Identifying and understanding who your key customers are is a crucial part of marketing for Clif Johnson, especially if you’re targeting diverse audiences like professionals and consumers.
"You really have to put on kind of two marketing hats. You have to understand the needs of both of those customers and really be able to cater to them in order to effectively market to them,” says Clif.
Once you know your audience, you can start providing them with targeted content with the help of segmentation to enhance marketing efforts.
And while initial sales are important, repeat sales indicate effective relationship management.
On this episode, Clif and host Dave Charest, director of small business success at Constant Contact, dive into the importance of understanding key customers, repeat business, and the role of Constant Contact in their marketing.
Meet Today’s Guest: Clif Johnson from Pablo Designs
⚡What he does: Clif is the Director of Global Sales and Marketing at Pablo Designs. Pablo Designs is a manufacturer and distributor of interior lighting that challenges traditional design metaphors. Their mission is to create designs that deepen the relationship between objects, their users, and their environment.
💡 Key quote: “Storytelling sells and engages far better than numbers on a spreadsheet. You can have the best product in the world, but if you're not telling a story around it…you're going to not only lose people's attention, but in many cases, you're probably going to bore them to tears.”
If you love this show, please leave a review. Go to RateThisPodcast.com/bam and follow the simple instructions.
Chapters
Identifying and understanding who your key customers are is a crucial part of marketing for Clif Johnson, especially if you’re targeting diverse audiences like professionals and consumers.
"You really have to put on kind of two marketing hats. You have to understand the needs of both of those customers and really be able to cater to them in order to effectively market to them,” says Clif.
Once you know your audience, you can start providing them with targeted content with the help of segmentation to enhance marketing efforts.
And while initial sales are important, repeat sales indicate effective relationship management.
On this episode, Clif and host Dave Charest, director of small business success at Constant Contact, dive into the importance of understanding key customers, repeat business, and the role of Constant Contact in their marketing.
Meet Today’s Guest: Clif Johnson from Pablo Designs
⚡What he does: Clif is the Director of Global Sales and Marketing at Pablo Designs. Pablo Designs is a manufacturer and distributor of interior lighting that challenges traditional design metaphors. Their mission is to create designs that deepen the relationship between objects, their users, and their environment.
💡 Key quote: “Storytelling sells and engages far better than numbers on a spreadsheet. You can have the best product in the world, but if you're not telling a story around it…you're going to not only lose people's attention, but in many cases, you're probably going to bore them to tears.”
If you love this show, please leave a review. Go to RateThisPodcast.com/bam and follow the simple instructions.
What is Be a Marketer with Dave Charest?
As a small business owner, you need to be a lot of things to make your business go—but you don't have to be a marketer alone. Join host Dave Charest, Director of Small Business Success at Constant Contact, and Kelsi Carter, Brand Production Coordinator, as they explore what it really takes to market your business. Even if marketing's not your thing! You'll hear from small business leaders just like you along with industry experts as they share their stories, challenges, and best advice to get real results. This is the Be a Marketer podcast! New episodes every Thursday!
Dave Charest:
Today in episode 54, you'll hear from a sales and marketing director that knows the secret to getting repeat business. This is the Be A Marketer podcast. Be a marketer. I'm your host, Dave Charest, director of small business success at Constant Contact. And I help small business owners like you make sense of online marketing.
Dave Charest:
And on this podcast, we'll explore how to find the time to be a marketer. Remember friend, you can be a marketer. And at Constant Contact, we're here to help. Well, hello, friend, and thanks for being here for another episode of the Be A Marketer podcast. Today, our guest is Clif Johnson, director of global sales and marketing at Pablo Designs.
Dave Charest:
Now this San Francisco based company founded over 31 years ago creates interior lighting for both consumer and industrial applications all over the world. Now the business thrives on the relationships built with their professional customers such as lighting designers, architects, and interior designers. I asked Clif, who's been at the company almost 7 years at the time of recording, what he finds most challenging about his role. It had to do with identifying and understanding who their key customers are. Why is that important?
Dave Charest:
Well, let's pick up the conversation there.
Clif Johnson:
Because we're a manufacturer that is not only selling products to professional users but also to end user, to consumers who are buying it for themselves, you really have to put on kind of 2 marketing hats. You know? You have to understand the needs of both of those customers and really be able to cater to them in order to effectively market to them.
Dave Charest:
So, yeah, tell me a little bit about why because I think this is important for people to hear because I like how you're making those distinctions between the two audiences. And so why is that so important to know them and understand that to what you're doing?
Clif Johnson:
Yeah. I think it's you don't wanna be telling the incorrect marketing story to the wrong customer. If we have a product that is really designed for a specific application, let's say, you know, gigantic 52 inch diameter overhead ceiling lights, they're really intended to be used in maybe a commercial office or a corporate setting. We don't wanna necessarily be marketing that to the same customer who is shopping for products for their dining room
Dave Charest:
Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
Or their bedroom or their living room or their bathroom. I think it is very easy to misidentify who key customers are for certain products. It doesn't really matter if you're selling a widget or a a desk lamp. You always want to make sure that you are really honing in on exactly what the customer need is and then trying to tell them stories around that need, around solving the problems that they're looking for. And I think any effective marketer can kind of explain how they go about doing this.
Clif Johnson:
Of course, everybody does it differently. But one of the things I realized very early on, especially in my role, is that it wasn't a one story fits all or one size fits
Dave Charest:
all. Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
I think that has really helped us not only market our products but also grow as a business.
Dave Charest:
Yeah. No. I love that. So when you think about what you've accomplished over the years in the role, what would you say has been your biggest accomplishment so far?
Clif Johnson:
I think growing the base of people that we work with. You know, prior to joining the company, we had a very limited number of commercial agents in the US. We had a very limited number of commercial agents in Europe that we were working with. And I think by bringing more organization and really trying to, again, understand what the roles of these agents were, who they are selling to, and who are they not selling to, and really kind of putting everything on a map to see what our areas of coverage were. We were able to really develop a plan and execute it.
Clif Johnson:
And, you know, I think if you look back 7 years ago, we maybe only had, I think, 8 or 9 sales reps in the United States and then maybe a couple of 100 individual retailers. Fast forward to today, we have closer to 30 with probably closer to 300 retailers. And I think a big part of that has really been making sure that we're talking to the right people. We're engaging with the right people at every level.
Dave Charest:
Why is that accomplishment important to you personally?
Clif Johnson:
To me personally, I think because it helps it helps tell our story better. And I think for me, I have stronger relationships with some of our agents and some of our retailers than other ones, of course. I'm not allowed to have favorites. But no. I think for me, it's a it's a matter of pride.
Clif Johnson:
We take a lot of pride in the people that we work with and their ability to tell our story on our behalf. And if somebody came to me and said, you know, what is the single one thing you're proudest of accomplishing in the last 7 years? I would say it would be finding these fantastic professionals that we work with that help us do our jobs.
Dave Charest:
When you think about where you are right now and where the business is, what are your what are your top priorities as you come into this? I guess we're a quarter in now. Right? But, like, where are you where are you headed?
Clif Johnson:
That's a great question. You know, I think we always have these kind of basic goals. Right? We have grow top line revenue, grow sales of new products, grow sales of existing products, launch new collections. And I I feel that those goals are gonna be similar for most people that are kind of in our shoes, in my shoes.
Clif Johnson:
I think on a higher level, I think building upon partnerships that we have started in the last 12 to 18 months, that is always a major key player in our success, continuing to find new partners to engage with, and then also main just maintaining the deep relationships we have. You know, I think as a business, we have kind of our a level, our b level, and our c level customers. And our a level tends to occupy maybe the top 10% of, sales by revenue. And those are the relationships with some of these people and some of these companies. We've now been working with them for 20 or 30 years.
Clif Johnson:
We have a good understanding of what their needs are. They have a good understanding of what our capabilities are, and we wanna make sure that we're continually providing them with white glove service with everything they may need. With our b level customers, these are customers that we have maybe been working with for a shorter period of time. So maybe 2 to 3 to 5 years. And we want to make sure that we are continually delivering on what they're coming to us for.
Clif Johnson:
Maybe they started working with us 2 or 3 years ago on a single project. They bought something. They're coming back to us now saying we have this other opportunity. We'd like to talk to you about using your thing on whatever this project does. We wanna make sure that we're continually staying engaged with them to make sure that they're aware of all our all of our products, all of our capabilities, and when they have a need that we're delivering that to them.
Clif Johnson:
And then you've got kind of your c level customers who are people that they may have worked with you 10 years ago, but they haven't come back to you for a need ever since. Or they're people that they may have worked with you once last year, wasn't a particularly large order, but for whatever reason, you feel like there's a bigger opportunity there. And so we wanna make sure that we're dividing our time equally. And then on top of all of that, finding new customers to engage with.
Dave Charest:
So when you start thinking about that, I mean, you you mentioned a lot obviously, we mentioned things like, you know, revenue sales, all of those top line things and and that type of start, but then maintaining and building new relationships, I guess, obviously, there's a number. Right? You can see the number of relationships grow. But then on the maintenance piece and even just building those relationships more, like, is there I guess, how do you measure that? Like, what are you looking at to say, okay.
Dave Charest:
We're successful at building these relationships?
Clif Johnson:
I mean, there is the I think revenue is always a good indicator. Not necessarily the amount of revenue, but whether that revenue was kind of sizable at all. So let's say we may have met a lighting designer or a lighting designer came to us and said, I'm working on a restaurant. I need to buy 26 pendants at this price. What do you have that kinda fits my need?
Clif Johnson:
Aesthetically, technically, etcetera. That initial order may only be $2,000, $3,000. Kinda doesn't really matter. But what we want to see as a manufacturer is we wanna see that person coming back to us when we've launched a new collection and saying, I saw you came out with this. I would like to use it for this.
Clif Johnson:
Tell me more about it.
Dave Charest:
Got it.
Clif Johnson:
And if they do that, that tends to mean that we've done our job.
Dave Charest:
Got it. I love that. So it's almost like it's cool with the first sale, but it's like almost that what's that repeat sale? Like, is there that coming? And if that's almost a real indicator that, yeah, that you've done that well, that's awesome.
Dave Charest:
I love that.
Clif Johnson:
Absolutely.
Dave Charest:
So, what do you see as or what are you running into over the years and even currently as challenges to kind of achieving these goals that you're setting for yourself?
Clif Johnson:
Absolutely. Market saturation is a big one.
Dave Charest:
Talk to me about that.
Clif Johnson:
In our space, I mean, it's the lighting space is it's almost infinite with choice. It's like going to a grocery store and trying to buy a loaf of bread. You've got a million different options, the same number of price points. You've got your very low end. You've got your very high end.
Clif Johnson:
You've got kind of everything in between. I think the biggest challenge is finding and identifying our unique value proposition to our core customers. It's not as important for us to really be selling our value proposition to everybody. We really wanna be selling it to our core group of customers and to an audience of customers who look like our core group of customers. And by doing that, we're able to constantly kind of find these new people to work with.
Clif Johnson:
On a consumer level, if we're selling to consumers, it is really challenging to stay top of mind. Consumers are absolutely bombarded with content now from essentially every angle. It's not limited to just a screen. It's a billboard. It's a print campaign.
Clif Johnson:
It is kind of media everywhere. It's kinda omnipresent. And I think trying to stay in front of customers who are interested in bettering their home, bettering their home office, better shopping for products, staying in front of those customers is always a it's always a challenge. And I feel like it becomes more of a challenge every year.
Dave Charest:
So as you talk about this value prop and then even if you think of, you know, Pablo's mission. Right? It's just in terms of the business. Like, how are you working through that to incorporate into the things that you're doing?
Clif Johnson:
I think it helps if we build these ideas in as we are developing a product from the very beginning. If we look at a specific space and say, we think there is a market need for a, you know, a desk lamp that is in this 200 to $300 retail list price point that is very feature rich that comes in this variety of color waves. We think that we can successfully bring that to market because we can sell it to this kind of core group of existing customers, and we can find new customers that will buy it because we see these other 5 options in the marketplace that we think are not addressing the need correctly. I think by doing that, what we're really able to do is tell the full story of this is what the thing is, desk lamp, table lamp, floor lamp, pendant light. This is the need that it's filling.
Clif Johnson:
This is the price point we're gonna try and target to manufacture it out, and then this is how we're gonna bring it to market. Really understanding that full cycle, which in some cases can be 24, 36 months long.
Dave Charest:
Mhmm.
Clif Johnson:
No. It's not. I think when you're a small to midsize manufacturer and you're doing everything in house and, you're often working with contract manufacturers, you have to start engaging with them in a very, very early part of the product development life cycle. But understanding 24, 36 months down the road, who are we going to be selling this to, and what need is it gonna be filling for them? My job as a marketer, it makes that portion of it, of of launching it so much easier if we've already addressed all these questions at the very beginning.
Dave Charest:
So talk to me a little bit about so, you know, you've done all these things. You've you know your audiences. You've got something that's filling a need. So how do you then go about figuring out and, I guess, developing or approaching your marketing strategy? What does that look like?
Clif Johnson:
Yeah. So I think usually about 6 months before a product gets launched, we start having I would call them, top level conversations with our friends. These are people that we have worked with for a long time. They may be customers that I have known for my entire professional career. So that's about a decade or so.
Clif Johnson:
There are lighting designers who we may have worked with now for 10, 15, 20 years. We have a core group of kind of very large nationwide retail partners that we work with. We start kind of showing them the sneak peeks of it. Here's what this thing looks like. Here's the feature set.
Clif Johnson:
Here's the price point. What do you think? It's that simple. We start engaging with them early on so that they have the opportunity to call out features, functions that they either feel are missing or that they feel need to be addressed in order to make it a compelling product for not only for themselves, but also for their customers.
Dave Charest:
So I wanna try to understand where this happens. Right? So are those one to one conversations that you're having with people? Are these reps talking to people and previewing that way? And then I guess if that's true, when does the, I guess, the digital portion of this start to happen?
Dave Charest:
Talk me through that a little bit.
Clif Johnson:
Absolutely. So for your first point, they're one to one conversations. They're happening with our reps who many times these professionals are basically now friends. You see them at shows. You go to sales presentations with them.
Clif Johnson:
You work with them. And they not only know you and your company, but they know the products very well. And they have they have a good feeling for how their customers will respond. When it comes to kind of how do we translate this into, I guess, speaking to customers, we'll typically start that process, I would say, 3 months before the product actually goes live. You know?
Clif Johnson:
And so by the time that happens, we've had all of these one on one conversations, not only with our biggest partners, but also with our sales agents, with our kind of lighting designers who are our, you know, kind of our our big customers. And they've all given us, you know, reams of feedback. We like the price. We like the size. We like the finishes.
Clif Johnson:
We like kind of all the technical specifications. We think we're going to be able to use it in kind of these settings. And by the time we've taken all of that stuff into account, we think it's ready to show and ready to go to market. And that's when we start kind of putting together the overall marketing calendar for how we're gonna be messaging up. And so digitally and I think this is kind of a good point to bring into what what we use Constant Contact for.
Clif Johnson:
When we look at the digital marketing calendar for a product that we're launching, one of the first things we do is we start to segment out all of the contact lists that we're gonna be messaging and the story that we're going to be messaging that contact list with. So if we have maybe a contact list of people that we have met at a specific trade show in a specific city over the last 5 years, and all of these contacts have been uploaded into Constant Contact, flagged, segmented out, first name, last name, email address, firm, etcetera. As we start to launch this product, we will then pull these lists of contacts together to start building very specific messaging campaigns to them. So maybe that message is join Pablo at this specific trade show in your city to see this product that's being launched for the first time. And that'll give us a very good base of individuals to start campaigning to.
Clif Johnson:
Now we may do that for 6 to 8 different shows, but what it allows us to do is within a very, very short period of time, message a brand new product that's been in development for, say, 3 years and start engaging with people at the very top of the sales funnel to start getting them interested.
Dave Charest:
I love that there's a, like, kind of a multi faceted approach to this, right, just in terms of the steps in the storytelling and getting people. I would argue in many ways ready to even buy the thing right before you're even asking them to buy it, right, which I think is is really fascinating, and I love that you're doing that. So, well, tell me a little bit about let's get into the nuts and bolts of some of this. Right? So you mentioned, you know, it's you on the marketing side.
Dave Charest:
So, like Yeah. I guess, what is your approach to actually getting stuff done Sure. When it comes to this? And, like yeah.
Clif Johnson:
Well, no. Organization is key. Right?
Dave Charest:
Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
Organization's key. I have a lot of peers in our space that I can bounce ideas off of without divulging anything that's too proprietary either from them or for me. But really, yeah, I mean, I think as a business, we're not selling inexpensive consumer products. That's not we're not selling a $20 cosmetic, a $30 T shirt, $90 pair of chinos. We're selling decorative lighting that on the low end, maybe 2 to $300 on the high end, maybe north of $3,000 for a single piece.
Clif Johnson:
And so you really have to build your campaigns around the likelihood that it's going to be a lengthy sales process. It's not gonna be a buy now. It's not gonna be a, you know, shop now. It's gonna be more of a learn more type of call to action. And as we start engaging with customers that have come to us in the past for something so let's say of these contact lists that we've pulled together, we have several 100 of them that may be customers that have come to a trade show, indicated that they either like what we were doing or that had worked with us before, asked to sign up for our contact list.
Clif Johnson:
We wanna be very aware of how we're communicating with those customers. So, you know, if if we're launching a new product that's gonna become available in August, we wanna start messaging them maybe in July and saying, this is this new thing. Here is the story behind it. We'd like for you to learn more. And by learning more, if they simply click on learn more and jump to the page on our website, that kind of expression of interest is enough to kind of get them into the funnel.
Clif Johnson:
And many times from there, they will either download a spec sheet. They will, forward the email that we have sent them about the collection to a sales agent or to a showroom that they may be already working with. And then from there, the sales approach kinda takes a bunch of different angles.
Dave Charest:
Got it. So talk to me through so obviously, you're you're using Constant Contact. What would you say are the notable results you see from using the tools?
Clif Johnson:
There's a couple. There's a couple that immediately come to mind, and then there's kind of a a few that are more ambiguous or amorphous. I think the analytics that we get the moment we send out any piece of marketing collateral are incredibly important because it really allows us to understand how successful the messaging kinda in the moment is. Right? If we send out a an email to an audience of maybe 8,000 customers, 8,000 contacts, and our open rates are quite high and our click throughs are quite high, then we know that there is an appetite or we have a suspicion that there's an appetite for exactly the story that we're telling about whatever that product does.
Clif Johnson:
The inverse of that can also true, though. You know, if we send out sometimes we think we're sending out, you know, this amazing email blast to 20,000 customers, and it's like the open rates are like point 0 3%. It's like it kinda falls on deaf ears. But there's still learnings there. You know?
Clif Johnson:
It's, I think having the analytics that Constant Contact gives us is, it's incredibly powerful because it gives us that ability to kinda measure what our audience is, engaging with.
Dave Charest:
You mentioned, 2 things and then the amorphous stuff. So what was the second thing?
Clif Johnson:
The the second thing is really integration. So we've we've integrated with Constant Contact in a variety of ways. When you go to our website, there's an initial pop up. Stay informed. Subscribe to our newsletter.
Clif Johnson:
And that has been very good at kind of establishing very top of funnel leads. So you know? And sometimes those customers are from the United States or maybe from Canada. Sometimes they're from, you know, a completely different country. And so it's a very good kind of baseline indication from someone that they wanna stay in touch with us regardless as to what the message is.
Clif Johnson:
They just want to keep us in their head for some future purpose. Those leads could be they could be design students. They could be a design student at a local university somewhere. It could be a major architect. It could be a distributor that has seen our products on jobs and may need to purchase them in the future.
Clif Johnson:
So it's you really get a very broad swath of customers. And so being able to take those leads and tie them into the same contact list that we're also merging leads that have signed up to receive our content from trade shows. And it's incredibly valuable. You know, it kinda gives us this ability to organize and tailor our message to a specific need depending on who that customer is.
Dave Charest:
You also are integrated with with Shopify, if I'm not mistaken. Can you tell me a little bit about what that looks like and and how you're using that? Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
Yeah. Absolutely. So we launched our Shopify, our online web store, probably 6, 7 years ago. And at the time, it was really to address this need for us to cater to customers that were not close to any of our existing retailers. I I think, initially and still, this is this is pretty true.
Clif Johnson:
You know, we don't actively try and compete with our own retail network. We sell products at wholesale, and then our retailers are selling them to their customers. Most of the the customers that we're catering to are in places where we have no other retail presence. You know? And so having that as a ability for us to establish and maintain very limited direct contacts with some of our customers in a way that doesn't compete with our other partners, it's very important to us, you know, as a business.
Clif Johnson:
But at the same time, it's really, you know, allowed us to take our go to market strategy one step further. You know? And so if if a customer that lives in, say, Idaho, where, you know, there's not a a significant number of high end lighting retailers located, wants to purchase a product, then if they wanna purchase it directly from us, that's a relationship we're more than happy to to have.
Dave Charest:
A lot of questions are coming going through my mind right now just in terms of, like so in terms of even just collecting contact information then because it sounds like you're you're very specific about the types of people and who you're gonna be speaking to and all of that. So, like, I guess there's arguments, I guess, on two sides of the of it, right, where it's, like, you know, collect very little, collect a lot, build over time. I guess, what are you collecting at the outset, and how are you building that over time? I guess, how are you managing all of just, like, the contacts themselves?
Clif Johnson:
Sure. So Shopify makes it very easy to integrate directly with Constant Contact. It was one of the reasons that we originally went with Constant Contact was because of this ability to integrate the consumer's contact information by intent. So, you know, we have one segment of customers who have made at least one purchase from us. But we also have another segment of customers who have abandoned the shopping cart but have still opted in to receive our marketing communications.
Clif Johnson:
In many of these cases, these are double opt ins. So they'll receive one email confirming that they wanna receive, email from us. And then once they confirm that, then they'll officially be added to another list. And so by having all of these different segments out of customers that, like I said, abandoned shopping cart or they've completed a purchase or they're potential customers, It really gives us the ability to cater the messaging that we're sending to them. We try not to message them so frequently that it becomes almost bothersome.
Clif Johnson:
But with most of these customers, we tend to message them probably, I'd say, once every 3 to 4 weeks. So it's just enough to stay top of mind, but not enough to hit unsubscribe.
Dave Charest:
Yeah. I think it's a that's always a an interesting question that we get too. And I think it's different for every business. Right? But it's finding your own sweet spot on that.
Dave Charest:
So you mentioned the abandoned cart. How important is that, or have you found that to be in in terms of what it's allowed you to, I guess, recapture in many many instances?
Clif Johnson:
I would say very. We've tried different types of strategies with regards to getting that customer to come back and move forward with a purchase. Sometimes it can be offering them a slight discount. Sometimes it can be offering them free expedited shipping. Sometimes it can be a variety of things, maybe a gift with purchase.
Clif Johnson:
I think we have a, I would say, fairly good rate of being able to to get those customers to move forward. We're always trying to improve them, and it'll never be perfect. Right? It's I would be hard pressed to find a scenario where we completely close that loop between customers browsing and adding to cart and then customers coming back and buying. Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
There's always gonna be tire kickers, for lack
Dave Charest:
of a better word. Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
But for those customers that are considering a purchase that add it to their cart and then close the window for whatever reason, we wanna make sure that we are staying in front of them any way we can without being intrusive.
Dave Charest:
Yeah. Random question for you. Well, not really random. We're talking about the Shopify integration. But are you using or are you even aware of the product block feature within Constant Contact?
Clif Johnson:
No. Okay. Product product block feature.
Dave Charest:
Yeah. So let me I wanna mention this because I always get I'm always excited when, like, yay. People are using Shopify. I'm like, wait. Are they using this?
Dave Charest:
And I feel like it's very it's a very helpful thing. So within your Constant Contact account, when you're building an email, you obviously have the drag and drop things that you can pull over. I think maybe the second section in, there's a bunch of blocks in there that one of them is, like a read more block, like an RSVP poll, and then one is a product block. And since your Shopify account is connected, what you can do is you can drag that block in and then when you click on the block, you can actually select from all of the products that you have on your Shopify website. And when you choose that product versus uploading, downloading images, and writing all the descriptions, and copying pasting, it's going to pull over the image that you have.
Dave Charest:
It's going to give you the description, the price, all of those things which you can then edit. But if you're trying to add a product to the email, it saves you a whole bunch of time because you just plop it right in. Right? So something worthwhile to to check out if you haven't been using that because I feel like that's like a huge time saver. Right?
Dave Charest:
Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The more I I feel like the Constant Contact is really good about developing features to support marketers.
Clif Johnson:
I think the biggest challenge that I've often run into is just staying on top of what those new features are. Yeah. You know?
Dave Charest:
It's a difficult thing. I mean, I think I think it's the the constant challenge of, I mean, anybody, really. But when you think of it from a marketing perspective, it's like, okay. How much time do I have? And I'm going in to do the thing that I know I'm gonna do.
Dave Charest:
Right? I don't really have time to be exploring. Right?
Clif Johnson:
So Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
So true. Yeah. It's, you know, and I think a lot of what I do, I think as a in my role within the company I'm I work with is trying to find new and interesting ways of engaging with our customers, but at the same time, managing my time to the best that I can. And so any any platform that gives us this kind of ability to take a templated solution, modify it to make it our own, and then make very small tweaks in it to tailor it to what our needs are, it's almost always a win. So Well,
Dave Charest:
I'm curious, you know, just in terms of oftentimes we're speaking to people that marketing is a necessary evil. Right? It's not necessarily something that they wanna wanna do. They know they have to do it. Sure.
Dave Charest:
But someone like yourself that obviously has marketing in the title, right, and you're like, it's something that you do, and I'm I'm assuming you have some enjoyment in that process. What do you love most about marketing?
Clif Johnson:
That's a great question. So I guess to step back briefly. Yeah, when I stepped into my role so previously, I was only doing sales management. This is 7 7, 8 years ago. I was only doing sales management, and that was really pretty tried and true account executive type role.
Clif Johnson:
You know, you've got your core set of customers. You wanna buy new customers, but you also wanna maintain the the ones you've got and keep them happy and be selling to what their needs are. I think in my role right now and when I really started to get more involved in the marketing aspect of kind of what we do yeah. I'm I'm very fortunate in that I genuinely love this part of what I do. I feel like it is finding the people that wanna listen to the stories you wanna tell and then telling them the stories.
Clif Johnson:
And, you know, them purchasing the product at the end of that is kind of the ultimate compliment because it means you've done your job correctly.
Dave Charest:
I love that way you're looking at it. Yeah.
Clif Johnson:
But I like that I like that it gives me this opportunity to kind of build a cohesive message around a thing, whatever that thing is. You know? It could be, like I said, table lamp, a pendant, a pencil, whatever. But I I really enjoy this ability to find people that we want to engage with, build relationship with, maybe sell products too, maybe not. But and tailor a story around whatever we're trying to achieve.
Clif Johnson:
Yeah. It's great. It it's full of challenges. You know, it it's certainly not I wouldn't say it's an easy job, but you are you constantly have to learn. Right?
Clif Johnson:
You have to look at what you did. You have to analyze the results, and you have to tailor your next steps to whatever those lessons learned are. I I find it endlessly fascinating.
Dave Charest:
If you had to do what you do today without constant contact, what would that be like for you? Oh, like,
Clif Johnson:
I it would be impossible. It'd be impossible. I don't know I don't know enough about the history of marketing to understand how people did this 50 years ago. I don't think Mad Men tells a tells a complete, complete picture of it. It's no wonder there was a a lot of heavy drinking back in the fifties sixties among marketers.
Clif Johnson:
Yeah. I don't know how. I mean, aside from having a an army of salespeople out there that had 1 on 1 relationships with the right customers in the right places, it would be incredibly difficult.
Dave Charest:
Yeah. When you think about Constant Contact specifically and if you were talking to another customer who were using it, what would be your number one tip for them in terms of taking advantage of the platform itself?
Clif Johnson:
Learn the basics. Learn and understand the basics very well so that as you are getting started, you're really taking advantage of the power that it can offer you. One of the things I've I've always enjoyed about Constant Contact is, you know, apart from it being feature rich, is the relative low cost that it has when you compare it to not only other email marketing platforms in the marketplace, but also relative to the power that it can give you as a marketer. You know, it solves a lot of problems and it fills a lot of needs at a very, very low price point. And I think as someone who would just be getting started off using it, you know, maybe that person is a drop shipper.
Clif Johnson:
Maybe that person is a designer. Maybe they're a maker. Maybe they are starting out their own little retail operation. Really understanding how to segment out your customers based on what what your message is to them and understanding how to not only build but maintain your contact lists, how to manage those contact lists is key to really getting started off on the right foot. And I think Constant Contact for us as a manufacturer and for me as a marketer, it has met those needs very well.
Clif Johnson:
It's exceeded them.
Dave Charest:
Well, friend, let's recap some items from that discussion. Number 1, know and segment your audience. Now as Clif mentioned, Pablo Designs has a professional and a consumer audience. The same stories aren't going to apply to each group. The more you can understand and tap into the needs of the audience that you are trying to reach, the more effective your marketing is going to be.
Dave Charest:
So recognize and look for those moments where you may have multiple audiences. Number 2, pay attention to repeat sales. Now Clif mentioned how, sure, initial orders are one thing, but what's really important is how well they've managed the relationships to get those repeat sales. Now if people are coming back, the team has done its job. Now, of course, you're always gonna be thinking about bringing in new customers, but don't forget how important it is to be building those relationships that bring repeat customers.
Dave Charest:
Number 3, involve your VIPs before you launch. Now Clif mentioned that about 6 months before a product gets launched, they start having top level conversations with their friends, and I'm using that in air quotes. This is the core group of people that gives them feedback. Now not only on the product itself, but they're also learning what's important to communicate from a marketing perspective. So the lesson here is talk with your customers.
Dave Charest:
You're gonna learn so much about how to better communicate with them, which, again, leads to better marketing. So here's your action item for today. If you're using Shopify or another ecommerce store, make sure you're connecting it to your Constant Contact account. I'm gonna include some links for you with more details in the show notes. I hope you've enjoyed this episode of the Be A Marketer podcast.
Dave Charest:
If you have questions or feedback, I'd love to hear from you. You can email me directly at dave.charest (at) constantcontact dotcom. If you did enjoy today's episode, please take a moment to leave us a review. Your honest feedback will help other small business marketers like yourself find the show. Well, friend, I hope you enjoy the rest of your day and continued success to you and your business.