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Veterans know how to lead. The lessons we learned in the military form the foundation for bigger successes in business, entrepreneurship and community.
Host John S Berry, CEO of Berry Law, served as an active-duty Infantry Officer in the U.S. Army, finishing his military career with two deployments and retiring as a Battalion Commander in the National Guard. Today, his veteran led team at Berry Law, helps their clients fight some of the most important battles of their lives. Leading successful teams in the courtroom, the boardroom, and beyond, veteran leadership drives the firm’s rapid growth and business excellence.
Whether building teams, synchronizing operations, or refining tactics, we share our experiences, good and bad, to help you survive, thrive and dominate.
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[00:00:00.00] - Austin von Letkemann
There's still a lot of hesitancy among military leadership to embrace what we're doing as content creators. You know I'm always blown away. I had a guy walk up to me yesterday, and he said, my daughter is joining the military because she watched your videos and I said, I'm really sorry, sir. I was like, did she watch the videos?
[00:00:21.22] - John S. Berry
Welcome to the Veteran Led podcast. I got some phenomenal guests today. I'll just commandeer the stage and say this is the unscripted Veteran Led podcast at MIC. The first guest is a friend, many of you know, an influencer, and a great leader, Austin von Letkemann.
[00:00:52.22] - John S. Berry
Second guest, and I'm going to cheat on this one, is Zach Bell. His company is Veteran With a Sign. Welcome to the stage, Zach.
[00:01:06.17] - Zach Bell
What's up?
[00:01:07.01] - John S. Berry
Great to meet you.
[00:01:07.16] - Zach Bell
Pleasure.
[00:01:09.18] - Zach Bell
Sorry, it's a company out. Thank you. Sorry.
[00:01:15.09] - John S. Berry
All right, so let's get started. What I like about both of you gentlemen is you understand that humor is part of leadership.
[00:01:22.21] - Zach Bell
Yes.
[00:01:23.12] - John S. Berry
So, we'll start with you. Tell us a little bit about your journey. You're an active-duty soldier, military intelligence officer, and you continue to inspire the troops by telling the truth on social media. The truth is always funny.
[00:01:38.09] - Austin von Letkemann
The truth is... It's so funny. When I started doing this stuff, I have a very dry delivery, and I do that. I have a dry delivery in my stand-up comedy and everything else I do, too. But I was enlisted for 10 years, and so it was always confusing to people when a lieutenant would talk about things that a normal enlisted guy would be frustrated with. It was pretty cathartic. But most of the time, there wasn't even a joke associated with it. I would just be saying like what we do. You know what I mean? We're standing out in formation for three hours and it's 115 degrees. That guy's like puking. I think he had a heat stroke. People are dying laughing. I'm like, I'm not even joking. This is what we do. But so, yeah, it's been really funny.
[00:02:22.23] - John S. Berry
Zach, tell us a little bit about your journey and your mission.
[00:02:26.14] - Zach Bell
What I like to do is I had this idea to create a shareable meme that was of the military experience that was universally applicable to everyone so that people could have something that they could be like, oh, I know that, and I understand that. I was just like, Well, what's better than me with cardboard? Was just the idea. What is like the easiest way to deliver a message without any...
[00:02:51.09] - Austin von Letkemann
It's simple and genius.
[00:02:52.19] - Zach Bell
Yeah, any misinterpretation. The first photo I ever took, I asked the young lady who used to cut my hair. I was like, Will you take a photo of me outside? I'm just going to hold up a sign and say something stupid. It was in March of 2020, and she's like, Sure. I went out there, took it. Three months later, everything else took off. But there's literally not that much. I had no idea what it would become, but I was like, Hell yeah. Probably the best way to describe.
[00:03:21.00] - John S. Berry
You are both masters of messaging. You're able to get that simple message across that people understand. Does it take a lot of work in editing, or do you just go with the flow with this? I'll start with you, Austin.
[00:03:33.12] - Austin von Letkemann
I'm still active duty, and I'm also like a dad, and so I don't have a lot of time, and that's why all of the actors in the videos are me. It's just me. If you guys didn't know that, it's just me. The actors aren't paid that well either. It's crazy. Really terrible working conditions. But yeah, I purposely kept it as simple as possible. I've only recently invested in in a studio set up. I just kept it in my car, and it was me going back and forth. I was literally having a conversation with myself about the things that frustrate me about the military. They're really petty things, but when you're dealing with 100 petty things over the course of a week, it's not petty anymore. It's just so... I remember as a junior enlisted guy, I'd have this level of rage. I'd get home and tell my wife about it, and she's like, why are you so mad? This is like, you ran today, like whatever. I'm like, we ran yesterday, too. My knees hurt. You know what I mean? But yeah. I keep it as simple as possible. There is a lot of work on the back end that goes into it, but I try and keep that to a minimum.
[00:04:47.03] - John S. Berry
What about you, Zach? Do you feel like you have to edit your stuff or you just go with the flow?
[00:04:52.12] - Zach Bell
I probably should edit it more, but for the most part, I just go with the flow. I mean, a lot of it was just image-based initially, and even then, there was a lot of interpretation. One time, I made a joke about Navy Seals that a friend of mine said I could make as Navy Seal, and it's like writing a book doesn't make you a Navy Seal, but wearing a pair of gators does. It's like the sunglasses they all wear. I then followed that up with a photo of me and Eddie Gallagher and my friend, Darren, who are Navy Seals as well. I was like, I'm just a Navy Seal now. Hundreds of comments were dedicated to how I was stealing valor, not to how I was standing in between them. That was just made me a Navy Seal. Apparently, it's harder than that. I didn't know that. They'll tell you. They'll tell you. That was when I try to really refine it to a diamonding of a message that I want people to take away from it. But sometimes I'll leave a few loose threads to kind of let people walk on target with videos and stuff I do because sometimes I feel like I soak up all the energy in a bit or a joke, and I just want to see what people do in their interpretation of it.
[00:06:04.12] - Zach Bell
But yeah, it's kind of a weird balance, in my opinion. Austin is better than me.
[00:06:09.22] - John S. Berry
Well, I like what you said about making that diamond, refining the message. In the military, so many of us have had commanders that give this ambiguous guidance, and it's horrible.
[00:06:20.17] - Austin von Letkemann
We're all know it when I see it.
[00:06:22.20] - John S. Berry
What's that?
[00:06:23.09] - Austin von Letkemann
I'll know it when I see it.
[00:06:24.06] - John S. Berry
I'll know it when I see it.
[00:06:25.10] - Austin von Letkemann
My favorite.
[00:06:25.20] - John S. Berry
Yes. It's unfortunate. Then we suffer through that, but it's great to make fun of it. But then when you're on the creator side of it, you realize sometimes your message isn't that clear. Then even when it is clear, sometimes that message falls flat. Zach, what has been you found to be your secret to creating engaging content? Not just clear and concise but engaging.
[00:06:51.15] - Zach Bell
I honestly just try and look through the lens of stuff that I would like to see, and that's basically it. At first, my wife said, Stop making jokes for you and your 10 friends. Whenever she says that, if I just put the hammer down, that thing will take off. Or if she says, don't post that, I'm going to post it. But I don't know. I just kind of like to look through the mindset of someone who's in the military, either still in or active, or like they just got out and they're trying to figure out things, and then just the weird juxtapositions of life, the things that don't sense. I made a joke about Walmart Melatonin in the other day, and he now two guys are like, I miss you, bro. I can't anticipate the things that happen, but it's just, I don't know. I just try to be a little less serious.
[00:07:45.08] - John S. Berry
Austin, how do you walk the line being active duty military and people looking at you and your content, and you got to think, Hey, I might have to pull this down. How do you make that call?
[00:07:56.03] - Austin von Letkemann
I've made, over the course of three years, a little over 8,000 videos. Well, four years now, I guess. Three or four years, somewhere around there. I've only taken down four or five pieces of content. I feel like I walk a really really good line. Zach talked about it a little bit, but the way that I think you make engaging content, especially for our community, is you weave in themes of empathy. There's only a few things you can do as a content creator. You can educate, you can entertain, and you can inspire. That's basically what it comes down to. Zach is very inspirational. I am obviously like an entertainer. I want to make people laugh. But I found that that fourth thing you can weave into all the others, and that's empathy. If somebody feels that you empathize with them, it doesn't matter if you're a different gender or you look different, or even if you believe things differently politically, you're an ally now. We're allies. If I understand your struggle, that's immediately engaging. If I understand where you've been and what you've done and what you're going through, that's engaging. That's what I found.
[00:09:06.01] - Austin von Letkemann
I think that's why my comedic takes on the nuance of military life resonates with people the way it does because they can tell I empathize. There's definitely some anger behind it.
[00:09:21.02] - John S. Berry
As far as what you've done with this, and as you can see from the hat and the shirt, you've got your own gear, you've got your own swag, you've got your own brand. I always say, why would you wear somebody else's jersey? Wear your own. Tell us a little bit about the decision to do that, to make this another part of your brand.
[00:09:40.02] - Austin von Letkemann
Like the merchandise, specifically?
[00:09:41.19] - John S. Berry
Yeah.
[00:09:42.23] - Austin von Letkemann
It's funny because I'm still active duty. I actually spoke to a number of attorneys, and a number, not from a legal standpoint. I wanted their perspective on ethics because attorneys operate in the gray. I also spoke to a number of chaplains who are supposed to be our military's experts on ethics. Because I wasn't sure how I felt about it. I'm active duty. Active-duty service members could buy stuff off my website or whatever. This is absolutely not a plug for that. I'm saying that for legal reasons. But after talking to about six different people that I trust, I decided to go forward with it. I knew I was going to exit the military at some point, and now I've created a business for myself, and that's how I'm going to feed my kids when I get out. But yeah, it was honestly a pretty hard decision, and a decision that I thought about for a very long time before I pulled the trigger. I'm happy I did it. I have had people tell me that Live Laugh toaster bath shirt, specifically. I had a guy, he's like, Yeah, I wear this to my counseling appointments every time.
[00:10:58.07] - Austin von Letkemann
It's the only place I wear it. My therapist loves it. I'm like, Your therapist loves it. He's like, Well, yeah, he's a Veteran. I'm like, okay, that makes sense.
[00:11:07.01] - John S. Berry
I've noticed some Veterans, they do this because they just want to give back and make people laugh and connect with the Veteran community. But for others, it is like, hey, we have to figure out a way to keep this going. It's like anything else. We've got to figure out a way to monetize it so that we can grow it, get more audience, and give back even more. Zach, for Veteran with a Sign, tell us a little bit about that and where that's going.
[00:11:27.14] - Zach Bell
You mean like other projects I have?
[00:11:28.23] - John S. Berry
Yeah.
[00:11:30.23] - Zach Bell
Okay, so I had a guy message me once when I started selling merch. He goes, I didn't know it cost money to run an Instagram page. It doesn't, but it takes time away from everything else. If I'm doing this, I can't do other projects. I have merch and stuff, but for me, I wanted to expand beyond what I was doing. I mean, it's hard to live in short form media. I developed two podcasts. One is in a sunsetting phase because I need a new studio. The other one is just dog walking the internet right now. It's doing really well. I'm starting a few new companies. I'm ownership in an energy drink company, Drink Echelon. I'm just trying to stuff that's affiliated with my community that I like and that I cosign, I'm trying to be a part of. Mainly beyond just traditional things because I'm specific in that aspect of, I drink energy drink every day, I drink protein every day. Okay, I'm just going to start moving towards that, and things like that, if that makes sense.
[00:12:41.03] - John S. Berry
Yeah, I think it's leadership by example. It's great to have that message out and to entertain people. But I think if you're doing something important, you have an obligation to grow it, to help more and more people, more and more Veterans. If you're effective and you're helping one person, you can probably help a lot more. I think the stigma Well, but if you're making a living doing it, then there's something wrong with that. There's not. This is America. We believe in capitalism, and we want our Veterans to be successful. We want the people who protected our rights to have these business opportunities, to have those opportunities. A lot of times when I see people criticize Veterans about this, I'm like, well, wait a minute. Yeah, they protect our right for capitalism. If anybody deserves the opportunity, and quite frankly, has the leadership ability to do it, it's our Veteran community. I'm really proud about what these gentlemen have done is they've got it into the mainstream. There's so much garbage on social media that we see that doesn't help anybody. It's not even funny. It's just stupid. There's a lot of hate. But yet, as Austin says, more plates, less hate.
[00:13:50.19] - John S. Berry
Working out, doing the things right, and setting the example, continuing to lead by example for Veterans is something that both these gentlemen have done. I would ask you this, what do you see in your futures? I know you've talked about some of this stuff, Austin, but where does it end? Where does it begin and where does it end?
[00:14:10.12] - Austin von Letkemann
I'm actually starting my transition off active duty. I actually just spoke to a really great guy in the Army Reserve, so I might be crossing over to the Army Reserve. But I'm now part owner in a Veteran apparel company. It's like the OG brand. I can't make the announcement here because we're going to do a big announcement for it. But I think people will be really excited when they see that it's back. I'm working with a peptide and TRT company now that is Veteran-owned, so I'm really excited about that. The military beats up our bodies. Any way I can partner with somebody to make the Veteran community healthier, I'm happy to do that. I work with the American Legion, Black Rifle Coffee. I'm continuing to work with companies where I like the teams and I like what they're doing, and I'm going to continue to do that. I'm really, really excited because part of what we're doing with this apparel company is going to be tangibly giving back to the Veteran community, and I feel like that's my next step. Our community has blessed me wildly beyond anything I deserve, and so I do feel like it's time to tangibly give back in some way.
[00:15:26.19] - Austin von Letkemann
I think that this company will allow me to do that, or I hope it will. So, I'm really excited.
[00:15:32.18] - John S. Berry
Outstanding. And, Zach, what is your perspective on your future?
[00:15:38.02] - Zach Bell
I have two kids in high school. And as that happens, I'm probably going to bounce my phone off a wall when the youngest one graduates and just retire and just work on a farm and do a podcast. I have an exit strategy, just slowly shutting things down. I have a lot of partners and stuff that I work with. I'm grateful. But when I started this in 2020, I just wanted to spend more time with my family. There's a few things I'll hang on to, but I don't want to be the last guy holding up a cardboard sign on the side of the road. As they wheel me into the Vet home. People have this idea that this stuff is out of the box, different than a normal job. Your boss can walk in and be like, Hey, you got to go. It's the same type of thing. I would argue we have more control over that than others, especially someone who's spent a decade in corporate America. But for me, it's just like I've hit a lot of goals now. I just want to see people in my community continue to be successful. It's been amazing to see what Austin's done and others.
[00:16:49.21] - Zach Bell
Tyler Vargas-Andrews is another guy. I'm really proud to watch him as he's doing a lot of things, too. It's just a really good time to be here. I'm just trying to tighten up my team and just kind of all grow and go farther together, if that makes sense.
[00:17:03.06] - John S. Berry
Absolutely. I think that's what we learned as you. You go a lot further as a team, and we've all experienced that in the military. I got to give a shout out to the Department of the Army here for embracing what Austin's doing, an active duty soldier. I heard from the last 10 years. We have this huge recruiting problem. We can't get kids that are in shape. We can't get people that want to join. I think it was because the messaging in the media wasn't right. Now we get someone who encourages physical fitness and says, Hey, there's humor and leadership, and I'm going to tell you the truth. I think that It has been amazing. The evolution of a leader is sometimes where we see whether this is going to be a great organization or whether this organization is going to fail. And so great leadership in the Army for promoting this and for allowing it to flourish. And now we're coming to the close. So I want to know what message for both of you, start with you Austin, do you want to get out there that you feel has not gotten out there enough?
[00:17:55.04] - John S. Berry
Either because your comedy wasn't good enough, you failed, or you didn't have the guts to say it, or maybe you just haven't reflected enough and you haven't figured it out till now. But what is that one thing that needs to be said that you haven't said yet?
[00:18:07.06] - Austin von Letkemann
There's still a lot of hesitancy among military leadership to embrace what we're doing as content creators. I truly do believe it's a matter of national security, only because our recruitable population lives online. The corporate, very polished content that the military produces is good, and it has its place, certainly. But we have to leverage the talented people in our formations if we want to grab the next generation. If we want the next Jocko to join the military, it's probably going to be guys like us that are speaking to them. I'm always blown away. I had a guy walk up to me yesterday, and he said, My daughter is joining the military because she watched your videos. I said, I'm really sorry, sir. I was like, Did she watch the videos? That's incredible. He's very proud of her. It was a very sweet, very touching moment. I appreciated him sharing that with me. But yeah, I would say we cannot be so risk averse when it comes to social media. It seems like we're more afraid of an errant word than we are an errant bomb at this point.
[00:19:25.16] - John S. Berry
Yeah, we're all going to say stupid stuff in real life, so let's just do it on social media. Zach, what about you? What needs to be said?
[00:19:33.07] - Zach Bell
One last thing that I don't say or needs to be said more. Just whatever.
[00:19:37.22] - John S. Berry
Take it.
[00:19:39.00] - Zach Bell
September is National Suicide Prevention Month. It's something that this pulled me into this work in particular. I've been around the world twice, done everything a guy can do in a combat tour, and I lost more people after war than I did to it. Ultimately, Veteran with the Sign was a way to make a better veteran. Literally, that's what I think it is because at the time, Veterans online were like, this is how Veterans cook, and they have a steak, and they dump bullets on it, and they're like, yeah. It's pretty lame, and it's not my thing. But I just wanted people to laugh more and hurt themselves less. Everything I do is a very thinly-vealed approach to group therapy and nostalgia and trying to get people together to build community beyond the battlefield. That's what I'm always trying to do. The way I found that it works is with cardboard and a Sharpy and a backwards hat, so I'm going to run that up until I'm done. So, yeah, I think that's the best way to do it.
[00:20:40.05] - John S. Berry
Thank you for joining us today on Veteran Led, where we seek to help Veterans build an even bigger, better future after military service. Unfortunately for some of our Veterans, the roadblock to a better future is that they are not receiving all of the benefits that they earned. If you need help appealing a VA disability decision, contact Berry Law.