Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Welcome to The Giving Garden Podcast, where we explore how small acts of giving can blossom into lasting change. In each episode, we highlight the power of giving—whether it’s time, kindness, or resources—and how these acts can transform both lives and whole communities.
Join us as we explore the ripple effect of giving and its lasting impact.
To the Giving Garden podcast where we explore how small acts of giving can blossom into lasting change. I'm your host Martina Halloran, founder of the Giving Garden and CEO of Doctor. Hauschka Skincare USA. In each episode, we highlight the power of giving, whether it's time, kindness, or resources, and how these acts can transform both lives and whole communities. Join me as we explore the ripple effect of giving and its lasting impact.
Martina Halloran:Today's guest is someone who has spent her life cultivating beauty, equity, and opportunity in one of the world's most influential industries, the art world. Sarah Cardona Kay is a respected art dealer, entrepreneur, and advocate with more than twenty five years of experience spanning museums, auction houses, and private galleries. Her career has taken her from curating old masters to champion contemporary voices, all while holding space for excellence, integrity, and bold creative vision. But her work doesn't stop at the gallery doors. Sarah is also the founder and chief creative officer of POW Arts, the professional organization for women in the arts, a vital collective that empowers, educates, and mobilizes women across the visual arts landscape.
Martina Halloran:Through this work, she's building not just a stronger art world, but a more just and inclusive one. Today, we'll explore the power of creativity as a form of giving, the importance of women supporting women, and how Sarah has turned her passion into platforms that uplift others. Sarah, welcome to the Giving Garden podcast.
Sara Cardona Kay:Thank you. That was so lovely. Thank you.
Martina Halloran:Oh, you are most welcome. Well, that's that's your work. That's I that I just have the privilege and the honor of of sharing with our listeners and our audience your your incredible work and the work that you're currently doing. So we're gonna just jump right in. Can you tell us a little bit more about the professional organization for women in the arts, also known as POW Arts, which I love, POW.
Martina Halloran:Like, is so you know, it's powerful in its mission and the work that you're doing with the organization.
Sara Cardona Kay:Sure. So POWERTS will turn 18 this year, which is hard to imagine like a kid going off to college, you know, except it never leaves my house, which is great. And we're now global. We're a global member. And our membership are all women that work in the business of the visual arts.
Sara Cardona Kay:So while we're all creative in our own way, we are not the traditional creatives of the industry, but we are curators, museum directors, gallery owners, gallery assistants, you know, demographic within the business sector of the visual arts. And we started with five women, all of whom I worked with at Christie's. This was I mean, I left Christie's in 02/2005. So I started in 1999. And by the time I was starting to write the mission for Power Arts, each of us had left Christie's and wonderfully, we're working about a block away from each other in different spaces.
Sara Cardona Kay:One of us was at the Met. One of you know, I was at my office at Cruze. You know, someone was at the Whitney where we all just migrated north. And I think I sat around and complained a while and someone said to me, Well, you know, that's nice that you can do that, but, you know, maybe you can do something about it. And it prompted me to look at other organizations that champion women in their industries.
Sara Cardona Kay:And when I did the research, which took me probably six to nine months, there was a professional group for women in every industry, even the most niche ones, you know, women in engineering of space. I mean, like the most niche industries had a space for women to come together. And then the mission was dependent on what that industry needed, although they're so alike. What was shocking was that there wasn't really anything like power arts in our industry. There was another organization that I was a member of, and they you know, they were more a traditional networking group.
Sara Cardona Kay:But there was no space and a voice that said, these are the challenges. This is what we want to change. These are the real things going on that sometimes we don't even talk about between each other. Like, let's get together and figure some stuff out. There wasn't that kind of pro act of voice and action.
Sara Cardona Kay:So I looked at all these great organizations and I said, I like that. That makes sense. This doesn't work for us. And I I tailored it to what I needed at the time, what my closest girlfriends needed at the time, and the common challenges that I saw throughout the industry. So I wrote the mission.
Sara Cardona Kay:I bought a bottle of wine. I invited a bunch of these ladies to my office, and I read the mission. I said, Who's in? And they all raised their hand. Of course they did.
Sara Cardona Kay:All right. Well, you know, you have an idea and it's in your head. Right?
Martina Halloran:You know, trust me. I get it. I get it. I had an idea that was in my head and I'm so fortunate that it's it's happening.
Sara Cardona Kay:It works. Yeah.
Martina Halloran:But I but I hear you because networking is so fundamentally different. You know, there's countless networking spaces out there, but but organizations that really have a mission that the intention is to change circumstance, they're all not equal. And creating the space that you felt you needed and your friends and your girlfriends needed is pretty powerful. And it takes a lot of courage, especially in an industry like the art world.
Sara Cardona Kay:I was noticing that I was becoming increasingly angry. That's a path. Right? To to just talk to people in our, you know, closed faces, you know, with a martini and say, we're angry. We're angry.
Sara Cardona Kay:Okay. But it gets old. Yeah.
Martina Halloran:Absolutely. And it can hurt you not only professionally, but personally. And you're not even at some point, you're operating in a way that you're not even aware of. And so I think community is so critical no matter what industry that you're in in that community that is really supporting this healthy social professional path forward, and is giving you real tactical solutions, if you will. Sometimes you can't change everything.
Martina Halloran:But if you can help somebody build their wheelhouse of how to navigate, because that's the first step. How do I navigate in this space successfully to move towards the line of how do I then impact change and make comprehensive or fundamental changes that need to happen to support the community that I'm building and part of. So your career has taken you through some of the most prestigious institutions in the art world, in the world for that matter. What experiences sparked your spirit of giving to wanna do more in your field? I know we talked a little bit about there was a void, but was there anything that really happened that really said, I need to really help other women because this is happening?
Sara Cardona Kay:I did not come from a posh family with a bunch of money and a great pedigree. I was raised by a single mother in Queens, New York. Everything that came my way that I was smart enough to grab and do something with, I consider myself extremely fortunate. Extremely fortunate. One, because those opportunities opened up to me, but also because, you know, I was going to build a career, and I did, in something that's my passion.
Sara Cardona Kay:Right. That is no small thing to to spend your time, your work life doing something that I don't just enjoy it. It is me. I'm obsessed with the art. You know, there's no there has been good and bad.
Sara Cardona Kay:There's been no separation between that and my life. I think as I began to succeed more and more in the industry and with the help of hundreds of others that supported me, that champion me, it was a natural. Well, I didn't get here alone. I didn't come into the world with this. And that's something that I think because of my family.
Sara Cardona Kay:You know, it's this sense of gratitude.
Martina Halloran:That is really powerful. I think we come from a similar space. My conversations with people about gratitude, and how they've made progression in their careers. There's a common theme that we didn't get here alone. I talk often about food justice, because I came from a food insecure household.
Martina Halloran:I was a free lunch kid working in the beauty industry where people think everything is perfect and gorgeous, and we're all we all have perfect lives, which is absolutely not the case. Though I had such tremendous support along the way, I had people cheering me on, rooting for me, creating space for me, creating opportunities, and and then taking them and running with them. And I think that's critical for women, especially women who haven't had access in any space. And without access, people are left just watching and not participating. The idea of what you're doing in your organization is so exciting, because you are coming from a place of passion.
Martina Halloran:And I think passion can drive people to the finish line. This wasn't just a professional network. Clearly, it was a call to action. What are you hoping to give women? What do you feel is really missing right now?
Martina Halloran:Like, you've been on this journey for eighteen years. So if you took a look out today and said, what can I offer? What can we do for women in this space today? What do you think that might look like?
Sara Cardona Kay:I think permission is a big deal at any age, at any spot in your career, any place in your life. Having women around you to give you permission, because we're not we're not given that in the outside world. No, the opposite. Not only not given permission, but we're told no, no, no doubt yourself, everything around you, clamp a dent, like all of that. So I think having a place where you can go and speak freely, that you're encouraged to speak freely.
Sara Cardona Kay:Talk about things like money. Yeah. Let's just talk like, how uncomfortable is that for so many women? Money. Let's talk about money.
Sara Cardona Kay:Let's talk about, you know, how you breastfeed and do an art fair. Let's talk about that. You know, let's talk about you didn't know how to negotiate your salary or someone was harassing you in the office. As you said, these are these can be very practical tools. Right?
Sara Cardona Kay:So that's another thing. I think it's the permission to say what you need to say, A space to be witnessed, just witnessed. You know, you tell a woman something and she listens to you. That can make all the difference. I've had so many amazing encounters, but I can remember sitting with a woman who is just heroic in my field.
Sara Cardona Kay:And she was I was in the back of her car and I was telling her a story about being sexually harassed by a client. She had a comeback that was so her own, but so good and so funny. I never would have thought of that, you know, and she just said it. So she was candid. She was generous.
Sara Cardona Kay:She was funny. She shared her tool. You know, all of those things. And she made it lighter. And she made me feel like, oh, I could say something like that.
Martina Halloran:Easily. Easily. I think the wisdom of women is very powerful. When you look at the history of talking about pay, when you look at the history of talking about harassment in the workforce, the history does not support us. Right?
Martina Halloran:There's so many factors, and to be almost validated by another woman to say, you got this. You can say that. You're empowered, you have permission. Permission is a big conversation, because I think permission has moved into this silent space where you go into a meeting, and you may very well be the CEO, or the head of the consulting company, or the owner of the brand, and people will direct conversation to other people. When you are really the decision maker in the meeting, they are silently shutting down your permission.
Martina Halloran:Because they don't wanna be exhausted by saying something to you. Women today are finding their voice in a different way, and women that have been in industries for twenty years, thirty years. There's an awakening now that was always there, but I think we're emboldened and empowered by this emerging young voice to be like, no, you don't have to take that in a meeting. That's an excuse me. The decision here lies with me.
Martina Halloran:And I think that permission that has tried to move into this silent space of disrespect, I would say it is. It can be often. It's enabling people to recognize that, and giving them the tool to understand what's happening. And younger women, I find when I'm having conversations, they are not tolerating it. And I love that.
Martina Halloran:And that's pretty powerful.
Sara Cardona Kay:I've witnessed that too. The generation or generations under me and and you, they have a different way of showing up.
Martina Halloran:Yes.
Sara Cardona Kay:And that's great. That's great. And it's so new. It'll be really fascinating to see what that looks like. You know, is that gonna change who's at the top in twenty, thirty, forty years time?
Sara Cardona Kay:Mean, there's just because we've never really seen things like that in a large scale.
Martina Halloran:Absolutely. Somebody recently shared this with me and said, this younger generation has found their mental health and they're not letting go of it. And I thought that was really interesting because I think work challenges, whether it's you're not being heard, you're not being validated, you're not given the credit for the work, it's going to a male counterpart, or you're not being in a space of pay equity, that erodes somebody's mental health over time. Right? That's And I just thought that was such a brilliant statement that these young people are saying, I am going to be happy, healthy, and whole professionally, and this is what it looks like for me.
Martina Halloran:I don't care what my manager is saying, but I have a different mindset around what a healthy work environment looks like. And young women are really stepping up and leaning in and saying, this is not good for me, So I'm gonna take my skill set somewhere else. And while I feel that there's this moment of all of these women such as yourself that are really moving in a direction to focus their work on uplifting others, whether it's through mentorship, advocacy, education. What does generosity look like? What can we do in terms of sharing with our listeners?
Martina Halloran:Like in that space, what can you do to support other people in the actual space? Not behind closed doors, not on a one on one. How are women coming into this space and how are other women supporting them?
Sara Cardona Kay:First of all, I love what you just said because I've never heard it said so directly that these that this new generation is prioritizing their mental health. That is key. That is key. And when, you know, we're talking about generosity, we're talking about giving, we're talking about role modeling, that is the foundation for all of it. So when I think about how to be generous with colleagues now, incoming, you know, next gen, I think about first taking care of myself, right?
Sara Cardona Kay:And it's not something like prioritizing my well-being. Because when I prioritize my well-being, I can role model for somebody else. That's happened, you know? And I've been this sort of loud one in boardroom, and my assistant said to me, Can I do that? I said, yes.
Sara Cardona Kay:Not only can you, but you should go for it.
Martina Halloran:Right.
Sara Cardona Kay:Right. But but that but that was me showing up for me. I think just being present and being accessible. Right. And I think you have to be also taking care of yourself when you're doing that.
Sara Cardona Kay:Right. You have to say, Okay, let's talk for fifteen minutes. I can meet you for a coffee or come back to me with the three questions. Right? You always have to be taking care of yourself before you can extend that to anybody else.
Sara Cardona Kay:I think a lot of individuals. Some to me because I'm accessible as a person. I like people. But really, I am interested in seeing these women succeed. I'm psyched about it, you know?
Sara Cardona Kay:And and and whatever way within what I can give, I can do that. It's a win. You know? It's just a win.
Martina Halloran:Well, it clearly sounds like it's coming from a place of authenticity. And often people will say to me, if your cup isn't full, you can't fill somebody else's cup. But I think you said something really important that it's specifics. You can show up for people and be really present. I have fifteen minutes.
Martina Halloran:You know, that way there's an understanding of this is what I can give you right now, or come back with the three questions. This is what I can support you in. I think part of trying to support people, especially women trying to create space for other women in industry, you do have to set boundaries, and understand how much you can actually give. Because there is a limit to what you have, and how are you taking care of yourself, and how are you nurturing yourself. So you can really support people and be present.
Martina Halloran:So that fifteen minutes is really rich in that fifteen minutes, and it's not just eight minutes and a little wandering and looking at your phone. And I think that's really important for people to understand that it's not about quantity, it's about quality of being present for somebody. And that can be a game changer in somebody's day. Especially when I've met with young women or emerging voices in this space who came out of a rough meeting, and they're literally falling apart. That fifteen minutes can be a game changer for them.
Martina Halloran:And that's all you need. That's all you need.
Sara Cardona Kay:You need the ear of one wise, kind woman. Right?
Martina Halloran:Kind.
Sara Cardona Kay:Kind and wise.
Martina Halloran:Kind and wise.
Sara Cardona Kay:To sit and to listen and to be like, you got this. Yeah. You
Martina Halloran:got this.
Sara Cardona Kay:It's a total game changer.
Martina Halloran:Yeah. There's that voice in your head. And I think when you Some people come into life with a voice in your head that's saying yes when the world's saying no. My dad was that voice for me over and over and over. When people were saying I would just hear him in my head.
Martina Halloran:Big Marty saying, yes. Yes. Yes. But so yeah. No mystery in my name.
Martina Halloran:I'm named after my dad.
Sara Cardona Kay:That was my grandfather's name. Love Marty's. Love Yeah.
Martina Halloran:Big Marty, little Marty, my whole life. But I think when you can find, you know, somebody that you can You're hearing that voice. You know, Sarah said, I can do this. Sarah said, I belong here. Hearing that word of encouragement in a world that can often just be hitting you with that negative.
Martina Halloran:And it's so small, but yet it is so powerful.
Sara Cardona Kay:Mhmm. I had it yesterday. I I experienced yesterday. I was sitting with a very dear friend of mine who's recently retired. And she said to me, well, I haven't talked to anyone else about this, but I'm I'm I'm thinking of moving to this place.
Sara Cardona Kay:Right? And she talks about all the reasons why. And I said, it's so smart. That makes complete sense. And she goes, really?
Sara Cardona Kay:I was like, of course, you. First of all, you've been talking about this place for I don't know how long. You just gave me a list of all the reasons why this is going to excite you. Right. And I said and she I said, what's you know, what's what's stopping you from thinking that this is going to happen?
Sara Cardona Kay:Because to me, I see it very clearly. And she said, Well, you know, there are people in the community that probably won't support this decision. And I said, Well, that's not your community.
Martina Halloran:That's exactly what I'm thinking in my head. Those are not your people. Those are not your people.
Sara Cardona Kay:Said to me, But, Sarah, you don't understand. You're so generous. You said generous. I said, I'm sorry for you. You call that generous.
Sara Cardona Kay:Okay. I accept it. But I guess that's the reality. You know, the generosity of rooting for somebody else, of the generosity of our encouragement, the generosity of like, yeah, I can see that bitch. Are you kidding?
Sara Cardona Kay:Of course. Go for it. You know?
Martina Halloran:And finding that joy in somebody else's success, the more, you know, we have this conversation, I'm dialing in my head too often, I think people cannot find a joy for other people, specifically women. Women can be tough on other women. Yeah. And I try to ground myself in, if this makes sense for this person, if this is their path, it doesn't matter what my path would be. But is this a really great thing?
Martina Halloran:Let's celebrate that. Let's create this space for her to move forward, and really go for what it is that she is looking for, and that is going to fill her cup. But being able to to kind of accept what somebody is doing, I think that's a hard thing often for women. Because sometimes it comes from a place of, I wish I could do that.
Sara Cardona Kay:Well, that's exactly what I was gonna say. And going back to what we said like ten, ten minutes ago, I I can exercise that because I do it for me. Yeah. And I've always done it for me, even when it has looked scary and messy and people are like, that's a bad idea. When someone says that's a bad idea, I'm always like, I'm
Martina Halloran:on. Yes. And that's a.
Sara Cardona Kay:Got someone that upset that I am about to hit something really gold.
Martina Halloran:Yes.
Sara Cardona Kay:You know, golden. Why we're even talking about it is because that is not what we're taught. We're not given those tools. They take the tools and they say, No, here's here's self doubt. Here is scarcity mindset.
Sara Cardona Kay:Yes. You know, all those things here, starvation. Oh, man. You know, like they just give you the wrong tools. And there's a reason that they do.
Sara Cardona Kay:Right? So you need you need a bunch of women that are like, no, I'm taking this tool back and it's mine and I'm going to share it with you. Yes. And then it works.
Martina Halloran:And that's called thriving communities. When you are really fueling people in their mental, physical, emotional states, when you are creating that energy to really thrive, everybody wins. Everybody's successful. And when I say winning, it's not who's got the biggest job, or who's got the biggest home. It's about having this space of just feeling really great in your own skin, going to a role, or a job, or a position every single day that you say, I love this.
Martina Halloran:I am here. I am present. I am going to make impact. There is this real space for conversation to talk about what it is that I want, what it is that my ambition is. Because those are things that were have not been encouraged for women.
Martina Halloran:Are there other women that are giving back and trying to affect change and impact the lives of other people?
Sara Cardona Kay:Totally. Totally. I mean, what I've noticed is, you know, women who are in the industry, even like ten years, you know, which is not a huge amount of time, but it's substantial enough. They are totally interested in seeing the next gen succeed. Totally.
Sara Cardona Kay:I think what happened very early on in the history of power is that we became known as the place for next gen, which I love because it was purposeful, but it wasn't. You know, it was it was rooted in a spirit of generosity. I mean, that was when I wrote the mission, there was actually like a philanthropic. I mean, when I did actually thinking about having philanthropy arm, but the language around it was about giving back. Right?
Sara Cardona Kay:So I think it naturally attracted women that were ten years plus in the field, right, to come and start having that conversation. And it also made space for all these young women. We had women in like high school. Wow. Yeah.
Sara Cardona Kay:I mean, I'm all for it. Like, because the earlier you start talking about these things, the better off you're going to be, the better well armed you're going to be. The art world, especially sadly, because it's luxury, because it's opaque, because it's rooted in all the things that we know it's rooted in. It's that nobody does not lend itself, but it rides itself on this sense of hierarchy. And I was like, that's exactly the kind of thing that's going to keep us behind.
Sara Cardona Kay:That's the exact thing that's going to keep us smaller, less successful, all those things that I that nobody wants to have. Well, some people want to have it, but we don't. So I just wanted to see something different. I wanted to see a place for this young gen to come in, to have a space. It wasn't nomination based.
Sara Cardona Kay:It wasn't, you know, who do you work for? It wasn't who is to get it. You have to be building a career in a particular sector of the visual arts and the business side of it. And we explained very clearly what that is. Right.
Sara Cardona Kay:Or you have to be established in that or you have to be in between jobs like there is a criteria. You have to buy into our values. You have to believe in those values. Well, that's a given.
Martina Halloran:That's a given. If somebody's gonna come to a group like this, you would hope that they are looking to build their wheelhouse of tools and skill sets Because so many of the things you've talked about, any woman could benefit from, really. And you can translate that. If somebody decided to leave the art world, the really incredible thing about what you're doing is she can translate those skills, and those tools into other areas. You've built this incredible career that balances private art consulting with public facing advocacy, which is really interesting.
Martina Halloran:Where does giving fit into both of these worlds? Because you've said some pretty interesting things about the art world. It is a luxury business. It's inferred that they're meant for certain people. So where does this intersect, and how does it fit?
Martina Halloran:And how do you find the space to connect the two?
Sara Cardona Kay:It's complicated. It's very complicated. You just brought something very complicated to the table, which I'm glad you did because most people don't. And it is it is something that, well, I've had to navigate for decades. The truth is, you know, I made a decision very early on in my career that I'm interested in the commercial side.
Sara Cardona Kay:I like to make money. I do not want to starve. I do not want to be uncomfortable financially. I like to make money, which is why I went in the commercial sector. It's why I'm an art dealer.
Sara Cardona Kay:It was purposeful. And I also started this nonprofit, which if I had to do it again, I'm not sure the structure would be the way that I created it, but that was my mindset then. Fine. Putting that aside because I was in such like a high stakes spot within the commercial sector, I did a couple of things to find balance for myself and to find health, you know, a real healthy place for myself personally. But I also think one that the field benefit from overall.
Sara Cardona Kay:So having this nonprofit and giving back and encouraging others in the industry, although it didn't take much, the women that joined, you know, quickly, they were like, Of course, I'm in that. That didn't take a lot. But in the commercial side, it's it's difficult and it's difficult because obviously we're a business, but it's difficult for another reason. The art world is the the art market is the only unregulated legal industry. Wow.
Sara Cardona Kay:I mean, I did not know that. You imagine what that means internally? Can you imagine the Wild West?
Martina Halloran:Free for I was just thinking free for all.
Sara Cardona Kay:It's so complicated. Now, to make it even more complex, the majority of my clients. Historically and today. Are older men. I would say like 95% of my clients are older and.
Sara Cardona Kay:What do you do with that? So one day I said to one of them, I told him about the thing and he goes, Are female art dealers really a community in need? I said, Well, listen, I didn't say that we're in need, you know, like, come on. However, could things be better for us? Of course.
Sara Cardona Kay:But I speak for every woman in any industry, right? It's universal. As you said, what I'm saying applies to any female listening into this conversation, no matter where she is in the world and what she's doing. So it was constantly bumping up against that kind of thinking and that kind of thinking in many ways dominates the field. Now, what's interesting is you look at the history of the art market, you you look at someone like Betty Parsons, you know, like the first great art, there's many great first female art dealers, right?
Sara Cardona Kay:And now there's so many women that own their own galleries, and there's so there's so many more. But still, still, still, still, you're looking at the top, top, top, top among the professionals and top among the artists. I mean, talk about a crisis in terms of an imbalance. Look at the creative side. That gap is still enormous.
Sara Cardona Kay:Yes. So there's many more of us. But where are we? You know, at what point in the art world are are we? So all of that to say, you know, this question that you asked, it's a very complicated answer and one that I have wrestled with for years.
Sara Cardona Kay:And I have to say that a great victory, both for me personally and of the organization, was a woman who I did marketing for. I would market her exhibitions. I would work as her sort of artist manager. And one day, she took me into the house and she said, Sarah, you worked so hard. I said, well, thank you very much.
Sara Cardona Kay:She goes, I'd like to give you a gift. And I said, okay. And she basically gave the organization a significant sum of money for a number of years. Wow. To be supported by this woman who clearly believed in me and clearly believed in the organization.
Sara Cardona Kay:Talk about permission. Talk about validation. Talk about support, kindness, generosity. All of it. Game changer.
Sara Cardona Kay:Game changer.
Martina Halloran:Mentorship is moving into sponsorship. And what I mean by that, sometimes I think mentorship for some people can end up being a little nebulous. Sometimes that door is so big, and so heavy, and so hard to open that you need sponsorship. You need me, you need Sarah to just open the door, and you walk in with them, and help them, and pull up a chair, and it's a seat at the table. I think women are afraid to do that for other women, because you're placing your bets on somebody else other than yourself.
Sara Cardona Kay:Mhmm. So sad.
Martina Halloran:It really is sad, but I will say somebody did that for me, and gave me such a powerful voice that I am so committed to move my support from looking only like mentorship to sponsorship. Because people are ready at different parts in their career. They need different things. But if people don't have exposure, especially on the business side, because as you're talking about all of these incredible women that are on the business side in the art world, it's the same thing with any Clearly, I'm on the business side of the skincare industry, the beauty industry. If you are not giving women exposure to these different situations, they will never learn how to lean in.
Martina Halloran:They will never see it in action. They will never see it in motion. They'll see it for men. So I consciously have thought about what is moving consistently in space. What is moving from mentorship to evolving to sponsorship on a more regular basis?
Martina Halloran:And I'm so humbled by this conversation because what you're doing is so powerful for women and helping also women recognize the permission piece. What do you think sponsorship can look like?
Sara Cardona Kay:Well, sponsorship in the way that you're defining it within the organization is that I hire women. I hire women staff. I hire I hire women service providers. I mean, all of my personal service providers are women.
Martina Halloran:Love that.
Sara Cardona Kay:Organization does it. If I'm not going to support me, who's going to you know, it's like, who's going to support us if we don't?
Martina Halloran:Right.
Sara Cardona Kay:Right. So employ employ women. Hey, women. You know, we pay all of our speakers. Is like almost unheard of.
Sara Cardona Kay:We pay them like a real speaker rate. The museums in Manhattan don't pay their speakers. It is insane. We pay every single person that speaks on a program. I have a real funny relationship to mentorship as it has previously existed.
Sara Cardona Kay:And I say that because women don't need to work more. Right. They don't need to give more necessarily in that way. Right. So sometimes mentorship, if it's not in a more defined presentation, manifestation, right?
Sara Cardona Kay:It's like more work for a woman. No, no. So I like that you're using the word sponsorship, but I think about the way I do it naturally with some of my closest friends. You know, we're each other's like business strategists.
Martina Halloran:Yes. I love that.
Sara Cardona Kay:Alright. What do you think about this idea? What do you think about these numbers?
Martina Halloran:I often encourage people to have their own board of directors. If your goal if you wanna if you see yourself in the CEO seat, the president seat, the GMs, whatever role it is, who is your inner circle? Who is your board of directors? And how do you strategize with them? If you are really thinking about mentorship, sponsorship, then that advocacy piece, and how are you advocating for yourself?
Martina Halloran:I think you have to operate as well. Hopefully, we give people information, guidance, tools, support, and then they start kind of morphing that into a dynamic that's really healthy and right for them. Because to your point, women don't need to be doing I don't wanna hear about superwoman. I don't wanna hear about like, she can do it all. She can do this.
Martina Halloran:She can do that. She can sprint 10 miles while she's breastfeeding and you know, stay up all night and do a presentation, walk into the office and be flawless. I don't wanna hear about it anymore. It's unattainable. It's unrealistic.
Martina Halloran:It's unhealthy. So I've stayed grounded in the see it be it. And I know that my actions in the office are important. So if if people can see me walking into the board meeting relaxed, if people see me fully prepared, if people see me leading the conversation with my board members who the majority of them are men, and an incredible organization who have embraced the vision of me, the vision of The US arm of the business, and have allowed us to grow. Our business in The United States is led 70% by women.
Martina Halloran:We've really been able to change the game of what a brand can look like. The conversation has to go more to tactical action for some women, because sometimes they need that practice moment. We have opportunities to really create space for women, to really have an emerging voice, and really build a career.
Sara Cardona Kay:You know, we have very clear core values, which you can read on the website. I'm very proud of them because they resonate, because they're important, and because we use words like safety. And I talk about financial safety, emotional safety, physical safety, mental, you know, all those types of things. And it takes the management to imbue those values and to also have an action plan that's according to those values. Right?
Sara Cardona Kay:You know, it's it's telling the woman, you really should take a vacation.
Martina Halloran:I'm a firm believer in work life balance. I don't say that. I am vibe it. You know, I do Pilates and I play golf and I have a dog and everybody needs a moment to pause. And they need to step away from the work to really reorient themselves, and really just to check out.
Martina Halloran:And so I I do encourage everybody in the organization to take time. And it sounds like you take a little time because you are in the Hudson Valley, you're up there, and then you're in New York. So you definitely have this experience from kind of that urban environment, which can be kind of aggressive, and the natural environment of the Hudson Valley, which is so beautiful. How do these spaces influence your relationship with generosity and creativity?
Sara Cardona Kay:Both are inspirational in different ways. You know, I think I need the energy of the city, the exhibitions, the museums, the visiting artists. I need that for my own fuel, inspiration, creativity, drive, happiness, well-being, all of it. And I also need stillness and quiet and trees and small rabbits and, you know, two dozen deer in the field and a porch to just drink my coffee and a place to grow things. I don't really know what happened.
Sara Cardona Kay:There's no reason for it because I grew up, you know, in a in an apartment in New York. You know, why I have such a green thumb is, you know, just a miracle. But I do. During COVID, I studied herbalism. And then, you know, when I went up to the Hudson Valley, I separately got myself into horticulture school.
Sara Cardona Kay:Funny enough, there was another art dealer in the group who I knew, like the world is so small.
Martina Halloran:The world is so small.
Sara Cardona Kay:The world is so small. But I see it really as I mean, no different than what we're talking about in this whole conversation. When I talk about tools, when I talk about nurturing, when I talk about being present, being consistent, showing up, that's what I do with my garden.
Martina Halloran:And that's what Mother Nature does
Sara Cardona Kay:When you are That's what mother nature does.
Martina Halloran:Yeah. And mother nature is very creative. She's resilient. She's had to be in the changing environments that we're in, and how does she nurture? We are so grounded in nature.
Martina Halloran:And I think this is a wonderful wonderful place to to thank you, and take the time to just reflect on the conversation. I think you are doing such incredible work. And I hope this is not our last conversation because I'm interested and I wanna hear more and I have so many more questions, but we'll have to leave it at that.
Sara Cardona Kay:This was such fun. Thank you.
Martina Halloran:Thank you for listening to the Giving Garden Podcast. I hope you're leaving inspired because even the smallest act can spark positive change. If you've enjoyed today's episode, don't forget to like, subscribe and share. The Giving Garden Podcast is produced by Edwin Bautista and edited by Steven West. A special thanks to Helen Palisi for her guidance and generosity.
Martina Halloran:The Giving Garden Podcast is brought to you by Doctor. Hauschka Skincare USA, pioneers in natural skincare for over fifty years in home to the Giving Garden loyalty program. Visit drhauschka.com to learn more.