.

You know

how many

sales

books

talks

about

eating and

lifestyle?

It talks

about

having a

well being

team. For

me, these

are all,

like,

important

life kind

of focuses

and so,

like,

that's

what I'm

proud

about in

this book.

And I'll

be honest,

this is

the irony.

There were

points

writing

this where

I really

questioned

myself,

like, why

am I doing

this? I

don't have

anything

to share.

I don't

have any

value to

add to

anyone. No

one's

going to

want to

read it,

and it was

really

difficult

actually

publish

it. Like I

that book.

It took me

about nine

months to

actually

publish

it. It was

finished.

I just

couldn't

do it. I

was just

like, No,

no one's

gonna want

to do

this. And

God

forbid,

someone

reads it

and thinks

it's crap,

you know.

And then

we're on a

podcast

talking

about

that,

like, so,

you know?

And then

again,

what

happened?

Eventually,

I was

like, I

don't

care. I

just feel

good that

I've

written a

book. And

do you

know what?

Who? It

matters to

me. It

matters to

me, and

I'm happy

with it

now. Do I

have a

goal on

how many

of books I

want to

sell?

Yeah, is

it a money

spinner?

No, for

anyone who

wants to

is not a

money

spinner.

But do I

have in

the game a

goal on

how many I

want to

sell?

Yeah, 100%

you know.

Do I love

it like

you just

put out? I

didn't

know you

had it

like did I

feel good

when I saw

you bring

out? Yeah?

Absolutely.

I was on a

zoom call

the other

day

speaking

to a CRO

and he

literally

just waved

it at me.

I didn't

know he

bought it.

And I love

that. So I

think, you

know, it's

a really

quite cool

milestone

in your

career to

be able to

publish a

book. And

like I

said, I

have a

goal on

how many

I'd like

to sell.

If I do, I

don't, it

doesn't

really

matter. I

just

enjoyed

the

process.

What's the

goal?

10,000

copies.

How

Mark Ackers: many

sold? Over

100 Okay,

and where

can people

buy it

from? So

James Ski: it's

available

on Amazon,

and you

can get it

on Kindle.

I think

you can

get it on

Kindle

from 99

pence. So

there's no

excuse if

you're

listening

right now,

grab a

copy. I'll

tell you

what, if

you are

listening,

and you

grab a

copy and

you linked

in me with

a photo of

your book,

I will

jump on

the phone

with you.

Mark Ackers: That's

an offer,

right

there. See

BEC is

grabbing

her phone.

Oh, there.

She's

ordering a

copy right

now, I was

going to

ask, like,

how many

times you

need to

quit

writing

this book?

Because

it's hard,

isn't it?

Well,

you've

done it,

yeah, but

I suppose

I had two

other

people to

push. And

true, this

is just,

this could

have gone

away, and

no one

would ever

known

about

James Ski: it.

That's

true. And

that,

again, it

comes back

to that.

You know,

no one

cares.

Like, no

one told

me to

write that

book. No

one said,

James, you

should

write a

book.

Like, no

one said,

like, I

have to

sell

10,000

companies.

These are

just my

aspirations,

my goals,

right? So

you're

right.

Like, and

I think

that's a

lot in

life.

Like, and

that's

sometimes

the

accountability.

10,000 is

a huge

Mark Ackers: number.

I actually

don't know

what the

average is

for a book

that's

sold.

Where did

that come

from? The

James Ski: number?

Yeah, if

I'm

honest,

and I

spoke to

someone

about this

earlier

today,

actually

the. Is

really

going to

play up

and what

people

think

about me

and my

ego, but I

honestly

believe

that I

have a

huge

amount of

credibility

and a

story that

completely

unique.

How many

people

have you

read about

listened

to that

have spent

200 nights

in a

mental

health

hospital,

seven

different

mental

health

hospitals?

You know,

I've

raised a

family,

I've had a

successful

sales

career,

been in

business,

and

continue

to strive

and

produce a

book,

right? Not

many, and

I can tell

you why,

because

I've been

trying to

find

someone

like me

that has a

diagnosis

of a

bipolar

and has

been able

to achieve

what I've

achieved.

And I'm

not saying

behind

closed

doors, in

families.

There's

not a lot

of people

out there

that have

it. Of

course,

there is,

right? I

love

meeting

them. So

for me, I

feel like

my story

is unique

and I have

a lot of

value to

share. I

would like

my story

to reach

millions

of people

around the

world.

And, you

know,

there's

something

like, I

don't

know,

changes a

lot,

correct?

Me, it's

like 8

billion

people on

the

planet.

There's a

billion

people on

LinkedIn.

I've only

got 35,000

connections.

Well, how

can I not

get 10,000

people to,

you know,

read my

book? So

that's

kind of my

logic to

it.

Mark Ackers: I

think the

thing

that's

difficult,

right? Is,

how do you

make

people

care? You

share your

story

there. I'm

sat here

because

I'm

listening

to you,

thinking,

wow. But

actually,

how do you

make

people

care?

James Ski: Well,

okay, so

here's

another

thing I

actually

also

think, and

I can't

quite

quantify

this, but

I also

think

people

hear my

story and

go fucking

out.

That's a

lot.

That's a

bit much.

I actually

don't want

to dig

more into

that guy,

because

that's too

much. So I

also feel

like it's

kind of a

bit

Marmite,

where

people

feel like

they can't

relate to

me. So I

actually

think I'm

a bit

inaccessible

to a lot

of people

in that

basis. I

think

sometimes

they see

me on

LinkedIn,

doing the

videos, or

they hear

the story

about

bipolar,

or they

hear the

mental

health

hospital,

and I just

think,

God, I

just don't

get that.

Like I

don't get

that.

That's

just not

relatable.

But that

is me. I

only know

my story,

right,

which is

the same

for any

individual.

So I do

also think

I've got a

branding

challenge,

like, and

someone

actually

said it. I

was

interviewing

for a

brand,

personal

brand

manager

once never

went

through

it, and

she was

just like,

I just

don't

think

people

relate to

you. And I

was really

upset

about it.

I was

like, God,

but she's

probably

right, you

know,

like, I

just my my

story is

quite

extreme,

so my ego

thinks

everybody

could be

interested

and should

interested

in it, but

maybe

they're

not. But

how do you

get them

to do it?

It's just

marketing,

isn't it?

At the end

of the

day, you

know, I

don't know

what the

conversion

rates on

audiences

are

traffic,

but I need

to do

certain

level of

marketing

activities

over the

next five

years to

find to

reach

enough

people

that

10,000

people

want to

buy that

book. Now

what's

great is

because

this is

recorded,

we could

actually

watch back

on this

when I hit

that

target,

Mark Ackers: absolutely,

we'll do

that.

Click this

up. BEC,

um, you've

probably

mentioned

the word

ego more

than any

other word

sat with

me. I know

it's hard

quantify.

How, how

big do you

think your

ego is

massive?

James Ski: I'm

not even

actually

that

comfortable

talking

about it

on even

this

conversation,

considering

how public

I am. So

like, ski

is an

abbreviation

of my full

surname.

I'm half

polish.

Mark Ackers: Did

not know

that.

Yeah,

what's

your full

surname?

No, I'm

James Ski: not

gonna say

it. Okay,

I'll tell

you

afterwards.

But, you

know, so

like, it

is an

abbreviation.

It's not

what I was

born with.

Mark Ackers: that

a branding

decision?

Exactly?

Yeah,

because

it's more

memorable.

Yeah,

didn't Wow

James Ski: when

I was at

uni, and I

used to

run

parties

Jamie

Foxx, and

this, this

girl came

up to me,

and I gave

her my

full name,

and she

was like,

No, I'm

just gonna

call you

ski. And

no one at

school

would ever

short my

name to

skin. I

was like,

That's

brilliant.

I like

that. And

then when

I started

my first

job and I

started to

say my

full name

on on the

phone, I

was like,

This is

too long.

I'm just

gonna go

with ski.

So every

time I

joined a

company, I

just went

by James

ski. So

it's just

stuck with

me, and it

is a

brand.

Now, I my

psychologist,

and I joke

she's

like, who

am I

talking to

today?

Ski.

James.

Ski. This

the

character.

It's the

showman.

It's the

guy that

people see

on stage.

Is the guy

people on

LinkedIn.

That is

not who I

am. It is

who I am.

Yes, it

is, but,

you know,

there's,

there's

other

parts to

me,

there's

other

parts to

personality

with my

kids or,

you know,

friendships

relationships

that I'm

in. And I

just know

having got

close to

certain

people

that I

also, you

know,

sometimes

they

struggle

and they

think,

God, you

know, can

you just

chill? I

just, it

doesn't

matter.

Like you

don't need

to show

off here.

You don't

need to do

that. And

so I guess

the reason

why I've

dropped it

a lot is

because I

think

people

assume a

lot about

me, and I

think they

don't

really

know me,

but I

think if

they get

to know

me, I

would like

to think,

you know,

I actually

am very

humble. I

am an I

would like

consider

myself a

good guy,

and. And I

like to be

there for

other

people.

I've had

my own

challenges.

I want to

support

people.

But I

think

there's a

perception

of me, of,

you know,

and this

is always

the fine

line

between

confidence

and

arrogance.

I think

there's a

perception

of me,

like he's

arrogant,

and, you

know, he's

got a

southern

swagger,

and, you

know, he

thinks

he's great

at this,

that and

the other,

and he's a

sales guy,

and I

don't like

sales

people,

and it's

just just

not I just

happened

to ended

up in and

I chose to

be in

sales as a

career.

And I

think, you

know, ego

for

everyone,

can help

you, but

it also

can hinder

you. And I

think mine

is a

constant

battle.

Mark Ackers: Well,

what I

realize

how

wherever

you are,

yeah,

because

people

have huge

egos, and

they don't

think

that's

true.

Who's got

the ego,

James ski

or the

real

James?

Who's last

time, I

don't

know,

probably

both.

Okay,

yeah, what

are your

parents or

your dad?

particular

thing that

you've

chopped

your name,

to be

James Ski: honest.

Like it

was funny

because my

grandfather,

who was a

business

guy from

from

Poland, he

ran big

textile

factories

before

Nazis

Germany

took over,

because

they took

over it

all. And

actually

thought it

was great.

He made

sense.

Logically.

My dad

wasn't

keen on

it.

Doesn't,

doesn't

really

like, like

the idea

of it. But

it's

interesting

now,

because my

kids

obviously

have my

real

surname

and, well,

my oldest

son is 13,

five years

he's gonna

be 18.

He's gonna

be on

LinkedIn,

yeah, he

ain't

gonna get

no rep if

I if not

got the

same

though.

So, yeah,

you might

be seeing

the real

name come

out soon,

but I'm

holding it

back. It's

Mark Ackers: very

true. The

reason I

ask is, Is

my brother

has

changed

his last

name in

terms of

the

pronunciation,

so my

family

pronounced

my name

acres.

Yeah, I

can

totally

see, when

you look

at my last

name. It's

acas,

until you

see that,

right?

Like, if

you it's a

c k, any

word

that's got

a c k is

ack,

right?

Back being

example,

right?

Zach being

example.

But we get

called

ackers all

the time.

I don't

correct

people. I

just saw C

as a

nickname.

My brother

has gone

all in on,

you know,

I'm just,

I'm

hackers,

and he

works in

the same

industry

as my dad

and my dad

is like,

What a

disgrace

to our

name.

Like, my

name has

been

changed.

Everyone

knows my

name like

Michael

Akers.

They know

you're my

son. They

know

you're

calling

yourself

hackers.

It's just,

that's why

I asked

about your

parents. I

James Ski: think

it's quite

funny.

Yeah,

yeah. It

was funny

because I

this is

actually

interesting.

Actually,

I feel for

a lot of

people, I

comes back

relatability.

There are

a lot of,

you know,

especially

in the UK,

a huge

amount of

diversity,

right,

international

names. And

I actually

think it's

challenge

for

people.

Unconscious

bias is

obviously

an issue,

right? But

I do think

you need

to adapt,

and if you

need to

cut a few

things to

like, fit

in to

accelerate

your

career, I

think you

should go

for it. If

I'm

honest,

like,

people

won't

agree to

that.

People

will be

like, No,

this is

me. This

is who I

am. But,

you know,

there's

some

really

complicated

names out

there. I

don't

think it

helps you

at all. If

it's

really

complicated,

yeah,

Mark Ackers: I

can

totally

see that.

James,

honestly,

this

conversation,

I could

easily

just get

another

beer, a

little

reload

from the

be attack,

but I'm

conscious

of time

you need

to get to

your

parents as

well. Tell

us all,

what is

sales

confidence

2.0 What

are you

doing now?

Thanks

James Ski: for

asking.

Yeah. So

the you

know, I

built my

reputation

from a

business

perspective

of helping

software

companies

and

service

companies

launch and

expand in

the UK

over the

last kind

of five,

six years.

everyone

from

sales,

loft,

Gong,

zoom,

info, six

cents.

High spot,

companies

launching

here or

UK,

companies

cognizant,

Jiminy,

Covo now

trumpet,

I've

helped

expand

them, and

obviously

we've

worked

together

at refract

a Lego and

now my

sales

coach,

that was

business

model.

That model

doesn't

exist

anymore in

the bulk

on a

sponsorship

side of

things.

And the

reason is,

is that

sales

leaders

now in the

UK are

very

educated

on the

sales

stack.

They know

what a

forecasting

tool is.

They know

what

conversation

intelligence

is. They

know what

databases

are. They

don't need

a third

party like

me to

educate

them. So

the model

is shifted

to, okay,

how can I

service

this

audience

that I've

built over

the last

five, six

years, and

I'm

extremely

well

known. And

the

fundamental

thing,

despite,

you know,

the

scare

mongering

that's not

going

anywhere,

companies

need to

hire

salespeople.

And while

some

people

might be

arguing

for less

salespeople,

the long

tail, ie,

the number

companies

that are

getting

funded

week in,

month out,

in the UK,

Europe and

the world,

continues

to grow.

It doesn't

matter if

it's AI,

it doesn't

matter if

it's deep

tech. It

doesn't

matter

what it is

sales,

people are

still

going to

be needed.

I don't

care what

people say

about AI.

So I've

shifted my

attention

with sales

confidence

2.0 to

help

people get

jobs in

sales and

help

companies

hire

salespeople.

And what's

totally

unique.

Super

disruptive

in the way

that we do

it. One,

we provide

a pre

vetted,

pre

qualified

database

interview

ready

candidates.

So the

problem

with job

boards and

posting

jobs is

you just

get

hundreds

candidates

that

aren't

relevant

for what

you're

looking

for. With

our hiring

platform,

they're

pre

vetted,

pre

qualified,

ready for

you to

interview.

They might

not be a

culture

fit, they

might not

be the

candidate

that you

want, but

they will

put on a

good

performance.

We've also

trained,

developed

and

supported

them. So

we put

them

through

master

class

training.

We coach

them. We

actually

put them

on a cold

call

program,

so they

are doing

cold calls

every

single day

before

they

interview

for a

sales job,

so they're

getting

real life

practice.

The second

thing is,

if you're

like,

well, the

hiring

platform

sounds

great,

James, but

I just

need

someone

today.

Well, you

can join

one of our

assessment

days. That

is a

common

model in

the

market,

but we're

just

disrupting

it, and

we're

about 50%

below any

other

competitor.

And then

the final

thing is

learning

and

development

content

I've just

built up.

We've

talked a

lot about

it today.

I've got

the best

SDRs, AES,

VPs of

sales in

Europe

that have

shared

their

expert

content,

and we've

got it on

platform,

Netflix

style,

content

that you

could

for. So

yeah, the

future of

sales

confidence

2.0 is

really

helping

people

enter the

sales

profession

and

helping

companies

hire

salespeople.

Mark Ackers: Sounds

amazing.

Obviously,

you shared

it with

me, and

I'm really

excited to

see the

journey

you're

about to

go on.

James.

Thank you

so much.

Like this

podcast, I

feel like

I say it

regularly,

but

genuinely,

I think

it's

probably

the most

honest

podcast

we've had,

and we've

touched on

a number

different

things

I've

really

enjoyed

speaking

with you.

Could

easily do

another

hour, but

let's call

it a day.

There. We

can always

have you

back,

since you

can't to

Newcastle

regularly,

I just

want to

say thank

you for

coming up.

Thank you

for coming

in and

sharing

your

story.

I've

really

enjoyed

it.

James Ski: Thank

you, mate.

You know

what? It's

been

great, you

know,

especially

because

obviously

we go way

back now,

you know,

and it's

been

amazing to

think

about

where our

careers

have got

to and the

impact I

think

we're both

having on

the

industry,

and I also

think it's

just for

personally.

You know,

what's

nice about

having

these

conversations,

because I

obviously

hosted my

own

podcast,

is just

nice to

reflect,

isn't it?

And just,

you know,

feel good

about some

of the

milestones

and share

some of

the

anecdotes.

So, yeah,

look, I

love what

my cell my

sales

coach are

doing, and

I think it

genuinely

impacting

people's

careers,

but their

lives as

well. And

you know,

what more

do you

want?

Thanks. So

much. Nice

enough.

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