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This podcast is focused on challenges that are routinely encountered by men aged 50 - 70, but
not often discussed. Although targeted to them, this is also applicable to older / younger men
who are looking for ways to age differently, as well as the women that are involved in their lives.
Stress, relationships, male friendships, diet, mindfulness, aging with vitality and dying are just
some of the many topics that are covered. A rotating series of guest speakers join the podcast
to provide insights and wisdom relating to other relevant topics such as EMF radiation,
emotional intelligence, mindfulness and hair health.
00;00;00;00 - 00;00;04;04
Unknown
Background music
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Darius
Hello, everyone, and welcome once again to another episode of Age Differently Meaningful conversations with men. My name is Darius Naigamwalla I'm here with my co-host Peter Callan, as well as our first guest, Doctor Ash Hayatdavoudi . Welcome, gentlemen. How are you today?
00;00;22;22 - 00;00;26;00
Ash
Morning, Darius. Hello, guys.
00;00;26;02 - 00;00;33;27
Peter
Yes it is. And welcome to our audience. hopefully back for another meaningful conversation.
00;00;33;29 - 00;01;03;26
Darius
Absolutely. So, before we get started, full disclosure, I am an investor in Ashes Company. What's the old, what's the old joke? You know, not not only the president of. I'm a member as well. ash was the one who started me on my journey of hair restoration. So ash personally, just really delighted to have you on, on with us today and share with our audience, you know, hair health and options for men that are noticing hair loss and want to do something about it.
00;01;03;26 - 00;01;11;02
Darius
But before we dive into all that good stuff, why don't you just tell us a little bit of background about yourself, your background.
00;01;11;04 - 00;01;39;18
Ash
Yeah. And Darius and Peter again. thank you for having me. It's a pleasure to be here. And, talk to your, your base here. my background is is, I'm a physician lawyer. I grew up in Southern California, born in Iran. been traveling south and southern California since I landed here. currently in San Diego.
00;01;39;20 - 00;02;18;25
Ash
so really entrepreneur with, with, currently involved with a couple companies. one of our companies is, a company named Presidium Health. provides conscious level health care services to underserved members of our community. the, disproportionate utilization of, the health care system and a value based approach. a sister company, is, really an enterprise of, various entities, and that's, that runs, I'll be your money.
00;02;18;28 - 00;02;46;15
Ash
enterprises and what we mean by a conglomerate of different entities is, is that what we really are is in the hair space and the, hair rejuvenation space, and, we're in different verticals in that space, be it, products for maintenance, products for hair growth, surgical solutions, minimally invasive surgical solutions, injectable solutions.
00;02;46;17 - 00;02;53;17
Ash
the whole gamut of, of solutions for individuals suffering from, hair loss and everything.
00;02;53;20 - 00;03;14;22
Darius
Yeah, interesting. I remember the first time I even considered going in hair rejuvenation. Peter, I don't think I told you this. We were on a board call. It was at the start of Covid, and we had been on it for an extended period of time, and I was feeling a little uppity or a little edgy. So I used to have this 90s rocker wig so I wouldn't put this thing on, had hair down to here.
00;03;14;25 - 00;03;37;27
Darius
I just wanted to see if anybody was still paying any attention on so. And ash looked at me and goes, wow, you look really good. I'm like, I think you need to go grow your hair again. I said, that ship has sailed long ago. Oh no it hasn't. We're going to have a conversation. And that conversation sparked an interest and sparked, the rejuvenation.
00;03;38;00 - 00;04;00;06
Darius
so, ash, what's going on when guys are starting to lose their hair, right? Some. It starts at 18, some it starts at 20. But what's going on from two perspectives, one physiologically what's happening and then emotionally, what are you seeing? Men are experiencing?
00;04;00;09 - 00;04;12;13
Ash
Yeah. It's, I'll take that and I'll, I'll kind of, at the second, but I was just, while you were speaking. I was reminiscing on that day. What was that? Three years ago now?
00;04;12;16 - 00;04;14;28
Darius
It was four years ago now. Yeah.
00;04;15;00 - 00;04;34;20
Ash
So four years ago. And, That's incredible. Yeah, we were just talking. And the next thing you know, you know, Darius, my my my, older brother was running the company at that juncture and was the the lead surgeon. And, before this guy's a doer. Darius goes right on the side. He's got his mind set on something.
00;04;34;20 - 00;04;49;03
Ash
He goes, next thing I knew, he, he had, visited my, the clinic, and and and right after that, he got the procedure, and it was, it was pretty cool to see now, for years,
00;04;49;05 - 00;04;53;01
Darius
You might see something like this.
00;04;53;04 - 00;05;12;24
Ash
Oh, my God. but that's that's when that's when you're really healing yourself. That's that's like, what we need is a before and after. but for you, and, and, you know, going back to your question that it's, it relates, you know.
00;05;12;27 - 00;05;35;27
Ash
You know, I would pass it back to you, you know, when we discussed during that conversation four years ago, we talked about, the, the option was there, you know, we didn't really go into how you felt, up to this point, whether it bothered you or anything of that sort. it was, you know, the option is there.
00;05;35;27 - 00;05;45;20
Ash
And and once you knew the option was there, you went forward with it. But before that, had you, you know, was it something that you thought about it or was it just, you know.
00;05;45;22 - 00;06;10;15
Darius
Yeah, it's an interesting question. So I started losing my hair at 19, and it was after the death of my father. I didn't process that very well, moved away to school. Stress caused it. And I tell you, one of the most disappointing or out the word is emotionally challenging. Experiences you have is a 19 year old is waking up every morning with a pillow full of hair.
00;06;10;18 - 00;06;30;24
Darius
Right? You can see it all just falling out. And then you start thinking, oh my gosh, I'm 19. I'm going to hide this for as long as I can. Fortunately, that was the 90s. Baseball caps were good because it's embarrassing when you lose your hair, especially at that young in age, and then you start comparing and contrasting yourself.
00;06;30;24 - 00;06;49;05
Darius
So for me personally, I didn't like it. And then I eventually, I guess about four years in came to the realization I can't stop this, so I may as well just shave my head and embrace it. I'm not going to hide it. I this is what I have. These are the cards I've been dealt. And so I shaved my head.
00;06;49;07 - 00;07;02;07
Darius
And then as it progressively receded and got worse, it was just pretty normal. But I would pass it over to Peter right now because Peter and I have had this conversation and it didn't faze him at all.
00;07;02;10 - 00;07;29;20
Peter
Well, you know, it's, I started balding really, in my 60s, at the very top of my head. And it's, I think it's, it's genetics because my father and my brothers all similarly. But for me, you know, this age of baldness being so kind of embrace it just it just seemed like a natural flow. So we're having this conversation that I'm representing.
00;07;29;20 - 00;07;57;03
Peter
I think that population that's kind of like, you know, hair. Why is that so important here? And, you know, you know, you have a, an important viewpoint to share, both of you. And I think the audience should hear from Abby from ash on. Why is it that people come to him? What has been his experience? You know, you resent one interest or one one experience the rise.
00;07;57;03 - 00;08;06;18
Peter
But how about the rest of the people out in our audience? What's what's, what's a what's an example? Other examples of why people come.
00;08;06;20 - 00;08;43;15
Ash
Well, and, you know, this played out perfectly because as you saw from both of you, you know, you see sorry guys, for sharing. But if you were doing befores, you know, you guys had similar, similar domes, right? that physical manifestation, incredibly varying individual, impacts on you. And my point in saying that is, you know, while hair loss is common.
00;08;43;15 - 00;09;07;21
Ash
So, you know, two thirds of men by the time at 35 and 80% of men at, at some point in their life, 50% of women by the time they're, they're, 50 and 80% by the time they're 75. You know, hair loss is very common, but the impact of hair loss is incredibly individual eyes.
00;09;07;24 - 00;09;38;05
Ash
It's based off of, individual characteristics themselves with social pressures and extrinsic pressures. the person's been, you know, succumb to in their life what's important to that person. and what they, what they, hold as priorities. all those things kind of play into it where, each individual has a different, different type of, response to losing hair.
00;09;38;07 - 00;10;13;00
Ash
What I would say is, is the individuals that, that find our group specifically are individuals that do prioritize their hair significantly. And that could be for a number of reasons. It could be for hysterics. Right. which is kind of what we associate this with. But it can also be to mitigate loss. And so we go back to what Darius just talked about.
00;10;13;00 - 00;10;49;28
Ash
You know, he went through his process. He, began losing hair. at first he, was combative against it. You got sad a little bit about it. he got angry a little bit about it, and eventually he just accepted it. you know, that's called grief, right? So there's different reasons why an individual might come to our group specifically.
00;10;50;00 - 00;11;10;04
Ash
but that's the general reason. It's someone that, you know, has lost what they once had. And what they're seeing is a reflective of what they're feeling. And they want those two things to meld a little bit better.
00;11;10;07 - 00;11;12;08
Peter
This is,
00;11;12;10 - 00;11;24;27
Ash
Have you so have you. Sorry. Sorry to interrupt. Have you, everybody's experience loss. Is there anything tangible you'd be willing to talk about in terms of laws and how that progress for you?
00;11;25;00 - 00;11;30;20
Peter
Yeah, yeah, I would, but it wouldn't be associated with hair.
00;11;30;23 - 00;11;32;23
Ash
that's absolute. But,
00;11;32;25 - 00;12;01;21
Peter
But, you know, I, I have mentioned this in, in the prior episode, I left Michigan, I left, a scholarship, at a time that I was just overwhelmed with a number of things. Fatherhood, distance from home, marriage. And so it was just, you know, a decision that, a fork in the road that, left me to abandon an opportunity that was a dream of a lifetime.
00;12;01;25 - 00;12;24;09
Peter
You know, I was at the University of Michigan, and I was. I didn't realize I didn't have any context. I didn't realize I was on. I was a member of one of the greatest teams at the university. but because I didn't play a lot and because of all these other factors, I just made a poor decision. So that loss that anger.
00;12;24;11 - 00;12;48;13
Peter
And I want to come back to the emotions aspect of what you just mentioned, because it seems to be a theme that constantly runs in, in our podcasts and all of the aspects of the different topics we've talked about and the importance of being able to identify these emotions and how they affect us in our lives. Real quick, let's go ahead.
00;12;48;15 - 00;12;51;13
Ash
Can I connect that story with with hair?
00;12;51;15 - 00;12;53;00
Peter
Yeah, please.
00;12;53;03 - 00;13;14;26
Ash
What would you do? What would you give to have that opportunity back? And I can tell you what it was for me. I had the similar experience with you in University of Michigan. I have what every every person says. age 35, 40. I wish I could go back to college again and redo this and do it right.
00;13;14;28 - 00;13;37;03
Ash
I spent you know, I spent $300,000 going back to law school to try it again. What would you give to have that opportunity again? And that's the same thing with hair. They're not changing what they what they are. They want what they lost. and that's why they come to us.
00;13;37;05 - 00;13;54;19
Darius
I would say their access. Not only wanting what you lost, it's wanting to take that. At least in my situation, it's wanting to take that and integrate it with where I am today. Right. So I want to bring those two worlds together and have the best of both. Both of them.
00;13;54;21 - 00;13;57;04
Ash
You want the ability to be able to do that.
00;13;57;07 - 00;13;57;27
Darius
Yeah.
00;13;57;29 - 00;14;23;18
Ash
You we're not talking about esthetics. We're talking about you had the ability. Yeah. To do that to to to have whatever look you wanted on that individual day because you had hair. Yeah. You lost that ability. You went through the stages of grief because of that. As well as a way to resolve that loss.
00;14;23;20 - 00;14;48;06
Peter
Yeah. As well as a number of coping mechanisms that are laid. Soften the grief, the loss. You know, the the most obvious one was just, you know, shaving his head, but what else was going on? You know, what else happened in terms of maybe his ego, what happened in terms of his self-worth? You know, all of those things somewhat.
00;14;48;07 - 00;15;16;17
Peter
You know, this is so multi-layered because it's it's multi layer because of the sociocultural, the family aspects of it. and because we not being mindful kind of come back to this. We're not aware, we're not paying attention, we're too distracted and we don't see what's going on with us. It took me decades, you know, kind of finishing the story about Michigan decades to realize I was angry at life.
00;15;16;19 - 00;15;31;29
Darius
Yeah, yeah. What I always say, Peter, when I think I'm awake, I'm in the middle of the deepest slumber that I ever possibly. And I think I'm awake now. Which means somewhere I am. Get asleep, I get, I get it. Yeah.
00;15;32;01 - 00;15;33;03
Peter
But going back in.
00;15;33;03 - 00;15;41;18
Ash
Those dreams, we don't, you know, we learn from those things and and we progress forward as, as, as better beings. It's the whole.
00;15;41;24 - 00;16;02;18
Peter
Issue. The difference between the rise and I that I see is, we're kind of at opposite ends of the timeline. It happened to him really early, whereas for me it happened. You know, when I generally people start, men start to lose their hair. Do you see any differences there? and talk to people who come to you.
00;16;02;20 - 00;16;23;22
Ash
And again, there's, there's a medley of things. Right. You know, okay, let's talk about females. Right. it's a lot less socially acceptable for females to have hair thinning and balding because it's not a known entity. Right. It's a male goes bald, they put it on a wig. So we don't know what's going on in there. Right? Yeah.
00;16;23;22 - 00;16;58;06
Ash
There's females that will stop going outside in public because their hair is thinning. I mean, that's, you know, whether that's appropriate or not. is is a whole nother issue. The suffering that goes with that and the solutions that can alleviate that are another bucketed. And so and so. Yeah, the younger you have it, the more prone you are to, social pressures, the less developed you are as an individual.
00;16;58;08 - 00;17;37;13
Ash
you know, those those, those things definitely play into it. Male, female, high level executives. We had, you know, without going into specifics, we have individuals that are CEOs. And, you know, I profile positions that prior to coming to us, they would spend 2 or 3 hours a day making sure that their hair was like before they left, putting in topic, put it in and you know, different devices to, to to ensure that no one would know, that, that they're losing hair, whether has an effect or not to the perceptions of others.
00;17;37;21 - 00;17;48;01
Ash
Who knows. But this is what's going on inside these individuals, which is torture. unfortunately.
00;17;48;03 - 00;18;11;18
Peter
Yeah, I know that very well. I have a CEO client, female, who had. And I want to get back to the topic of stress and the impact of stress that derives mentioned earlier. She had $1 million deal goal turned sour. it was actually fraud that was committed against her and her company.
00;18;13;03 - 00;18;35;20
Peter
The she started to get into just a mental funk and started losing her hair. It started. And so I wanted to talk a little bit about the, the relationship between stress and hair loss. If you would please.
00;18;35;22 - 00;19;00;22
Ash
information is the enemy, my friend. I mean, anything that promotes inflammation is bad for the entire body from a holistic standpoint. And hair. yeah. We take this out. Don't ever do that. It's a sin. And I'll be reminded by the way, to pull out your hair. But you know what it like I said, 100 of these fall out of a day.
00;19;00;22 - 00;19;49;16
Ash
Look at this tiny little thing. We discount the fact that each of these little things is a full functioning organ, full functioning organ that is able to replicate, able to, produce color, able to, synthesize, keratin into, hair is able to do a number of things right. so when you plug, the, the follicles on the scalp with, the, the, the actors within inflammation, I will go into those, but it's not as exciting.
00;19;49;19 - 00;20;23;21
Ash
And then, like anything else, it's going to affect hair growth. It's going to affect, melanocytes, which are responsible for hair color. That's why you have significant graying hair color. Great grading with, increased stress. but. You know, we often think is hair loss is permanent. stress induced hair loss is, reversible. and the faster you lose it because of stress, the more reversible it is.
00;20;23;24 - 00;20;49;15
Ash
and again, not to get in the weeds, but there is something called telogen effluvium where you could suddenly start losing clumps of hair similar to what Darius was describing when he, was, was younger from his, incident with his with his father. And that certainly happens. And it certainly is reversible. But you have to be educated with the tools and resources necessary to, to to take advantage of that reversibility.
00;20;49;18 - 00;20;52;19
Darius
You mean a case of beer doesn't help?
00;20;52;21 - 00;21;11;13
Ash
no. Case of beer is necessary. That's that's just. That's a given. That's not. That's not part of the strategy. so if you have if you have two cases, then you might support someone in your hair or two and see if that has any effect. We can run a clinical study with those.
00;21;11;15 - 00;21;13;12
Darius
Would be good for the brewing companies.
00;21;13;15 - 00;21;14;10
Ash
Yeah.
00;21;14;13 - 00;21;22;14
Darius
So we got stress ash. What else could be contributing to to hair loss.
00;21;22;16 - 00;21;39;08
Ash
Anything that you could think of that you would say is bad for you is bad for your hair? Well, you know, when you think about the hair, it's it's in the skin on the head. So the scalp, you know, you want to make sure your scalp is nourished, is moisturizes and dry is. And getting too much UV radiation.
00;21;39;11 - 00;21;49;12
Ash
You want to make sure your nutrients are good. The stuff you guys are talking about. I think we were talking offline. Moringa.
00;21;49;14 - 00;21;50;29
Darius
Ashwagandha.
00;21;51;01 - 00;22;20;25
Ash
sugar. I could go down the list. Sage, salt, palmetto, all these things that are available, the growing body of evidence behind, botanicals and their benefit and hair, skin and various other modalities is is vastly growing over the last few decades. And this stuff is becoming more and more, commonplace to, to, to, to, combat some of the issues, but other things and females hormonal changes post-pregnancy.
00;22;20;28 - 00;22;46;17
Ash
You know, we're lucky as males. We, yeah, females have a whole nother slew of things going on in terms of, hair loss, for instance. Ours is. Yeah, it's androgen dependent. they have a androgen dependent mechanism and a androgen independent mechanism and just a convoluted things. I'm sure there's a there's, there's a joke in there somewhere about females being more complicated, but I'm sure as heck not going to make it.
00;22;46;19 - 00;22;51;00
Ash
Yeah, that's a that's another episode.
00;22;51;02 - 00;22;56;07
Peter
That's another episode.
00;22;56;10 - 00;23;26;10
Ash
but yeah. So anything that you can think of and if you got and not not to plug our own company, but we have, a lot of great blogs on, hair and scalp health in addition to various botanicals and their benefits, science based benefits on, originary.com. And for any females or females in your life that might be listening, we put up, informational site because we feel that females are underrepresented in terms of hair loss therapies.
00;23;26;13 - 00;23;32;16
Ash
called her hair health.com. feel free to jump in and, further.
00;23;32;16 - 00;23;39;20
Peter
Please, please, please plug your company if it's helpful to the audience, even one person, please plug away.
00;23;39;23 - 00;23;44;29
Ash
if you want a hair transplant and be our money all day.
00;23;45;02 - 00;24;09;04
Darius
So, ash, let's talk about some of the options. Now, we've talked about if it's bad for the body, it's bad for the hair. Right? We need to make sure that we're taking care of the scalp. We're getting adequate nutrition, nutrition. We are managing our stress levels. We're getting exercise. Once the hair loss has progressed, what are some of the options ranging from, you know, topicals all the way through intervention?
00;24;09;04 - 00;24;15;14
Darius
I'll give us a sense as to what people could potentially start looking into.
00;24;15;16 - 00;24;44;01
Ash
Yeah, I think that's just probably if we're in, you know, hey, so if we're going to do one take on point for, for your listeners that that are having difficulty emotionally from some hair loss, it's, the new age, there's, a plentiful amount of solutions. from, completely noninvasive to to invasive, that, are available.
00;24;44;03 - 00;25;21;25
Ash
we, you know, going from a noninvasive standpoint, kind of the, the, the most noninvasive, we talk about some of the botanicals that we've been discussing and the growing body of evidence. So, they help scalp in, in their health, and, and leveraging those, and then maintenance products from, you know, shampoo and conditioner standpoint, what I tell our team, both on the Presidium side and, all the, our money side is that as as physicians, we have one rule, and all the other rules come secondary to that one rule.
00;25;21;25 - 00;25;50;24
Ash
And that one rule is first, do no harm. And the truth of the matter is, is a lot of the shampoos and conditioners we put out, out into the market over the past 50 years have been devastating to the hair follicles globally. And, you know, it's just a matter of, of the products that we the ingredients we add into these products to make them, trigger our senses and make them more sticky from a commercial standpoint are the same.
00;25;50;27 - 00;26;19;13
Ash
ingredients that are are killing our household calls in terms of sulfates and parabens and, polyphenols and things of that sort. moving up from there. There's different medications, minoxidil, finasteride. And there's, a few things in the pipeline that, may be coming, and to, the industry as well. Then you have a growing body of injectable stem cells, exosomes, platelet rich plasma.
00;26;19;15 - 00;26;49;21
Ash
that have demonstrated efficacy and, and playing a part in, hair rejuvenation. And then, of course, the, the, the Cuda, the, the, the permanent solution, the solution with the most control and, and that gives the, best results is, is hair transplantation. And then when you talk about hair transplantation, there's like anything else in life, there's levels to this game that.
00;26;49;24 - 00;26;55;14
Peter
You know, I didn't realize there was so much research and science behind this.
00;26;55;16 - 00;27;34;16
Ash
yeah. You know, it's it's weird. And health care, you and what we've been trained as medical residents in the past and as med students is you got to do research to publish and get your name out there. The world of hair is the one exception. post 2010, you had a few clinics ourselves being one of the clinics that where the only groups doing research and and hair rejuvenation and hair loss therapies, the Affordable Care Act opened up, a medley of research opportunities and funding opportunities for hair research.
00;27;34;18 - 00;28;03;26
Ash
because of that, what we're seeing is, a growing body of evidence and growing number of individuals that are doing research in the field since 2010. And what they're finding is, to be honest, is what, people, in the Far East and, Middle East have known for centuries and centuries what we're doing is we're testing, ingredients and botanicals known in those cultures to improve hair.
00;28;03;28 - 00;28;12;18
Ash
And what we're finding is that their anecdotal evidence, can go from anecdotal to research based pretty quickly.
00;28;12;21 - 00;28;34;05
Darius
So I if I'm 45, 50, just starting to notice hair loss, not everybody has access to a resource like you who I had to basically just chart the course for me. How does someone get started? Where do they go to start learning about the options, learn a little bit more? What are some good resources they have available to them?
00;28;34;07 - 00;29;01;08
Ash
Yeah. And you know, again I'll mention, you know, I try not to be I'm not very slow. Go ahead. But but, the reason why I refer to our websites is because they've always, again, they're created in, the vision of our, our, founder, my brother, Doctor Barber. And with that, it's always ethics first. So we always want to educate first.
00;29;01;08 - 00;29;34;18
Ash
So our websites are incredibly informational, specifically. And all of your money go to the, hair transplants and hair restorations tab, and that's all informational stuff. her hair health, hair health.com, is a non-branded site, so we're not selling anything on there is strictly informational and during in the blog section for Originaire. we have been putting out blogs and I think we have a total of 25 and, we're planning on putting out one a week for the, the next year.
00;29;34;18 - 00;29;40;03
Ash
So, stay tuned. There'll be educational resources there as well. It's fantastic.
00;29;40;03 - 00;29;54;24
Peter
I have a I have a curveball for you. If, if I'm observing and stepping back and you're doing the same with me, what do you say to somebody in the audience who's in denial?
00;29;54;26 - 00;30;20;06
Ash
Denial? Well, I wouldn't say you're in denial. You know, you're you're you you're completely happy with you, right? That's not I don't think that's denial. I think that's a healthy place to be. I think the person that's in denial is the person that's not happy with the way they look, but they're telling themselves that this is it.
00;30;20;09 - 00;30;32;19
Peter
You know, that's this is exactly where I'm going with this. Because denial can take the form of coping mechanisms where you basically tell yourself stories that, yeah, I'm happy with the way I look because.
00;30;32;22 - 00;30;33;14
Ash
There.
00;30;33;16 - 00;30;55;11
Peter
And, you know, this this is this is just an observation of life that I've, I've witnessed, I've seen. So I can imagine in this area where it's it's convoluted, it's perplexing. There's a lot of layers to this. But somebody who is feeling these emotions that we've talked about, they don't want to feel, and so they deny and they tell themselves stories that develop coping mechanisms.
00;30;55;11 - 00;31;03;16
Peter
So what do you say to somebody in our audience is maybe in denial?
00;31;03;19 - 00;31;09;23
Ash
There is,
00;31;09;26 - 00;31;35;29
Ash
If you're able and this is easier said than done, grief is a very difficult thing. Denial is a very complicated thing. if you're able to find, support and able to get yourself to, to, to open up and, and, look at what's out there, you'll realize you don't need to be in denial. there's solutions to this problem.
00;31;38;16 - 00;32;05;12
Darius
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, Peter, I think if, if tell me about a call to action for this, the call to action is if this is something that's bothering you. This isn't 1980 anymore. There is a range of options that are available based on how much it's bothering you, the level of investment that you're willing to make, and the extent of, and how long that you want the results for.
00;32;05;14 - 00;32;24;14
Darius
So in my mind, the call to action here is only the only our listener knows if it's really bothering them or not. I think the only person can actually take that holistic look inside and say, no, I'm comfortable with this. I don't need to do anything, or I want to dip my toe in the water and see if this can work, or I'm going to make a fundamental change in how I look.
00;32;24;17 - 00;32;38;20
Darius
So the call to action is to, you know, take that look inside and then look at the options that are out there, because I just touched on, what, a half a dozen, a dozen different potential options for people that want to make a change.
00;32;38;22 - 00;32;58;06
Peter
He has he has said that, you know, the rise, the approach that I'm suggesting here is that people take, our audience take a real close look at what are you feeling, you know, are you are you hiding from the grief or are you having fun? Loss. Yeah. And and then start exploring, you know, what are my options?
00;32;58;06 - 00;33;05;00
Peter
Like, like ashes suggested. There are lots of options. And like you just mentioned, this is a 1980.
00;33;05;02 - 00;33;29;24
Ash
Yeah. I have two pictures next to, in front of you, one from when you had here and one from right now. one. Which one do you like more? And two, if you like the one with hair more, does it bother you enough where it's right. And that's a good objective. Yeah. Way to to to look at once again.
00;33;29;27 - 00;33;55;05
Ash
Remember it's very individualized. And again 80% of males are going to have this. You're not you know how long these feelings this is. You know this is you know my my brother got introduced to I'll do your monte in 2002 when he first had his procedure. Hair loss very much bothered him. he's he was a very confident man.
00;33;55;08 - 00;34;25;26
Ash
And hair loss was affecting that, that that confidence. Because what he was feeling inside isn't what he was seeing in the mirror. He's also a guy, as am I, who's been raised to be very, that stuff shouldn't matter, right? Yeah. Right. we're both from Palmdale, which is kind of, a little rougher area. And and, in Los Angeles.
00;34;25;26 - 00;34;51;07
Ash
So our comments were this isn't very Palmdale. It took over three years of research. He interviewed Antonio Armani five times, flew out to Toronto. In order to do it. And when he did it, oh, man, watch out. It was a new man, not a new man. He was. He was.
00;34;51;07 - 00;34;52;13
Darius
Himself.
00;34;52;15 - 00;34;59;11
Ash
He was. He was the man who was. It was an a force to be reckoned with. Yeah.
00;34;59;14 - 00;35;07;12
Darius
So, Peter, before we close, we usually do a poem, any poem or words that you want to share with everybody.
00;35;07;15 - 00;35;14;04
Peter
Well, you know, I really was hoping we'd get guests that come with poems. And maybe ash has one.
00;35;14;06 - 00;35;41;23
Ash
Yeah. I always, you know, I always go with, I love poetry, but my, my favorite poet is, is, Tupac Shakur, and he's got, and, death is not the greatest loss in life. The greatest loss in life is what dies inside when we're still alive. Never surrender. Oh, I love that. Awesome.
00;35;41;25 - 00;35;44;27
Peter
Yeah. Very well said.
00;35;45;00 - 00;36;07;27
Darius
Well, ash, thank you from the bottom of my heart for coming on and educating our audience. We really appreciate it. For everyone listening the podcast. If you have comments, go to Age differently.com click on the podcast underneath. Welcome to provide comments, questions, feedback whatever you have. And ash thank you once again. Really really thank you for your time and wisdom.
00;36;07;29 - 00;36;18;20
Ash
Thank you. And so I appreciate the time for this. And thank you to the listeners for, for taking the time to, to, entertain.