Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
A weekly show from the folks at East Lansing Info breaking down all the news and happenings in East Lansing, Michigan.
Hello, everyone, and welcome to this week's episode of East Lansing Insider. I'm East Lansing Info's deputy editor, Anna Liz Nichols. And this week, we're talking to Mike Mudrey, owner of For Crepe's Sake and the Local Epicurean here in East Lansing. I figured as the temperatures are finally dropping, albeit slowly, and we're entering into fall, it was a little on theme to talk to Mike about the cooking classes and other opportunities to slow down and connect being offered at the Local Epicurean. After two years of operation here in the city, I'm looking forward to hearing more about what's on offer at the Local Epicurean and what it's looked like to bring people together over food.
Ana Liz Nichols:But to start, Mike, can you tell me a little bit about the history of your time here in East Lansing and what went into developing The Local Epicurean?
Mike Mudrey:Yeah. It's, I'm it's I'm glad to be here. It's a a relatively long story, but I'll try and shorten it. I'm from Grand Rapids, went to Michigan State, met my wife at Michigan State right at the end of our undergrad. She's a East Lansing resident.
Mike Mudrey:We got married, four kids. We're living in Atlanta, Georgia. And in 2017, we decided to move back closer to home. We were deciding between East Lansing and Grand Rapids. Landed on East Lansing because that's closer to her family and plenty to do.
Mike Mudrey:So we got here, and, you know, we spent the first year or so just trying to get our feet back in the ground and get embedded in the community. And every Saturday morning, I'd take my three young boys at the time out for what we call daddy and boys breakfasts. And we'd go out to a local place and just kinda sit there and look around. And, you know, I had this realization, and I'm like, hey. A great way to get involved in the community is to own something.
Mike Mudrey:So I was like, what if we owned a place like this? And so we started looking around and thinking of ideas and thought, okay. Maybe we could do, like, a a Subway franchise. That seems to be an easy one. And then I did some research and realized that's not a great investment and a great business to be a franchisor of.
Mike Mudrey:Then I thought, oh, we don't wanna if we're gonna do something, we don't want a a burger place or a pizza place because they're sort of a dime a dozen. I found an app called biz BizBuySell, and I was shocked that any moment you could be walking by businesses where there's plenty of owners looking to sell or looking to get out. And the this eventually leads to the, like, local Epicurean. But, we found a place called For Crepe Sake for sale. It was located in Downtown Lansing and thought, okay.
Mike Mudrey:A crepery is kinda cool. That's unique. No city could probably hold or accommodate more than one or two of those kind of places, so it stands apart and stands unique. So my wife and I bought that. I'm gonna go fast now.
Mike Mudrey:Fast forward a couple years, we during the pandemic, we were in the middle of actually initially opening opening a second for crepe's sake location in East Lansing. And then when the pandemic hit, we decided it was best to close the original in Downtown Lansing and open the new one and just relocate everything. I noticed that there was a really cool and kind of a cute concept crepery in Grand Rapids called brown butter crepery, and they had shut down all service except for what they call brunch boxes, which were sort of made you know, take home and make a crepe kits that you'd put together. So I sent one to my mom for Mother's Day in May 2020. Asked her how she liked it, and she said she loved it.
Mike Mudrey:It was absolutely, like, such a fun experience and so cool and so unique. So I emailed the owners and said, hey. If you're ever looking to sell, let us know. And she said we're not planning on reopening after the pandemic. So, again, long story short, we bought that in May 2020, reopened it in July 2020, and it happened to be next door to a place called The Local Epicurean.
Mike Mudrey:The Local Epicurean started as one gentleman, Ryan Rairdon, who worked in cement, the cement industry making sidewalks and roads and stuff and decided he wanted something different. So he started making handmade pasta, hand cut pasta by hand at a local market in Downtown Grand Rapids, went to farmer's markets, and then it sort sort of grew into its own thing. So the Local Epicurean in Grand Rapids was next door to Brown Butter and also happened to be the building owner, of our Brown Butter. He was my landlord for Brown Butter. So we got to know him really well.
Mike Mudrey:And every time Gina or I or Gina and I would go to Grand Rapids, we'd swing into the Local Epicurean and pick up some pastas, a unique bottle of wine, sauce, imported olive oil, all kinds of cool stuff. Got to know the owner really well. And over the course of the next year, we kept saying, like, this is just such a cool place. I wish we had something like this closer to us. And he's finally said, well, why don't you open one?
Mike Mudrey:And because there was only one location. They'd kind of built it over time. It had grown from, you know, just making pasta to doing a lot of other things, including private cooking classes. So we said absolutely. Looked for a few locations.
Mike Mudrey:We wanted it to be close to home. And so we started working on building the Local Epicurean East Lansing around, January 2024, opened in November 2024 and thought it's such a unique concept. There's, you know, there's pieces of it that you can find in the area, but when you put it all together, you can't really find it. So it's been a just a a pleasure and a joy to open it open that, and, that led to us buying the original Local Epicurean in Grand Rapids from him in January of this year. So now we own the two locations, and they complement each other well.
Mike Mudrey:The new location in East Lansing, I say new even though it's almost two years old, is a much larger and open airy space with high ceilings and a much larger market, a much bigger bar, and significantly more cooking capacity or or capacity for our classes. That's the long story short or the story the long story long, probably.
Ana Liz Nichols:Could you tell me a little bit? Because I I think people in East Lansing may generally know about the Local Epicurean. They might have seen I believe you guys sometimes have stand at the East Lansing Farmers Market. But for those who may have not frequented or or visited the Local Epicurean yet, what's on offer there?
Mike Mudrey:Yeah. I'm glad you asked because one of the things I realized I've and I've learned a lot in this sort of business career as we built the six zero one group, which is the company that kind of owns and operates these. I was always under the impression that you just open the doors and people will know about it. And so I've realized in the past year or so that, oh, we need to do a little bit more PR because we are in a busy street. We're right by Trader Joe's and Whole Foods.
Mike Mudrey:It's a great location, but it's not a place unless you happen to be going to another place in that strip mall, like Crumble Cookies or somewhere that you would just walk by. So, yeah, I'm happy to tell people more about it because I think if you've seen us at the farmer's market, you know we make beautiful, we have, like, 24, I think, varieties of hand cut thin pasta, infused with flavors and spices and cheese and everything else. And that's kind of, I think, what people think that that's all we do. And then they walk in the door, and they go, wow. It's a lot more than this.
Mike Mudrey:So there's really three aspects of the Local Epicurean, and the core part of it is private cooking classes. So we have 22 menus. Every pasta and or every class includes making a handmade pasta, but they also incorporate all kinds of proteins. And we've got everything from a chicken Parmesan to a big tomahawk steak that you can make and, shrimp and lobster and and everything you can think of. So the way it works is you do a three course class.
Mike Mudrey:You get together with a with a group. We host groups from two to I think we largest one was, like, 86 people, a corporate event Wow. For a a company in the in the Lansing area. And they, you know, they cook the first first course, then they sit around the bar. We've got a really large open cocktail and wine bar with handcrafted cocktails, and our our goal is always have unique wines that you can't really get anywhere else.
Mike Mudrey:So they sit around the bar, and they enjoy the first course, a salad, or potentially sometimes that the pasta is part of the first course. And then they go back to the cooking area, and they make the the main course, then go back to the bar and enjoy another cocktail or another drink and make that and then finish up with a sorbetto or some sort of sweet dessert usually. So that's the core aspect, but the bar itself is open to the public. We have a lot of regulars that come in and just sit around and have a drink. So it's sort of a unique atmosphere compared to a lot of the other places to get a cocktail or a glass of wine or a beer in the East Lansing area.
Mike Mudrey:And then the market itself is kind of the the third part. So the market not only includes our handmade, hand cut pasta, but it's got imported pasta from Italy. We've got a bunch of, you know, special olive oils and vinegars and spices. The most unique salt collection, I think, you could ever imagine. I didn't know there were so many different types of salt until I did this, but all things either, sourced locally or imported from Europe.
Mike Mudrey:And then we also include a bunch of take and bake. So we realized that people wanna stop in and experience a local Epicurean meal at home, but don't necessarily wanna put all the ingredients together. So we've got lasagnas and raviolis and pestos and probably the best garlic bread you've ever had, at least that's what I think, available to pick up on a just take home basis.
Ana Liz Nichols:Yeah. As someone who's lived in East Lansing, sometimes we get, you know, fun businesses with great food coming to town, but they don't always stay. And I was just wondering if somebody who, you know, went to MSU, has spent time and you're an East Lansing resident now, is there an element of the Local Epicurean you feel kind of stands the test of time here in the city? I know it's only been two years, but that you feel like this is kind of the aura of the Local Epicurean that is going to perhaps sustain it for for years to come.
Mike Mudrey:I think, you know, we've got a a couple things to that. One is my goal in creating this business that started as sort of like a side gig has now turned into a real business is that I wanna build an enduring company. And so we're very kind of specific on what we wanna do and how we do it. And that starts with the idea originally. Like, there's a subway.
Mike Mudrey:There's literally subways across the street from each other, and there's burger places everywhere and a lot of places that have a, you know, kind of a unique concept, but it's a it's a traditional twist on something that you can get anywhere else. I think that makes it really hard to last. And so I think the thing about the both the creperies themselves as well as the Local Epicurean is that it is unique. So it's not an everyday day, you know, stop. I don't think you a lot of people would go and take a class every single night when they're looking to just go out and get something to eat, but it's sort of the thing you do on a special occasion.
Mike Mudrey:We get the opportunity to host birthdays and celebrations and bridal parties. And, you know, big part of the business, and I didn't realize this when we first opened it, but it's probably the most important of the bar biz part of the business is kind of corporate outings and team building. So we've got very specific team building offerings that we've got a lot of repeat customers from. Some of the big companies around, but also some small, you know, law offices and accounting firms and realtors and things like that that come in regularly to either treat their clients or to celebrate with their team. So I think that the the the the longevity aspect of it for us is always keeping it unique.
Mike Mudrey:So twice per year, we rotate our menus or we introduce new menus, and then we'll bring things back. Because we do have a couple super fans that have taken almost every class we have, and and some did it in the course of the first year. And so they wanna come back and say, okay. What what else are you gonna add? So, keeping it fresh a little bit.
Mike Mudrey:And then the other aspect of it I didn't mention is we also do kind of monthly community events just to introduce new people to it. So while I mentioned most of our classes are private, prepaid, prescheduled classes, twice a month, we do what we call supper club, which is a community event. So you you one person can sign up or a group of four could sign up, and you do a menu that's not on our traditional menu. Sometimes it might be something we're testing to add to our classes in the future. Sometimes it's just a unique, you know, seasonal menu.
Mike Mudrey:So we you know, this season, we've got really kind of autumn flavors in our, in our supper clubs. But we've those have been, you know, anywhere from, you know, five or six people in some of the slower summer months that come to a supper club to I think we had 28 in our last one. And it's a really cool opportunity because you get to meet and cook alongside people that you don't know. And so we've noticed there's a lot of people visiting professors and, you know, people new to the area that will sign up for a supper club just because it's a great opportunity to do something fun, and meet new people. And then we also do a couple wine events per month, the wine tasting, typically one Saturday afternoon per month, and it's an open house style where we'll have five or six wines and and appetizers to pair with them to explore different areas.
Mike Mudrey:And then once per month, we do what we call as a wine passport, which is a wine tasting, but it's educationally focused. So we'll, like, hone in on a specific region or area of the world or type of wine, and we'll have four or five different wines. And we'll have an educator there to talk about what makes this part of the world unique and why their wine is different and so what the flavors and the aromas and everything from the soil it was the grapes were grown in, to the history of the region and all that kind of stuff.
Ana Liz Nichols:Mhmm. Have you found that within East Lansing, there's an appetite for that? You know? Because you can we can order the food on our phones now, not just I guess that's we've been able to do that for a while, but now with DoorDash and and and other food food ordering apps, you can get food fast. Yeah.
Ana Liz Nichols:We live in a a a fast food, fast art
Mike Mudrey:Fast everything. Society. Yeah. Yeah.
Ana Liz Nichols:But in terms of, you know, appetite for for this slowing down, for this connecting over food, have you found that there's there's within our Yeah. You desire for that?
Mike Mudrey:I think there is. And I actually I so on the side, when I I call it my therapy, I do some writing, and I do research, and I've written really long essays and thoughts and just basically word salads of my opinion. I wrote something about this, and it's something I truly think about and deeply believe. And it's one of the reasons we're making a pretty big bet on the local Epicurean, not just in East Lansing, but in we're potentially opening one in a major Detroit suburb and then potentially, you know, other locations. I think as the world gets faster, there's gonna be a desire to have those special moments where it slows down.
Mike Mudrey:And so the act of cooking this class, one of the best parts about it is you can't really you know, you can't aside from taking pictures, you can't be on your phone because you're doing something constantly. So I go to a lot of restaurants, and you'll see a couple or a group of people or a family with their kids, and they're all, like, staring at their phones in the meal and while they're at the table. And then the meal comes, they eat it real quick, and then they get back on their phones. So I think that, you know, I I worry that the the nature of DoorDash and Uber Eats and kinda speed of service for everything else, that's gonna be really popular, and I worry that it's gonna drown out the middle. So the kind of the traditional dining experience, but I think it'll actually amplify the high end dining experience or the active dining experience.
Mike Mudrey:We've sort of coined a phrase called made together dining. I I also tell people it's the perfect opportunity for a first date because it's low friction. So you've got two hours together with another person, but most of the time, you've got one of our instructors there with you and you're actively doing something. So there's rarely any awkward silence, which is perfect. So I think it's I think though as the world goes more digital and goes more AI and goes faster, I I think that we're gonna see in this area and all the areas that there's a lot more desire for this active thing.
Mike Mudrey:And so I think that, you know, the East Lansing residents, the land Greater Lansing area, we have a lot of regulars that come in from pretty far away. I think they enjoy it. And, again, it's not it's not something that you're gonna do, you know, Tuesday night, Wednesday night, Thursday night, but you'll probably pick a specific date, in the future either to celebrate something or to just have, like, a special outing with those you care about.
Ana Liz Nichols:Are people making the pasta?
Mike Mudrey:Every every class is made from scratch pasta, which is super fun, and we've got special ways to do it quickly because oftentimes, you'd all of our pasta, for example, it's on the the shelves. It takes days to make because you have to dry it in a specific way for it to have longevity in within the bag hanging from the shelf that you can buy and take home. But the pasta we make in class, you know, it's one of the first thing. Even if it the pasta is not part of the first course, it's the first thing you start making, and that you go back and you finish the rest of it, and you come back, and pasta's part of the dish. But every single class, that's a core of ours.
Mike Mudrey:It was the birth of Local Epicurean, and and there's I did not realize how many different types of pasta there are. Last year so in our first year open about six months in, we implemented a new pasta maestro series, which actually incorporates a lot of handmade shaped and infused pastas pastas directly from Italy. We had somebody on our team that had, trained in cooking school in Italy, and so he kinda brought these old world methodologies to you. So there are some very intense classes from a pasta standpoint. So pasta maestro is mostly just focused on the pasta, and you you're looking at infused pastas with unique shapes and, you know, stripes through them and all kinds of stuff, and you get to do it in the class.
Ana Liz Nichols:Yeah. In terms of not being able to to be on your phone and, honestly, the the age old concern on a first date of what do I do with my hands, making pasta a solution. Because I can't as someone who's made pasta, I can't think of anything that gunks up your hands more than making pasta.
Mike Mudrey:There's a lot of washing your hands frequently even so you can get your phone out to take a picture, and everyone's like, I'm gonna go quickly wash my hands, then you take a bunch of pictures. But it is. You're just you're you're always doing something. And I think the you know, our instructors are you know, a lot of them have culinary backgrounds. Some of them have just a little bit of a culinary background, but they've got a background in entertainment or working with people.
Mike Mudrey:So they are active with their the class kind of, you know, side by side, showing them what to do, showing them how to do it. So, yeah, from my first date standpoint, not only are hands busy, but there's always this triangle of conversation going on, which really helps.
Ana Liz Nichols:Yeah. And then I think the most important question of this this talk is what is your favorite pasta shape?
Mike Mudrey:You know, that's a really good question. I'm, like, a really I'm a traditionalist. So, you know, to me, fettuccine, which is a very basic pasta, is still the best. Although we make we have a a class called the steak and ravioli brunch, and a ravioli is a really big single ravioli. They're delicious, so it's infused and stuffed with ricotta and other other things, a ricotta blend.
Mike Mudrey:That's probably the best tasting in my opinion because it's just, like, oozing good goodness. And, you know, it's very fun to watch people make them because there's a lot of shaping to it, and then you've gotta make sure you seal the edges correctly before you drop it in the water. And without fail, you you lose a lot a lot of good men along the way, but the outcome is still pretty good. I mean, the core of the business is the private cooking classes. I'll say one of the benefits of taking a class so the by far, our biggest selling item are are paper class gift certificates.
Mike Mudrey:So it's a massive gifting opportunity. And our classes are you know, they're on the higher end. They're $99 per person to a $129 per person. It'll tell you that you end up getting multiple meals out of it because every class is so big. But when you take a class, at the end of the class, you have the opportunity to buy discounted class gift certificates.
Mike Mudrey:Mhmm. And so that's, like, one of the key things. But it's, you know, around the holiday season and birthdays and celebrations and graduations, the kind of beautiful real paper certificate is is sort of, again, something unique versus, an egift card or, you know, a email that has, like, a a barcode on it that's a gift gift card.
Ana Liz Nichols:Yeah. Like I said at the start of the podcast, we're heading into fall. It's kind of the, like, get inside and and get close in season. Is there any programming or events that Local Epicurean is going to have on offer soon that you'd like to maybe plug for listeners?
Mike Mudrey:I think that I would just stay attuned or look at our our upcoming supper clubs. Like, that is our big thing, and the so the the the seasonal aspect of the supper clubs is really cool. So if you look at the supper clubs we have planned through through the rest of the year, each one has a very specific seasonal kinda nature to it, including an Italian inspired Thanksgiving meal. So look at those, and then the wines also do the same. So our our team in the sommeliers we work with do a really good job of sort of pairing our wine tastings with the season.
Mike Mudrey:I'll just and I'll leave it at the the fourth quarter. So, well, roughly, through December is by far the busiest season at the Local Epicurean. So it's amazing to me how many large classes we're booking now for November and December. So if people are interested, I would say get on get in there soon, to book a date because the the prime, you know, Friday night, Saturday, all day, they get booked out pretty quickly.
Ana Liz Nichols:Yeah. We actually talked a little earlier about, you know, the level of, you know, meeting new people and connection that Local Epicurean naturally lends itself to. It's kind of a easy environment to get to know people or meet new people. I was wondering if there, in the last two years, have been any moments or events that have particularly stood out to you that have been, you know, poignant when we talk about this sense of community in East Lansing or the opportunities there is with slowing down over food to to connect with others?
Mike Mudrey:Yeah. I think there's a couple things. So one is, like, some of the large group events. So a lot of financial advisory firms will book an a big event for and invite all their clients in. So it's one organization booking and paying for the event, but they're bringing in a bunch of people that don't really know each other.
Mike Mudrey:And so we've those have ranged in size from 40 to the 86 person class we had. And I think, like, that's where it's buzzing. You know, you have people that, you know, know each other, a a family or a couple come in, but they're cooking with six or eight other people at the same table that, they didn't know. And it's just like those are, like, the most fun events. But then the the, the supper clubs themselves.
Mike Mudrey:So I I have a background in sort of executive development and team building or at least a lot of experience in it. So my know, I don't work in the Local Epicurean itself a lot, although I wish I could work in it every day. But I go to every supper club, and I kick off the supper club, and I may and some people hate this. My wife hates when I do this, but I make everyone introduce themselves to each other and say where they're from. Because to me, it is a little bit about it's not just the act of doing the class, but it's the act of getting to know people that you don't know and pushing them out of their comfort zone a little bit.
Mike Mudrey:So that to me, that's the the most fun. The the 28 person supper club that we did last month, you know, just the the the the around the room introduction itself took a lot longer than I expected.
Ana Liz Nichols:It's very interesting that both the businesses you have in East Lansing are these unique places. Like, you have the Local Epicurean. It's a cooking class place. Yeah. And, like, the today's focus has been on the Local Epicurean, but you also have for Crepe's sake, which, you know, I plenty of people experienced over in the Lansing location and reopened under under your leadership, in 2021 amidst the pandemic.
Ana Liz Nichols:How has the reception been for, for crates sake in East Lansing?
Mike Mudrey:Yeah. I mean, it's been fantastic. So it took us an entire year to open it. So we signed the lease in March 2020, and then due to supply shortages and opening and closing rules and everything else that everyone experienced in the pandemic area, we spent twelve months working on it, finally got it open in March 2021, and it was booming. Our sales compared to prior pandemic in Downtown Lansing were nearly double.
Mike Mudrey:And within the first year, I realized a couple things, and it took us five years to actually start to fix this. One is I realized it wasn't big enough. So if you'd ever been to, for crave's sake, on a Saturday or a Sunday morning, like, midmorning brunch time frame, it could be a ninety minute wait. And it just drove me crazy that that's the experience we were having and and giving to our customers and how many people were returning away, and that never would come back because they did not wanna wait ninety minutes for a crepe. So that, not big enough, not enough capacity to make food.
Mike Mudrey:And because we were serving so many and making so much more so many more crepes than we were in Downtown Lansing, crepes create a it's a lot of heat and a lot of smoke and a lot of so when it got really busy, it would get steamy in there. So I had this, like, itch to fix this problem. We looked at a variety of solutions from from, like, air purification systems and really expensive things done to the building, which I don't own, and then thought, okay. We just maybe we should look for another location. So about a year ago, there's been a for those in the East Lansing area, they'll remember the Taco Bell, right on Grand River, 601 East Grand River, that shut down, I think, in the same time frame, like, early pandemic time frame and never reopened.
Mike Mudrey:I found out
Ana Liz Nichols:One of our toughest losses during the pandemic.
Mike Mudrey:Well, I found out that corporate Taco Bell shut down every location that didn't have a drive through, so that's why they shut that down. But I I looked at it, and I thought, I don't know if we could go into a Taco Bell, but started talking to our real estate agent and got to know the building owner and realized it's actually a beautiful spot. So about a year ago, we started working on the idea of relocating for crepe's sake. It's taken a lot longer than I expected, but we're, you know, sitting here at the in mid September. I think we should be open sometime in October or late October for the new location.
Mike Mudrey:One of the reasons we went to that location was it's much larger. It's got big ceilings. It's got better airflow. It's got a larger back of house kitchen so we can crank out a lot more food quickly. But the building owner also owned a liquor license.
Mike Mudrey:And so what the deal was, we were buying the liquor license from him too, and this is why it took a while because there's a lot of regulations around that. So when we relocate and reopen the new for crepe's sake, sometime this fall, we're gonna be introducing mimosas and wine, frozen mimosas, frozen espresso martinis. And so our goal is it's gonna be a little bit more of a, like, go to destination, brunch destination. We'll be open till seven or 08:00 at night every day for dinner. And then we're also expanding our menu.
Mike Mudrey:So, I can't tease that too much, but think about a full brunch menu and kind of a a full day menu without losing the core of what we do. So I'm really, really excited about this. I think it's got an opportunity to be like what we always wanted to for crepe for crepe's sake to be, and it's it's taking our our third location to get there. But, I'm I'm really excited. In fact, this is you know, there's a few things that consume most of my time, and this is this is one.
Mike Mudrey:My wife and I were Anybody who drove by last Sunday and saw people painting inside inside for crave's sake, that was Gina and I, you know, painting all the walls and and deep Taco Bell ing it. We've had construction going on to Taco Bell. The vibe a little bit. Yeah. Really looking forward to what it's gonna offer.
Mike Mudrey:And then just for those also in the area that are interested, you know, the the well, they probably know for East at least those in East Lansing and at least the student population knows University Weiner, which closed down their location. And they're now operating on the back of our existing, for crave's sake, location. That was by design, although we never intended to both be operating at the same time because we thought we had be we would be moved to our new location prior to that, but, that didn't happen. So we're we're kind of managing two kitchens, two businesses running out of the same kitchen, not two kitchens, out of the same kitchen right now. But once we move for crepe's sake, we've got another concept coming up.
Mike Mudrey:It's it's called Tiny Joys. That's all I'm gonna say. And as soon as we get the new for crepe's sake location, you'll see a a pretty quick, reopen of the existing two eleven MAC for crepe's sake and location with a with another sort of morning focused concept. My wife and I love it. You know, we we this all of this was like our initial goal was, like, being kind of embedded in the community, and there's so many different ways you can do that.
Mike Mudrey:And, we thought this was kind of a fun way to get really committed. And, you know, now having three, you know, East Lansing based locations or at least very close East Lansing based locations, you know, I feel like we're very, very committed now.
Ana Liz Nichols:You're locked in.
Mike Mudrey:Yeah. We're locked in. Yes.