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A daily podcast delving into the biggest stories of the day throughout the sports betting and igaming sector.
Jessica Welman (00:02.074)
Startups have always been an integral part of the online gambling space. Some of the largest companies in the sector started out as a small idea and from humble roots. Nobody arguably is more in tune with what is going on in the world of gaming startups than betting startups podcast host Jesse Lermont. On today's episode of iGaming Daily, we'll survey the startup landscape and talk about what to expect from next week's first pitch competition at SBC Summit in Lisbon.
iGaming Daily is brought to you by OptiMove, the number one CRM marketing solution for the iGaming market. We can still get you that first free month if you go to optimove .com forward slash SBC or just click that link in the description below. I am Jessica Wellman, editor of SBC Americas, and I am joined as I said by Jesse Lermont, who you are our MC for all of the first pitches, which we thoroughly appreciate.
For those who don't know why you're so tied into the startup space, do you want to just kind of give our audience a little bit of background as to how you ended up being the guy who covers and is in the know of what's going on in that particular area?
Jesse (01:14.638)
100 % Jessica. First of all, thank you for having me. Great to finally be on your show with you and really excited to see you in the SBC team next week in Lisbon. I got a head start on my trip to Portugal, so I won't have jet lag, which I'm happy about. I won't have any excuses to be tired next week. Yeah, look, I'll give a quick synopsis here as to sort of how I found myself spending as much time as I do talking to early stage and growth stage companies within our space. I guess the first
Jessica Welman (01:17.626)
Of course. I know.
Jesse (01:41.614)
jumping off point would be I did once upon a time have a startup myself within the real money gaming industry. Back in 2010, which feels like prehistoric times, I started a company doing a lot of what we now call data analytics and a lot of stats driven tools for betters. At that time, if you can kind of rewind in your mind a little bit, you know, the movie Moneyball had just come out. People were very enamored with this concept of saver metrics and data analysis. And that time there really wasn't anything for sports betters or punters to...
to crunch numbers easily. So my team and I set out to build some tools at that time. And that was our foray into the industry and I've been hanging around ever since. So I do have that firsthand experience on the startup roller coaster and from a founder perspective. My startup got acquired by Pinnacle Sports in 2015, which sort of set the trajectory for the next six years for me in the industry working for one of the most prominent bookmakers in the world. And that...
You know, amongst other things included a relocation to the Island of Cura, which was a great time in my life and many lifelong friends from that chapter. part of my remit at Pinnacle in my role there as director of product management was kind of being the gatekeeper for a lot of new suppliers that wanted to pitch their wares to Pinnacle. So I was already out at all of the industry conferences every year, hearing pitches from new suppliers, new vendors, and within that, a lot of new startups as well. you know, part of my role was to kind of just talk to, talk to them all. And I really enjoyed that.
you know, I really have always had an affinity for startup culture and going from zero to one. And back in the day when I started my company in the town on the west coast of Canada, where I live, I started a local meetup group for local entrepreneurs and founders and really kind of cut my teeth, I would say on, being sort of the person there, galvanizing a community of people around early stage tech companies. And, know, fast forward, six years after my, my time with Pinnacle was up, I really didn't know what I wanted to do next. So I'm.
I was kind of sitting around. like, you know what, my role there is dumb, but I kind of want to still keep talking to founders of early stage companies in this space because obviously, you know, in 2020, 2021, in the first couple of years post PASPA, there was the gold rush, right? Everybody was coming into the space with their big ideas and there was so much happening and there still is, of course. But I just said, you know what, I'm going to start a podcast. I'm going to just talk to one startup a week and just kind of see where this goes. And almost three years later now, and 130 something episodes later, still no shortage of startups trying to get on the podcast.
Jesse (04:05.27)
still no shortage of people for me to talk to. And just through the sheer consistency of me putting out an episode every week, I've really, I would say accidentally positioned myself as being one of the people really in the know with early stage companies in the space. So yeah, it's a quick arc to my story, Jessica, happy to sort of pull on any threads there, but that's kind of the road that got me here.
Jessica Welman (04:23.162)
curious. So I'm not a founder, but I was kind of ground floor of the group that was acquired and became Katina in North America, or now basically all of Katina. And I just remember the vibe when there was 10 of us, 12 of us and there's, it's great to work for big companies too. But do you think some of the desire to talk to these guys is because
that part of the process, there's always just so much energy and potential and it's just a different vibe than a lot of other companies.
Jesse (04:59.15)
I mean, I think you just hit the nail on the head, right? Like at that stage, at the earliest stages, everything is nothing but potential, right? And that's the exciting part. You have nothing but the future to be hopeful about. And as your company starts to reach scale, which of course is a great place to be, that's where we all aspire to be. But you lose a little bit of that enthusiasm, let's call it. know, things start to get really, start to need to have processes and infrastructure and some of these sort of more corporate -y things that somewhat detracts from that, the excitement of those earliest days. And a lot of the...
lot of the folks I talked to on the podcast that have reached scale. did an interview a few weeks ago with the co -founders of PrizePix. That's a good example. And, you know, they were lamenting about the early days, like you just talked about back when it was like 10 or 12 of them and they were sort of elbow to elbow in one room. And of course, now they're a juggernaut. I don't, I don't need to explain how successful they've been, but there really is a, is a special time in any company's life cycle at those earliest days. And I think once companies, if they're lucky enough to sort of reach that critical mass and reach scale, they really do look back longingly on those earliest days, even though
You know, times are tough. There's never money in the bank. You're never quite sure where your next dollar is coming from. Like it goes both ways, but there is a real romanticism about those earliest possible days.
Jessica Welman (06:07.298)
It's a, it's a very cool spot for them. It's, you know, we all look at the success, you know, it's prize picks is a great example in the U S draft Kings and Fandel startups at the end of the day too. So it's great that you can scale like that, but, that's kind of what I love about being at the first pitch competition, which you are a great host of. I've been to the U S one in the Canada one. plan to hopefully find time to be there on Tuesday as anybody listening should, but.
For those like, who would you say benefits the most from attending and watching along with the first pitch contest?
Jesse (06:45.634)
Yeah, great question. mean, beyond the obvious answer of the finalists themselves who have a fantastic platform that SBC provides them to really, you know, get their message out there, get discovered, get that visibility, which is so crucial at the earliest stages and really helping to position them as credible companies within the industry that are innovating and disrupting. Beyond that, you know, lot of the folks that join the audience of the live event are, I would say everything from obviously investors are very interested in looking at the next big thing.
We get a lot of folks that represent operators that are in the room looking for potential new partners or suppliers, or, know, strategic partners at that level. we get a lot of other influential stakeholders that again, are really just trying to see who are the next big disruptors coming into the space. And, really when I, I'm up on stage or looking out at the audience in the room, they're looking at the folks that are in the room. really is.
a well represented room, a very influential senior industry stakeholders in there. It really does draw a crowd. I I know you were in New Jersey in May at the event there and that one was literally standing room only. There was a queue to get in the room for that one. We actually ran out of space. So that's a real testament to just how much I would say enthusiasm there is for folks that are looking to kind of bear witness to, you know, the live pitch event. And also I should say as well, right. You think a little bit about like shark tank or that type of
format and you know people just are generally interested in seeing companies do a live pitch and sort of the excitement and anticipation around what will the judges ask them what will the feedback be will anybody bomb like there's always there's always sort of like that intrigue as well which draws part of the audience into so you get a wide cross section of people in the room there but there is a very meaningful cohort of those that are senior decision makers absolutely
Jessica Welman (08:31.022)
Yeah, you hit on something I think is super cool about it, which is there is a panel of judges that are just elite people. We've got Paris Smith from Pinnacle, others, on the panel. So hearing the kinds of things that they think to ask people and getting a little kind of glimpse into their mindset of what they're looking at is another really cool piece of this. I'm curious. sorry. Go ahead.
Jesse (08:56.248)
Yeah, absolutely. sorry. I my slow wifi here. No, I was just gonna interject there for a second. I'm always so amazed at the caliber of judges, but to your point, Jessica, the questions that they think to ask in real time, I mean, are just a real testament to the level of expertise and experience that the judges have. And, you know, I would not want the pressure of sitting there on the judging panel having to think about how to critique the pitches that we just heard, because the pitches are very well crafted.
and very well delivered and obviously is a product of many reps of practice that the founders are putting into it. And the questions they get, they do get put on the spot. They're very smart questions. And again, I'm reflecting back on the New Jersey installment a few months ago. I was just amazed by the level of thoughtfulness from the judges. And that really also is frankly, a big value add for the founders up on stage to get perhaps a level of questioning they wouldn't otherwise get, which forces them to really think critically about.
you know, some of the fundamental aspects of their businesses. So sorry, I cut you off there.
Jessica Welman (09:56.93)
No, no, I wasn't sure if you had a response or not, so that's all. You know, the format you said, it's kind of like Shark Tank. They've got three minutes. They can have visual aids. It reminds me, I did competitive public speaking in high school. And so this is the, I like going to first pitch too, because it's the closest I get to like reliving that heyday for myself. Three minutes is such a small, small, small amount of time.
How do, like, as someone who's done pitches, how do you get down into three minutes what you need to say? Like, how much do you practice? Is everyone scripted to the word? Are people willing to go off the cuff? What works and what doesn't?
Jesse (10:43.406)
Yeah, great question. And three minutes is 180 seconds. And when you're up on stage where there's a countdown timer right in front of you, basically staring back at you, literally ticking down those 180 seconds and it goes quick. You know, the room's often warm, the lights are bright. It's, it's, and you really need, in my opinion, and I would say the winners of previous installments of first pitch and the more, you know, successfully delivered pitches I've seen really come down to people.
almost developing a muscle memory around the pitch and the presentation, right? You need to expect something is going to go wrong. There might be a technical issue. You might get thrown off. the mic might stop working for a minute. And when the moment you get thrown off, you need to be able to immediately pick up where you left off. And, know, some of the folks that have won previous installments, I've asked them like, what have you guys done to kind of get, you know, to, get the W and they said literally stood in front of a mirror and rehearsed it a hundred times until I got this thing down word for word.
in 180 seconds. And that really is the level of preparation that needs to go into this if you're serious about winning. And of course, all companies are serious about winning. It's a fantastic prize package. I don't know why you wouldn't want to win. That is the level of preparedness that one needs to bring into it. And it doesn't leave a lot of margin for error. It doesn't leave a lot of room to go off script. You know, I have seen some startups over my time hosting the first pitch event where they tried to ad lib it and
It goes horribly wrong. They fall off script. And by the time they get back onto their script, they're down to like the last 30 seconds. And me being the affable Canadian, I generally am have to play the bad cop there and hook them off stage. feel like it's like the end of the Oscars, the, you know, the sort of thing. And so it is, it is what it is, but you really do have to get every word developed in the memory bank and every second counts. It's so cliche, but it's just so true. Cause three minutes, man, it goes quickly.
Jessica Welman (12:16.122)
playing them off, yeah.
Jessica Welman (12:28.346)
What's impressive too is once you rehearse something that much, can sound rote. It can sound like you don't have energy in it. And so you have to have it down pat, but also make it sound like you're just kind of talking off the cuff. I think these guys tend to be so passionate about their project that that part might not be as hard as it seems.
Jesse (12:51.958)
Yeah, well, the passion certainly helps. would say the other thing too, that I often, you people sometimes ask me for feedback, whatever my feedback is worth, but, you know, some of the, again, better pictures I've seen really tend to include a little bit of narrative or storytelling as opposed to pure facts and figures and like numbers and metrics and all that stuff, which is important. And obviously tells a story of success, but you need to include a little bit of like storytelling in there too, right? At end of the day, the judges are humans. And as humans, our brains are wired to really respond well to
to narratives and stories and intrigue and all of this. So to your point, yeah, you know, it can come across as a little bit overly rehearsed. But I think one way to overcome it is by injecting a little bit of storytelling, which gives you bit of room for, you know, injecting your own personality, some of that passion you talked about. That really is, I think, a key differentiator for, again, the more successful pitches that I've seen over my time hosting first pitch.
Jessica Welman (13:45.37)
important is the deck, the visuals and that sort of thing to put together a really winning pitch.
Jesse (13:53.464)
Yeah, I mean, it obviously it helps. really, a trap I would sort of hazard folks to try and not fall into is to sort of use the deck as the talking points and the, know, again, if you can visualize you as a founder up on stage, looking at the audience, there's a screen behind you that you can't see because you're facing the audience. And oftentimes the founders are turning around looking at the deck on the screen behind them.
facing away from the audience, which doesn't lend itself well to really, again, engaging with the judges, engaging with the audience and really having your story resonate with them. So the deck is really an aid, right? It's a tool, it's supposed to reinforce the words that you're saying, as opposed to being the script you're reading off up there on stage. And again, that is a big differentiator and something that has been, I guess, a hallmark of the winners of the past installments at first pitch.
Jessica Welman (14:44.738)
I'm curious if you, do you follow the pitch guy or the deck pitch deck guy newsletter where they send out kind of what winning and successful decks look like? This is a weird newsletter I have fallen down the rabbit hole of just because I'm always curious. Like sometimes we talked about this on the pod before better and Joey Levy, you see how much money that group has raised. was like, that's got to be a hell of a deck and a hell of a pitch.
And you just want to see it. Do you take time to just really dive into those decks and stuff of all the startups that are in the space still?
Jesse (15:23.698)
I number one, should probably subscribe to that newsletter. I haven't seen it. It sounds like a rabbit hole, as you say.
Jessica Welman (15:27.894)
it's like all it's like coke and everything it's not just gaming but yeah it's a fun one
Jesse (15:31.468)
Right. That's cool. so, I mean, yeah, I get a lot of decks hitting my inbox, in different contexts, right? part of, as a bit of a side note and an interesting anecdote, perhaps, you know, with the position, I suppose I've carved out for myself with the betting starters platform organically, what's somewhat, what's kind of happened is I get a lot of founders approaching me saying, Hey, here's us here. We are, I've attached our deck to kind of introduce ourselves. You know, we're looking for.
capital, can you help us, you know, find some investors? And on the other side, I do get, you know, a certain cohort of investors saying, Hey, Jesse, what are some interesting companies, deals, opportunities coming in? I'm kind of finding myself in the, the, the middle of all of this, which is again, maybe a story for another day. but to your question, like, yeah, I do see a lot of decks coming through. you know, coming back to what I said a minute ago about the storytelling aspects, some of the ones that really resonate with me the most are the ones that like really
have a very interesting sort of like arc to the narrative. More so than again, just like problem solution, know, Tam, all of this fundamental stuff you would expect to see in any deck. Yeah, that stuff's all important, but like the ones that really hook me in the first minute, which is what keeps me clicking through to the end of the deck are the ones that really, you know, put a bit of bait out there to intrigue me. And, you know, the ones that I think, you know, probably I haven't seen the better deck, obviously, but I have to reasonably assume and,
Having heard Joey speak a lot about the journey with better and formerly with simple bet, and the success he's had on the, you know, raising capital side of things, have to assume there's a very interesting sort of storytelling aspect to what they've done, which has led to some of the success. And, to me, that is such a critical ingredient is, is, you know, just getting past the sheer like bullet points on the deck. That part is so dry after a while. And if you look at enough decks, I mean, you start to get almost like blindness to it. You don't really absorb what you're reading is what it comes down to. So it needs to be something that really hooks.
hooks the reader in the first minute to kind of compel them to keep reading all the way to the end.
Jessica Welman (17:32.13)
All right, I'm curious, how often have you predicted who the winner is gonna be and been right for our first pitch competitions? Because the competition's tight in this sometimes. And I know for me at least as an audience member, I've been wrong before that I was like, well, that's, but I think there's also a difference between someone who's a very compelling presenter versus not necessarily having the most compelling process.
Jesse (17:57.774)
Yeah, I think that last point is the one to make and maybe a bit of my defense as to why I haven't gone 100 % with my own predictions. So mean, when I'm standing up there next to the stage, listening to the five presentations, obviously, as everybody in the audience is, you're sort of doing your own ranking. And I'd say my hit rate's about 50%. And to your point, you know, some of the best pitches I've seen haven't necessarily been the best business opportunities that the judges have identified, right? So
You know, I've been surprised a few times. I'm not going to lie about that, but, it also makes me relieved as to why I'm not a judge, right? I'm, you know, I'm definitely up there. I think ranking what I deemed to be the best delivery of a presentation and pitch, not necessarily indexing it on what, you know, might have the greatest likelihood of commercial success or longevity or scale within the industry. So again, I don't envy the judges. It's, very difficult because by the time you get down to the, the five companies that are chosen as finalists, I mean, they're typically competing.
against the field of I don't know what the numbers are these days. told me I think for this one it was around 40 submissions that SBC received. So right away you're getting down to like almost the top 10 % of submissions up there on stage, which already is five very strong companies and narrowing it down to one from there. Again, I don't envy the role of the judges, but again, the judges are imminently qualified to do that. And that's why we have such a fantastic lineup of them for every installment of First Pitch.
Jessica Welman (19:23.502)
Yeah, so to quickly just run down, excuse me, the five companies that we will see in Lisbon next week, it is MatchHype, Random State, Savage Tech, StatX Sports, and Xgenia. I will say, looking at these, I think this is the most B2B, SaaS -focused group of five we've had.
agree or disagree on that one. It seems like we've had lot of more consumer facing marketing focused companies, at least in the US and this group, it's a really different set of what they're bringing to the table.
Jesse (20:00.502)
Yeah, so I totally agree with that. And actually you just hit a point that I was going to mention, which is, you know, the fact that for this installment, the first pitch, which of course is in Lisbon, I think four out of the five finalists are European based. have one that is coming over from the U S which is Sean at Stadex Sports. but I guess what I'm observing is to your point, like on the U S side and the last three versions of first pitch in New Jersey have been very, consumer centric.
with a lot of the products. And I don't know if that's a reflection of the state of maturation of the US market, vis -a -vis the European side, which of course, you know, generally speaking is far more mature. And I think the entrepreneurs that are entering the space are identifying opportunities that are a reflection of the maturity of the space that are looking for more, I would say, narrow parts of the stack to infiltrate as opposed to being, you know, the next DFS operators, bad example. But like, you know what I mean? There's a bit of,
I would almost say, and I might get in trouble for saying this, I was almost, sorry, was a bit more sophistication in the caliber of companies that are in this installment of First Pitch because they are really thinking critically about some very narrow parts of the industry, but also ones that are ripe to be attacked. So I love it. think, and I'm not being facetious in saying this because we're trying to hype it up a little bit. This is definitely the most competitive field I've seen of my times hosting First Pitch. And,
You know, there's a couple in there that, as you would expect, are very heavily leaning on AI. Actually, probably three of the five are. And, you know, the technology that's now being developed is extremely robust. And this stuff probably has a lot of use case, if I'm being honest, for other industries or verticals beyond just iGaming in some instances, right? So this is very sophisticated stuff. Huge opportunities are attacking here.
Each of these companies stands a very legitimate chance of winning next week. So yeah, it's a fantastic field.
Jessica Welman (21:55.128)
Yeah, I was very impressed looking at the field, not to belittle any of the other first pitches that we've had. But like you said, you can tell that these are people that are thinking really in depth about where people need assistance, like in the tech stacks in particular. So I am very excited to see it, see you. Just a reminder, everyone, first pitch will be on Tuesday this year at SBC Summit Lisbon. So be sure to find some time and check it out.
Jesse, thanks so much for joining us and I can't wait to see you across the pond next week.
Jesse (22:30.284)
Alright, safe travels over Jessica. We'll see you next week.
Jessica Welman (22:32.9)
Sounds good.