To Coug or Not To Coug

In this episode, Jen shares the juicy details of her oftentimes wild personal life as she explores whether or not she is a cougar, the popularly defined 40-plus-year-old woman who dates men who are at least 10 years younger. If you've been labeled with this sexist term send us your feedback as we work to redefine what it means to age and thrive in a society that would prefer we grow old "gracefully."

What is Juicy Bits?

We created Juicy Bits because we wanted to continue the conversations that we start out on the trail and on the chair lift. Hosted by our CEO Jen Gurecki and Ambassador Jillian Raymond, they talk candidly about everything from dude soup, to sex, to politics, to equity in the outdoors. We occasionally (read: frequently) drop F-bombs, interview some of the most interesting people in the outdoors and beyond, and say things that many of us think but don’t feel comfortable saying out loud. If you are easily offended or looking for something that is G Rated, this is not the podcast for you. But if you love truth-telling and irreverence, get ready to laugh, cry, and maybe pee your pants a little bit. 

Participant #1:
Hello and welcome. I'm Jillian Raymond, the co creator of Juicy Bits and a coalition snow ambassador. And I'm Jen Gorecki, your co host and the CEO of Coalition and Snow. For those of you who are new, get ready to laugh, cry, and maybe pee your pants. A little Juicy Bits is about taking the conversations that we start on the chairlift and at the trailhead and bringing them to you to explore alternative narratives that challenge the status quo about what it means to be a modern woman in the outdoors. Grab your helmet, because sometimes it's a bumpy ride. Fyi friends, this podcast is for mature audiences, so you've been warned. Let's get to work and juice the patriarchy. We would be remiss to not discuss the leaked brief from the Supreme Court suggesting that they will overturn Roe versus Wade. This will be one of many times that we will mention how critically important it is to vote, because we have midterm elections coming up in November. And if we get to the point in 2026 that we elect a Republican President and we have a Republican Senate, and we have a Republican House, that is the scenario in which abortion will be banned across this nation. So there are actually things that we can do. And one of the easiest things that we can do is we can go out and vote for candidates who support reproductive rights. And it's not even voting Democrat or Republican. It's voting for candidates who are committed and have a history of voting this way. And we need to ensure that we have elected officials who represent the opinion of the majority of Americans, which is that abortion should be safe and legal. Because right now we have a Supreme Court that seems to fucking miss the point that most Americans are just fine with abortion because we put that fucking argument put to bed a long time ago. So, friends, get ready to gear up for a big election cycle. Think about the organizations that you can donate to. Think about if you live in a safe haven state like Nevada, where I live, where we border, so many States that could have trigger laws come into effect. And what you can do and let us not continue to think about what ifs and to live in a world of this is happening. And there's action that we can take. And it's going to require a lot more than us simply marching and yelling. We're going to actually need to mobilize people and put money toward things, and we will need to do that, because that is certainly one of the most pressing issues of our time right now is to ensure that reproductive health and that reproductive health as a human right continues to exist in the United States. Jaguar Puma Tiger Sabertooth Lion S Lioness Cougar Coug that's you right, Jeff Coog. According to Married Girlfriend, I am a Cougar. And so we are dedicating this episode of Juicy Bits to unpacking the concept of the Cougar. And whether or not I am actually a Cougar, that is what we are going to talk about today. This is a good time to turn off Juicy Bits. If you don't want to hear anything about my dating life or sex or anything, this would be a good time to just hit just move on, because that's what we're going to talk about. But this is going to be a good one because there's so many things that go into this whole concept of constructing the Cougar, and we're going to get into all of them. Julian, do you think I'm a Cougar?

Participant #1:
I'm like, yes and no. And again, to our listeners, sorry. And you're welcome. Because here's the thing. I feel like as a competent woman in her 40s who's happily married with a satisfying sex life, I can feel sexy as F, right? And then I get Mammed, and I'm like, you fucker. Way to knock me down, like five pegs. So I'm like anything with language, Jen. I'm like, if you want to be a Cougar, you're a fucking Cougar. But then I'm like, I'm not sure what it is. So I think a Cougar older woman, maybe help me out. I'm sure you researched it when it came across your desk. So give me a little because I'm kind of blinking. I'm like, is it a negative connotation? There's always fucking something negative about it because it's women in their 40s, so it's got to be in 50s. Exactly. So we're all on the same page. And then I'll answer your question, and I might actually might not answer it towards the end or I might not be able to, but let's get on the same page here. Okay. So in all the Googling that I've done, Cougars are women in there. I have spent far too much time on this subject. Also, again, this is how you end up watching porn at 02:00 P.m. On a Tuesday because of the things you Google to prepare for Juicy Bits. A Cougar is a woman in her 40s or 50s who actively chases after younger men and will use the tactics of young men who are always on the prowl for women like a Cougar. A woman in her 40s or 50s uses those same tactics that younger men do historically. It's not the nicest thing to say about an older woman. I think also, as we continue on in this evolution of sexuality and aging, it's not the worst thing, right? I think there's certainly an opportunity to be like, Fuck, Yeah, I'm a Cougar.

Participant #1:
Okay. Am I a woman in my 40s or 50s? Yes. Okay. Do I date people who are much younger than me? According to Google, all the dumb shit I read on Google, which, by the way, is almost all written by young men, which is telling there's at least an eight year difference between the older woman and the younger man. Is that true? Check. Also yes. So I have those two things that would line me up as a Cougar. Now do I chase them? That is a hard no. Let's be really clear here. They all chase me. They all chase me, they meet me and they're like, yes, I want more of this. I am super upfront about my age. I do think that if you just saw me, you wouldn't necessarily think I'm in my forty s. I think I passed for mid 30s. But my age doesn't really seem to deter these young people. It just seems to get them a little bit more riled up, perhaps because older women there's also a stereotype that older women are really good in bed because we know more. Also. Check. True, yes. But yeah, I feel like I lean on the am I a woman in her 40s who has sex with younger people? Yes. But I don't chase after them. I'm not on the prowl. I'm actually have been super happy just doing my own thing and like not even dating. And then the minute I got back into the swing of things there, they all were just like lining up. So that's how I answer no, not necessarily. Hard no, because I do have a few checks, but I don't like, are you a Cougar? If young people chase after you, that is not really being answered on Google. Now wouldn't that be fascinating to actually provide something that would only get instead of having like 74,000 hits on it? It would be like we're filling the void. Breaking through the noise again, here's lady parts. So look for this in your email inbox. Right then here's part for the newsletter. Because what I picture and this is not in a demeaning way, but I think of that bar, Death and Taxes, right in Reno. It's kind of like smoky. You can't smoke in there. But I picture it kind of Smokey good drinks. And so I picture more a Cougar out there dressed beautifully, maybe elegant, with like a splash of sex appeal, looking for that younger guy at the bar who's going to use those tactics. So I feel like there's a stereotypical Cougar that the Media's played out on that television and now I'm catching myself. As I say, this is probably why I get fucking mad. I'm like, that's not how people date, right? They're not like going out and meet you. Like there's other ways that humans are interacting. So I don't think it's even just that we have to rename what does it look like when you're check yes. Check yes. Hard no to the kind of more stereotypical or generalized definition of the Cougar. But when you could be that seasoned woman in her 40s that people are chasing after you because then you don't want to be the prey. So that's my whole thing with the Cougar thing. It's kind of the predator connotation with that because I think of that a lot with language around any relationship is that if it sets up some sort of power imbalance or a dynamic that's predatory, that I think can be really damaging to both parties and all parties in all language around sexuality unless it's consensual and fun and you're dressing up, that's the whole other fur ball. So, yeah, I don't have my answer yet, but according to Google, I'm going to go no. Yeah, thank you. I did take a quiz today and it said yes. The quiz said yes. And I don't know why, because when I asked which one of these famous men would you date, I picked the oldest one. So I don't really know how I got a yes except for I think that probably gives everyone a yes. But okay, to be fully transparent, has it happened that I have been at a bar by myself and met a younger person? That answer is also yes. But that was like precove at times when I would travel a lot more and I travel alone all the time. And I'm not the type of person who is going to stay in my Airbnb all by myself. But no, I'm going to go out. I'm going to meet people. I like talking to people. In contrary to popular belief, I'm relatively nice when I first meet people. I mean, maybe, but it's not difficult to meet people when you go out and you're chatting and I will strike up a conversation with anybody. I'll be on the chairlift and I'm talking to people. I'll be at a bar. I'm talking to people. But I don't remember the last time I found myself sitting alone at a bar that was like precovid travel. And certainly I have never once in my entire life thought to myself, I really need some Dick. Tonight I'm going to go to the bar and search for a man. Never. Because no woman ever needs to work that hard to get laid. Let's also be honest about this. This whole idea of a Cougar that like a woman has to chase a man. Only men would come up with this bullshit because they're the ones who are constantly struggling to get laid. We are not. There's always someone you can call multiple people. It's just not hard. So I feel like this whole idea that women have to prey on men, we do not. Men are not difficult. No, they're not. They're kind of like plants. You bring up an interesting point about who's sort of holding the narrative of that. So if you have young men writing whatever this language, this definition, or you have this storytelling from the perspective of that woman alone at the bar who wants to get late and she's putting herself out there and she's chasing me and look what I can do. It is a whole narrative that's owned by the wrong author because it's painting this picture of I don't want to use the word desperate, but it kind of makes it not as sexy and powerful and wonderful as it is to be a woman in her 40s or in her 50s. Because to your point, that enjoys going out does not mind going out alone and then is interesting and, like, meeting people. And that does not necessarily translate into, I want to sleep with you or I'm chasing you. You're just like, oh, I'm actually kind of just like a human on this planet, and I like to connect and meet other humans. And that's the point. To me, that really stands out, especially having been in a monogamous relationship for coming on 20 plus years and married for 14. I like having friends of the opposite gender. I like it striking up conversations with males. And it is really interesting to see the dynamic shift when I'm not interested in something more than just, like, interesting conversation analysis. Like, actually just connecting because of that one track. If you're striking up a conversation with me, it probably means that you want me. It's like, probably not. And I might actually be really happy when this chair list ends or the bartender brings me my tab. Yeah, I am literally just practicing talking to strangers. Okay. Do not think this is anything more than me remembering what it's like to talk to strangers, because that is a skill I have lost. I just want to say, if we want to add some proof to this on my phone, I have text right now from two people who are younger than me, who I sleep with, who are texting me. Okay? I just want chasing them. I think the other interesting part about this whole Cougar thing is that it's so heteronormative. Every single thing on the interwebs about Cougars is older women chasing younger men. So is there a word, or do we think women are Cougars if they are having intimate relationships with younger women? So I'm in that scenario right now, I have someone in my life who the whole reason why this came up is she called me a Cougar, and I was like, I'm 100% not a Cougar. You know, you're chasing me. And she's like, It's really cute. I'm like, no, it's not cute. It makes me feel old. And she's like, okay, I'm going to call you Coug. So she's going to listen to this and think this is, like, the best thing she's ever heard. Also, Hi. And I was like, I didn't like being called a Cougar. I didn't like it because it made me feel like I was preying on her or preying on other people, which is 100% not what I'm doing ever. But I do think it's really interesting that everything that's written about Cougars is them going after younger men. And so, again, that's relatively problematic. That what, like, older women aren't dating younger men. Sorry, younger women? What about women? Are you still Cougars? Are you not? Like, is that just like a normal like no one thinks twice about older women dating younger women. What is the dynamic around this whole, like, women and men thing? Again, it just makes me feel like men have completely constructed this entire narrative and they make it about them and they would never think that maybe something else would be going on. Well, hopefully they're all listening right now and having their mind fucking blown. That would be sweet. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I feel like probably most of the people who listen to this podcast are women and we could do something. We just don't really make ourselves that available to men. I think we kind of intimidate men, but maybe not for all women. Right. Regardless of relationship status, regardless of sexuality. I think the idea of the constant to your point, this sense of heteronormativity, heteronormativity and like being in a box. Right. So even just in this positive relationship that you're with with this person than to hear a word put out there that has these connotations that you might not like. So here's the thing. You're in a place where you're like, I can unpack this. I can talk to this person about it. I can bring it to Juicy Bits. Where do all people have that place and that availability when there is language around relationships and sexuality and relationship dynamics where they can go with that, to be able to either move past it, reclaim the words, or be like, fucking again. Maybe it's something that feels super powerful or something that they kind of wish to change. So I feel like that's a piece of it also that's important. So people can feel just good in their skin, right? Good in their skin. So they're good in their naked skin. They're good with their partners. They're good in all that. And I don't think that's something I think we've always been to really try to be true to this on Juicy Bits when we bring the conversations forward because some people might not talk about it, might brush it off. No big deal. And it's like there has to be a place for all those conversations, if that makes sense, you know what I mean? Yeah, well, it makes me think, like, to your point, I'm a confident person who, if something said to me, I will have the conversation around it. And it wasn't like the exchange that I had with married girlfriend wasn't bad. I certainly don't want to paint it like that. But for a second I was cringing like, oh, I don't want to be a Cougar.

Participant #1:
We live in a society where we're taught that older women aren't sexy and that

Participant #1:
older single women are desperate. And that's like such a big thing for me because I've chosen this life that I live. I'm not married. Not because I couldn't find a husband. I'm not married because I chose to not be married. I'm not in a long term monogamous relationship, not because I'm not able to do it or nobody wants me. It's because I've chosen to live a different life. And I feel really fortunate that I'm in a place in my life where I can feel really comfortable with that and that I have supportive friends like you who are like, yeah, just be you, Jen. Do whatever you want to do. But I would imagine that there's probably a lot of women who maybe don't exist in this bubble of positivity and support like I do. Right. And what a shame if you're a woman in your 40s or fifty s and you meet someone who's younger and you don't know if you should date them simply because of age. And that is this construct that we've created where we really don't favor women who age. We certainly are okay with men who age, but we really think that women should always do anything that they can do to stay young and look young. And in my Googling, one of the articles that I was reading, they were even talking about, like, you may not even know she's a Cougar because of surgery or they dye their hair or they know how to apply makeup or all these things. And I'm like, oh, that's so gross. That's so gross. You may not know she's a Cougar. Get the fuck out of here with that preying on and like, manipulation and that you have to represent yourself as someone else to be loved or to be desired. And I think that's also really problematic because we don't want women to age. Right. We want them to stay a certain way. We want them there for the male gay. So all of those things would also not be seen as something that a woman might do for her own choice and things that she likes, not just because of impossible societal standards of beauty, but because they make you feel good. That that's for someone else, not just themselves. Well, maybe that's why Cougars have this negative connotation, because it's this idea that a woman in her 40s or 50s would be doing something for herself, that she would be going after something simply so that she felt good. She's not behaving in a way that is meant to care for or cater to the other person. She's showing up for herself. And maybe that's sort of the bigger issue. We don't necessarily appreciate that we haven't gotten to a point where that is something that is acceptable, that women would do things simply for themselves simply for their own joy. And so we have to label it in a way that somehow lessens them and takes away from them being their full selves because he wants them as mothers and wives and grandmothers. There's such a pressure and there's such an acceptance of that path, if you will. Right. That that's really an acceptable role for a woman as being someone who can say, I don't need I'm childless by choice. I'm not married by choice. Those would be things that are seen, I think, as really threatening to men and threatening to people who have especially what we're seeing right now, who have won a really conservative hold on this, like, picture of what it means to be a woman and what does it mean to have a family and what does it mean to be a mother and all of those pieces. And so I feel like any challenge to that can also feel disruptive to the status quo. And that's, again, part of the work that we always want to be doing is disrupting that and interrupting these predictable patterns, because you want to be able to see that there are other very fulfilling, very meaningful paths and directions and expressions within this wide world that we live in. And I think that that is something, again, comes down to men wanting to reroute and reframe so that they're in control of that narrative. Something that I can say that I want to not forget in that piece of being that older woman is I will have a very hard time. I don't know if you've seen this, Jen, or if it's come across, but I have two instances of younger men wearing hats that say, I masturbate to hot moms. And this is more in the brick and mortar classroom. So these are students of mine. And then seeing them on College campuses as a presenter, and for me, asking them to kind of remove them or just kind of feeling like, maybe I'm the Prude right now, right? Maybe I should be like, celebrate, go home and fucking whack off to me. I was like, no, this is not a compliment. This is not a compliment, right? No. Okay. We do not exist as hot women for young men to masturbate, too. That is not why we show up in the world like this. You are fucking welcome that you have this to go masturbate to. But don't think for a fucking second that we do this for you. Also, just keep it to your fucking self. I don't wear a T shirt or a hat. Also, I have this podcast right now, and I'm not even talking about what I masturbate to, okay? I'm not. You just can keep it to yourselves. I do think that's disgusting. I don't think that's us being Prude, Jillian. I think that is us saying, no one needs your toxic masculinity to be thrown in my fucking face when I'm just trying to walk down the street or exist in my daily life. Like, remove your hat, young man. Remove buddies or present at a University or I'm like a doctorate guest speaker. And I'm like, I really have to like, I would rather you sitting there fucking with a vape in your mouth rather than that hat on. And you're going to try to tell me that that's a compliment because you're hot old. I think it was a hot older model. It made me think about this when we were talking about it because it was supposed to be this complimentary thing, maybe right after I was manned to remind me that I was still hot and masturbatable too. And I was like, that's not here. And that's the fucking bullshit power with that dynamic of the Cooper shit. It's like, I'm going to throw up on you and your fucking Dick like, grow horrible. Well, and just the idea that like, moms aren't hot. So why do we think moms aren't like to say you masturbate to hot moms means that sort of in general. Moms aren't hot. Moms are human beings. Moms are sexy. Just because you have a baby, you're no longer sexy. Again, what are these societal norms that we place on women? So when you're married, you're not sexy when you have a child, you're not sexy when you're older. You can be sexy, but you're also kind of desperate and gross because you only want to fuck young people. But if you fuck people your age, then that's okay because you're staying in your Lane. But I mean, all of it is just a hard no for me, a super hard no. I don't even know. Also, no one should wear those hats. We take the hats off also, like all the milk stuff, like all that. It is absolutely disgusting. But I was going to say something earlier, Jillian, and now I can't remember what it was, but it was like, so fucking important. I just forgot. It could be your perimenopausal mind fog, which is super hot and sexy to bring up with a younger human that you want to fuck. Right? You're like, Sorry, I couldn't forget. I couldn't remember that one. Sorry, Babe. I do actually enjoy bringing that up. I bring that up mainly because I am an asshole because I want to see the response that I get because I do frequently forget things now and anyone who knows me knows that. I attribute it to the absolute overwhelming decision making that we had to do during COVID and still continue to actually have to do because covet is not resolved and anyone in business knows that it's not resolved. So I feel like that took everything out of me. I also feel like there's just so many things that I'm dealing with daily. I can't remember all of it. And then yeah, I'm like, oh, I did have that hot flash last May. And when I Googled, Google told me that a symptom of being perimenopausal is that you forget things. And I'm like it's that 100% is not because I am lazy or not listening or forgetful or anything. I'm going to blame it on this thing that is happening with my body. So I do actually like saying that to the younger people who I date to specifically see how they react. Everyone has handled it well, outwardly, I don't actually know what's going on in their brains when I say it, which is probably a good thing, but I will say they keep coming back for more. So we're okay. Also, I was tangent here. I was a little worried that maybe the reason why I wasn't remembering things is because, as we've discussed, everyone knows that I like to drink. And I was like, oh, fuck, am I drinking so much that I don't remember the night before? But then just this last week, I had two nights in one week where I had zero to drink. Nothing. Not a drop. I 100% did not remember the previous day. I didn't remember it. And I had this baby. Okay. It's not the drinking. You just legitimately don't remember anything. Again, perimenopause, covet, general, being overwhelmed with the world that we live in. Just reckoning five, like, episode three. We did a great one on Paramountopause. You might have forgotten. I know I'm like a year or two younger than you, so my onset is happening differently. But we do have a do you remember we recorded it? Yes. We had to come to terms. I'm like, why the fuck am I waking up at 04:00 in the morning, wide awake? Oh, insomnia. Great. Okay. I'm kind of sweating on really cold. Okay, great. This is what's starting to happen. Bodies talking to us. This is hot. This is hot stuff right now. All those Cougars out there doing my kids right now. That's right. This is it again. Anything with language. We've said this before. I feel like it can be kind of even sprinkled in throughout, like, thoughtful conversations. I had a kind of a thought less conversation that I won't delve into the details here recently with someone who said some pretty disturbing things. And I was kind of trying to help to guide them to not be such an asshole and be like, hey, you got to think about your audience. You got to think about systems and individuals and try to kind of, like, mirror back to them what they were saying. And that's the person I care about. So I wasn't giving up on them. But the whole fundamental little spin back that was happening of this person mildly listening, being defensive, really came down to language and the use of language and the shift within our language and then how we see how that language has impact and then what the result is of that. So say, for example, married girlfriend, if you had been really upset by this, the important thing would have been what happened next. Right? And I think that's just that little reminder to all of us. Right. It's like people are. We are human. We make mistakes. Everything that comes out of our mouth is always perfect. We're showing up as we are. But what happens after that, I think, is essential. And this comes down to forgiveness and listening and understanding and compassion. And again, some people are just fucking assholes and you can be done with them. And that's fair. But that's not always the case. So that sense of language and the use of words and allowing them to be not empowering, I don't need to be empowered. I am powerful enough. I don't need that to be told to me again, because I think that indicates it's been taken away from us and needs to be given to us. So where is that sense of feeling powerful within our language? Yeah, well, I think there's plenty of people who use the term Cougar in a positive way, like married girlfriend was certainly not putting me down or saying anything to hurt my feelings. It was definitely a compliment. But here's the thing. When you are a person at a certain age who's not categorized as old by society, it is really difficult to sometimes hear those words. And I actually now remember what it was I was going to say earlier. I'm going to get to that in a second. I certainly struggle with aging. It is not easy. It is a daily practice to remind myself that I am still good enough and maybe beyond good enough. But it is hard when you have wrinkles that are there and you have Gray hairs and things are not like skin sags and you can't like, I look in the mirror sometimes now and I'm like, I look older than how I feel. And if we lived in a world where older women were glorified and appreciated and revered, I think I would probably feel really differently. But we don't. We live in a world where I'm not supposed to age and I should be doing everything that I can to look younger. So when there's a term that's bestowed upon you that squarely places you in an age bracket and not necessarily in the best light, it is just like one more thing in society telling you that you're something that you shouldn't be. And what I was going to say earlier is that also living in the United States, we live in a country where all the systems are set up, where my life would be easier if I were married. My life would be easier if I had a child. We want people to do that. Every single system, from health care to taxes to the cost of living, requiring two incomes to just the general bullshit, like what people say to you. It takes a lot every day to remind myself why it is I've chosen to do this and that I am doing what I chose to do and to remind myself of all, like the great things in my life and the things that I have because I chose to take this different path. And that really does take a lot to work through and to remind yourself. And so while I would love for Cougar to be reclaimed and it's something that all women in their forty s and fifty s would be like, yeah, I'm a Cougar. I don't really know if we're there yet. And in general, I don't know. I'd kind of like to just say, fuck that word. Men came up with it. Let's come up with our own bird. I don't need to use language that men have used. I'd rather just have something new and something maybe created by people like me that really embodies who we are. But it's not easy. It's not nothing set up for us. I would have to say, stay tuned because I can see whatever this word is that swirling in your brain that hasn't come up yet is going to be on the fucking beautifully drafted sticker. It's going to be available on a hoodie on the coalition website. It's going to be, well, this would be a great thing. If any of our listeners have a word, you could definitely shoot us an email at [e-mail]. I would love to hear that. Now, Julian, let me ask you a question. We did not discuss this prerecording, so you are not prepared for this. All right. If for some reason you were single, which we you're not going to be. You have an incredible husband who, you know, I adore, and you really are an example of someone like you're doing it right. If you were single, though, would you date people who are ten years or younger than you? Would you do it? I have no idea. You've never thought about it?

Participant #1:
I might be useless. I don't know. I don't know. Yes. Well, I will say, okay, this could probably answer the question when I had to. I'm really excited to get those prototypes on Friday. So I will say that I would probably have no problem dating someone that was ten plus years younger because the kid, he was definitely a kid. He wasn't like a minor, but he was young as fuck. That was helping me fix the bindings on the prototypes. The last time I was in the Valley, this was like the first prototype. And I think I had to message you to be like, I kind of might have sexually harassed this kid. I think we're cool. But I could have been borderline because he was just so fucking dreamy and so cute and he had a South African accent. Come on. No, to the girl next to me. You have to work near this dude all day. How are you even functioning? And then I'm sitting there being like, Jillian, what the fuck is you were in public. You're telling this to this kid's face while I'm fixing my boot? I'm going to have my wedding band, and I'm again, very happily married. But I think what it made me think about is do I ever think about it? Not necessarily, but I think I would have no problem if there was, like, an attraction or I was like, I don't know what I would do. I'm not sure. Autumn, you might need to delete all of this. I don't know any of that made sense. Now you have me that you asked this question. We were at the College recently for an event, and I will say that the College students, to me, they look like fucking children, like babies. Yes, they do. Maybe the teacher in me there would be a point. But if I'm 43, 33 is not a College student, that's like borderline adults. So I think I would have trouble with maybe someone 20 years younger than me because they would just be too young. Yeah, I did. Let's see. I don't know. Kid was 26 and I was 43. The thing that I never quite figured out with Kid is that because we were dating, like in first winter of COVID, we never went out. We didn't go to a restaurant together. We didn't go to a bar together. We didn't have that be out in public time together. So I have no idea what that would have been. His aunt or like his mentor or something. Yeah, your boss or some. Oh, no. Naturally no one would have thought I was his boss. They still would have thought he was my boss. Let's be honest about that. But I did. I remember saying to him, like, Kid, you have no idea what I'm like in real life. You have no clue what it's like to be out with me and like doing things. And Kid and I are still friends, although we don't sleep together. Really. I mean, I know when he wants to sleep together every time he comes over, if he wants a beer, if he asks. I always offer people drinks when they come to my house and I'll offer them everything. Would you like beer, wine, whiskey or water? I have everything that you would want. And most of the time kids want water. But when he wants a beer, I'm like, oh, you want to have sex? I see you. Okay. So sometimes it happens. But we still to this day have never gone out in real life. So I don't know what it's like to be out in public with somebody who's almost 20 years younger than I am. Whereas married girlfriend is 13 years younger than me. And we go out in public frequently and it's fantastic. And I don't even think twice about it. I don't think that she thinks twice about it. We just have a wonderful time every time that we go out. But I will say again, because this is like society knocking at my door, throwing bricks through my window. I do wonder, like, I wonder what people think. And I don't think that because we're two women. I think that because of the age difference. I do wonder if people think things. I think people always think things. And hopefully they mostly keep them to themselves because I will say most of the unsolicited comments and advice I get is fucking bullshit. And I'm like, you need to mind your own fucking business. But I think it's interesting for more the sociological kind of people analysis, curiosity route, as opposed to anyone harping on your fantastic time. Yeah. Okay. So to recap, am I a Cougar? I think we have decided, no. So just because we're going to need to get feedback from listeners, number 01:00 a.m.. I between the ages of 40 and 50? Yes. Do I have sex with people who are eight years? Is there a difference of eight years or more? Yes. Do I chase them? No. Do I use the predatory tactics that men use on women? No. Am I desperate? No. Am I chasing after them because I can't get laid? No. So I think that I'm not a Cougar. But maybe listeners have picked up on something and they're going to write in and be like, no, you are Cougar. Or maybe people will be like, you're just cough. Cough is good. I did learn that a woman over 60 is called a Saber tooth, which get the fuck out again. No, but I don't think what a Saber tooth looks like. Oh, wow. Yeah. Women over 60 who date younger men. So we've learned that I'm not a Cougar. We've learned that Cougar is super heteronormative. And so fuck that noise. We've learned that Cougar is a term created by young men to describe women who, by the way, you'd be fucking lucky you'd be lucky to fuck us. You'd be lucky to hang out with us. You would be so lucky to have my time. So lucky I don't give my time to a lot of people. You would be lucky to get some of it. So maybe we need a word for young men who are fucking lucky to fuck me. Maybe we need a word for that. Jillian okay, so that's what I'm going to leave everyone with. And again, please send any comments about your thoughts on Cougars. And if I'm a Cougar, and if you have new names for Cougars, you just send them along to us at [e-mail]. And also, Congratulations to you. You made it to the end of this episode and we are done talking about my sex life just now. Bye, everyone.