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Warning: Producer Dan couldn’t make it to this episode, so please don’t turn it off when you hear Scott's voice first. Also, note that this is not our usual format - it's our first update interview. The updates are nothing but positive, but we revisit parts of Amy's story about her broken neck and sheared brain stem, and we also talk about the suicidal thoughts she was having at that time. Amy's book Finding My Hero Within: A Journey from Incapacitation to Empowerment is out now.
Dan and I first became acquainted with Amy in August 2023 when we interviewed her for our 17th episode, I Laid in Bed 23 Hours a Day for a Year. The episode was about the catastrophic injuries she experienced when she fell at home. Amy didn’t know it at the time, but she’d later learn she sheared her brainstem, and she lives with a broken neck to this day.
Amy’s episode was one of the first that made me think Positively Terrible could be something special. She was a great guest with a powerful story, and I had no idea why she trusted us enough to share with us idiots. She was one of the first guests we booked who wasn’t a friend, family, or a friend of a friend. I immediately knew she was a great guest, but I didn’t realize Amy would become a special friend of the Podcast. We’ve followed Amy as she's continued her journey, and we never go too long without hearing from her.
Considering how much we appreciate Amy, we quickly agreed when she approached us to record an update. This one is a little lighter on the trauma aspect, though she does tell us about the fancy new plate in her neck. This one is more about a life achievement she wanted to share – she published a book! It's called Finding My Hero Within: A Journey from Incapacitation to Empowerment, and it's being released for the 10th anniversary of her accident.
Creators & Guests
What is Positively Terrible?
Scott, his wife's fiancé, and her boyfriend walked into a bar. Now, each week Scott and Dan discuss surviving, and thriving, after trauma. Settle in my terrible listeners, today's episode is going to be Positively Terrible.
Terrible Scott (00:01.642)
You're tuned into Positively Terrible, where most weeks, Dan reads the intro in his professional producer voice. He can't be here today, so this week, Scott, that's me, is interviewing Positively a Terrible alum, decent fucking human, and newly published author Amy Thurman in our very first update episode. Amy, how are you doing today?
Amy Thurman (00:24.526)
Oh my gosh, Scott, thank you so much. I'm so honored that I'm your very first update. I'm doing great.
Terrible Scott (00:28.266)
I couldn't think of a better update to have. I'm so happy to get to talk to you again. I know in the months since you've been on your first time, we've conversed and we've gone back and forth. So it's been really nice getting to know you over the last six months or whatever it's been. And on our end, the podcast, we were at episode 17 when we first recorded with you.
Amy Thurman (00:33.614)
Hahaha.
Terrible Scott (00:54.794)
And now we are approaching a year since we first launched. That's, that's going to be happening in a couple of weeks. So we're up there in the late forties. I didn't look to see exactly where we're at, but I'm probably not any more polished than we were six months ago, but I know what I'm doing a little bit more. So Amy, welcome back. Yeah.
Amy Thurman (01:10.382)
Ha ha.
That's so exciting. Thank you so much. I'm so that's congratulations. First of all, that's so exciting for you guys. And I, I have told you this, just you, but I want to say it publicly that this, the episode that I did with you guys is still one of the fan favorites. Like I have done so many podcast interviews, but the one that people always come back and say, that was my favorite was the one I did with you guys, because it was just.
So natural, you asked such great questions and it was just such a good conversation. And so, yeah, obviously you know what you're doing because it's one of the favorites. So thank you so, so much, Scott.
Terrible Scott (01:50.122)
Well, I'm not sure I do know what I'm doing, but I am able to fake it well. So let's talk just a little bit. I'm going to make sure, I want to make sure our listeners know about the first episode and what we talked about a little bit. So the episode that you were on, I said was back in August, episode 17, it was called, I laid in bed 23 hours a day for a year. And in that episode, you talked about a time when you had,
passed out unexpectedly, fell to the floor, broke your neck and sheared your brainstem. And I do want you to talk about that a little bit, but before you do that, I'm going to just read some quotes that I pulled from that episode that as I listened to it and preparing to talk to you again, just really stuck out to me. The first one was just, I live with a broken neck now.
There was another moment where you said, I felt like there was a train sitting on my head.
Terrible Scott (02:53.13)
You talked about an interview you did with a medical professional and you told us that she had never seen anyone with a shared brainstem who survived it before.
Amy Thurman (03:04.238)
Yes.
Terrible Scott (03:05.674)
And probably the most telling of this period was when you said that you had prayed to die.
Amy Thurman (03:13.422)
Yes, yes, those are very heavy.
Terrible Scott (03:18.954)
So Amy, your book is coming out because it's the 10 year anniversary of when you broke your neck.
Amy Thurman (03:26.094)
Yeah.
Terrible Scott (03:26.762)
Can we go back for just a couple of minutes and talk kind of about the headspace you were in back then and compared to where you are today.
Amy Thurman (03:37.614)
Absolutely. It's, oh my gosh, a vast difference. That's why, you know, my book is called Finding My Hero Within, a Journey from Incapacitation to Empowerment, because that's exactly what happened. Like, I was completely incapacitated physically. I literally did lay in a bed for 23 hours a day for almost a year. But I was also completely incapacitated mentally, emotionally, in every other aspect of my life. I didn't know how to get to where I wanted my life to be.
And so I have over the last decade learned how to do that, learned how to, I call it polish the mirror of my life to get to this path that led me to this trajectory that I'm on now, where I'm able to live an empowered life. And so it's been a lot of learning, a lot of digging deep and figuring out what I had buried in there that I had to let surface and deal with and pain and trauma and just all of that. I had to be willing to deal with all of that.
in order to get to where I am today. So it's been quite a journey.
Terrible Scott (04:39.594)
Even when you decided that you wanted to survive the incident after praying to die and then kind of having that moment where you decided to make the best of your life, did you think you'd get to where you are today?
Amy Thurman (04:54.798)
Oh my gosh, absolutely not. I had no idea what would develop from that one choice of choosing to fight to live instead of fighting to die. My plan back then, I had my master's degree. I was working at a university and my plan was to go on to get my doctorate degree, to gain more knowledge, to impart more wisdom upon people. That was what my plan was. And so that's what I...
Terrible Scott (05:17.066)
Right.
Amy Thurman (05:22.542)
assumed what happened. That was in my quest to get better. That's what I wanted to do. And I just, I never could, like I still, 10 years later, and am unable to work because I can only hold my head up for a few hours at a time. I can't be dependable to anyone, even myself. And so, yeah, I never ever thought that this would be my life. Yeah, it's wild.
Terrible Scott (05:50.538)
Well, you say impart wisdom, and I can't help but think that authoring a book like this is actually achieving that goal in a way that you never could have with just more education.
Amy Thurman (06:06.926)
I had never thought about it like that Scott. Like I'm literally like having chills over here because it's so true. The wisdom that I was planning to impart, you know, was more book knowledge type things. But as you put it, I'm able to like share the wisdom of life now, not just through the book, but through my life that I've been living, just as an example to people of what's possible.
Terrible Scott (06:07.722)
You
Terrible Scott (06:26.538)
Yeah, yeah.
Amy Thurman (06:34.958)
when you set your mind to it. And so it is a totally different kind of wisdom, but it's, I think it's a much more effective type this way. So I'm so glad you shared that. Yeah.
Terrible Scott (06:40.298)
Well, more effective and more important. I'm going to guess. I have not read the book and I don't know what wisdom you'd have been imparting on me with your education, but we wouldn't have crossed paths. You wouldn't be out here giving your message of resilience and taking your life into your own hands and coming back from such a catastrophic injury. And it's been...
Amy Thurman (06:54.606)
Hahaha.
Terrible Scott (07:08.522)
you know, kind of an incredible, I've only seen a very small part of your journey, but it's been incredible to see what I've seen. And you had another surgery recently. Can you tell us about that?
Amy Thurman (07:21.038)
Sure, it was February 5th and I had just about finished my book by then so I didn't include this part in my book. But yes, since I finished that book, I have had a second surgery where they went in through the back of my neck and their first surgery I had a plate and eight screws in the front. And so this surgery they added another plate and eight more screws in the back.
So my neck is, I have two plates and 16 screws in there now. And I no longer feel like a bobblehead. Like that, you know, it was wobbling around. Like there was no stability to my neck and it was affecting the muscles. It was affecting, you know, so much as far as pain goes. And I feel it. I feel the stability now. I feel that it's, it's finally fusing. It's finally starting to heal and things are improving. I still struggle. I still.
You know, have to rest a lot and rest my neck and I still have balance issues, but I'm feeling much more stable. Like it's going in the right direction. And so I knew that I needed this surgery years ago. My neurosurgeon and I talked about it years ago, but he said it's a nasty surgery. Like it's nasty to recover from. And so you don't want to do it only as a last resort. So I put it off because I was dreading it.
because everybody I talked to said, oh my gosh, the recovery is horrible. And literally, in the hospital, they tried to give me those heavy, heavy pain relievers. And I said, I don't need those. Can I just have some Tylenol? And my neurosurgeon said, what? You only want Tylenol? And I said, you know what? The pain from this surgery is not that much worse than the pain I was living with on a daily basis. I just need some Tylenol.
Terrible Scott (08:57.706)
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Amy Thurman (09:14.158)
And he used the word remarkable. He said, I have never ever had a patient recover this well, this quickly from this surgery. And so I put it off for so long because I was dreading it and it was just like, oh my gosh, you know? So.
Terrible Scott (09:18.89)
Hahaha!
Terrible Scott (09:26.058)
All right, so you're not going to need a second book to talk about this experience is what you're saying. But this is now this is twice that you've told us that you've had a doctor say, I have never witnessed and it's been a very positive experience for you both times. So that that is great. And I'm glad to hear it. I know I saw some of your posts on social media and it was clear that this was a serious thing that you you were.
Amy Thurman (09:33.902)
Oh.
Terrible Scott (09:55.882)
we're going into and had to make that decision. One more question on it. Was there a specific thing or a specific moment when you decided like, I just have to do this now?
Amy Thurman (10:12.59)
It was when I went in and I saw the the x -rays the screws in the front because it was wobbling around the screws were starting to break and so there's like no fixing that like that doesn't just fix itself and so I knew it had to happen like if if because it was just going to get worse the screws were going to eventually completely break and cause more problems and I thought I'm not getting any younger and it's going to be harder to recover the older I am and so
just gonna do it. Like just do it, get it over with and move on with my life. That was my thinking. And so I'm so glad I did. Oh my word. So glad I did.
Terrible Scott (10:48.042)
Yeah, it sounds like it. So let's go back to the book. When did you decide to write a book?
Amy Thurman (10:59.054)
Oh my gosh. I used to teach language arts in a land far, far away and long, long ago. And when I taught that, I thought, you know what, it would be cool to write a book someday. I'm teaching these kids how to write paragraphs and essays and it'd be cool to write a book, but I didn't know what it would be about. I didn't know what I knew enough about to be able to write a book. And so it just sat there in the back of my mind for so many years.
And then as I began just sharing my story with people and conversations, it just kept coming up. People kept saying, you really need to put this in a book. You really need to put this in a book. And I would say, well, I appreciate that, but I don't know that really people are really interested in my story, you know? And, um, and then when I started doing podcast interviews, um, it took five separate people telling me that I needed to develop a TEDx talk before I believe that.
maybe there's something to this, which I am currently working on a TEDx talk, but it was from all of those people saying, I really feel like this is something that's needed in the world. And so I took just a beginner course on writing and started writing it and it just didn't feel right. I was just like, ah, it's just putting it down on the paper. It didn't feel right. And I met with this person and she said to me, and I was expressing that to her like,
It's so difficult. Like it's the most difficult thing I've ever done because of the emotion that's involved. I was reliving the trauma every time I sat down to write and it was just so hard. And I was expressing this to her and she said, have you ever thought about writing it from the person you are now instead of the person you were then? And I was like, wait, what? How do I do that? You know, anyway, I eventually grasped that concept and I scrapped the whole version, whole first version of it.
and just started writing from that perspective and it just flowed, literally it just flowed out. And so I don't know if you have seen some of the responses of people who have read it, but it just blows my mind. It really does.
Terrible Scott (13:05.066)
Yeah, I will admit as of this second, I have not, but definitely plan to get myself a copy and to look at all of the reviews and maybe we'll post some of them on our website or on our social media for you. I'm going to ask you, I'm not going to call, I was going to say a dumb question. I know that it's not the kind of the meat of what you're here to talk about, but I am super fascinated with.
Amy Thurman (13:22.734)
Oh.
Terrible Scott (13:33.386)
with writing books. And I probably want to talk to you offline if you ever get more time. I know you're incredibly busy right now. Because I've had this in the back of my mind for a long time. And I'm just curious about how long did it even take you to write the book? And let's start with both from when it wasn't feeling right, the whole process, and then from when you finally hit your stride and it all started flowing out.
Amy Thurman (13:42.254)
No, absolutely.
Amy Thurman (14:02.798)
Yeah, you know, I do a talk where I talk about the importance of sharing your story. And so I'm going to back you like, I will keep you accountable, Scott. If you want to write a book, you let me know and I will, I will keep contact with you until you do it. Cause there's so much healing. Like it was so hard, but there was so much healing that came from that, that I never could have gotten anywhere else. Um, the class that I took, I believe was in August, let's see of 2023.
Terrible Scott (14:09.162)
You
Terrible Scott (14:14.09)
Okay, okay.
Amy Thurman (14:32.75)
So that was last year. That's when I started writing it, that it just didn't feel right. And it wasn't until December of 2023 that I actually started really getting into writing it from this new perspective. And my editor said, you have to have a specific number of words before you come publish it. Like they won't let you publish it until you have a specific number of words. And so I was keeping track every day of how many words I was writing so that I could hit that mark.
and I hit it in March. And so it started in December, finished it in March, and then in April, there it was, all ready to go. So yeah, you gotta do it.
Terrible Scott (15:06.506)
Wow.
Yeah, I mean, I want to say how like that that that is to me. I mean, look, I know there's prolific writers out there. You've got the if I'm going to extreme examples, you know, Stephen King, how many books in a year was he writing at his peak? And then you've got people who take years to write their books. And obviously, there's differences between fiction and nonfiction memoirs, all of that. So I'm sure the experience is different for everyone. Just.
because of even because of your own style. And but it's just been one of those things that it's like, it's such a daunting idea. And I look at people and I tell myself, you know, there, there are people who run marathons and they're not doing it to run in to enter the Olympics. They're doing it for the personal challenge, for the pride, for whatever reasons they have.
And I've got those deep inside and I've got, I've got a couple of books. I've got both fiction and nonfiction inside of me. And it's one of those things that's extremely intimidating. And I, if you, if you're really offering to get on my ass about it, I need someone on my ass about it. Okay. I mean, this is something that I've put off for a long time. Um, so we'll let, let, let's work together.
Amy Thurman (16:30.286)
Bye.
Amy Thurman (16:35.086)
Absolutely. Yeah. Sold. Sold. I will be your ass -chewer.
Terrible Scott (16:36.938)
All right. All right. That's perfect. So, Amy, I kind of want to know a little bit about the book then. When does it start in your life? Does it start with the injury or does it go back further than that?
Amy Thurman (16:56.942)
It starts before that because the issues with my health started when I was pregnant with my youngest son. So that was in 2009. And so it starts there. It is, then it jumps to, you know, the 10, the 10 year journey of all of that I've been through with living with this broken neck and discovering it and fighting through the medical system and the disability system and going through so many specialists and tests and advocating for myself.
And, you know, six years later, finally figuring out what caused me to pass out and the full extent of my neck injury. And then when I decided to stop pursuing that, there's a chapter in there that that's called the puzzle piece that broke me. When I finally six years later, the doctor said to me, you have a serious injury to your neck. Like six months after the accident, a neurologist said, you have a neck injury.
But it was six years later before a person tested me for a specific thing and said, your neck is very, very injured, much more than you thought it was to begin with. And it was at that point where I was just like, okay, this is it. When he said to me, 5 % of people with this injury to their neck survive, even fewer, the percentage is fewer of people who are able to walk with this injury that I thought.
Okay, I need to accept that. I'm still here for a reason. You know, obviously I have survived this for a reason. I'm still able, I had to relearn to walk and I talk about all of that. And so it's a very personal, it's some of the things people are saying are telling me that they feel like they are inside my head, that they're right there with me, that they feel like they have a best friend, that they're right there cheering me on, that it's a roller coaster because that's what it was. One person said she,
could see it being made into a movie. And I had one reader who contacted me and asked if they could meet me via Zoom. And I thought, that's interesting. Okay. So we did that. And they said that they were considering ending their life and that they, because of my story and my book, that they chose to live instead. And so it's that journey, but it's also,
Amy Thurman (19:25.23)
The words they're using are inspiring, encouraging, empowering. And it's also a guidebook for people who are going through adversity. I put in, because you know, I have this polish, polish the mirror is my business. It's my philosophy. It's my practice. And so I put in little, little segments of those throughout the book that are actually tips and tactics that you can use in your own life to learn to polish the mirror of your life. And so I put just a few of those in there.
Terrible Scott (19:26.57)
Yeah.
Amy Thurman (19:53.774)
and I'm hearing really, really great reviews about those sections. So it's also a guidebook. So it's just all the things, you know, wrapped up into one.
Terrible Scott (19:59.242)
Yeah. Yeah. And when you talk about the timeline, I'm thinking back to your original episode and it took six months before, I think it was six months before they even diagnosed you with a broken neck that initially they were looking at like head brain injury. And if I remember correctly, they more or less sent you home telling you to take some Tylenol and
hearing you now I'm kind of thinking like now this time you had the surgery and all you wanted was Tylenol. So some more parallels here. Yeah, for sure. And this time it was your decision and this time it was the right thing for you. But those are all incredible things to hear about the people who have read your book and to hear anyone ever say that, I mean, you saved their life. I mean,
Amy Thurman (20:30.477)
Yes.
Amy Thurman (20:40.142)
Come a full circle, yep.
Terrible Scott (20:59.114)
I cannot imagine. I've had people tell me how meaningful it is to hear my fucked up story. And I can't imagine hearing someone say that they were thinking about ending their life, but they're, they get, we're so inspired by you. And that is just an amazing thing. And another thing that I couldn't imagine hearing, and you're probably going to hear it if you haven't yet.
Amy Thurman (21:09.71)
Mm -hmm.
Terrible Scott (21:27.466)
Has anyone asked you for an autograph yet?
Amy Thurman (21:32.718)
It's so funny that you said that. I went to the pharmacy the other day and I walked in and the pharmacist, obviously they know me by name because I take lots of meds. I don't take a lot of medications, but you know, I'm there pretty regularly. And so they know who I am. And I walk in, the pharmacist yelled, it's me, Amy Thurman, get her autograph. I was like, what is happening? And I literally walked outside to get back in my car.
Terrible Scott (21:51.594)
Yeah.
Amy Thurman (22:01.838)
And there were two other people who I know pulled up and yelled out the car window, do you have a book with you? Can you sign it? So I was standing in the parking lot of the pharmacy, signing books, you know, taking pictures.
Terrible Scott (22:12.042)
That's got to feel surreal. I want you to tell me the truth on this. Did you practice your autograph anticipating that you'd have to sign some books?
Terrible Scott (22:25.034)
Yeah
Amy Thurman (22:26.062)
It's so funny because you do you wonder about that like what am I going to say? And so I did because I'm doing a couple book signings coming up and yeah, so I have been thinking like what am I going to write? I don't want to just sign my name. I want it to be more personalized. But if I don't know the person well, what am I going to write? You know, it is this whole thinking that you go through. And so I came up with one little short slogan that I can put for those that I don't really know well.
Terrible Scott (22:31.658)
Okay, okay.
Terrible Scott (22:41.514)
Hahaha!
Amy Thurman (22:54.19)
And then the people that I do know well, I just, it was, to me, it reminds me of in junior high when you're signing everybody's yearbooks.
Terrible Scott (22:58.442)
Okay, yeah, that makes sense. I mean it except for everybody only wants your signature this time around so I'd imagine that's pretty both maybe maybe the same is saying something about me, but I think it'd be extremely cool but very like awkward as well But I hope you get to sign enough that you get comfortable with it that you know what to say So Amy we said we're gonna keep the short today
Amy Thurman (23:04.814)
That's what it feels like.
Amy Thurman (23:21.102)
Ha ha ha!
Terrible Scott (23:27.754)
So I do want to ask you one more question about your book. What is your favorite part about it? If you can tell me a quote or a chapter or just the accomplishment, what's your favorite part?
Amy Thurman (23:47.79)
I have so many favorites. My very favorite chapter is probably the one called An Unexpected Gift, and it's about my children and how what we have been through together has actually been an unexpected gift that I felt so guilty. I missed that year of their lives, you know, and I felt like I ruined them and that they were not prepared for life. I just failed at being a mom, but that's not what happened at all.
they were actually more prepared for life. They became more resilient, they became more resourceful, they became more compassionate and caring, and just had to mature so that it actually prepared them for life in a way that it wouldn't have otherwise. And so I think that's my favorite part of the story is just the bond that it's created between me and my kids. Yeah.
Terrible Scott (24:37.578)
That sounds great and terrible listeners. If you haven't heard Amy's episode yet, I know you're going to rush over and listen to it, but if you haven't heard it, Amy was very busy with work. She expressed that, you know, maybe she hadn't spent enough time with her family before some of this and that when it happened, a lot changed. And, you know, you just said that year, but
Amy Thurman (24:47.566)
Yeah.
Terrible Scott (25:04.714)
The last time we talked, you expressed that even before that year that, you know, you loved your family. I'm sure, I'm not trying to say, I'm not trying to say, you didn't say that, oh, I was failing as a mom or anything like that. You just said that your attention wasn't always where it should have been or could have been. So I know that that's a huge part of your story. And, you know, I...
It's nothing, I've said it a million times, the experiences that we go through, I wouldn't recommend to anyone, but sometimes there's some pretty cool things that come from it. So Amy, thank you so much for coming back on and giving our listeners an update.
Amy Thurman (25:43.278)
Yes.
Amy Thurman (25:49.55)
Of course, thank you so, so much. It's such an honor to get to chat with you again, Scott.
Terrible Scott (25:49.898)
Oh, that's a strong word. I don't know that I'd go with honor, but we are the ones, or I said we, Dan's not here. I am the one who's honored right now. I'm sure Dan is honored that you thought of us and said, hey, can we get together again? So your story has just been so great. And hopefully you don't have anything else that requires you to come back on and to overcome and come tell us about more traumas.
Amy Thurman (26:07.374)
you
Amy Thurman (26:12.142)
Yeah.
Oh.
Terrible Scott (26:20.01)
But hopefully we'll have a chance to work together again. And if not on top, positively terrible, hopefully you and I can get together and talk about some of the stuff that I want to talk about Amy.
Terrible Scott (26:33.642)
All right.
Amy Thurman (26:34.51)
Absolutely, yes, get that book out there. Absolutely. It's available on my website. I don't know if I said that. It's www .getamyshelp .com slash book. That's G -E -T -A -M -Y -S -H -E -L -P. And there are like four different countries that you can order from on that link there. So, yeah.
Terrible Scott (26:52.426)
All right, such a professional remembering to get that final plug -in that I forgot to ask where you can get it. I always ask where you can get it. So thank you, Amy. Again, it's great having you on. Terrible listeners, thanks for tuning in. I'm also gonna post Amy's episode again or put a link to it down below. And always remember, you can follow us at PositivelyTerrible on any of these streaming apps. You can follow our social medias at PositivelyTerrible.
or email us at podcast at positivelyterrible .com. And this episode, I can't say has been positively terrible because it's been nothing but positive. Thank you so much again, Amy. We'll talk to you later.
Amy Thurman (27:40.302)
Thank you so much.