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Join Australia's leading comic speechmaker, Homer Papantonio, and renowned cardiologist, Dr. Ross Walker, for a podcast that blends humor and health in a way you’ve never heard before. "The Seriously Funny Wellbeing Podcast" delivers top-notch insights on wellness and well-being with a satirical twist. Get ready to laugh, learn, and live better—it's not for the faint-hearted!
Homer Papantonio (00:02.428)
Welcome ladies and gentlemen to podcast number 13 of the Seriously Funny Wellbeing Show and this one is on motivation and with me again is the highly motivational, all-round nice guy and affable, irresistible and often insatiable Dr Ross Walker. So we're going to start with some profound jokes and quotes on motivation Ross.
Ross Walker (00:23.374)
Yeah, I thought you were having me on today.
Homer Papantonio (00:31.482)
And of course a lot of motivation has to do with the mind, moods and perspective. Remember Ross, that talking to yourself is okay, but answering back is risky. The statistics on sanity are that one out of every four people is suffering from a mental illness. Look at your three best friends, if they're okay then it's probably you.
Ross Walker (00:44.175)
Absolutely.
Ross Walker (00:55.576)
Yep.
Homer Papantonio (00:57.146)
You might empathise with this Ross, what's the difference between the psychiatrist and the patients at the mental hospital?
Ross Walker (01:06.18)
The psychiatrists are letting go home.
Homer Papantonio (01:08.772)
patients are the ones that eventually get better and go home. So Ross do you know that research has shown that laughing for two minutes is just as healthy as a 20-minute jog. So now I'm sitting in the park laughing at all the joggers. Another one, whatever you do in life always give a hundred percent unless you're donating blood.
Ross Walker (01:23.672)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (01:31.022)
I like that one that's one of your better ones.
Homer Papantonio (01:35.185)
People often say that motivation doesn't last. Well neither does bathing. That's why we recommend it daily. Live every day as if it were your last and one day you'll be right. One in five people have dandruff. One in four people have a mental health problem. I've had both. This is interesting.
My therapist told me that I overanalyze everything. I explained to him that he only thinks this because of his unhappy relationship with his mother.
Ross Walker (02:05.368)
Yeah, that's right.
Homer Papantonio (02:08.405)
This is a good one. I told my wife the truth. I told her I was seeing a psychiatrist. Then she told me the truth. She was seeing a psychiatrist, two plumbers and a bartender.
Ross Walker (02:19.662)
Well, look, I've got to tell you that I tried just on motivation. I tried calling the tinnitus helpline. No answer. Just kept ringing.
Homer Papantonio (02:22.382)
you
Homer Papantonio (02:32.715)
So the reason I talk to myself Ross is because I'm the only one who answers I accept.
Ross Walker (02:39.404)
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (02:40.092)
So Ross, let's move on to the seriously funny side of the show. So if you're a light comedian, John Mulaney, who says, have to be funny first and if they have a point, that's awesome. And that's what this seriously funny wellbeing show is about. So Ross, medical news met foreman benefits beyond diabetes. That's been a very interesting subject, hasn't it?
Ross Walker (03:06.264)
Well, it's interesting that metformin is now being trialed around the world as an anti-aging drug. There's a thing called the TAME study where they're taking people about age 70 and a placebo-controlled trial to see after seven years whether there are parameters of aging, what the mortality rates are, et cetera. And the reason why they got onto this, they gave a bunch of diabetics metformin. metformin is the standard treatment for type 2 diabetes.
not type 1. So they gave a bunch of diabetics metformin and they compared them to age match controls who weren't diabetics who were not taking metformin. And they found that the diabetics taking the metformin had less heart disease and cancer than the non-diabetics who weren't taking it. So the metformin had some incredibly profound benefits in that situation. And I personally believe, treating a lot of diabetics myself, that all
Homer Papantonio (03:35.61)
Yep. Yep.
Ross Walker (04:03.79)
type 2 diabetics should be taking metformin as long as they don't have significant kidney disease. But these two studies, the first one in Nature Genetics, looked at the effects of metformin on a particular gene that has a major role in cell growth and found that metformin in laboratory animals and in human culture cells of cancer, et cetera, et cetera, stopped the growth of cells.
So they're now getting to the mechanisms for why metformin may be an anti-cancer drug and going with that anti-cancer drug, probably an anti-aging drug. And interestingly, they found that in the mice who were genetically primed to develop esophageal cancer, those mice who were fed a processed Western diet or had type 1 diabetes induced.
Homer Papantonio (04:38.374)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (05:00.396)
they found that they marked increase for esophageal cancer, but the metformin blocked that in those particular mice. So interesting work there. Then they took a bunch of monkeys and followed them for four years and gave them metformin and compared them to age match controlled monkeys and found that metformin markedly reduced the deterioration in their organ function. So pretty exciting stuff.
Homer Papantonio (05:24.048)
Yeah, that was funny. I've just got a vision when you said... The researchers followed the monkeys. What, with Metformin? Were they chasing him around with Metformin?
I just found that funny Ross, What do they entice them with a banana to come here and hit some metformin? So future of medicine, yellow food dyes increases skin transparency.
Ross Walker (05:41.099)
Yeah, that's hilarious.
Ross Walker (05:47.01)
I just put the metformin in that child.
Ross Walker (05:55.884)
Yeah, now why is this is sort of could be in my future of medicine file or in my weird file. So what if it increases skin transparency? Well, there's a few animals, jellyfish, zebrafish and a glass frog, whatever a glass frog is, who have transparent skin so you can see through to their organs. The zebrafish is very much used in medical research because you get a great look through the body of a zebrafish. But they found that
In mice, if they painted this particular yellow food dye that had the unusual name of FDNC Yellow 5, if they painted on the abdomens of mice, they could see through into their organs. And so this is an interesting thing because mice have very thin skin, unlike humans. But what they're talking about is potentially now using this for humans for a few specific things. So there's a lot of people that have really lousy veins. So I know myself.
I've got one decent vein to have blood taken from. So people have really lousy veins. If you could coat this dye on the skin, you could actually show the veins right up and make it easier for the people putting IV lines in or taking blood. So it's one thing. Also, the early detection of skin cancers. So you put it over the skin and it shows up the skin cancer. And light delivery to deep tissues for things called photodynamic and...
photo, just general photo thermal therapies and also simplifying laser removal for tattoos as well. So it's just a lot of areas where it might be good to make the skin more transparent.
Homer Papantonio (07:35.324)
You wouldn't want it to be too transparent Ross. Imagine it'd be a turn off. Imagine seeing someone and you could see their heart, lungs, their testicles, their rib cages. Okay, you wouldn't want any of that. Body of evidence, mind, diet and memory. Always interesting. Yeah.
Ross Walker (07:38.491)
It goes away. You just use it.
Ross Walker (07:45.664)
It's, we're not too here. Now that'd be a real balls up. We're not, we're not too here.
Ross Walker (07:57.378)
Yeah, this is interesting. Look, when you go into any bookstore, you go to the health section, there are so many books there on diet. There've been books, there've probably been thousands of books written about diets, you name it. Yeah, the Atkins diet, all these sort of different diets, the Zone diet and the keto and paleo and all this stuff. But the reality is,
Homer Papantonio (08:07.872)
how many diets are there? The Predican diet, the blood type diet, the whole lot, Yep, yep.
Homer Papantonio (08:21.488)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (08:24.984)
There's only one major diet that has any long-term evidence base, and I say it all the time, it's the Mediterranean diet. So they looked at this particular thing called the MIND, M-I-N-D diet to see if it had an effect on improving cognition as you got older. But what is the MIND diet? It's really just a combination of the Mediterranean diet and a thing called the DASH diet, which is another variation on the Mediterranean diet. And basically this MIND diet has...
the two or three pieces of fruit per day, the three to five servings of vegetables, the little bits of meat, eggs, dairy, chicken, fish, nuts and olive oil, with a bit of a focus on berries, because berries have particular plant chemicals called polyphenols that concentrate in the brain and having at least one or two pieces of fish per week. And this was a study of just over 14,000 people, average age 64, and it found that those who had...
The greatest adherence to the MIND diet, which I'm just saying is a variant on the theme of the Mediterranean diet, had a moderate reduction in progression to cognitive decline. So interesting stuff.
Homer Papantonio (09:30.332)
And we can bang diets, I like the whole area of food as medicine. That food can work as medicine. Yeah. Yeah.
Ross Walker (09:39.435)
It's the third most important drug on the planet, what you put in your mouth, after the second most important drug, which is three to five hours every week of exercise, two-thirds cardio, third resistance, and the most important drug, happiness.
Homer Papantonio (09:49.307)
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (09:53.648)
Yeah, and this is a really interesting, controversial subject here, Ross. Mobile phones, safe or harmful? And I'll preface this by a friend of mine, Charlie Tio, the neurosurgeon, had a suspicion many moons ago when I met him, I did a fundraiser, and he always thought that there was a connection between...
Ross Walker (10:00.332)
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (10:21.134)
mobile phone use and rare forms of brain tumours. What's the evidence telling us now, Ross?
Ross Walker (10:25.282)
Yep.
Ross Walker (10:30.414)
Well, the evidence is really interesting because there's two studies have come out. One came out recently and it was a study published in the Canadian Journal of Cardiology. Sorry, no, no, that's the second study. The first study was published out of Australia. It was an Australian study looking at mobile phone use over about 30 years. And especially from 2003, the uptake of mobile phones went through the roof.
And so what they did was measure the amount of brain tumors that occurred over that period. And basically, apart from a little bit of an uptake in the diagnosis of glioblastoma, which only occurred because of improved MRI techniques, there was no increase. I look at Charlie, Charlie's a mate of mine as well. I know Charlie very well. And I'm not saying he's wrong, but I'm just saying there is no evidence that mobile phone use that has improved. I mean, everyone's got a mobile phone.
Homer Papantonio (11:16.732)
Hmm.
Homer Papantonio (11:22.48)
Nah. Yeah.
Ross Walker (11:28.588)
And there hasn't been a marked increase in glioblastoma meningioma and people use it. There was a study out of the WHA, you ask who, a number of years ago suggesting that people use a phone on one side. Most of us tend to use the phone either on the left side or the right side most of the time. So people use the phone on one side for more than 30 minutes a day on a regular basis. Have about a 30 % increase risk for brain tumour. But this big study out of Australia.
Homer Papantonio (11:28.72)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (11:57.558)
refutes that saying this.
Homer Papantonio (11:58.95)
Would it be safe just to, in the light that we know that radiation, all that, it's cumulative and it cumulatively can cause certain cancers, would you just use it if you can on the speaker phone? Yeah.
Ross Walker (12:17.806)
yeah, look, I'm not saying I think people should forget about this and whack the phone to their head as much as they can. I think that people should minimise their use of the phone anyhow. I I just find it, I find it almost vulgar when you go out to a restaurant and you see two couples, or a couple there, just on their phones not talking to each other. It's rude to the relationship, it's rude. Or what really irritates me.
Homer Papantonio (12:22.576)
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (12:29.489)
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (12:39.194)
Yes, I know.
Ross Walker (12:46.944)
is when you get on public transport and some fool is there talking at the top of their voice as if you care about their conversation. I mean seriously, if anyone's listening this and you do that, stop! It is rude! No one cares about what you think.
Homer Papantonio (12:54.115)
Hahaha
I know. Yes, it's very rude. But also young ladies, may I say, crossing the road looking down at their mobile phone. Yeah, yeah, I mean...
Ross Walker (13:09.74)
No, it's not just the ladies, it's everybody does it. And it's dangerous and it's ridiculous. So I think we should use the hands free as much as possible, minimise your use of the phone, text people more than having a conversation with them and talk to them face to face. That's the way of doing it. But the second study, the one that was published in the Canadian Journal of Cardiology, looked at people who use their phones the least as opposed to use their phones the most.
Homer Papantonio (13:31.76)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (13:37.774)
those who use their phones the most had a significant increase in cardiovascular disease. 21, if you use the phone for more than six hours a week, 21 % increased risk for cardiovascular disease. Now, why? Why on earth would that happen? Well, I reckon it's associated with people who use the phone a lot are more stressed. Because why are they, no, not just sedentary, they're more stressed. Why are they on the phone so much?
Homer Papantonio (14:01.817)
century.
Ross Walker (14:07.202)
What are they doing on the phone? Now know my son's in real estate and he's always on the phone, but it's a stressful job as well. He's dealing with people all day. They ring him at any time of the day or night. So maybe it's the stress that goes with this. There's also an assessment.
Homer Papantonio (14:20.398)
It's a fear of missing out, FOMO, know, fear of missing out, I mean, yeah, but on things, on deals, on trends, you know, yeah.
Ross Walker (14:24.738)
see how what you know
No, I get that, but I'm just saying it's that, it's sleep quality, it's possibly neuroticism, it's the psychological distress of it all, but there is a link between the amount of time you use your phone and cardiovascular disease, but there doesn't appear to be a link between the amount of time you use the phone and brain tumour. Okay?
Homer Papantonio (14:48.294)
Yes, that's another room for another podcast, Internet Addiction Disorder 2, which is huge in China apparently. A lot of people staying up all night, they just don't sleep. And they're into all these different forms of social media. So Ross, let's move on to motivation. Interestingly, most speaker agencies...
Ross Walker (14:55.298)
yeah,
Ross Walker (14:59.436)
Yep.
Ross Walker (15:12.692)
I couldn't be bothered, Homer.
Homer Papantonio (15:15.984)
would classify me as a corporate imposter, they'd say, how do I define what I do? Well, I'm like a humorous motivational speaker. Ross, you might also broadly fit into this category too, as a motivational, you're informative, everything. Yeah, of course you are, Because we both try on occasions to succeed to enlighten people to change for the better, don't we?
Ross Walker (15:31.764)
I'm a lot funnier than you so...
Ross Walker (15:41.634)
Yep. Yep.
Homer Papantonio (15:43.036)
Interestingly, motivation has a symbiotic relationship with wellbeing. A motivated person may also tend to engage in healthy behaviour, improving their general health. They may also form an upward spiral of positivity.
understanding the relationship of the mind with the body and create a path that leads to a healthy life. That's what we do. So motivation is the affirmative desire to accomplish something, but it isn't a prerequisite for accomplishing it. But it can sure help. When you're not feeling motivated, getting things accomplished can feel like an enormous burden. So clearly it's in your best interest to your motivation. But the question is,
It's easy to believe motivation is a feeling that just happens to hit us randomly like a bolt of lightning. But the truth is, motivation isn't a feeling, rather it's a manifestation of thought and you can create it by adjusting your mindset. The challenging is figuring out what sort of mindset you need to cultivate motivation. So maybe instead of a fixed
closed, rigid mindset, and we all know people like that, we need to have an open, curious, optimistic mindset. And I love those qualities of gratitude, optimism, perspective, and for some the right mindset involves setting goals, but that won't necessarily work.
for someone who finds it challenging to connect actions with results, particularly if the results can't be seen immediately like weight loss or attaining a fitness goal. Sometimes it's fear, sometimes it's lack of self-confidence. One way to change the narrative is to literally change the narrative voice in your head to one that's kinder, more encouraging,
Homer Papantonio (17:49.742)
and has a, wait for it, a sense of humour. Right? A sense of humour, because...
Ross Walker (17:53.71)
Hmm.
Homer Papantonio (17:56.84)
Humours big but interesting there's a psychology and biology to motivation when someone comes to me and says I haven't the energy or motivation to exercise the irony is as I've said countless times we need to expend energy to create energy and ideally feel motivated and energized at the end of this process. So I studied exercise prescription many moons ago which is all about type, duration, frequency, intensity
and volume of an activity. But I think if we genuinely want to increase fitness and activity levels in this country, and I don't know, there's a huge proportion of the Australian population, Ross, that doesn't get, doesn't do any form of exercise. Huge percentage.
Ross Walker (18:45.87)
Only 25 % of people do the walk or prescribed dose of three to five hours a week.
Homer Papantonio (18:51.6)
Yeah, yeah. So we have to get people, wait for it, to choose an activity or exercise that suits their personality. And all of us should become good animals. I've said that. So if you're an introvert, you're probably like...
exercise, but this is a it's quiet head clearing benefits maybe endurance sports like swimming, cycling, running, one-on-one personal training, rock climbing, golf. So these mind body exercises are non-judgmental high energy if you're an extrovert you might like
pole dancing, zumba, hitting new jam, there's all these other fitness things out there. There will always be extroverts who put on headphones and anyway. So that's always been an intriguing subject for me when, as a motivational people, how to get people to change what they're doing. They're pretty can...
said many moons ago when he was trying to get people on his diet and it was always a scare tactic to say if you want people to change their diet they'll do it for two reasons interest or fear and there's a school of thought that says to GPs such as yourself, Ross, if you've got a chain smoking patient to say to them listen Fred if you don't give up smoking in three months you'll be dead
Would that motivate them to say, should you have the green light to do something like that? Yeah.
Ross Walker (20:29.949)
But I'm not a GP, I'm a cardiologist, but that's statusite. But I say it to people all the time. I said it to a woman the other day. But look, I think we've got to take this a little bit deeper. It's not just about motivating people to exercise. It's about what do people need to be motivated for? They need to be motivated to change things that aren't working for them. And so I have a thing, there's a couple of things I want to talk about.
Homer Papantonio (20:32.484)
Yep. But even other cardiologists should say that.
Homer Papantonio (20:43.473)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (20:50.063)
Mm.
Homer Papantonio (20:53.564)
Hmm.
Ross Walker (20:58.284)
I want to talk about what my daughter, Dr. Ali Walker, speaks about around the place. She's a motivational speaker, strangely, who talks about all this, talks about relationships. She's written two wonderful books, one Get Conscious and another one Click or Clash about relationships. But she also talks about the motivational quadrant.
Homer Papantonio (21:06.149)
Another one.
Homer Papantonio (21:18.108)
Mmm.
Ross Walker (21:18.73)
And so it's like anything. Years and years ago, I visited a guy called Vic Stricker in Ann Arbor in Michigan, because he is very big on motivating people to stop smoking. And one of the things Vic always talks about is you have to give people personalized messages. So you mentioned there are people who are motivated to do this, people motivated to do that, people who are motivated by positive reinforcement. So the carrot.
Other people are motivated by negative reinforcement, the stick. But here are the four quadrants of motivation. So firstly, there are people who are motivated by power, by security, by making money. OK, so those people are in that quadrant. It's all competition, power, et cetera. Then there are people who are motivated by hedonism. So people, it's all about pleasure and fun and adventure and indulgence, all of those things.
Then there are people who are motivated by love and belonging and connection. Then there are people who motivated by altruism. So to them, when something happens in their life, to get them to change whatever's caused that bad thing to happen for them, whether it be a heart attack or a relationship breakdown or whatever, you've got to motivate them based on what motivates them.
So you've got to find out which quadrant that person sits in. So there's no point saying to the CEO who has just had a heart attack, you want to get back to be able to see your grandchildren. I'm not saying they don't care about their grandchildren. What they care about is getting back to their powerful position.
then I've got a friend who is like a brother to me who I love dearly, but he's significantly overweight and he hates exercise and loves food. He's a human vacuum cleaner. But his only motivation is hedonism and pleasure. So that's what you've got to motivate him for.
Homer Papantonio (23:13.596)
But should you be compartmentalizing those quadrants? No, but Arthur, could you have two or three of those quadrants?
Ross Walker (23:17.708)
Of course you should, of course.
Ross Walker (23:24.106)
no, look, Hema, nothing's ever that simple. No one's ever only in that quadrant. I'm just saying, what is the primary motivation for that person? There's often other, and so the third one, somebody who is motivated by love and belonging connections. So that's when the grandmother comes in with a heart attack.
Homer Papantonio (23:28.76)
Okay, yeah.
Homer Papantonio (23:32.705)
Primary motivation, okay.
Ross Walker (23:44.782)
And all she cares about is getting back to being able to see her grandchildren again, her connections with the family. And then there's the people who are just motivated by altruism. They just want to do good. want to be, so they want to get back to be able to doing all of those things. So I just want to tell you a couple of stories. One of the things that I use in my own practice is what I call my five point power program to motivate people. So firstly,
Homer Papantonio (24:09.936)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (24:12.11)
The first thing in anything, it's the same thing with anything I do in my practice, is assess how bad someone's condition is to start off with. So decide what the problem is. And that person, the first step is to make a decision that they want to change. OK, so there's that old joke.
about how many Californians does it take to change a light bulb? answer is five. One to change the bulb and four to share the experience. How many social workers does it take to change a light bulb? The answer is 10. One to change the bulb and nine to workshop it. And then how many psychiatrists does it take to change a light bulb? The answer is one, but that light bulb has to really want to change. So that, they're your change jokes. so people have to A, make the decision that, well, firstly, recognize there's a problem and say,
I've got to do something about it. Secondly, that nature will certainly look at the limiting patterns in your life that are stopping you from achieving that change. Number three, nature abhors a vacuum. So you don't just stop something and replace it something else. I'm going to give you a great example in a second. Number four, you've got to train the habit. And I'll get onto that. And number five, you've got to live the program. So let's, I'll give you probably the best case from my practice.
This occurred 30 years ago. A man I saw, his name's Alan, that's his real name. I won't give you his last name, of course. He came to see me, was age 42, and he had the worst case of dilated cardiomyopathy I'd ever seen. In an ultrasound, the heart on the screen is doing that. His was doing this. Almost not moving. And Alan went on to tell me how...
He worked on the tugs down at the down down in Sydney Harbour. And when the tugs weren't in, they'd start drinking at the pub at 10 o'clock in the morning. And he'd drink till about 10 o'clock at night, probably have about 20 schooners over that time. And he'd stay absolutely blind rolling drunk every day. And he'd wiped his heart out from this alcohol induced cardiomyopathy. He didn't No. So anyhow, I said to him, you got a choice here, mate. Keep drinking. You're going to be dead within a month.
Homer Papantonio (26:08.38)
Smoker.
Homer Papantonio (26:18.716)
Thank you.
Ross Walker (26:26.528)
Stop drinking and I'll salvage your heart. So Al thought, well, I don't want to die, I'm 42. So he stopped drinking. But what was the limiting pattern for Al? Well, going to work. He wasn't well enough to work anymore. He had 20 liters of extra fluid in his body because his heart just wasn't pumping the fluid through. So I put him onto a pension straight away because he just wasn't well enough to work. And then, this is mind
Homer Papantonio (26:32.22)
you
Yeah.
Ross Walker (26:57.356)
He then replaced his alcohol habit with a fascination with Egyptology. So this knockabout 42-year-old Warfy became an amateur Egyptologist. He learned everything he could about Egypt. He just became obsessed with Egypt, did courses on it, became an expert in Egypt. And the money that he used to spend on grog, he put into a bank account. So he replaced it. And...
Homer Papantonio (27:22.694)
Yes.
Ross Walker (27:25.262)
saved up enough money to take him and his beautiful wife Thea over to Egypt to go through this, when it was safer to do it, to go through the pyramids. And he had a wonderful, wonderful trip based on all of this. And I've got to tell you beautiful story. About 15 years ago, mean, Al's still one of my faithful patients. He's still alive at 72. His heart's back to normal.
Homer Papantonio (27:45.478)
So just on Al, so he followed his passion, not his pension. Even though you put him on that. Yeah. Okay.
Ross Walker (27:50.222)
That's it. That's it. But 15 years ago, he came in to see me and he put a picture on my table. He said, Ross, this is my grandson, Jake. He said, without you, I wouldn't be enjoying Jake's life. I said, no, Al, without the decision you made 15 years ago, because it was 15 years ago when this happened, you wouldn't be enjoying Jake's life. You made that powerful decision that has completely turned around your life. And then number four in all of this is
Homer Papantonio (27:59.846)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (28:19.778)
You've got to train the habit. Now, my very, very good friend, Dr. Gina Cleo, who lives just around the corner from you on the Gold Coast, she is the habit change expert. So she's written a wonderful book called The Habit Revolution. So anyone should buy that book and read it. And she talks about the fact that you've got to train your habits and you've got to make small changes at any one time. Alan had to make a big change. She just couldn't drink anymore or he was dead. But for most of us, you mentioned weight loss before.
And this is the problem with weight loss. People want the quick fix. So they go on a diet, and I wrote a book 20 years ago called, Diets Don't Work. It's just on the back shelf there. And diets don't work because you go on a diet like you go on a holiday. What happens when you go on a holiday? You come back. What happens when you go on a diet? You stop. Because for the first month, yeah, you lose five kilos, but you're only losing water and muscle. No one wants to lose water and muscle. You want to lose fat. But fats, it's like an archeologic dig. The fat's ingrained there.
You've got to work for months and months and months before you start shifting any of the deep ingrained fat that you've put on over 20, 30 kilos. Sorry, 20, 30 years you put on 20, 30 kilos. So it's going to take a long time to get rid of that fat. And people don't have the staying power to get rid of that fat. So what Gina does is teach you how to do things on a small basis, look for small changes so you can develop those habits. So you've got to train the habit, she says, for 66 days.
Homer Papantonio (29:27.704)
Yes,
Ross Walker (29:46.958)
before it then becomes an ingrained habit in your life. I think at least 30, but she's more the expert than I am. So you must, you certainly must train that habit. And then finally, and here's the key, you've got to live the program for the rest of your life. And you see, this is the problem, Homer. You walk up to a set of stairs and a set of escalators, and 95 % of people take the escalators because it's easy. If you take the stairs, you don't get to the top of the stairs and look down and go...
Homer Papantonio (30:00.636)
Yeah. Yeah.
Ross Walker (30:15.778)
Well, there goes a kilo, because Confucius said once, said, a journey of a thousand steps begins with a single step.
Homer Papantonio (30:23.772)
So that's a great segue into what I just a paragraph or two that I should have mentioned. sorry, can't, yep.
Ross Walker (30:30.35)
Well, I can I just finish off with one more thing. The great Napoleon Hill wrote a book years and years ago, I think it was in the 1930s called Think and Grow Rich. And he wasn't talking about money. He was talking about being successful in everything you do. And the two great success principles are discipline and perseverance, which is living the program for the rest of your days. And the most successful people on this planet in all ways are people who are disciplined.
Homer Papantonio (30:39.953)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (30:59.084)
and people who demonstrate perseverance. Over to you.
Homer Papantonio (31:02.074)
Yeah, so it's interesting when you mention power, immediately I thought of politicians. When you mentioned hedonistic, elite athletes have to be, by and large, they've got to be almost vain and look after every aspect of themselves and very much selfish maybe. Love and belonging, mothers, the best aren't they?
Ross Walker (31:27.18)
Mothers, a mother is the greatest example of loving and belonging.
Homer Papantonio (31:31.492)
Yeah and ultra-wisdom would be someone like Mahatma Gandhi or
Ross Walker (31:38.456)
Hmm. Inspiration of people. Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (31:41.34)
was gonna say that. Yeah, yeah, those. But the intriguing thing about motivation, you touched on it before, Ross, is that we have to do uncomfortable things quite often in life that may enhance our wellbeing, that builds resilience, capacity, and quite often after a tall over, like banging your head against a brick wall, contentment, happiness, that the pain goes away. Whatever the sport, exercise, activity, people,
who have become uncomfortable in it are more engaged in their activity. They feel more motivated to keep doing it. And there's a, how do you describe a certain level of exercise they call zone two or zone three, that is a little bit uncomfortable where you can't speak.
too well and everything. that's something. So growing is often uncomfortable. Embracing discomfort can be motivating. People should seek the discomfort inherent in growth as a sign of progress instead of avoiding it. And again, it also comes back to what you mentioned before about purpose, having a sense of purpose with your life.
and also being passionate about what you do, really liking what you do, finding, you know, maybe it's the luxury of our years that we do what we do, you know, and we try and it's not about the money, it's not about, not that we make any, yeah.
Ross Walker (33:16.206)
No, think we all, look, let's be frank here, everyone needs money. We all need money to survive. And in fact, it's been shown that in terms of happiness, there's a certain amount of income you need to actually maintain happiness in this society. But once you get above that, I see people at the top end of town who are incredibly wealthy. They're no happier than the rest of us.
Homer Papantonio (33:22.566)
Yeah.
Homer Papantonio (33:38.086)
Yes.
Ross Walker (33:40.002)
because they've got so much money, they just worry about what they're going to do with it. So I think that money, if money is your primary motivation for anything, you really have to look at what you're doing. I've been doing my job for 45 years. I love it. I still enjoy every day that I work. I mean, I don't want to work myself into the ground, but I certainly, 45 years has been a privilege, not a burden. It's wonderful to be a doctor. I love being a doctor.
Homer Papantonio (34:06.236)
Well I tell people at our age that they don't so much retire but they've got to re-fire. It's about a bit of lifestyle engineering and finding out what do you really want to do? What sort of contribution do you see to humanity? And that's always been a really interesting area.
Ross Walker (34:13.01)
Yeah.
Ross Walker (34:16.558)
Hmm.
Ross Walker (34:28.386)
Yep, well there we are. I think we've covered that very well.
Homer Papantonio (34:31.1)
Beautiful. So we've got some listener inquiries. Mick from Townsville. Wait, wait. it Mick from Townsville? Yeah, Mick from Townsville. My dental health has never been great after many years of sport and not enough visits to the dentists. I haven't got many teeth left. I have two friends who've had...
Ross Walker (34:53.027)
Right.
Homer Papantonio (34:55.696)
Good outcomes from dental procedures in Bali and one in Thailand. I simply can't afford to have major dental work here in Australia. What are your thoughts Ross regarding overseas dental procedures?
Ross Walker (35:12.066)
Yeah, can I say that that obviously the the all and for procedure, which can cost anywhere between 20 to $30,000 is very expensive. And there are people who can't afford that. I would strongly say to people that having been involved in medical systems in all of these areas, that Thailand's fine.
I don't have a problem with Thailand. I do have a problem with the Bali medical system. think, again, I've had some people who've had very good service there in Bali as well. But I just think in terms of the safety, the infectious disease control, Thailand's very, very high quality stuff. So I would advise Mick to go to Thailand if he can't afford to get it done here in Australia. The next best thing is to go to Thailand.
Homer Papantonio (35:58.288)
There are some hospitals, systems, healthcare that you'd probably avoid in some countries. are we allowed to name them? No? Okay, okay.
Ross Walker (36:05.774)
yeah, absolutely. the thing is, no, no, no, I'm not going to name it. But 2030, well, America would be a big one because it's too expensive. But 20, 30 years ago, you'd only get your therapy in Australia or America. Even places like Europe, the service wasn't so good. But in the last 10, 15 years, the services have really caught up.
Homer Papantonio (36:14.604)
Yep.
Ross Walker (36:28.448)
And people would say, you wouldn't get treated in India or China. No, no, no, there's services there because everyone's trained to the same level now. But I can tell you, I won't mention the country, but these are high quality university towns where people still get bad service.
story, I was just horrified by the level of service this friend of mine had at this particular place. So, but again, this is one of the problems you hear. Someone goes into a hospital and gets a bad doctor and a bad nurse and says, that hospital is dreadful. Someone goes into the same hospital, gets a really good doctor and a good nurse says, what a wonderful hospital. No, no, no. What a wonderful service you got from those two.
two or three or four or five people looking after you as opposed to the bad service the other person got from the other people looking after them. It just depends on your individual experience of the people involved in your care.
Homer Papantonio (37:28.86)
So have you been to places like China and Russia?
Ross Walker (37:31.886)
Yeah, I've never been to Russia, but I go to China on numerous occasions. I've probably been there 10 or 15 times. 30 years ago, I did a round China, six city tour in China, teaching a new cardiac technique to the Chinese doctors. And over then, they weren't that good, I've got to say. But now they're terrific. Chinese doctors are great. And then they're very, very well-trained, very sophisticated therapy as you get in China.
Homer Papantonio (37:51.801)
though yes okay.
Homer Papantonio (38:00.09)
and Russia? Okay, all right. Maria from Sorrento. My elderly mother lives with me at home. Although she struggles to walk at times, she still is very keen to go for a walk outside. I find lately this process takes far too long. She insists on using her walking frame, but it's very stubborn when I suggest that part of the way she could sit in the wheelchair and use...
Ross Walker (38:01.312)
Never been there, couldn't say.
Homer Papantonio (38:27.708)
the walking frame for the part of the walk? Do you have any suggestions to that? And then it would be interesting to know what percentage of the population over 85 rely on walking frames.
Ross Walker (38:41.87)
I can't give you a number. What I can tell you, I think we mentioned this a few weeks ago, that tragically, something like 40, 45 percent, it's around that figure, of people over 65 are either frail or pre-frail, which is really quite sad. And obviously Maria's mum...
is a bit frail, but I think it's wonderful that she wants to go for a walk. think the worst thing that could happen is she just stays at home. Her muscles will atrophy completely. At least she's trying to do something to keep her muscles going. The only thing I would suggest is Maria has to be pretty careful that she doesn't fall over during the walk because she fell over and cracked a hip. Once you've cracked a hip or fractured your spine, the prognosis is dreadful. I still think there's a fine line between doing
Homer Papantonio (39:07.836)
yet.
Homer Papantonio (39:27.836)
Yes.
Ross Walker (39:33.518)
nothing and really your muscles will just go to mush and doing what Maria's mum wants to do. So I admire what she's doing, but she just has to be very careful she doesn't fall over.
Homer Papantonio (39:46.537)
We get a lot of inquiries about Sarcopenia too. And when does that kick in? Do that kick in? Really?
Ross Walker (39:49.464)
Yeah, yeah. And kicks in from 30.
The sarcopenia osteoporosis starts at age 30, accelerates at age 50. So for the people listening, you don't know what sarcopenia is, it's loss of muscle mass. So it's probably a good idea for Maria's mother or anybody listening just to get some light weights, just two kilo weights are pretty light and just do some gentle arm lifting with that. Maybe some bands for legs just to keep the muscles in the legs. I mean, what I do personally, I do weights and stretching every morning and 30 minutes
Homer Papantonio (40:11.089)
Mmm.
Ross Walker (40:23.664)
on my exercise bike every day. And that's my exercise regimen now, whereas up to the age of 52, I played sport. So I just think it's important for all of us to have an exercise habit. Even look, I think for us old farts, an exercise bike in front of the television, which I've just got over my shoulder here in my study.
is the best form of exercise because as somebody who uses an exercise bike, you don't have to wear a helmet, no one's going to run into you, you're not going to fall off your bike, it doesn't matter what the weather's doing, you're not breathing other people's cars in. I know I'm speaking to a cyclist here and you're going say, you can't say that. I just did.
Homer Papantonio (41:01.52)
you
Ross Walker (41:02.464)
And so you can pedal to what level you want to. mean, the day before my knee replacement four years ago, I did 20 Ks on my bike, but I couldn't walk up and down stairs because my knees were stuffed. So that's what I really like about the exercise bike for that very reason. And for very old people, just to sit on the bike and just gently move your legs and have
Homer Papantonio (41:09.19)
Mm.
Homer Papantonio (41:23.44)
Yes, but also you know what's big now is cycling backwards and also walking backwards if you can do it. I'm not suggesting people, older people should be walking backwards on the roads but if they can do it even on a treadmill apparently that is, I've been doing it on my knee as you know I've got a pretty bad right knee and I've been doing it with my
my dogs for at least half an hour in the morning walking backwards and I have noticed a difference in the pain levels and also mobility around that knee.
Ross Walker (41:59.298)
There is a Monty Python song. I'm walking backwards for Christmas across the Irish Sea. I'm walking backwards for Christmas. It's the only thing for me. I've tried walking sideways and walking to the front, but people look at me and say that it's a publicity stunt. So I'm walking backwards for Christmas to prove that I love you. There you go.
Homer Papantonio (42:23.64)
I'm a huge Monty Python fan and I've never heard that. You didn't just fabricate that, did you? No? It's definitely a true one. So what percentage of people get sarcopenia over 60? What would you say? And I mean...
Ross Walker (42:26.776)
Well you just heard it now. you are. No, no, it's a definite Monty Python song. Google it. It's on YouTube.
Ross Walker (42:43.406)
it just depends on what percent. I would say to you probably 75 % get a degree of sarcopenia. We all get loss of muscle mass as we get, everyone does. But that's why it's so important to do resistance training to keep the bulk in your muscles.
Homer Papantonio (42:51.994)
Yeah, yeah.
Homer Papantonio (42:57.244)
Yeah, so even if you lost 1 % every year, or 2%, that would be 20 % every 10 years. 20 % every 10 years. Okay. All right, I think it's time to sign off, Ross. Okay, we'll see you next week, folks. And don't forget, please go to seriouslyfunnywellbeing.com if you want.
Ross Walker (43:02.702)
And that was what happens. Yeah, it's quite profound.
Ross Walker (43:12.864)
Okay, sounds terrific.
Ross Walker (43:21.203)
and also tell all your friends to go to seriouslyfunnywellbeing.com. Yep. Bye.
Homer Papantonio (43:26.092)
Exactly right. Thanks so much and we'll see you next time. Ciao.