Interior Designers Breathe Life into Home Remodels

Interior design requires a passion and meticulous attention to detail. Having access to these professionals allows homeowners to rest easy knowing the design vision will be executed at the highest level. This episode dives into the visionary world of interior design, explaining its importance in the home remodeling process, as well as its place for navigating budget, timeline, and expectations. We also highlight the latest trends for kitchens and bathrooms, and how products have evolved over time.

What is The ProSource Podcast?

Creating a design concept for a kitchen or remodeling an outdated bathroom requires an understanding of the products and services available to those looking to undertake such a project. The ProSource Podcast breaks down the home remodeling industry and highlights the merchandise and experience that it requires to achieve your vision. Join ProSource Director of Digital Marketing Content Kevin Devine, as he speaks with those who facilitate the ideal project and offer valuable information for how to choose the ideal products and services that transform your ideas into reality.

Hello, this is The ProSource Podcast.

I'm Kevin Devine,

Director of Digital Marketing Content

for ProSource Wholesale.

In this series

we’ll focus on home remodeling,

especially kitchens and bathrooms.

You'll hear from those in the know,

including our corporate merchandizers

showroom team members

and the trade professionals

who ultimately make it happen.

We're glad you've joined us.

Enjoy.

Hello.

In this episode of The ProSource Podcast,

we're joined by Ellen Kurtz,

who's an interior designer.

A member here at ProSource Wholesale.

Ellen, thanks for joining us. Thank you.

So let's start

with a real simple question.

Ease into it here.

Tell us who you are and what you do.

Well, I'm an interior designer,

have been in business for many years.

Don't want to say the number,

just want to go with many.

And I

started out went to the

University of Missouri.

I have a minor in architecture,

major interior design,

and been in the business for,

like I said, many years. Okay.

So that answers that part.

What got you into the industry?

What motivated you?

Obviously, you went to college,

you got an interior design degree,

but what motivated you to do that?

Well, when I was younger,

I always shopped with my mom and dad

doing their own home

and then got interested in

but was really interested in fine arts,

but realized

I was not going to be able

to make money doing that. So quickly

decided when I got to Mizzou that I,

I thought, you know what?

Interior design

is definitely where I want to be.

And we'll have a discussion later

about why Missouri calls itself Mizzou.

That's a whole separate

discussion we can have. Right.

Do you have

so you're an interior designer.

You put together design.

So do you have other trade professionals

that you work with

to execute on your vision

that you put forth? Oh, yes. Many.

So I work with lots of builders,

many contractors and

specifically like two major ones

right now.

And they execute

my design, put everything together.

I give them a drawings and selections

and then they take it from there.

So I'm guessing it

probably helps

to have some consistency in who you use

because you understand their work and

they understand your vision.

Absolutely. Absolutely.

Yeah.

That's that's

it's hard to find somebody

that you can be matched up with

and you work well together.

And I've been to lots of contractors,

you know you just as you work with them

and they understand you

and you understand them,

you let them be

professional in their part

and you hope to receive that on the back

end of it as well.

So but yeah, it works.

It works

well when you connect with somebody.

I was going to ask,

what does that dynamic like

when you work together?

So part of my job,

I always laugh with the contractors

I work with now is

my job is to get the materials

there, on location

and their job is to stay there

and put it together.

So making selections with my clients,

like my part is always up

in the beginning of the project.

And, and then as he executes

and pulls things

together, I'm

always checking in on the jobs.

It's not that I'm not there,

but I trust him in

taking care of that

and not having to check in with them

too often. So.

Too often.

Yeah, too often.

So let's touch on that.

Your job is to make sure the products

get their his

his or her job is to make sure

that it gets installed. Right.

How often do you stop by it

at the job site and check on progress

and see how things are going?

It varies.

It depends

on, you know, what part

a part of the job that they're at.

And many times my clients they,

they're not on the job site at all.

So they just want me to

walk through with them at different times

just to make sure everything's

running smoothly.

And, and that

and that works out pretty good.

Sometimes the contractors

are there, other times it's after

hours, so he won't be there.

It just it it varies.

Yeah.

So now, I’m

compelled to ask,

have you ever gone in

when the contractor isn't there

and just been freaked out

at what you're seeing that

that is not what you envision?

Yes. Or a product that arrived recently.

I had a situation

where I'm doing a executing a fireplace

and the stone was on the job.

It got delivered

and the stone was not correct.

It was

it had shading of green in it

and there was no green in the sample.

So I had to walk through and

get Eddie on the job and

pull off everything.

And we went through all the boxes and,

and there was a lot of tile,

so we had to send it all back

and I had to make a reselection.

So that's been a

process is still ongoing.

Well, you reselected

just out of curiosity

was because you just couldn't

trust it at that point.

Or they were saying,

it’s probably going to have green. Yes.

Yeah.

They were saying by the time

you eliminate all the green stone

that was appearing,

you know, it was a natural product,

so there was no guarantee.

So we had to get rid of it.

And I picked out something

that was a little bit more predictable.

Well, that's a good way of putting it.

Yeah.

How disappointing is that?

No, it. Was.

It was because it doesn't change.

The whole vision, too.

No, not that much.

I mean, it did in the beginning.

And then I had to, like,

just come to resolve with it

and just say, hey, we're just moving on.

We got to get going on this project.

So

because it held it up

for a good three weeks, so. Wow. Yeah.

No fun.

Then.

Probably the homeowner was none too

thrilled with that either.

How do you, how do you manage

that aspect? Yeah.

Luckily, this homeowner

trust me and everything.

So I just flat out said, hey,

you know what?

We're going to have to

just change course.

And, you know, and they're like,

Whatever you think. So that was. Good.

Well, that works out well. Yeah.

Yeah.

I mentioned earlier

you're a member of Process Wholesale.

How long have you been a member?

And why did you join?

Well, I've been member at least 30 years.

When they first started

and they were over off of,

I think it was Metro Boulevard and

did work with them when they first

like I was in appeared

in one of their magazine ads.

And I used to go there all the time

just to make selections for carpeting,

mainly at that point.

And then as

you get further into your career

and stuff tiles

and you know, any

anything that they offered.

And now of course,

there's so much bigger,

you know, with the cabinetry

and plumbing and all of that,

which is great to utilize.

I just I love coming here.

So yeah, so I'm

I'm going to put a little context on this

for our viewers and for our listeners,

because you said for 30 years.

So ProSource Wholesale started in 1991.

St Louis

showroom was the first

of those showrooms. Yeah.

So here we are, 2023.

Yeah.

So, yeah, you were

you were pretty close

to the beginning there.

I was, yeah. Yeah.

I worked with Mike,

who was the manager there,

and like I said, did

many, many projects with them.

So you've seen many changes?

Oh, yes, lots of changes.

And we'll be talking about that.

Yeah, that's.

Yeah, yeah. So here's the question.

That's how long you've been with us.

What keeps you coming back

as a member for that long. For 30 years.

Yeah. It's what's the.

What's the.

Biggest?

Well, the biggest thing is

Eddie Weddington is my manager,

and he always gets back with me quickly,

which is great.

And if there's a problem,

always comes to some solution.

But then when they started

adding the cabinetry and took me off

into another part of my career,

which I could then purchase the cabinets

and do the complete design,

you know, before

I always had to go to a retail place,

pick our cabinetry there,

go from place to place a place. Here,

I can come one,

you know, it's like one stop shopping,

you know, it's like everything's here.

So it,

it makes it much easier, much faster.

Specifically as a designer,

you know,

what are some of the benefits

of working with ProSource?

Is it

just being that one stop shop,

especially now? Yes, definitely.

Yeah, Products.

Definitely that

and I get the help that I need.

So I think before

when I used to have to

go to cabinet places,

you relied on the salesperson

to come up with the design.

And I always had input,

but not as much input.

When I can control it from the beginning,

which I like a lot better,

I feel like I end up

with a much better product

because I have a vision

and I want to execute that.

And instead of having somebody

share that with a client,

it's me sharing it with my client

and having the support behind it

and it makes my product come out

much better and my vision

come up a lot better too.

So when it comes to product selection,

do you have a preference in that?

Do you bring your homeowner

clients here to the showroom

and go through the product selection,

or do you prefer to take samples to them

and maybe have a little bit

of a control there?

Yeah, it well, it depends on the client.

Okay.

Some people will just say, Hey,

I'll just narrow it down to two

selections or just give me

what you think and I'll take the things

you know, the selections to them.

If somebody's really wanting

to go through lots of things,

then I will bring them in.

But usually that only happens once

and we'll spend

quite a bit of time pulling from,

you know, flooring,

cabinetry, countertops,

plumbing, all of that.

And then once we put it all together,

then they'll just say,

hey, bring

bring me some other choices

or some other ideas.

But typically it's

only one time they come in.

So yeah.

So when you talked

about taking all those products

and putting it together,

do you put together like a

sort of,

I'll call it a design board, as it were,

putting all those products

together in one little grouping

so they could see how they may

all interact in that particular space.

Yeah, quite a bit.

If once I go and see a client

that and then I'll invite them

to come here,

I'll usually have

something already

laid out as a starting point

so that we can say, Hey,

what do you think of these?

And, you know, narrow it down from there,

you know, tweak it, whatever.

So yeah.

So you mentioned Eddie

your account manager.

How do you navigate the product selection

along side of him?

Do you how involved, I guess

does he have. Hardly any at all.

He laughs at me

because I just come in and take over

and just do whatever.

But I do bring him in

when I don't know something

in particular about a product,

which is great

because used to be, you know,

I would have to go to all these different

like things

to, you know, teach me about products

and I don't have time for that anymore.

So I really lean on Eddie to help me

with that part of it.

Like, especially with flooring.

That's one thing with,

you know, hardwoods in the

LVT products now

and it changes so quickly anymore.

So and I just depend on him to kind of

guide me in that.

So is also part of it

keeping Eddie

not necessarily

out of the product selection, but just,

you know,

you controlling that part is part of

that also just your comfort level

because you have been

a member for so long. Yeah, Yeah.

A lot of it is.

I just come in, I'm in and out

like so quickly and,

you know, and Eddie

always laughs with me.

I go, I come take samples

and then he'll go,

Is your car full of samples?

And I'll say yes.

And he goes, Jump me, go clean it out.

And I'm like, Yes.

So we bring all the samples back in

and we drop them off. And anyway, so.

Okay, yeah.

So, you know, ProSource

has in-house kitchen and bath designers.

Do you make use of that service?

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Well, at least once a week, if not more.

Okay. Yeah.

So I work with Laura. Okay.

And she's great.

She does a great job and helps me execute

my designs and and my vision.

So, yeah.

So this might be a

I want to talk a little bit

about the dynamic of that relationship

and this might be a good time

also to sort of clarify,

because you're a designer

an interior designer,

we have kitchen and bath designers

maybe talk a little bit

about the distinction of what role

each of you play here

and then therefore how you work together

when you're coming to the showroom.

Right.

Primarily, I mean,

I already have a vision coming in.

What what

really AIDS

is the drawings

that she generates for me,

especially the 3D drawings,

because if somebody in

in their home has a certain vision and

and I'm not seeing their vision,

but anything

that I can give them on paper

so that they can comment on and

just help to see,

you know, yes, this is where

we're going in the right direction.

You know,

anything visual

that you can give a client

is best.

So and she really helps me on that

part of it so much.

Okay. Yeah.

But at least once a week

you're working with her. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Yeah. So

that would raise

another interesting question in that

when you look at the projects

that you do, are the vast

majority of them kitchens and bathrooms

or at least involve

a kitchen and bathroom?

I would say not, no, not all projects.

I mean,

I do do a lot of kitchens and baths,

but like a bar.

I'm doing a wine cellar right now

that she's helping me with.

I'm doing another bar.

So it just it's all over.

It could be just even refreshing a house,

which a lot of my clients

are just refreshing.

So it just involves changing countertops,

maybe a backsplash.

So, you know, we come in

with a drawing to do that.

So, yeah, it's all over the board.

I mean, you know,

lots of different things.

But no, I'm not always doing kitchens and baths.

I do lots of other products.

Well,

if you want to come over to my place

and do a wine cellar, I'm

not going to say no to that by the way.

Yeah, that was interesting.

Something else

that you mentioned there with the refresh

and maybe just doing countertop

or doing a backsplash.

So it doesn't have to be a whole room

makeover for you.

You could take something

that small and work with it.

Is that mostly though,

also from previous clients. Yes. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah.

It's clients

that I've worked with for years

and maybe I did their house, you know,

10, 15 years ago.

They'll want to come back

and say, okay,

take this house and give me a new look.

Some of it is just like maybe

using their area

rugs, changing paint colors,

adding some new

cabinets or, you know,

furniture pieces just to change it up.

You know, they get tired

and they want it to look different.

So, yeah, so I'm working on

lots of projects like that. Yeah.

So the smaller scale as it were.

Yeah. Yeah.

How many projects do

you take on at a time?

Well, I was counting the other day

because I'm like usually I,

I know usually

throughout the year

I'll have like 20 projects

going at one time.

Right now I have probably about 12 or 15.

At one time. Yeah. Yeah.

How do you balance that?

Everybody's had a different

face, so, you know,

you might concentrate

really heavily on a project.

Like right now I'm doing a barn.

I haven't done a barn.

Yes, I'm doing a barn.

Okay. Yes, We may talk about this.

Yeah.

It's a great project.

In fact, I'm going there

right after I leave here, so.

But it's a two story barn, and I'm.

I'm working with all the finishes

right now,

trying to come up

with the stained colors for the exterior.

But anyway, so it's a fun project.

No, I'm not letting this go.

I can't. Okay.

What are the animals

being kept inside this barn?

And we're, like,

setting them up on some nice LVT flooring?

No, No. This.

This is going to be more like a fun barn

where they have lots of toys to store.

Okay,

so it's out in Wildwood,

and we're actually

doing a container pool.

It's a pool made out of a

truck container. Okay.

And they're taking containers now

and they're actually lining them

and turning them into pools.

And so we're adding

one of these on the end of the barn.

So they it's a lap pool, basically.

Wow. It's a fun project.

I would love to see pictures of this

when this is done.

I know.

Because I'm trying to envision that.

Well, it's really fun

because I was there yesterday

and I'm seeing all the wood go up

and it's like an actual barn raising.

I love it. It's so fun.

I'm taking pictures every day.

So. Have you

ever done anything like that?

No, no, this is a new venture

So how did you prep yourself?

Is there even, like, research

you can do for this?

No, not really.

No, not really.

It's funny because my client.

You know, I've done their home,

obviously, and it's

right on their land, so

they've been wanting

this barn for a while.

So anyway, I got involved and,

you know, it's just fun.

Yeah.

So, so sorry to drive

so much into that project,

but that was so unique.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

I have a lot of unique projects. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah.

So maybe a little

bit of a spinoff of that.

How do you go about gathering information

on the homeowners

lifestyle and incorporate

that into your design?

And when I say that I'm talking

kids, pets

working from home,

which many people do now,

even in-laws who may or may live there,

how do you go

about getting that information

and then incorporating those parts

into your design?

Yeah, well,

that's part of my

one of my very first meetings

with the customer

and talking to them

about how they use their space

in their house,

you know,

and some of these homes that are older,

you know,

they'll have the formal living room,

formal dining room.

People don't use those.

So reworking spaces, I

do a lot of space planning

to make the

rest of the house work

instead of adding square footage,

use the square footage

they have to try to incorporate

some of those.

Right now

I'm working on a project in the city

where the customer, they live there for

probably about ten years,

but they want their in-laws to move in.

So they're we're developing

and adding an addition

onto the home

so that

the parents can live with them

as they age.

So yeah, I think

we're going to see a lot more of that.

You do to sort of the trend

line is going.

Yeah, I think you're going to see more

families living together

because costs are getting so expensive

and I think I think

we're going to see some of that.

Yeah. Okay.

So you touched on a little bit here.

How do you navigate actually

take into account the traffic flow

within a home,

a home remodel design, especially,

say, in a kitchen

that could may

or may not have like an island

they could, you got navigation around that.

So how does traffic flow

get incorporated into your designs?

Yeah, it's definitely important.

Obviously, it depends on,

you know, how somebody is coming in

from their home,

whether through the garage or

how they use that kitchen space.

A lot of people will want

to incorporate places

where they make charging stations.

They'll use their computer at an island.

There's an

if they have pets, you know,

many people want to incorporate

like a pet area,

whether it's in the kitchen

or close by in a laundry space.

And I'm seeing more

like people who use appliances

and they don't necessarily

want it in the kitchen.

Pantries become really important,

so they're actually

incorporating stations in the pantries

where they bring out appliances

or leave them out all the time

so that they do use them instead of,

you know, trying to pull something out.

You know, don't keep it already set up,

which is good.

That isn't when it's

either out or easily accessible it’s amazing

how much more frequently they are used.

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

Yeah.

So just because you brought up

because we were talking about pets

here, too, are you seeing a lot of

look, I'll

use the

term pet station

but more like the bath or shower station.

Oh yeah. Yeah.

For dogs. Yeah, I've done those.

It could be for cats. They’re a little less likely

to cooperate.

But yes, I've done a few dog showers.

Yeah, Yeah. Okay.

Yeah.

We just lowered the shower door itself

and have a handheld

so that you can actually rinse,

rinse the dogs off

and trap them in there at the same time.

So they don’t get everywhere. Yeah. Right.

Oh it's always important. Yeah.

So the pivot

a bit off of the word shower here

and go into plumbing

when you're doing a kitchen or bathroom,

how do you address

plumbing issues

that could occur there either

maybe it's

the existing plumbing

and that you're working with

or you have to relocate the plumbing.

Mm hmm.

Yeah.

Relocating. We do a lot.

Okay, So

because we're changing space around,

you know,

particularly the finishes

when you're getting into the plumbing,

Not so much.

I mean,

you can learn a lot

about shopping with somebody

on their plumbing

just by the finishes

they choose

and things that they talk about.

It's interesting.

When I do a whole house,

I'll start with plumbing

because it's kind of easy

and at least I get to hear

what a client like leans toward,

whether it's

more of a contemporary faucet versus

something a little bit softer,

I can kind of tell

where they're going

with the rest of the items

they're going to choose.

So but

right now,

I think there's so many great finishes

that they're coming out with plumbing

and it's like kind of like jewelry,

just like

hardware is on cabinets,

you know, it just it

it kind of adds another element.

That's it,

you know, really makes the kitchen shine.

So I like that.

But it's interesting

that you would say that, though,

that you might actually start with

with some of plumbing

like faucets

and drive out from there,

because I think that that would be

maybe last on the list.

But you kind of use

that as the motivational element

for the theme in the room.

And getting more information

from the client.

You know, just talking about a project,

sometimes they don't know

what to tell you.

You have to kind of

pull that out of them.

So starting with something simpler,

you can kind of hear

what they're saying

and, you know,

it helps you with other parts of the

of the project. Yeah.

So staying for a moment in kitchens,

what about existing appliances

that are in there?

How do you take that into account

or are you

more often than not changing out

appliances at the same time?

No appliances are a challenge these days.

Takes a long time to get them

and if somebody has like, for instance,

I'm doing a project

now where they have a 48 inch subzero,

I'm encouraging them to

keep it and work with it because really,

I mean, it's almost like 18 months

now to get some appliances

and it's crazy.

It does dictate,

you know,

what you're going to do in a kitchen.

And I often tell them to go ahead and go

appliance shopping

and give me some input on that

before we actually get

started on the design,

because it does

it does dictate some of those things.

So. What about

if we break out side of that?

What about existing furniture

that they may want to keep

in a particular space? Yeah,

a lot of people have heirlooms

from different family members.

You know, we try to incorporate that,

but also letting them know

it also is going to dictate their style.

So you have to walk gently with that,

but try to incorporate as best you can.

And you know,

most of them know whether or not it's

going to fit the design or not.

And they have to make that choice

whether or not to use that in their space

or put it somewhere else.

So because we've talked a little bit here

about style,

if I were to ask you,

what is your particular style

preference? Just straight up yours,

if you could take any blank space

and put it

put a particular style in there,

what would you lean toward?

I'm I am more contemporary,

not on the modern end of it,

but more contemporary personally.

But of course I do every style right?

And you have to in this business.

I also have a Western style

lower level,

not my preference, but my husband's.

But our. Whole. That's nice of you.

Yeah,

well, I started there

when I moved into his home.

We decided to remodel it

and I told him he could do anything

in the lower level, but beyond that,

that was it.

So he was confined to that one space.

Yeah, he is confined, he loves it.

And so he's happy with that.

So I get the rest of the house,

so it's all good. Okay,

so I ask that and then I'm curious,

when you're designing a space

for one of your clients,

how are you able to keep

your own personal preferences

sort of out of it

and zone in on what they.

Oh yeah.

Oh yeah, definitely.

Yeah, yeah.

I've done

lots of different styles, you know,

over the years. So

yeah, so

one of the

interesting projects

I did, a lady and her husband

lived in Singapore

and they had quite a few artifacts

that they brought back from there

and the whole house was around that.

Not necessarily my style,

but it was a great project

and was fun to deal with. So yeah.

So you mentioned

you worked

with all sorts of different designs.

How many different design styles

do you think you've worked with?

Is there one you haven't worked with?

Maybe is an easier

question.

Yeah, probably that would be the easier

question. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like Southwest.

Yeah, yeah.

There's, yeah, a number of styles.

Okay, so

let's do this.

And if this brings us back to the barn,

so be it.

But can you talk about

some of the most fun projects

that you've worked on

and what made them so enjoyable?

Yeah, so I did a really great project

some years ago.

It was

for a

house that was being built over in Ladue

and the gentleman

collected artifacts

from all over the world. Fireplaces,

architectural pieces,

and he had a whole warehouse full of it

and the home was quite large and so

when I got hired,

he took me to this warehouse

and said,

I want you to incorporate

as many of these items as you can.

Into the house. Into his new home.

And it was a big home, so

there was lots of space,

but it was a challenge.

And, you know,

I had to work with specific sizes.

Of course,

and just there was some fabulous pieces

a marble fireplaces,

columns from all over

brackets and from old buildings.

Anyway,

so the project was great

and it lasted for quite a while.

And the home is gorgeous.

It turned out really beautiful.

Yeah, it was a great project.

So it's all done?

Oh yeah. Percentage wise.

What do you think?

You how much of his artifacts

did you think you got into the home?

Quite a bit.

And I think he was really impressed

by how much I was able to incorporate.

You know, we did things in doorways

and he had a copper ceiling

that I incorporated

into a pool table room,

like one of the old tin ceilings

that he had gotten out

of a particular place,

doors, old

doors, windows,

you know, quite a few pieces of it.

It was really interesting

how it came out.

So. I don't think I ever want to go into

how he got all that back.

Yeah, I know. And I'm like, Yeah, yeah.

I don't know how he got it all there,

but he had quite a bit, so.

Wow. Okay then.

Well, let's flip it the other way.

Can you talk about

some of the challenges that you face

and how you overcome

those challenges in your design?

You mean working with

in what way?

What challenges? It could be anything.

It could be

just the space

in the way it's

configured or what

you want to do,

or it's a product that gets selected.

Yeah, well,

I guess there's always challenges

on every project.

What I like to do is, is look at a whole

space for a client

and instead of confining it to say,

Let's do a kitchen design,

many people don't look outside of the box

by opening up,

like taking down a wall

or opening up a window

or relocating a window.

Something as simple as that

can make all the difference in the world.

And I try to share that with them

and press them a little bit

so that the outcome of the project

can be so much better.

Sometimes you can get to people

to do that type of thing

at other times that they

they're not open to it at all.

So it just depends.

Have you ever gone into a project

and the client wants something done

and you look at the space and like,

this just can't be done.

Right? Yes, of course. Yeah.

And sometimes you just have

to educate them

and prove to them

that it show them

another avenue, you know,

you know, put down a

different objective,

a different way of looking at something

and you can get them to come around.

Yeah. Yeah.

So here, maybe a fun question for you.

Taking it from a designer standpoint,

there are one or two shows on TV

or streaming. Yeah.

So within the home

remodeling world, as it were,

how do you take first off, do you,

is there any of those shows that you like

or feel

are realistiv enough

or can even offer inspiration from

with it,

or do you just find them

to be more of a nuisance

within your profession?

Oh, I think they're

they're all great because it does

teach people

what a designer actually does.

I think many people just think that

you choose,

you know, you choose furniture

and you put it in. The space planning

part of it

is really what we're all about.

And I think those shows

have taught people

that that's what

a designer actually does,

looks at your space

and reworks your space.

So that part's good.

The down part of it

is that they looks like

in one episode in one sitting,

you can have your whole job done.

And I mean. That's not realistic?

It's not realistic.

The other part

that is sort of irritating

as well is all of the programs

they use to convey the projects,

like all of the 3D elements.

I mean, those are all great,

but they cost lots of money,

so they are not all realistic

for somebody like myself to have

access to.

You know, we have

a little access to some of that,

but not like they portray

in some of the shows.

Yeah, fair enough.

So you sit down and you agree

on your vision with the homeowner.

How hard is it to set a realistic.

I put the emphasis on

that realistic budget with them. Yeah.

Do you find that

they even know what the budget should be?

No. Wow. That's.

That's pretty much what it is.

They don't know what the budget should be

because they're not aware.

But what I always look at is,

first of all, where's the home?

What price point are we in?

You don't want to overprice your project

because you're

never going to get it back.

We talk a little bit about that.

Some of them have an idea in their head.

Most of the time they don't,

so they just want to go

through the process and say, okay,

this is what I'm looking for.

Tell me how much that's going to be.

You know, and unfortunately,

I think throughout the years,

things have gotten so expensive,

like a project,

maybe even three

or four years ago, you know,

it's elevated so much and people

in their heads

may have looked at a project

maybe three or four years ago.

And now what they're seeing

is it's increased so much more. But

thank God they're still

out there doing them and it's all good.

So I was going to ask you

about that, about the changes.

It's not just having

done this for 30 years,

but with ProSource.

But just the last few years.

Oh, things have changed.

It's changed a lot. Yeah. Yeah.

Supply chain has just been horrendous

for this business.

It's been really tough.

It's getting better,

but it's still not completely there. So.

But yeah, it's been a challenge.

As a designer,

how much do you pay attention

to trends that come out

and everyone

you know, every paint

company comes out

with their color of the year

and some of them are very neutral

and others are just wild, right?

And so how much do you look at trends

and either you or the homeowner

want to incorporate

those into your designs?

Well, thank God they have trends

because otherwise

we would not be doing what we're doing.

So that's all good. But the trends, yeah,

what I encourage my

clients to do

is don't pay attention to them

because there's

always going to be something new.

So do what they feel like

that's best for them.

Use their color palettes.

Like when we went through all the whole

white kitchen and everything being gray,

I encouraged my clients, don't do that.

Do what,

those, you know,

your colors and your finishes

make you happy.

Not not something that's just so trendy,

you know, because it do it for yourself.

People are in a

worry about resale

unless somebody is only fixing it up

for resale.

That's the only time

I suggest that they look at it that way.

Otherwise, if they're staying there

and they're

doing a project, do it for themselves.

Yeah. Yeah.

So let's just flip it

maybe to your own world here

in the projects that you do,

do you see sort of trends or themes

developing within the projects

that you do?

Do you see a lot of that,

a lot of similar things happening?

Yes and no.

You know, I think in the Midwest, we all

people have a tendency

to be more traditional,

not so contemporary, but

I think the shows that are on TV

have inspired

lots of people to,

you know, reach out into other things.

When I go to market for furniture,

you know, it's a coastal thing.

You'll see

trends hit on the on the coastlines

much sooner

and then it comes back to here.

But for the most part, I think, you know,

if people are hiring somebody like me,

they're already interested in design,

so they've already educated themselves

to some aspect of that.

And so they're they're already aware

of, you know, what trends are coming

or what they're interested in anyway.

So you touched on it a little bit earlier too,

circling back to it.

Do you see a lot of technology

fitting into your designs,

like one of the one popular one

that we see out there

a lot is Alexa

is making her way throughout the house.

Oh yeah. In

a lot of especially

into kitchens and bathrooms.

Are you starting to see that

come forth in your designs?

Yeah, you do see that

sometimes it's just,

you know, mainly toward one one room.

But yeah, somewhat a lot of my clients

think technology is

it's too much into space

and it changes so quickly.

And what we've seen, you know,

just for instance with TVs over time

that industry changes so drastically

from even year to year that they're not

they don't

want to get caught up into that

and limit themselves.

So I don't know

if I've answered your question

well enough, but yeah. Good enough.

I’ll accept it. Okay.

All right.

So last question for you

here as a designer,

and it's a little bit

touching on budget as well,

how do you overcome the perception

that some homeowners may have of saying,

A. I don't need a designer,

I just do this on my own and work

with a contractor to get it done,

or they look at it and say,

I might want to designer,

but I can't afford that. Right?

That because that's just going to add

to the cost of the project.

You think it's just going to go up

exponentially.

How do you overcome that perception?

That's easy.

Okay, so.

I'm glad I could ask you

an easy question. Yeah. So

so first of

all, when a client does call me,

I'm honored that they do.

But when I go out to meet with them,

basically it's just for us

to get to know each other.

And I tell them that in the beginning,

it's it's more about,

can you work with this person

and can we collaborate together

and get to some design

to make them feel more comfortable

with that,

either like charge an hourly fee

or give them a flat fee

And some of the flat fees.

I'm seeing more and more of that,

especially if somebody has never worked

with the designer before.

They want to know what that

what that outcome is going

to be as far as dollar amounts.

And so I'll tell them, okay,

that this includes

this service and give them a flat fee.

They feel comfortable.

It's then they don't feel

bad about calling me or

inviting me to come out or

shopping with them or whatever

part of the project is because they know

there's a set dollar amount

and that helps them.

And I think once they get started,

then they're ready to

go on another project.

So it's it's easy once we get, get,

get in there

and get some comfort zone for them.

Do you feel it's fair, say,

even if it's not perceived that way,

that using a designer

can actually save you money in some ways?

Oh yeah. Yeah.

And I think, you know,

I don't necessarily say that to them

because I'd rather them know that

by when they get into the project,

they're then they start realizing

how much it does save them

and how much time it saves them as well.

Yeah, Well,

thank you for joining us here today

and sharing your thoughts.

Appreciate that.

Ellen Kurtz, everyone.

We appreciate you joining us

on The ProSource Podcast.

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