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Welcome to the Pretty Okay Podcast, a chill (but sometimes spicy) small business podcast for people who are crazy enough to have one. Hosted by the Founder of Enji, Tayler Cusick Hollman, we cover everything from basic business practices to small business marketing. We sit down with some of our favorite small business owners and experts who share their stories, real-life experiences, and advice, all while keeping it (very) real and honest.
SAMANTHA: We're back, bitches! How's that for
an intro?
TAYLER: I love that.
SAMANTHA: Welcome back to the Pretty Okay Podcast.
I'm your host, Samantha Welker.
TAYLER: And I am Taylor Holman.
SAMANTHA: And it's been a minute.
TAYLER: It's been a minute. Like, however many
minutes are in a year? 500,000. No, 500, 25,600
minutes.
SAMANTHA: Right? Clock that. We made it 35 seconds
into the episode before Taylor sang. That was
pretty good.
TAYLER: That's a record.
SAMANTHA: But that is a very good way to remember
it. Honestly, that's the only way. Thank you,
rent.
TAYLER: Thank you, rent. I mean, I was like, there's
no, unless I'm picking up my phone and doing calculations.
I don't know that number.
SAMANTHA: So. I like that you say picking up your
phone and not picking up a calculator.
TAYLER: Oh, well, I only, you know. That's why
you're smarter than me because you has a calculator.
SAMANTHA: Well, you know, what did our teachers
always say? You're not going to always have a
calculator in your pocket. And it's like, no,
we do. Just kidding.
TAYLER: Oh, my God. That is 100% what our teachers
used to say.
SAMANTHA: Yeah. And you're like, it's like, no,
I do have one in my pocket, but I keep my actual
calculator on my desk. So I have both. So like
you're doubly wrong.
TAYLER: Oh my God. Oh, back to the days. Everyone's
like, Oh, yep. This is typical Taylor and Sam,
but this is what you come here for, right? The,
the rants, the, um, what's the word? Rants, soapboxes,
whatever, whatever comes to mind. It's very stream
of consciousness, which is why it's entertaining.
SAMANTHA: Yes. And, you know, rant wise, do we
have a doozy today?
TAYLER: We have a doozy today, you guys. This
one, Samantha started ranting about on... The
good old gram, as where any quality rant starts,
right?
SAMANTHA: Right.
TAYLER: And I promptly swooped right in and said,
we should make this an episode. So here we are.
SAMANTHA: Here we are. I think, too, when I started
it, I was like. I'm just going to write a blog
post or I'm just going to, I should just do a
podcast episode or something about this. I have
so much to say.
TAYLER: Yes. So what are we commenting about today?
SAMANTHA: Oh, great. We haven't even told them.
Did we tell them?
TAYLER: No. No, we haven't told them.
SAMANTHA: I was, Sam was just ranting. That's
all they know. Okay, well, it's going to become
as no surprise to anybody that I was ranting about
influencers. So here we are today.
TAYLER: So you can think of this as a follow-up
to our Trust Me, I'm an Influencer episode. Yeah.
But this one is, I think, going to be a little
bit more cutthroat. So buckle up, bitches.
SAMANTHA: Buckle up, bitches. I, yes, I have many,
many thoughts, obviously, which we will get into.
But yeah, I think this rant mostly stemmed from
frustration. And I know I'm not the only one.
Like, As soon as I posted those stories, like
every friend I have that has a brand is just like,
oh my God, me too, me too. So if you're listening
to this because you're like, oh, God, Sam's ranting
about influencers. No, it's not just me. So...
I'm trying to speak collectively for business
owners everywhere. Business owners, marketing
managers, whatever your seat is where you're working
with influencers. It's pretty much all the same.
TAYLER: Yeah, you know, and I have... Had this
interesting experience. You guys, since we last
recorded in an episode, I have birthed another
business. And so, right. So NG is out into the
wild. And I experienced this in a similar but
different way because people make this assumption
that if you have a tech startup, that you have
$50 million in funding sitting in your bank. And
hey, that is not what Engie is doing. We are totally
self-funded. We do not have extra cash to throw
around. But I'm still getting these requests from
not even necessarily influencers, just like people,
assuming that I have money to burn and asking
for dumb shit and like just coming in hot with
the requests. So. Yeah, I'm I am very much excited
about today's chat because, you know, it's. The
takeaway, there will be some actual takeaways
as there always are. Yes, yes, yes. But it's like
how to ask properly and not be an asshole influencer.
And then also like from the business side, what
do you need to do to maybe like repel some of
these folks from reaching out too often?
SAMANTHA: Yeah, you know, I think even in the
days before Taylor, came on the podcast, Julia
and I did an episode, like I think one of our
very first ones that was like how to not be. Gross
when pitching yourself to brands.
TAYLER: And
SAMANTHA: If you're an influencer and you're wanting
to get into the game, go listen to that one first
and come back. Actually, go listen to that one.
Then go listen to the... Trust me, I'm an influencer.
And then come back because this is like a tiered
subject here. There's a lot to unpack. So, I mean,
let's start with... Kind of just talking in general
about like. Who's an influencer? From a brand
perspective, what is an influencer? Aren't we
all influencers? We're all fucking influencers.
Like, are we still allowed to cuss?
TAYLER: Yes, absolutely.
SAMANTHA: Um, so influencers, people think are
somebody with a crap ton of followers who post
something and it goes viral. That could not be
farther from the truth these days. Like honestly,
it would be awesome if it was, that was how it
was for a hot minute when Instagram was, you know,
kind of rolling along and the very first influencers,
uh, were coming out. But I mean, there's a lot
of different buckets for influencers these days.
And I think that, you know, content creators is
kind of the main one that brands are looking to
work with. And we're going to get into all of
that later. But like, there's really two main
purposes of why a brain works with an influencer.
And I'm going to use the term influencer as like
an overarching thing here, right? But two reasons
they're working with influencers are either to,
A, generate sales, right? Hoping that their reach
gets people interested in your product. Or B.
Create content. Because when you have these different
buckets, you've got your content creators who
they might not necessarily convert all that much,
but to create beautiful content for you to use.
And they are incredibly valuable to your business,
but in a different way. Right. Then obviously
generating sales. So, I mean, I. Right now I work
with, I think, I want to say we have about 150
influencers on our roster.
TAYLER: That is too many to manage.
SAMANTHA: Well, yes, it is. I inherited them.
And, yeah, it's too many. I inherited them. A
big part, you know, and. As I've been with Briar
for the past year. Which I don't even know if
anybody knows that. Cause if we don't podcast
since I started with Brian,
TAYLER: I don't think so. So, you know, we all
heard my business birthing baby. What's yours.
SAMANTHA: Yeah, I mean, I didn't birth anything.
I just took someone else's, but.
TAYLER: I shouldn't put it like that.
SAMANTHA: But so I'm at Briar Baby now instead
of Sully Baby, heading up brand and marketing.
Very lateral move for me. Pretty much the exact
same role, just instead of baby wraps, baby hats.
Hence the beanie. I have to stay on brand. Actually,
this is Christy Dawn, so don't tell anybody. But.
I, yeah, I inherited about 150 influencers. And...
I'm going to try not to make this episode just
me complaining about the influencers that I work
with on a regular basis. Because I hate... You
think 150 is a lot, but at Solly Baby, we did
150. It reached out to 150 a month. So it was
a crap ton. And I know brands that do even more
than that. All depends on your product. We'll
get there. But. In terms of... You know, the ones
that I currently have. I've been able to figure
out which bucket to put them in. And so there's
a small group that goes into the content creator,
which it's like their shit's on brand for us.
We love it. We're going to use it. There's the
ones that... Have a smaller account, but for some
reason have a bitching like engagement rate. And
like some of our top. Converting influencers have
less than 3000 followers, but their audience is
super tuned in. You know, they're very. Like.
I would consider them an actual influencer because
people are influenced by them to buy shit. And
then we have the largest bucket. Which is just
people who want free shit and nothing happens.
I would say that's about 80% of those 150. Which
In general, is pretty common for most brands.
You know, and it's, it's. As a business owner
or a marketer, you know that it's just throwing
shit at the wall and seeing what sticks. We don't
know at the gate who's going to convert and who's
not. It's trial and error. You know, you're taking
a risk by... Gifting people product and whatnot.
Which That's another thing. Gifting versus paying.
Mm-hmm. A lot of influencers these days want to
be paid. And it's understandable, right?
TAYLER: They're creating content.
SAMANTHA: But unless they're getting paid for
creating content, getting paid to actually just
be an influencer. And like promote a product doesn't
work for brands anymore. It just doesn't. So if
you're listening to this, think about which of
those buckets you fit in, you know? And if you
haven't considered which of those buckets you
fit in. It's time to do some soul searching because
there's a good chance you're in that big old 80%
bucket.
TAYLER: Which is the most annoying bucket. And
those are the people that are currently reaching
out to me. Like, I had someone who... Wanted us
to upgrade their account, which there's no way
to upgrade their account because when you create
an ng account, you get access to everything, right?
Like we don't throttle anything. But they literally
just emailed me this morning asking that if they
would write us a review. If we would upgrade their
account. And I was like, putting on my soft kid
gloves as I'm typing, but in my mind I'm going,
fuck off. Like, if you want to write a review,
write a review. If you don't, don't. But don't
come at me asking for free shit just because you
are going to type some words that I don't even
know what you're going to type.
SAMANTHA: Yeah, that's an interesting one. That's
like... Bare minimum.
TAYLER: 100%. So annoying. Thankfully, I don't
know who this human is outside of having contact
via this email. So it's highly unlikely that they're
listening to this podcast.
SAMANTHA: Yeah, yeah. Sure, sure. You know, thinking
about which of those buckets you might fit into.
Content creator, you know, someone with a dedicated
community who's actually going to convert. Other.
I'll just say other is the third bucket. And you
know, here's the thing is that influencers have
the ability to track this. They know it because
a lot of the times brands are using a platform
like Grin or Shopify Collabs where they have a
back end and they can see how they're converting,
how many link clicks they're getting, how many
times people are using their discount codes, things
like that. So there's no need to be flying blind
as an influencer. And if it is something you really
want to do and you really want to be a content
creator for brands, you should be keeping an eye
on those metrics. Thousand percent, why wouldn't
you? Because, you know, I would be willing to
bet that all of these gals in the 80% bucket here
I've never looked at that and are still just continuing
to ask for free product, knowing that they've
gotten zero link clicks. Like... Hello. Yeah.
So. I encourage you to check out, you know, those
backends. And if you don't have those, like if
you're working with brands that don't have that,
which is, I think, kind of rare these days. Email
your influencer coordinator or whatever, and just
be like, Hey, how's it going? Like, what can I
do? If it's someone you were actually want to
build a relationship with.
TAYLER: Yeah, and if you are an influencer or
content creator listening to this or like exploring
the idea of adding this as a, you know, a revenue
stream for your business.
SAMANTHA: Yeah.
TAYLER: That's exactly what it is. You have to
treat it as another revenue stream of your business.
Therefore, you have to treat it like a business.
And a real business is going to track these numbers.
And... From the business side of things of who
you might be trying to sell your content to, or
create these relationships with, that's the first
fucking question I'm going to ask. Like what's
your average conversion rate on things, right?
Like, because as the, as the company, I want to
have an idea, even just a broad strokes idea of
what I can expect from you and the, and the money
or product that I'm investing in you. So. Yeah.
If you are doing that soul searching and you are
in that 80% bucket. Or you're looking at your
business and the influence that you have, the
influencers that you have, and you're looking
at that 80% bucket. You personally need to make
some pretty significant changes in terms of how
you're approaching your pitches, right? Yeah.
Or how you're just operating things in general.
SAMANTHA: Yeah. And I mean, that actually kind
of leads pretty nicely into. Talking about what
a brand wants from an influencer, right?
TAYLER: I kind of touched on it a little bit.
What a brand needs.
SAMANTHA: More singing. I've missed yours. Missed
it. Looking at it from a big picture, which...
I don't think the majority of influencers do.
You know, It's... Not free marketing for brands
to work with influencers. I've seen people post
stuff like that, like influencers that I've worked
with. And then I start following. I should say
I have a handful of influencers that I follow
on my personal account that I love, right, that
I've worked with. And I'm like, you're a rad human.
You do a great job. Great. I'm interested in what's
going on with you. Let's be friends. I also follow
like other ones. And then It turns me off from
working with them anymore when I see the stuff
that they're posting, because like, I'll see them
complaining about brands not wanting to pay them.
And things like that. And it's like, I don't think
you realize that. Influencer marketing is not
free. We are paying for the products that we're
making. We're paying to ship them. We're paying,
you know, we're paying for all like the platforms
that we use to work with influencers. Grin's not
cheap. That's like three grand a month. Oh, my
God.
TAYLER: That's how much that big one is.
SAMANTHA: Yeah, it's stupid. It's an investment.
Oftentimes you have people like employees who
are dedicated to influencer coordinating. That's
a salary. That's a person. Like none of this is
free to a brand. And then you're looking at the
profit margins. Like, you know, I know at Glitter
Guide, I was always amazed by the amount of beauty
products I would get sent. Like. Without asking.
They would just show up at my door. And it's because
beauty products have a much lower cost margin,
right, than we have for, say, making handmade
baby bonnets. It's a lot. Different, especially
if you're producing your product overseas. That's
also a big factor. So there's just all of these
things to kind of look at when you're looking
at the brand that you're requesting product from
or requesting to work with. Are they local? Where
are their products made? What obviously you're
not going to know the exact answers, but like
take a guess based on their industry, what their
profit margins might be. So, you know, if it's
a bottle of baby bubble bath. Great. Like they're
doling that shit out like candy. But when you
have stuff that's more handmade or more has really
a lot slimmer profit margins. They can't be doling
product out to everybody who comes in requesting
it. And I know like for us, we get a ton of repeat
requests, like influencers who just want new product.
Like if we come out with a new style, they're
like, great. Or, hey, my baby grew out of this.
Can I size up? And it's like, we're not just.
Like. Your closet. Outfitting your kid. Yeah.
And so I think, you know. That's just a big component.
To me, that's the biggest one that influencers
don't take into consideration is the actual business
and financial side of it is that. No, you're not
technically getting paid when you're doing a gifted
collaboration, but it's not free marketing for
the brand. Like if anything, they're taking a
bigger risk than you are. So yeah, 100% off your
fucking high horse. No, I'm just kidding.
TAYLER: But also, yes.
SAMANTHA: But also, I'm not kidding.
TAYLER: Yeah, no, I think that's one of the huge
things that just people in general don't realize
or appreciate is that everything costs something.
Even if your business does have like a dedicated
affiliate coordinator or influencer coordinator,
that's still time from that person's day that
is the cost on top of the, you know, the actual
financial investment. And I was talking to a new
friend of mine just yesterday and one of her kind
of broken record phrases to herself, maybe kind
of a mantra is minutes matter. Like that's what
she's really leaning into this year. And I was
like, oh, that is so good. Right. And that ties
into this whole thing where it's not free. Every
minute that a company is trying to execute on
any sort of request costs it money. So nothing
is free.
SAMANTHA: When did we agree that you could get
new friends?
TAYLER: Oh. Okay, fine. Sorry. She's in Florida.
If that makes you feel better, like I will.
SAMANTHA: No, it doesn't. Why are you hanging
out with people in Florida?
TAYLER: Well, on the internet. On the internet.
SAMANTHA: Lives in Florida and I'll trust her.
TAYLER: I know that whole state. Unfortunately
I know like more than a few people that are in
Florida. I'm like you need to leave. You need
to leave.
SAMANTHA: You're better than this. Yeah.
TAYLER: Oh my goodness. I like that though.
SAMANTHA: Minutes matter.
TAYLER: Yeah. The minutes matter. Everything matters.
Right. Time is money.
SAMANTHA: Money is power. Power is pizza.
TAYLER: I was totally going to say that. I used
that gif in an email newsletter for ng.that long
ago.
SAMANTHA: And I was like, oh, I know where she's
going with this. I'm so proud.
TAYLER: Yep.
SAMANTHA: Oh, so good.
TAYLER: You guys, you guys. Let's talk about something
helpful for all of the small business owners that
tune into this.
SAMANTHA: Are you saying the rest of that was
not helpful?
TAYLER: No, I think it is helpful. I'm just kidding.
It is helpful because you always want to know
like what shit is happening out there, right?
Like, you know, half of this, half of surviving
the lifestyle of owning a business is knowing
what could potentially come at you that is just
a total bullshit opportunity, right? Yeah. And
so that is, even though we're wrapping this up
as a rant, it's still very helpful for people
to know, right? Like, don't just give your shit
away for free. Please don't do that. And that
is so rampant in the wedding and creative industry,
just like people giving away things for free that
have hard costs. So please don't do that. And
the other side of this equation, for anyone who
wants to work with an influencer of any type.
What are the, we should probably talk about the
things that are positive that they should look
for in a collaborator. So we already kind of roundabout
talked about how that influencer should have some
numerical data. To give to you, provide to you.
And if they... Resist, that is a clear sign to
just like... The fuck out. Right. Yeah. But what
are other things that businesses and brands should
look for? In an influencer if they're considering
them. Asking for a friend.
SAMANTHA: Yeah, sure.
TAYLER: Asking for a friend.
SAMANTHA: I get a lot of media kits sent my way,
which... Are fine. Like, For me, I'm not really
looking to see the whole huge breakdown of who
your audience is and like which. You know, you
can see when they send over a media kit, I guess,
you can see the other brands they've worked with.
And that's helpful because then you can. Like,
be like, oh, cool, they've worked with so-and-so.
So, like... I've had brand friends too, who will
reach out like. In the same industry and be like,
Hey, Do you mind sharing some influencers you've
worked with who work really well for you? I'm
like, yeah, I'm happy to share those with you.
Because as long as they're not a competitor, you
know, if it's like. Somebody else with another
baby bonnet you fuck off um but i don't think
people most of the time people aren't that dumb
TAYLER: No, I would hope not. Please don't be
that dumb. Guys, don't be that dumb.
SAMANTHA: I mean, isn't that kind of just the
equivalent of like when people ask you to... Do
consulting to be a marketing consultant. It's
kind of the same thing. It is the same thing.
But like, you know. When there's people in the
same industry, but selling a different product,
like I'm happy to share that with them and vice
versa. I think it's good to, you know, if someone
has a track record, it's basically like asking
for a reference in a job interview. Um, And, you
know, like we said, a lot of it is just throwing
shit at the wall and seeing what sticks. But tracking
it on your end is crucial, which if you don't
have a platform like Grin or Shopify Collabs or
anything like that. I mean, honestly, Shopify
Collabs is free, so you should be on it even if
you're not. And because most brands are on Shopify
these days, Shopify collabs is easy to track.
Recommend jumping on that bandwagon. Um, and.
You know, I think... I've had people just send
over screenshots of their last few posts that
are like, look, my reel got X amount of views.
Like that's always handy. Big one for me, this
is just like a personal pet peeve maybe, is, you
know, canned. Blanket requests where they don't
even say your brand name in it. They're just like,
I love your brand. Would love to collaborate.
It's like. Try a little harder.
TAYLER: Yeah.
SAMANTHA: And. So like those basic canned inquiries
and then also. You don't fucking follow the brand
on social yeah I don't. The other day I was combing
through our influencers and I was like, these
ones don't follow us on social and we give them
free shit. Like, how does that make sense? Yeah.
How can they be an actual? Organic representative
of the brand if they're not engaged yeah and so
i mean that's a big for me that's a big sign if
they're not already following you when they reach
out like They're just on the hunt for free shit.
TAYLER: Yeah. And, you know, from from my side
of things, because I'm very much like actively
trying to find the right people that would be
good influencers and affiliates for Engie. Yeah.
And. I guess you would call it a tactic. I don't
know. It sounds really aggressive to call it a
tactic, but these are the things that I'm doing.
Strategy. Strategy. These are the strategies that
I'm doing. And so I'm trying to find folks, and
oftentimes I'm finding them on Instagram, just
seeing who's connected tangentially to my network.
And the first thing that I do is I follow them.
Right. And then I engage with them, like genuinely
engage with their content, liking stuff, commenting,
you know, just kind of friendly banter. For quite
a long while, before I ever think about making
an ask.
SAMANTHA: Because how long do you think would
you say ballpark?
TAYLER: Two months?
SAMANTHA: Okay.
TAYLER: I mean, I really, because, you know. I
mean, people could say this about me too, where
like maybe on the surface level, they think it's
a good fit. And then they really follow me like,
oh, maybe it's not great.
SAMANTHA: Yeah.
TAYLER: You know, because you just really have
to get to know someone if you're trying to build
some sort of real long term relationship. And
so I want to see if there are any sort of like.
I mean, let's just be real. I am looking for political
red flags. Like, does this person live in Florida
and think Ron DeSantis would be a great president?
SAMANTHA: Why are you making friends in Florida
then?
TAYLER: This person is not voting. Well, Ron DeSantis
isn't even on the ticket anymore. But this person
is definitely not a Republican. So she clears
that gate. But, you know, I think that that's.
That's important to know as a brand. Like who
are you proverbially getting in bed with? So you
need to scope that out before you are deciding
to tap someone in and really... Treat them. Well
and compensate them for their time. Because you
just, you know, you don't want to find out that,
oh, this person has been out there touting your
product, your service, your business, your brand.
And then like something comes out of left field
and you're just like, ooh. Now I have a nice PR
kind of crisis that I need to handle.
SAMANTHA: Yes. Yes. I, especially with big time
influencers. I always do a deep dive on them.
You know, it's always great to do a Google search
before you're working with somebody. Like if you're
just gifting somebody something like, OK, you
can look as deep as you want. If you're like doing
an actual paid partnership with somebody or a
collaboration, you need to Like, you need to be
your own FBI. Investigate the shit out of it.
Because things will come out. And I remember one
time with Solly, like. Wee. I think it was like
right before I left, but we gifted this gal something.
And she posted about it. And then like our audience
got so upset because she's. Can't remember what
her deal was her and her husband like were super
trumpy and super like they said some really like
shady shit i guess i genuinely don't remember
the details because i was like um If you're not
watching the camera or the video, I did not fart.
That was me saying I'm out. Just realized not
everybody's going to be seeing my hand motions.
Uh, yeah. So it's, you know, it's, it's easy for
people to get riled up. We know this, like we
know people are easy to get fired up on the internet.
Don't even get me started on the kite baby controversy.
TAYLER: Oh, I don't know what this kite baby is.
Did someone put a baby on a kite?
SAMANTHA: Yes, we'll circle back to that. We absolutely
put a baby on a kite. No, that's the name of the
brand.
TAYLER: Oh my god, you guys, this is such proof
that Sam and I work in different industries. Also,
as a non-parent, I'm like, I don't know what Kite
Baby is.
SAMANTHA: Oh, I'm surprised. I mean, it's like,
like all the news outlets have picked it up and
stuff. That's why I thought maybe you'd heard
of it. Like, yeah. Anyways. Yes. I mean, even
when you're just giving someone product, like
they're a representation of your brand, right?
And. Because let's be honest, like. People know
when somebody's posting something that's gifted.
Or paid. Instagram makes that very clear that
you need to. Say, this is a paid partnership or...
You could just tell.
TAYLER: Like, you know what I mean?
SAMANTHA: Like, you can just tell the way somebody
writes a caption. They're like, I love my... It's
like, yeah, we know. They gave it to you for free.
TAYLER: Which is fine.
SAMANTHA: For me, like... I think that. It's better
to be safe than sorry. So if you feel like there
might be red flags with someone,
TAYLER: Just hold on.
SAMANTHA: Wait, do the Taylor thing. Wait a few
months.
TAYLER: Scope it out. Scope it out. So, I mean,
in addition to really getting to know the people
that you're working with, I think. One of the
big mistakes that smaller brands make when they're
starting to work with influencers is... Not having
a contract. Right? Every grandma gets a contract.
Right, Sam?
SAMANTHA: Even your grandma gets a contract.
TAYLER: Grandma gets a contract.
SAMANTHA: Yes. It's a little different with gifted
than it is with.
TAYLER: Yes.
SAMANTHA: Compensation. If you're expecting something
specific in return for gifting product, you need
to be very clear about that. You need to outline
it in your campaign terms, however you're. Onboarding
your influencers. That needs to be written out.
If you're gifting them and just like... You know,
like, hey, I gave Mandy Moore a baby wrap. Really
hope she posted about it. I wasn't going to be
like, hey, Mandy Moore, can you sign this contract?
You know, it depends on the situation. Yeah, if
money is exchanging hands. Grandma gets a contract.
A lot of the times you get people who, even with
like a campaign. That they opt into, which is
the. Kind of the main way to do it in the product
industry. You get people still just doing the
bare minimum.
TAYLER: Mm-hmm.
SAMANTHA: I can listen. I'm going to rant about
a few things for this topic. But one of my biggest
ones, Unboxing is not fucking content.
TAYLER: Stop making unboxing videos.
SAMANTHA: Nobody bought anything based off of
somebody's unboxing video. It's boring. It's lame.
It makes you look like you're showing off the
fact that you got free shit. And it does nothing
for the brand that sent it to you. End rant.
TAYLER: And...
SAMANTHA: On our campaigns, I always put stuff
like. You know, because you put deliverables,
right? Yeah. So say you're launching a new product,
you create the campaign. That people can. Apply
for. From your influencer pool. So putting in
those deliverables in there, like I want. Two
Instagram stories on these dates for the launch,
one static and feed post on this date. And you
can put, or I always at least put things like
in parentheses, unboxing does not count.
TAYLER: Yes. Yeah. Because you want this content
to add value to your brand and your product, right?
And What people want to see before making a decision
to buy from you is how it works and how it helps
someone else. So that's the kind of content that
you want your, you know, your influencers, your
brand ambassadors, whomever, your content creators
to create, because that's actually going to help
you not just look at this beautiful, you know,
USPS brown box that I got.
SAMANTHA: Right.
TAYLER: And I pulled out this product.
SAMANTHA: Yeah. I'll tag you. I'll tag you in
my stories if you send me. Something. It's like.
TAYLER: Yep.
SAMANTHA: And the thing too, like with stories,
stories only last for 24 hours, right? So I know
a lot of people like to focus on their stories
because they tend to get better traffic these
days than in feed because the algorithm hates
us. But stories are just, they're too quick. Mm-hmm.
Like. They're too fast to be anything more. Then
a shot in the dark at converting.
TAYLER: Yep.
SAMANTHA: So if you're actually looking to like
build a relationship with a brand, you need to
offer more than just stories.
TAYLER: Yep. Yep. And... For all of the brands
out there, please track some metrics on each of
your folks. These people, like you said, Sam,
like they're going to come back to you and ask
for more. They're going to ask for more free shit.
And so it is your responsibility as the business
owner to know who deserves more free shit.
SAMANTHA: Right. So. And can I tell you who does
not deserve more free shit?
TAYLER: I don't know. Tell me.
SAMANTHA: So one of my big things. If you're going
to come back to me and ask me for more stuff.
Please don't be posting competing brands. Oh,
yeah. On your social channels. Yeah. If you're
deciding you want to work with a brand in certain
industries, right? Whether that be a certain apparel,
certain like technology, whatever. We'll just
continue to use baby hats, for example. So say
I send you a bonnet and then you come to me and
ask me for another bonnet and I go to your socials.
And you've just posted your baby in another company's
product. Tagging it like It just... It's not even
like, oh, she's working with our competitors.
It makes it feel so incredibly... Not organic.
TAYLER: Yep. Like, it feels gross.
SAMANTHA: It's like... It's gross. So that's a
big thing. If you really want to work with brands
on an ongoing basis, you have to build a relationship.
And that means, you know, engaging with them on
social media, following them on social media,
engaging on social media. Those are my favorite
influencers are the ones who I didn't. You know,
I'm not asking for shit. They're just doing it
because they genuinely love the brand.
TAYLER: Yep.
SAMANTHA: And that kind of in tandem means not
promoting other brands with competing products
if you want to continue working. With the original
brand. It's really easy to want to try to get
as much free stuff as you can. I get that. It's
they're like, it's exciting to have brands send
you stuff for free. But from my business perspective,
like you have to make smart choices. Yep.
TAYLER: Yep. And that's the lesson from today's
episode, folks.
SAMANTHA: Make smart choices.
TAYLER: Make smart choices and stop asking for
free shit, right?
SAMANTHA: Well, unless I mean, you don't have
to stop asking, but you have to be worthy of the
free shit. And having X amount of followers does
not make you worthy of said free shit. Like that's
the part people need to realize. Or when they
say like, well, I can create content for you.
It's like, OK, well, take a look at the brand's
content. If your content is not up to par or not
the same vibe and they're not going to repost
it, does nothing for them.
TAYLER: Yeah.
SAMANTHA: And, you know, I mean, I'm sure with
NG too. When you're looking to work with influencers
for your brand, please use the product correctly.
Don't post stuff using it incorrectly. That was
always a huge thing at Solly. People would post
these reels of them wearing their wraps and their
babies got like one leg out and they're going
to fall. And it's like, Jesus Christ. Okay.
TAYLER: Yeah. So
SAMANTHA: That's another thing. Pay attention
to brand guidelines.
TAYLER: Yes. Yes. And. OK, I'll revise my lesson
for the day is that both from the the influencer
perspective and the brand perspective, you are
looking for a true. Brand ambassador and loyalist
who believes in the business. Right. And so you
need to be that as an influencer and not just
be grabbing for stuff. And then as a business
owner, you need to be trying to connect with and
find those folks. So, you know, I have. Run different,
I know affiliates is different than influencers
to some degree, maybe to a major degree. But,
you know, when I look at The... Affiliates that
I've got, most of them fall into that 80% bucket
where You know, they will... Post their affiliate
link on a resource page of their website. And
then that's basically where it stops. And... That
it's like, that's not, this is not what we're
trying to do here. We're trying to look for people
who are genuinely stoked about what it is that
you're bringing to the table. So. So yes. So yes.
People. So yes. Influencers. We could rant about
influencers till the end of time. Sure.
SAMANTHA: But we don't have that much time to
record.
TAYLER: No, we don't. We don't. You've got two
small children. I have a to-do list that won't
quit. You also have a to-do list that won't quit.
So if anyone wants to continue this rant, you
know where to find us. We're all over the internets.
They are all over the internet.
SAMANTHA: Yeah.
TAYLER: So. Well, as we're wrapping up, you guys,
we have kind of a big announcement to make. Samantha
does need to step away from the podcast.
SAMANTHA: Yes, it's been.
TAYLER: You've been on, you've been doing this
for a long time. Five years.
SAMANTHA: That's a long time. It's a long time.
And I mean, I guess we can't technically count
last year because we just kind of went for last
year.
TAYLER: Also not a farting.
SAMANTHA: But I mean, you know, we didn't record
at all last year because I was just so overwhelmed
with work and the punk ass baby that, you know,
it just didn't work out. And I think I'm just
at a punk ass baby didn't work out. No, he worked
out fine.
TAYLER: The way you said that made it sound like
the punk ass baby didn't work out.
SAMANTHA: No, I kept the punk ass baby. I have
to get rid of the podcast. Something I had to
give. Yes. But, you know, I mean. It's been a
wonderful five years for me, five, four, whatever
you want to call it. We've talked about a lot
of really fun stuff and I think we've helped a
lot of people. But fear not because the podcast
is not going away. I'm just going away.
TAYLER: I mean, I am personally very sad that
you're going away. I was reading back through
some of our reviews and I love most of them are
like. About our relationship and our friendship
and just how there is a, a very special chemistry
to be totally cliche that we have. And I love
that we've gotten to share our weird fucking friendship
with the world. Because. It makes me so happy
that people, A, find it entertaining and B, feel
like we're a place that they can come to learn.
And so it really, you know, I am taking over the
podcast with all of the responsibility. I'm like,
let's do this. It's going to be different because
I won't I probably won't say fuck as much because
I don't know if all of my guests will want me
to say fuck as much.
SAMANTHA: We'll see. Those are the wrong guests.
OK. We'll see.
TAYLER: It'll be different, but I'm gonna definitely
keep. The baton going with all the small business
talk, all of the spicy topics. Like I want this
to continue to be a place where people are going
to get brutally honest. Yeah. I think conversations
about running a business. So, and who knows, maybe
every once in a while I'll drag Sam back into
a conversation. Yeah.
SAMANTHA: I'll pop in. I'll pop in every now and
then.
TAYLER: So, but yeah, I mean, I'll pop in. The
plan is to release new episodes on a monthly basis.
I have hired podcast editors because Sam was that
person and I just got to show up and be the pretty
face and talent.
SAMANTHA: In addition to all of the outlines.
Come on. And sell yourself short.
TAYLER: But, yes, I've had to hire someone because
I was like, I don't know how to do this.
SAMANTHA: It's a lot of fucking work. Hence why
I had to.
TAYLER: Yes, exactly. So but the podcast is going
to live on. It will still be the Pretty OK podcast
because that is the best podcast name ever. And
I don't think that much will change other than
the fact that it's going to be me and some other
rotating human on a monthly basis.
SAMANTHA: But which, you know, to be fair, has
been it's not a new thing. Because you picked
up an awful lot of slack in those early Milo days.
TAYLER: You know, those punk ass baby days, you
know, that is, that's what partners do, Sam. We
pick up the slack. So, well... That is, I guess,
the last episode of this iteration of the Pretty
OK podcast.
SAMANTHA: I bet you didn't know when I jokingly
asked you if you wanted to be my new co-host that
this is where you'd end up. I know.
TAYLER: And I still. Taking the reins. I know.
You guys, we've talked about this before. When
I was a guest way back when. It was kind of like
a joke. Like, hey, do you want to be my new podcast
partner? And I remember... And I immediately,
I remember texting Cassie and immediately I was
like, oh my God, I think Sam wants me to be your
podcast host, co-host. Like, I took it very seriously.
SAMANTHA: So I'm glad it worked out.
TAYLER: It did work out. But yes, little did I
know that, what, I think you and I have been doing
it for two and a half years, three years, something
like that.
SAMANTHA: More than that, because Milo is two
and a half.
TAYLER: Oh, okay. So like three and a half years
probably then. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Yes, little did
I know that I would be taking the torch, but.
You know.
SAMANTHA: Well, here you go. Take it.
TAYLER: Taking it.
SAMANTHA: I can't wait to be a listener.
TAYLER: Judge the shit out of all of my guests.
SAMANTHA: Yes, if they're from Florida.
TAYLER: No one on my guest list is from Florida.
I promise you that.
SAMANTHA: Okay. Well, we'll see. So, but yes,
I know you're going to do great things with it
and I can't wait to listen to it.
TAYLER: Yeah, it'll be fun. Well. This is us signing
off from the Pretty Okay Podcast. Show notes will
be up on prettyokaypodcast.com. There will be
intermittent social media shenanigans happening
on Instagram still at Pretty Okay Podcast. But
thank you so much for tuning in to this episode.
We'll catch you next month. And Sam, I love you.
You're the best. Thank you for birthing this podcast
and giving it to me.
SAMANTHA: Hey. This is probably the only thing
I'll birth and give to you. So, you know. Love
you too.
TAYLER: All right, everyone. See you later. Bye,
guys.