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Dan Hope and Andy Anders of Eleven Warriors bring you inside the Ohio State beat every Wednesday with a podcast covering everything you need to know about the Buckeyes.
Note: This transcript was AI-generated and has not been edited for errors.
[Dan Hope]
Welcome into RealPod Wednesdays. I'm Dan Hope joined by Andy Anders coming at you a little bit later on this Wednesday. So maybe it's Thursday by the time you're listening, but National Signing Day, of course, a busy day for us on the Ohio State beat, not only because of the new recruiting class that's coming in for the Buckeyes with those guys officially sending in not their national letters of intent anymore, their Big Ten scholarship agreements to officially become Buckeyes and members of next year's team, but also the first time since immediately after the Michigan game that we got to talk to Ryan Day and we wanted to go to that press conference and be able to hear what he had to say before we recorded this podcast.
And I think nothing groundbreaking in that press conference, probably nothing that we didn't expect to hear from Ryan Day. But you know, I will say, I think the thing you can, you, you, you'd have to give Ryan Day credit for on Wednesday is he did take full accountability for what happened on Saturday. He said that, you know, ultimately as the head coach, the loss falls on him, all the issues ultimately come back to him.
And, you know, he knows that, you know, right now when scrutiny on him as is as high as it's ever been in his tenure as Ohio State head coach, that he can't pass the buck right now that he's got to be the one to say, yeah, I need to do a better job so that we can achieve better results.
[Andy Anders]
I do think he deserves some credit for that because I watch other coaches around the country that get defensive when reporters ask them about losses like this, you know, you look at someone like Lincoln Riley, for example, who can be, have very flippant responses to these sorts of questions being brought up about their future, about the frustrations of another loss to Michigan. It's not to excuse what happened on Saturday because it is still unacceptable the result of that. And they should absolutely be getting, you know, we should absolutely be having these kinds of conversations about Ryan Day coming off a fourth straight rivalry loss to Michigan.
But it was good to hear him be willing to sit up there and give thoughtful and accountable answers for questions, admitted that they maybe leaned a little too much on the running game and it didn't get the ball out to the perimeter to those playmakers enough in that game. Although he still kind of annoyed me by referencing the fact that they threw it more times than they ran and Will Howard ultimately had close to like 33 passing attempts, which is rarely a number. He's reached in Ohio State.
I wrote a story over the weekend where if you took over, if you took out the end of the first half and the end of the game, those two drives for Ohio State had to throw the ball. They threw it 13 times and ran it once between those two drives. They ultimately did run more than they threw when they kind of had the option to do either.
But besides the point, well, talking about what Ryan said, I think as well as you could address what happened, he did. It's not going to do a lot, I think, to dissuade a lot of the negativity coming at his program right now, at him right now, but it was good to hear him take accountability. And this is a team that ultimately, you know, process what happened, acknowledge what happened, talk about how bad it was, but you do have to move on and try and go obtain the last objective for you that's out there and trying to go on a playoff run and win a national championship.
So I think that was kind of the general candor of Day's press conferences. Yes, this was awful. Yes, it was unacceptable.
The offense failed at every turn was kind of the ether of it with, you know, you get in the red zone five times and only get 10 points. That was a big deal for what he referenced on Wednesday. But there is still more out there for this team and they are still going to try and work toward that.
[Dan Hope]
At the end of the day, it's a results-oriented business. You get judged on your results. You don't get judged on how nice a guy you are or how well you answer questions in press conferences.
You get judged by whether you win or lose games. And when you're at Ohio State, whether you win or lose, the game is one of, if not the top criteria that you get judged on. And so Ryan Day knows that as well as anybody.
As you said, there's still one more chance to salvage this season, and that is to go win a national championship, or at the very minimum, make a deep run in the college football playoff that shows you really are one of the best teams in college football this year. And I think he understands that as well as anybody. I mean, I asked him a question about it on Wednesday, and I wasn't the only one to bring this up, but you've got a senior class, you know, on a day where we're talking about recruiting and we're talking about the hope and promise of a recruiting class.
This is a 2021 recruiting class that was the best in school history when it signed at Ohio State. I mean, I remember all the hype with that class. And obviously there were some guys in that class, like a Quinn Eowers, who didn't end up being a part of a class for very long.
But guys like Jack Sawyer, JT Tuamolo, Donovan Jackson, Emeka Buka, Travion Henderson, I mean, these are all guys who are five-star recruits. These are guys who are supposed to be program-changing players. And all those guys I just named, they've all had very good individual careers.
But from a team goal standpoint, they haven't accomplished anything. And I don't mean that as a criticism specifically on those guys, but it's just the truth of as a team, if those guys don't go make a national championship run here, they're going to leave Ohio State without ever achieving any of those three major goals. And so the pressure is certainly on this team right now.
Like you said, they have to move on. They have to put the Michigan game behind them quickly. And I think that's one of the big questions now is just what exactly is this team's mindset going to look like going into that college football playoff game and probably 17 days from now in the first round?
Because Ryan Day acknowledged it on Wednesday. He was asked, are you really starting to see the guys get excited about that college football playoff game? And he acknowledged there's still a mix of emotions right now that guys are still getting over that Michigan loss, a game that none of them thought they were going to lose.
And so they haven't necessarily put it all behind them yet, but he is optimistic that they will, that by the time Sunday rolls around and they have an opponent, they know who they're going to play next. They are going to be ready to put that behind them and to go focus on going to win a national championship. And that's what they have to do.
And I think, you know, even beyond that, I mean, I fully expect that they will get themselves back into a place, you know, by the time this weekend rolls around, where they're going to be ready to get after it. They're going to, you know, winning a national championship has always been the end goal for this team. So the fact that they still have a chance to do that, I think there's certainly going to be a great hunger to try to go do it.
I think the bigger question is going to be, we just saw this team on Saturday, play a game where they started out slow, clearly lost their confidence and then didn't play very well. And Ryan day acknowledged that when I asked him on Wednesday about the team's confidence and why they didn't play with the same confidence against Michigan as they did against Indiana. And in his words, he thought they did have a lot of confidence going into that game against Michigan.
They just didn't sustain it.
[Ryan Day]
You know, I think, I think we came into the game as confident and as loose, I think, as we've been since I've been here, probably going back to 19. So, you know, I think as the game went on, it started to get a little bit tighter because, you know, it was, you know, a couple of turnovers here and there, you know, some things didn't go our way. And so, you know, you start to feel that a little bit as the game went on.
I don't think we started out the game that way. I don't. And I thought that preparation was loose coming into the game, but obviously it didn't end that way.
[Dan Hope]
I guess, then, what do you have to do, Ben, so that if you get into playoffs, you end up in a similar situation where things start poorly? How do you keep the team from losing its confidence like it did in that game?
[Ryan Day]
Yeah, well, you got to continue to find ways to jumpstart the team and get some excitement and execution fuels emotion. And, you know, a big part of that is coaching, you know, trying to find ways to jumpstart the team and give them some X plays or things on their perimeter that can kind of get us going a little bit. And then when you start, you know, moving things around and getting the ball outside, it opens up a little bit inside.
Now, all of a sudden, we can't just abandon the run. We're just not going to be throwing it, you know, 60 times a game. That's just not a recipe for success.
But it's clear that we have very, very good receivers here. And when we have an advantage there, we got to utilize that. And so we have to figure out what those adjustments are going into this next game and make sure that gets done.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, it certainly felt like by the time that Michigan had hung around for a while in the game, when they were up 7-3, when a lot of things started going wrong in this game for Ohio State, when it was clear they couldn't run the football, you could just feel the tension build and build and build and the pressure get more and more intense. And even the stadium itself, like the anxiety in the air, I've seen criticism of the crowd. I don't think it's fair.
I thought the crowd was there and they were loud and it was a great environment for the first half. And then everyone got anxious. Everyone got unsettled.
Because coming into this game, everyone expected Ohio State to win. I think even a lot of Michigan reporters and Michigan people who are around that team expected Ohio State to win this game. And so when it was going a different direction or it was very close in the second half and the offense was having the futility it was, you saw a lot of, I think, even some boos from the crowd, right?
But Ryan Day said after the game, you understand that frustration. You understand all the pain that's been tied up in this rivalry, not just for Ohio State's players and its coaches, of course, but the fans too, that's been tied up in this rivalry the past few years. And it's just like, oh, here we go again.
Thought it was going to be different. Ohio State's coming in as a three-score favorite at home. And now that anxiety hits you and it did feel like the team just tightened up.
And I think part of it too was, again, that reliance on the running game. The game got shortened a little bit because of also how Michigan ran the ball in spots. They put a few drives together, but I mean, really the defense played out of its mind in this game.
So you can't put too much on the defense. But it just felt like it just had that aura about it where you didn't get through that level of anxiety and play as loose and confident as you had done one week prior against Indiana. And I also wonder too how much of the quarterbacking had to do with that.
This was obviously the worst game of Will Howard's career. And he throws a couple interceptions, takes a big hit, is evaluated for a concussion. Don't know exactly to what extent he may or may not have been affected by that hit.
But in any case, I think that those struggles at that position, in addition to the fact you were unable to run the ball, just everything, the offense started playing tight. You could see it even in the way Carson Hinsman was snapping the ball where it felt like every third snap was bad and threw off the timing of a play. You could just see the emotion on the sideline and how much it was all weighing on them.
And ultimately, it played into the reason why they lost. And so, whether it's something psychological, you address and figure out why that happened. And then you hope, again, to go on a run and right the wrongs.
Because if you don't, it's going to be a very different looking program potentially next year.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah. I mean, you could see the clip, if you rewatch the game, Jack Sawyer makes the great interception on the goal line. And then the offense immediately goes free and out.
And they pan back to Jack Sawyer. And he just kind of had that look on his face like, really? I just made this great play.
We just had this super long drive go against us. We get up the field without allowing any points. And then you got to go right back out there again because the offense went free and out.
And it's a frustrating thing. It's one of those things. But I think even for the defense there, late in the game, while I'm not necessarily saying they were pointing fingers at anybody, I just think that when you're out there for so many plays, and then you make a big play, and then you immediately have to go right back out there without your team having scored, at some point, that frustration is going to mount.
At some point, you're just not going to play with the same level of confidence. And I think, to your point about the crowd, if you want the crowd to cheer, you've got to give them something to cheer about, right? So at least offensively, Ohio State didn't do that.
So you certainly can't put it on the crowd. Like I said, I think the crowd, before the game, I think particularly early in the game, I think the energy in the stadium was even more than it was against Indiana. I think it was a very raucous crowd.
You could feel it. An hour before the game, it was already packed in there, and it was loud. And I think there was a lot of energy in that stadium thinking, we're going to do it.
This is it. We're going to finally get revenge on that team for what happened the last three years. And it just gradually dissipated over the course of the game.
I think we felt the same way just watching it in the press box. You're thinking early in the game, oh, it's another slow start. They're going to come back.
I think for me, I think end of the first half, Ohio State, they go up tempo, they drive down the field, they tie the game. At that point, I'm thinking, all right, I feel like they're going to come out in the second half and take over the game. And then I think it was just kind of from there, as they couldn't get anything going offensively, you just kind of gradually, gradually started thinking, are they actually going to lose this game?
And then I think really the moment where you really felt that was late in the fourth quarter, the defense has a chance to stop Kalel Mullings in the backfield on third down. He breaks off for a 27-yard run. I think that was the point where it's like, they are going to lose this game.
You kind of felt it at that moment, like it's just not going to happen for whatever reason. They just can't figure it out in this game and Michigan's going to win this game. And again, I do not put it on the defense.
That's one play on a defense that was out there a lot more than it should have been in the fourth quarter because the offense couldn't get anything going. But we do want to move forward from that because Ohio State is going to be playing in the college football playoff in 17 days, most likely. I mean, there's a chance they could play a Friday night game on December 20, but seems most likely their first round game will be December 21.
It also seems likely that that game will be at home for Ohio State. And I think the one thing we do agree on, I think, is that's a game when we talk about Ryan Day, that absolutely could be a make or break game for Ryan Day in terms of whether he's Ohio State's coach next year. He was asked point blank on Wednesday if he expects to be at Ohio State next year.
He said yes. He's asked if he's ever thought of leaving Ohio State on his own. He said, no, this is a wonderful place and I've got a great job, one of the best jobs in America.
Ross Bjork has also expressed support for Ryan Day in an interview with the Columbus Dispatch on Sunday. He said, you know, Coach Day is a great job of leading our program. He's our coach, but didn't necessarily close the door, I wouldn't say, on making a change of what he said.
You know, his first quote was, you know, our full focus right now is on the college football playoff and making a strong run. At the end of the story from the Dispatch, you know, he was asked if he could be swayed by public opinion on Day, with certainly a lot of Ohio State fans having turned on Day and he said, let's go make a run of a playoff. That's all I'm going to say.
Let's go make a run of a playoff. That's what we've got to do. So I think that leaves the door open to where if things go wrong in the college football playoff, the possibility of Ohio State making a coaching change once this season ends still exists.
It was never going to happen before the CFP. As of now, you know, everybody at Ohio State is moving forward with the hope that Ohio State's going to go win the national championship and this conversation will go away. But I do think certainly that first round game, especially with it being a home game, Ryan Day better win that one.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah. You said make or break. I would drop the make personally.
It could definitely, I think losing that game to me should definitely break it. And you are fired pretty soon thereafter. I think a lot of fans would agree with that assessment.
Of course, there's still considerations about the future and arguments you could get into to keep Day around. But four straight years of not achieving your goals and not even ultimately coming close to any of them, other than I guess the Michigan game was a close game, but it was a Michigan team that you on paper should have beaten. So for me, I think it takes at least two, that's my personal opinion, two playoff wins for him to stick around.
But I could see why at least if you get one home playoff win and put a good showing on and a close quarterfinal loss, maybe there's a debate to be had about Day's future and his ability to win these kinds of games and get the program where the program knows it can and where it wants to go. There is going to be a lot of pressure on him. For me, Bjork's comments to your point, Dan, the entire undertone of it is talk to me after the college football playoffs because you're not going to dissuade any confidence behind your guy when you are going on a potential title run.
There's no reason to say, oh, he's on the hot seat. He's on the chopping block. We're considering this.
We're considering that when there's that's just going to put extra pressure, extra attention and circus around the team that's already got plenty of it coming off of this loss to going into the playoffs. So to me, Bjork's comments made a lot of sense. And again, it was that not closing the door on a coaching change.
It just reads like going to watch the results of the CFP first, hope they go on a big run, and then again, talk to me after the college football playoff. And that's where the team's full focus should be. Yeah.
[Dan Hope]
And just before we get off of that, I mean, I think, you know, realistically, like we know how these decisions are ultimately made, right? Like, ultimately, the decisions on Dave's future is going to come down to what do the donors want? Like, that's really like at the end of the day, I think particularly now with this athletic director change, I think Gene Smith was a guy who was very loyal to the people he hired.
And I think we saw that with Chris Holtman, where he probably kept Chris Holtman probably a year longer than he should have, because he really, you know, I think if Gene Smith was still the AD right now, I think my read on this situation would maybe be a little bit different, because I think Gene would maybe be more inclined to want to give Ryan Day another year regardless of what happens, whereas Ross didn't hire Ryan. So Ross is in a different situation.
And I mean, we saw it at Texas A&M with Jimbo Fisher, where, you know, they hired him to they they gave him a 10 year contract, fully guaranteed, and they made a change because the results weren't where they were supposed to be. And so I think that, you know, if, you know, if Ohio State was to lose in the first or second round or whatever, and then donors are like, yeah, we will pay for his buyout. We want to change.
Then a change could certainly happen. But if they say, we don't want to pay that $37 million buyout, we want to stick with Ryan Day, then Ryan Day's going to be the coach next year. I still, I still tend to lean on the side of thinking if he wins the first round playoff game, he will likely still be Ohio State's coach next year, regardless of what happens from there, because it is a big buyout.
Uh, at that point, you're getting into making a coaching change in January when the transfer portal will already have been closed for the first time. And then you'd be opening a brand new 30 day transfer portal window for your guys to leave when guys can't leave from other schools. And, and there's also just for reality.
And again, we will get in more into this if it actually gets to this point, but there's also the reality in my mind of like, there's not that obvious guy out there. Like, I think that's the one thing when you start thinking about if they were to make a change after a first round win, like if you lose in the quarterfinals and there's some guy out there that you really think like, this is the guy who's going to get us back on track against Michigan. This is the guy who's going to lead us to all of our goals.
Then you'd be more likely to make a change than if it's like, well, there's some good candidates out there, but are we really sure any of them is an upgrade? Ultimately, that's an assessment that Ross Bjork has to make. I know that, you know, there's a lot of excitement from people about the possibility of Mike Vrabel, whether or not he'd be interested.
I don't know, because I still tend to believe he would want to be an NFL coach. Uh, I, I would say, but I'm not buying the Urban Meyer coming back rumors. I just do not, do not see it.
Uh, I I'd be very surprised by that. You know, I, there's certainly other coaches out there. I mean, Marcus Freeman's a name that certainly comes to mind as an Ohio state alum and the success he's having at Notre Dame right now.
But you know, I, I, I think ultimately, first and foremost, you have to make a decision on whether Ryan Day is the right guy. You, you make that decision before you make any decision about who would be the next guy. You're looking at who's out there in case you need to make a change.
But you know, ultimately it comes down to whoever Ryan days, the right guy. And I think some of that too, you know, it's, I do think like if you lose the first round playoff game at home, like it's going to be hard to come back from that, I think beyond that, to speak in absolutes, I think probably isn't somewhere I would want to go. I think, you know, because there's a difference between, I mean, you know, depending on the seating and we'll get into that just a sec, like, let's say you're the eight seed as it has to be right now, and you're going to play Oregon of a Roseville, Oregon's the number one seed.
Like is, is any lost to Oregon? Yeah. You've already lost him once, but like, is any loss to the number one seed, like a disqualifier on Ryan day as a coach, if you go and get thumped, like that, then, then, you know, that's probably a different story.
Even if you lose in a tight game by a field goal where, you know, you, you played well enough to win. It just didn't go your way. So I think there's more nuance to it than just simply the matter of did you win or did you lose, but maybe not for the first round.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, see, the thing is with me for that is he is on the chopping block in my head right now. To me, he has to coach to get his job back. That's where I'm at.
Because four years in a row, you said the three goals every year, same thing, beat Michigan, win the big 10, win the national title, haven't done any of them. And again, this was an unacceptable loss, I think for a lot of people in Ohio state fandom. And then again, like we've discussed, those aren't the people that make these decisions.
Ultimately it's the boosters and that $37 million figure does have something to do with, hey, you know, that's a lot of money to fork over. And then you're trying to pay guys within IL still to keep them around. There's a lot of financial reasons to keep day another year.
I get that. But to me, I think he has to earn his job back. And for me, a home playoff win doesn't do that against a middle league team.
I think you have to, and this is just my opinion, I don't want to speak in absolutes either. I think there's absolutely a good chance they keep them around with a home playoff win, and then you go lose, like you said, possibly the number one seed in the playoffs. But that's the kind of thing I'd need to see for me to say, okay, he's earned his job back.
Because to me, he should be fired if nothing else were to happen. Like if the season just ended after Michigan, I think he would absolutely be fired. Right.
And so I just think he's got to do something to earn it back. And that's why for me, the standard is at least two, because that means he'll have beaten a significantly bigger challenge in that quarterfinal, likely. So that's just where I stand on it, sort of a thing.
Moving on, though, to who Ohio State could end up playing in that first round. It does seem prime position for a home game because Ward Manuel talked to him, or the public, the general national reporter landscape talked to him on a teleconference call after the playoff ranking show. And I think one of the main takeaways is that they're not going to move teams above or below each other that aren't playing conference championship game weekend.
And without that happening, there's not really a route for Ohio State to not be hosting. Like they'd have to get jumped by the Big 12 champion or something. It would be ridiculous like that.
So I would put it pretty like 99% Ohio State is going to host in the first round. As it stands, that would be the 8-9 game with them in Tennessee. But there's a few scenarios you look out there and you say, OK, this is a way that they could end up as a higher seed than the eighth seed.
And then that would obviously change the opponent you play in the first round. Oregon and Penn State, Ohio State owns a head-to-head win over Penn State. Obviously, Penn State would be in with a very high seed and a bye if they beat Oregon, and Oregon beat Ohio State plus has one fewer loss if they were to lose to Penn State.
So you can't see Oregon falling behind the Buckeyes, but you can definitely see Penn State. Dan, what do you think it would take? Is there a number that's a big enough loss for Penn State to drop below Ohio State in your eyes, or is it just they have to lose, or is it Penn State should be ahead of Ohio State no matter what because they went 11-1 and made the conference title game?
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, it's a tough question because, like you said, Ohio State does have that head-to-head win over Penn State, and Penn State also does not have a marquee win on its schedule. And so I think there's a very valid argument that Ohio State should jump Penn State if Penn State doesn't beat Oregon, particularly if Oregon wins by two scores or something, because Ohio State lost at Oregon by one point. So if Penn State loses in any kind of convincing way against Oregon, when you talk about data points, that right there is a valid data point that you could point to on Penn State and say, OK, they didn't play Oregon as competitively as Ohio State did, and they lost to Ohio State in their home stadium.
So how can we rank Penn State ahead of Ohio State? Now, you know, I'm in the camp in general, like I don't like the idea of punishing teams for playing in the conference championship game and picking up a second loss because, I mean, Penn State's won one more game than Ohio State. They won 11 games in a regular season when Ohio State only won 10.
And so, you know, I think if you think Penn State's better now, you know, should they really be punished if they just lose a close game to Oregon? I don't know. I don't know if they should, but I won't be surprised if they are.
I think I would probably guess it's more likely than not that Ohio State will jump Penn State if Penn State loses, because Ohio State has that head-to-head win and you'd have that comparable data point where Penn State's playing Oregon on a neutral site that's certainly closer to State College than Eugene, rather than Ohio State losing by one point on the road at Autzen Stadium. So, you know, we'll see how that game ultimately plays out, but I certainly won't be surprised if Ohio State ends up jumping Penn State. I think the thing that makes that tricky, though, is Penn State is currently two spots ahead of Georgia.
And so would Georgia also move below Ohio State if it loses to Texas? Because that one I have a harder time wrapping my head around just based on my resumes, because Georgia, I mean, you could, their win over Texas in a regular season is arguably the best win anybody's had in college football this year. You know, they've also beaten Tennessee.
They've beaten another team that's playing for a CFP berth this weekend in Clemson. You know, they had two losses to teams that are on the bubble of the CFP in Alabama and Ole Miss. So neither of those losses is nearly as bad as Ohio State's loss to Michigan.
Their strength of schedule is ranked as the third toughest in the entire sport this year. So should they be punished if they lose a conference championship game? To a team they've already beat?
I mean, I would, I would say no again, unless it's a blowout or something like that. Yes, they have had some close calls against teams they shouldn't have, including a game against Georgia Tech last weekend where they needed eight overtimes to beat Georgia Tech, but they still won at the end of the day. So it's weird because even though Penn State is ahead of Georgia right now, I still think it's more likely that Ohio State jumps Penn State than it jumps Georgia, assuming they both lose.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah. And again, I think a lot of that has to do with the head-to-head result, right? You have a win over Penn State.
And so you can compare those two teams and say, well, same number of losses. Penn State maybe doesn't look as that impressive against Oregon. You have that argument of, okay, well then they deserve to be below Ohio State because also Ohio State probably has better wins than Penn State.
The win at Penn State and the win against Indiana at home, two top 10 wins. I do think it was interesting because Ward-Manuel didn't really paint a big gap between Ohio State and Georgia either, although I do agree with you, Dan. I think the overall resume is just stronger for Georgia, and I don't think you should really be punishing teams that much for losing conference title games.
And so I don't really see a world unless Georgia gets blown out where they fall behind Ohio State. And you can make like the dominance argument if you want, like Georgia's looked iffy in more games against middling competition than Ohio State has. But Ohio State just lost to a pretty middling team in Michigan, even if Georgia almost lost to Georgia Tech too.
Of course, that was a crazy game. But for me, I'm with you. I don't really see the committee putting Georgia behind Ohio State, especially with some of the SEC leanings that have happened in the polls, even just this week with Alabama being placed firmly ahead of Miami, despite its two bad losses and three losses total, which Miami's 10 and 2.
But of course, Miami might not have as strong of wins, of course. And there was a whole debate there. But I just think the committee has leaned SEC on the whole, all things considered.
And so I do think it's much more likely that it is Penn State who would fall behind Ohio State and not Georgia, despite the fact that Georgia is directly one spot ahead of them.
[Dan Hope]
The other thing that we're really not going to know until Sunday is, is the committee going to manipulate the final rankings to get the matchups it wants? It insists it will not do that. But I think there's a lot of us that are kind of in that cynical boat of like, because I look at it when I was kind of doing my mock bracket based on what I think will happen this weekend.
I'm thinking, okay, Texas beats Georgia, Oregon beats Penn State. My feeling is then Notre Dame will be a five seed. Georgia will be the sixth seed.
Ohio State will be the seventh seed. Penn State will be the eighth seed. Tennessee will be the ninth seed.
Then Indiana will be the tenth seed. Well, does the committee really want an Ohio State-Indiana rematch? I mean, I don't know how much anybody really wants to see that because that game was not very competitive a couple weeks ago.
I think most people want to see Ohio State, maybe not Ohio State. I mean, I think Ryan Day, Ohio State would probably be happy to play Indiana because they'd go into that game with a lot of confidence because they've already beaten them very convincingly once, but in terms of a more compelling matchup for a national audience, like we can move Ohio State up to six and they play Alabama, or we could keep them at eight and they play Tennessee and both of those would be more compelling matchups. So the cynic in me tends to think, even if resumes would suggest Ohio State should be the seventh seed, if Indiana is the tenth seed, maybe they're more inclined to keep Ohio State at eight or move Ohio State up to six to get that more desirable made-for-TV matchup with either Tennessee or Alabama.
[Andy Anders]
I'd agree and I've said it too. I don't think they want a rematch with Ohio State at the end of this fight. And that could also mean going back on their word and moving Alabama ahead of Indiana or something like that to manipulate it on the opponent's side.
[Dan Hope]
That'd be a bad look, though. That'd be really hard to justify. So it's a lot more justifiable, the things you can play with in terms of like Ohio State versus Georgia and Penn State, if those two teams lose, I think you can justify any order of those three teams to kind of get you the matchups you want.
Cause my, my way I see my feeling is if let's say SMU beats Clemson, then Alabama is going to be that 11 seed. You know, if Clemson beats SMU, maybe that gives you a little more wiggle room of both seeds because then you could say, well, you know, we can keep SMU in the field over Bama. And then you could kind of have a little more wiggle room of what you, where you put SMU versus Indiana.
But I, you know, if we, if we just take the hypothetical Oregon wins, Texas wins, SMU wins. I think really the, the area where you have manipulative room is the Georgia, Ohio State, Penn State order. And so, you know, again, they have said time and time again, we are not focusing on rematches conferences, whatever we're just focusing on ranking the teams and if, and if, you know, we'll know on Sunday, like on Sunday, if, if there's, if a rankings all makes sense and there's a rematch in there, but we'll go, Hey, they were telling the truth, but you know, I don't, you know, I, I think until that actually happens, there's going to be some cynicism going into Sunday of like, and they really going to do what they think makes the most sense from a rankings perspective, or are they going to try to get the most desirable matchups for ESPN and TNT?
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, that, that will definitely be one of the more interesting things to follow non Ohio State wise, obviously, because that's who we cover with this whole rankings is do they ultimately follow their words in that respect? I think out of those teams that we're talking about here, I think potential candidates for Ohio State, depending on where they fall, seating wise, Tennessee, Indiana, Alabama are definitely the three most likely. And again, I would agree with you and you probably put Indiana lower on that list because of, you know, the committee really secretly probably wants to avoid rematches.
The only other candidate you could throw in there, I think is the big 12 champion, because there's a scenario and I don't think this is going to be what would happen, but there's a scenario where Ohio State ends up as the six seed moving ahead of both Penn State and Georgia, and then the big 12 champ jumps Alabama and ends up as the 11 seed instead of the 12 with Boise state, of course, getting the fourth first round by for a conference champion.
[Dan Hope]
Um, and then you end up with a six, the 11 game or Ohio State is playing the big 12 champion, but, and also that, yeah, also the other possibility there too, is if the, if the committees decides we want to put the big 12 champ in the top four, Boise's already ahead of Alabama. So like if Boise wins, you can't move Boise below Alabama. Right.
Based on what you said, you can't move Boise below Alabama. So that would be the other way to do it too. Is like, if they decide, because I know like our, like I'm, I'm with you.
Like, I think if Boise wins, they're going to get the four seed, but I know like, you know, our Garrick Hodges among those who thinks like they're going to put the big 12 in the top four at the end of the day, like they could decide. Whoever wins big 12 vault them all the way up. So they're in the top four, then Boise could get that 11 seed and then Bama could be the 12 seed.
And then Ohio State could face Ashton Gentee in the first round.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah. And to that point, I mean, Boise state could still lose the Mountain West championship too. So that's, that's another possibility that exists.
[Dan Hope]
Certainly.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, exactly. So there, and then you end up playing, then it would be obviously Indiana, Tennessee or Alabama in that scenario. But, um, I think out of those possible matchups, other than again, the scenario where Ohio State ends up playing the big 12 champion or even Boise, I think the least favorable matchup for me for Ohio State is with Tennessee because Tennessee has an elite defensive line, much like Michigan's.
It's going to be really cold in the shoe. I haven't looked at the forecast for December 21st, but I can't imagine it's going to be warm. Um, and running the football is again, going to be a big emphasis.
And so this offensive line, how shoddy it looked against Michigan, certainly. And I thought there were a lot of underlying concerns in the Indiana game. I had mentioned that I was very cautiously optimistic, uh, going into that Michigan game about the offensive line because there were some subtle things, it's like, uh, they didn't really perform as well as some people were saying in that Indiana game.
Uh, ultimately did enough for a blowout, of course, but, uh, didn't foresee what happened against Michigan happening. But that offensive line, if you get paired with a Tennessee defensive line, that can really impose its will and maybe shut the offense down again, because it's going to be cold again, possibly windy, like that could, and then Tennessee's got a great running game with, you know, one of the, one of the better backs in college football too. So that's a, for me, the least favorable matchup of the group.
Uh, Dan, where do you stand on that? Maybe who would be the best team for Ohio state to face out of those we've mentioned?
[Dan Hope]
Yeah, I think it's Indiana again. I mean, I think, I mean, because Ohio state's already proven they can beat Indiana convincingly. I mean, it's always hard to beat a team twice, but I don't think anything about Indiana would scare you going into that second matchup based on how well you've already played them once at Ohio stadium.
So I think you'd feel really confident going into that matchup. I would agree that Tennessee is the most challenging matchup though. You know, I think Alabama would certainly present its own challenges as well.
You think, you know, Jalen Milrow, you know, how dynamic he can be as a dual threat quarterback. Ohio state's had its share of struggles defending mobile quarterbacks this year. And so I think either one of those matchups has the potential uh, to be a challenge for you.
I mean, I think like, if you just think from a storylines perspective, like the Alabama matchup is probably the most fun matchup because you think Caleb Downs playing against Alabama again. Uh, you know, I just think that's, that, that, that would certainly be a fun matchup. Tennessee would be a fun matchup as well.
So, you know, I, I think either of those two are going to pose their own set of challenges, but I would agree with you that out of the likely matchups at this point, I think Tennessee is the one that, you know, if I'm Ohio state, I would least want, because I think they're the one that on both sides of a ball is going to pose the toughest matchup.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah, I'd agree. Um, well let's, I guess let's get into some predictions now, because what, what, how do we exactly think it's going to play out? I think for me, where I would go, um, I think Oregon's going to beat Penn state handily in the Big 10 championship game and Penn state's ultimately going to fall behind Ohio state.
I think Georgia stays above them, even if they lose to Texas. Although I foresee that being a pretty good SEC title game, because I don't think either of those teams have proven to be that elite, but they're both good. And so I think that'll be a really tight SEC title game.
The way I see it playing out is Ohio state ends up with the seventh seed and then to avoid, and then, um, I guess that would put them against Indiana in the first round of the committee sticks to its word. Um, but we'll, we'll see how that goes. That's kind of just how I see it falling.
Um, there, Dan, where do you have it?
[Dan Hope]
Yeah. I mean, I'm, I'm right there with you. It's just, it's again, it's just that question of like, is the committee actually going to stay true to its word and avoid and not worry about avoiding rematch?
I mean, I think if they just rank it based on merit and what makes the most sense in terms of resumes, I think if Penn state loses, I think there's a good chance Ohio state jumps. Penn state is the seven seed. And I think Indiana is very likely to be the 10 seat.
And so, you know, I think if, if those games play out the way we think they're going to play out, I think the seven seed is the most likely destination for Ohio state. It just becomes a matter of, do they really want to make that change? Do they really want to set up, you know, what, what, what could likely be a rematch in that scenario?
Or do they find a way around that?
[Andy Anders]
Also want to talk about this Ohio state recruiting class that was just signed number five class in the country. You gain turbo Rogers, awesome name, Bo Jackson and turbo Rogers in the backfield. Right.
So, uh, this is a, uh, very, I like that combo in the running back. You lose Naeem Offord. The constellation is you still have the number one cornerback of the country in Devin Sanchez.
Uh, Dan, just overall thoughts on the recruiting class before we get out of here.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah. I mean, I think there's certainly some players to be excited about. I mean, it starts of course, with a five-star quarterback, Tavian St. Clair, a guy who has been all Buckeye, uh, from the beginning, uh, committed less than a month after they offered him back in 2023, and it's just been, uh, all in with Ohio state ever since he's been at pretty much every home game. He's been the leader of this class along with Devin Sanchez, as you mentioned, I think those two guys, both top 10 overall prospects in this class, they they've just been all in with the Buckeyes from the beginning. They've been great leaders for this class. And I think those two guys really stand out as guys to be excited about.
Uh, I think, you know, the linebacker class is really strong. They, they, they held off a late push from Miami to get Tarvis Offord. They also got Riley Petajohn, who's a borderline five-star there up a linebacker position.
I think both of those guys have the potential to be elite linebackers for the Buckeyes. Like you mentioned, I mean, it's, it's hard not to get excited about a guy named Bo Jackson. Especially when you look at his measurables, a guy who's, you know, a 215 pound running back, who's supposedly run a four free 40.
Like, Oh, that kind of sounds like the, or Bo Jackson. So I think he's a guy certainly to get excited about. I think, you know, Carter Lowe's a really good in-state offensive lineman.
Quincy Porter's a guy who I think is kind of flown under the radar compared to some of the other highly touted wide receivers Ohio state has landed in recent years, but I think he has a lot of potential to be an elite, one of the next elite wide receivers for Ohio state. I think, you know, Nate Roberts is a guy who has the ability to be a really good tight end. And so I think there's a lot of quality players in this class.
It is a little bit of a disappointment right now, but we're talking about Ohio state for number five class. Cause you know, I remember having Garrett Codge on him a summer and I remember telling him like, I'll believe the number one class in the country when I see it, but there was a lot of hype and hope at that time that Ohio state could close, but number one recruiting class in the country, and it's kind of been a theme here in recent years of Ohio state. Uh, they they've struggled to close a little bit on the recruiting trail in terms of, you know, getting that number one class it's like they, they, they always seem to lose somebody like a name offered in the late stretches and they don't necessarily always replace that guy with, you know, someone of similar caliber.
So I think it's a little disappointing to have just the number five class. It's still a very strong class with a lot of quality. I think, you know, if you're looking to poke holes in this class, you're going to look in the trenches, which, you know, we're, again, we're just coming off the game against Michigan and it's been the theme, uh, struggling in the trenches, especially on the offensive line.
And you look at this class, like I mentioned, Carter Lowe, a really good prospect to other linemen in his class, Jayvon McFadden, Jake Cook. But you know, the original goal was to get like five linemen in this class. You only got three, you missed out on some other top targets.
And so it's another class, but I think, uh, you know, Justin Fry has come up short unless they can pull off an 11th hour win for David Sanders jr. Which as we're recording here on Wednesday afternoon, still has not signed his, uh, paperwork with Tennessee. Uh, you know, the feeling he, he made visit to Ohio state two weekends ago, Ohio state was feeling very confident at the time that optimism kind of waned last weekend when he didn't return from a Michigan game, Tennessee felt like it had done enough to close the deal there, but as we're recording here, Wednesday afternoon, hasn't signed yet.
A feeling is he's not going to sign today. So still a glimmer of hope there, maybe that Ohio state could get back in that recruitment. And if it can, that would, you know, some of a disappointment I just talked about that would, that would really spin a lot of that, uh, back in a positive direction, but, you know, short of that, I think Ohio state is going to have to be really aggressive in the transfer portal in terms of, uh, adding both starting caliber veterans and depth to its offensive line, because I just don't think the recruiting at that position has, has been where it needs to be the last few years and, you know, defensive line as well, I think is another area where you lost two commitments in the last few weeks before signing day from Zaheer Mathis and London Merritt. They were able to close the deal with Zion Grady.
Uh, there was a late push from Auburn there, but Ohio state was able to hold them off and get Zion Grady in the class. So that was a big win for a top 100 defensive end from Alabama. They also on Wednesday afternoon were able to flip.
I don't, I'm not positive on how to pronounce his name, but I'll take my best shot at the Satana lay, uh, from St. John Bosco in California. Uh, he was committed to UCLA. They were able to flip him into the class as well.
Uh, avoiding a disastrous outcome there in terms of that defensive end class, but still disappointing to miss out on Zaheer Mathis and London Merritt. And that is another position, uh, where Ohio state has had a trend of late in the cycle losses leading up to signing day on the defensive line. And so I think those are the two positions I look, I look at and go.
If they, if they could have landed one or more, one or two more top targets at each of those positions, we'd be talking about this being an elite class. I think the misses there is where you've, you feel a little bit of a let down. Even though there's still a lot of great talent in this class.
[Andy Anders]
Yeah. And I think it goes back to, you would have liked to see Frey cast a wider net in the offensive line recruiting. And again, if they end up pulling off the last minute upset for David Sanders and a lot of that gets, you know, overwritten, but I just think, you know, Javon McFadden's a nice prospect.
Carter Lowe was a nice lay up in state. He's a really good player. I think he's going to have a really good career at Ohio state.
Uh, but the, I just think you didn't have enough depth in the class and you didn't have enough, just like high end talent either, like they're, they're Jake Cook's a fine developmental piece. I just don't like it. It's just not there.
The power that you need, the ammunition that you need, especially coming off this season, where you, Justin Frye did a great job coaching the offensive line in terms of development based on how they played at the start of the season. When they were fully healthy, even after the Josh Simmons injury, they kept things going and John Simmons gets out for the season, you figure things out for Penn State and then Seth McLaughlin goes down and the offensive line has been a bit of a catastrophe since really with, with coming off of that Michigan game. And so you didn't have the depth there.
And offensive line is one of the hardest positions to build depth at. I've talked about this before. It's a, there's a much bigger premium on good offensive linemen than there is almost any other position.
It's, it's hard to find really good offensive linemen, but you're Ohio state. You need to have enough depth that two injuries don't cripple you. And that's just a failure of recruiting and developing that depth over the course of the years, even dating back to Greg Stradrawa, Ohio State just hasn't had elite offensive line recruiting any time in its recent past.
And they, there's been a few prospects that they've hit on that were big wins, but they just haven't built out that depth and really solidified to the trenches. And so, yeah, you're going to have to be really aggressive in the transfer portal because Josh Simmons has already said he's going to the NFL draft. I think that was the one thing, like if you could have gotten thrown out of big and IL bag and gotten on your hands and knees and pleaded, Josh, please come back.
Sorry for hitting my microphone, Josh, please come back. You know, maybe then you just need one tackle in the portal, but now you've probably got to go get to, because I frankly don't know with Josh Fryer and Josh Simmons leaving, like who's going to be that guy that's next at the offensive tackle position. Like you're, you're talking about like Zygmuchalski, who definitely didn't look good in his turn.
I'm talking about like, you know, some of the young backups, like a George Fitzpatrick is who are next in line and none of you have no one on the roster now that's going to be on the roster next year at offensive tackle that has shown you they are capable of playing Ohio state caliber ball. And so you probably need to go get at least two tackles in the portal as it stands because David Sanders was the one guy. And again, there's still a chance at an 11th hour flip.
I wouldn't bet on that happening, but there's still a chance of it. David Sanders was the one guy who could have come in and played as a freshman, which is very rare for offensive lineman, but he was, is that good. However, barring that, I think you've got to go out and at least get two tackles in the portal as things stand.
And, um, that is, again, like you said, the one area of this recruiting class that feels like it came up short, but still a lot of good pieces to like.
[Dan Hope]
Yeah. And, and interestingly, Ryan day did say at the end of this press conference on Wednesday, that they're going to be reevaluating that offensive line just for this year, going forward to the college football playoff, even said the possibilities on the table of potentially moving Donovan Jackson back inside. I don't know if I like that idea because of what you just said, but I don't feel very confident in any of the offensive tackles who would step in.
If he has to move back inside, especially if you're going up against someone like a James Pierce from Tennessee, but we're running out of time here. So we'll talk more about that next week. Call it by this time next week, we will know who Ohio state is playing in the college ball playoff.
So we'll begin to break that down, but transfer portal will also be open next week. So we'll certainly be starting to look at the developments that could take place there for the Buckeyes as, uh, the. Off season kind of starts to begin, even though, uh, the college football playoff is still to come.
So a busy time for the Buckeyes. We'll be continuing to cover all of it over at 11 warriors.com. And we hope you'll join us again next week on real pod Wednesdays.