Baking soda and baking powder: what’s the difference?

Show Notes

Baking powder? Baking soda? I mean they're both white powders with the word "baking" in it. How different could they be? Well, one can cause miniature kitchen volcanos and the other does what? Listen this week as Melissa and Jam talk about acids, bases, baking soda, baking powder, and how they can make all the difference in your busy life as a single parent of three.

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What is Chemistry For Your Life?

A podcast that helps you understand the fascinating chemistry hidden in your everyday life.

Have you ever wondered why onions make you cry? Or how soap gets your hands clean? What really is margarine, or why do trees change colors in the fall? Melissa is a chemist, and to answer these questions she started a podcast, called Chemistry for your life!

In each episode Melissa explains the chemistry behind one of life’s mysteries to Jam, who is definitely not a chemist, but she explains it in a way that is easy to understand, and totally fascinating.

If you’re someone who loves learning new things, or who wonders about the way the world works, then give us a listen.

Melissa: 00:09

Hey. I'm Melissa.

Jam: 00:10

I'm Jam.

Melissa: 00:11

And I'm a chemist. And I'm not. And welcome to Chemistry For Your Life.

Jam: 00:15

The podcast where we help you understand the chemistry of your everyday life.

Melissa: 00:19

Okay, Jam. Are you ready to learn what you're gonna learn about today?

Jam: 00:22

Yes. I'm very ready to learn about what I'm gonna learn about what I'm gonna learn about today.

Melissa: 00:27

You're gonna learn about Baking soda. Wait. Hang on. Do you bake ever?

Jam: 00:32

Sometimes, but it's probably my least favorite part of cooking. Like

Melissa: 00:37

Oh, wow. That's unrelatable to me.

Jam: 00:39

I I know. I'm sorry. At least you're a category of cooking. I don't

Melissa: 00:43

Like, you think you're too good for baking in your burger than everyone who bakes? Right. Right. We know you feel that way.

Jam: 00:47

No. I don't feel that way. I feel, like, a lot less confident in that area compared

Melissa: 00:50

to Okay.

Jam: 00:51

Okay. It's like, I just don't go there very much.

Melissa: 00:53

Well, I'll help you get more confident in that area today because we're gonna talk about baking soda.

Jam: 00:58

Okay.

Melissa: 00:59

That's the orange box Tuan.

Jam: 01:00

Uh-huh. The orange box. That also makes you think of of Rosie the Riveter.

Melissa: 01:04

Oh, yeah. I was Rosie

Jam: 01:05

the Riveter for

Melissa: 01:06

Halloween one time.

Jam: 01:07

Oh, nice.

Melissa: 01:09

That actually plays nicely into a little thing I'm gonna tell you later, but it's fine. So we're gonna learn about baking soda in the orange box with the Rosie the Riveter arm. Mhmm. We're gonna talk about baking powder.

Jam: 01:19

Okay.

Melissa: 01:20

That's the one that comes in the little circle can usually that's resealable on the top. Mhmm. And we're gonna talk about what the heck is the difference between them.

Jam: 01:30

Nice. Okay. Good. That's very, very good.

Melissa: 01:33

Yeah.

Jam: 01:34

Can maybe prevent A horrible baking mistake in my future.

Melissa: 01:38

Or it'll just help you be like, oh, I know what this does and this does when these 2 things Happen.

Jam: 01:45

Well, you know, sometimes 1 or 2 of those things are called for in a nonbaking dish. Like, I think I was making a sauce that called for 1 at one point. Mhmm. So it's still bookable even if it not bake.

Melissa: 01:55

That's true.

Jam: 01:56

Still help me.

Melissa: 01:57

Alright. So but before we do that, before I tell you about those things and we talk about the difference in all that? Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

Melissa: 02:02

Uh-huh. I wanna hear about how your week was.

Jam: 02:04

Dude, it was alright. It was not my favorite week in the world.

Melissa: 02:08

Oh, no. Really? Why?

Jam: 02:09

Well, there was this I feel like every week I've been talking about how I'm, trying to apply for jobs and stuff like that. So it was a super sweet job that a friend of ours had told me about And got all my stuff in order. Got everything looking awesome, with a lot of help. And Went to submit all of it. This was to a, one of the universities in our town.

Melissa: 02:32

Mhmm.

Jam: 02:34

And then it was very suddenly closed already. It was, like, had not been open for very many days.

Melissa: 02:39

No. Yeah. That's so sad. But I

Jam: 02:41

still had the thing, like, the page up or whatever. Like, I still had, like, the page. I had the Job in my cart or whatever.

Melissa: 02:46

Right.

Jam: 02:47

When I actually hit tried to hit submit, it said error or and it was like, it's not available anymore. So that was a huge bummer. And I was like

Melissa: 02:53

That's So sad.

Jam: 02:54

Yeah. A lot of my week last week was built around, like, getting all that stuff ready leading up to that, and then it was just a total anticlimactic Ending to it. So university, that one in the center of town, if you're listening, hire me. I'm Still here.

Melissa: 03:10

Yeah. I thought you're gonna say I'm mad at you. That's what I would've said. University, I'm mad at you.

Jam: 03:15

Well, I think this university, if they're listening, is in the position to They're they've got all the power. So

Melissa: 03:20

That's true.

Jam: 03:21

I could be mad. I could still be just willing to work for them, which I think I'm the 2nd one if we're both honest.

Melissa: 03:25

Yeah. That's true. That's true. Not worth it to be mad. So that was just sad.

Jam: 03:29

Yeah. Yeah. So that was my week. No.

Melissa: 03:31

Not sad.

Jam: 03:31

I'm so sorry. That's alright. I'm over it now. I mean, sort of.

Melissa: 03:34

You're, like, I'm over it. I don't I'm not mad.

Jam: 03:36

Well, I still did the I found out, like, who I think the supervisor is, and I sent them my stuff.

Melissa: 03:41

So Nice.

Jam: 03:42

So I I there's still a chance. It's not it could be, like, A to be continued kinda thing Right. Which would be pretty sweet, but I don't know.

Melissa: 03:49

Well, my week was not like that. I have the opposite of your not working issue where I worked constantly. Uh-huh.

Jam: 03:59

Uh-huh.

Melissa: 03:59

But there's something that's making me very happy right now, and I'm gonna tell you what it is. Okay. It's something in the air. You can feel it coming. It's the best time of the year.

Jam: 04:12

It's the most wonderful time.

Melissa: 04:16

Yes. Exactly. So I

Jam: 04:18

Christmas.

Melissa: 04:18

Love no. Oh. This is not right, Jam. It's not Christmas.

Jam: 04:23

Oh, okay.

Melissa: 04:23

Every year around this time, a podcast that I love Called Spooked comes out. Oh. And this is the this is what hearkens the coming of my favorite 6 months of the year. Uh-huh. My favorite half of the year.

Melissa: 04:37

Uh-huh. So first come spooked. It's 13 weeks before Halloween. It's a spooky Episode that comes out once a week until Halloween

Jam: 04:44

Got it.

Melissa: 04:45

For 13 weeks. After Spooch comes out, this is when I know everything exciting is about to happen. The weather starts getting cooler. Mhmm. Hockey season starts.

Melissa: 04:54

Uh-huh. That's, like, my favorite. Uh-huh. After hockey season starts, Then Halloween comes. I love Halloween.

Melissa: 05:00

I didn't used to care about Halloween, but my friend in college got me really into it. Uh-huh. I started to realize how fun it was to dress up Rosie the Riveter or Mario or, you know, a golden snitch, whatever it is. And so Halloween is coming. And then after Halloween, it's gonna get even colder, and I can wear all my cute sweaters and comfy clothes.

Melissa: 05:20

And I love that season.

Jam: 05:21

Dude, I like that too. I'm I'm not gonna be wearing as many cute sweaters and stuff like that, but I do like the changing of the seasons. I like whenever Just things change, and it's like, okay. I can wear something different or just start looking different outside. I I'm with you.

Jam: 05:34

Mhmm. So I'm excited about that.

Melissa: 05:35

Well, think you just like when things change in general, like, then you're happy about summer coming back, but I'm not. We'll get to that.

Jam: 05:41

Oh, wait. I'm not happy about summer coming back.

Melissa: 05:42

Oh, you're not?

Jam: 05:43

Oh, okay. Is, like, probably the least Favorite of mine.

Melissa: 05:45

Yeah. I hate all of that. Yeah. Well, so that's what I was about to say. Uh-huh.

Melissa: 05:48

After it gets cold, then it's Thanksgiving with your family, and then it stays cold. And then it's Christmas Yep. Which I do love, And then it still stays cold for several more months, and then it's my birthday, and then it's spring break, and then I hate everything after that. Yeah. I mean, it's exciting if the Dallas Stars get into the playoffs, but That's not a guarantee, and it's just getting hotter.

Melissa: 06:06

And the end is just coming and all that's sad.

Jam: 06:08

So, basically, it's a big chunk of the year that we're just kinda waiting for Good to be over.

Melissa: 06:13

That's what I do from roughly April until

Jam: 06:17

Now ish.

Melissa: 06:17

Now ish. Yeah. Yep. So I'm really happy because I can feel that The anticipation of autumn coming is it's tingling all around me. I can feel it.

Melissa: 06:28

It's very close.

Jam: 06:30

Yeah. I think I can feel it too.

Melissa: 06:31

Well, it won't be too long before your wife just starts lighting fall scented candles all over the house.

Jam: 06:35

She actually has already started doing that.

Melissa: 06:37

So I

Jam: 06:37

should've I should've known.

Melissa: 06:38

That's how you could feel it too. Okay.

Jam: 06:42

Baking soda, baking powder.

Melissa: 06:44

Baking powder. Do you know what the purpose of both of those things are in baking? Why do people put those in? If you watch The Great British Bake Off, you should know.

Jam: 06:53

I have never watched that. Oh, okay. Do not.

Melissa: 06:56

That's a mistake. Jake. Am I right? Population?

Jam: 07:00

I'm trying to think if they have any guesses at all. When have I used baking soda? Baking soda is the volcano one.

Melissa: 07:10

Yes. But what does it do in baking? That's a re that's good. We're gonna get to that. You're jumping ahead.

Jam: 07:16

I didn't mean to ask. It's, like, the only association that that comes to mind.

Melissa: 07:19

Okay. Then I'll just cut you this and let you know. Alright. So it is in the volcano. We'll definitely do that.

Melissa: 07:24

What they do In cookies and cakes and all that Uh-huh. Is there a rising agent? They are what causes the cakes to rise. Both of them are. Woah.

Melissa: 07:35

They cause the cakes to rise and get fluffy cakes and bakes to get fluffy and delicious.

Jam: 07:41

Okay.

Melissa: 07:42

Okay. Not I guess the other flavors make them delicious, but that's what they do.

Jam: 07:46

Uh-huh.

Melissa: 07:46

The reason it causes them to rise is it's putting air bubbles into the batter.

Jam: 07:51

Interesting. Are we gonna get into a little bit of how on that? Because I have, like, a lot of questions now.

Melissa: 07:57

We definitely are. Okay. I'm glad you have a lot of questions. That's good. Yeah.

Melissa: 08:00

So we're gonna get into that. But for right now, think about your volcano reaction.

Jam: 08:05

Okay.

Melissa: 08:06

So it's Baking soda

Jam: 08:08

Mhmm.

Melissa: 08:09

And vinegar, and what happens?

Jam: 08:11

It reacts, and then it Expands or Mhmm. I guess it's a lot of bubbles too. Mhmm. Yeah. Just suddenly overflows whatever it's in no matter what.

Melissa: 08:22

Right. So that is a reaction that's happening. So right now, we're not gonna understand the difference yet. I'm just gonna tell you the bare minimum of How rising agents work, and then we're just gonna talk about the difference.

Jam: 08:34

Okay.

Melissa: 08:35

Okay. So there's a reaction that's happening when you mix Baking soda with acid. Okay. Okay. That reaction evolves gas and puts all the bubbles in.

Jam: 08:48

Okay.

Melissa: 08:49

Okay. So it happens pretty quickly when you do the volcano reaction because there's usually a lot of it. Right.

Jam: 08:55

And so

Melissa: 08:55

and it's usually in a small container. That's why it volcanoes out. Mhmm. So there's a lot of it, and it goes and comes out very quickly. That is an acid base reaction.

Jam: 09:04

Okay.

Melissa: 09:06

So do you know much about acids and bases?

Jam: 09:10

I I do from my time. Only as they apply to pools because I work at a pool store, and I tested water. So the closest it ever got to, like, actually doing the chemistry. So test waters, Like, pH and stuff like that.

Melissa: 09:25

Okay. Well, to just I mean, a very basic definition Mhmm. Is I mean, really, it's, I guess, there always just one definition is something that gives up a hydrogen plus cation. So that is basically, you know, hydrogen on the periodic table?

Jam: 09:42

Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

Melissa: 09:44

Hydrogen has 1 electron.

Jam: 09:45

Yes.

Melissa: 09:48

If you take, that 1 electron away from the hydrogen atom, that's called a proton. It's technically a cation.

Jam: 09:56

Uh-huh.

Melissa: 09:56

But it's just referred to the h plus. When you lose an electron, you're positive. Mhmm. My cousin told me this joke To remember that that you say and and Adam ran into a bar and said, I think I lost an electron. And the bartender says, are you positive?

Melissa: 10:11

That's what you remember. So it's just basically a hydrogen atom that's lost its 1 electron, so it's positive and leaves a proton is what we call it.

Jam: 10:20

Okay.

Melissa: 10:21

So an acid is something that can give up that proton. Okay. And a base is something that can take that proton.

Jam: 10:27

Oh, interesting.

Melissa: 10:28

So it's usually represented in, science as basically an h plus moving from 1 molecule to another molecule.

Jam: 10:36

Wait. It can give up okay. I'm turning my head around it. So hydrogen wants to have One electron?

Melissa: 10:46

Hydrogen naturally has 1 electron. Uh-huh.

Jam: 10:48

And I'm not Totally understand the definition yet. Only because I I think in my head, acids are I don't really have an understanding what a base is so much in my, like, everyday life.

Melissa: 10:59

Very normal. Yeah.

Jam: 11:00

But Acids. I'm like, oh, dude. This stuff, like, that burns

Melissa: 11:03

or

Jam: 11:03

it's like Mhmm. Like, kind of intense, or things are, like, a little bit acidic where it's like you can almost kind of Feel it or taste it depending on the food or whatever. And so that's, like, where the word acid has mostly been applied In my life Right. And pool chemicals.

Melissa: 11:19

Yes. So probably the rest of the world wouldn't have that pool chemical experience. But A lot of times, actually, bases are also that caustic burn can hurt you. So Uh-huh. Try to take what you know about acids or acidity And put it away.

Jam: 11:34

Okay.

Melissa: 11:36

Just don't think about it now. Mhmm. Mhmm. And think about this new science definition.

Jam: 11:41

Okay.

Melissa: 11:42

So it's just a hydrogen atom

Jam: 11:44

Mhmm.

Melissa: 11:44

That's lost its electrons

Jam: 11:46

Okay.

Melissa: 11:47

Moving back and forth, kind of.

Jam: 11:49

Okay.

Melissa: 11:49

The acid will send it over to the base. Mhmm. More accurately, the base will take it away from the acid.

Jam: 11:57

Okay.

Melissa: 11:58

So does Is that driving with you? Can you say it back to me one more time?

Jam: 12:01

So an acid so there's high in every in every acid, there's hydrogen? Uh-uh.

Melissa: 12:11

In the definition of acid and base that we're using that Yes. There are hydrogen atoms on the molecule that are willing to be given up. Yes.

Jam: 12:24

So not every so not don't I shouldn't make it that broad reaching. So in this scenario, the acid we're talking about that has hydrogen atoms in the molecule, acid has the oh, it's it's electron. That hydrogen has its electron taken away.

Melissa: 12:42

No. Oh, no. Okay. So, really, what happens is Mhmm. The base has an abundance of electrons.

Jam: 12:51

Okay. Okay.

Melissa: 12:52

So a good way to think about it is those electrons come over

Jam: 12:57

Mhmm.

Melissa: 12:58

And they nab the hydrogen without that electrons. The hydrogen Already has those stay behind. So it just takes the, basically, the proton of the hydrogen and leaves the electrons behind.

Jam: 13:12

Okay. Okay.

Melissa: 13:13

So that's an h plus. It's that's what it's called. Something that loses its electrons becomes positive. So it's just a hydrogen that's lost 1 electron.

Jam: 13:22

Okay.

Melissa: 13:23

So it takes a hydrogen without the electron

Jam: 13:25

Mhmm.

Melissa: 13:26

And that's what happens.

Jam: 13:30

Okay.

Melissa: 13:32

I don't know what I thought I was gonna say, but that's it.

Jam: 13:34

Okay.

Melissa: 13:35

So it's just that h plus moving. The acid gives Away the h plus, and the base takes the h plus. The a acid gives away the hydrogen Uh-huh. But keeps its electrons. And the base takes the hydrogen with None of it.

Melissa: 13:49

The original electron.

Jam: 13:50

Okay. Sweet. So so?

Melissa: 13:55

Mhmm.

Jam: 13:56

Electrons. Keeps the electrons.

Melissa: 13:57

Yes.

Jam: 13:58

Base has the positive. The proton

Melissa: 14:01

Takes the positive. Takes. So the base takes. The base starts out very negative, and that's why it wants the positive from that.

Jam: 14:07

Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

Melissa: 14:08

From that asset.

Jam: 14:09

Okay.

Melissa: 14:10

Can you say that one more time?

Jam: 14:11

So a Base. Mhmm. It starts out pretty negative.

Melissa: 14:18

Yes.

Jam: 14:18

And so it wants this positivity.

Melissa: 14:20

Yes.

Jam: 14:21

And so it's like, Give me the proton

Melissa: 14:25

Uh-huh.

Jam: 14:26

Or I'll be mad or whatever. So it takes the the Proton from this hydrogen Mhmm. Leaving electrons, so it's taking just an h plus.

Melissa: 14:37

Yes.

Jam: 14:38

And then the electrons are left behind, Yes. Is an acid.

Melissa: 14:42

The acid was what it starts out as.

Jam: 14:44

It already was an acid. Mhmm.

Melissa: 14:45

Okay. So everything you said was right. It takes the protons. Uh-huh. It leaves it takes the proton.

Melissa: 14:53

It leaves the electrons behind on what used to be the acid.

Jam: 14:57

Okay.

Melissa: 14:58

The new name of that is conjugate base. That doesn't really matter.

Jam: 15:02

Okay.

Melissa: 15:02

But it starts out as an acid because it has that proton that's It's willing to lose.

Jam: 15:08

Okay.

Melissa: 15:08

And the base is the negative one. Mhmm. Takes the proton, leaving behind the electrons and creating Turning the acid from an acid into a conjugate base.

Jam: 15:17

Okay.

Melissa: 15:17

That doesn't that last part doesn't matter a lot, but it seemed like you were getting caught

Jam: 15:21

up on that.

Melissa: 15:21

So the acid is what it starts as. Does that make sense? Yes. You think you got it?

Jam: 15:25

I think so.

Melissa: 15:26

You know what an asset and a base it are now?

Jam: 15:28

Yes. Although yeah. It feels A little bit not related yet to real life, but hopefully that'll change.

Melissa: 15:34

Well, hopefully, it will change because when you add the vinegar And the baking soda together. Now remember, we were talking about baking soda?

Jam: 15:42

Yes.

Melissa: 15:43

When you add those 2 things together, that reaction is happening.

Jam: 15:47

Okay.

Melissa: 15:47

The vinegar Has protons. Mhmm. That's what makes it acidic. That's what gives it that acidic flavor. Uh-huh.

Melissa: 15:55

The base, That's the baking soda is very negative, and it wants to take the protons from the from the vinegar. Uh-huh. In that reaction, as that's happening, it creates air bubbles.

Jam: 16:10

Okay.

Melissa: 16:10

Now this isn't very important unless you're just really interested Mhmm. In chemistry, which hopefully you are from listening to this. But just so you know what gas it is and how that all happens. Uh-huh. Why are you soiling?

Jam: 16:23

I was just thinking about how, like, they wouldn't have even clicked on this. It's, like, so clear this is a chemistry podcast. Like, whoever's listening would not

Melissa: 16:30

have I guess it's Just like this isn't crucial, but this explains why it gives off Yeah. Gas, what gas it is in this case. So baking soda Mhmm. The formula of the atoms Uh-huh. Is 1 hydrogen, 1 carbon, and 3 oxygens.

Jam: 16:46

Okay.

Melissa: 16:47

Okay. When it gets another proton

Jam: 16:49

Mhmm.

Melissa: 16:50

It becomes 2 hydrogens, 1 carbon, and 3 oxygens. It just takes that hydrogen. H goes from being h c o 3 to h two c o 3.

Jam: 17:02

Okay.

Melissa: 17:03

So 2 hydrogens. Yeah. When you have that, It will break up into water and CO 2. Do you know what CO 2 is?

Jam: 17:12

Carbon dioxide.

Melissa: 17:13

Yes. Okay. So h 2 c o 3. If you write those out and move them around, they will rearrange to h 2 o and c o 2. You have enough atoms of all those to make that.

Melissa: 17:28

And so that will naturally happen. After the baking soda gets a proton, it will break apart into H two o and c o two.

Jam: 17:37

Okay.

Melissa: 17:38

C o two is a gas. Yeah. Those are little bubbles that you're seeing.

Jam: 17:41

Got it. And that's c o two is carbonation. Yes?

Melissa: 17:48

Okay. Well, we're not there yet. That's another lesson for another time. Sorry. That's a good idea.

Jam: 17:53

I know where that is.

Melissa: 17:55

Yes. That is in something else, and I have that on our list to talk about.

Jam: 17:59

Okay. So you're combining these 2 things, Vinegar.

Melissa: 18:02

Honey. Yes.

Jam: 18:03

And baking soda.

Melissa: 18:05

Baking soda.

Jam: 18:05

And it reacts. Mhmm. One of the things that happens is that it takes I can't wait. The vinegar is the one that's taking.

Melissa: 18:15

The vinegar is the acid.

Jam: 18:16

Yeah. No. It's giving. The baking soda is one that's taking

Melissa: 18:19

Mhmm.

Jam: 18:20

And it takes a hydrogen

Melissa: 18:21

Mhmm. From Well, a proton because

Jam: 18:23

it does proton.

Melissa: 18:24

Take it takes a hydrogen without the electron, so that's key.

Jam: 18:27

But it does end up having a effect on the makeup with the leftover stuff.

Melissa: 18:31

But still a hydrogen. Yeah.

Jam: 18:32

Yeah. It takes a hydrogen without the electron. Mhmm. And then that changes the, 1, while that's all happening, air or bubbles of gas Mhmm. Are created, Just carbon dioxide because the main letters, which is 1 hydrogen

Melissa: 18:49

Mhmm.

Jam: 18:50

1 carbon Mhmm. And 2 oxygens?

Melissa: 18:53

3 oxygens. Because it has to give 1 oxygen h two o and keep 2 oxygens behind for c o two.

Jam: 18:59

So baking soda starts out as One carbon

Melissa: 19:03

Mhmm.

Jam: 19:04

1 hydrogen

Melissa: 19:05

Mhmm.

Jam: 19:06

And 3 oxygens.

Melissa: 19:07

Yes.

Jam: 19:07

And then when the whole reaction's happening With the vinegar

Melissa: 19:12

Mhmm.

Jam: 19:13

It takes a hydrogen minus electron.

Melissa: 19:16

Yes.

Jam: 19:17

And then because of that, And the things get reconfigured.

Melissa: 19:20

Mhmm.

Jam: 19:21

We were aware the letters of the different elements that are there Mhmm. One of them becomes c o 2, I mean Mhmm. Which is the gas that starts bubbling Yes. Like crazy. Yep.

Jam: 19:30

The other one's just basically water.

Melissa: 19:31

It is water.

Jam: 19:32

H two o. Yep. And then there's, like, it's all going on all at once. Mhmm. But that's like

Melissa: 19:37

Yeah. And, really, scientists know a lot, but it's hard to say. I don't know if they've looked into exactly how this happens. Uh-huh. I would assume that before it breaks up, first, it becomes h two c o three, and then it breaks up.

Melissa: 19:52

Uh-huh. So I'm sure I could look into that and find out if that happens in that order or if it some other mechanism happens where Immediately, it forms the other 2, but it doesn't matter a ton. K. I it is my instinct But the h two c o three forms, and then the h two c o three breaks up very quickly into h two o and c o two.

Jam: 20:14

Okay.

Melissa: 20:16

And we can put that on there so that, we can put that on there. We can put that on Instagram Uh-huh. So that you guys can see. And Twitter. Love my Twitter peeps my tweeeps.

Melissa: 20:26

You can see sort of how the h two c o three breaks into h two o and c o two. I think it'll be easier when you can see those letters spelled out.

Jam: 20:36

Yeah.

Melissa: 20:36

So and you don't really have to worry about the bond breaking or how they rearrange unless you wanna Go into science class. You'll learn all about that. It doesn't matter a ton. All you need to know is that happens, and that's how gas is formed. Mhmm.

Melissa: 20:50

Okay. Got it. So if you so you got it. You know what happens with a vinegar reaction.

Jam: 20:57

Mhmm.

Melissa: 20:58

Now if you put that base into your baked goods Uh-huh. With something acidic, like, say, if you're making a lemon cake.

Jam: 21:05

Mhmm.

Melissa: 21:06

Lemon juice is acidic. It's got those protons going on. Yeah. So you put baking soda and lemon juice and everything else in your batter, And then you pop it in the oven. That reaction is happening much slower or not much slower, but it's less violent, less intense because it's not as much stuff.

Melissa: 21:23

It's just a little bit of the baking soda, a little bit of the lemon juice, and they're not as close to each other or any of that.

Jam: 21:30

Which is kind of good because you want, like, a volcano of

Melissa: 21:34

Of a cake.

Jam: 21:34

In your oven. So

Melissa: 21:36

And as you add heat, usually reactions happen faster. So I would assume So what happens? You put all that batter in. It's probably a reaction's already starting to happen. You can usually see a little bit of bubbles in your batter before you put it in the oven.

Melissa: 21:49

Right?

Jam: 21:49

Interesting.

Melissa: 21:50

Can you think of that? Can you think of seeing that? If you've made a cake from scratch

Jam: 21:53

I think I've just thought of it as, like, things settling. But yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Melissa: 21:57

I have 1 lemon cake that I make that that bubble starts straight away. And that means that it's kind of on a timer. You gotta get it in that oven quick because reaction's already happening. Uh-huh. So that's happening.

Melissa: 22:11

But as it bakes and that moisture is leaving in everything, the the air bubbles leave little gaps

Jam: 22:16

Mhmm.

Melissa: 22:16

In the batter So that causes there to be little those little air holes in your cake that make it light and fluffy.

Jam: 22:24

Nice. That's very Interesting. Because I just trying to go off of just intuition as a

Melissa: 22:30

Mhmm.

Jam: 22:30

Layman. Mhmm. The idea of putting some powder into A batter Mhmm. Would, in my mind, just make it thicker. Mhmm.

Jam: 22:38

Like, I would just think, like, this is just gonna get thicker. It's just going to.

Melissa: 22:42

That's what flour does.

Jam: 22:43

Right. Right. Right. It's my why because, like, oh, yeah. Yeah.

Jam: 22:46

It's like assuming that all powders are gonna perform like flour will.

Melissa: 22:48

Right.

Jam: 22:49

But it just would be my assumption without understanding what's going on. Even so, like, even if someone told me, like, over and over and over, like, this is what's gonna happen is gonna get fluffier Mhmm. It wouldn't just start making sense to me just because someone keeps saying that unless they explain it.

Melissa: 23:02

Well and if there's no acid present and you just throw some baking soda in and you don't give it anything to react with, it will do that. It'll leave a baking soda flavor and thicken up your batter, and it'll be gross.

Jam: 23:15

So does that flavor not Is that flavor a lot less prominent when you actually do have something acidic?

Melissa: 23:20

Yeah. Because the baking soda's gone. It's become c o two and h two o l. Wow. Which are basically flavorless.

Melissa: 23:27

One's gas, and one's water. Yeah. So now that's baking soda. We've been talking about baking soda this Whole time.

Jam: 23:34

Okay.

Melissa: 23:35

What do you think baking powder is?

Jam: 23:37

Is baking powder the opposite?

Melissa: 23:40

Like, it would be acid, you mean?

Jam: 23:42

Yeah. Is it acid?

Melissa: 23:43

No. But that is I mean, kind of. That's, like, smart a smart thing that you're like, I'm just gonna add powdered acid, and then it'll be basic. No. It is already the acid and the base mixed together.

Melissa: 23:54

But because they're mixed together in the dry form, they are not able to react. Do they need a method to move around together and interact? I mean, there might be a very little. I don't know how that would happen, but usually reactions seem to happen With some kind of medium for them to interact with each other. So they put the acid in the base.

Melissa: 24:11

It's baking soda with an acidic powder. I think it's, like, cream of tartar or something Together in there, and then when you put it in and add your liquid, it starts reacting.

Jam: 24:21

That is incredible. I wish you guys could see my face right now.

Melissa: 24:24

His face is Like, as if he's being washed over with knowledge. Just amazed.

Jam: 24:30

It's like someone just, like, labeling knowledge on top of my brain and Starting to soak in.

Melissa: 24:34

Or someone turned on the light and he saw a room for the 1st time. Yeah. Like, oh, this is what the world looks like.

Jam: 24:40

Room of snow?

Melissa: 24:41

Yeah. I don't know why is internal lines are a room. Like, you could've, like, walked outside of the prison and seen grass. Yeah.

Jam: 24:47

That's true. It's like, woah.

Melissa: 24:48

Structures. Yes. Wow.

Jam: 24:51

But seriously I didn't know. That is genius. The idea that, like, like well, Emerson's thinking like, wow. Okay. That's kinda cool because baking soda, I guess, if you happen to you're making a cake that's already acidic.

Jam: 25:00

Mhmm. I guess it'd be helpful. Mhmm. But I was kinda thinking, like, well, I guess there's a lot of reasons that that won't apply. Like, a lot of Right.

Jam: 25:05

Recipes where I'm not gonna be able to use the fluffy Yes. Like, You know, tool Uh-huh. Niceness of baking soda. But then just as I was kind of that was sinking in, you're like, but wait.

Melissa: 25:18

There's more.

Jam: 25:19

There's more. Because that's genius.

Melissa: 25:22

Yeah. They're so people are so smart. I don't know who came up with baking powder, but, like, That's amazing that someone thought to do that.

Jam: 25:30

Yeah. That really is amazing.

Melissa: 25:31

So cool. So I will say this.

Jam: 25:35

Okay.

Melissa: 25:36

So I was doing this, and I like to just do a little pre fact check to make sure I'm doing things right. This one I already knew. It's just in my brain from years. It's kinda hard to give credit. I don't think it's plagiarizing if you do have the knowledge from going through class.

Melissa: 25:49

But

Jam: 25:50

Mhmm. Or it's like, how could you cite every single thing that you've ever Read it or learned it.

Melissa: 25:54

Right. And

Jam: 25:55

you wouldn't even know which really thing you're actually referencing.

Melissa: 25:58

Yes. Exactly. So it's like, that's not really worth it. But Uh-huh. I was looking at Some recipe places that I like to sort of see which ones use baking powder and which ones use baking soda.

Melissa: 26:06

Uh-huh. So I knew my lemon cake. I use a lemon cake from Love Life and Sugar. It's amazing. Uh-huh.

Melissa: 26:11

And that one uses, it uses baking soda plus a little bit of baking powder.

Jam: 26:16

Mhmm.

Melissa: 26:16

Because there's not enough of the acidic lemon juice to make the whole thing bubbly. Then I went to look at Nestle chocolate chip cookies Mhmm. And they use baking soda, not baking powder, which I was really surprised by. So I Googled what's acidic in chocolate chip cookies, and Sally's Baking Addiction website told me That brown sugar is acidic. I didn't even know that.

Jam: 26:40

It's because of the molasses?

Melissa: 26:41

I don't know. I didn't look any further, but I just got really interested. I thought I went to that chocolate chip cookie recipe. 100% sure it would use baking powder, and it uses baking soda. And I thought, what?

Melissa: 26:55

So I learned something new too, and I was just excited and wanted to share. I can look into what makes brown sugar acidic, but I kinda ran I was doing something else and didn't think to go further. Isn't that crazy? I don't know.

Jam: 27:06

Is crazy. I would have thought the same thing just with my new very noob knowledge. Yeah. I would have thought, like, well, I've had many targeted cookies of all baking things. That's an area I'm a lot experienced in.

Melissa: 27:15

Mhmm. And

Jam: 27:15

I would have totally, totally thought it'd be powder and not soda. Weird.

Melissa: 27:20

You seemed so happy. Yeah. You, like, seem so happy to have learned this.

Jam: 27:24

I think I I started getting a little bit, like, not as hopeful that I was gonna have an uh-huh. I was like, oh my gosh. I just gotta get through this and, like, remember this stuff. I'm struggling. And then it started making sense, and then I got it.

Jam: 27:37

And then you blew my mind. And then so now I'm, like, excited because it there's a point where I was, like, not feeling confident about my learning ability. I was like, oh gosh.

Melissa: 27:45

Yeah. And that's probably a little bit on me too because I thought, Oh, explaining acids and bases is gonna be so easy, but it's always interesting to me. It's just a Fun challenge for me to have to learn a new way to explain something because I'm so deep in it. I think I can do a pretty good job of pulling myself out and

Jam: 28:03

Yeah.

Melissa: 28:04

Trying to see it from a nonchemist perspective, but I am so in it. There are some things that I think are just basic knowledge that are not

Jam: 28:11

And it's crazy. Be based knowledge for any chemist. It's like Right. That was, like, years ago for you. Mhmm.

Melissa: 28:15

I mean, 14 years ago

Jam: 28:17

Yeah.

Melissa: 28:18

Since I was in high school.

Jam: 28:19

Yeah. Whereas, like, maybe Whereas, like, it was a base building block for many of us probably at some point in school or whatever, but it wasn't basic building block enough for life that it just Got forgotten or left or never really understood in the 1st place.

Melissa: 28:40

Yeah. It was fun. That was a fun one. It was a fun, interesting challenge. Okay.

Melissa: 28:44

Well, now just because it was a little confusing at the beginning, I want you to go all the way back to the beginning, do a quick quick explanation. It doesn't really have to be quick, but do a quick overview.

Jam: 28:53

Okay.

Melissa: 28:54

And, tell me everything that you learned as if I'm someone that didn't already know it. And, you guys, jam made me this Cold brew coffee? No. It's not cold brew. Jam made me this iced coffee.

Melissa: 29:07

He he made one for me and one for his wife, Emily, And it is so tasty. He's very good at coffee. I am really enjoying this. So I'm looking forward to Being able to here's can you hear the Yeah.

Jam: 29:22

I'm It's going through.

Melissa: 29:23

Looking forward to being able to drink this delightful drink while I learn.

Jam: 29:29

Okay. So from the very beginning

Melissa: 29:31

From the very beginning.

Jam: 29:33

Acids and bases are different. Mhmm.

Melissa: 29:38

That's that's true.

Jam: 29:40

Okay. 1 for 1. Bases take away The in this scenario, take away the hydrogen.

Melissa: 29:52

I I should clarify that. There are different definitions of acid and base. Mhmm. This is 1. This is the general one that most people think of when they think of acids and bases.

Melissa: 30:03

Mhmm. There are other definitions that different types of chemists use. It doesn't matter a lot. I just didn't want you to think I wanted you to have the whole picture.

Jam: 30:14

Okay.

Melissa: 30:15

So it's not it's not a big deal that you have to say in this scenario. This is the most common type Okay. Or definition of acid.

Jam: 30:21

Yeah. Bases a base takes away the hydrogen and, but leaves the electron, the 1 electron the hydrogen has.

Melissa: 30:35

Yeah. That's really important.

Jam: 30:37

And so then it has it takes this positive hydrogen

Melissa: 30:40

Mhmm.

Jam: 30:41

And leaves that electron. So then the the the acid has these electrons that are extra or something like that. Mhmm.

Melissa: 30:49

Yeah. Now the acid has become basic.

Jam: 30:52

Mhmm. And then the base has taken on these positive Yes. Hydrogens? You

Melissa: 30:58

should make it neutral.

Jam: 31:01

So in the case of, like, vinegar and baking soda, it when that happens, the Baking soda

Melissa: 31:11

Mhmm.

Jam: 31:12

Is taking on those hydrogens

Melissa: 31:15

Mhmm.

Jam: 31:16

And it changes, in in that reaction, what's going on, it see, the things are reconfigured, the elements reconfigured and stuff like that

Melissa: 31:25

Yeah.

Jam: 31:26

Which Creates CO 2, which is bubbles, which causes that, like, expansive explosiveness Yeah. And water. So then The original makeup, which is 1 carbon

Melissa: 31:37

Mhmm.

Jam: 31:38

1 hydrogen Mhmm. And 3 oxygens

Melissa: 31:40

Mhmm.

Jam: 31:41

Becomes Carbon with 2 oxygens, better known as carbon dioxide. Yep. And 2 hydrogens and an oxygen

Melissa: 31:49

Mhmm.

Jam: 31:50

Which is h two o, which is water.

Melissa: 31:52

Right.

Jam: 31:54

So that's happening in that volcano scenario.

Melissa: 31:56

Mhmm.

Jam: 31:57

When it comes down to baking

Melissa: 31:59

Mhmm.

Jam: 32:00

Take the baking soda still from the volcano.

Melissa: 32:02

Yes.

Jam: 32:02

Put that into something that's already acidic like the lemon cake.

Melissa: 32:06

Mhmm. It

Jam: 32:06

does the same thing Where it it reacts, creates carbon dioxide and water. Mhmm. So the baking soda itself stops kind of existing as we know it. Yep. It doesn't leave a flavor.

Jam: 32:17

And because of the it's having slower, not as fast as and explosive as the volcano. It creates

Melissa: 32:25

Tasty chocolate cake volcano.

Jam: 32:27

Yeah. That

Melissa: 32:28

would be crazy. Yeah.

Jam: 32:29

It creates because of the air bubbles or not air bubbles, the, carbon dioxide bubbles

Melissa: 32:36

Right.

Jam: 32:38

Are make the cake fluffier. That happens slowly while the thing's cooking. Mhmm. And so it's like, just slow that way down and make it way less violent.

Melissa: 32:47

Mhmm.

Jam: 32:47

And it creates a fluffiness rather than, like, a Foamy liquidiness.

Melissa: 32:53

Mhmm.

Jam: 32:55

But then things got crazier because people figured out how to make baking powder.

Melissa: 33:00

Mhmm.

Jam: 33:00

Which is like don't worry about whether you're trying to make a cake that already has acidity in it, like a lemon cake or whatever.

Melissa: 33:07

Right.

Jam: 33:07

This thing is already the full package.

Melissa: 33:09

Yeah.

Jam: 33:10

It's got acid and base. Mhmm. And you just put it in there. And because it's gonna get wet and whatever else And dissolve into something while you're baking it. It's gonna have the same reaction without already having to be acidic.

Melissa: 33:25

Yes.

Jam: 33:26

And it's gonna make your Baked good or whatever, fluffy.

Melissa: 33:29

Your cakes and bakes, fluffy.

Jam: 33:31

Is that right?

Melissa: 33:32

That is correct.

Jam: 33:34

Oh, man. That man, what a test.

Melissa: 33:37

This is a good one. This is a shout out to I should've done I should've said this in the beginning, but I didn't. Part of what inspired this is the new season of Great British Bake Off has come out.

Jam: 33:50

Uh-huh.

Melissa: 33:50

And, normally, we in America have to wait 6 or 8 months Uh-huh. To get it. And maybe it's not that long, but that's how it feels. And now they're Netflix is releasing it by episode every week, so we only have to wait, like, 3 days.

Jam: 34:05

Interesting.

Melissa: 34:06

So this is a shout out to The Great British Bake Off and, cakes and bakes. It's it's all very exciting.

Jam: 34:13

Woah.

Melissa: 34:14

And I am a baker, so I can put Some pictures of my cake online for

Jam: 34:19

You should. I've had some of these cakes without knowing any of the chemistry behind them. I've had some of them. And with no Real credentials or knowledge? I can attest they are delicious.

Melissa: 34:28

Yay. I'm so glad you think so. Also, I wanna give you the UK a shout out because we have, Like, 75 downloads there.

Jam: 34:36

Yeah. They're, like, making up a a sizable percentage.

Melissa: 34:39

They are. And Canada, My people in Canada Uh-huh. Are killing it. We have, I think, a 100 downloads in Canada. They're the 1st country.

Melissa: 34:47

If they haven't already, they will be the 1st country to reach triple digits.

Jam: 34:51

2nd country.

Melissa: 34:52

Oh, besides us. Yeah. I wasn't counting the states. I meant the 1st country outside of us.

Jam: 34:57

Who we are. Yeah. Yeah. 1st country outside of us. Yes.

Jam: 35:00

Dude, Canada.

Melissa: 35:01

I don't count us as a country.

Jam: 35:03

Yeah. We used to be, but, you know, not so much anymore. Canada, head us up, dude.

Melissa: 35:08

Yeah. Canada, I love you. I just look up pictures of places in Canada to be happy. Yeah. So Canada, And you've got my favorite sport.

Melissa: 35:17

I just have so much to thank you for.

Jam: 35:19

Thanks, Canada.

Melissa: 35:20

Thanks, Canada. And thanks all of you guys for listening And for learning about chemistry this week.

Jam: 35:26

Melissa and I have a lot of ideas of topics of chemistry in everyday life, but we do wanna hear from you, about thoughts, Ideas or questions you might have from your everyday life that you wanna know the chemistry behind. So hit us up on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, or gmail@kemforyourlife. That's kem, f o r, your life, to share your thoughts and ideas. And if you enjoy the podcast, you can subscribe on any Podcast app, your favorite one, your least favorite one, whatever. And if you really like it yeah.

Jam: 35:53

If you really like it, you can write us for a review on Apple Podcasts. That'll help us to share this podcast with even more people.

Melissa: 35:58

This episode of Chemistry For Your Life was created by Melissa Collini and J. M. Robinson. J. M.

Melissa: 36:03

Robinson is our producer, and we'd like to give a special thanks to A. Kiewasong and V. Who reviewed this episode?