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Our mission is to take a stand for Christ while hunting from tree stands and enjoying God’s great outdoors. On every adventure, if you look for it, God will teach you something about Himself. That’s what we want to share, a show about awesome hunting and an awesome creator who made it all possible.
Speaker 1 0:20
Hey, welcome back once again to the stand outdoors, the show where the faith and the great outdoors come together. I'm Dave Baker, along with the founder of the stand outdoors, the Right Reverend. Mike, Hey, today we're talking about crossbow hunting, the pros and cons of crossbow hunting. And I know, Mike, you had a little issue with the crossbow situation when it came out for the first time. I think you were very upset. Yes, I tense. I sense there were some animosities going on there. You traditional compound bow hunters? Yes, we're not very happy about the crossbow situation,
Speaker 2 1:12
right? And I started out using a stick and string, you know, like a traditional shooting instinctive, making my own arrows with and when the compound bow, when it came in, you know, I went to that, but this was really pushing it to me, you know, the
Unknown Speaker 1:27
very, very opposite of what your dress was.
Speaker 2 1:30
I mean, I could see it. I was upset because I could see it in shotgun, but not in archery, you know, and, but now that I've got a hurt shoulder, and nobody really, actually, everything that I I thought would happen did happen right in my own backyard, where I knew that these young kids would be getting a hold of these things. They don't want to take the time to practice and do all this stuff. They can go out pick up that thing and shoot it like a shotgun, and they can hunt during archery season. Now, here we are, the pure archers being so stealth. We're spraying ourselves down. We're clean. We're wearing all this expensive scent lock, you know, you know, scent protection, and we're doing it. We're we're planning way ahead, you know, to put in our stand. We're doing all this stuff to outwit these incredible animals. And one one day, I'm walking out of my stand, you know, Ben so quiet, got a nice little access and exit area, you know, not to disturb the deer. And I see five teenagers all with crossbows walking through the woods. No kidding, just tromping through. So I go over there. First of all, they didn't even have permission to hunt, which was crazy. So I go over there, and I said, What are you guys doing? And I literally set them down, Dave. I said, Listen, guys, have a seat. And I couldn't believe they actually did. You know, they seem to be very, you know, cooperative for teenagers. But they, they, they sat down. I said, I want to tell you a little something about Archer. This is archery season, and believe it or not, that crossbow is a piece of archery equipment, I said, and you can't just walk around like you're, like, you got a shotgun and you can, you know, with buckshot, and you're going to shoot jump, yeah, I said, that's not an archery season. It's all about, you know, figuring this deer out. And I just explained the whole thing, and they listened. It was amazing how they sat there and they listened, you know, and I gave him a nice, I mean, I felt like my cave speech. But I knew that would happen. I knew that, you know, they would Ben up thinking, that they would think it's a gun, do it, you know, and they'd be taking these long shots, wounding deer, you know, messing up the whole woods for archery. That's why archery comes before shotgun. Is because archers it's a lot harder to figure those deer out within 20 yards. Get them close. Yeah, 20 yards. So, so, yeah, it was, it was pretty upsetting, but I've learned to, you know, grow with
Unknown Speaker 4:15
it. It is a reality. Now my
Speaker 2 4:16
it is a reality, and can't turn back the clock. Yes, I know. And I, you know, I've come to grips with matter of fact now that I have 10 grandkids, and my oldest, you know, is only, well, he was eight when he got his first buck, and he got it with a crossbow, and I was thrilled to death that we could do. So I'm seeing all these positive things. It's getting more people involved in the sport, and I've just learned that in my old age here, that we hunters got to stick together. You know, we really do, because there's a lot of people against us, and we don't need to be against each other because of the weapon we choose to use. That's very true. A good word, yeah. And we really need to just, you know, be together. It.
Speaker 1 5:00
Now, let me ask you a question here. You, you know, I started with the Matthews compound that's I started shooting back in the day. It's
Speaker 2 5:07
because you have a lot of money. But now that I figured, I better go with
Speaker 1 5:11
the best before I if I'm going to do this, I'm going to do it upright. And I was never a huge bow hunter. Dad used to use the old, the old green crossbow, or a compound bow, the old style, yeah, and he was not very successful with it, because he couldn't get the deer close enough. But anyway, so the transition from that to crossbow was an adjustment. So let's talk a little bit about kind of the adjustments you've made from going to be a compound bow hunter, pulling that thing back and holding it, and now they've gotten, you know, the old compound bows were harder than even with the newer Matthew brands and a ton of other bear brands, all of them, right? There's so much easier once you get back to
Speaker 2 5:50
hold it, to hold it, yeah, but
Speaker 1 5:53
talk about, you know, what are the challenges to hunters that are getting ready, that maybe are our age, or that have said, You know what? I can't pull it back anymore. I've got it down as low as I can, pressure wise, and I can't get it any bit lower. So what are some of the challenges we have to deal with going with a crossbow?
Speaker 2 6:09
Yeah, well, I, you know, again, I getting older, and I had to crank mine down. I had a 68 is what I usually shot. And it kept getting lower and lower, but every year, and then I ended up having shoulder surgery, and, you know, Rotary cuff surgery, and that was on my left arm, holding the bow and all so. And I'm just getting over that right now, but it's become very important to me to it kept me in the game, you know, but you do, I remember you have to learn some different things about it. First of all, most of them are very loud, and it's very hard to dampen that sounds very hard, but the good thing to do to offset that, especially today, they're getting out there 400 feet per second, some of them, you know. So even though it's loud, the deer don't have a chance to move, you know, if it's a 3040, yard shot, but, but you still got to hold it, you know, it's like a bow. You still got to hold it. You got to know your yardages. You got to have a range finder. You got, you know, because you got all these dots, you know, you got to pick your pen and, you know, so it has a, it's very similar, you know, in a lot of ways, it's kind of, to me, it's a little tougher. I found it tougher in a tree stand. Plus, I don't like lugging that big old, heavy thing in. I like my three pound, four pound, you know, compound bow, but, but to bring that, to lug it in, is kind of tough, but, but, but when you're up there in the stand, what I found that works really well is because a lot of times, even, even if you have a ladder stand and the rails, they're not at the right height or whatever, you know, but that trigger stick by Primos, again, they got to become our sponsor because I'm giving them too many plugs, no. But that trigger stick, the small one, it's a tripod, but you keep it wrapped up at the bottom. And when you're up in your tree stand, I'm talking to, hang on a ladder stand, they have the webbed bottoms. So even if you have a mesh, you know, type of a platform fall through, they won't fall through you because, but all you need is that you don't even need to spread it out, you know, with the legs tight. Keep it tight with that band that around the bottom. Bring it around when you're ready. You can adjust it, you know. And I love, I can, and if I'm in a ladder stand, I can lean it against the rail and just, and it just sits there, you know. I can even have my crossbow in my lap if I want, or I can hang it up next to me, whatever
Speaker 1 8:38
I want, yeah, because all the rails, the rails, depending on what you're in, they come they come down at an angle that's often different. Every single one of them are different everyone and so sometimes, sometimes I'm forced to get down. I have to move more than I want to want to get to get to get down to where I can get my eyeball on the scope and get a shot.
Speaker 2 9:02
And that's the advantage of the crossbow. Like with the compound bow, you got to draw and everything, and it brings in all
Speaker 1 9:07
this. Now, do you sit when you're when you do? You try to sit, when you try to sit? Yeah, and that's why a lot of hunters love to stand. No matter what they're shooting. They want to stand,
Speaker 2 9:17
but if you stand, then you're going to have to have a long stick to stabilize it, or, you know, you got to hold it free hand. Got to be steady. Yeah, you got to be free hand. And that's hard if that, if you, if he's out there, you know, 4050, yards, you can remove it all around. You're going to, well, it's a small target, small target, but, but, yeah, using that trigger stick, really, or some type of tripod that, but you don't need to have it as a tripod. You can keep it together and just and even in a in a blind on the ground, or a tower blind, you know, where you have a big area, hard floor. Yeah, I will still use the, you know, the tripod, but I will use the taller one so I can get up to the window. Yeah. Yeah, and, but then it's in place, you know, you can even use, like for my grandson, I used the bog, you know, which is a very heavy duty. You can literally clamp it right into the, you know, the top of it. And they don't even have to hold the thing. They can still move it around, but they don't have to mess with it, you know, while they're waiting on the deer. And those are really two good, good ways to hunt with a crossbow. I remember that when I first started, I love the crossbow and a blind, because a lot of times you don't even have the height to shoot a compound bow out of a blind unless you're kneeling down, which, you know, I had my knees replaced 11 years ago. I'm not doing that anymore, but, but, and I even missed a doe one time because, you know, I hit the top of the blind with my compound bow. So I usually, if I'm in a blind, I'm going to go with, you know, I'm talking about a ground blind, I'm going to go, you know, with a cross. Well, you're very, very horizontal at that point. Good. I found out, like with my compound bow in a blind or even in a shooting house. I can't see my pens right before dark. It's very hard now. I even have a light, you know, the true glow, you know, has a little light, and I have that I could turn on to shine on my pens. Or, you know, get the fiber optic, you know, going brighter. But still, it's hard to see through my peep side and that thing, it's not but, boy, when I put that, that crossbow up and look through that scope, I'm going nice. I'm seeing real clear. It's magnified, like three times or something. Yeah, mine has
Speaker 1 11:34
a little battery in it so you can turn on the different, you know, 4030, 20, right? And it just kind of, they all light up in green or red. Unfortunately, I tend sometimes forget to turn it off, and so my battery goes.
Unknown Speaker 11:49
I do the same thing with my compound, but you're
Speaker 1 11:51
trying to find that size battery. Whenever you're like, Oh, they're out of them.
Speaker 2 11:55
Of course they are, of course they are. But, but one time I was going to go for the Triple Crown. I called it. It was actually, no, I called it. I only did this once a while ago, but it was actually, it was a Grand Slam. It was the slam. I called it, yeah, and it, what it was, was archery, Buck. Then I was going to get the, I think. Then I went after the shotgun dough. Then I was going to go after a doe with my Flintlock, Flintlock and and I got all three of those. And I called it the Triple Crown when I got them all. But then the Grand Slam would have been getting another doe with my crossbow. Gotcha four weapons. And wouldn't, you know, I got this doe coming in, so perfect. She's right there. And this is, again, how you got to know your yardages, right? And I, you know, it's open field, so it's hard to kind of pinpoint where exactly she was going to be, right. I was picking out spots in the grass and how far away they were. Finally she comes out, but she was like, it looked like maybe 10 yards further than what I had, you know, ranged, and so I think it was, it turned out to be like 50 yards or something. And so I shot, and I don't know if she just ducked her. I just went, but I missed her with the crossbow. I didn't get the big old doe, and I didn't get the slant the Triple Crown, but you didn't get but it was fun. It was so much fun. And I think, and that was early on with my should I use this weapon or not? Right? Right? And I had so much fun with it, yeah, that even, I think, she ducked it, mostly because it was so loud. And then I learned, man, you got to aim a little bit lower. And my my crossbow only goes shoots like 360 a square foot, I mean, a feet per second. So you got to still aim a little low if they're out there, 4050, yards, because it's amazing how fast they can duck. Now,
Speaker 1 13:55
one of the other things Mike, that I will I'm going to tell a story on my brother in law, who just recently killed a nice eight point in West Virginia with his crossbow. But he's a coffee drinker, and so up on his railing he had one of those steel thermos thermia. I don't know they're fancy ones, right? He had it. He had it pretty high. And so he had an eight, an eight point, coming in perfect. He was broadside 40 yards, and he thought, Okay, I'm gonna take this deer. And he leans down, and when he lets it fly, the the crossbow the right side hits the No, it is, hits the cup, knocks the cup. Now he doesn't know this is happening when he's shooting. That must have sounded crazy. So he hits the deer, and he spines him. He hits him high, yeah, but the deer goes down. Deer can't go anywhere. But there's no vital that he didn't hit any vitals. The deer still alive, right? So, and this is, you know, kids, you want to turn the radio off, you can or turn the podcast off. He had to go stab him. Oh, no, he didn't have any. Of the arrow. He couldn't he put another. Well, no, his bow was broken. Oh, I broke. It. Actually needed to get it restrung. Oh, my God, at the shop right now. But anyway, he was very fortunate that the deer was actually on the ground. He couldn't go anywhere, right? He couldn't run anywhere, right, right? Because he hit him. He hit him high. He hit if he looked at the shot, it was perfect, if he hadn't hit the coffee cup, right, right? So again, Word to the wise. You know, when you're when you're doing compound, you know, everything's everything's everything's vertical, right? You know, so you've got vertical things you have to watch out for, as far as strings and the bow. Now, with the crossbow, it's more horizontal. You can't be leaning up against trees and putting your thing right up against a tree. You have to be forward. You have to be forward of the tree if you're leaning right, because I've even, you know, hit a bolt just to release the tension. And now after I get done the hunt, and I was up against a pole and cracked it, and had to get spacers fixed and all this. So these are just things you have to watch out for, different than the compound, different than rifle
Speaker 2 16:06
with the cross. You need that because it's more wide, it's more of a
Speaker 1 16:11
horizontal situation. Yeah, figure out all your stuff.
Speaker 2 16:15
I know. I know we were in a shooting house just the other day, and my my grandson missed a doe, but, but it would that the shooting had was a new one. We hadn't hunted the friends of mine their property, and he had a high window, so I had to put him on a stool, get him up there, but, but the windows were only like a foot wide open, you know. So he had to make sure he was back far enough, yes, but he needed to shoot down, you know, close to him. And the doe was coming in, you know, like, maybe only 30 yards away. So he had quite an end. He had an angle there, and, and he and I, you know, he did his best, but, but he, he missed her and, and he had to, you know, live with that. You know, his first miss, but he's doing good. He's only nine, that's right. He's got plenty of time. I was gonna tell you another time too. That was funny, but I think let's just move on. One thing I can say about the crossbows, though, and I've learned this not only in my own, you know, life, they are a deadly weapon. They are they are deadly. And I have heard that when I talk with different guides that I have you know hunted with. They love the crossbow because they know they're not doing this long tracking job on these deer. They go, those are deadly weapons. Every one of them, they love the crossbow. They go using the compound or crossbow. Good, a crossbow, good. I'm glad using the crossbow, because they're
Speaker 1 17:47
deadly, yeah. So what do you use at the end of your bolt? What are you using?
Speaker 2 17:52
You talking about broadhead. Broadhead, I use a mechanical, you know, and, and I use the hypodermic, hypodermic. But I, you know, they're epidemic. They're deadly, yes, and, you know, there's something interesting about that too, that, that, that I learned because I used to use another one. I'm not going to mention the name you ever use, fixed broad heads. Oh, yeah, I actually got this year. I got them with a wasp boss three blade and and it flew really nice out of my crossbow. So, so it was really good. But on my compound, and now on my my grandson's crossbow, crossbow, I use the the the rage, you know, hypodermic, but I was using this other one and a lot of times, and even the rage, you got to watch out, because the Rage has that the big slicer, like chisel point and all this stuff. I met a guy at a bow shop and all, and he was getting people coming back because I hit a durable perfect with my compound bow and with with this broad head, I was using mechanical, mechanical. I mean, I hit her in the sweets, perfect, yeah, and it didn't penetrate and and it, and I lost her. I couldn't, couldn't figure it out she was 20 yards. I never found her. And, and I was going, and I was talking to this guy about it. He goes, You know, we, we stopped selling those because there he said that there's a problem with when you make that opening, that initial opening too big, with that initial point of the broad head, it won't open. The shoulders of the mechanical won't open because it's not hitting anything, and they don't open. And so the thing that's really good about the hypodermic, the way it was designed, was it has a very pin hole, like a pin hole in the very front of it, yes, so that that when it goes through and hits the shoulders, it opens immediately.
Speaker 1 19:57
Let me tell you, and slices it open. I want. As soon as I went to hypodermic with rage, right? I It was a game changer. I mean, a real game changer, yeah, and I know that there's some people fixed fixed blades. You know, he was not going with any kind of he was sold on those. A lot of people are, yeah, but I do like the mechanical hypodermic. They do work very well. They put them down pretty
Speaker 2 20:22
quickly, yeah, and they have a nice wide cut if you have a marginal, you know, yeah, type hit, but that's about it. I all I have on the crossbow, but I have learned to really listen and be a little more open to new things that are coming out, you know, in my old age,
Speaker 1 20:55
Mike and I have been talking about The pros and cons of crossbows, and we had good moments with them and bad moments with them. And I think at first, Mike was not very happy about the whole crossbow thing. You were a traditionalist, as they say, yeah. And so he had to kind of get a new mindset. And when he started using it more and more, he started to realize, Wow, I think I'm going to like this. I think I'm going to like this situation a little bit so but you did have to kind of change up your mind on this whole idea of a crossbow, didn't you? Yes, I did. And spiritually, sometimes we have to do that. Oh, yeah. And
Speaker 2 21:39
that's a good segue into our talk today about, you know, the spiritual lessons that we can learn through these things. And I thought about, you know, Romans, 12, one and two, where Paul said, I beg you may actually use that strong language, I beg you, brethren, by the mercies of God, that you give your life as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable, which is our reasonable service. And then he goes on And be not conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you can know God's perfect will. And that renewing of your mind as a believer, a new believer, especially. But But, but it's ongoing, you know, is so important and, and what Paul's talking about there is, you know, the world is the opposite of, you know, the world and the way they live and the motivations that they live by are completely opposite of Christianity. And it's sometimes it's hard to get a hold of that. And we've got to renew our minds. We've got to put in our minds the truth of the Word of God. And you just, I remember one guy I'll never forget. You know, these stupid illustrations. You know, if you got a bucket of mud and you keep throwing white rocks in it, pretty soon, you're just going to have a bunch of white rocks in there. You know, that mud will splash out. I never forgot that stupid illustration, but every time I'm reading scripture, I'll think there's some white rocks going in there, getting rid of that mud. You know, my brain, you know, but it's an ongoing thing, and we have to do it. I also thought of Ecclesiastes 12, one and two, which talks about, you know, he's going through, Solomon's going through the time for this, a time for that. And he says, there's a time to embrace, and then there's, there's a time to refrain. And, you know, sometimes I have to put this, this verse together with James 119 which says to be quick to listen and slow to speak and slow to anger, and that quick to listen. We're when we've got our minds made up about something. This is one thing I loved about Charlie Kirk, you know, he would go on that campus and, you know, and we're praying for his family and all you know, horrible thing, you know, that happened to him, but, but anyway, he would go on these college campuses, and he would just say, let's talk, let's discuss things. And he would really listen to what they had to say. I mean, he had a lot of answers, but if we stop that discussion, and discussion includes listening and sharing. You know, your thoughts, not just sharing your thoughts. A lot of times when somebody's talking to me, I find myself thinking about what I'm going to say, not even listening to what they're saying. And if we, as Christians, could, and it's a lifelong thing to learn, yes, if we can learn how to listen, and I'm not good at it at all, I'm not, I'm not the guy you want to watch, but, but I try to be, and I want to be more and more. And is it where I really listen and see try to put myself in their shoes? How are they looking at this? And usually when I'm able to do that, like the crossbow, when I'm able to do that, I can actually see what they're saying. I can see maybe some benefits there that I didn't even recognize before, from their viewpoint, because I wouldn't even listen. And
Speaker 1 25:17
you know, listening and renewing your mind are all you can't just do them on your own. You need the assistance of the Holy Spirit. There needs to be what I would call a supernatural element to this whole idea of renewing your mind. There needs to be and this is what I can tell you, if you call upon the Lord and say, Lord, I need you to help me renew my mind. He will provide the Holy Spirit for that to do it. I think it's a great prayer to be praying all the time right when you can, when you can pray, take that time to say, Lord, please help renew my mind. Please help me to be slow to speak and slow to anger. Lord help me to listen to the other side. Because I'm telling you, if you don't pray that prayer, and you don't ask the Holy Spirit to help you in that, you're going to fail, because you're going to try to do it on your own terms. Yeah, and you're not going to be successful. You might have some brief success with it, but on the long term, the long and that's and that's how we have to plan you, and I might be talking about all the time, we have to plan for the long haul, right? And the long haul is relying upon the Holy Spirit to give us direction and to help renew our minds.
Speaker 2 26:29
Yeah, I love that verse in Galatians where it says, If we walk by the Spirit, and that's what you're talking about, yep, what does it mean to walk by the Spirit? But he say, he goes on, he says, if you walk by the Spirit, you will not carry out the desires of your flesh. What does it mean to walk by the Spirit? Well, I believe it's synonymous with what you're saying. You're walking by faith, depending on not just yourself and your own self reliance, but you're depending on the Holy Spirit that God gave us to do what, to guide us into all truth, to give us strength, to comfort us and then to convict us. Right? Those four things are are spelled out in the Scriptures about the ministry of the Holy Spirit and and boy, that those are some good words, Dave, good words.
Speaker 1 27:12
We would love to hear from you. We'd love to hear your stories. So please send us a note or question by going to our home page at the standout doors.com and hit the Contact tab. Also, we'd love to pray for you too. Leave your prayer request by hitting the Contact tab. Or do you know Jesus tab? Yeah.
Speaker 2 27:31
Also, check out our targeting the truth Bible studies. We have these Bible studies that include hunting videos. I mean, think about it. When was the last time you went to a Bible study and got to watch a hunting video? Well, that's what targeting the truth. Bible studies include you watch a video, then I share the three to five minute spiritual message at the end. But then you go into the five discussion questions. You have Leaders Guide. You have everything you need. You're so good right there to have a men's group, you know, you can download it. And guess what, guys, it's all free. It's right there for you. Anybody in the stinking world that has a computer can can download this for free. And then we, you know, we want to keep it that way, because we want to reach as many people and the outdoor community as we can, and
Speaker 1 28:23
it's all found at the stand outdoors.com. Check it out. Hey, Mike, and I want to thank you for joining us today on the podcast. You can find it anywhere. It's in on Apple, Spotify, many other platforms. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe. Leave a review, share it with a fellow Hunter, and you can get all the details about our guests. Any links can be found on our show notes, and you can find us online anytime, day or night, 24 hours a day, free of charge, the standout doors.com that's the standout doors.com Until next time for my case, I'm Dave Baker, and
Speaker 2 28:54
remember, stand firm in the faith and keep targeting the truth. You.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai