December 22 2025 #283 - Bluetooth Range Limitations | W3GMS Workbench

In this episode of the W3GMS Workbench, host Chuck, NA3CW, guides the weekly Monday night net on the W3GMS 146.985 MHz repeater, bringing together amateur radio operators from across the region for practical discussion, troubleshooting, and shared learning.

The Workbench focuses on radio theory, operating practices, station building, and real-world ham challenges, starting with a roundtable of what each operator has been up to in the past week, followed by a directed question-and-answer segment. Newcomers and seasoned operators alike are encouraged to check in, ask questions, and contribute experience.

This session features discussion around Bluetooth range limitations, exploring whether repeaters or extenders exist for low-power data devices like battery management systems, along with creative workarounds, limitations of the Bluetooth standard, and alternative wired and wireless solutions. As always, the conversation highlights the strength of amateur radio: collaborative problem-solving and learning from each other’s successes (and failures).

Whether you’re a newly licensed ham or a long-time operator, the W3GMS Workbench delivers practical knowledge, good repeater etiquette, and a welcoming place to sharpen your skills—one question at a time.

📡 Meets every Monday at 8:00 PM on the W3GMS Parksburg Repeater

🌐 RF, EchoLink, and AllStar participation

🎙️ All stations welcome—questions encouraged

What is W3GMS Monday Night Workbench Net?

Every Monday Evening at 8pm Eastern Time, the W3GMS/R Crew get together on the repeater at 146.985Mhz and discuss technical questions and sometimes do lessons related to Ham Radio for newer Operators to learn from experienced Elmers. The Workbench was set up to be a safe place for any technical questions to get asked and good answers to be given.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And my call is NA3CW, tonight's host for the workbench.

I'm located in beautiful Parksburg, Pennsylvania.

We meet every Monday at 8 p.m. on the W3GMS Parksburg repeater, 146.985 megahertz.

The PL tone to access the repeater is 100 hertz.

For those who use tone squelch on receive, the repeater transmits a squelch tone of 94.8 hertz.

Newcomers are very welcome.

We encourage all stations to check in.

Take a look at the repeater website located at www.w3gmsrepeater.com.

It has a lot of information, including technical articles, pictures, and repeater etiquette and history.

Please be aware that on occasion, the repeater experiences intermod interference.

Please run maximum power or be prepared to check in digitally through Echolink or All Star.

We want to hear you.

To be able to use Echolink or All Star on 985, you need to register with us.

Directions for doing so can be found on the website, w3gmsrepeater.com.

Also, when Intermod is present before starting a transmission, give a short call.

Am I getting in okay?

Once the host, me, confirms that, then you can share your longer comments.

Here on the workbench, we focus on answering general questions of radio theory and operation.

Additionally, we invite each station to briefly comment, briefly comment,

on your amateur radio activity for the past week.

When checking in, please indicate if you have a question for the workbench.

If you don't have a question, still check in.

After all stations have checked in, we will first share what we've done this past week using the roundtable format.

Please, please write down the call of the station that checks in right after you.

When you have finished your comments, turn the mic over to that station.

Once we have made all our comments, we will start the question and answer portion of the workbench.

bench operating as a directed net. I will call a station that indicated having a question

and then for stations who wish to respond to that question. Wait to be recognized by

net control, me, before beginning a transmission. This helps us handle the questions efficiently

and keep the net running smoothly. At times, it helps for two stations to pass the mic

back and forth to help clarify the situation or pass information. Feel free to do that

as needed and then pass the mic back to net control. Some things to remember. Don't be too quick to talk. Pause a couple seconds before hitting the press to talk switch. This is good repeater etiquette and pauses are especially helpful for those on All Star and Echo Link. In other words, give them a little space to jump in. When you do click the PTT button, wait a second,

before starting to talk. We don't want to miss what you have to say, including the first parts of your call. It takes a moment for the repeater to process your PL tone. Also, the repeater has a three-minute timer. It's the law. If you talk more than three minutes without letting go of your mic button, the repeater completely shuts off until you release your push-to-talk switch.

So every two to three minutes, release the mic button for just a moment and then you can continue. Before we begin, I want to say thanks to all our workbench hosts. They are the ones who helped make this happen. And if you may be interested in hosting the workbench, please contact Jim, AF3Z, or any of us who will be able to help you get started.

Lastly, please join Greg W3DIB for the Christmas edition of the 985 Roundtable on Thursday night, 8 p.m. Be there or be flat. At this time, we're going to start the check-in process. Remember to indicate if you have a question for the group.

So, digital stations using all-star or echo link. I will leave long pauses to make it easier for you to check-in. So please be patient. I'm going to leave some time. Digital stations, please call now. This is NA3CW.

And this is W1RC. Good evening.

Whiskey 8, Charlie Romeo Whiskey, CR. I have a question.

Okay, that seems to be all for echo link at all-star. We'll now take RF.

Digital or any other form of station that wants to call in. Please call NA3CW.

Whiskey Alpha 3, Victor Echo Echo, WA3 VEE. No question.

3SC1, Kibo Charlie 3, Sierra Charlie Yankee. No question.

C3RFG, Jim and Malverns. No questions.

Alpha Alpha 3, Lima Hotel. Question.

WA3 King Fox Tango, WA3 KFT.

Alpha Foxtrot 3 Zulu, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo Echo, John, no questions.

No questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Alpha India Sierra, KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

WA3 VEE, Ron.

KC3 SCY, Luke.

KC3 RFG, Jim.

AA3 LH, Leon.

WA3 KFT, John.

AF3Z, Jim.

WA3 KZG, Scott.

KD3 AIS Timon Malbert, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo Echo, no questions.

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Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

Kilo Delta 3 Echo, no questions.

The other thing for me is I got accepted into the CW Ops, CW Academy Fundamental CW course.

So that's exciting.

So I haven't done as much CW from last year when I took the beginners course.

So I'm starting that in January and February and it's coming back, which is good.

This is more about learning, you know, getting better at being CW, not just learning the letters,

but actually getting better at it.

So I think that's it for me, short and sweet.

And then I think I'm a tail gunner so I'll hand it back to you Chuck.

Uh, NA3CW, K3, KV3, JGB.

Thanks Matt.

And good concise reports from everybody.

Thank you for that.

Before we go on, do we have any other stations that would like to check in?

And if anybody else has come up with any more questions before we start that segment, please call NA3CW.

Ski3, Mike Foxtrot, Bravo.

Ski3, Mike Foxtrot, Bravo.

Okay, seems like that's it.

Good evening Mike, W3NFB, NA3CW.

What's your week in ham radio before we move on?

No question.

It was going to the breakfast.

Thanks Joe for hosting a wonderful time and it was great to see everybody.

And back to you Chuck.

Let's get the ball rolling.

Thanks Mike.

So, we'll now turn to the questions and answers.

We encourage all stations to make comments, observations, or share experiences and don't assume that your level of experience or knowledge isn't enough.

We can all learn from each other and contribute to the discussion so feel free to pick up the mic and have some fun.

And always remember that sometimes the simplest questions are actually the most fundamental and deep.

So, we're open to simple questions as well as messy ones.

So, as we go into the stump to chumps phase, CR with a question, you're on.

WHCRW, NA3CW.

Very good Chuck.

Good evening all.

This is a Bluetooth question.

Lots of devices come with Bluetooth.

And for some reason the manufacturers when they make these Bluetooth devices must believe you're always sitting right next to them within five or ten days.

Well, that's not the case.

So, my question is, does anyone make a universal repeater/retransmit device so you can use a Bluetooth device out about 150, 200 feet?

the general question back to the next.

Very interesting, CR. So you're looking for a Bluetooth range extender. So does anybody

have any experience with that one? Please call.

Can I ask a question to CR? This is KC3NZT.

Go ahead, Harvey.

What is the input and the output? Is this audio or is this data? Is this USB? What is the desired input and output at the end of the 150 feet?

It's data. I have some batteries and the batteries have Bluetooth output. So if I walk near the batteries with my phone, I get the information I'm looking for. But that's out in my shed in the backyard.

And it goes from the batteries to the... So audio is involved. Back to that.

Harvey.

Okay. For data, I don't have experience with that. Mostly because not many things have external antennas, which gives you an option. And also the mandated low power of Bluetooth. So for data in, data out, I don't have experience with that. I do have experience with the audio side of it. But that doesn't sound like it will help you. Back to that. This is KC3NZT.

We are, do you have any other questions or suggestions? NA3CW.

C3, okay.

I'll proceed.

I know nothing about it, but I did a quick dive on Google AI. And it says there are Bluetooth dongles with extend range. You can get transmitters and receiver units to place. And there are Bluetooth repeaters and boosters. So they are out there. That's all I can add to it. At least according to AI. Back to that. KC3. Okay.

units to place and there are boot tooth repeaters boosters. So they are out there. That's all I can add to it. At least according to AI. Back to that KC-3-0-OK.

I've learned to take AI with a bucket of salt, but it may be right. Any other comments?

KC-3-K's entry.

Go ahead, Scott.

There are lots of Bluetooth extenders, transmitters, and receivers, but most of them are for TV or audio. The data, I also have one of these batteries as well, CR. It's an eco-worthy battery and has the built-in Bluetooth for basically reading all the diagnostic data that's in the battery.

I don't think that there is an easy way of doing it. I don't believe they make a repeater for data, but I will do some research offside since I also have the same sort of deal.

I don't really have a need to see it far away like you would want. I just walk outside close to my trailer where the battery is and I can connect to it, but I can understand why you would want to be able to connect. The only thing I would think that could help, which I don't think they do, you would have to break the battery open and put an external antenna on the Bluetooth.

But yeah, those batteries are sealed, but they're sealed, but they are, if you know what I mean. And yeah, maybe the company should think about that, maybe putting a Bluetooth antenna on the outside of the battery, maybe a port so you can plug in an antenna.

But I will do some deeper diving and if I find anything I will shoot you an email, CR. Back to you, Chuck.

I don't know if that's what you're looking for, CR, but if you're looking for basic data, in my home here, I built a shunt that is wired with a remote display. It's extremely simple and cheap.

I don't know exactly what data you're looking for. I'm sure the app is best, but if you're looking for volts, amps, watt hours, in, out, and everything data log like that, that kind of stuff is extremely available. But it does require wires.

And I don't know if you have conduit to the shed, although I feel like I remember you did at some point put conduit to the shed. But I don't know if that helps you at all, but that would at least give you a remote shunt that then you could read from inside the house. I have one in my kitchen that reads the battery bank. So it may not be what you're looking for. But that level of sophistication, which is low, is available. KC3NZT.

Thanks, Harvey. Any other comments before we turn it over to CR?

EMFP.

Go ahead, Mike.

Maybe this is a question inside of a question, but couldn't he just have, like an old cell phone he's not using, you know, for calls or internet anymore that has Bluetooth to use that as a repeater?

But of course it would have to be powered, you know, that jazz. Never mind. Forget I said anything. But a burner phone in between. I don't know.

Mike, any other questions or comments?

KZG.

Scott.

Mike, what do you got?

So I've been, I was looking online here and I've seen people use, believe it or not, Raspberry Pis or a Pi Zero. They have Bluetooth. But you would have to have that out in your shed with the app on it and then have a portal to that Raspberry Pi to your house to retransmit the data via some sort of web GUI that you would all, you would have to find and make work and yeah, just makes it more difficult. But I'll keep looking. Back to you, Chuck.

Thanks, Scott. Well, CR, what do you think? W8CRW, NA3CW.

more difficult, but I'll keep looking. Back to you, Chuck.

Thanks, Scott. Well, CR, what do you think?

W8CRW and A3CW.

Well, guys, this is not something that's come up yesterday. This is something I've been

going around with for a while. And Harvey, you're

correct. I ran wires out to my shed years ago.

I made one major mistake. I didn't use large enough conduit. And after a couple of wire

runs, the conduit is full, so I can't use it anymore.

But, Scott, if you find anything, let me know. I'd appreciate it. I don't like walking out

to the shed to see how the batteries are doing. Back to net. Thanks all, guys.

W8CRW.

W8CRW. No, Harvey. Chuck, CR, I don't know how packed it

is. It could be all the way full. But with a shot back, it's usually easy to pull something small through.

And all that's needed is voltage tap measurement, so the gauge of the wire is irrelevant. I actually use old thermostat wire, which is extremely small. It has multiple conductors in it. So I don't know if anything could get through. But for something like reading a shunt, those are just voltage taps. They're not passing any current. So don't know if that's an available option to you, but just wanted to throw that out there. KC3NZT. Back to you, Chuck.

Thanks for having me. Comments, CR?

The last cable I put through there was a struggle. So I've given up on using that. And I don't see me putting in another conduit ever. That was done in conjunction with running a water line out to the back. So it was a one and done. And I miscalculated my future needs. So if anybody ever does that job, put in something two or three times as big as you've ever been.

as big as you ever think you'll ever need back the net.

Words live by CR.

Okay, let's move on.

Leon has a question for us.

AA3LH, NA3CW.

Thank you Chuck and the rest of the net.

Well, I told you and I proudly tell you that on this workbench I was told to put a 1-2-1 choke balance on my G5RV

that we used to travel with.

Right now it's up in the air and it is working much better.

That brings me to this question.

We travel with a van.

We have a tri-magnet type thing where you can stick it fast to the side of your van

and you almost got to pry it off with a crowbar at one of those jobs.

And on that, we have a hamstick.

Now I want to decide if I can pull it down and work on the SWR

and get the SWR, yeah.

SWR are real low.

As low as it will go, 1.3 or less.

But I was wondering if I would put a 1-2-1 choke balance on that, would that help any?

Would that make it better?

I'm just curious what anybody would think.

A3OH.

Thanks, Leon.

Just to clarify, you're talking about putting the possibility of a choke balance on the feed line that's feeding a hamstick vertical?

Roger, that's what I want to know if it would make a difference.

The 1-2-1.

Like I did my G5-0 RV.

Put one of them on that one.

If that would make a difference.

Just curious.

Well, does anybody have any comments for Leon?

Please call, NA3CW.

KD3EE.

Go ahead, John.

I have a couple verticals that I've played around with, like portable things.

And I usually introduce those chokes when I'm seeing RF back to the radio and to the computer to kind of, you know, to tamp that down.

That's what usually, it's not, for me it's not as much of a performance thing, though it should, I guess, eliminate some noise that would be coming in off the coax.

I think it doesn't hurt.

So, you might want to try it.

The only time maybe you don't put one on is if you're counting on using the coax as your counterpoise or your part of your ground plane or something of that antenna.

Back to you.

It's KD3EE.

Thank you, John.

Any other comments?

...tickets.

Okay, I'll make one.

So, you got a, you got a hamstick you're using as vertical.

What are you using for radials, Leon?

I have 14 gauge speaker wire cut at different lengths.

Some, if I run 80 meters, I usually have a 30 feet out there or 20 feet, some 10, cut them, I kind of, I don't know, they're fastened to the van with a vice grip.

They are grounded through that wire that goes through the radio itself.

That's what we use for, for our counterpoise.

I don't know about, maybe about six of them I put on at different lengths that I can switch, pull it down and switch antennas for different bands.

That's what I use for counterpoise.

Back to net control.

Thank you, Leon.

I would say it's definitely in the couldn't hurt, might help category.

For instance, if you, there's a little test you can do that's not conclusive, but it can be interesting.

If you, like, you know, slide your hand, like wrap your hand around the coax while it's transmitting while you're looking at the SWR, or maybe have your lovely assistant help you with that, just kind of run your hand up and down the coax.

If the SWR moves during that process, you're definitely getting RF back up in the coax.

But I would say for any verticals like that, the odds of having some imbalance and having RF coming up the coax, I think is, it's pretty significant.

Whether it's problematic is another matter.

But, yeah, I think it's in the chicken soup category.

Couldn't hurt, might help.

Any other comments from anyone else before we go back to Leon?

Okay, Leon, what you think?

I appreciate the help that I can try, it's not going to hurt.

If it doesn't help, I have it on, you know, it might help, but I don't know that it helps.

That's because that's kind of where it's at.

But that way, that way it would go out the radio, it would not come back to the, it would not come back to coax.

It would go out the, out the Jeep, go out my hamstick like it should, and guaranteed it wouldn't come back.

That's, that's important to me.

Because when I'm out there near Oklahoma, I try and tell it back, I want everything to go out to my hamstick I can get.

That's, that's important.

Thanks for the help, guys.

Back to Net Control, AA3LH.

Thanks, Leon.

Do we have any other questions?

Or since we're doing pretty good on time, because everybody was good and snappy.

Jim, you had a, something you were wondering about too.

So first, do we have anybody else that has, anyone else that would like to log in?

Or has any questions?

Okay, quiet out here in the prairies.

Jim, what was your wondering about?

NA3CW.

Alright, very good.

I'm glad you gave me time to remember what I was wondering about.

My Triton IV, which comes out of the 1970s, that's a couple years ago.

I think it was the 1970s.

No, no, not older than that anyway.

And, uh, I forget exactly how the VFO and all that is set up.

But anyway, it does tend to drift until things warm up, which is kind of normal.

The thing that I'm not as clear about, uh, it'll drift up maybe 300 kilocycles.

Why don't I say that?

It's an older radio.

Anyway, it'll, or no, maybe not kilocycles, hertz.

300 hertz will go up about 300 hertz or something like that.

But if you leave it on long enough, then it drifts back down, and it might even go farther down than it started out.

I'm just curious, um, without, well, I can't give you any details on the rig, but, uh, um, what types of things make it drift up, and what might be changing later on that makes it drift back down again?

AF3 is it.

What an interesting question. Hmm.

So let's have some, uh, let's have some thoughts.

Ron, you've been very quiet.

Anybody have any thoughts?

NA3CW?

I'll get it started, I guess.

Uh, this is WA3VE.

Well, I don't know much about, uh, Bluetooth repeaters or one-to-one current balance.

So that's why I'm quiet over here.

But, um, my first thought is probably in the VFO area.

There's probably a leaky capacitor, but I am still, I'm still in a quandary myself about why it would go both directions.

It almost sounds to me like it's a heat-related, heat-related, uh, function.

But then again, I don't know that, I don't know that, that, uh, that radio, but that's, that's kinda, that's kinda where I would start at least thinking.

I don't know, what do you think, Chuck?

NA3CW, WA3, VEE, you and everyone else.

Does anybody else have any, uh, thoughts or comments?

I don't know if it's relevant, but I have a question for Jim.

Go ahead, Harvey.

If it goes up and it's coming back down, is the fan kicking on or running the whole time?

Uh, ain't no fan. That's easy to tell ya. There's no fan on the rig.

That, back to net.

Okay. Um, interesting. Why are we, I don't know if it's not a fan.

Well, I would, is, for something that old, a bad capacitor is always an open possibility.

But I was also thinking, is that, I don't know anything about the Triton.

Uh, you know, my ignorance is complete.

But I'm wondering, um, is there, is there mixing going on?

Is it a direct VFO, direct amplified output, or is it a synthesized rig where, um, there's mixers, you know, heterotivism,

or, you know, heterotivism, rig, where there's, um, a VFO that gets mixed with a, uh, carrier oscillator that gets mixed with another oscillator?

I'm just wondering if, if you're, if the drift is not all isolated to the VFO.

Maybe the VFO comes up and stabilizes me, while some other oscillator is going the other way.

Any comments on that differential diagnosis?

This is AF3Z here.

I'm sort of flipping here.

It's a, it's a, yeah, I just lost it.

Oh, that's terrible.

It is a heterodyne.

What am I looking for?

Superhet, whatever.

It's got an IF in it, and it's got transmit, receiver, mixer.

And so, yes, there is, it's not any kind of direct thingamajabber.

That's a technical term.

Back to you there, Chuck.

It's an indirect thingamajabber.

A heterodyne thingamajabber.

Any other comments?

NZT just spitballing.

Go away.

Is there any chance on a fanless rig, I don't know how many watts it puts out, but on a fanless rig, are you transmitting while you notice this drift?

The reason I ask is I'm wondering if there's some kind of heat sink lag.

When the chip is hot, the oscillator's hot, it hasn't heated up this heat sink yet.

And so it drifts one way until the heat sink stabilizes.

And so it drifts one way until the heat sink stabilizes.

Everything gets the same temperature.

It's dissipating more heat, more uniformly, and then it drifts back the other way once it can handle it.

I don't know anything about that rig.

I don't know anything about that rig.

Not one thing.

But if it's a 100 watt rig with no fan, I imagine it's got a pretty sizable heat sink.

And I'm wondering if you turn it on and just start using it, if it drifts one way, it drifts back, and then it stabilizes.

If it stabilizes in the end, I would look towards heat.

If it's not anything related to your transmitting, I would think there's probably a failure somewhere.

But again, I don't know anything.

I don't know anything about that rig.

But it's just something that popped into my head.

KC3NZT, back to next.

Jim?

Yeah, it's got a sizable heat sink that goes across the back of the rig pretty much all the way.

And the width of the rig, this is 1970s vintage.

It's not a huge box, but it's a good foot or so wide.

And, yeah, I don't know.

To answer your question, when I get on and I don't let it warm up, I do notice, I mean, it's drifting while we're on the air.

And this is CW I'm talking about.

But anyway, it'll drift up.

But as far as it drifting back down, it's more like when I leave, it's sitting on here and I'm doing other stuff.

And then I come back and look at it.

Oh, it's back down a couple hundred hertz.

So I don't really know what's going on at that point, except the rig is just sitting there, usually not transmitting.

I've never, I don't think I've ever been on the air long enough to see it drift back down.

But I'm not even sure about that.

This was just a fun little interesting pondering question.

But, yeah, it's definitely got mixers going around.

And also, as I recall, the display is not a counter, not a frequency counter, if I am remembering correctly.

I believe it just sort of calculates the frequency from some oscillator or something.

I'm trying to quickly read the manual, but I'm not doing very well.

But maybe that has something to do with it, too.

I should actually measure the frequency coming out.

AF3 is it.

AF3 is it.

You're reading my mind back into the concept of test your tester.

You know, how does it look on, even just looking at it on, like, some online SDR, you can get that kind of resolution on those.

You know, if somebody is, you know, 100 or 200 hertz off, you can see the difference on an SDR.

And you might want to give that a shot to test your tester.

Back to you, Jim.

Good idea.

Yeah, it's an interesting phenomenon.

I never noticed it before.

I mean, I've noticed it over a period of time now.

But it was when I would leave the rig on, sit here on.

Usually after we went on, like, an hour or something.

And then it would come back later and it drifted back down.

So if I get any more information, I'll share it back here.

But I appreciate the thoughts.

It's a tantalizing little question and exploration.

AF3 is it.

Does anybody have any other final comments for Jim?

Or does anybody else have any other questions?

2A3VE.

Looks like we had a double.

Like, you know, Ron won, of course.

And who else was there?

That's an RF bully.

That was KC3NZT.

Okay, Ron first.

I couldn't stop laughing at that one.

Are you really good?

Excellent.

And all very good.

Okay.

What I did here is I just quickly, I don't know anything about the rig, but I think operationally,

what I think you said, Chuck, and what was inferred with a couple other comments, look at what it's doing.

Look at the behavior.

Look at what you're doing when you see this behavior.

Is it, could it be, maybe draw some correlation between, okay, it drifts when it's hot, drifts when it's sitting there.

It sounds like a very similar problem to what my TS-130 has, my long, tried-and-true Kenwood over here.

But what I did was I went into Google and I just did Tentec Triton 4 Drift.

Evidently, this is a problem with that unit.

And it turns out that I just picked one of these, and you may want to take a look at this, Jim.

There was dirty trim pots in the VFO section.

Now, again, I know nothing about this radio.

Couldn't even tell you what it even looks like from the front panel.

But you might get some ideas there as well.

But I'd start with what I think was mentioned earlier, as I just said.

Try to draw some correlation between what are you doing with the radio when you see this problem.

If it's just sitting there, then that will tell you a lot.

If it's doing this while it's heating up or whatever, that's another story as well.

And then maybe come back to us and we can scratch our heads a little bit more and see what's going on.

Anyway, that's why I threw that out there.

Good old whenever this particular chump, if I'm a chump, can't answer a question, always rely on the mouse and the keyboard.

Back to you, Chuck.

NA3CW WA3.

Oh, let me just turn it over to Harvey, if you don't mind.

KC3NZT WA3 VEE.

Thanks, Ron.

The only way I would go with that is I pulled up eHAM real quick.

My general assumption is that people that make reputable rigs, Tentech is one of them for sure.

They wouldn't release something that is broken.

So I sometimes use websites like eHAM to just sanity check and see if it's a known issue with the rig or if it's something that happens with age.

And just a quick eHAM check.

Half the people say ignore the VFO, the readout, altogether and just talk to the person you're talking to and see what they say.

And the other half says you have to constantly adjust it.

If everybody said one way, you know, it could lead towards, you might lead you towards there's something wrong.

And the other half would lead you towards it just does that.

But, yeah, I would think that if you're talking to the person and they don't hear your pitch on CW change and you don't hear their pitch on CW change, I would ignore it and chalk it up to a design issue.

But if you talk to them and they talk to you and the pitch is changing, then clearly something is moving and that would lead me towards malfunction.

But eHAM seems to be split.

Some people say, yeah, it's great.

Just make sure that you, you know, you touch up the dial.

And the others say ignore the dial and just keep talking because it's fine.

So it looks like it might be able to go either way.

But if you play with that on the air with the guys at local that you normally CW with, you might be able to pin that down.

If they hear you fine, you hear them fine.

But the VFO drifts, it might be something to ignore.

But if they say, yeah, I mean, I can, you know, you can hear me fine, but you're changing all over the place, then that would indicate failure or something to investigate.

That's just kind of where my brain would go.

KC3NZT, back to net.

Thanks, Harvey.

Back in the day, there was a line of equipment called SWAN.

And never was anything better named because they not only drifted, they paddled around.

They would just move all the time.

It was like SWAN 350s and stuff.

They were known to be unstable.

They just were.

So there you go.

So I guess we'll draw a line on it here.

It's after 9 o'clock.

And we don't want people nodding off.

Do we have anybody that's been lurking out there that would just like to get on the list?

Please give me a call.

Okay.

Nothing heard.

Thanks to all stations for checking into the 985 workbench.

A big thank you to Joe, W3GMS, for making this repeater available for the workbench.

You are invited to use the repeater early and often.

It's a great way to show that you appreciate the gift of 985 to the amateur radio community.

And finally, again, join Greg Christmas night at 8 p.m. for the 985 roundtable.

This concludes the workbench for tonight.

Feel free to stick around and carry on.

Have a great night. Have a great week ahead.

Merry Christmas, 7-3. This is NA3CW. Clear.

NA3CW, this is KC3NZT.

Army, go ahead.

I had a quick question for you that wasn't really AM-related, so I didn't want to ask it on the workbench.

But I got a power supply issue, and I don't know which way to go with it.

The long and the short of it is I have LED lights that are on my toolbox, so this is quite vain.

Quite vain.

But they are somewhat functional.

But anyway, so the issue I'm running is coming up with a USB power brick, one of those little blocks you plug into the wall,

that can continually supply enough current to light these LEDs, which look fantastic. I'd really like to keep them.

I've tried probably seven or eight brands, all very reputable.

And some of them work okay at first, but they can't handle the heat long term.

And so in my searching around, it looks like the converters, the voltage step-down and rectification in those blocks is kind of subpar.

And the only way to get it to work reliably is if it has data communication so it can use one of those fancy protocols like power delivery or the QC 3.0 or whatever.

But either way, they've got to have communication to know what to do.

And I need probably an honest-to-goodness 2.5 to 3 amps continuous per LED light strip.

And so I have two options I can go with.

And I was hoping you could speak on them.

One is to make your own.

Everyone says it's much more reliable to have a 120 to 12-volt switch power supply and then a 5-volt converter after that.

And that is very, very stable.

But that involves me building something.

The other is using these new, very expensive, relatively at least, gallium oxide-powered USB bricks that seem to be much more temperature-stable.

Can you speak on that either way?

I have no communication, so there's no way that my device can talk to the power supply.

But which one, if you had to build it, which one would you do?

Would you try the off-the-shelf options, which are about $30 per brick?

Or would you try to build your own power supply and just have it be a switch mode power supply and leave it as that?

If the question is just how do I come up with 5 volts at amps, I mean, there's lots of power supplies here.

You can get 5 volts at amps.

I have names that you can steer me on my Google search.

That's all I want.

If I could have one per strip and they could put out a 5 volts, 3 amps regardless and just do their job, hot and grounds, nothing else, I would be absolutely stoked.

But I mean, I haven't been able to find that yet.

And so it looks like everybody's pushing me towards building a multiple step, step-down rectification switch mode power supply, which is just a lot of work.

I'd rather, I mean, I'd rather just buy something and put it in.

So what is a device like that called, barring putting like a lab power supply where I can dial it in myself on the bench?

What's that thing called?

It's just called a power supply.

You know, Meanwell makes all grades of power supplies, and they're quite reasonable.

And, you know, if you want 5 volts at 200 watts, you could get it.

But, yeah, there's, there's, when I need a small regulated power supply and, you know, regulation comes with all these switch mode things,

I just get a little Meanwell and put 120 volts in, get my 5 amps out or 5 volts out, and call it a day.

You know, that's, they're, you can get them for like 20 bucks or something.

And they're, they're bulletproof and will just run all day long.

Refer to them as LED drivers.

Well, that depends on, yes.

That's, they, they have LED drivers.

It depends on how the LEDs are wired.

Um, LED drivers, I think, are constant current devices and they'll vary the voltage to keep the current flowing correctly.

But I think that's for, you know, um, daisy chains of LEDs, as opposed to, do these LEDs have individual resistors in them,

and they're made to run off a fixed voltage.

So, uh, tell us about your strings, Harvey.

Probably about, uh, 3 o'clock in the afternoon, things are turning off and turning back on, and you touch them,

and these things are screaming.

They're at like 140 degrees.

So, I just want something simple that's got a normal American plug on one end, and then terminals on the other, and I'll wire it in.

So, uh, I'll have to check out, meanwhile, that may be just the ticket I'm looking for.

I'm wondering, these black walrus that we have run are the power of different things?

Couldn't he find one, one of them that he's looking for that would give, that would give, give, give us five volts out?

I mean, I'm not sure they're strong enough, but we have some that will run tape recorders and stuff, and maybe you can find one of them.

One of them that we call Radio Shack.

I know they have a bunch of stuff like that.

Maybe they could set him up with something, a 3-0-H.

Thanks, Leon.

I think he's looking for something a bit more substantial.

Um, you know, several amps, and usually walwarts are not doing several amps.

But, um, a good outlet for, uh, for Meanwhile stuff is, uh, Jameco.

You might want to check them out.

And, um, there's other places as well, of course.

Uh, if you're on Amazon.

Meanwhile is a very well-known and respected brand.

Um, obviously they're not, uh, they're not U.S.

Uh, they're not U.S. manufacturer.

But, um, I've always had good luck with them, and other people have, uh, you know, speak well of them also.

And they have all kinds of combinations.

They have, um, you know, open frame ones, closed ones, you name it.

Uh, but they're, yeah, you can get as big and heavy-duty as you want.

Now that's, again, for regulated 5 volts.

And I'm assuming if it's running off a, um, at all running off one of those, uh, little chargers, that it's looking for 5 volts.

The other flavor is, is, uh, LED driver style.

And those are constant current for strings of LEDs.

Um, and they have, um, a different voltage current characteristic.

So, Harvey, I'm assuming yours are made to run on a fixed 5 volts.

NHRCW.

Yeah, correct.

I, I, I'm gonna have to, um, I'm gonna have to figure out.

Maybe you can give me the phonetic spelling of JANCO.

Uh, I didn't see anything come up.

But, um, but yeah, they're, they're just, they're rated below what the bricks are rated at.

I don't know what I'm bumping up against.

I guess I'm bumping up against, uh, uh, just inflated ratings is what my suspicion is.

But these, these are only supposed to pull, like, 2.2 amps at 5 volts.

And I'm getting power supplies that are, uh, they're capable of minimum, with no communication, minimum 2.4 amps.

A lot of them will go way over that.

Um, but it needs communications to do it.

And my, my, my bit of research that I've done is, um, I'm finding a lot of these supplies won't do what they're rated at unless they do have communications and the device is calling for it via the comm lines.

And I have no comm lines.

These are just dumb light strips.

But they look awesome and they, they help light up the tools and so I want to use them.

Um, and I just, I can't.

It's one of those things where once a week I buy a different brand of brick just to see.

And everybody's got a drawer full of those things and everyone at the shop has let me borrow every one of theirs.

And it's, it's very weird.

I, I mean, there is one that's made by Beats by Dre, the headphone company.

And it's only rated to one and a half amps, but it worked okay.

Um, and then there was one anchor one that worked okay, but the three other anchor ones wouldn't.

And so I'm just sitting here trying to find all these, uh, these reputable brands to try.

None of them are working that are coming in the mail new.

It's just the random ones I'm finding around the shop sometimes work.

And I'm thinking, this is ridiculous.

This is not a big ask.

I just want two and a half amps per tap, continuous, all day, every day, uh, and be able to handle the heat.

So I, I didn't think it was a big ask until I started going down this rabbit hole.

Apparently, it's, uh, I'm asking more than it's willing to do.

So I will, I will definitely check out those supplies.

But yeah, if you could, if you would be willing to give me the phonetics on the Janko, um, and I'll also, I'll do, you know, due diligence on Amazon and all that stuff.

Um, and thank you, uh, um, uh, Scott for sending that link over.

I haven't looked at it yet, but I will.

But yeah, this is just, it's just frustrating.

And there's nothing that's more obnoxious than seeing the lights blink while I'm working on something.

It's just, this is a very simple ask.

Uh, so I appreciate it.

Uh, KC3NZT, back to you, Chuck.

I got Amazon up, NH-CW, I've got Amazon up.

And, um, they have the Meanwell, five volts at 18 amps.

It fits in the palm of your hand.

And costs $17.

Uh, I, I, hopefully I can find that.

If I find it, I'm going to get that.

And then I take it as just screw terminals, which is fine.

I don't care what it looks like.

It's going to be mounted underneath the, uh, the countertop that's on the toolbox.

So I'm never going to see it.

It's just supposed to come on when I flip the, the master switch when I come in and, and then do its thing forever.

So, uh, I'll try to find the $17 one.

And, uh, I appreciate it.

I knew, I knew somebody messed with this, I'm sure.

So I appreciate it.

KC3NZT, back to you.

Got a 12 volt, 3 amp, um, LED driver.

But they regulate differently than I think what you're looking for.

So, yeah.

The, uh, the Meanwell, uh, I'll, I'll send you the link.

The Meanwell, um, 5 volt, 90 watt, 18 amp, single output.

Yeah.

And, and Meanwell, if it says it'll do 18 amps all day long, it'll do 18 amps all day long.

So, yeah, it's, it's a nice little compact thing.

They're bulletproof.

They got all the, uh, proper agency doodads.

And, um, you know, they're, they're a good thing.

So I'll send you the link.

Any 3CW.

KCG.

Scott, I'm sorry.

Appreciate it, Scott.

Go ahead, Scott.

There's, uh, that link I sent you.

I think they're all 5 volt supplies, uh, by Meanwell.

And they're all different, uh, amp ratings.

And literally they're just little white boxes with wires.

Your, your 5 volt DC wires come out one side of it.

And your AC inputs on the other side.

So you'll have to put, you'll have to terminate your own connection.

On either side.

Which you're perfectly capable of doing.

Um, but, uh, yeah.

You basically just figure out what amperage unit you want.

And you can take those, uh, part numbers or model numbers from the site I sent you.

And just punch them into Amazon.

And they'll pull up on there.

Instead of trying to order them through the website.

And pay shipping and all that.

Just use the model numbers on Amazon.

They should come up and get what you need.

But, uh, those should, yeah.

Like Chuck said, you should be able to tie all those to one of those Meanwells.

And run them all on one supply.

Especially the 18 Amper.

It should, uh, it should do it all day long.

Uh, I'm going to say 7-3, gentlemen.

And have a good evening.

W3KZG.

I'll be clear.

3, Scott.

3, Scott.

7-3.

I appreciate it.

I will do that.

I had the idea of running some more.

If I could figure out how to get this work.

18 Amps is more than enough.

Um, but I just wanted to add some more inside the cabinets.

Uh, that are on either side of the toolbox.

So I could see stuff.

But, uh, this looks perfect.

It looks like you just supply your own AC cord.

And it's good to go.

So, uh, I appreciate it.

Oh, I also got one.

Oh, yeah.

I just got your email.

So I have it, Chuck.

Uh, thanks again.

I appreciate it.

Uh, KC3NZT.

Back to you.

Very good.

Uh, when you get all done, take a picture of it.

We can see how awesome it is.

So.

Yeah, anytime.

Yeah, I've, I've, uh.

I know Ron.

And I know.

I'm pretty sure Joe has also had good luck with, uh, with me.

Well, I've always had good luck with them.

They're easy to get.

They're, they're, uh, very cost effective.

I mean, you could not think about building something for seven, you know, that will do what this thing does for 17 bucks.

It just can't.

And it, and this has, um, you know, thermal design.

It's got, you know, input protection.

You know, it'll run at any, you know, like, you know, 90 to 250 volts input.

And, and they're not, you know, they've got noise filtering in them.

As opposed to junky ones that look the same but don't have noise filtering in them.

So.

Yeah, let us know how you make out.

W3K, or yeah, KC3NZT, NA3CW.

I will, I will.

I'll let you know how I'll make out, and I appreciate it.

Let me, let me just, you made a comment earlier, and it really resonates for me.

But you're talking about that.

Be careful what ChatGPT tells you.

Well, I can tell you that, you know, I use it, um, just in jest, just for fun all the time.

I'll be doing something that's very specific.

And, uh, but the information is all public.

And, uh, I'll show people, the younger guys at work that use ChatGPT for everything.

I'll show them, I'll ask, ask them the question that I'm dealing with, and show them how they're completely wrong.

Uh, well, I mean, the internet, not ChatGPT, but just the internet forums in general, they were, you know, they were similar, people describing a similar problem.

And they were saying that you have to buy, you have to buy the switch mode power supply that goes 120 to 12 volts for, like, a laptop with high current.

You got to put that inside of a metal box that you buy yourself.

And then inside the box, you got to get a 12 volt to 5 volt, uh, DC switch mode supply, or some kind of DC supply that will go from the switch mode supply to the regular,

related supply.

And, and you have to build all this stuff.

And I'm looking at these people's recommendations, and I'm thinking, this sounds exhausting.

This should not be that complicated of a problem.

So, uh, I will say that knowing what to search for, uh, it helps a lot.

And, uh, you guys have a lot of information out there.

So, I can't even imagine if somebody said, that's what you have to do.

I probably just would get rid of the lights.

I mean, that just, it sounds exhausting.

So, uh, this, this is fantastic.

I'm sure it will work.

And, uh, and, uh, I'll send you a picture when it's done.

But, it already looks great as it is, but only until about noon.

Then things start going wonky.

So, uh, I, I would love to get all of these USB bricks that I have lying around hooked to stuff.

They're not just sitting there.

They're hooked to stuff.

But, uh, you end up with this just nonsense mess of, you know, 20 bricks all powering all these USB things.

And it just sounds, there's got, there's got to be a better way.

So, I appreciate it.

And I will, I'll send a pic when it's all done.

KC3NZT back to you.

Yeah, I'm just, as you were describing that mess, I'm just shaking my head going, wow.

Somebody on crack or what?

Okay, very good.

I'm going to head upstairs.

But, uh, yeah, I look forward to, uh, hearing your results.

KC3NZT, NA3CW going upstairs.

KC3NZT clear.

Thank you.