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At Sandals Church, our vision is to be real with ourselves, God and others. This channel features sermons and teaching from Pastor Matt Brown and other members of the Sandals Church preaching team. You can find sermon notes, videos and more content at http://sandalschurch.com/watch
Welcome to the Sandals Church podcast. My name is Brian Berson, and I'm the campus pastor at Sandals Church Redlands. We are so happy to have you join us today as we listen to this incredible message. If you've enjoyed our content, consider leaving us a rating to help this podcast reach more people. But for now, let's get into the message.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Hi and welcome to Sandals Church. I hope that you're having a great 2026. How many of you guys had relational conflict in 2025, hold on, with a family member, a friend or a coworker? Raise your hands. Okay, if your hands not up, I'm hoping that you have some conflict this week so that you can practice what we're gonna talk about.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Look conflict is never something that we want, but if you're in relationships, it's something that you're going to have. You're gonna have conflict if you're married. You're gonna have conflict if you're single. You're gonna have conflict if you have a job. If you stay at home all alone, you're gonna have conflict with yourself.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I mean, the reality is sin affects us primarily relationally. Now, all of us have kind of this idea of how we handle conflict. Some of us go to a counselor, that's good. Some of us go to a friend, that's good. But what we do at Sandals and what makes us different as Christians is we go to Jesus.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And we say, how do we handle conflict? So these may not be the verses that you want today, but at some point in time, these are the verses that you need. So if you're not in conflict right now, what I want you to do is file this sermon away and save it for a rainy day. Amen. When you're about ready to lose your mind, like, pastor Matt said I need you to save this for this moment.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So let's open our Bibles to Matthew chapter 18. We're gonna look at verses 15 through 20, and then I'm gonna summarize verses 20 through 35. And I think you'll get why as we close the message today. But let's just begin with the word of prayer. Father, help us to understand that conflict is a normal part of life, but handling it in the way that you teach is a supernatural way of life.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And so help us today, Father, to just be open and honest about this and help us to be better in this area with our family, with our friends, and with our fellow Californians or wherever we live today. So Holy Spirit, join us, help us. We pray this in Jesus' name, Amen. So in Matthew 18, Jesus has been talking a lot about how to treat people. And for the last couple weeks, we focused on the little ones.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And so Jesus talks about if anyone mistreats a little one, it would be better if they tied a weight around their neck and threw themselves into the sea. So there's been some harsh challenges about how to treat kids. Then he turns and talks about how do we treat each other. And so listen to what he says in Matthew 18, let's look at 15 through 20. He says, if another believer sins against you.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Now, if you're new to Christianity, I just want you to notice what he said. He didn't say another person. He said another believer. One of the most heartbreaking things is you come to church to meet great people and then you meet us and we're like, yeah, right? There are broken people in church.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So Jesus says, if another believer sins against you, go privately and point out the offense. And if that doesn't work, put it on Facebook. That's not what he says. Go privately and point out the offense. If the other person listens and confesses it, you have won that person back.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:This is a miracle. Write that in your Bibles. This is a miracle when this happens. But if you are unsuccessful, that's normal. If you are unsuccessful, take one or two others with you and go back again so that everything you say may be confirmed by two or three witnesses.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay, let's continue. If the person still refuses to listen, take your case to the church and then if he or she won't accept the church's decision, treat that person as a pagan or a corrupt tax collector. Man, isn't that incredible? He says this. He says, I tell you the truth.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Whatever you forbid on earth will be forbidden in heaven, and whatever you permit on earth will be permitted in heaven. And then he ends with this thought. I also tell you this, if two of you agree here on earth concerning anything you ask, my father in heaven will do it for you. Now here's the famous verse that's always ripped out of context. For where two or three gather together as my followers, I am there among them.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So let's talk about what this means. So here's what I want to challenge you to do today. Okay? If you're in a fight today and you came to church, today's your special day. You get to practice this on the way home.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You'll be like, What? But if you're not in a fight, I wanna challenge you to prepare for relational conflict. So when you're dating, it's all a lie. I love you. I'm gonna listen to you.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Over the Christmas break, you know, I I I went to a wedding and literally the bride said she was no longer gonna be a Giants fan, but a Dodger fan. I was like, liar, liar, pants on fire. So when we're in love, like we'll do anything. But when we're in a conflict, we won't do anything. So we got to be careful.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So this is a preparatory thing to think about, hey, when and if I get in a fight with my spouse? When and if I get in an argument with my roommate, when and if I have a disagreement with my parents, in and when in and if, excuse me, or when and if I get in an argument with somebody at church, how am I going to handle that? And if you don't think about it beforehand, listen to me, you're not going to handle it well. Take it from someone who's messed this up thousands of times. I am an expert on how to not handle conflict.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Amen? You know, I'm going write a book, I screwed up my life and you can too. You're right? So Jesus says in Matthew 18, look at this, If another believer sins against you, Christians can hurt you. And you need to be prepared for this.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So let's just run through the life of Jesus. Okay? So Jesus was publicly slandered by his family. Some of you guys have never noticed this, but in Mark chapter three, Jesus' brothers and mother come to take him home. And here's what the Bible says because he lost his mind.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Mary thought Jesus went crazy. So he was publicly slandered by his own family. Look at this. Jesus was betrayed by a friend. Anybody been there?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay. The best knives come from your friends in your back. He was betrayed by one of his best friends, Judas. He trusted Judas. He loved Judas.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:He put Judas in charge of money. Look at this next one. Jesus was crucified because of his religious leaders. So if you've been heard in church, listen to me, Jesus was crucified by his religious leaders, not in his church, but in his synagogue. Okay, it wasn't the Jewish people that did it, it was Jewish leaders.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And then Jesus teaches us this. Jesus says we can expect similar experiences, so welcome to the faith. But we're all shocked by this. And typically here's how Christians handle conflict in the church. We leave the church, we leave our faith, we go to another church and we gossip and slander the church we left.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Very few people apply Matthew 18 to conflict. And it's because it's easy to read this, right, when I'm chill. This is chill Matt, happy Matt. But when I'm upset Matt, I'm angry Matt, this is hard to do. And and so here's what I want to encourage you to do.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Prepare about prepare for this when you're not angry because when you are angry, that's not the time to be like, you know what we're gonna do? We're gonna Matthew 18 this right now. Okay, Hulk Hogan, settle down. We need the Holy Spirit, not Hulk Hogan. So let me give you a little something that I've learned to help me handle conflict.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay? This is just this is a free Matt Brown ism. You don't even have to tithe on this. Here we go. When you're upset with someone, identify the what, not the why.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay, identify the what, not the why. Here's what our culture just perseverates on. The why. Why did you do that? So we have things in our culture called hate crimes.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So you murdered someone, that's the what. The why is you did it because of the color of their skin, because of their sexuality, because of their religion. Let the courts handle the why. The why, what it does is it deepens the offense. So let's assume I'm a black guy, of course.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Right? I'm a black guy. Someone says something to me rude at Sandals. So that's what they did. They were rude, they were mean, they were they were nasty.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:That's what they did. Calling them a racism is putting the why. It's why. So be careful as a Christian. Our culture calls people racist.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Our culture people calls people sexist. Our culture labels people as homophobic. Be careful with that. You're not called to follow our culture. You're called to follow Christ.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So what did they do? Same thing in marriage, right? Your husband was rude. He didn't pick up his underwear. That's what he did ladies.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You're like I know why he did this. He doesn't respect me. He doesn't love me. He hates me. My mother told me not to marry him.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:See, do you see how the why? Now it's not a piece of laundry on the ground. It's an insult to your very being. So be very, very careful. So in the church, if somebody's rude to you, somebody's unkind to you, somebody doesn't listen to you, focus on the what and say, here's what you did.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:But if you go to the why I can tell you there's very little hope for reconciliation. Because here's the why. My wife will ask me, why did you do that? Here's the truth, I don't know. Like you think I'm in control of his mouth, it just says things.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Some of you do this with your three year old. Why did you do that? Why would you do that? Why would you ask a three year old why they did what they did? Let's go there.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So focus on the what. Okay, and why is that? The what is enough. The what is a bomb. The why is a nuclear bomb.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:It just increased the blast radius. And here's the thing, the bigger the blast, the harder it is to reconcile. So what did they do? Next, okay. So that was Matt Brown.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let's get back to Jesus. Deal directly with the person. Unfortunately, it's way easier to talk about someone than to talk to someone. It just is. Our culture loves to talk about people.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:We have a hard time talking to people. So here's what Jesus says, Matthew eighteen fifteen. Go privately and point out the offense. So you don't blast them on social media. You don't put, know, tell them on X what they did wrong.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You go privately and point out the offense. If the other person listens and confesses it, you will have won that person back. Look, the hope here is for reconciliation as a Christian. It doesn't always happen, but that's our hope. That's our goal that we could be reconciled.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So let me give you just some advice. Don't just like, Well, followed Matthew 18. You ticked me off and I told you you're a jerk and I don't can't stand you and I don't think you're going to heaven. No, that's not what he said. Let me give you some advice.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Look at this. Don't respond until you cool down. Let's see how quiet got in here. Everybody's like, oh, that was good. That was good.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So I was at dinner with my family. You ever been at dinner with your family and and your mom or your dad or a cousin or aunt will offend you? Is that just me? Just I'm the only one with family that says offensive things. So something was said.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Have you ever had this? You you like, there's a switch inside and you're just like, you know? And but as you get older, you notice that. When you're younger, you just let it fly. And so I thought I was gonna sneak off.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I went I went got up from the table. I went down by the refrigerator. I thought I was hidden so nobody could see me. And I went because I knew that if I responded at the dinner table, guess what? I'm gonna lose my mind.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Dishes are gonna fly. Everybody's leaving. You know, it's terrible. And what's funny is when I went down behind the refrigerator, my wife went like this. And she saw she saw the whole thing, you know, and she she's looking at me.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:She's like, what is going on? Here's the thing is, she didn't even know or catch why I was offended. Ain't that crazy? But I caught it. I received it.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I am the pastor and I will execute biblical judgment. But here's the thing, didn't wanna run the meal. I didn't wanna run the time. I need to chill out and I need to get ahold of myself before I talk about it. Okay.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So here's another thing. So take take take a second to cool off, take a second to chill out. Next, look at this one, seek counsel before you talk. Okay. Don't talk about people.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:But here's the thing, whenever I'm dealing with a staff member, I talk to my leadership team. Hey, I'm thinking about saying and I always love it when I'm about saying this and my leadership team is always like, or we could say it differently. It's not a 100% of the time, but it's really close that my leadership team suggests an alternative way to communicate my concern. And let me just say this, generally speaking when we confront, we're all harsher than we need to be. It just said generally.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:With your kids, you're harsher than you need to be. With your spouse, you're harsher than you need to be. Because we have to work ourselves up with anger and we lean on anger instead of God's word. And just say, you know, no, I'm gonna I'm gonna go with God's word here and I'm going to say this. So if I have conflict with my kids or an issue with my kids, I run it off my wife.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Same thing. She's like, or we could say it this way. Because as a dad, dads, I tend to be harsh. I tend to I tend to not put my loving foot first. That's my tendency.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And so I don't mean to be harsh. I don't mean to to be mean. And so my wife will say, don't you why don't you say it this way? So listen to me, I'm not gossiping about them. I'm seeking counsel because I love them.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let me say that again. I'm not gossiping about them. I'm seeking counsel because I love them. I wanna be a good pastor. I wanna be a good leader.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I wanna be a good friend. I wanna be a good dad, and I have a record of getting it wrong. Can I get an amen? Some of you guys need to go back and look at the court documents of your life and conflict and go, you know what? There's a theme here.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And that theme is, I tend to blow things up. Okay. And then lastly, according to Jesus, look at this, look for the spiritual victory. When you're arguing, what's the win? The win for God is always reconciliation.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:For some of us, the win is that they agree with absolutely everything we're upset about. Do you understand that? So for you, they gotta repent all the way down to the specific little thing that you believe they said. That means you're God. If you see it completely right and they see it completely wrong, then you're God.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Now you have a problem. So learn to say, you know what, what percentage of agreement am I willing to accept? So right, if you're married and you're fighting with each other, do they have to agree 100% with what you're saying? Could it be 90? Could it be 80?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Could it be 70%? Because a lot of Tammy and I's fights have to do with that issue. I can agree with like 90% of what you're saying, but that last 10% that's not what I meant. That's not how I feel. And so does it have to be 100% complete agreement to move on?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And here's the thing, if it has to be 100%, you're gonna lose friends, you're gonna get divorced, you're gonna be lonely. Because people have their perspective. They have their perspective and you have to learn to say, okay, here's what happened. Here's what happened. So let's say a person sins against you.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You've identified the what. So this is why the what's so important. If you run-in with this makes me feel, you've just added a bomb to it. You say here's what you said and I didn't like that. Here's what you did and you go to them and it doesn't work.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:It doesn't work out. And let me just say this, I need time to receive things. How many of you guys when somebody comes up and tells you you're a sinner, wrong, no good, terrible person and you respond like Jesus in the moment? I tend tend to need some time to process. So what I would say is even if they're Christian, even if they're a pastor, even if they're a leader at our church, leave a little room for them to repent and get it right.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay. Let me just say that. Sometimes it takes a moment for what you're saying to get in their head. Sometimes it takes a moment for the Holy Spirit to get in their head. Sometimes it takes some time.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So leave a little gap there for the Holy Spirit to do his work. If that doesn't happen, here's what Jesus says. Look at this. Ask your spiritual community to help you solve it. So the goal is not to punish.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:The goal is not to maim or embarrass. The goal is reconciliation. It's to make it right. And here's the thing, the devil doesn't want us together. He wants divorces to end or excuse me, he wants marriages to end in divorce.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:He wants friendships to end without talking. He wants families to cut each other off and go no contact. That's always the devil's goal. Our goal as best we can is to try to reconcile. So in Matthew 18 verse 16, but if you are unsuccessful, I want you to underline these words.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You need to think carefully about this. Take one or two. Here's the keyword others. So circle that word in your Bibles others. Because you know who others is?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Not you, not your wife, not your dad, not your best friend. And we'll talk about why that's true in a second. Take one or two others with you and go back again. Look at this, so that everything you say may be confirmed by two or three witnesses. How many of you guys have ever been in a fight over what was said?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Raise your hands. Okay, if you're married and your hand is not up, are lying in front of Jesus right now. Like this is this is marriage 101. We fight over what was said. So in families the same thing happens.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:What was said? And so here's why it's important. Sometimes listen to me, you were unaware of the words coming out of your mouth. It's not just me, my words are just recorded. So I was in the car with my wife and my oldest daughter and there was a conversation.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay, men when women are talking be very very careful. Okay, when guys when fists are flying, you know there's a problem. When women are talking, just gotta be ready. So my wife and daughter are talking and my wife says something that offends excuse me, my daughter said something that offends my wife. And so my wife gets out of the car, she's all upset and I turn to my daughter and I said, you said this and my daughter said, no, didn't.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I said, honey, this is I said, love you. That's what you just said to your mom. You know what my daughter said? Oh, that's not what I meant to say. Okay.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:But that's what you said. This is why an outside other is so important to your conflicts. This is why counseling is so beneficial. When you're married, you're arguing over what you didn't say and sometimes you need an unbiased person to go, that's what you said. That's what you said.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And and again, I told my daughter, I love you. I care for you. And listen, the second she heard me say it, she started crying. She said, oh, that's that's not what I meant. I love mom so much.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And the process of reconciliation began. But she needed somebody and the reason why I was okay in that moment because she didn't say it to me. She said it to her mom. Now if she said it to me, we need her mom or we need somebody else to say, hey, here's what you said. And and let me just say this for all of us.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Sometimes words just come out wrong. They just they just they don't come out the right way. And especially when we're upset, when we're angry, when we're anxious, communication is not perfect. It's not perfect. So here's what encourage you.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let's say you got an issue with somebody in this church. They offended you, they upset you, they they did something and and a lot of what it is nowadays is political things. Somebody posts something, you know, on the Internet and you're going back and forth hating each other in the name of Jesus because that's what Christ would have you do, right? Here's what I would say, try not to involve friends or family. And let me tell you, I have made this mistake as your pastor.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So let's say somebody's upset with me and Tammy and I go to talk to them. So the Bible says two or more should be present. Here's the thing, Tammy and I are not two or more. You know what we are according to the Bible? We're one.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So that person doesn't ever feel like Tammy is objective. Or if it's Tammy that they're upset with, they don't ever feel like I'm objective. So what we have to do is we have to involve people in our church who aren't our best friend, who aren't related to us biologically, who can be objective so that they can help us reconcile. And here's what you need to do, you need to learn this. And I've have made this mistake so many times.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And it wasn't until one of our past ors literally called me out and said, When you and Tammy meet, that's not two, that's one. And I had to have somebody else tell me that. I didn't realize this on my own. I went, Oh my gosh. And then oftentimes all I'm doing is I'm involving Tammy in the conflict.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And we didn't make it better, we just made it worse. Okay. So you go to the person directly, it doesn't work, you involve your community group, you involve a counselor, you involve somebody else. This is so important. Look at this.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Jesus says take it to the church leadership. Now, of you are like, well, is ridiculous and the church is the people that hurt me. Okay. I understand that. Can we just talk about our culture?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let's talk about where we live now. Some of America's biggest problems is we're stuck in the past. Things that used to be problems and we're not here and now. So there was a day and age in our culture, in our country, where the church was incredibly abusive. Where the church was wrong, but in the eyes of our culture, they were always right.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So people got mistreated, people were abused, and so as a culture the church was wrong and people were wounded. Now I'm not saying that doesn't happen now. Here's where we are today. Now today, our culture believes powers, governments, people in charge, people in authority, now we believe they're always wrong. And so now we have all these wounded warriors on the Internet telling their stories about how they've been hurt in the church.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I'm not saying that doesn't happen. I'm just saying as a culture we've shifted from the church can do no wrong to where we are today, the church can do no right and the victim is always right. We have to be careful as a church. And so what's happened is, listen to me, when you attack the authority of the church, you don't respect the authority of the church and you're not blessed by the authority of the church. So listen to what Jesus says.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Not that the church is perfect, not that the church get always gets it right, not that the church hasn't been abusive, but Jesus says this, the church is the power you need to help you resolve the conflict you're in. So Matthew eighteen seventeen, If the person still refuses to listen, take your case to Facebook. Take it to Instagram. Start a podcast. Do you know how many Christians are violating the teachings of Jesus in the name of Jesus?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Take your case to the church. Man, take it to the church. This is so important. We gotta do this. And here's the thing, some people don't want forgiveness, they just want blood.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Years ago, there was a conflict in our church. One guy had borrowed $200 from another guy and they were best friends. They were gonna get in a fight. They got in a physical altercation in the parking lot at church because nothing says Jesus like a fist fight, right? Amen.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So I called them into my office and they were fighting and one said it was a gift, the other said it was alone and they were never gonna speak to each other again in the name of Jesus over $200. So you know what I did? I opened my wallet, I took $200 and I gave it to the guy who felt robbed and I said he didn't steal from you, he stole from me now forgive him. Do you think he was willing to forgive his friend? No.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:The issue wasn't the money, the issue was the sin in his heart. And that guy left our church with my $200. Okay? And I'm only a little bitter about it which is why I'm telling you about it right now. I kid you not.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay, let's look at Matthew eighteen eighteen. I tell you the truth. This is so important. Why does the church matter? Why should you go to the church?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let's say you're considering divorce. The Bible says God hates divorce. It doesn't say you should never get divorced. Do you understand that? So it's challenging for the church to interpret this.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:God hates divorce, but sometimes divorce is what's necessary. God still hates it because it's awful, but sometimes it's the only choice. So if you're considering divorce, instead of going to a counselor, of going to your friends, instead of starting a podcast, go to your church. You try to reconcile with your spouse, it doesn't work. You involve a counselor, you involve your friends, it still doesn't work.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Here's why you go to church to see if you can get divorced. Look at this. I tell you the truth, whatever you forbid on earth will be forbidden in heaven, and whatever you permit on earth will be permitted in heaven. Let me translate this for you. Here's what Jesus says, not what I say.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Here's what Jesus says, Whatever decision the church renders on earth will be held as valid on Judgment Day. Did you just hear that? So if you decide to get divorced, I don't know whether it's biblical or not, you made the decision. We're gonna find out on judgment day whether or not God is with you or not. Here's the thing, if you come to the church and we decide, even though we're not perfect, even though we're sinners, even though we make mistakes, if we tell you, yep, you can get out of this relationship.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:On judgment day, here's what God is gonna say, I'm with the church. That's hard that's hard for us to understand. But here's the thing, God knows how hard it is to be a leader. And he knows that we are doing the best we can. And so listen to this teaching, this is always ripped out of context.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I also tell you this, if two of you agree here on earth concerning anything, and it's not anything, the Greek word here is a judicial decision. So we translate it anything, but really what it should be is any rendering. So I also tell you this, if two of you agree here on earth concerning anything you ask, my Father in heaven will do it for you. Here's what Jesus is saying, Church discipline is difficult so God is with you. And then he says, For where two or three gather together as my followers, I am there amongst them.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And so it's a great verse for a Hallmark card, but here's what Jesus is saying. Disciplining people, so let's say you and your spouse, you can't figure it out. You went to a counselor, you can't figure it out. You come to the church. Here's what Jesus is saying.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:We need an extra layer of grace for leaders who have to make decisions when they don't have all the information. Do you understand that? And look, do you feel all quiet? We're so uncomfortable with that, but it's what Jesus taught. So the church can get it wrong and on judgment day, Jesus says, I'm gonna side with the church.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Not because it's the right decision, but because they did the best they could. So here's what I would encourage you to do. And if there's an accountability on judgment day, listen to me, he's not holding you accountable. Guess who he holds accountable? Us.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:If we rendered a horrific decision or if we sinned or we were abusive and all those terrible things. We have to go back to the beginning of Matthew 18. If anyone hurts one of these little ones, would be better for them to tie a weight around their neck and throw themselves in the sea than to deal with me. So this isn't a pass for the church to do whatever they want. This is just to say, look, we need to have leadership.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And as a culture, we love to hold leaders accountable but part of the reason we get such bad leaders in our culture is we have a standard that no one can meet. I I I we just we just want perfection and so the good people don't run because we destroy their lives and we're left with the people who are already rats that run because they don't care. And this is why we have the government wants. So listen to me, you want a good pastor? You want a healthy pastor?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:You want a healthy church? Love your church, love your pastor, and give them grace. It's not an easy job. Okay? I'm not saying to pass.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I'm not saying they get to do whatever they want. I'm just saying be careful. So one last thought. If you involve the church leadership, you're guaranteeing that Jesus is involved in the process. If you go alone, what you're saying is I'm going it alone.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Alright. So let's jump into this. So you got a conflict. You tried to work it out, it didn't work out, you involved your spiritual community, it still didn't work it out. You bring it before the church and the church renders a decision and says, yep, you can get divorced or you need to separate from this person.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Here's what Jesus teaches. After the church says, you need to create space, it's okay to create space. Because here's the thing, you don't have to stay in the cage with a gorilla, especially if the church is like, that's a gorilla. You're like, well, gonna pray about that. Okay, you pray inside the cage.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Look at this, create a healthy boundary. So listen to what Jesus says. Matthew eighteen seventeen. So if you wanna go no contact with your family, this is very popular, I'm going no contact. I went to a counselor or really I read a book or really I read a podcast or really I thought about it.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay, a lot of young people are going no contact. Listen to me, if you're a Christian, before you go no contact, did you run it through this process? Matthew eighteen seventeen, if he or she won't accept the church's decision, treat that person as a pagan or a corrupt tax collector. Wow, that's Jesus. Listen to me, some people are beyond help.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Some people are abusive. Some people are evil. Now wouldn't that be so nice if they just had shirts that said I'm evil, keep distance. But sometimes they're the people that smile the most when you first meet them. So we have to be careful.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So we we we have to be willing to create boundaries. And here's the thing, can I just say this to you? As your pastor, I really struggle with people getting upset with me and leaving the church. And here's what I did. I spent so much time grieving over them and wishing they would come back that I wasn't good enough to the people who stayed.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let me say this, instead of focusing all your attention on the wounds from people who left, why don't you focus your love and attention and appreciation on the people who stayed. Amen? Because we really we really don't appreciate those people enough. And the longer I've been at Sandals, the more I appreciate the people who stayed. Even though I'm not a perfect leader, even though I make mistakes, but my tendency is to focus on the wound rather than the grace of a church that stayed that loves me, that cares for me.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Okay? So just just think about that. Lastly, here we go. Maintain a real appreciation of grace. So Jesus teaches this, right?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:I would imagine we're gonna have a lot of questions on the debrief podcast about this. And let me just say that, that's good. We can't just we can't just do Matthew 18. What we have to do is involve people, we have to involve a pastor, we have to involve spiritual wisdom because there's nuance in every situation. So Peter has a question.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So Jesus teaches, here's how you forgive, here's how you give grace, here's how you handle conflict. Then Peter pipes up, not Derek Jeter, Peter pipes up, then Peter came to him and asked, Lord, how often should we forgive someone who sins against me? Right? Because here's what he's saying, so I gotta reconcile every time? And so Peter believing he's generous says, seven times?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So should I forgive someone seven times? The Jewish number for perfection, completion? And Jesus replied, no, seven to not seven times, but 70 times seven. For those of you who failed math, that's four ninety. It's four ninety, which by the way in Hebrew numerology is the number for completeness and perfection.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So here's what I want you to see. If you have your Bibles, I want you to open to what we're talking about. We just spent four, maybe four and a half, five verses depending upon how you count it on conflict resolution. And now we have 14 or 15 verses, listen to me, on grace. What is Jesus trying to teach us?
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:When you have conflict, you need to be a messenger of grace. Because it's way easier to be critical than godly. It's way easier to be wounded than to reconcile. It's way easier to be judgmental than to have judgment. Four verses on conflict, four to five or 14 to 15 verses on grace.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So Peter asked this question, how many times should I forgive? Jesus says, I tell you 70 times seven which is four ninety. And then Jesus tells a story about a man who worked for a king who decided it was time to collect all that he was owed and this man could not pay his debt. Listen to this, and so he begged the king to forgive him. Listen, and the king gave him grace and wiped away the debt and sent him on his way.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Then that person who received grace also had someone who owed him money. And that person too got on his knees and begged for forgiveness and grace. And the person who received grace from the king, listen to this, grabbed this person by the neck and choked him and said, I will throw you into prison, you and your family, for what you did to me. Listen to what Jesus says, Matthew 18. Then the king called in the man he had forgiven and said, you evil servant, I forgave you that tremendous debt because you pleaded with me.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Shouldn't you have mercy on your fellow servant just as I had mercy on you? Wow. Listen, we wanna be a church. We wanna be people of grace, then we need to learn to give grace. And I want you to listen very carefully to how Jesus answers Peter.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Jesus calls people who have received grace from him but refuse to give it to others evil. Now listen, and then he says, take my servant and throw him into jail so that he may be tortured. That's the word. Now, that's hard for us to worship God as loving and merciful and also embrace him as a God of wrath. But that's the God of Jesus.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:And we need to understand that. And what offends God the most is people who've received grace but cannot give it. So let's close with this. Who do you need to forgive and give grace to this week? If you call yourself a Christian, this is something you need to do.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:It doesn't mean that they were not wrong. It doesn't mean that they didn't wound you. It doesn't mean that that that you know that you have to be best friends with them. But here's the thing, the older I get, the two sins that creep in me the quickest are unforgiveness and bitterness. And both of those are rooted in a lack of grace.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:So let me ask you, who is it that you need to give grace to? And let me say this, some of you right now are beating yourselves up and the devil is having a heyday with you. You're no good. You never practice this. You always give it wrong.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Listen to me. Maybe the person that you need to give grace to today is the same person that Jesus wants to give grace to and that's you. Maybe the reason you can't give grace to others is you've never received it for yourself. So maybe today as we pray, you just say, help me forgive myself. Lord, help me have grace.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Because can I tell you, the person I'm the meanest to is myself? The person I beat up the most is myself. And at the end of the day, Jesus didn't just die for Sandals Church. He didn't just die for the sinners in this world, He died for Matthew Stephen Brown. And I can be a recipient of that grace and so can you.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Let's bow our heads and let's pray. Heavenly Father, would you reveal to us right now, who is it that we need to give grace to? Maybe it's a family member, maybe it's a friend. God, would you just help us release them? Right now, maybe we could just pray for them.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:This person who hurt us, who wounded us and God, let them experience the same grace in their lives that we needed in our lives. Let us be a people of grace. Let us learn to forgive one another. God, we don't wanna be like Peter that sets limits. We wanna be like Jesus who was limitless when it comes to grace.
Pastor Matthew Stephen Brown:Help us to be a people of grace. We pray this in Jesus name and all God's people said, amen.
Pastor Fredo Ramos:Gosh, a timely and needed word for us as we think about reconciliation and the work of God and his grace in our lives. And that is our hope and prayer that you would not just hear this message but wrestle wrestle in the presence of the Holy Spirit as you think about who you need to show grace to this week. And listen, I wanna encourage you. If this teaching or anything that Sandals Church has been doing online has served you in your journey of following Jesus, would you consider supporting that work? To do so, you can go to sandalschurch.com/support.
Pastor Fredo Ramos:Grace and peace.