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We are Meredith and Mishelle and together, we are flipping the script on what it means to be an IT girl. Each week we will be discussing topics and questions submitted by YOU, our audience, as we navigate life's challenges together.
Meredith (00:00)
Welcome back everybody. Michelle and I are here to discuss episode 11, which we have titled, Show Me the Money. we're gonna discuss all of our ins and outs about budgeting, finances, question that was associated to that. But as always, before we dive in, we're going to go with our icebreaker question, which is, what do you wanna do when you retire?
Mishelle (00:25)
Hmm, such a good question. What do I want to do when I retire? Well, I for sure want to be spending time with family. And I think in the last episode I was talking a lot about that homestead. So what I see myself doing in my retire, my retiring age is just out there.
Gardening, which I'm going to learn how to garden. I don't know how to garden right now. I kill everything. So I don't have a green thumb, but I think just learning to the gardening process, gardening, I think in my mind, it sounds so relaxing and so great. And so I think that's what I want to do, but who knows? But I think that like retiring travel, I mean, the normal cliche stuff, traveling, hanging out with family, doing the things that matter, I think are like.
like big things for me. I think about my values, my core values, which are adventure, family fun, freedom. So I think it would be some type of adventuring, something fun with my family. I can also see potentially Brian and I going cross country in an RV. We love the RV life. So there could be some of that in our retiring age. huh. Right? Lots of camping.
Meredith (01:38)
That sounds like something you guys would do. I think that if you have the opportunity to talk to Ben, he loves gardening and he loves, that's been a background of his for a while. I think he even studied it in college. I have killed a bamboo and a cactus. So I have no tips.
Mishelle (01:54)
Mm.
I've killed a cactus - I've killed multiple cactuses. Killed all the things.
Meredith (02:09)
My, I think that this is what I would call like my semi retirement goal because I have dreamed about this for so long and I want to be that old lady usher at like an event area. So like maybe it's a sports arena, maybe it's like concerts that ushers people to their seats and then like regularly gets on the jumbotrons.
Mishelle (02:34)
AHHHH
Meredith (02:36)
you know their name and you're just like, that's just crazy, Meredith. She's crazy. Yeah.
Mishelle (02:40)
I know exactly what you're talking about, but first when you first said usher I thought you meant usher the singer like you were gonna be a crazy fan and be a dancer, but okay You want to actually usher people?
Meredith (02:46)
And Dancer?
and be hyped with the people.
Mishelle (03:05)
I could have
Okay, ushering, so fun, because that takes you, I feel like that brings back your security day vibes when you used to be a security officer. Put on the uniform, get out there, get to know people. I could totally see you doing that.
Meredith (03:14)
Yeah. Yeah.
would love it. Like that's my retirement. I have really humble retirement dreams. That's it.
Mishelle (03:22)
You would.
I mean, that feels fun. Yeah, keeps you connected in the mix. You get to do your sporting events.
Meredith (03:29)
Right? I mean, yeah, Ben and I enjoy traveling now and traveling. So I just am like, if things are paid off and I could just love and enjoy the things that I love and enjoy, then sports and concerts would be it. And I would.
Mishelle (03:48)
Maybe I would, okay, I didn't think about it in terms of like what would I do with my time and career. I think I would, maybe I'll be a dog walker.
Meredith (03:56)
There we go. And I don't know that you have to have a career. I just like that people would pay me to enjoy the things that I like to enjoy. man.
Mishelle (03:57)
I could see myself being a dog walker.
Too funny. Okay, that was good. That was good. All right, moving into the question for our episode, show me the money. The question is, I struggle to save money and budget. What are your tips? And I would say same girl, same. I also struggle with budgeting and saving and all the things.
I don't know, I can give you, I guess I've had a journey through it and I'll start with sharing some things that I do, but I think Meredith, you might actually have more tips on this topic than me, I don't know. But what do you think? Yes, no?
Meredith (04:46)
I so this is where I shine like this is like me to 2 .0. I think financial literacy, especially like in high school is imperative, but not very many high schools have that program. And I've learned from such failure in this arena that I've really had to be very methodical and very understanding of the entire
Mishelle (04:50)
great!
No, they don't.
Meredith (05:16)
financial system, retirement planning, budgeting, savings. So we think that I do have a lot of tips that I would share with people, but it's also going to be like, mom talk or, you know, just like parental guidance where it's like, okay, cut the crap, let's get serious needs versus wants. Like that's like where I would approach this from because that's
Mishelle (05:38)
Okay.
Meredith (05:44)
how I approach it in my life.
Mishelle (05:46)
Okay, so then I might, you might actually, this episode might all be about Meredith coaching Michelle on her budgetary means.
Meredith (05:53)
I honestly, this is really interesting, but I keep a spreadsheet budget. I'm sure nobody would have not thought that I didn't keep a very detailed budget that I reconcile frequently.
Mishelle (06:08)
So you're actually entering in your expenses into this budget. So not just like setting the budget, but then you'll actually put the actual spend against it to see if you're over or under.
Meredith (06:20)
Not to see if I'm over or under, but if I have overspent, because I don't have a great relationship with boundaries when it comes to a stress state for me. When I'm stressed, I overeat, and when I'm stressed, I overspend. Doing those two things brings me some sort of fleeting...
enjoyment of like, my gosh, it's gonna make me feel better when it really doesn't make me feel better long term. And so I know these things of myself. I know these bad behaviors. So I'll start back also when I first left high school, I was really interested in having the best purse, having designer sunglasses, having all of these really expensive clothes. Yeah, yep.
Mishelle (07:10)
Same! Same! I was just telling somebody my very first purchase when I started working at 16 years old. You want to know what it was? Gucci sunglasses. Had to have it. 16 years old with my Gucci sunglasses.
Meredith (07:18)
There you go.
I bought all of that stuff on a credit card where I was just like, free money, here we go. And so my credit score wasn't great because I lived beyond my means for just some really unreasonable feeling of I needed to have this. And so I would tell somebody who's trying to start of a plan is to be honest with yourself and write down all of the critical needs that.
Mishelle (07:27)
Yeah? Yeah.
Meredith (07:51)
you need to live? Are you paying rent? Do you have to pay utilities? Do you have a car payment? Like everything that is tangible around that and then how much money you're bringing in. Then you have to obviously see how much you have to play with from there. But for me, go ahead, Michelle.
Mishelle (08:06)
Yeah.
Well, I was going to say, do you then do when you're budget reconciling, do you do that every month or are you doing this weekly?
Meredith (08:16)
So right now in this moment, I'm actually being more diligent about this practice and I'll share a lot more of this spiral, but my paycheck isn't guaranteed. And for a lot of time, Ben and I are fortunate enough to live off of like one salary and then save the other or do the other, but my salary isn't guaranteed. And so I operate under the method of like a 50, 30, 20 rule where I should be 50 % should be like my mortgage and like
the utilities and all of these different things. But right now I'm still also planning like taking $150 in cash out of the bank and only spending that at the grocery store where it could have been before a lot more. So like really weekly planning to not spend more than this to be really regimented and pull myself back because when you don't have any concerns
Mishelle (08:58)
Wow.
Meredith (09:10)
but where your expenses and your spend is going, it's very difficult for you to, I mean, it's not difficult, but you can live paycheck to paycheck. And I never want to be in that feeling. An example that I would also share is, I separate things out into multiple accounts. It sounds crazy.
Mishelle (09:32)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Meredith (09:34)
but I auto deduct it like a payment where when I first started saving and when I first started getting out of debt and trying to build my credit score, I would have my checking account, which would be all of my necessities, my cell phone bill, my car payment, my rent, and my grocery. Like the things that I needed to live was this checking account. I had a savings account for big future items that might happen. What if I need new tires? What if my car broke down?
And I could maybe only put like $20 a paycheck in that. But just to start small and start saving, then another savings account was just for slush fund. Here's what I want to spend on food going out to eat. Here's what I want to spend on this. And the remainder, if I could, was going towards retirement and travel or things of that nature. And I started that pretty early. And again, it started where it was only like, I can only put $20 here, $20 here, $20 here.
but it started to snowball and accumulate more. But the best thing I would tell you is to pay yourself first, one hour a day.
Mishelle (10:38)
Okay, so those are good tips. I feel like I do some of that. So that makes me feel better about myself. But what comes up for me, and this is where you could help me is I'll put money in these accounts that I have set aside for, like you said, emergency or fun money or vacation. Like I've got the accounts, right? I've got it set up. I'm putting money in them. But what I find myself doing or what I find really difficult is for myself to then take that money out and use it.
Meredith (10:48)
Mm -hmm.
Mishelle (11:07)
So I will leave it in there and I would rather just put it on my credit card because in my mind I'm like, let me just leave that I've saved it and now I don't wanna touch it. And so I'm like doing the practice but then in real life in real time, I'm like, forget it I'll just put it on my credit card.
Meredith (11:18)
Mmm.
put it on a credit card. You're not wrong. So my credit card, I put it on a credit card that will get me more miles, get me free hotels, get me something for free. So I put the things on the credit card but I immediately take the money out of the account and pay that credit card off.
Mishelle (11:28)
So then what's the tip?
Mm -hmm.
Okay, see, but I'm not doing that stuff.
Meredith (11:46)
Because you're putting a feeling around the money that is there, but you're not putting a feeling around the money that you're spending on the credit card. So you should feel the same way about equal accounts. Like you should, yeah. And I understand that. And it's more of a muscle and practice that you have to put yourself in. Because I'm like you where my credit cards come out of a checking account.
Mishelle (11:54)
Mm -hmm.
Right, and I don't.
This is...
Meredith (12:13)
but I've saved the money and I'm like, well, I could afford it out of my checking account. Why would I move that money? But I still have to move the money over because I'm essentially borrowing it from an account that I saved in, but that's what it's there for. That's what you worked hard to do.
Mishelle (12:28)
I know it's, it is, and it is there for that, but for some reason I just don't want to touch it. I just want to leave it there because it's like, well, I'll just leave it there and I'll just pay this credit card off using like my other regular checking money. But then what happens is I can't pay it all off. So then the debt builds up, you know, even though I have the money to pay it off. It's like, I won't do it because I'm like, no, that money is sacred.
Meredith (12:44)
Well... yeah. Hmm.
Yeah.
Mishelle (12:55)
but it's like, no, that's the money you put aside to pay for the things that you just put on your credit card. So it's such a my game for me.
Meredith (13:02)
I think that you are coaching yourself out of this, but what I would tell you to do is stop putting that much money in that savings to accommodate for this.
Mishelle (13:11)
Mm. So that I could just put it on the credit card and then just pay it off. Since I'm doing that anyway.
Meredith (13:16)
Yeah. Yeah. Because if that's the thing that you're safe keeping and it's something that brings you joy because you get to see that grow, then maybe you put 150 in that savings and then put, I don't know how much you would save, but say if it was 500, I would put 350 in a checking and then put 150 here and still divide it out because that's still going to grow and you can preserve and really have that for a rainy day, but still be able to
pay off your entire credit card bill monthly because then the interest accumulates on top of that. And like I'll even open a Disney credit card if I know we're going to Disneyland or Disney World just so that I can get 25 % off and then also like perks and discounts when I'm there. And then I close the card when I come back but I pay everything on that Disney card but I have to be really diligent about moving the money accordingly.
Mishelle (13:51)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, it's like staying on top of it. You gotta, I think budgeting is really about managing yourself and your needs.
Meredith (14:13)
Yeah.
And managing your expectations and your needs because people have to understand that it's not saying you can't have anything that you want. I don't drink coffee, but people want to drink Starbucks every day. We're not saying don't drink Starbucks, but also understand how much it costs for Starbucks that's taking away. And you have to decrease that in another area if you want to start saving more. So it's about sacrificing.
for the vision and the goals that you have for yourself a handful of years from now. And that's what I had to prioritize a lot in the very beginning, 18, 19, 20, up to like 26 was really prioritizing what can I sacrifice and what really do I need to survive?
Mishelle (14:49)
Yeah.
I mean, that's huge to be able to do that 18. I don't think I started really budgeting like that until I'm getting smart with my money until maybe even like, I wanna say like in the past five years. But what I did was I did the same thing that you did. The only thing I'm not doing is reconciling it every week or month. I did just go ahead and set, okay, how much money total am I bringing in? Put it in a spreadsheet. Then I started deducting like.
the things that I have to pay no matter what. Like those aren't going away. Like the mortgage, the car payment, all the things, right? So I put all that in there and then I started putting in food, going out to eat and then anything leftover was like my shopping fund. And so I've looked at it that one time and then I think after that, what I do on a daily or not a daily, but just in general to manage it is I don't put it all in a spreadsheet to manage it, but then from there,
Meredith (15:33)
Mm -hmm.
Mm -hmm.
Mishelle (16:00)
When I get paid, I'll like subtract out the things that I know have to go out. And then I have the leftover and then I know like, there's my play money for the food, the going out to eat, the shopping situation. So I kind of like loosely manage it, but it's not like to the T and that's where it gets messy because in my head I'm like, I have all this, but I probably actually don't.
Meredith (16:04)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah.
Mm hmm. I when it was very difficult for me, I would give myself at the beginning like $35 a week to spend on lunches or Meredith, you have to pack your own lunch and bring my own lunch in nowadays. Everything we can all agree that the prices of things are more expensive now. That's why I could easily spend $150 a week on groceries. But that's breakfast, lunch and dinner for, you know, for my my household.
but I also still will only make sure that I plan and prepare that list to meet that. And so it's just not practical a lot for somebody to go to the ATM and take out cash nowadays. It's on your watch to pay things. So that's why I reconcile it more frequently and credit cards are really good right now, especially if they give you back an incentive, airline points or gas points or whatever.
I usually put everything on credit cards that give me something back, but then I also have to categorize monthly through the credit card, what category I'm spending my money on, entertainment, fuel, like it breaks it down for you a lot of the time in there. And I can tell my stress states when it's like, I bought new shoes and I bought all of these new clothes. And I'm like, okay, how do I recognize that trigger and that emotion?
Mishelle (17:37)
This is...
Meredith (17:49)
well before it goes to spending. And this, so for me now when I shop, I wait 24 hours and if I still want it in 24 hours, then it means that, I probably still really want it and it's not an impulse buy because I'm in a stress state. So I've had to like just really get to know myself and be more honest because I was in a lot of debt and I had a
Mishelle (18:10)
So much self -control, Meredith. That's great. Yeah, let's talk about that. Okay, so let's talk about the journey with money and everything, because I bet people would enjoy or get something out of that, because I'm sure there's other people who are in a lot of debt right now.
Meredith (18:13)
Well, but I was in a lot. I came from a lot of debt.
Yeah, it's just doing little chunks and really going out there with all the tips of the trade and finding what works for you because some people are saying pay all your debt off in order for you to feel really great about your life and set yourself up for success. I think that's like a Dave Ramsey model where other people are like, no, debt is good and you should carry debt because it's cheaper to borrow money right now
But at the end of the day, it's like, find what works for you. And at that time, when I was growing up, it was I liked nice things. And I liked to probably give an appearance of this girl's got it together. She is the quote unquote it girl of what it girls are supposed to be at that time, instead of us flipping the script.
But then when my mom got sick, I got $30 ,000 in debt right away from her treatment over a week. Three treatments of hers was $10 ,000 a time and I had to borrow back against my car, had a really low credit. Nowadays, if you don't make a certain amount, you can't rent. You can't rent an apartment unless you make three or four times the amount. So I had certain cosigners.
And so I just really was in a place where I didn't want to depend on others. So I was like, I got to focus on my credit, got to focus on getting more money, got to focus on a savings. I always felt like when I was getting ahead, everything fell apart and that really rubbed me the wrong way. So I was like, I don't want to be this person that's always in this cycle that feels like, man, I can't afford, I have to choose between ghostries or new tires.
And so I just kept doing like $20, $20 here and there. And even if it was cash and taking $20 and putting it somewhere, because we're emotionally triggered right now, everything is one click by, everything's by now. I get suffered into.
Mishelle (20:20)
And all those Instagram ads coming at you. If one more Instagram ad tries to sell me a $300 pair of overalls, I mean, Meredith, I'm just not gonna ever reach my financial goals because the amount of times I have actually gotten those things in my cart and then been like, no, I'm not buying these overalls, but then they just keep showing up.
Meredith (20:33)
you
But do you ever go and look to see if those overalls are anywhere else cheaper and or you like slightly used? Cause that's what I do whenever I get suckered. Okay. Yeah.
Mishelle (20:50)
I do. I do, I do. But I, for this particular situation, I really don't want the overalls. I don't need the overalls. It's just that it keeps showing up on my feed that I keep falling for it. And then it's like, no, no, no, I don't want these. I really don't need this.
Meredith (20:57)
Mm -hmm.
Mm -hmm.
Everybody does. I'm that way with books. I could spend thousands and thousands on books and I get suckered into them all the time. I know this is a really nerd thing. I also get suckered into clothing every now and again, but the worst part? It's books. Yeah, no, it's actually like vacations and events and those aren't cheap.
Mishelle (21:24)
Meredith is like, for me, it's book.
Yeah, they're not.
Meredith (21:34)
And then I'll look at Ben and just be like, so do we want to go on a road trip and hit up these three stadiums while we're there? And he gets suckered in too. And we do it. And luckily we're at a point where, yeah, we busted our butt and saved, but I can't imagine where you live and all of like how expensive everything is right now, how hard it is for people to try to manage and do a budget. But I would just.
encourage people to start with your necessities and then really understand what's important for you to sacrifice now. The younger that you can sacrifice, the better financially that you'll be off in your 30s, your 40s, your 50s, your 60s. And it's just like need versus want. And I'm not saying you can't have the things that you want to have, but you can't have everything that you want to have.
Mishelle (22:23)
Mm -hmm.
Meredith (22:27)
So just setting goals to reward yourself with something if, hey, I budgeted well and I was able to really mind my budget for three months, then I'm going to reward myself with a new pair of shoes or these overalls because I did that. But it's not like I'm going to reward myself with a new luxury vacation and then just erase everything that you tried to accomplish. I mean, the biggest thing for me is like
Mishelle (22:49)
Mm -hmm.
Meredith (22:55)
retirement saving, you know, especially our age, we don't know what social security is going to do here in the next handful of years or decades that it's, I can't rely on anybody else to pay me back after my years of service and in my career. And so I just really am very diligent on retirement and retirement planning and setting myself up for that. But I've got student loans. I know it's just
Mishelle (22:58)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah
I think it's smart.
I mean, I would just say too, if you're at any age and you work at any job and they offer 401k, put something in it. Because that would be my one financial regret is the amount of times I had a job that was offering 401k and I didn't put anything in there because I didn't think I was making enough money, but even the smallest amount that you put in there will grow. And so take advantage of the things that are being offered to you.
or if there's like a stock option situation, buy the stock, buy that stock, get in there and do it. That was another thing that I didn't do, because I just didn't know or didn't have the thought to do it or thought I didn't make enough money to do that. And that would have set me up for success. And so that would be my advice too, is to take advantage of those opportunities. And I think if you can have the self -control to manage your credit card debt and not
Meredith (23:54)
Mm -hmm.
Mishelle (24:19)
put so much on there than to do what Meredith is doing and take advantage of those credit card offerings because you can get a lot back from using a credit card because credit cards really aren't bad. It's our money habits that are bad. But if you can't manage your money habits, then having a credit card is not for you because it's too tempting. It's way too tempting. And I think we've all been there. You go to college with no financial.
Meredith (24:38)
Yeah.
Mishelle (24:45)
education at all, someone hands you a credit card and it really does feel like free money. And you're like, great, I can just start spending. And then before you know it, you have thousands and thousands worth of credit card debt that you can't get yourself out of. So, cause I know that story too. I was in a lot of credit card debt too. And that was just from my divorce and from just like not making enough money and having to live off my credit card. And it took a long time to get out of it. But I think
What I really like is, I know there's like the Dave Ramsey theory, which is like paying it all off and all the snowballing thought process, starting with like your biggest credit card debt and working way down. But I also really like Rammet's approach, which is it's not always about saving more and paying off your debt. It's about trying to figure out how to make more money. And I like that approach too, because at the end of the day, I mean, if there are things that you want to do or you're not
Meredith (25:19)
Mm -hmm.
Mishelle (25:40)
able to make your budget or you're always coming in under and short. I mean, I would spend energy and time and effort figuring out, okay, what do I need to be earning to be able to live the life that I want? And then if that's the number, what sort of education, job or experience do I need to go out and go get and figure out so I can create that life for myself? And so that's kind of, I like that approach too of like, it's not always about the saving and the paying off. It's like,
try to add more to the top. Because you can manage the bottom line, but if you can get more in the top, then that's good too.
Meredith (26:12)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, I would agree. That's a lot of great advice, especially around the retirement and just as early as you can start investing in yourself and your future self. One example I would give just to show you like a call to give the listeners like my cell phone provider offers a credit card. And if you use the credit card towards phones, your bill, whatever, they offer you another 20 % discount.
So it's something I'm gonna pay anyways, why am I saying no to 20 more percent off? And that's like the type of credit cards that you should look for. But to your point, Michelle, if you're not responsible enough to manage that well and know I've got to pay this off like a bill, I was gonna pay it like my cell phone bill anyways, why not? Auto deduct the last statement balance or the full cost of the credit card, the full balance of the credit card.
Mishelle (26:50)
Yeah.
Meredith (27:11)
then it doesn't really work for you. Then you shouldn't have as many credit cards as I'm proposing that I currently have, that I'm saying I currently have. But I use every single one has its purpose and a function for me to provide me more value.
Mishelle (27:19)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, which again, I think it just depends on the person. Cause for me, I know that I don't have great self control and I wouldn't be able to have like that many credit cards. So for me, because of my own like relationship with credit cards, I've whittled it down to one. I have one. I have one. It does provide 5 % cash back, which I think is a great offer.
Meredith (27:32)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah.
Mishelle (27:49)
And for me, that's perfect. And so I manage that one credit card. I know I need to pay it off, but I get that 5 % cash back or that I can use on travel or I can use it to pay off part of my bill. But like, I'm going to get that 5 % back on everything that I, everything that I spend or put on that credit card. And so that feels like one win and an easy manageable bite -sized piece that I can manage. So I think budgeting is not one size fits all.
Meredith (28:05)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah.
Mishelle (28:17)
seems like no matter what you're going to need a spreadsheet. I do think they have apps for that now too, but I for sure think getting it in a spreadsheet helps also. And then reviewing it from time to time, whether that's weekly, monthly, quarterly, and making sure that things are on track and pacing the place where you want it to go. Those would be our big pieces. And then what else, Meredith? Anything else? Last minute.
Meredith (28:39)
Yeah, I would agree. No, I think that that's really right on the money there. You have to really put in the time to understand yourself and your ability to budget and to manage money well. But you have to tangibly write down your goals and how you're planning to get to those goals financially. And that's the fun goals. Like I want to travel to these locations and you have to do the research on what that takes.
Hehehe
And that will start painting the picture of how much you have to save where, and then all of those life events that could pop up. And it's not fun. It's not the sexy part of life. And I get that it's fun to spend money and make money, but to have that much financial freedom and control and that ease, you know, in that frustration and that stress that sometimes money puts on all of us, just do yourself a favor and you can even, you don't have to do it monthly. You can maybe do it every three months.
Six months, you know, annually set those goals for the year. But you do need to start somewhere and save and invest in yourself. Swim and tell people.
Mishelle (29:43)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, save and invest even if it's a small amount because a small amount is better than zero. So I think when in doubt, invest for sure. Okay, great episode. Hopefully this has been helpful to somebody out there trying to manage a budget or get out of credit card debt.
Meredith (29:54)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah, I would agree.
Mishelle (30:09)
Meredith and I both have come out from credit card debt onto the other side now. So just to encourage you that there is a light at the end of the tunnel, you can get out of very large amounts of credit card debt in the tens to 20 to 30 ish thousand dollars worth of credit card debt. Like there is a way out of that. So don't feel in despair. There's a way out. It just requires self -control, self -discipline and taking baby steps. So
Okay, well, as a reminder, if you have any burning questions for us or if there's something that you would like to talk to us about or want us to cover in our next episode, please email us at our email, which is hello at itgirllife .com or drop us a line on Instagram or just visit us at our website at itgirllife .com and you'll see a button to ask a question. So hope to be hearing from you soon and thanks so much for joining us today.
Meredith (31:06)
Bye.