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Welcome to "Visionary Voices" the podcast where we dive into the minds of business owners, founders, executives, and everyone in between.
Each episode brings you face-to-face with the leading lights of industry and innovation.
Join us as we uncover the stories behind the success and the lessons learned along the way.
Whether you're climbing the corporate ladder or just starting your business journey, these are the conversations you need to hear - packed with visionary voices and insights.
Let's begin.
So Victoria, welcome to the show.
Could you give us a top level overview about what it is that you're currently working on
and your journey so far?
Sure.
uh Firstly, thank you very much for inviting me Akhil.
It's great to be here.
So I'm head of growth at Dusted and Dusted is an independent agency that's been in
business now for an amazing 21 years.
And we're now known for creating distinctly different brands that build.
commercial value.
We went through an 18 month strategic repositioning which launched in June this year and
our new website went live in June.
I joined the business in April and I've been working with the founders um David and Darren
who set up
the agency in the early days and I have been helping to build the commercial engine really
behind that.
So developing the account-based marketing strategy, um building out prospect lists and
developing very targeted email marketing sequences across the broad range of sectors that
we work in.
Now, in terms of my personal journey, originally, I suppose we could go back to where it
all started and my first role in marketing and in fact it was public relations because
I've always been very creatively driven but...
I would say equally pragmatic.
So I had aspirations in my teens of going into the fashion industry and becoming a fashion
or textile designer.
But I realised quite quickly when I was m doing my Art Foundation course that actually em
that environment wasn't perhaps the best fit for me.
I didn't come from a
a family where, in fact, no one in my family had a degree.
Nobody had pursued that route.
so looking ahead at three, potentially four years of full-time study didn't feel like
something I could realistically do.
And I just happened to come home from college one night and open the local paper and I saw
this tiny advert.
for a marketing assistant.
And, you know, this was before the days of websites.
So I just picked up the phone and spoke to the office manager there and said, you know, is
the role still available?
And so I ended up going in there and what I soon discovered was that this was Kawasaki's
PR agency.
So, you know, that moment changed.
my whole life really because over the next three and a half years I learned all of the
basics around PR, how to write, copy, press releases.
I very quickly became the account manager for the Kawasaki Jet Ski account.
So, in my early 20s it was hugely exciting to be able to...
work with the motoring journalists and m post these sort of launch days for the new
models.
m So, we had the editor from Top Gear magazine who would come along.
But really what the takeaway from that was, was really how m the ability to clarify and
simplify quite complex
propositions and really the face-to-face interactions with people were where the magic
happened.
So I learnt that really early on and that has continued through um my career.
um And in terms of how I ended up at Dusted, in my late 20s I was the director of a
branding and design agency and we used to specialise predominantly in the health and
fitness sector doing a lot of sort of neighbourhood marketing for um membership
recruitment and retention campaigns and actually one of the biggest businesses that I
helped to grow was now known as David Lloyd Leisure.
Wow, okay.
Yeah.
That was again a very, you know, very exciting time.
And Darren Holburn, who is Dusted's MD, actually worked at that agency with me.
obviously through social media and LinkedIn, we stayed in touch over the years.
And m I just happened to see a post in January this year that, you know, about Dusted.
And so we caught up and...
very quickly it became clear that we could help each other.
uh
very, very cool journey.
And it obviously shows you have a lot of experience in the marketing space and seeing how,
the industry has evolved over time.
Because I think it's changed so much over the years, which is, really cool.
So you've obviously had exposure to all of that.
I would like to ask as well, you know, being in the industry, in the marketing industry,
and with all this experience that you have, what's some advice that you'll give to people
looking to get into the marketing space right now?
Because
You know, I myself I even get messages of people looking to get into the marketing space
and asking, you know, what should they do?
Like, you know any tips and tricks and that's that side of it.
um based on your experience and what you're seeing right now, what advice would you give
to someone looking to get into the marketing field?
Because I think yeah, I think you'll have a lot of insights around around that.
Of course, absolutely.
um I think that, you know, the current uh landscape is very competitive for marketing and
there are now some very good apprenticeship schemes.
I think it's important to do your research and see
which businesses are really forward thinking in the marketing space.
I think being open-minded and um showing that you are passionate and being more visible
about your passion for marketing is really where uh it can help you to stand out in, you
know, in a...
um
competitive market like like we're in I think It's it's important now and I'm actually
doing it myself to be more visible and You know to start writing more uh regular posts and
to you know, I've recently started a sub stack blog and Because I think that now with
social media with LinkedIn.
We all now when we're recruiting and certainly in my experience when I've been building
teams and I'm looking at CVs, the first thing that I do is look on LinkedIn and actually
see, you know, what posts the candidates, know, once it gets down to obviously.
uh
the last sort of one or two that you might be considering, obviously not in the first
early stages because that's much more automated.
But I think now your passion for marketing or whatever it is that you're doing or whatever
area you want to get into, you need to make that very visible in your online presence.
Yeah, yeah, I think that's some some really good advice because I mean, we're seeing it
seen the same thing, right, where your online persona and then your online, you know,
social media is right reflects the value that you can potentially provide to to a company.
And so it's really important that is all dialed in.
I think that's some really good advice there.
And then the other side of it as well that I'd love to get your, your take on is, you
know, throughout your career, and throughout everyone's careers, there's all these big
turning points that comes up, right?
And so I'd love to learn from you, you what are some of those, those biggest turning
points that you went through where, um, you know, really had some insight that come up,
came off the back of that.
Um, and it was really big, you know, either challenge or change as well throughout
throughout your, throughout your career.
Yes, definitely.
um Which challenge shall I take this one on?
There have been plenty.
um I think going back around, I think it must be 15 years, I was working with, in fact,
it's much longer than that, it's 20 years.
I was working for...
an educational media and marketing startup which I learnt very quickly uh was struggling.
I was headhunted for that role and uh once I had been working in the business for around
six months the existing contract they had came to an end and the sales director there and
the other members on the senior leadership team were
struggling to know which way to go with the business.
And what we had at the time was uh two proprietary assets, two databases, and we had six
months cash flow left.
And so I worked very closely with the founder of the business and we researched a number
of similar educational media and marketing companies across Europe.
and were very inspired by a German business.
And we turned around that business, developed new products, and grew the team from what
was only three, and there were three of us with the six months left, to 10 people and
turning over 2 million in two years.
So although that's not on a large scale compared to a lot of startups.
That process um was hugely beneficial and um what I've realised is that when things become
overwhelming or when you're really up against it, um again it comes back to clarity and
focus on what are your assets, what can you do um keeping costs down.
I think that's the thing.
um
you know, how can you be really innovative and use what you've got in a different, more
beneficial way?
And we were able to go out there and win really big government clients and entertainment
clients, which helped to, you know, really turn that business around.
So, em yeah, I think that's certainly something I look back on and...
em
can see clearly how it really helped to shape who I am.
Because I also happened to have my two children during that time.
My two sons, there's four years between them.
So I was working for that business for eight years.
so juggling that was...
quite challenging at times, trying to be all things to all people, and as working parents
do.
And actually, being a small business um back in those days, it wasn't able to give me the
flexibility that I really needed.
I needed to sort of reduce my...
full time working to four days a week and they just weren't in a position to be able to do
that.
So that was the point where I decided to become a independent consultant, you know, and
start um working for myself.
And I think that that happens quite a lot for m
mums and you know people who are trying to juggle you know a heavy workload with raising a
family and I was very lucky because when I handed in my notice my boss from the
educational marketing company said he was working on a new concept so I spent a year
working for him on a freelance basis
on a business feasibility study with NHS down in Kent.
It was an incentivised sort of weight loss initiative.
And I was also able to find a superb local client to me, a guy called Paul Lewis, who has
been a real visionary leader in the e-commerce and retail space.
And so I helped him.
to widen his service proposition and to grow his business at a really important time for
him.
And it's been wonderful to see him go on and grow his agency and then be acquired in
recent years as well.
he's now having a year off enjoying a sabbatical somewhere.
Well deserved.
I'm sure.
Yeah, definitely.
Definitely.
It's interesting as well in the marketing space.
Just, just on that note is, you know, a lot of people that I know that get into the, into
the marketing space, they have gone and tried doing their own thing at some point in their
careers as well.
Um, and it's really interesting to notice that as a bit of a trend with, you know,
marketing professionals is, you know, because I think with what we do, we can provide so
much value to, a company.
that going and trying it on your own as well, I think makes complete sense to see if we
can make it work and see if it's what we want to do as well.
And as you said, on a lifestyle point of view, it does give you a bit more of that
flexibility.
It also gives you a bit more of that stress as well.
I'm trying to run it, but em at the same time, know, yeah, the flexibility there is
really, really good and really does help out a lot as well.
And it's interesting, your story is a little bit similar to mine where when I was in
full-time work and I was like, I'm going to go do my own thing, I actually signed that
company as a client as well.
And so, so it really helps, right?
With that first client in the books and done, it makes the whole process much smoother
than trying to start from scratch.
It certainly does, yes.
Yeah, definitely.
And so, you know, we're talking about, you know, balancing, I guess, motherhood and
lifestyle with obviously work and your career as well.
So I guess through that balancing act, let's say, again, like on the advice point of view,
what advice could you give to people potentially going through that now?
I mean, you know, we're thinking of having kids in the next kind of couple of years.
And one thought in the back of my mind is how am going to balance like this work and kids
and everything?
So it'll be good and quite timely to learn from you.
What are some of lessons that you've learned from that?
Yes, I do think that, you know, obviously my peers and our friends over the years who have
had children as well have struggled with the same challenges.
And I think it...
It depends hugely on your individual situation.
think, you know, we were extremely lucky having someone in the family that could support
us at that time.
And I've seen that as uh as a big differentiator in terms of how well new parents are able
to cope.
You know, if you do have someone in your family on either side that can get to your house
within an hour or two.
that's hugely helpful.
um
Obviously running your own business, being entrepreneurial um can give you more
flexibility.
what I've also noticed, I think, increasingly over the last five years post-COVID, is how
supportive big businesses are em and the improvements that I've seen.
heartened by because I can really see that larger businesses are offering more maternity
leave and they're supporting new mothers.
There's a lot more support.
I think we've come on a long way.
We've moved forward in a very positive way on that front, broadly speaking.
and I think it's important if you are planning a family to really think about how your
current situation supports that.
You know, it's easy now to do research on all of these things and there will certainly be,
you know, some companies where you'll get more support than others and I think
you know, do your research.
You can't obviously always plan these things um that far in advance.
It depends what your individual circumstances are.
But yeah, I think, I think now um quite a lot of um organisations are able to offer more,
more support to working parents and long may that continue.
Yeah, definitely.
Definitely.
Um, no, no, it makes a lot of sense.
And, uh, I appreciate all the advice on that side.
I'd love to switch gears a little bit and move into obviously the day to day on what
you're doing now, right?
So building these AVM programs, these email sequences, lead lists, everything like that.
And so with the work that you're doing right now, I mean, what other impact have you seen
from that technical work that you've, that you've been doing there?
Uh, and how has the business, you know, seen that growth since, uh, you know, you stepping
in and kind of taking the reins of, uh, of running that side of it.
Yeah, of course.
Well, I mean, we've been really very impressed with how the repositioning has worked in
terms of how we're being perceived and the sort of inquiries that we're getting.
know, Dusted works across a number of sectors, predominantly in the technology.
med tech, fintech, automotive and professional services space.
um we've definitely been able to grow out that I've been able to double the CRM in terms
of our prospect um target database, which makes a huge difference.
And I've been able to obviously
ensure that the data is regularly clean because we're doing more frequent communications
and we're very pleased with the deals that we've had in in the last few months.
We've got new med tech clients, new technology businesses that we're working with.
You can see obviously on our website the number of really compelling case studies we've
got that show really tangible outcomes.
think that's the thing that has very much impressed me from the moment I started working
with the team at Dusted is how
from the first interacting with prospects, we are looking at how we can really add value
and understand.
We take a really consultative, workshop-based approach with new prospects.
And we also have our own proprietary AI platform called Elevate, which brings in over 40
data points.
We're very insight led and that has certainly helped to shape the outbound strategy
because naturally we look at competitor insights, we look at market insights, we are
ensuring that we're attending all the relevant trade events in the space because I think
actually
um Being out there talking to new startups in these sectors and new businesses and really
talking to people in real life is hugely em helpful.
um that has definitely helped to shape the outbound strategy and the
email marketing messaging, the whole comms and content strategy that um we've developed.
um it's hugely em exciting in terms of the sectors we work in, but also to see how because
of our very data driven and insight led approach and because of our consultative
workshop-based processes, that is obviously working.
I think we've improved in a number of areas considerably over the last year because we've
had to.
It's a hugely competitive space, the agency space, there are over 4,000 in London alone.
I think that we've been
acutely aware of all of that and obviously Darren and David and the senior leadership team
at Dusted have evolved.
I think that's one of the things that came through for me when I caught up with Darren
earlier this year for the first time was how he'd really um been very smart about how he's
evolved the business over the years and made strategic hires because within the business
We have very talented strategy brand strategy leads as well as, you know, super sort of
creative and CGI capabilities as well.
And all of that comes together and clients can see that, you know, not only do we have the
insights to shape their strategy and their brand evolve their brand.
moving forward, but we bring fresh thing, really fresh thinking, know, fresh ideas.
And often when we're going through that process, we'll also look for inspiration out of
sector as well.
And that's really, I think, going through this
process with new prospects and new clients in recent months you really do see how that
whole process provides you know breakthrough moments and thinking for businesses that are
sometimes struggling to see the way forward.
You know, they might not have the clarity they need in their proposition.
And what we're aiming to do is to really understand what the point of difference is.
You know, is it IP?
Is it the founder story?
Is it a combination of factors that makes this business different?
And then creating brand distinction around that, that really
helps to give them that edge, you know.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I think one thing that I'm getting from this bit of the conversation is the amount of
value you guys give to not only clients and customers, but also before they're a client
and customer as well, right?
Where you have, you know, that tech platform, you get all these insights and that helps
shape the messaging and the messaging that you put in front of your potential leads and
your potential clients as well.
Because I think the biggest problem with the cold outbound space and, you know, trying to
grow the business and everything is
It's so easy to assume what we think would be valuable to a client, but very rarely is it
actually valuable to a client.
And so we can spend all this time and energy building these resources, these assets.
But then if you haven't got the data to back up that this is what they actually want to
see, and this is what they need, then it's not going to work.
It's not going to grow the business.
And so it seems like you guys have nailed in that process of how do we deliver the right
type of value to the right type of lead or potential client.
And then that way it starts a conversation.
And then naturally, you're going to see the results of that.
Yeah, and I think, you know, having an empathy-led approach to sales and putting yourself
in the prospect's shoes and thinking about their space and what challenges they're facing
and how you can help them to navigate that and actually make...
significant difference to their business is where the dusted team really shines.
I think that this is also a bit like, you know, it all compounds as well because the more
that, you know, I think that was one of the things that came through to me.
when I first looked at Dusted earlier this year was the calibre of their clients even
though they're not household names in the B2B space you know they are big enterprise
businesses you know like SS &C Intralinks for example in the FinTech space and also they
had
worked on a really exciting rebrand for Mahindra m to rebrand their first m electric m
SUV.
So m with incredible results.
m So m and I think that when you have long term clients m of that caliber, m your
It speaks volumes and it does a huge amount.
I've worked as a consultant for a number of years with a wide range of startups.
And sometimes I'm starting by writing case studies and thinking, what am I actually going
to use?
Whereas with Dustin, that's never been a problem because we have such a wealth of
really credible and compelling case studies, as well as the new insights that we're
getting on a daily basis.
Yeah, yeah, no, no, absolutely, absolutely.
I mean, it's that social proof, Is once you have that overwhelming amount of social proof,
like the trust and authority is just there.
And it's very difficult when you don't have that to try and get those salesmen, get those
conversations rolling.
I mean, how do you think, you know, the role of AI and these technology changes that we're
seeing come into the marketplace, how do you think that's going to affect the strategy
that you guys have right now and what you guys are doing to move the business forward as
well?
Well, I think like any business, um know, now um AI plays a role.
um And as I've mentioned, you know, we have our own in-house proprietary tool, which is,
you know, has been repositioned this year and is integrating um AI capability um as well
as um
our managed service dashboard because obviously when we work on branding or new website
projects, what we want to do is to develop an ongoing relationship.
So we often work with our clients on an ongoing basis.
So that's been enhanced by AI as well.
um And we're getting really, really promising feedback um because naturally we've um
done it on a piloted basis with a limited number of clients before we roll that out.
But the initial feedback's really, really exciting and promising.
And I think that AI is hugely beneficial.
It's saving time for all of us.
But it's only as good as
the queries and the data that you put in it and you train it with.
And ultimately, you need a human in the loop.
We know this.
I was at Big Data London and um Fintech London and I've been to events this year where
everywhere you look, there's AI.
uh
You know, everybody has an AI solution.
And I think that, you know, in the last 12 months, how we're all working has changed
beyond recognition.
And obviously with the shift to GEO, um how SEO has evolved m and will continue to evolve.
m
is something that is an important thing for all agencies and all businesses to keep up to
date on and to be developing these tools in a responsible and ethical way.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And that's what I find really exciting about the marketing space right now is, you know,
how quickly we can spin up this, uh, like these, these dashboards or these data, uh, data
things, or, different tools that we can then put in front of clients or potential clients
and really show them, you know, visually what it is that we can do or what we've done.
And I think that's a really cool, you know, way forward essentially, and a really good way
to show the type of value that we, can have because
There's a lot of agencies that, that, you I know of that I've spoken to that haven't
actually incorporated some of this new tech yet, which is really surprising because on our
side, what we've done is, know, we have a whole, you know, platform dashboard, everything
for our clients.
can have complete visibility over of everything.
And it adds so much value to what we have and adds to that, um, that differentiator,
right.
Between other, other competitors as well.
And so, um, I think if you, if you aren't using some of these AR tools and a hundred
percent, need to start looking into that and, know, you can spin up lead magnets so quick.
Um, you know, quiz funnels or whatever it is that you want to do to create value, you can
do it so, so quickly.
But, to your point, it is important to have a human in the loop, um, with whatever system
that you're building out as well.
We made the mistake of going full AI at the very start, you know, when these APIs came
available to us.
And, because of that, you know, we saw, you know, certain QA's QA and things like that not
done properly.
And so now what we have in any type of automation is there is always a human in the loop
element to it.
Um, which is aided.
obviously by AI and everything, but at the same time, we need to have that human
interaction and involved into this, at least right now with the way the tech is.
So yeah, completely resonate with you on that side of it, but it is a very exciting time
and especially the marketing space where literally we can be very creative in any type of
angle that we have.
I think some other departments, they're a bit more rigid.
They might not have the full flexibility, whereas in marketing specifically, you have so
much flexibility to build anything out.
which can then provide that value to our potential clients.
Yeah, for sure.
I I was extremely lucky to work with one of the first machine learning algorithms out of
Harvard, m during my time m helping to establish the London office for Crimson Hexagon,
which was a social media analytics startup, which is now known as Brandwatch.
m And I remember back then,
just being blown away by how we could train the algorithm, you know, with a really small
data set.
uh And then it was able to apply that to, you know, billions of records of data.
So I think, you know, seeing how it's evolved over just this last six months, speed at
which m
um our day-to-day um working lives have been transformed.
um It's certainly um a very exciting and interesting space to be working in.
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
So what one of the one of the final questions we always ask us in the show is if you can
go back to your 18 year old self and only take three lessons with you, whether it's some
business knowledge, the marketing knowledge, some philosophical knowledge, anything, what
are those three bits of advice or knowledge be and why to be those three things?
Okay, yeah, well I think my confidence wasn't the best in my late teens.
um As I said, you know, I was really lucky to get into PR, but I think I would say be
braver.
um When I look back at my earlier career, I
probably uh let my lack of confidence hold me back a bit.
So yeah, I would say be braver.
Confidence really does compound and the more you take yourself out of your comfort zone,
the easier things become, you know.
often we can waste so much of our lives worrying about things which we build up in our
minds but actually when we do it it's well often it's often it's really enjoyable and
rewarding you know mostly it's it's enjoyable and rewarding so yes i would say that i
would also say that curiosity is a real superpower you know oh
having an inquisitive mind, uh being interested in people, in businesses.
um If that is of interest to you and that can fuel your passion, um then um keep learning,
stay open-minded.
um I think that's definitely...
important in life.
And coming back to the human edge, which is the name of my sub stack blog, I would say be
uniquely you and you know really being true to yourself, being true to your values,
because values may evolve over time but they don't really change.
So
really think about who you are and what your values are when you're making decisions about
your career and how you move forward.
Amazing, amazing.
Well, thank you so much for taking the time today.
Really enjoyed the conversation.
And I think there's some good golden nuggets throughout the the episode for everyone to
take away.
So yeah, thank you so much.
Thanks so much Akhil, nice to talk to you.
All the best.