Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
The Pool Envy Podcast is where real, licensed pool professionals speak up. In an industry overflowing with DIY chatter and surface-level advice, we dive deep into code, compliance, and craftsmanship that set licensed contractors apart. Our goal is to educate and elevate the industry — teaching safety, sharing knowledge, and helping those who build and service pools do it the right way.
From the job site to the code book, this is a pool envy podcast where licensed pool professionals speak up. Code, compliance, craftsmanship, hosted by Jason Davies. License across Wisconsin, Florida, and Texas. Your deep end starts now.
Jason:Alright. Today, we're talking about what happens after the build. Not the pretty photos, not the walk through day, not the look at my new tile moment. The part no one wants to think about. Today, we're talking about what happens when a pool dispute turns official.
Jason:When it moves from job site conversations to paperwork, insurance, and legal channels. And I'm going to say a line that might sting a little, but it's said to help, not attack. Everyone can build a pool until they get caught. Now, when I say caught, I'm not talking about some gotcha moment. I'm talking about getting caught by reality.
Jason:The day something cracks, leaks, stains, trips, fails, won't hold up, or doesn't match what you were told you were buying. But here's the uncomfortable truth. Licensed and unlicensed can both take your money. Licensed and unlicensed can both give you something that looks like a pool. And licensed and unlicensed can both disappoint you.
Jason:So the real question isn't, can they build it? The real question is, what happens after? Before we go any farther, this episode is educational. It's not intended to be legal advice. It's not insurance advice.
Jason:If you're in an active dispute, talk to a qualified attorney in your state, and talk to your insurance professional about your specific situation. I am not here to pick sides. I'm here to talk about how reality works when the talking stops and the evidence starts. Let's de weaponize something right up front. The phrase, I'm going to sue you.
Jason:People say that when they're scared, angry, and generally out of control. And I get it. It's the last lever people think they have. But here's the reality. Court is not customer service.
Jason:It is slow. It's expensive. It's emotionally draining, and it's not automatically produce a check. So if your plan is I'll sue, that's not leverage. That's hope.
Jason:And hope is not a project management tool, and this goes both ways. Homeowners, I'm gonna sue you, doesn't magically fix your pool. Contractors, disappearing doesn't magically erase the problem. It usually just confirms you don't have control of the job. The smartest move on both sides is to understand what actually matters before a dispute becomes formal.
Jason:Let's be honest. Licensing doesn't automatically create craftsmanship. I've seen licensing work that was sloppy. I've seen unlicensed work that looked decent, at least on day one. So what is the difference?
Jason:Licensing changes the accountability landscape. It can create more friction against disappearing. It can create a clearer identity, a clearer trail, and sometimes enforcement mechanisms that varies by state, but the concept is simple. A real business with a real footprint has more gravity than a phone number that can change next week. Now, does that guarantee you'll get treated right?
Jason:No. But it changes the odds that there's something to pursue if things go sideways. Documentation, identity, oversight, sometimes insurance requirements, sometimes boards. So here's the question I want homeowners to start asking, not emotionally, just practically. If something goes wrong, what does accountability actually look like here?
Jason:Because both licensed and unlicensed can take the money, but the after is where the gap shows up. This is where a lot of people, homeowners and contractors, get punched in the mouth by reality. A homeowner thinks, oh, he's insured, so if the work goes bad, insurance makes it right. The contractor might think, I have insurance, so if something goes wrong, it's handled. Most of the time, that's not how it works.
Jason:Commercial general liability is commonly built around bodily injury and property damage, not as a workmanship warranty. And on the bad work issue, coverage questions often hinge on things like where there was an occurrence, what kind of damage happened, and what the policy excludes. In other words, the details matter. Blanket assumptions get people hurt. So here's a clean educational takeaway.
Jason:Insurance is not automatically a redo button. It is not automatically a refund policy. It is not automatically a workmanship warranty. If you're a contractor listening, talk to your broker like an adult and ask, What actually applies to my work? Completed operations, defective work allegations, professional services, and what's excluded?
Jason:If you're a homeowner listening, don't just ask, are you insured? Ask, what does it cover, and what does it not cover? And if someone gets weird and evasive when you're asking that, that's information that you should stick with. This is one reason the lowest price wins model is dangerous. It often means there's no margin for doing it right, no margin for fixing it later, and no real protection when the bill comes due.
Jason:Now, I want to address something you'll hear people say online. You see contractors going to jail. Let me say this carefully and accurately. Most workmanship disputes are civil. That's money, contracts, scope, negligence arguments, not jail.
Jason:Criminal exposure usually shows up when conduct crosses into things like unlicensed contracting, where it's prosecuted, repeat violations, fraud, theft, taking deposits with no intent to perform work, fake licensing, and similar behavior. For example, Florida law explicitly treats certain unlicensed contracting violations as criminal first degree misdemeanor for a first violation, and a third degree felony for repeat violations. That's not me trying to scare you. That's just reality. Some states put teeth into licensing.
Jason:So the clean takeaway is bad work is usually civil. Bad conduct is where criminal exposure can occur. If you keep those two categories separate, you stay sane, you stay accurate. This is the part that hurts, but it's why people need to think before they hire someone. Even if you win on paper, collecting can be a totally different problem.
Jason:If the builder has no meaningful insurance that applies, no assets, no stable business footprint, and no intention of paying, you can spend a pile of money proving you're right, and still never see a dime. That's why you'll hear the term judgment proof. In plain English, there's nothing realistic to collect from. So again, I'm going to sue you is not a plan. A plan is figuring out if there's anything behind the real contract before you sign it.
Jason:Here's where we bring it back to my lane, standards and facts. When disputes turn formal, what survives is relatively boring. What was the scope in writing? What changed? Is that in writing?
Jason:What was documented with photos and dates? What standard or baseline safety framework applies? What happened when? Who did what? And was it verifiable?
Jason:This is why I talk about code and standards so much. Not because code is the whole world, but because codes and standards are shared language. They are minimum baselines. For example, the International Swimming Pool and Spa Code is explicitly written as a set of minimum requirements aimed at reasonable safety, health, and welfare. And electrical safety around pools is its own universe for a reason.
Jason:Because failure isn't just a bad finish. It can be life safety. That's why any c six eighty keeps showing up in these conversations. So here's a line you can take to the bank. Vibes don't hold up.
Jason:Documentation does. Now I want to land this with something practical and fair, because I don't want homeowners paranoid, and I don't want good contractors painted with the same brush as the worst ones out there. A pool is not rocket science in the sense that a lot of people can produce something that holds water for a while. But the hard part isn't getting water in a hole. The hardest part is building something that lasts safely with a process you can defend.
Jason:So here is the most basic reality test I know. If your builder can't point to real people you can talk to, people who will actually answer the phone, then what are you buying? Because years of experience can mean two very different things. It can mean years of learning, refining, building a great track record, and standing behind work. Or it can mean the same bad situation repeated over and over, as long as there's a fresh supply of first time customers who didn't know what to ask.
Jason:So if you're shopping for a builder, don't ask for a pretty portfolio. Ask for after the build proof. Ask them this. Did anything go wrong in the first year, and how did it get handled? Did they communicate when it got uncomfortable?
Jason:Would you hire them again today? Those questions don't attack. They just reveal reality. I'm going to close with the motto behind a lot of what I do. Most pool disasters are preventable before the contract is signed.
Jason:That's not victim blaming, that's reality. Because once the money is gone, your options shrink fast. So whether you're a homeowner or a contractor, here's the North Star guiding light. Build and buy pools that can be audited. Build and buy work that can be proven.
Jason:Build and buy projects where the after is treated as part of the product. And if you're listening thinking, man, I didn't even know what to ask. You're not dumb. The industry just hasn't done a great job of teaching people what matters. That's what this show is for.
Spyder:Thanks for listening to the Pool MV podcast, where licensed pool professionals speak up. Hosted by Jason Davies, licensed across Wisconsin, Florida, and Texas. For more insights, subscribe and join us next time.