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If you are seeking new ways to increase your ROI on marketing with your commerce platform, or you may be an entrepreneur who wants to grow your team and be more efficient with your online business.
Talk Commerce with Brent W. Peterson draws stories from merchants, marketers, and entrepreneurs who share their experiences in the trenches to help you learn what works and what may not in your business.
Keep up with the current news on commerce platforms, marketing trends, and what is new in the entrepreneurial world. Episodes drop every Tuesday with the occasional bonus episodes.
You can check out our daily blog post and signup for our newsletter here https://talk-commerce.com
Brent Peterson (00:02.23)
All right, welcome to this episode of Talk Commerce. Today I have Misha Zee and we've all agreed that I got his first name right. I was gonna, you know what, I should do it. I'm just gonna do it. Zvezdentov. Yeah, go ahead. Misha, do an introduction for yourself. Tell us your day-to-day role and maybe one of your passions in life. And pronounce your last name for me.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (00:19.414)
Ehhhhhh! Zzzz!
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (00:28.458)
Awesome. Yeah, sure. Misha Zvagintsov. Technically, if my Russian father heard me say that, he would say Zviggintsov. So that's really Zviggintsov. Phonetically, keep it simple. Zviggintsov. I just say Misha Z. My day-to-day role is I am obsessed with podcasting, not only my own podcast, which you are going to be on. By the way, Brent, can't wait. We've got the day scheduled.
But also, and anybody listening, watching can go to the table rush talk show. That's my podcast. Shameless plug. But yeah, all in on podcasting. I also help people guest speak on podcasts. So not only how to find them, what to email, how to get on them, but what to say, when to say it, get your call to action in line, get your bios done, all this stuff. So I'm on coaching calls all the time, coaching people.
being interviewed all the time, which I love, and then I'm interviewing people all the time and constantly falling further and further behind. What a gift.
Brent Peterson (01:37.966)
There you go. Well, I can definitely attest to the following further and further behind. So that's something that I definitely resonate with, yes. So, Misha, before we get into content, and I'm excited to talk about email and influencer marketing and all kinds of fun things today, but you have graciously volunteered, or let's just say, voluntold, to be part of the Free Joke Project. And all I'm gonna do is tell you a joke.
And all you have to do is say, should this joke be free or do you think someday somebody should, we could charge for it? Like there's gonna be a paywall on this joke, right? And I'm gonna guarantee this joke is fantastically great. So here we go. All you have to do is tell me what you think of it. I arrived early to the restaurant. The manager said, do you mind waiting a bit? I said, no. He said, good. Take these drinks to table nine.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (02:30.899)
Oh my gosh, paywall for sure.
Brent Peterson (02:34.226)
Oh good, all right. I think out of 200 and some episodes that's number five, but appreciate it.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (02:40.986)
If you're coming up with jokes like that consistently, you could definitely pay wallet. And I think if you, yeah, especially if you have better ones, you could give some for free and then pay while the others, right?
Brent Peterson (02:49.023)
Oh, all right.
Brent Peterson (02:54.27)
Oh, there you go. I will tell a secret that I don't write the jokes. I use the internet to find my jokes. I know it's crazy, right? No, actually, one thing that ChatGP2 is terrible at, and I haven't found any of the good AI platforms yet, none of them tell jokes well. They're just garbage. And I even, like on my own website, I have a joke, some jokes, and I did some like,
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (03:03.771)
Right chat GPT you can ask it to put different spins on it too.
Brent Peterson (03:23.894)
Give me 10 commerce jokes. My podcast is taught commerce. It is, they're horrible. They're the worst jokes in the world. Yeah, so you're better to find an old book and I do have some books here for dad jokes. You're better to find a book and then just memorize some dad jokes out of a book than it is, don't ask Chad GPT. Or maybe, yeah, go ahead.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (03:40.526)
Hey, I love it. Well, I was gonna say what's cool about what you're doing is you're consolidating all that information. You're putting your passion for jokes, consolidating that information, providing value by giving some for free and perhaps some of the best ones behind the paywall. So I think that that's amazing. You had a joke in your email. To me, we were sending an email back and forth and where is that? I can't remember what it was, but I was like, this is amazing.
Brent Peterson (04:00.268)
Yeah.
Brent Peterson (04:04.752)
Yeah, that's right.
Brent Peterson (04:08.562)
Yeah. Yeah, well, I don't know if it's amazing, but I appreciate it, thank you.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (04:09.85)
So I'd love your.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (04:14.692)
All right. Amazing is a stretch saving, saving communities or something. That's amazing. Having. Yes.
Brent Peterson (04:16.85)
Yeah. Yes, exactly. Yeah, and then dreaming one day that I'll be a professional comedian, that's not gonna happen. Yeah.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (04:29.318)
No. Hey, you asked me about a passion too. Before we get into marketing and influencer marketing and all that kind of stuff, I think you said, what's a passion that I have? Yeah. No problem. I just, I was so into my pitch that I forgot about the question. So no, I love yoga. Man, I just love
Brent Peterson (04:38.311)
Yeah, what's a passion here? I'm sorry, I skipped right over it. I started talking before I even got to it. I apologize.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (04:58.418)
I was going to say jogging, but you probably smack me on the side of the head. If I said jogging, running marathons, half marathons, whatever, but I'm imagining my passion for yoga and what it does for me meditative wise, connecting me to source, God, the universe, whatever, just creating that space. Um, so we have all in on yoga and the mindfulness practices around it. There you go.
Brent Peterson (05:24.746)
Yeah, no, I also enjoy yoga. I will admit that a couple years ago I was injured and I did take up yoga every day. It does help because I think as an older runner, I'm an older runner. And I can say jogger, you can say jogger. I don't run very fast. So that yoga definitely is something that everybody needs and it is only a benefit to you as an athlete to do the things that your body, like.
And in any athlete, you're doing something repetitive and your, your muscles are getting used to that one thing. So my flexibility and my hips are terrible. You know, my wife is all, does yoga and we will both do the frog thing or whatever. And you know, she's like, well, why can't you get down that low? Well, no, I can't. My, I physically, my muscles won't do it right now. So I need to just take some time and it's definitely on my, on my radar to get back into it. And, uh, we also have a Jack Russell Terrier.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (06:11.72)
Yeah.
Brent Peterson (06:20.43)
And my routine was get down in the basement, turn, just like I do, I watch a video for yoga. And the Jack Russell would sit there and I'd throw the ball back and forth in the middle of my yoga because he's just a success with fetching a ball. So anyways, that's my yoga story.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (06:37.274)
Hey, amazing. I was gonna say you think about cyclists, cyclists that get to be our age if they're still cycling and they've been doing it their whole lives. I think you call it they're pronated, right? So they're, they're hunched forward, their hips are forward, their shoulders are forward. And after a lifetime of that, if you can jump into some yoga, it can, it can, it can reverse that process and, and open you up.
And if you think about any activity that we perhaps making it into our 50s, I actually don't know how old you are. If you're not in your 50s yet, I apologize. But I actually lose track of how old people look, the older I get, I can't tell anymore. I just can't tell it. Yeah, right. Um, yeah. So yeah, fountain of youth, yoga is absolutely the fountain of youth.
Brent Peterson (07:21.194)
Yeah, that's a good thing, right? Yeah, I'm 57. There you go.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (07:32.122)
I've traveled all over. I've been to other countries to practice yoga. I'm very blessed to be in Encinitas, California, which is probably one of the yoga capitals of the world. Like Yogananda Parmahansa Nanda, you know, was hanging out here, the Self-Realization Fellowship and great teaching. And for a while, I was so into it that I loved going to the retreats and all those sorts of things.
Anyway.
Brent Peterson (08:03.306)
Yeah, I mean I you know I was in I was in the software space for a long time and And I'm a big promoter of movement and I think as people that are sitting at their desks Are sitting doing just sitting right and they they're so busy. They can't even have they don't have time for run They don't have time for yoga. They don't have time to stretch They don't have time to do anything other than sit at their desk and do their work and I I'm a firm believer that is such
that you need a balance. You not only need a work-life balance in terms of seeing your family and doing other things other than work, but you need a physical balance.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (08:41.238)
Absolutely. I'll tell you this too. My father passed away 13 or 14 years ago, something like that. I've lost track. And I tell you this because I grew up in Jackson Hall, Wyoming. And my father, he was a mountain man, hippie lawyer, but just loved the mountains. And he was just, he was a yogi at the same time. So he had started doing yoga in the mid to early sixties.
It was so powerful in his life, especially as a single dad. So he basically raised my brother and I, and he was into meditation and yoga. And so I'd learned a lot of, I don't know, by osmosis, a lot of the power of that. But what was interesting was the yoga space was not big enough for the both of us, right? So I was like, I'm not doing yoga, my dad's doing yoga.
fully contemptuous into my early 40s. And then he passed away and I was cleaning out his effects at his house. And I found his yoga practice. I found his meditation books. I found all this stuff. And it was like the torch in that moment was handed to me. And I was like, this is how you make it through your single dad. Cause I was divorced, still divorced. At the time I was divorced and.
And I was like, oh, I get it. And I'll say even more about that. So the torch was handed to me. I went all in on yoga. People had been telling me for years, you're basically a yogi. You need to be doing yoga. Finally, there was enough space in the yoga world, but the power of breath and being able to slow down and really be in touch with your breath translates out into your life. So.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (10:39.191)
It gives me that opportunity to pause when agitated. Because if you're in a strenuous yoga class and you're hitting that point of tension and you can breathe through it, right? And then all of a sudden that's translating out into my life, into those moments of stress at work with my kids. I'm able to just, hey, that's a tense moment. I can breathe through this, you know?
Brent Peterson (11:05.258)
Yeah, I mean that is such a practical advice for anybody that's in business or is in interaction with other people, right? I'm part of Entrepreneurs' Organization and we believe in always sharing our experiences like, so we don't give advice, but we try not to give advice anyways. So sharing your experience like that is a great example of how...
Hopefully somebody has heard that and they say, oh, you know, I should try that. And I think I could get something out of that. And part of that is that experience that you take in doing that and sharing it with others. Thank you for that, I appreciate it.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (11:46.906)
Yeah, indeed. And what did you say you were a part of? What was the group?
Brent Peterson (11:50.834)
It's called Entrepreneurs Organization. It's global, there's a chapter in San Diego, they've got a great chapter in fact. EO, EONetwork.org, it's a volunteer led organization, so it's a peer group for people that own a business.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (12:08.426)
I'm taking notes furiously eonetwork.org love it. I'll check it out and there is a San Diego chapter. I'm I love networking any opportunities to have more in person I love the in person stuff so anyway.
Brent Peterson (12:12.619)
Yeah.
Brent Peterson (12:25.086)
Yeah, so tell us a little bit about what you're doing now. And I'm particularly interested in the influencer marketing portion of it. I was called an influencer yesterday and I never really thought I was, but maybe in my own little tiny space I am.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (12:41.09)
Yeah, boy, that's so such a great, great question and such a great frame. Because I think we lose track as having a podcast, you have a platform, me having a podcast, the Table Rush talk show, I've got a platform. And whether I've got one listener or 10 listeners, or 1000 listeners, depending on the content I'm delivering,
I'm influencing people. And then, Talk Commerce, your podcast, you get to interview people, and you get to bring on people such as myself, or I've seen your guest list, awesome. And then we get to influence willing minds, bodies, and souls by the conversations we have with people. Just like I went on my little yoga riff, which...
has really been transformational in my life. I guarantee you somebody in your audience listens and goes, Oh my gosh, I need to do some yoga. I'm tired of yelling at my kids. I'm tired of my kids are in their teens and I'm still fighting with them. This is insane. Right? So yeah, yoga can help you pause when agitated. Anyway, influencer marketing. So you've got a podcast and
I'll speak to guest speaking on podcasts. And when people think about that, let's say the common man or somebody who's not really active in the podcast space, I think they immediately go, well, yeah, I wanna speak on Joe Rogan's podcast or Jordan Peterson's podcast or what's that lady's name who's super powerful in the young entrepreneur woman space. That's.
I think her name is. She's just blowing up in the podcast land. And so people go, Oh, yeah, I need to speak on Joe Rogan. And I go, well, no, actually, you don't. Like, if, if you have a message that you want to get out to the world, you have, you're being called to share your experience, strength and hope, let's say, and I'll speak to, let's say people in our 50s, like you and me, like I'm
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (15:00.89)
I've retired out of my original sales career so I could teach yoga and get my kids through school. You sold a business or retired out of software, I think I heard you say, right? So we, I'm, I like being productive or feel like I'm adding value or really serving. It's like if I'm serving.
Brent Peterson (15:11.85)
Mm-hmm.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (15:25.37)
you know, God and the people about me, like I feel fulfilled and life is good for me, almost no matter the circumstances. And, and so
people who are maybe in their 40s or 50s who are retiring or wanting a new career or something like that. And they're called and they have a message they wanna get out. Well, podcast guest speaking is a great way to do it. And I'm gonna try and cut to the chase here. Let's just say, for example, that you have a captive audience of a hundred listeners per episode versus Joe Rogan that's got five million or whatever the absurd number is.
But if I said to you, hey, I can give you a stage where you can bring your message and speak directly to a hundred people, is that a value to you? And most people in that moment, they go, oh my gosh, yes. Like if I could have a stage with 10 people where I have a captive audience of 10 people that have a slice of my audience, I guess it's just so powerful. And...
Did I answer your question or am I, did I, my gosh, got off on a tangent? I'll let you talk for a sec.
Brent Peterson (16:40.062)
No, that's great. I mean, I think the idea of being on a podcast to try to get some of your thoughts across is a great way of... In the partner world, you would do a webinar with another partner and you would both have some commonality in that and help that... So it's a platform to get your message across. As a podcast host, I think we both talked about that. This is a great way to learn.
specific things that are happening in our industry. And you have a chance to pick the type of guests that you would like to have on your show to kind of help frame that learning, right?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (17:21.062)
Yeah, such a great way to say it. Indeed. Yeah, we get to learn. I'm constantly, I love learning and I'm super curious, which probably brings me to, you know, being a good podcaster or it's a labor of love. Whether my podcast is having success on any given day or not, and that's super fleeting, right? Some days I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm so smart. My podcast is crushing it.
And other days I'm like, this is, what am I even doing? But it is a labor of love. A lot of times it can feel like we're talking to the void, yes?
Brent Peterson (17:59.566)
Oh, yeah, definitely. Tell us a little bit about both, you know, the reason you came up with the podcast and then why somebody should be searching to be on a podcast. Should there be some kind of central point? And then when they get on that podcast, how should people behave? Should they be...
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (18:01.274)
Yeah, yeah, go ahead.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (18:24.465)
Yeah.
Brent Peterson (18:25.398)
Let me just, one last little bit. Should they be salesy? And the answer is obvious, but maybe people don't understand. Should they be overtly selling whatever they're trying to do? Or should they be giving somebody a solution?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (18:39.53)
Yeah, great, great question. I originally started my podcast, it's a long story, but I had come out of retiring, burnout in the home loan business. I was great at it, sales, loved it, loved all about it. Telemarketing, knocking on doors, sending out flyers, everything, loved it. Overnight, it became very painful. And you know, I'd been through a divorce and all this stuff and my parents died in rapid succession and...
And the universe was like, you need to retire and get your kids through school. I was like, no, my identity is a business guy. I'm successful. I crush it. And the universe was like, all right, we'll just make your work harder. And so I stayed in it about two years too long. Hey, there's the apple thumbs up. I need to turn that off. But fast forward, kids get through high school, off into college, have their girlfriends, their jobs. I have two boys, they're...
and 23 now. And when they were getting ready to be done with high school, my youngest Waylon, that entrepreneurial fire was burning. I was like, all right, it's time to get back into the entrepreneurial marketing world. And I fell into Russell Brunson's funnels. You know who Russell Brunson is,
Okay, awesome. Yeah. So Joe and I don't, I always go big. I joined his $25,000 a year program. I'm doing it. Probably did that too early too, because I was so wide and what I was doing testing, trying and learning testing,
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (20:38.218)
Whether you on the YouTube channel, that's debatable, but he's like, if you're on any of social media, you can get shut down anytime. If you are dependent on ads for your inflow of business, you can get shut down at any time. So get a platform, start talking. So I started what was called the bitch slap the accelerated path to peace podcast because I had been whacked so hard in the side of the head by the universe.
but had this rebirth and it's happened to me a few times in my life. First I got clean and sober when I was 17. I've been clean and sober ever since. Judge Rank said to me, hey, you can either go to jail for a long time or you can clean up your act and go to treatment. And I was like, treatment it is. And by the grace of God, it's stuck, right? And so that's like that, I'm sorry I'm swearing. And anyway, that was the bitch slap moment, right? And then I got a...
I gotta quit my job and get my kids through school. Made my work was so painful. I was just getting smacked on the side of the head by the universe or God or call it whatever you will. And so I was like, oh my gosh, there's so many people that have so many stories like that. And there's this rebirth moment that comes from those really tough times. Hopefully if we can get out of victim mode or however you want to say it, or what do I need to learn? How do I need to change? How can I grow? How can I...
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (22:11.216)
And so I started that podcast super fun. It was great. Did a whole bunch of episodes interviewed a ton of amazing people telling these stories of rebirth. And then as I was testing and trying and moving on and moving on and moving on. I was like, I really love the entrepreneur space and the marketing space and I just love it so
I'm gonna rebrand as the Table Rush Talk Show, which it is now. And so anybody listening, watching, and I'm sure you're aware of this Brent, maybe not, but you'll get it. This speaks to as well that clear and not clever, many mentors, Russell Brunson being one of them as well in his coaching program, they were constantly telling me clear and not clever, clear and not clever. And I tend to lean towards clever. Table Rush Talk Show tends to lean towards clever.
But when somebody speaks from stage or speaks at a webinar, and if they do a really good job, everybody gets up and goes to buy, so they rush to the back of the room to buy, hence the table rush, right?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (23:20.326)
So now I'm in the, yeah, yeah. So yeah, and then, so there's, that's my podcasting. And then there was like a part two and three to the question. I think one was, why get on the podcasts or?
Brent Peterson (23:20.702)
Yeah, no, that's good, yeah.
Brent Peterson (23:34.654)
Yeah, why get on it, and then how should you behave while you're on it?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (23:38.678)
Oh, yeah, yeah. Love that. So I think another thing too, that people miss is, is people go. So I have this guy Phil, he's amazing hustle Phil. He is crushing it right now and he does affiliate marketing. Okay, he is an affiliate marketing genius. Okay. And so he comes to me and says, Hey, I want to go on a I want to go on a podcast guest speaking tour.
I want to go on an influence tour is what I like to call it. I want to go start guest speaking on podcasts. Say, okay, I can help with that, right? And so he starts thinking that he can only go on podcasts that speak to affiliate marketers or maybe online marketing for solopreneurs or he's thinking very myopically. Maybe that's not the right word, but he's pigeonholed himself.
into where this audience is that can help, who he can help. He's got a great, great story. So I said to him and his assistant, Danielle, who Danielle runs the Influence Tour for him. But basically I said, look, you could go speak on, for example, real estate podcasts, because the real estate market.
has really gone sideways, not that prices have gone down, but that realtors, there's not much business out there. So prices are stable and rising perhaps, but a lot of realtors are suffering. I was like, you've got a whole group of salespeople out there that were perhaps having a whole bunch of success and now the market has turned on them that would probably
love to hear your story of rebirth as an affiliate marketer. And those realtors would probably love something new and love to jump into your program into your thing. Right. And his brain just went him and Danielle they were like, Oh my gosh, like, there are so many different ways to look at a slice of an audience. Right. And I think too, that
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (26:03.634)
really, I just need a portion of the audience to be right fit, if you wanna say, yeah? Yeah, cool, yeah. And then should I sell or not? And I'm gonna give you, generally speaking, no. Hopefully, what I teach my people is how to tell stories like this. Like, let's get your story bank in line so you know what to say, when to say it, so you can answer the question in a thoughtful way and add value.
Brent Peterson (26:12.394)
Yeah, that's good.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (26:32.378)
You spoke to that Brent like that's how we add value by telling the stories of Of change success failure, right? And what can people learn from that? um
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (26:45.05)
And so some podcasters want you to sell. I have been on podcasts where they're like, I'm counting on you coming in on here and selling. It's almost like a webinar, like a pitch, right? Like get on here and pitch. But anyway, I'm gonna say 95% of the podcasts, they just wanna have an engaging conversation. The hosts like you, Brent, you wanna learn and you wanna feel like...
I'm adding value to your audience, right, for free. And so that's what I like to do. I love it. I'm passionate about what I do. I could talk about it all day. And I know that perhaps one of your listener goes, well, man, this guy's kind of got his act together about this podcasting stuff. And I like yoga. Maybe I'll reach out to him, right? Yeah.
Brent Peterson (27:41.151)
Yeah, there you go.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (27:43.006)
There you go. So anyway.
Brent Peterson (27:45.546)
You mentioned earlier some of the different things that content creators can do. There is a great conference that happens in the spring for the content entrepreneur at CEX. It's in Cleveland. I think it's CEX conference, whatever. CEX, it's in Cleveland in May about content entrepreneurs. And they talk about the same thing you just said. You could have a podcast, you should have a blog, and certainly don't put your.
all your money on a social channel like Twitter, Facebook, or Instagram. And the other one they talked about was books. What is your feedback on writing a whole book and should anybody even try to do that nowadays?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (28:24.39)
Oh my gosh, yes, for sure. If you have, man, I can't wait to write my book on how to get speak on podcasts. Like I'm collecting all the stories. I can't wait to write it. And there's some other books in me, but I think as a tool to, it's like the joke scenario we talked about earlier. You're giving out your, what's Russell Brunson say?
It's the same content delivered in a different package. So people can learn about what I'm doing by podcasting. They can learn about what I'm doing. If I were to write a book, they can learn about what I'm doing by joining my membership. They can learn about what I'm doing by one-on-one coaching or group coaching or masterminds and all this stuff. And I think it's really crazy. If you look at Russell Brunson and
Brent Peterson (28:58.52)
Right.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (29:23.89)
what he teaches. He literally is doing that he will give content for free.
or he'll deliver it in a different way. It's the same content, because I've been through it, and coaching or high-end coaching or higher-end coaching. So I think a book is an amazing tool to bring people into the fold. And I can't wait to write my first book. I hope I answered the question.
Brent Peterson (29:52.018)
Yeah, that was great. I mean, I think some of the other things they had talked about and just to kind of keep on the same subject or the same line here, you had mentioned somebody like you're a realtor friend, he could be teaching a course. Another one is, especially now with AI, or at least platforms that allow you to be able to build a course quickly. If you have all those ideas, you can put them into a format where you could get into a system that allows people to come in and buy that course, and especially if it's on demand.
It's not, it is easily then scalable, right?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (30:25.946)
Yes, yes. And I think too, you know, man, we can write the book on the idea or we can run with the idea. Honestly, I had, I was in the, what, healing modalities, I would call it when I had the, and I'm sorry to swear, the bitch lap accelerated path to peace podcast, because I was like, man, I can help people get through basically divorced dads.
can you, I'll help you get through divorce gracefully. And I just, it was not calling me to charge money to serve for that at a big level. It's like, there's plenty of people out there to do it. And, you know, I mentor so many people in recovery. And a lot of the guys I mentor are divorced dads going through divorce and I'm doing it for free because it's a passion because I want to help them stay clean and sober, right? So, but it got me in the game. So anyway, as I'm
traveling around and going to all these masterminds. And if you think about the mortgage business as an interview, if you're a home loan officer, you are interviewing the potential home loan getter, right? And number one question, so if this was a mortgage interview, oh, Brent, are you looking to buy or refinance? Okay, great. And then, okay, oh, you're looking to refinance. I need to know five things. I need to know your income.
I need to know your, which is your two year work history. I need to know your assets. So your asset base, retirement, checking, saving, stocks, bonds, traditional assets. I need to know your credit score. I need to know your debts. So, well, how many cars are you making payments on? Do you have other houses? Do you have, you know, what are those things called? Not the condo tells, time shares, right? Stuff like that.
really fun thing about credit reports is they say everything about somebody. They are so rich with information and I'm a curious guy anyway, we'll get to it. Then you need to know about the property, right? If it's refi, how much is it worth if they're buying all this stuff anyway. So I've interviewed 1000s of people. And I'm really good at asking questions and getting the information because sometimes you're dealing with sensitive information.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (32:51.114)
people are like, well, I don't want to tell you what my credit history is. And so you got to know how to tell them, hey, I'm not here to judge. I'm just here to get you in the box so I can get you into your house or get you that lower rate. So like, you know, or the income. So I've always been fascinated about what people do and how they make money. And so I was always talking to
CEOs, CTOs, VPs, GMs, entrepreneurs. That was my niche in the mortgage business. I just love what people did and I was fascinated and I got to see tax returns. So I got to see, Apple is so fun. Giving us the, anyway. Anybody who's not watching but is listening, I'm very animated with my hands and Apple keeps on putting off fireworks and lasers. Anyway.
Brent Peterson (33:46.382)
Thank you.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (33:49.43)
So I just love the entrepreneurial journey. And so I'm in Russell Brunson's thing. I'm going to all his masterminds. I'm going to these other things. I'm going to what you mentioned CEX in Cleveland. Not that one in particular, but things like that. I've got my podcast. I'm interviewing entrepreneur after entrepreneur. I've done online virtual summits. I'm interviewing people.
I've hosted those summits and I quickly found out that people were not very good at telling their own story as an entrepreneur. And two, they're even worse at telling their company story through the eyes of their customer. Let's call it a testimonial, right, whether it's a video testimonial, a written testimonial, whatever it is. And I would always
as I'm interviewing people, so quickly people start paying me to interview their customers to get their customer story, to get their video testimonials. I start getting flown around to interview people and
And one of my favorite things to do is go to a thing like CEX. So I'll get paid to go to these events and then do a whole bunch of interviews at the same time, stadium style. So the cameras facing the crowd and then you're interviewing. And so it's super fun. But anyway, where was I going with this? Sorry. You got me rolling, which I love. I had a bit of
imposter syndrome still. So even though I'm getting paid to interview people, I'm literally getting flown around the world. I'm still like, am I adding value? And then at the same time, coincidentally, this friend of mine, who was a title officer in the real estate business, and he's got this great online show, it's called the small business spotlight. He kept telling me, I have this framework, it's called the
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (35:57.362)
the perfect video testimonial system, my five-step system for getting your customers to gladly do your selling for you. So basically you get the testimonial and then you repurpose that content into shorts, reels, TikToks, blah, right? He's like, my realtors need to know how to do that. You have to speak on my show. You've got to teach your framework. And I have this imposter syndrome. And so I'm like, okay, but never will I, right? So.
I wake up to an email from Stacey Oliver, who pays me to get her customer testimonials. And she says, Misha, you're the one who moves the needle in my business. I pay all these other people. And you're the one who drives the revenue. And my I was like, Oh, my gosh, it's like this imposter syndrome evaporated. I was like, I'm adding value at the exact same time. I had finally relented or capitulated or
said okay to my friend Ryan. I said, Ryan, yes, I'll speak on your show and I'll teach your realtors. I get on, I do it, and I crush it. And I was like, oh my gosh, I need to get my message out there. I need to go on a podcast tour, on this influence tour. So in my sales heyday and mortgages, I systemized everything, you know, scripts, emails.
templates, templated everything. And I was like, man, if I applied all that to guest speaking on podcasts, this would be ridiculous. So I did this Facebook post and I said, hey everybody, I'm gonna go on a guest podcast, guest speaking tour, so I can talk about how I help people with getting their perfect customer video testimonials, you know? But I'm gonna create all these assets to do this. So tracking sheets.
to find the emails, how to, and I'm going to document all of it. Who wants it? And I got this flood of engagement. Right. All these people are like, well, I want to know that. And so, this is the next big epiphany to lead me to what I'm doing today. I was like, man, I jumped into Stu McLaren's group. Do you know who Stu McLaren is? Okay, so Stu McLaren, he does membership sites. So he's all about
Brent Peterson (38:13.089)
Hmm.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (38:18.27)
turn what you know, love and do and how you help people into a membership site so you can get monthly reoccurring revenue. Right? This is kind of the dream for a lot of us. And he's like, launch your idea before you build it. You could write your book before you could write the book around your idea. This guess is what I'm trying to close that loop. Right? So
I did
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (39:17.422)
You disappeared. There you are. Sorry. Yeah.
Brent Peterson (39:19.544)
Hey, I think, I think, yeah, I think that, I think that Riverside just pooped out on me. I feel like we just rebooted. Yeah, you were gone and now you're back. Yeah, sorry about that.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (39:29.042)
Oh, well, you can edit it together, right? And yeah, no, it's okay. He was Riverside's telling me to. Yes, like cut to the chase. Cut to the chase. No, no. Yeah.
Brent Peterson (39:35.816)
We're still recording, but it looks like it's... What is it telling you? Okay, well, sorry, go ahead. You dropped out at... I think about a minute ago.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (39:50.31)
Yeah, so basically Stu's like, and if you're hearing this again, well, I'm sure you'll edit it. But anyway, if not, you get to hear it again. He's like, launch your idea before you build it. And so I went live on Facebook and said, hey, I'm going to, I have this idea. I want to teach people how to go on a podcast tour. I'm going to start this membership. I'm going to give everybody a discounted rate. It's not built yet. But I'm going to do it. I've got this idea. Who's in?
And I got this flood of engagement and bam, I was like, okay, so I started teaching people and I was literally three baby steps ahead, right? Perfecting the scripts to get on the podcast. And I'm like, here's the script I perfected, you can use it, right? You gotta have a bio. Like anybody listening, watching right now, you could start requesting this guest speak on podcasts without having a bio. As soon as somebody asks for you for one, then make the daily.
Right? I just all of these things, right? Without a head shot, no headshot. But finally, someone said you need a head shot. Okay, because I'm gonna get a headshot, right? But I've templated out all these things and in the gear and everything. My point is, with a book or anything.
We can just take action on an idea and create it and then have volume two or addition two or whatever and get the idea out there and see if it sticks and see if it has traction. I apologize for going down this rabbit hole but I just, I think that so many of us get stuck in. Where's the market going. Is this going to have legs, our memberships going to be up or down next year.
Our podcasts growing or dying. Is YouTube going away? I mean, we know YouTube's not going away, but you get what I'm saying. Right. So I would just encourage anybody, even if you have an idea, float the idea and take action. Yeah.
Brent Peterson (41:51.636)
Yeah, one of the things that I think people miss out on in the podcasting realm anyways is as a host anyway, seeing it through, right? A lot of times people think I'm going to start a podcast, they're going to do 12 episodes and that doesn't get a lot of traction. Maybe speak to a little bit about that persistence and making sure that you have a dream but that maybe that dream isn't going to take.
is going to take more than 12 weeks or however often you put out your episodes. There's a time frame in which they say content entrepreneurs can become profitable. It used to be at 18 months. If you're lucky, it happens overnight, but a lot of times it's just consistent work. It doesn't mean it's hard work, but it's consistent.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (42:30.11)
Yeah.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (42:38.918)
Yeah, boy, I love that. And I hate it at the same time. So statistically speaking, if 10,000 people are starting a new podcast a month, and it's probably more like a day, or a YouTube channel or a blog, or maybe blogging speak, I think it's coming back. But statistically speaking, and you spoke to this, someone is gonna get lucky. And their podcast or YouTube channel or blog is
going to explode.
Brent Peterson (43:12.012)
Uh, no, go. Keep talking.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (43:12.222)
for the reality is, huh, go ahead. Yeah, I was gonna say the reality is for most of us, that is not the case. And some of them, we could even go, oh, well they got lucky and interviewed Jordan Peterson because I saw this podcast where somebody interviewed Jordan Peterson and it was a clip up, doesn't matter. That's why he blew up. Well, there's plenty of podcasts out there where people have interviewed very significant.
people of Jordan Peterson's stature, where that didn't help their podcast take off, right? So there's, I would say a lot, a lot of luck involved. And so this has been my experience, 690 some episodes in. I am constantly, go ahead.
Brent Peterson (44:00.892)
Oh, no, I was going to say on the flip side, what would you say to somebody that wants to be an episode? Is it also the same? Are you going to get a lot of rejections and things like that? Are you going to have to, if you want to be put on to like your whole, you help people to get on to other podcasts, right? It's got to be that same tenacity to get turned down a lot, but you just have to keep going at it.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (44:17.682)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (44:28.674)
If we want to look at it from the perspective of getting on podcasts and guest speaking and getting on stages. Yeah, you've got to be prepared for rejection and lucky for me or unlucky for me when I was in the home loan business and my sales career before that. I was telemarketing like mad. Like I've literally made a million hand dialed phone calls 250 hand dialed calls a day.
Well, maybe a million hand dialed calls might be a stretch, but for years I was hand dialing phone calls and hearing no, no. And then you get that one person who go, I cannot believe you just called me right now. This is incredible. You have to help me, right? Or yes, I want what you're selling. And to prove a point back in the day, and I'll deny it if anybody's listening this, but I will say it now, I used to go get, do not call this. I was like,
Give me that just to prove a point to my salespeople because I built teams, I built telemarketing teams. I got auto dialers that dialed the phone for you. I was like, the numbers don't matter whether they're on the do not call list or not because people get freaked out like, well, what if they're on the do not call list or not? I'm like, just don't worry. Just try to be of service and don't be rude. If someone says no, bye, right? So anyway, I would get
phone lists of just DNC phone, do not call phone numbers, and I'd start dialing away. And it's the same thing. No, no, no. Yes, I can't believe you called me. I still, yes, I need a home loan. I'm on the do not call list and you called me anyway. Thank God. Anyway, anyway, go ahead. Yes, yes, the new car warranty. Excuse me, so.
Brent Peterson (46:10.965)
Yeah, and I need a warranty as well. I need a new car warranty.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (46:20.35)
Here's basically what happens is you're sending out emails to guest speak on podcasts. And I have a super simple, you can make it really hard with that email, make it harder than it needs to be. And I'm gonna tell you what I send out all the time that works wonders, let me find it. Super simple. Brent, I found your...
talk commerce podcast and you have a great show. Are you looking for an interesting guest to be on the show? If so, what are the next steps? Thanks, Misha. Anybody replay that template it out, use it, it works. Now we can get super creative and be like, I've got a podcast, I'm going to share your show across all my episodes. I've got this following this, that the other thing.
This is how I'm going to add value. People will tell you all kinds of things. And I have those email scripts as well. That work. But this one works just as good. You send that out, send it out to 200 people. And these are the responses you're going to get. You're going to get no response. Literally nobody responds. So when you send out 200, 20 people are going to respond. 10%. Okay. And they're the other 180.
you're going to get no response. You're going to get no response. You're going to get a yes. They simply say yes, or they're going to say yes and, like yes and fill out this form. Yes and what do you want to talk about? Yes and let me see your bio, right? And then you're like, oh, okay. Well, here's my bio or no. Those are the four things. No response, yes, yes and, and no. If you get no response,
You literally in three to five days, two weeks, you just forward the email and say, just wanted to make sure you saw this. Send. And then you'll get a new round of 10%. Right?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (48:24.766)
The yes is like, yes, fill out this form or yes, it's very easy, which is not all of them, but some of them. And then it's the yes and, and you do what they say. Fill out the form, let's do a pre-interview. What's your bio? Give me the list of other things you've spoken on, whatever, just more details, right? And so anybody listening and watching right now, all you need to do is start sending emails and you will figure out what you need.
as you go along and you're going to get booked on shows before you have everything you need. If you get a no, it's just an opportunity to give a second offer. Ron Story told me this, Ron Story Jr. He has this software called PitchDB, which I use and I love. And I can give you the affiliate link. We should put it in the show notes. But Ron Story told me, he goes, he goes, if you get a no,
just give them a second offer. My second offer is, well, do you want to speak on my podcast? Cause getting guests is a lot of work, right? Can be. And so I'm like, oh, great. I literally reply back to exactly what they say and say, well, would you like to be a guest on my show? So if they say, no, we're all full up for this seasons of episodes, I go.
Brent Peterson (49:32.71)
Yeah.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (49:49.398)
Thanks for the quick response. Noted, you're all fold up on this season of episodes. Would you like to be on my show? Someone could literally say no. They'll just say no, and this has happened. No. And I reply back, noted, you aren't taking guests right now. Do you wanna be on my show? And they say yes. We had a little bit of an interaction, right? How we had a little negotiating to make our...
make this podcast happen, right. So I hope I've answered your question. And the people in my training, like, Phil, Danielle, Samantha, it's like, just trust the process and they trust the process. I literally wake up to texts, and DMS and WhatsApp, I just got booked on two shows, right? I just got booked on two shows.
Oh my gosh, I have someone on my show, right? It's like, it's not hard, follow the formula. We're gonna hear a lot of nos. Someone might say no, and you're stupid. No, and F this, right? It's like, okay. Anyway, there you go. That was a long answer.
Brent Peterson (51:01.348)
That was awesome. So just full disclosure, Ron Story is my newest sponsor. So PitchDB just literally signed yesterday. So they'll probably be on this episode as a sponsor. And I did, it's interesting when you said, just send things out because he gave me the demo of the platform. And by the way, it's a fantastic platform.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (51:10.893)
Oh!
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (51:18.963)
Fantastic.
Brent Peterson (51:28.944)
Um, and I, I just filled out the very first one on the top of the list. He's well, that's all in Russian, you know, we'll see what happens. And literally the guy got back to me and said, Oh, my English isn't good. And I don't think it'd be a very good podcast, but you know, it's interesting, right? He said, no, and I, I didn't follow up, but I, um, I should have said, do you want to be on my podcast? That was a good, that would have been a great response.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (51:37.268)
Yeah.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (51:53.374)
Absolutely, and you could say, you could say, noted, do you wanna sponsor my show? Here's some of my sponsors. Right, you could do your counterpitch.
Brent Peterson (51:59.62)
There you go. Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. Good. Um, Misha, we are running out of time here. Remember I said, let's target 20 minutes and we're running up against the top of the hour. This has been a really enjoyable conversation. We will take it up on your podcast next.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (52:17.81)
Yeah, I cannot wait. This has been a ton of fun, Brent. Thank you for, yeah.
Brent Peterson (52:20.012)
Um, you know, as we, we're not done yet, so don't try to get out too soon here. Um, as I do close out, I do give everybody a chance to do a shameless plug. So this is where you get to, and we've done some soft selling during the, well, we'll admit we've done a little bit of soft selling, which is okay. Right. Um, we've offered a lot of good value though. I thought, thank you with that for that, but this is your chance to do a shameless plug about anything you want, you could plug yoga, you could plug your kid's school, anything you want, what would you like to plug?
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (52:37.819)
Yeah, absolutely.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (52:49.774)
You know what, I think my students would be disappointed if I didn't give just a good clean call to action. So everybody could go to badzuck.com. And you can trial my influence army membership. It comes with three coaching calls a month, all a bunch of the frameworks that we talked about community.
to get on podcasts, what to say, when to say it, how to get everything dialed in as you grow your business as you guest speak on podcasts. And the really cool thing about it is if people take action through this, badzuck.com, it's $97 a month. You can trial it for $7 for the first month. And if you don't like it for seven, I'll refund your $7. Shameless plug, badzuck.com. How'd I do?
Brent Peterson (53:41.724)
That was awesome, thank you. That was very concise, yeah. A lot of times people go for 20 or 30 minutes on the Seamus plug, that's perfect, thank you. Badzuck.com, I'll make sure I get that in the show notes. Misha, it's been a very enjoyable conversation. Thank you so much for being here.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (53:50.583)
Yes.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (53:54.122)
Thank you.
Mischa Z - BadZuck.com! (53:59.962)
Indeed, thank you for having me, Brett.