So many of us go through life feeling out of touch with ourselves, others, and the world around us. We feel disconnected, overwhelmed, distracted, and uncertain of how to find the clarity, purpose, and direction we so deeply, so authentically, desire. The Living Centered Podcast in an invitation to another way of living.
Every episode, we sit down with mental health experts, artists, and friends for a practical and honest conversation about how to pursue a more centered life—rediscovering, reclaiming, and rooting in who we truly are.
I think a lot of it is me realizing that there were relationships that were not healthy for me to be in on a more intimate level, for a lack of a better word, like the way that our friendships are, you know, very intimate and real and full. Like, there were just some people that cannot hold that space for me. I think that there's a lot of grief that comes with that too. And so I think I I had a lot of grief over the last couple of years in that, but it's the people that I know I can be my fullest self with, and setting the boundaries with the people I don't need to be. Like, the more I can be who I truly am and be free in that with people that love me and care about me as I am, like that to me has been 1 of the most beautiful parts that's come out of going to Onsite and kind of doing all of this work.
Mickenzie Vought:Welcome to the Living Centered Podcast, a show from the humans at Onsite. If you're new to this space and just beginning this journey, we hope these episodes are an encouragement, a resource, and an introduction to a new way of being. If you're well into your journey and perhaps even made a pit stop at Onsite's living center program or 1 of our other experiences, we hope these episodes are a nudge back toward the depth, connection, and authenticity you found. In this series, we sat down with some of our favorite experts and emotional health sojourners to explore the relationships that make up our lives. From our friendships to our families or families of choice to our relationship with ourselves.
Mickenzie Vought:Part practical resource and part honest storytelling that will have you silently nodding me too. This podcast was curated with you in mind. Let's dive in.
Mickenzie Vought:Alright, y'all. I am excited about this week's episode. In the series on relationships, I feel like we will be remiss to not talk about friendships. And as a grown up now, I have found that friendships look a little different, and they're a little harder. And some of my favorite conversations we've had over the history of living centered podcasts have been around friendships and how to create meaningful friendships as an adult.
Mickenzie Vought:And so today we got to sit down with 3 Onsite alum, Ashley Colclasure, Ashley Eicher, and Beth Laird, who have created a really beautiful community. And Onsite and their Onsite experiences are at the crux of that. And so we asked them to take us back and talk about how they became friends, what their friendship has looked like, and how their friendships have been tested both through pandemics, house fires, hard seasons at work, conflict within their relationships. It was really beautiful, and they kinda pulled back the curtain for us to share how they have created meaningful friendships with 1 another and others. So I'm excited for you to hear this conversation.
Mickenzie Vought:It was so fun. Linds?
Lindsey Nobles:Yeah. I love this conversation. The women are just amazing individuals and getting a glimpse behind the scenes at their friendship and the vulnerability required in initiating friendships and being able to navigate conflict together and know that you're in each other's corner, for the long haul is really beautiful. So I think sometimes the best way to learn is just to, like, observe other people, and I'm so grateful for the opportunity that the Ashleys and Beth give us to observe their friendship.
Mickenzie Vought:Absolutely. Let's dive in.
Mickenzie Vought:I'm so excited to be chatting with you. Before we jump in, I think it's really helpful when we have multiple voices for everyone to introduce themselves so that our listener can connect your name with your voice.
Ashely Eicher:This is Ashley Eichner. I'm joining you from Nashville, Tennessee.
Beth Laird:Hi. I'm Beth Laird. I'm also joining you from Nashville, Tennessee.
Ashley Colcasure:And I'm Ashley Colclasure also joining from Nashville.
Mickenzie Vought:Alright. So Ashley Eicher and Ashley Colclasure throughout the interview, if I say Ashley, I might say Ashley c or Ashley e, just in Onsite fashion as your name tags red. Right?
Ashely Eicher:Listen, you can also just call me Iker and call her Ashley because that's what most people call
Beth Laird:me Iker.
Ashely Eicher:So it's fine. Alright.
Mickenzie Vought:We'll do that, Eicher. That's great.
Lindsey Nobles:I think this episode is so fun. We have had Ashley Iker Iker on before, and she's an old friend, and she's talked some about her living centered experience. And, Mackenzie and I were talking about how cool it would be to get people on that really, like, formed lifelong friendships kind of out of the program at Onsite. And that's sort of the origin story for y'all's little it was like your little quarantine pod, and it's become so much more than that. So, Aiker, maybe if you could kick it off and just take us back to how y'all all got connected.
Ashely Eicher:So I'll at least get through the Onsite part, and Beth chime in. So Beth and I were both at Living Centered in January of 2019. And her husband, Luke, and I went to college together, have been friends for years, And Beth and I would always both work in the music industry, would always pass each other to events and say, we should get lunch, but then we never actually get lunch. And, you know, especially in January when a lot of music industry people go, you're nervous about who am I gonna see Yeah. Within the music business that may end up in my small group, and I divulge all of my life secrets that I'm trying to work through.
Ashely Eicher:And so I just have this very vivid memory of walking into, dinner the very first night. I was terrified. It's not to be terrified of living dinner. It's amazing. Hardest and best thing I've ever done.
Ashely Eicher:I would tell anybody to go. But, I remember walking in, and the first person I see the moment I walk into dinner was Beth. And I we both kinda had this deer in headlights look on our face. And then I think over the course of the next week, I mean, you can speak into this, Beth, but we just kinda became, like, a a safe sounding board for the other 1. And, you know, every single night, there was a group of us that was always at the fire just hanging out and especially not having phones or email or anything like that.
Ashely Eicher:I think you really remember what real community looks like and can look like. And then she just had to deal with me a lot. So
Beth Laird:Mhmm. I think it was the opposite because I, I'm really glad that I went and I I had a really have a lot of stuff to work out. And I think a lot of things that I would I really wasn't expecting to come up. I thought I was going in for 1 thing. And I just kept saying, I'm looking for, I think, emotional clarity in what's going on and why I'm feeling this way.
Beth Laird:I have a lot of things in my life I love that I've always wanted, but I, but something is off and in pure, you know, Onsite and therapy fashion, I walked in and I think it kept leading me to a past trauma from when I was young. And I was like, no. I'm good. That's not why I'm here. And I kept going back to that.
Beth Laird:So I definitely was triggered in a lot of ways, and I think being out at the fire pit at night was just a really great way for me to kind of settle my nervous system. Honestly, I remember 1 night at Target. I literally had Ashley jumping up and down. It's like we had so much pent up anxiety and energy from doing such hard work during the day that we literally were just jumping. Like, we had to get the energy out some way.
Beth Laird:And so I think just having someone there that I already knew I could trust, and it ended up becoming such a safe space, for our little crew that ended up hanging out. And so we loved it so much, and then we didn't wanna stop afterwards.
Ashely Eicher:Well and then fast forward about a year later, we, all of a sudden, are in this pandemic, and no 1 quite knows what's happening or how to function. And so for Beth and Luke, our friend John and I and their kids, it kind of started to become like, well, let's hang out once or twice a week. Because as a single woman, they're really the only people I would see. Yeah. And then Ashley and Beth had met at a retreat.
Ashely Eicher:Y'all should tell this story. Like, a year before, 6 months before?
Lindsey Nobles:Ashley, do you wanna tell it, or do
Beth Laird:you want me to tell it?
Ashley Colcasure:You can chime in. I'll tell you when I went to Onsite and then
Beth Laird:Okay. Yes.
Ashley Colcasure:I'll bring it up to when I saw you, and you can bring it up to when you saw me.
Beth Laird:Okay.
Ashley Colcasure:So they went in January of 2019, and I went to the living center program in, August of 2019. Okay. And I feel like unlike Ashley and Beth, when I was there, I feel like I was kinda head down. I loved, loved, loved my group, but I wasn't the person that went and sat at the, fire pit. I would go upstairs and journal and go to bed.
Ashley Colcasure:And that's just what I needed, like, in this season. I guess I had 3 kids under 4 at the time, and so just to have some or 5 at the time. And so to have some time and space away from being needed was so good. So I went. I had an awesome time.
Ashley Colcasure:My friends back home, they were like, you have got to stop talking about Onsite It's, like, kind of exhausting. We love you, and, like, if you say it again, we're gonna, like, leave dinner because it's too much. And I really wanted my husband to go. He ended up going, in January of 2020.
Ashley Colcasure:And then it was in February of 2020 that reluctantly, I went to a retreat a women's wild who I had seen that went and, actually, I have some neighbors and stuff that went to that went to Onsite too, but but it was a person in the wild with her Onsite water bottle. And so I was like, I'm gonna go talk to that girl, because I felt like there was I was gonna have a common language with her.
Mickenzie Vought:Yeah.
Ashley Colcasure:So then, Beth, you can share.
Beth Laird:So I would like to share that I reluctantly went to the women's retreat because my friend, the you know, probably, I don't know, a few days before, basically, she said to my husband, Luke, would you be willing to keep the kids? And Beth rides the women's retreat with me. And I was like he was like, yeah. I think that's great. She's like, awesome.
Beth Laird:I'll pick you up. And I showed up, and Ashley Cole Glacier? I'm sorry, Ashley. Colesher was on the front row with multicolored pens and notebooks perfectly arranged. And she would pick 1 up in 1 color, write, put it back.
Beth Laird:And I was very judgy of her. I Her on the other day, reluctantly come, and here she was, perfect student, with her colored pencil.
Mickenzie Vought:Ready to engage.
Ashley Colcasure:I was engaged. I was ready. Very.
Beth Laird:So we end up connecting, walk outside, sit on a bench, and literally start talking. And I don't think we quit talking until we left the retreat, and we started realizing we had a mutual friend, John. And he and Ashley, full placer, have known each other forever and her husband. And he was in my small group at Onsite. And so it was really amazing how we all have been to Onsite and we're all connecting and we all know each other through really different ways.
Mickenzie Vought:Mhmm. Yeah.
Beth Laird:And I think that that's what made it fun too because while we're, you know, kind of in a little quarantine and hanging out, we really got to know each other. And you don't usually get to spend that much time together as friends and so we're all coming together differently with different relationships to each other and being able to spend time together and get to know each other and, Ashley has 3 girls. I have 2 boys. They love hanging out, same ages. So that was really fun too because then we were able to actually have community Yeah.
Beth Laird:With other people, and their children.
Ashely Eicher:Which so it really was, at some point early in the pandemic, became like the 6 of us and all the kids. And we were together probably twice a week, and we called it the quarantine. And it was just like, when are we getting together? What are we ordering for dinner? I gotta make cupcakes because that's what kids requested.
Ashely Eicher:I'm a cupcake connoisseur now, but only funfetti, just in case.
Mickenzie Vought:I get that. Get it.
Ashely Eicher:And we just, you know, had this really beautiful community, and it's just continued.
Mickenzie Vought:Lindsay and I both loved hearing the backstory of how the Ashleys and Beth formed their quarantine. I mean, the timing is so serendipitous. But as we thought more about this and got further in the conversation, Lindsay asked a pretty thought provoking question around how they were able to extend these relationships beyond Onsite and even incorporate new members into the fold, some who had attended Onsite and others who hadn't. We often share at Onsite that you now share the same language with anyone who has had an Onsite experience. But how were they able to build depth of relationships with people who hadn't experienced this?
Mickenzie Vought:Beth shared that her husband Luke was the only adult in their quarantine at the time who had not done an Onsite experience.
Beth Laird:If you know Luke and his personality, I I mean, you ladies can speak to it. But he is probably naturally 1 of, and I say naturally, he works very hard at it. He's very grounded and routined in that, doing his devotions. He's sober. He works hard at, at just being that person.
Beth Laird:So I think if there's gonna be 1 person in the group that hadn't, he's he's an easy 1 to fall in with because he's not really I mean, he's not a small talker. He really likes having great conversations and cracking jokes immediately. And so everybody I think that was a blessing. I mean, you never know, but all of us just became fast friends.
Ashely Eicher:Well, and I think too, I mean, to Ashley's point, like, we've all walked through really hard stuff in different ways over the last, you know, 3 or 4 years. And I think there is a there is a safety that I feel with these 2 specifically that I mean, I think that we can we deep belly laughter, but also can say what needs to be said or hold each other accountable and also can walk through the hard, hard stuff. And I think to Ashley's point, like, probably because we are able to we're able to go so deep so quickly because of, like, a shared language and understanding. We also have a lot of fun. Like, let's see.
Ashely Eicher:Know, true.
Ashley Colcasure:But I mean, we do start all of our all of our engagement with
Beth Laird:trust the process in unison.
Mickenzie Vought:Real cult like vibes over there.
Beth Laird:I mean
Ashley Colcasure:I mean Oh, yeah.
Ashely Eicher:Oh, I'm sorry. Especially
Beth Laird:when we're in Miami on the beach. Right.
Ashely Eicher:Miami on the beach. That was a that was a trip. We need to just do another trip, but I feel like we might have a little fight on that trip. It was fine.
Beth Laird:But I think that's honestly, that yeah. Like, she's talking about the safety, and just to speak to that and, like, what Ashley Coldplacer was saying. I do think it's different when you feel like you can be honest with someone, and they're not just gonna cut you off or be passive aggressive or even if they get defensive or passive aggressive. Like, I think
Ashely Eicher:I said something real defensive and passive aggressive.
Beth Laird:Yeah. I said something all confessive. That made
Ashley Colcasure:And I mediated.
Beth Laird:Yes. You did. And so I said something that triggered Ashley Iker, and I didn't know I was what I was stepping in. I actually didn't even understand what was happening. So then later, it's like, okay.
Beth Laird:Well, maybe we need a little space for a second, and then let's circle back and talk about it. Mhmm. I wouldn't be someone who just would run. I've I've been I've walked through a lot of hard things with a lot of people and been through a lot of things. So I always say I'm kind of your friend that's not scared of the dark, and I'll go in to get you.
Ashley Colcasure:I put that in my notes.
Beth Laird:Can we point out real quick,
Ashely Eicher:because I don't know that you'll ever be able to see this, that Ashley Colclaser has brought notes that she made for
Beth Laird:this podcast from a lot about you and why I was immediately judging.
Ashley Colcasure:Yes. I literally have on my notes, finding friends that are not afraid of the dark. That's weird. Right?
Beth Laird:Yes. But I think it's we can make that our TED Talk. Yeah. Exactly. We're all on that same page.
Beth Laird:I think, like, we all know. We have friends that want to have a good time that we love and are fun and we have friends that can handle the art of that come and go. We have mom friends. We have, you know, like our kids' school friend. Like, there's different groups of friends that, you have throughout different stages of life, and I think all that's great.
Beth Laird:Yeah. I just think it's a special bond when you don't think they're gonna leave you at your worst. And if you get triggered or you're defensive or you act out, they actually know it's coming from your trauma, and they're willing to call you out on that. Like, hey. I think we actually have the same therapist.
Beth Laird:Of course, Ashley Coldplacer gets a leg up on this because she is 1. But, you know, I'll say, like, go to your therapist and talk about it. I'm gonna go to my therapist and talk about it. Like, I think we're honest with each other or I mean, I remember Ashley Colclature and I, when she was walking through a really hard time recently with her family, it's like we were talking and I said, she was like, I wanna do something this way or whatever, and I was just like, oh, I think you need to think about it and take a take a minute to just make sure you're taking care of yourself. And she's like, I'm good.
Beth Laird:I'm like, okay. But, like, I can I feel like I could say that and she I'm saying that because I actually, like, genuinely care? So Yeah. I think that would be the difference, and I think another difference is that we all actually will call and apologize. Yeah.
Beth Laird:I don't know that a lot of friendships where I'll go to bed and just feel like that's set weird. And I'll call to say, hey. I'm sorry. Did this come off wrong? You know, half the time, they're like, no.
Beth Laird:That was nothing. But I'm willing I'm very, very willing to call and say, I'm sorry if I did something wrong or if I said that wrong.
Ashely Eicher:Well, I also think to that point, it's like we all know the other 1 has the tools to be able to Yep. To it. Like, this is Miami. Like, me getting and, honestly, I think I was unpacking. I didn't even really know why I was so set off, but I was so set off that it but that was part of, like, my fear and insecurities and trauma that was being triggered in a way that, like, Beth literally would have no clue because I never wasted.
Ashely Eicher:Yeah. And but being able to say, like, hey. I handled that really terribly, or I'm sorry, but this is where this is coming from, and this is how you know, we know the other one's not we know the 3 of us. No one's gonna leave. Mhmm.
Ashely Eicher:And I think we can have those really hard conversations, and I feel like we but we also I wanna go after the joy. Like, I think with that with that type of safe friendship
Ashley Colcasure:Mhmm.
Ashely Eicher:And, like, double over belly laugh at the most ridiculous stuff that I can't do with everybody else, like Mhmm. The way that I can with them, or say things that I can't say to anybody like, anybody else.
Mickenzie Vought:Can handle.
Ashely Eicher:Not really judged or, you know, like, kicked out of the church or anything. So that's good.
Beth Laird:I think it's a lot of to, like, sister bickering. You know, like, when you're really close with someone that you feel like is not gonna leave you, you tend to, like, joke and pick and bicker and and that. And I think that's kind of a little bit of our love language too. When we're together, people are like, oh my gosh. Y'all are just picking on each other or you're fighting art.
Beth Laird:And I'm like, no. No. No. This is how we love each other. This is
Ashely Eicher:a love language.
Beth Laird:It's a natural thing.
Ashely Eicher:Like, you're about to say something.
Beth Laird:I was
Ashley Colcasure:just thinking about how we go to True Food for lunch a lot, and I feel like we're all, like, leaned in talking, and I feel like the people around us are like, what the heck are they doing? Like, who are these people? But we laugh really hard. We're, like, crying. We're like you know, I I think and I think the both is what makes the friendship beautiful.
Ashley Colcasure:Like, we can have so much fun, and we can talk really deep. And I do III think that's rare too in friendships that kind of can run you know, can do both. I think that's Yeah.
Mickenzie Vought:I think that's rare. It's rare. And it's really rich. I think listening to you guys talk, I think what the words that came to my mind was safety and freedom. And just having that freedom to know, if something is wrong, will resolve it will repair.
Mickenzie Vought:We're both committed to that when I don't think we go into a lot of our friendships, saying, here's my commitment to you, right? Like in other relationships that matter a lot to us. We go in with even as Lindsey was saying, like your rules of engagement. Like there are rules of engagement and commitments that I've made to my partner that I haven't made to my friends. But I just feel that within you, there's this understanding of like, here's our commitment to 1 another.
Mickenzie Vought:We talk a lot about like, different kinds of friendships and the garden analogy of we've got flowers who are those mom friends. Those are, you know, the pop in, and we have really fun with you, but they're not gonna test. They're not going to stand the test of time. And then there's those weeds where you have to be really intentional, to set boundaries there so that they don't kind of come in and impede on your growth. And then you've got your oak trees.
Mickenzie Vought:And what I'm hearing you guys say is like, these are my oak trees. I know that no matter if we are in the sunshine, or we're in the darkness, as you guys have been talking about, this will be sustained. And so I just thank you for kinda giving us a glimpse of that, but those are the words that I I really reflected on with you.
Beth Laird:I do wanna say 1 more point that I think all 3 of us, you know, we all kinda run our own thing in business, and we are we trend a little more, like, assertive and independent and that kind of thing. And so I would say all 3 of us are not good at asking for help.
Mickenzie Vought:Yeah.
Beth Laird:And we all know this about ourselves. Like, speak for yourself. Yeah. Who
Ashley Colcasure:are you talking about?
Beth Laird:Yeah. So we all know this, but I think, look, it's very I could speak for myself and say it's very hard. Mhmm. And I appreciate that we could not talk for a while and then be like, hey. I miss you.
Beth Laird:Let's get back together. And it's never weird. But also I could just reach out out of the blue and say which I did this 1 time. Remember, Ashley Cole Placher? I had a problem at work I was so upset about, and I just said, I never I would never do this to anyone because I feel like I don't want to impede or I don't wanna be take up time because I know my schedule is so busy, so I don't wanna mess up someone else's.
Beth Laird:But I just called and said I really need to come over. Could I get a ball of line and just come over? I had a really bad day. And Mhmm. It it I think those things that we have is, like, I could reach out and say, could you do this, or can you help me, or can you like, even basic things I just wouldn't feel comfortable asking people about.
Beth Laird:So I think that is 1 thing that makes me feel comfortable because I'm not good at it. So even if I haven't talked to them in a while, I just know. I mean, I mean, we talk often, but it it just doesn't matter. It's like I know I can reach out and say, will you help me?
Ashley Colcasure:Right. I remember that meaning so much to me as a recipient there. Like, that gave to me, And I think that gives me permission or that gave me permission to have needs too, which and ask for ask for help. Yeah.
Beth Laird:Yeah.
Lindsey Nobles:I think as women, but really just as humans, it like, asking for help can feel so daunting. But then it's like when someone asks you to, like, lean in and they know, like I had a friend that had COVID and she was like, make me this soup, and she sent me the recipe. And I was like, thank you. Like, you're telling me exactly what you need. What an honor to be able to, like, serve you in that way.
Lindsey Nobles:Mhmm. So I think that it just is a reminder for all of us that we need to be better about, like, stating our needs and asking people because they want to help us, the people that are closest to us. I'm curious, like, how y'all have seen friendships just generally shift for you, like, pre and post Onsite, even, like, pre you know, like, we're all kind of in that the 40 ish range probably where it's like when you were in your twenties thirties, what were you looking for in friendships, and how has that evolved as you've gotten older? Because I know that, like, for me, COVID felt like a pivotal shift
Beth Laird:where I
Lindsey Nobles:was really looking for deepening instead of a widening Yep. Of relationships. And I'm just curious for y'all how you've seen that change over time.
Ashley Colcasure:I feel like before like, 2019 2020. 2019, I was in a I was in a place in my life where I feel like I was trying to decide between 2 paths and what I was, like, choosing and who I was choosing to be. Similar to what you're saying, Lindsey, where it's like, do I widen, or do I deepen? I I've said it. Like, I feel like I'm running to the top of a hill that I feel like I'm gonna get to, and then it's not gonna be enough.
Ashley Colcasure:And so that's when I went to Onsite. I mean, it really turned my world upside down. And so I think that, for me, there has been great gains, like Ashley and Beth, in my life as far as friendships go, but also great losses too. And, I mean, I had a friend tell me IIII
Lindsey Nobles:talked to her,
Ashley Colcasure:and I said, I'd love to get lunch. Like, I feel like we're not okay. And she said, it was after you went to Onsite. You just changed. And this was a friend that, like, was a best friend for many, many years.
Ashley Colcasure:Beth and Ashley know they're nodding. They're like, we know her. Like, we know. Because it was a really big loss, and it was really, really hard. And it's still hard, like, 5 years later and then or 4 years later.
Ashley Colcasure:And then during 2020 as well, we had a house fire. Our house burned down right, in April. Ashley was almost there. No. So I think that I just went through like, I and that's why the timing of this is so bizarre and and, like, not bizarre.
Ashley Colcasure:Like, I feel like it's just really cool to kind of to sit back and look at the timeline of all of this. Like the fact that we went to Onsite right before this happened, right before COVID, same with you guys. But I do feel like there was a there's there were changes that happen in friendship that still feel painful. And just like we're talking about, having a lot of fun in friendships and, like, laughing and belly and having the deep conversation, I think both can be true. Like, it can be a grief of, like, oh, gosh.
Ashley Colcasure:Like, if I had stayed on that 1 path, I would still be with that group of friends, and that could be really fun. But look what I have and look what I've chosen and to continue to invest in and to continue to want to invest in that. I think like what you said, you were like, those are oaks instead of flowers. And that, like, that may, you know, die in the next season, But it's still really hard. But, yeah, having a person tell you, you changed after Onsite, and that's why we're not friends.
Ashley Colcasure:I remember being like, like, okay. And then I probably called 1 of y'all, and I was like, wait. I think that was a compliment. Like, I'll take that. Like, I want to be the person that I started to be starting at Onsite.
Lindsey Nobles:I've heard someone talk once about, like, the post traumatic growth and how it's kind of like can be circular where it's like post traumatic growth and then trauma and then growth and then trauma. Mhmm. And so just you talking about that reminds me of, like, yeah, like, after the growth, there's there can be pain and loss and grief. Mhmm. And, but the story doesn't end there.
Lindsey Nobles:You know? It's like you keep growing and evolving and getting more aligned with your values and your sense of self. Yep. And it's all good, but that doesn't mean it's not hard and that there aren't losses in it.
Beth Laird:Mhmm. I always tell people to going to Onsite doesn't fix your problems. It shows you what the problems are, and then you have to do the work to fix it, and I think that's a really big misconception. It was for me. I I run at a very fast pace.
Beth Laird:I have a lot of stuff going on in life, and, I needed to check out to go to get fixed. And when I got there, I didn't, not only did I not get fixed, I had to really, really revisit and be triggered by some really painful trauma. And my what on everybody has a different experience Onsite. I will say a lot of my friends experiences were very different than mine. But in general, when I came out, that is when really deep work began for me.
Beth Laird:So it for me, it was the next 2 years of a lot of work Mhmm. Of what was pointed out when I was Onsite And my my trauma is around the loss of friends and very traumatic loss of friends. And it has, unfortunately, been a theme in different ways through my life. Mhmm.
Beth Laird:Just in different ways. Like, people who have just said I can't be your friend anymore because of this or disappeared or something happened to them or like, it it's just, like, unfortunately, you know, I feel like we all have our things. It definitely is a theme, in my life. And so I would say it's probably more difficult for me to recognize when someone in my inner circle is not healthy for me because I am I don't have a lot of people in the inner circle, but the ones I do, I'm very, very loyal to and I don't wanna lose. And so sometimes it takes me a little extra time and people pointing it out for me to realize maybe this might not be healthy.
Beth Laird:But all of that came through going to Onsite and all the work I did after has has really helped me understand that sometimes it honestly just understand what boundaries are. I don't think I ever really understood that. And and and when I set boundaries and people responded very intensely to them, I thought that I was the 1 doing something wrong or I was being mean. I didn't really understand, that all of that. So I think someone, you know, just going, hey, these are boundaries.
Beth Laird:And when people aren't adding to your life or it's 1 a 1 way situation, you actually can say no or back them into maybe the next realm of friendship. You know? That it's like everybody doesn't have to be at the same level. So I really think that that's helped me, learning all of that since Onsite And and those are some of the things that, I mean, I'm always gonna continue to work on.
Mickenzie Vought:Thanks for sharing that.
Ashely Eicher:Well and I think for me, I mean, friendships have absolutely shifted. I think as I became after Onsite and kind of to a best time out, there was a lot of work afterward. So a lot of work in the last couple years, period. But I think as I became more in tune with, like, little Ashley and the people that felt safe and where I could be my fullest self Mhmm. And not filter.
Ashely Eicher:Because I think a lot of my life where some of what Beth was saying, like, I my joke is I left Onsite. I was like, boundaries? What boundaries? Like, what are we talking about? Like, because I felt like I need to be best friends with everyone.
Ashely Eicher:Like, I was just friends with everybody, and I'd let them tell them anything. Like, I don't care. You know? And I think part of that's the nature of what I've done as a career for a long time on air and interviewing people and trying to connect with them and probably disarming people a little bit in what I do for a living. But I think I I did there was never a filter of where that just shut off.
Ashely Eicher:And so I think a lot of it is me realizing that there were relationships that were not healthy for me to be in on a more intimate level, for a lack of a better word, like, the way that our friendships are, you know, very intimate and real and full. Like, there were just some people that cannot hold that space for me, and I should that space for them either. And I think that there's a lot of grief that comes with that too. And so I think I I had a lot of grief over the last couple of years in that, but it's the people that I know I can be my fullest self with and setting the boundaries where the people I don't need to be. Like, the more I can be who I truly am and be free in that with the people that love me and care about me as I am, like, that to me has been 1 of the most beautiful parts that's come out of going to Onsite and kind of doing all of this work over the last couple of years and me not having to filter.
Beth Laird:I think it's like learning to, like, real vulnerability. Like, we all we have friends. We're all outgoing. We all have these types of jobs. I always thought that I was vulnerable.
Beth Laird:I didn't I didn't realize how closed off I was, And the reason I was because I was closing off to myself. Mhmm.
Lindsey Nobles:That's good. So I was That's good.
Beth Laird:No way I could have, you know, held you but or have gone there because it was something I was running from so hard, that whole time. And I think also learning, like, expectations. Like, I've really learned that it's okay to have different expectations for different friendships. Mhmm. And not everybody is gonna be everything, and that's okay.
Beth Laird:Like, it it really is okay if you have a friend that you just see a couple times a year, and you have fun and enjoy that conversation. I don't like when people get, like, oh, well, they can't go deep, so then I need to cut them out. Like, they might not be my best, closest friend I tell everything to, but I think you have to realize that we're all human, and not everybody I before, I couldn't have walked in the dark in the way I can now that I'm like owning all my stuff and I just wasn't capable. So I think it's like, you know, different stages of your life are capable of different things too. And I like giving other people grace in that too.
Beth Laird:And sometimes going, Hey, right now we're not going to be as close, or maybe we're just going to be distant friends, but it could come back around. And I've actually had that happen a lot too as people were, like, even having kids. You know? It's like they had their first baby, and now we're super close, and we weren't as close before because now we can just be more real. So I think stuff like that has really helped me with, like, just trying to be realistic with expectations and know that everybody's human.
Mickenzie Vought:Yeah. And I think something that I found is I used to really, for lack of a better word, like beat myself up if I had those friendships where I was like, Oh, I only see them 2 times a year, and I really love them. And I really should be like investing more. And I was like, or that's just what the relationship is. And there's beauty in that too.
Beth Laird:Yeah,
Mickenzie Vought:I love I relate so much to what y'all are saying of not always knowing what the filter is and who gets access to this. I think 1 of the most beautiful gifts I took from Onsite was actually came from Lindsay when she just kind of gave us an analogy of like, you don't have to tell everyone everything. And it was maybe the first time someone had ever said that to me. I think growing up in the environment I did, I thought like, oh, if we're friends, and you get every part of me, and I love how you guys have really walked in that journey of figuring out who gets what parts of me. And honoring that in yourself and say, you have to earn the right to get this part of me.
Mickenzie Vought:So I wonder what you thought vulnerability looked like and what it actually looks like. I'd love to hear more about that.
Ashley Colcasure:Well, that's funny. I mean, as you were talking, I was thinking maybe vulnerability felt like telling everybody your whole story and everything, but really vulnerability is not. You know? Yeah. Really, vulnerability is sitting in the discomfort and not explaining yourself, and not like, is being quiet and still and okay.
Ashley Colcasure:I mean, I know I'm like, maybe for someone named Ashley Colclaser, that would be be real vulnerability. Perhaps.
Mickenzie Vought:Perhaps.
Ashley Colcasure:Yeah. Because I I think, like, you're talking to 3 people who are like, and will say, we'll we'll tell you we'll tell you our story. Like, you could ask us any question. We're gonna answer it. Like and sometimes just sitting quiet is what is what we need, and what's best for our heart.
Beth Laird:Yes. I think you're right. I think I'm very bad at that.
Ashley Colcasure:That's not what I was saying.
Beth Laird:No. I am is what I'm saying. I'm saying you are right, and I and and I, like I know that is actually true. But as everyone that knows me knows, I hate feelings. Mhmm.
Beth Laird:And when you sit quiet, you have to feel the feelings. I like to be busy and productive and run from those feelings. So, yes, you're right. That is it. I think the other thing is I could tell people what happened to me.
Beth Laird:I didn't know, what I would tell would be the way I saw it on TV in bullet points. I think what I realized that I didn't know and what I what I was so scared of was the actual details and emotion I was probably feeling, and I never touched that. And I've been if I did accidentally, I had a vulnerability hangover. I didn't know how to cope because, again, I hated feelings, and I was pushing this away. So it didn't feel good.
Beth Laird:It felt wrong. Like, ugh. I just don't well, I don't know what's going on. And I and I had shut it out for so long. So I think learning, oh, being vulnerable means I'm gonna tell you how I felt when this happened and how I felt about the response in the details.
Beth Laird:And that that's scary because for me, 1, some apart a big part of the trauma is putting myself out there and then it being used against me in a way. So Mhmm. I think I was I'm always so careful, but because what if I do share too much? Or what if I did tell them too many things, and then they have this information that they could actually use against me, which has happened to me before? And so I think that's something that's probably, you know, uniquely I know different people feel, but uniquely to me, it's like Ashley Iger loves to journal.
Beth Laird:She's so good at it. And our therapist also, I I can't journal. And I know this is wild, but writing it down is too scary for me that someone might find it. And it might be used against me. And I just have that internal thing.
Beth Laird:So I think we all kinda have those things, but learning, like, actually being vulnerable is not just telling the highlights of your story. It's also telling people when you're in the heart, and I would rather wait and then say, guys, I wanted to tell you last week I had a hard week, and I just wanna be on.
Mickenzie Vought:It's how it's pretty.
Beth Laird:Oh, that's all I always feel like that. So being able to say, okay. I really don't wanna do this, but I'm gonna text y'all and say, need you to pray for me. I got something going on. It's really hard, and do it while I'm in it.
Beth Laird:That's actually being vulnerable. And so those few things for me really changed the whole definition. I didn't I didn't realize that.
Mickenzie Vought:If you've been listening to this conversation, you may be feeling a little envious. I know I was. Sometimes, making friends as an adult is really hard. Sometimes we have to mourn friendships that don't look the way we thought they would. Sometimes we just feel off in our friendships or like we can't make new ones.
Mickenzie Vought:And sometimes our lives are just busy. We asked Ashley and Ashley and Beth to share some practical encouragement to creating the meaningful friendships we all want to have.
Beth Laird:It starts and this is scary, you know, like I said, but it starts with you being vulnerable. I think, you know, it's hard to just go maybe ask someone to have a coffee or ask someone to go to a show or but I think if you expect others to put themselves out there and invite you, you have to do the same thing and not go into it thinking this is gonna be my new best friend. And if they aren't, I'm heartbroken. Just go into it thinking, oh, this person's interesting. They have something to say, or I see them all the time at work.
Beth Laird:Or and then I think also being a like, putting yourself out there to be a part of groups. Whatever what do you enjoy? Like, hobbies? I don't know if it's going to play tennis or if it's literally just walking the park or going to work out with a group of people joining at church. Like, there's so many different groups.
Beth Laird:It doesn't have to cost you anything to just show up and be a part of it. And then maybe it takes you a little while, but at some point, you ask someone or you get to know someone's name. And and I think you do have to put yourself out there a little bit if you want someone else to do the same for you. Yeah. I mean, I
Ashely Eicher:think that too. I think it's also being, you know, aware of your own boundaries. Like, this an example just came up for me as Beth was talking. Like, there's you know, I had an instance where there was someone I've been close to for a very long time, and there have been, like, ups and downs in our friendship. And there was a there was something that I thought was like, you know what?
Ashely Eicher:I think I can share I think I could share something I really care about with this person, and I think they can handle it. And then they can't. And, you know, I remember saying to these 2, like, this just did this just happen again? And I was like, yeah. And and I think you had it been 4 or 5 years ago, I would have been like, but they're so great.
Ashely Eicher:You know, I can but really realizing I needed to set a healthy boundary of okay. I can't I can't talk to this person about these things. There is a strong boundary I have to have there because I get hurt every single time. And so I think it's you have to be kind of willing, I think, to take those risks is not the word I wanna use, but, like, yeah, just kind of like, not that you're testing the waters to test the waters. I genuinely thought I could this person could hold this space, but it turns out they couldn't.
Ashely Eicher:And so I now know that and can make different decisions around those friendships.
Beth Laird:I also have to chime in here, Ashley Cole Plisher. I know you're you want to say something but I do vividly remember at the women's retreat or or soon after that you said, I said, I don't need more friends.
Ashley Colcasure:I don't think you were being you were like, maybe. Yeah. I know you said that, but it wasn't mean. I didn't take it. I didn't take it as mean.
Ashley Colcasure:You were more
Beth Laird:I was scared because I'm so loyal. My inner circle, it's like I almost am scared sometimes. Like, I meet someone that I really, really love and connect with. What if I don't have enough time for them?
Ashley Colcasure:Well and that's what I was gonna say too is, like, I was thinking about doing this today, like, as I was Mhmm. Preparing.
Ashely Eicher:As you were making your notes.
Ashley Colcasure:I am aware that it would be really hard to hear a podcast like this and to leave feeling like, oh, well, these 3 people, they are, like, always together, and they're, like, thick as thieves and sisters. And, like, and both of them are shaking their head because the truth is we get together every, like, 2 months, and, like, I'm I'm looking at them, and I'm like, oh, I love that I'm with them today. And so I think that the the lie is that you have and I think we learned this, or I learned this as, like, a little girl, that, like, you need a best friend. And if you don't have a best friend, there's something wrong with you. And that best friend better da da da.
Ashley Colcasure:You know? But you have all these, like, messages or I have these messages of, like, I'm you're supposed to do this with a best friend. You're supposed to see them this many times. A real friend would at least check-in on you twice a week. Like and the reality is, I think, changing from a spirit of, like, what we don't have to appreciating the connection that we do have like, even I'm looking at Lindsay, and I'm like, I've sat with Lindsay a lot this year on the couch of at Onsite and just as colleague friends, and I've been like, I love that we connected in that way.
Ashely Eicher:Yeah.
Ashley Colcasure:And I also just I don't think that I have to say, okay. We have to get coffee every week now for the next 6 weeks because so I guess I guess I'm saying, like, if we can transition into a or if people can transition into, like, a place of gratitude and seeing, like, what's in front of them instead of, like, what they wish there was. Because the reality is I didn't leave Onsite with a bunch of friends. Like, I kept it in track I kept in touch with them for a couple, you know, months afterward. But, really, like Beth was saying, it was the vulnerability of being like, hey.
Ashley Colcasure:I know what you I know what that water bottle means. Like, can we have a conversation? It wasn't like we went deep in our group, and then those are who I hang out with. The same with same with Beth and Ashley. Like, they weren't in the same group.
Ashley Colcasure:So I think just maintaining an open and grateful mind or an open mind and grateful spirit.
Mickenzie Vought:As we rounded out this conversation, these 3 started talking about something that I found incredibly encouraging, about their ability to cultivate and maintain depth in the midst of normal everyday life. They were bonded in unusual circumstances. A week long wellness experience at Onsite followed by a global pandemic. I love to love how they shared practical ways they connect with 1 another, were real about the amount of times they see 1 another and are able to actually connect, and the way that they've had difficult conversation when they feel like there's distance or even insecurity in their friendship.
Ashely Eicher:But I think too, like, to Ashley's point, like, we don't see each other, I think, as much as we would like. Like, it probably sounds like we're on Marco Polo all day every day, and we'll
Beth Laird:just catch that. Marco Polo. Polo.
Ashely Eicher:Beth refuses to get it. I've really worked. I've tried it.
Beth Laird:You on. I don't need another brand. I don't need another app. But then
Ashely Eicher:you would see my face every day. What a blessing. Mm-mm. But I think but we are intentional about it.
Beth Laird:Yes. Okay.
Lindsey Nobles:That's true.
Ashely Eicher:We really we really try we're coming out of and this is the difference between the pandemic and now. Like, in the pandemic, we were all at home. We were able to, like, see each other twice a week or whatever, and then we go on vacation together and all of a sudden. But then once, like, life started getting back to normal, it's been harder for us to see each other. It's like, their kids are all running around to a 1, 000 different things.
Ashely Eicher:They're running around a 1, 000 different things. There's I'm running around. Like, we have to be really intentional about trying to see each other and actually spending that time, whether that's at lunch or at dinner. And then our schedules are so crazy. Mhmm.
Ashely Eicher:But it's also being intentional about just trying to say, okay. We gotta make time for this.
Mickenzie Vought:This is a priority. Yeah.
Ashely Eicher:Like, we know we can text each other anytime or reach out, but being intentional about seeing each other and really spending that time, we have to we have to work a lot harder at it now than we did 4 years ago.
Beth Laird:And that's a switch too. We were it was so easy. So then all of a sudden, it became more effort to coordinate schedules, you know? I mean, it's like, it just is. It went from, like, oh, yeah.
Beth Laird:What are you doing Friday when no 1 had plans?
Ashley Colcasure:The, like We know that you're only allowed to hang out with us, so don't lie.
Beth Laird:Yep. You're at home right now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Beth Laird:And we're coming over this 1. But there, I think, you know, that is a big change in friendship. I will say in being okay with, you know, we all probably went through a little phase of being sad about that. I know I certainly did. It was like, wow.
Beth Laird:This was actually fun to spend a lot of time with people and not have a crazy schedule. And now we're back to life, and and we all are trying to adjust and take some of those notes with us. But the reality is, it's just there is a lot going on, and I think it is exciting. We don't get to see your people as much.
Mickenzie Vought:Yeah.
Beth Laird:But as long as you know you're connected and someone's gonna reach out and go, hey. What are you doing? Or do you wanna come to this thing with me? Or, like, let's get together, then you you'll make it work.
Ashely Eicher:Yeah. I would say also just being honest with each other. Like, I think, like, there is I think there's in like, I have an insecurity that I'll just tell you. Like and they know this. Like, I have an insecurity that as a single 1 in the group that, like, they're gonna go off and do couple things.
Ashely Eicher:And our friend John, he's got a girlfriend. He's got his girlfriend, and then all of a sudden, I'm gonna get left out because I'm a single 1. And that has been a deep seated fear. Even when we were in quarantine, I was like, this is 1 day gonna happen, and I'm gonna be alone. And they'll all be together, and I won't be invited.
Ashely Eicher:And that is something like it came up recently where I was like, I just had to voice it out loud to them. I was like, hey. I just need to tell you I'm feeling this. This is probably a lie, and as Brene Brown says, a shitty first draft I am believing in my head. But I need to, like, say it out loud to you.
Ashely Eicher:And the truth is, in my heart of hearts, I know that's not what's happening. But I also need to be able to say, like, hey. This is what I'm feeling, and can you tell me if I'm crazy or I'm not? You know? And so but that's, like, the real stuff of friendship too.
Ashely Eicher:Yeah. Yeah. And it gives
Mickenzie Vought:them an opportunity to adjust of, like, oh
Ashley Colcasure:Right.
Mickenzie Vought:Now we can be considerate and have that in our minds when we continue this interaction. It's just giving people information of how to love you better.
Beth Laird:Everybody has a narrative.
Mickenzie Vought:We all do.
Ashely Eicher:So if you're hearing this and you're like, wait. I have this narrative swirling in my head. I have to be the only person that believes whatever this is. Like, you're not the only 1. Mhmm.
Ashely Eicher:You're not the only 1.
Beth Laird:So know that you're not the 1.
Mickenzie Vought:Thanks all for this encouragement, and thank you for just letting us into your lives and the intentional, messy, beautiful friendship and community y'all have built. I'm so grateful, and I just wanna say thank you. So I feel like I could be a fly on the wall in your conversations for a lot longer, but we should probably
Beth Laird:Well, thank you all for that. Yeah. Yeah. We appreciate
Mickenzie Vought:Thanks for listening to the Living Center podcast. If you're enjoying the show, we'd love for you to consider leaving us a review or rating on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever else you listen. It only takes a few seconds to navigate to the show in your app and select the stars to begin your rating. It helps more people find the show, and we really appreciate it. Thanks so much.