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The Restaurant Roadmap is your guide to building and running a successful restaurant. Each episode explores the full journey of operations—from planning and development to menu design, execution, and growth. Hosts Danny Bendas, Amanda Stokes, and Chef Eric Lauer bring decades of expertise, joined by industry leaders and restaurant professionals who share their insights and stories. Together, they uncover strategies, tools, and lessons that help operators improve performance, strengthen teams, and elevate the guest experience. Whether you’re opening your first location or refining an established brand, The Restaurant Roadmap equips you to navigate every step with confidence.
Danny: Welcome to The Restaurant Roadmap podcast, powered by Synergy Restaurant Consultants, your go-to source for actionable insights and real-world strategies from the industry’s top experts, clients, and special guests. Whether you’re building a new concept or refining an existing one, we’re here to help you create a forward-thinking sustainable brand, elevate guest experience, streamline operations and maximize your bottom line. With decades of hands-on experience, our mission is simple: to deliver practical, proven solutions to the everyday challenges restaurant operators face. Let’s dive in and get to work.
Danny: Hello, everyone. Welcome to The Restaurant Roadmap podcast, powered by Synergy Restaurant Consultants. We have two of our fantastic consulting people with us. Amanda, Say hello, Amanda.
Amanda: Hey, everyone. Happy to be here as usual.
Danny: And Eric, how are you doing today, sir?
Eric: Super fantastic, Danny. Happy to be here.
Danny: All right. And expialidocious on top of that, right? So, very cool. So, today’s subject is, we’re going to continue with the front-of-house service, hospitality. We talked in our last podcast, the first episode, about the importance of the front-of-the-house.
It’s your first touch point. How does leadership manage the front-of-the-house, what type of service systems do you have, having a consistent service model and a whole bunch of stuff. So, I wanted to throw it to you guys real quick to see if there’s anything else you want to bring up, anything we missed, just to do a little bit of recap before we get into part two, which is more of the nitty gritty of really being ready to give great service. So Amanda, I’m going to start with you.
Amanda: I think we touched on a lot of the systems that make leaders successful, but something I don’t think we touched on is, you know, you go to these restaurants and everyone talks about their rockstar servers. You know, those are the people that they put on the best shifts. And in my experience, rockstar servers generally exist in restaurants where there’s very little systems or people not following systems. So, in my opinion, you could have a team full of rockstars if you’re well trained and systems are being followed and leaders are engaged. It’s an opportunity for the entire front-of-the-house team to be like rockstars. So, I think that’s something to think about. And a lot of managers hang their hat on that one server. “Oh, we’ve got Becky, and she’s fantastic.” Well, you should probably, if you have 20 servers, you need at least 75% Becky.
Danny: You need more Sues and Jills and Johns and Charlies. Eric, anything you want to add?
Eric: No, I just think Amanda brings up a great point there. I think back to a project we did last year and the owner was raving about this one server. And then we asked, “How come the server is only working lunch?” “Oh, because she can’t work with anybody else.” [laugh]. That makes you a rockstar because you can’t work with anybody else? I think that makes you a terrorist. Let’s be honest. Get out of here. You need a team player. Come on.
Danny: That’s a really interesting paradigm, right?
Amanda: I remember that, Eric. Oh, I’d forgotten. I think I blocked that out. I think I still have some PTSD from that, but I remember that. And the sad thing was, if she would have been properly managed instead of, like, let loose, I think she probably would have worked better with other people.
Eric: Absolutely. There you go. Systems and tools. If you work your people through the systems and tools, right, they all work cohesively. It’s when you allow them to go rogue and do their own thing, that’s where you get these issues that pop up.
Danny: Well, and I think another challenge is, if you only have a few rockstar servers, there’s this tendency to say, okay, you got to put the A team on Friday and Saturday and Sunday, and if you come in on Monday, you got all your B team people, and you end up doing a crappy job so your early week business suffers, right? And the other point I wanted to bring up, we talked about labor and managing. First impressions. You walk in the door and if you’re greeted with an inexperienced or very nice greeter—and typically, we put the less experienced people at the front door, which is a big mistake, we talked about that earlier—or I think the other point I wanted to bring up, oftentimes, when you’re looking at ways to save labor, you send a hostess home so there’s nobody at the door when you walk in. So, you walk in and you don’t exactly know what to do.
It’s like walking into somebody’s house and nobody’s home, right, so it creates just sort of that initial feeling of discomfort, even before nobody has said anything, nothing has happened. You already have this negative feeling, right? It’s always kind of driven me crazy. So, I think we always advocate—and I’m sure you guys would agree—always have somebody at the front door because that’s the first impression.
Eric: And the final impression, right? They can open the door for them on the way out and say, “We really appreciate you coming in. Please come and see us again soon.” So, that’s a huge, huge point, too.
Danny: So anyway, anything else before we move into today’s topics anybody?
Amanda: Yeah, I think as we talk through front-of-the-house operations, when you think about it, they should be designed around the guest journey and not around job titles. So, we talk a lot about the guest journey, and it’s really important, especially when we’re helping our clients, kind of define what that service model looks like, we always talk through things in a very granular group-think way about what is this guest going to encounter, what does the journey look like? So, I think modeling that from the guest perspective, you know, puts you ahead of the competition, just from the moment somebody walks in the door.
Danny: Yeah, as we talked about steps of service or the guest experience, from the time they park the car to the time they get in their car, what all needs to happen so they have a great experience, right? All right, so let’s get into the nitty gritty. And I was going to also mention, you know, like, we talked about how important hospitality in the dining room is, and it supersedes the front-of-the-house, I was just going to say, being a back-of-house guy, I was going to argue about that, but we talked about not having a war between front and back, so I didn’t want to start one. So, [laugh] we’re going to move on from there. So anyway.
So, we’re going to talk about some nitty gritty things to get ready to give great service and great hospitality. So, we’re going to start off with setup systems. And I’m going to throw this one to you, Amanda. What do you need to do to make sure you’re ready, so you’re not scrambling, you’re not running around, everybody’s heads in the game, the energy is high, and you’re ready to deliver on the brand promise?
Amanda: So, I think when you are running an effective front-of-the-house, it starts way before that shift, even you’re even thinking about that shift. It starts foundationally with great schedules. So, when you’re writing a great schedule and not being a lazy person who’s going to copy and paste week over week over week over week, it’s being really intentional about looking at the guest flow, when are they coming in the door, and being efficient that way. So, I think it starts before that day. And then making sure that there are systems in place for your team.
So, as people are coming in, they are busy, there’s things for them to do, they know exactly what they have to get, you know, ready for the guest, and everybody is playing a part in getting that restaurant set up. And then from there, the restaurant is set up, the manager goes around, checks and make sure that, hey, every single detail is covered so that when the guest walks in the door, it’s very clear that we’re ready for them and we’re waiting. So, I think having great checklists, having great schedules, making sure that everybody knows what their role is. And you know, nobody wants to walk through the door and feel like they’re walking into a restaurant that’s not ready for them.
Danny: Everybody’s running around and scrambling right?
Amanda: It’s not a good feeling for the guest. And even worse than that, if there’s anything worse, it’s not really good for the team members that are working there because nobody wants to work under that type of pressure. So, those are things that you know, back in the day, a hundred years ago, when the dinosaurs were roaming the earth and I was running a dining room, those were things that I would look for.
Danny: You were running the cave?
Amanda: Exactly. Fred and Wilma would roll up in their little stone car. And, you know, those would be some of the things I would look at.
Danny: Yeah. So, you know, we used to, at one of my last jobs before consulting, as the manager toured the dining room as part of their opening checklist, if they saw anything wrong in the dining room, like that, there was something wrong with the table, we trained our managers just to pull out the chair, and then the servers knew there was something wrong there. And we wanted them to figure out what it was and fix it because it was just a good, timely learning lesson so they knew better next time, versus fixing it, right? So, then they just understood the expectation. And it became kind of a game after a while, it became something that was kind of fun, right?
Amanda: You know, I always advocated for making sure the restaurant was as set and ready to go from the night before. So, one of my least favorite activities would be, you know, going around and having to wipe down tables or sweep under tables that were missed and things that were missed. It doesn’t feel good for the team members to come in and have to finish the close because it was just a lack of consideration or a lack of leadership at night. So, I think, you know, the way you close plays a really big part in getting that guest experience right when you open the doors.
Danny: Yeah, and then also it builds team camaraderie, you know, the closers help the openers, the openers help the closers, and it’s just, you know, it’s good team building kind of thing too, right? So, Eric, what say you, sir?
Eric: Well, you guys kind of talked about everything under the sun there, so maybe I’ll just expand a little bit about something Amanda kind of quickly glossed over was the front-of-the-house manager who copies and pastes their schedule week over week over week over week. And nothing’s more evident. And I remember going through this as a young manager, was that Monday holiday, and they copied and pasted a schedule from one Monday to a Monday holiday. And you roll into Monday holiday lunch, and you have two servers, and the entire dining room is going to get sat because it’s Monday holiday. It’s not a normal Monday.
And now everybody is scrambling, it’s not a fun shift, and then the closing manager walks in at, you know, three o’clock after everybody left, and they look around and they go, “What did you guys do all day? It looks like crap in here.” And you want to punch him in the face, especially if it was the service manager who wrote that schedule and set you up for failure. Yeah.
Danny: The place is a wreck, right? You get to fix it or you get to clean it up, right?
Eric: [laugh]. Exactly, exactly. That brought up a bad memory for me with that copy and paste, Amanda, so definitely wanted to expand on that a little bit.
Danny: And that’s where solid manager meetings come in, projecting next week’s volume, making sure you’re ready to go, right? You know, the other thing we used to do, like, this might be something that could help people, if you know you’re going to have busy lunches, we used to have everything set up—because we used to get busy right as we opened, just based on where we worked—and so we used to have our servers basically at the hostess desk ready to go, and the first table they got, they sat. And then you could kind of rotate the guests by each server. And it just sort of got the pace going, and the servers escorted the guests to the table. It was just a nice way to start things off. Anyway, just something else to think about.
Amanda: You know, nowadays, when you think about it, the guest experience starts way before they pull into your parking lot. It starts when they check you out online. So, when you think about the guest journey, you know, it’s 2026—hard to believe—but the guest journey starts the moment they search you online, and what does your website look like? Is it easy to navigate? Is your menu up to date? You know, is it user friendly and intuitive? And so, I think that’s something that’s really important in this day and age, and can’t be overlooked.
Danny: It’s all about the details, right, because people notice things subliminally or otherwise, right? So, Eric, we talk about service systems. The guest promise, consistency of service. So, I want you to take some time talking about that initially, and then we’ll go around the horn.
Eric: Every type of restaurant has their own service system, and every individual restaurant within those service types also has a service model that they want their team to follow. And I think it’s important, as a front-of-the-house manager, as a general manager, that you’re in the dining room and you’re recognizing the behaviors that you want to see from your service team, whether it’s fast casual, quick service, counter service, full service, fine dining, you want to recognize the proper behaviors from your team and really put those on display and give the people the props they deserve when they’re demonstrating them. And then when you see the behaviors that you don’t want to see, you’re coaching them real, in time, in the moment. Not in the middle of the dining room. You don’t want to discourage somebody in front of their guests. You don’t want that to happen, but you want to ensure that whatever your service model is, that’s what you’re following, that’s what you’re doing, and you’re coaching to it and developing your people to give the best service that they can within your model.
Danny: And I think, you know, having good support systems, to your point about servers, and, you know, taking time, order accuracy, just all of those things make it easier on everybody, kitchen, front-of-house, back-of-house, table turns, and everything else. So Amanda, anything else you want to add?
Amanda: Yeah, I know we’ll probably talk about the steps of service, but for me, it’s about making sure that it doesn’t seem like—your service style doesn’t seem robotic, whatever it is that you do. So, we are fortunate enough to help a lot of clients open up restaurants, and in that when we’re helping to define what the steps of service are. You know, I like to help them to write training materials that are very personal, meaning, I will wait on a table much differently than Eric would, I’m sure, back in the day. Meaning, I want Eric to bring his whole self to work. These are the five or eight things we want you to touch, but you do it the way you do it.
And Danny, you do that the way you do it, meaning—you know, I think we talked about this in a prior podcast where you said you worked with a consultant that would introduce himself and say, “Hi, I’m your guest,” because he got tired of hearing that same robotic way of greeting a table. So, I think it’s giving a team members the autonomy to bring their entire self to work, and especially if they’re funny and engaging, and you know, and then, from a service standpoint, making sure that if a restaurant says they want a particular service style, that they’re equipped to spend the labor in order to deliver that, not putting too much burden on the team member and asking too much of them because then we know that goes sideways really fast.
Danny: Yeah, I want to throw something else out, just for conversation here, you know, server support, and I think we always advocate for what do we do to keep a server in the dining room serving, as opposed to, we always use the idea, if you’re going to require the server to make a dessert, they’re never going to sell any because they don’t want to take the time. You’re forcing them to be off the floor. And you know, we’ve actually had scenarios with other clients where, if you have bus people, we set up a system where the bussers came in and did all the side work, took care of the running side work, and the servers just stayed in the dining room. And of course, you know, the bussers got tipped and stuff like that. The servers loved it because they came in, they waited tables, you know, who loves doing side work, right? Who loves doing roll ups?
So, it ended up being a really good system. And we did that for a client because they had a lot of problems with server turnover and that became a pretty strong selling point for a server. You know, you don’t work as many hours, but if you’re in a tip credit state, it’s like, who cares? I don’t have to do all that side work. I wait tables and I make money and I leave. So, any other thoughts on this whole server support? Got to make it easier for the servers to serve, versus doing a whole bunch of things just detracting or taking them away from that.
Eric: I agree a hundred percent, right? Put your servers in front of the guests. That’s where they need to be. They need to be taking care of the guests, giving them the service they need, and then, you know, especially today’s day and age, with the handhelds, they can ring something up without even leaving the table. It can be to the table before anything right?
So, I think it’s very important that you utilize that system where the server is in the dining room as much as possible. They have to leave it once in a while, and we all understand that, but server assistants, bussers, whatever you want to call them, they should be doing the bulk of the grunt work, and your server should be doing what they should be doing. It’s just common sense. It makes the guest experience seamless and they really get impacted in a positive manner when the servers are out in the dining room all the time.
Amanda: Yeah, I think, to Eric’s point, so he’s looking at this through the lenses of hospitality, I’ll look at it through the lenses of throughput, right? So, if we have a person in the dining room, a server, pacing the table and getting them through and moving the meal along at a good pace because that person in the back is making sure the food comes out, you know, we could potentially get an extra table turn, thus generating additional revenue. And so, I think pacing is really important. When you have the right team in place, you could really manage the pace, and not just for throughput and ultimately profitability, but it’s creating an experience that’s paced the way the guest wants it.
Danny: And, you know, yeah, and in our last episode, we talked about, you know, team service systems, where you have a front waiter or back waiter. You know, they can have a few more tables because there’s two of them, but that does help you keep one in the dining room and the other one, sort of like front waiter, back waiter, kind of thing, which, I think that’s an interesting concept. And, you know, it goes back to the old classic French service style, you know, in a modified fashion.
Eric: Danny, just to touch back on to something you talked about with servers making desserts. We were actually in a restaurant maybe last year, maybe the year before, and not only were the servers making desserts, they were also making the salads. So, you can—and the soups—so you can imagine how much of those items they were selling. And this restaurant actually moved the cooler from the kitchen into the server alley so they could accomplish making salads out there. And it just negatively impacted the kitchen’s ability to get food out in a timely manner because they were down a piece of equipment.
And it negatively impacted the guest service because the servers in the back throwing slop together in a bowl and calling it salad. And it negatively impacted the cost of goods because they don’t have any portion controls, and they don’t know what’s going on there, and they’re going to give you extra croutons because they think they’re going to get a better tip. So, your statement kind of reminded me of that. So, I wanted to bring that up.
Danny: One of the last places I worked at, not only did they do all of that, but they also had to make milkshakes, right? So, imagine the morale, you know, and how long you’re trying to—and hand-scooped. This wasn’t like soft serve, this was hand-scooped ice cream, right? But hey, before I forget, I’m going to say this. Remember those things, write them down because we’re going to do a podcast on Synergy’s funniest stories, right?
Not that we’re trying to criticize, but just have a little fun to just give some tips and kind of a fun way of we’ve been around, we’ve been doing this for a long time. We’ve seen a lot of stuff. I think sharing our fun stories and learning experience can be very helpful for our audience going forward. So Eric, today is your lucky day. We’re going to ask you to talk about technology to keep you in the game here. So, how does technology help—or not—in this whole service strategy?
Eric: You have to balance your guest expectations versus the use of technology, right? So, if you’re in a situation where the guests don’t want to see the technology, I probably wouldn’t recommend that our servers go out in the dining room with handhelds, you know? But if the guest expectation is somewhat different, a little less elevated, then definitely use those handhelds out in the dining room. Use technology to be on your side. One of the worst aspects of being in a restaurant is when you’re done eating and you’re sitting there and you’re waiting to pay, and you’re waiting to pay, and you never see your server, and 30 minutes goes by, and you’re like, oh my goodness, you know, then you get hungry again and you want to order another meal, but then you can’t pay again, so it just starts a doom loop, and you don’t want involved in that at all. So, technology is good. I think you definitely want to use it in the dining room all the way throughout, from the front door, to the service staff, to the beverages, the bar, everything, you want to use it in the front-of-the-house when it’s applicable and it makes sense.
Danny: But not as a replacement for great hospitality. Because I think that’s sort of what’s scary with whether it’s AI and a lot of these things. And there was a brand that was around for a while, many years ago, where it was all order at the table with a QR code. The problem was—you know, I actually went to experience it because it was a relatively new thing back at the time—if there was a mistake or you wanted, like, an extra sauce, you couldn’t find anybody to come check on you because it became so technology reliant, and that are working the opposite way. But I like that idea of not paying. That’s a hell of a way to boost your average share.
Amanda: You know, I think we’re very fortunate living in an era where there’s a lot of technology that helps really support the workflows and helps get people through. We talked about throughput. And so, I think it’ll never be a substitution for human connection, but you know, implementing technology where it makes sense, think about online ordering platforms that can integrate KDS, understand what your current KDS times are, and be able to accurately quote a guest for when their to-go order is. So, when you think about all of these things, for me in the front-of-the-house, I love the idea that our host doesn’t have to do a lot of math these days, where it can understand the flow of what’s happening in the dining room, and then, you know, help them to make better decisions based on what’s actually happening. You know, our host hate to overpromise and underdeliver, so usually they’ll tell a guest 25 minutes more than it’s actually going to be to cover their tails, and now we have great systems that can be super accurate based on where people are at their meal.
And so, I think technology like that makes things smoother. I think people love online ordering, you know, not having to talk to a human being. I myself appreciate that sometimes when I’m all out of words and I just want to go online, place an order, pull into a space, pull up, have somebody bring out my bag and be done with the whole thing. So, I love that. I think we’re living in a time where really smart operators who integrate technology in a way that doesn’t create bottlenecks is going to win guests and deliver profitability.
Danny: Yeah, and I’m glad you brought up some of those other things. It’s this whole thing that everything we’re talking about is not just designed—and we’re not talking about just full-service restaurants because, you know, there’s a lot of service given at fast food, fast casual, and there’s a lot of technology tools that can really help that. And then two other things, you know, just, we’re talking a lot about ordering and stuff, but you know, front desk technology, managing tables, whether that’s OpenTable and all of those platforms really help you manage your seating and your flow. And then in busy locations, you know, having some sort of a communication system so your people are communicating in a discrete manner. I think all of those parts of that technology just helps with the overall efficiency of the team, but also the dining experience.
Amanda: I can remember years ago when headsets and radios first came out and people were like, “What are you part of the CIA? Are you landing planes?” Because I work near the airport, like, “What are you doing?” And you know now when you think about it’s so common to go into a restaurant and see people using two-way radios to communicate, speed up throughput service, things that were so strange 20 years ago are not strange anymore.
Danny: Well, same thing with handhelds. Like, if you had a handheld, you know, people thought you were sending a text message to somebody else or they feel intimidated because you’re not looking at them. So, you know, there’s a bit of a learning curve, both for the team. Now, we did a project not long ago where the servers refused to use handhelds because they felt like it wasn’t personal, right? So, it’s just adapting, right, because the world keeps changing.
Amanda: I will tell you a quick funny story, and I know we’re supposed to save them for that other podcast, but I remember one of my restaurants, the frequency was tied to a Target, and it was just hilarious because they could hear us, and so they would be asking questions, and, like, randomly, we would tell them, like, nonsense [laugh]. It was so much fun.
Danny: “Register three is now open,” right?
Amanda: Okay.
Danny: All right. Well, I’m going to ask you, Amanda, now, let’s recover from that comment and talk about recovery systems in the restaurant. How do you take care of a dissatisfied guest?
Amanda: You know, the best recovery systems always begin with the front line, with people that are actually empowered and understand what it takes to make it right for the guest. And so, I think when people feel like they have that autonomy—and I’m not talking, like, when you know a bowl of hot soup lands in someone’s lap, God forbid. I mean, that’s a 911. But when the servers, the hosts feel empowered to do what’s right for the guest, I think you have a great beginning to guest recovery. And I think it’s—you know, we have a saying in the restaurant business. It’s called LAST. I mean, I remember learning it a hundred years ago: Listen, Apologize, Solve and Thank. Because I think the younger managers listen to respond, which means that they’re not actually listening to the guest. And so, most guests that are upset, they just want to be heard, and they want you to validate that how they feel. It isn’t a good feeling, whatever it is. How—not—whatever the guest, even if you don’t agree with it, that’s not our position. Our position is to make it right and show you, know, genuine empathy.
Danny: Yeah, and it’s not always just, well, I’ll give you a free dessert. You really want to get to the root of the problem and solve it and take care of the guest so they feel comfortable on their way out the door. I think the other thing—and Eric, I hope I’m not stealing your thunder here once again—is you mentioned, I think, Eric, you did about saying goodbye to people and teaching your greeters or whoever’s at the front door great recovery techniques because if you can stop someone before they leave, you can salvage them or save them before they tell 20 other people what a bad experience they had at your place, right?
Eric: That’s a great point, and I’ve had that happen multiple times when I was in the restaurant and in operations. Definitely loved when the host, or whoever was at the front door called me up and said, “Hey, make sure you get up here real quick. I got a guest that’s trying to leave and they were not happy.” So, it was great to recover a guest that way. And Amanda brought up a great point, and she said that a lot of young managers and managers listen to respond, and they don’t listen to know what’s going on.
It doesn’t matter what happened. It matters how the guest feels about what happened, and that’s the biggest key. And I think once people understand that, they’ll understand what’s going on. And then take it a step further. Don’t just stop at the table and thank them and solve their issue; trace it back to where the issue began again, right? So, if it was a kitchen issue, go into the kitchen and make sure that no other guests feel that same issue, right? If it happened at the front door, go to the front door. Solve the crux of the issue there.
Whatever it is, don’t just stop at the table because guess what? You’re going to go to the next table and the next table and the next table and continue to have that same conversation. So, do yourself a favor. Go solve the issue. Like, if it’s cold mashed potatoes, go find out why the mashed potatoes were cold. Temp them, taste them, see what’s going on, right? Items like that are just easy to fix. Take the time to do it.
Danny: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, and I think just again, that gets down to touching tables, managers being engaged, managers orchestrating, managers talking. And as, Amanda, you always say, don’t let the customer do the line check for you, right? You guys got to get ready for business and make sure those problems don’t—
Amanda: [unintelligible 00:28:42] you know, a final thought for me is that recovery isn’t about fixing mistakes. It’s the greatest moment of truth to build loyalty. When I think back, you know, when I was running restaurants, you know, some of my best guests came from really bad situations. When it was recovered properly, they began to trust us, we built a great rapport. So, those moments of truth that happen, you know, unfortunately, things go wrong in the restaurant business, is as an opportunity to earn a guest for life if it’s done the right way.
Danny: Yeah, make them feel special. And then I think I don’t remember which one of you said it, but empowering your team to make it right no matter what and then they understand the boundaries, and give them, you know, the ability to make it right and take care of that guest. I think that means a lot to them, right?
Amanda: So, one more thing—and I said I wasn’t going to say another thing, so it wasn’t my final thought—but another thing is the culture of the restaurant, meaning, if the restaurant managers always have this belief that guests are trying to get free stuff, and that’s, like, the overarching belief within the restaurant, it trickles down to the team members, and so, you know, anytime a guest brings something up, like, there’s a defensive nature that the guest is trying to get something for free. So, I think having the right culture in the restaurant, like, the guests are the only reason why we’re here. We’re going to take people at face value and creating the right culture around, you know, the guest can probably prevent a lot of, you know, things that are inflammatory or really bad things from happening.
Danny: I operate from the belief that 99.9% of people are good. You just kind of deal with the rotten eggs when you have to, but you don’t assume that everybody’s a rotten egg, right? So, Amanda, I love when you talk about hiring for hospitality and how you interview. And before I forget, we’re going to do a whole podcast series here coming up on the employee life cycle, so everybody stay tuned for that. It’s going to be as a six part series which I think is going to be really great. And some of what you’re hearing today is going to be in there, but you can’t talk about it too much because this is your life blood, this is what makes you or breaks you. So, what makes a great employee in the front-of-the-house, Amanda?
Amanda: You know, we always say that, you know, people either have the hospitality DNA, it’s in their blood, they’re just warm people, or they’re not. So, the skills that we do in the restaurant business, I would like to say that they—it’s just not, what do you call it, it’s not rocket science. So, I think it’s hiring for that personality more than hiring for skill. You could be a server for 20 years, but not be a hospitable person. So, I think it’s looking for those things first and then during the interview, like, you’re listening to what somebody is saying, but you’re also listening are they connecting with you? Are they making eye contact with you? What’s their comfort level? What’s their speaking cadence?
You know, do they smile when they talk to you or do they seem—I’ve had some crazy stuff, which I will save for our other podcast, during interviews, I’ve had some of the most—like, there was actually one, and for our listeners who were not old enough, like, I seriously thought I was on Candid Camera and I’m not making that up. Like I said, “Am I just—is there”—I looked around. I’m like, this has to be a setup. This can’t actually be a real interview. So, I’ve had some crazy things.
I like to see that somebody can think on their feet. You know, being a server requires not just hospitality. You’ve got to think on your feet. So, I’ve been known to say, sell me this highlighter, and I will hand it to them, and they’re like, “What?” I’m like, “You’re a highlighter salesman. This is your specialty highlighter, Sharpie. Sell it to me.” And the best candidates can always think on their feet and sell this to you and tell you why it’s the best highlighter. I’ve sold a hundred this month, and people are reordering them, and why they’re great. I don’t care what they tell me, as long as they’re creative, they could think on their feet, and the curve ball that I toss to them isn’t so much that it’s going to get them off track.
Danny: And I think the energy level. You know, we always say we don’t want to hire Eeyores, right? Because, you know that energy level is what dictates how they operate, how they smile. And being organized because you got to be organized to be a really good server. Eric, let’s—I got one other thing, but I’m going to give Eric a chance so he doesn’t get mad at us again.
Eric: Well, I just wanted to say, Eeyore actually did work for me at one point. It was pretty fun. But I think Amanda touched on it. You know, it’s about that hospitality gene and making sure most people are going to tell you what they think you want to hear in an interview, but it’s about getting that other 10% out of them that leads you to believe what they’re really like in the culture that you are trying to get going in your restaurant. So, are they going to be a good fit? Are they going to fit with your team? And do they know hospitality, and can they give it to you?
Amanda: The other thing is they, I would say, if you’re the GM of a restaurant or the director in a restaurant, like, it's always interesting to me that a lot of people don’t have the skill set to conduct very productive interviews. I found it, as a GM, to really get engaged and have people sit in on interviews where I conducted the interview, and they just sort of listen, and then as they get in their comfort level, I would sit in and listen to them conduct the interview and just chime in, and then at the you know, when the person left, I was able to provide real-time feedback about the interview. Because it’s interesting, not just from a legal standpoint, right, because people are smart enough to know these days what you can ask and what you can’t ask, but, like, it is one of the most important things you do as a front-of-the-house manager to get your team in place, and it’s always interesting to me why some brands don’t invest more time in that type of training to give somebody the confidence and skills that they need to conduct productive interviews.
Danny: And that’s going to be a big part of our series with the employee life cycle is, you know, you picked the wrong employee, you know, before you start. You know, it’s like receiving back product at the back door. Your quality and your costs are already not what you want, right? So, it all gets back to the basics. But the other thing I want to bring up is I think we’re really looking for people that are sort of entrepreneurial and, like, if I’m a server and I have a three or four table station, and it’s like, that’s my retail space for the next four hours, and I’m not there to just deliver food, I’m there to create an experience, and I’m there to help my guests.
So, I think changing that mindset to I’m just going to deliver food, I’m going to do this and that, and I’m going to get a tip, as opposed to really being an entrepreneur and selling within my retail space for that shift. I think that can really change the mental paradigm that people have, you know, in how they approach being a server. Eric, let’s talk about the relationship between front and back and just general communication. I know you spend a lot of time in both front and the back, so I’m sure you can add a lot to this conversation.
Eric: I think that it’s important that the front-of-the-house is comfortable speaking to the back-of-the-house. If you’re in a restaurant and that culture is divided so much so that they don’t feel comfortable doing that, the guest experience is going to fall downhill quick. You have to have the ability, as a server, to say, “Hey, that doesn’t look good. I don’t want to serve that to my table.” Or, you know, you have to have the ability to say, “Hey, great job back there.”
You know, there’s so many chefs that we’ve seen across many projects where they don’t allow the servers into the kitchen. They don’t allow people to talk. It’s one thing in the heat of the battle, all the communication should go through one person in the QA line there and the expo, but the server should still be able to communicate effectively with the kitchen. And the kitchen has to be able to take that ego, knock it down, and realize that the server is doing the best thing for the guest.
And trust me, I wasn’t always that guy. You know, there’s been a couple times where I put a plate in the window and somebody goes, we’re not serving that, and then I just push it back to him again and say, “Guess what? Now, you are.” You know? So, it’s not… it’s about the guest. It’s not about me, it’s not about the server, it’s about what is best for the guests and how can we best take care of their needs during their visit today.
Amanda: I think Eric touched on a lot of important points, and a lot of things always relate back to the culture within the restaurant. And so, if there’s a culture that’s collaborative between the front and the back, I know that’s the utopia of restaurants, and you know, you have a more cohesive team. I think, you know, there’s always this belief that, well, you know, the servers make all this money, and they have such an easy life, and you know, the cooks don’t get paid as much, and they’re back there and it’s sweaty and it’s hot, I think you create a great culture by, you know, teaching during training, having the server say, “Can I get you anybody any beverages? Can I get you a nice cold soda? Do you guys need anything?”
And I think it’s like teaching people… I don’t want to say teaching people to care about each other, but it is. Our culture is teaching people to care about each other. You’d be surprised when a guy’s in the middle of a shift, how far a Diet Coke goes when he’s really thirsty. And so, you build trust over time by doing things like that. And then I think the kitchen people always appreciate when the front-of-the-house communicates through one person so that they’re not listening to, you know, 25 servers on the floor. So, it’s teaching them that if they need anything, everything funnels through the expediter.
Danny: Yeah, and I think another thing that’s really important that, again, we do a lot of operations assessment work, we don’t see it very often where the front-of-the-house is communicating volume to the back-of-the-house. How many menus are down? Hey, we just had a party at six. You know, hey, we got a little bit of a lull here, so you have time to, you know, restock, you know, whatever that is because, you know, most of the time the kitchen doesn’t see the dining room, so they don’t have any idea what’s going on. Then all of a sudden they get hammered, and they didn’t realize it was coming, or they didn’t have a chance to stock up.
And I’m going to give you my funny story. I’m not going to hold it for the podcast coming up. You know, we once were opening a restaurant, and when I was part of an opening, I used to be the inside expediter, right? And so, like, we’re waiting for the orders to come in, and we’re waiting, we’re just kind of joking and talking, and all of a sudden they had this brilliant idea that maybe I should check the printer. And it turns out the printer in the kitchen was turned off inadvertently.
So, when I turned that on, it just went crazy for, like, five minutes. Of course, we were in the weeds before we even started. So anyway, had somebody told us that the dining room was filling up, we may have known that there was a problem there, right? So, anyhow. Amanda, you’ve done a lot of work as a GM and a director in a lot of places. So, what do you look for? And what were you when you were a manager, and as a director, what do you look for in leadership in the front-of-the-house?
Amanda: You know, as we began to really think about one of the most important qualities, you know, for me, it’s always emotional intelligence. It’s people who have the ability to read other people’s emotions and then manage them the way they want to be managed. It’s people who have that flexibility. And you know, like, the thing is, you know, they say you can grow your emotional intelligence over time; I’ve seen very few people able to do that, but I look for people that are just, they don’t necessarily have to, you know, have years of cooking experience or years of management experience, they have a willingness to get in there and coach elbow to elbow. You know, leadership is one of those elusive things, and you could describe it in so many ways.
I feel as if the best leaders are the ones who are always seeking feedback and asking, you know, what they can do to be better, and they’re also very comfortable giving feedback to others around them. So, by making their team stronger, they get stronger, the operation gets stronger. You know, it’s having the courage to give people the right feedback.
Danny: Very good. Eric, and there’s going to be a tough act to follow. Anything you would like to add to that?
Eric: She took kind of the soft glove side, so I’ll take the technical side. So, you want somebody who’s going to be organized, you want someone who’s going to be communicative, they’re going to listen to folks and—you know, and when you have servers, there’s 20 of them with where in cooks, you know, you only have, like, four or five. So, you got to be able to play Tetris with the schedules, you got to be able to do a lot of things and appease a lot of egos out in the dining room. And really, there is some drama that comes from the dining room. We all know that, we all see it, and you have to be the kind of person who can kind of get everybody refocused, recentered, and go back to it.
So somewhat, what Amanda talked to, but they have to have that good organization side on the back-end, to get everybody into the right spots at the right time, to ensure that our guest is going to be taken care of in the right way.
Danny: Yeah, and I think treating everybody consistently too, right? You know, not playing favorites and all. That gets you into a lot of trouble really fast, too, right?
Amanda: And, you know, think about, like, a great leader is, you know, they could be, technically, Eric said, organized and communicate well, but something that I’ve always said, which seems intuitive to me, is they have to be the best at hospitality, meaning giving hospitality to their team. You know, say, like, oh, we got to take great care of the guests and provide hospitality, well, to me, the GM and the managers’ jobs are to provide that same great hospitality to the team because, in turn, you want them to sort of model the same thing with guests, and if they’re, you know, grumpy cat where, you know, I worked with somebody like, “Oh, that’s just grumpy cat manager.” I’m like, well, then you shouldn’t be managing people. I’m sorry. We can’t have grumpy cat leading a team.
Danny: Well, and I get back to the whole thing is, you know, in my experience… I truly believe, and you can see it. You know, the energy of the manager dictates the energy of the team. So again, we get back to the Eeyore effect, and I think that’s what kind of sets the pace and, you know, it gets the energy going. You have fun, you’re having a good time, business is good, everybody’s making money, the restaurant’s profitable, who doesn’t want to work in that kind of an environment? Eric, what kind of KPIs do you look for in the front-of-the-house?
Eric: There’s a lot, right? So, we want to see check average, individual guest spend, when we’re talking about servers. We want to talk about regulars, frequency, how much they build people that come in to see them specifically on a given shift. You also want to look at tip percentage, right, because that’s indicative of how well they’re taking care of their guests as well. So, tip percentage, guest spend, frequency, regularity, all of those things are the metrics that I look for when I’m looking at a server.
Danny: To me being able to read a table. You know, that’s not data, metrics, or anything else. And I think I mentioned the last podcast, I don’t order my entree anymore. I order an appetizer because I don’t want to get everything at one time. And you know, throughput is critical, but if you’re doing it at the expense of the guest experience, it’s not the right thing. So, Amanda, anything you’d like to add?
Amanda: You know, there’s KPIs that you can quantify, and then there is KPIs that are just things that you have to watch and be engaged in the dining room. So, I used to, you know, one that you can’t really quantify, gain data on, is, does your server ask the right questions? You know, are they asking the right questions to get the right information, right, because that sets everything, right?
You talked about it. Are they rushing you? You know, are they looking at throughput? I would say sales for labor-hour is a really good one, you know, because we want people to make money, we also don’t want to crush the restaurant with labor. So, I like to look at that. Add-on sales, you know? What does Eric’s add-on sales look like compared to Danny’s?
And so, you know—and they work the same shift, they had the same amount of tables, they didn’t get different guests. I didn’t load Danny section with people who had more money in their pocket. So, I used to love to look at that and say, well why, you know, does one server outsell another server, right? So, if you can’t build a bigger restaurant and you can’t push out more food, what’s the best way to make more revenue, is to—and it’s not just about additional revenue. It’s about creating a great experience, right?
So, you get this delicious filet and now you’ve got this beautiful grilled shrimp on top, or you have a great sauce that’s an add on, so you’re creating a better experience for the guest. Then I like to look at, you know, speed, meaning how fast are we getting that table in and out? How fast are our ticket times? Even though that’s, you might say, that’s back-of-the-house KPI, it’s really impacting the front. If you can’t get food out, you know, nothing good is happening in the front-of-the-house when food isn’t coming out.
Danny: Yeah, and that’s critical, too. That’s a really good point to, you know, how you engineer the menu, how you develop the recipes, how many steps does a cook have to take to execute an item? And we have a client right now who we both lovingly know there’s so much handwork to put on an item, you know, it hinders throughput, it hinders ticket times, it hinders turnovers, and everything else. Let me ask you a question before we wrap it up here, about the future. Are there any incentives that you guys have used to help servers either get better service, make more money, or whatever? Like, I’ve seen instances where you know, based on your some rating or scorecard, you get a better station than somebody else. Have you guys seen any of those kinds of things? And is there a benefit or a negative and stuff like that? Eric, I’ll ask you first.
Eric: I have used them in the past, yes, where you have a server scorecard and you utilize that with the metrics that every server is graded against each other. You have them lined up, racked and stacked, and then the top tier gets the top stations. But you also have to realize that not everybody’s motivated by the same thing. So, you have to be careful when you do those types of things. Some people don’t really look at those things and use them to judge themselves, so you want to make sure that if you’re doing that, you’re having the conversations, you’re going through it, you’re looking at everybody as their whole person, as Amanda likes to say, and really judge everybody, not only on numbers and metrics, but also utilize feel and hospitality. Because we’ve all worked with that one server that makes every table feel great, but they don’t do any side work, they don’t run any food, and they’re just—nobody wants to work with them because everybody else has to pick up the slack. So, you have to be very cognizant of the whole person, and not just a couple of numbers on a score sheet.
Amanda: You know, I’ve also worked with a scorecard. I think everybody likes to see stats. They like to be rack and stacked. I wouldn’t say everybody, to Eric’s point, but a lot of people like to see that. I think just having a really strong recognition program that is, you know, immediate, that, you know, recognizes somebody in the moment of having done something really well or having supported the team. I think those things are important.
To Eric’s point, there could be that one server who doesn’t have a high check averages, but, you know, they’re always running food and they’re always doing everything else, so it’s finding ways, you know, that everybody feels—I hate to say it; we’re not giving out eighth-place trophies—but where everybody feels seen for the contributions that they make to the team. I think that’s important. But I would say that the best way to recognize somebody is to give them a great place to work. Create a great job by giving them all of the things they need to do their job, be successful, have fun at work, you know, make money, put money in their pocket every day. I think those are the things are important.
Danny: And then you mentioned that, and I was going to actually divert from our script here, and you brought it up subliminally, but servers love leaving with money in their pocket, which you said, right? But there’s sort of this growing trend now where their gratuities get added to their paychecks, and they get it. And then there’s a few software platforms—we don’t want to mention any names—where the money their gratuity is automatically put into an account so the restaurant doesn’t need as much cash on hand and stuff like that. So, in your guys’ experiences, do you have any sense of, you know, the servers care if the money goes in their check or they get their gratuity immediately? Is there any adverse effect from a culture and morale standpoint if they don’t walk out with 30 bucks or 50 or 200 or whatever? What do you guys hear out there as we’re in the trenches? Eric, I’ll go first with you.
Eric: So, I’ve managed both types of locations, and I’ve managed one where you had the transition from when they received cash every night to then it’s going on their paycheck. And I’ll tell you, it’s just certain people, they need that money every day, and that will never change, and they’ll find a different job that gives them what they need. You know, just like Amanda said, you know, you create the best job for the people that you can, and that decision is typically made way above the people within the four walls that can make those decisions, unless you’re a mom and pop place. I know for me, when I was growing up, my mom wasn’t a server, but she did get tips and we relied on those tips on a daily basis, so I have sympathy and empathy for the people who do need those on a daily basis, but like I said, if the decision is made above the people that are in your restaurant, you know, you just have to do it the best you can as a leader, to meet people where they are and give them what they need as best as possible. I do think, me personally, I think it’s better for the servers to get it on their check because I’ve seen many servers leave on a Friday night with a lot of money in their pocket, come back on Saturday dead broke, because they just went to the bar and spent all their money.
Danny: Yeah, there’s some potential security concerns, too, you know. Like, you walk out and somebody robs you because they know you got a couple hundred bucks in your purse or your wallet or whatever. Comments from you, Amanda?
Amanda: I think Eric touched on a lot of the good points, but I will say that there’s now digital systems—and of course, we won’t mention names—where it gets loaded onto a card that same day, so they’re not leaving with cash in their pocket, but it is loaded on a card, it’s available, it doesn’t have any fees to the team member. And that’s a great sort of mesh between both of those ideas, that it’s a digital currencies—not digital currencies, it’s not cash in their pocket, so they’re not subject to necessarily, you know, people knowing they’re leaving with a lot of money, and then those people that need it that day, have access to it, and those savers can just leave that money on the card.
Eric: I will add on to that. I did work in a company that did load the pay cards every day, and nothing was worse than waking up on Christmas morning and somebody didn’t get their pay card loaded and they felt like it was okay to call general manager and yell at them because their pay card didn’t get loaded on Christmas Day.
Amanda: You should do better, Eric.
Eric: Yeah, they didn’t work for me after that day, I’ll tell you that.
Danny: Well, that’s good stuff. I appreciate it. So Amanda, I’m going to ask you to bring it home. What’s in the future for all of this in terms of the front-of-the-house and food service?
Amanda: Ohh, the future? I would just say that, you know, my personal opinion is that service style will, you know, they’ll say full service is dying. I don’t think that’ll ever happen. I think people now more than ever, I saw Elon Musk just was at Davos, and he was talking about robotic nannies that are going to be around taking care of your children and walking your dogs and all of these things that are replacing human contact. I don’t think that’s in the future of the restaurant business.
I think people are always going to crave that hospitality engagement and that connection with a human being. You know, and it’s interesting, you know, it used to be the older generation was like adverse to kiosks and they didn’t want to engage with the kiosk. They’d walk to the counter no matter how long the line is. We’re starting to see a shift of this current generation, this Gen Z. They want to deal with humans. Like, they don’t want to deal with kiosks. It’s such a weird sort of dynamic that’s happening.
So, I think we’ll always see a hybrid of mix of service styles, both fast casual and full service. I don’t think that’s going away. I think guests just expect to have a personalized experience. I don’t think there’s a one size fits all. I think some of the best brands are being very specialized in choosing a really specific lane and executing it really well, so if you’re looking at some of those brands that do five things better than anybody else, you’ll start to see a lot more of that. Hopefully we don’t have robotic servers. We don’t ever want to see that in the future. I don’t want to see robots serving people.
Danny: Yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of people pushing back, you know, those automated little busser things where there’s this little robot that delivers your food or takes your dirty dishes. I don’t know how cost effective they are at this point. But, you know, I really, you know, I agree with you a hundred percent about this generation because they get so bogged down with technology and looking at their screen, you know, they just want to talk to a human, right? And I think the restaurants will always provide that social comfort, socialization, and just communication because—that’s why, you know, I always say I hate typing, and I don’t do a lot of social media because to me, it’s very impersonal, it’s not very social, so I think there is a trend back to, you know, talking to a live human. Especially, you know, I just referenced this on a podcast I was on the other day, how frustrating is it when you call, you get called a business because you have a problem, and 20 buttons later, you still haven’t gotten a real human to help solve your problem. It drives you crazy, right? So, before I go to Eric, I just want to say, I keep hearing about all these robots, but I’m waiting for a robotic dog, you know, like the Jetsons, right? And you’re a big animal lover, Amanda. Can’t you wait to have a robotic dog in your backyard?
Amanda: I don’t think so. Although, you know, I’d obviously save a lot of money on Farmer’s Dog. You know, that stuff is pretty expensive, so that would be the only benefit I can see.
Danny: Eric, anything else before we wrap it up?
Eric: I don’t think I can add anything to it either one of you just went through on that. So, you guys did a great job, and I don’t have anything more to put on there.
Amanda: I’m giving a high five, Eric. Good job.
Danny: So, you’re not really into robotic dogs either, right, Eric?
Eric: [laugh]. I’m not into robotic anything [laugh].
Danny: On that note, I want to thank you guys. I mean, it’s crazy how fast the time goes when we do these things, but a lot of really good stuff. I can’t thank you enough for all of your expertise. Keep on the lookout for our next edition podcast. And again, we are doing a—asking people to submit their questions, and if your question ends up being on a podcast, we would love to talk to you, give you some advice on that topic for 30 minutes.
We’re coming out with our Employee Life Cycle podcast series here in the next couple of months. We got a lot of really good stuff coming your way. Email us at info@therestaurantroadmap.com with questions, comments, topics, and all that good stuff. We’d love the opportunity to help you guys get better. And with that, I’m going to say thank you to Amanda and Eric one more time. And we will all talk again soon. Take care.
Amanda: Take care, everyone.
Eric: Bye, y’all.
Danny: Thanks for tuning in. We hope today’s episode gave you valuable insights you can put into action. If you have questions, want more info on today’s topic, or need support with your restaurant-specific challenges, we’d love to hear from you. Reach out anytime at info@therestaurantroadmap.com, and visit synergyrestaurantconsultants.com to explore our services, sign up for our newsletter, and catch up on past episodes. Don’t forget to follow and subscribe on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, LinkedIn, Instagram, TikTok, and Facebook so you never miss what’s next. Do you have feedback or a topic you’d like us to cover? Contact us. We’re here to help make the world a better place to eat.