The Studio Demands It!

S6 EP20 |  After 13 Michael Myers Halloween movies since 1978, the studio demands that the IP be revitalized by rebooting the much maligned Michael Myers-less third installment in the series.

_____________
  • Another Zelda Podcast - Another Zelda Podcast is a show wherein we talk about all things Zelda! https://www.anotherzeldapodcast.com/
_____________
Find other great shows from Sixfive Media here: sixfive.media

The views, information, or opinions expressed during Another Pokemon Podcast are solely those of the individuals involved and do not necessarily represent those of Sixfive Media and its employees.

This has been a production of Sixfive Media.
COPYRIGHT 2024 SIXFIVE MEDIA, ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
Thanks to our monthly supporters
  • Chris “WallScore” Wall
  • Michael Carey
  • Everett
  • Shane Redding
  • Bencompetence
  • Fionnegan Justus Murphy
  • Eli McCaig

Creators and Guests

JB
Host
Jim Burzelic
TW
Host
T.C. De Witt

What is The Studio Demands It!?

Two screenwriters attempt to recreate, reimagine, or flat out fix, existing film franchises when 'the studio' demands...MORE FILMS! It's an exercise in creative thinking where they will challenge themselves to conceptualize, pitch, and craft a film based on the stipulations of a hypothetical Hollywood overlord. | Sixfive Media

TC.:

Hello, and welcome to the Studio Demands It, an exercise in creative thinking where we will conceptualize, pitch, and craft a film or series based on the demands from one of you listeners acting as a hypothetical Hollywood overlord. Overlord. As professional screenwriters ourselves and massive cinephiles Cinephiles. We talk movies all the time. Movies.

TC.:

And we'd like to believe that Believe. We could meet

Jim:

Meet.

TC.:

Any demand thrown at us. Us. We will be your screenwriters for this episode. I am TC DeWitt, and joining me, as always, is Jim Music List Burzelic. Where are you, Jim?

TC.:

On your those There I am. For those who might not know, if you're just joining us on the cast, Jim has been figuring out season two of his favorite song. Yeah. And as we are getting to the end of the season of Studio Demands It, I thought it was worth checking in on where is season two in Jim's pursuit of the his favorite song of all time.

Jim:

I'm on round five. I'm in the s's of round five.

TC.:

Okay. Now

Jim:

just a quick What what does that mean? Yes. That means I'm down to 90 songs in I'm working through 90 songs on round five. So that means at the end of that, I'll have 45 songs. Right?

Jim:

Because it's it's elimination.

TC.:

Yeah. So those who might not remember or know, Jim has created an insane spreadsheet. He he discovered you're only limited to a thousand cells.

Jim:

5,000,000.

TC.:

Five. You were allowed five and you used all 5,000,000 cells?

Jim:

Yes. Several times over.

TC.:

Oh my god. In order to do an elimination style listening of every song he likes Yes. In order to determine what is his favorite song. He did season one, which ended with Clutch.

Jim:

Yes.

TC.:

Right?

Jim:

This one probably will as well. The whole reason I'm doing a second season is a friend had actually forwarded me a a bracket of 16 songs from this other thing. They're like, hey, look, this is what you were doing, but in a small form. And so I did that.

TC.:

Fools.

Jim:

And I was like, well, I just did three three layers of 16 songs. Let's put this in the spreadsheet, but I don't just want 16, 16 more songs randomly added. So I'll incorporate them in a whole new, a whole new thing.

TC.:

The the most exciting thing about this is that people can join you in your experience.

Jim:

They can?

TC.:

Because your Spotify playlist just consists of the two songs currently going head

Jim:

to And and it's it's public.

TC.:

Yeah. So people could be checking in on you To to see see what you're listening to.

Jim:

What two songs are currently Yeah. Competing. Yeah. Yeah. Yes.

Jim:

They could.

TC.:

So so what's so what do what's your Spotify?

Jim:

It's it's called, well, the list is called Cage Match. I don't know how you find Mhmm. Someone's lists.

TC.:

Well, I'll tell you what. If anyone wants to message Studio Demands It, you can I can probably send you a link? You can do that on Instagram at Studio Demands It, and you can ask for the link. Yeah. So if you wanna just Same check

Jim:

Reddit and Spotify. Yeah. Reddit or Reddit Reddit and a Discord.

TC.:

Yeah. If you wanna if you wanna get involved in listening to what Jim is listening to to because what's what's wild about your process, Jim, is is remind the people how you decide. You take two songs.

Jim:

I take two songs, I put them in a in a a playlist, and then I listen to those two just those two songs on on loop.

TC.:

Back and forth like an insane person.

Jim:

Until I decide which one I like more. You know what? After a 100 listens, I don't Sometimes it only takes one or two Okay. Listens. I as I as I wheedle them down to to my favorites, it becomes harder.

Jim:

And so, yes, I end up listening more.

TC.:

Does now iTunes used to do it where it showed you play count. Does Spotify do that? No. I would

Jim:

love to see play

TC.:

Old school iTunes, if you still have it on your your your MacBook, they don't do it on the phone app. Mhmm. Tracks your listens. So you can actually create columns in iTunes that tell you, you know, time, genre, playlist, album. Like, you can you can have a plethora of lists, and one of them was play count.

TC.:

And I used to love that because it would do I would randomize my music, and then there was a automatic playlist called top 25. You could see what your top 25 songs were, and you'd be like, oh, man, I've listened to Monkey Wrench that many times? Yep. Yep. I didn't, I didn't think the of songs that was in my top 25 unfairly was Jackson five's a b c one two three, because it was literally the first song Uh-huh.

TC.:

On my iTunes, so it auto play a lot. Yeah. So it had, like, way more listens than it actually deserved.

Jim:

No. You love that song.

TC.:

I love it. It's easy as one,

Jim:

two, three.

TC.:

Anyway, I just thought it was worth checking in on, where you are when it comes to figuring out there's a show in I know there's there's

Jim:

There probably is. I don't know how to crack that. I don't know how to make that interesting to people. Mhmm. It's interesting.

Jim:

I mean, I guess I could try to force, certain things because but without that, like, I'll go sometimes, like, two weeks

TC.:

Just listen to the same two sons.

Jim:

Because the thing is I I don't that's not what I do all day long. Right? Like, I do other things and I'll listen to other things. But, yeah, when when I have some time and I I just want something on, I will I'll do that.

TC.:

There you go. Like an insane person.

Jim:

Like an insane person.

TC.:

Alright. This cat will not leave me alone.

Jim:

Well, she was sleeping.

TC.:

I know, but I, like, coughed or something, and she woke up anyway. Jim, our listeners, we're gonna get to the demand now, and let's get this party started. Our listeners have given us demands from literally all over the world. And you listening right now, you can send us any demand you'd like, and we will read it right live here right now, live on the air, and try to meet the demand right here on the spot. And when we reach the end of the season end of the episode, if we've done our job, we may have pitched the full script or story meeting or exceeding those demands.

TC.:

And when the end of the season comes, you distracted me, Kat, your demand could be the one that we've crafted into a script that will be green lit by the fans for our finale. Thank you to everyone who's keep who keeps submitting. We had a great boom of new listeners this season. A lot of new demands came flowing in, as those paying attention to this season know, and last season, we do keyword searches so we have a sense of what the topic may be. And today's demand comes from Cookie Go Away.

TC.:

So is that the studio?

Jim:

That's where it comes from now.

TC.:

No. No. I don't wanna disrespect our listeners. This is from m and m e m m and e m m. So m and m from M and M from Azul Studios.

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

Okay. Alrighty, Jim. This is this is what we got. The Halloween franchise has one of the most tangled canons in horror history. Cinematic history.

TC.:

Right? Depending on how you count, it has been rebooted three times with four separate continuities in play. Okay. Original continuity, Halloween, Halloween two, Halloween four through six ending with the Curse of Thorn. Do you what the Curse of Thorn is?

Jim:

I don't.

TC.:

I don't what that is. Sorry.

Jim:

That might that might be a problem.

TC.:

Then we got the h two o timeline. Halloween, Halloween, Halloween two, Halloween h two o, and Halloween resurrection. So I know that. Halloween, Halloween two, h two o, Halloween resurrection. So that's four movies.

TC.:

Okay. Then, big cap big capital letters. Then, Rob Zombie shit out two movies. Yeah. Yep.

TC.:

Then, Blumhouse gave us through the Halloween, Halloween, Halloween kills, Halloween ends continuity. At this point, we've watched the multiverse of Michael Myers. Oh, oh, no. Oh, God. I hope this doesn't that's okay.

TC.:

Yes. We might need to know. We might need to know. Yeah. The multiverse of Michael Myers for over four decades.

TC.:

How many more times can we see this guy kill people? It's getting old. But this franchise has name recognition. It's a well that still has milk in it.

Jim:

Yep. Milk well. Common.

TC.:

Very common. It's a well that sells milk in it. And we have a demand we

Jim:

have

TC.:

a demand to give us more of that sweet, sweet IP. But enough of Michael Myers and Laurie Strode. Okay. Our studio demands that you reboot John Carpenter's second attempt, Halloween three season of The Witch. This movie was awful, but the ideas are sound.

TC.:

We demand a full reboot it of it so we can keep cashing in on the IP. Rated r, no known names in the franchise, in the actor roles, and to be released in the next spooky season. Impress us and get the green light. Okay. Woo.

TC.:

Eminem, you scared me for a second that we might need to do some quick check on what a Curse of the Thorn arc is. But Jim, see Halloween three, Season of the Witch.

Jim:

Season of the Witch.

TC.:

Now, we are familiar with this movie.

Jim:

We are.

TC.:

We are both familiar with this movie. Mhmm. But it's worth talking real quick about the success of this franchise. This the longevity that, yeah, it's been thirty plus years. Seventy when did the first one come out?

TC.:

'76?

Jim:

Yeah. Something like that.

TC.:

And we've gotten multiple reincarnations of Michael Myers. There is multiple continuities. Which one do you count? Which one you don't? The the most recent one, that Blumhouse, that trilogy they made Mhmm.

TC.:

Two really good movies.

Jim:

I really liked that first one.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

And then I remember insisting that I liked the other ones. Halloween Ends. Mhmm. I remember I told myself I liked Halloween Ends more than Halloween Kills. Halloween Kills.

TC.:

Well, because Halloween Kills just spun its wheels for two hours.

Jim:

Yeah. I'd I'd

TC.:

Evil evil dies tonight.

Jim:

And then it did.

TC.:

And then it didn't. Red Letter Media turned me around on Halloween Ends by doing a whole video on how good that movie is, and then there's also the Michael Myers and Laurie Strode stuff in the movie. Interesting. They broke it down to this new crazy killer character within Halloween Ends that has the actual a plot. And then, oh, yeah, also, let's have Laurie fight Michael.

TC.:

They turned they turned me around on Halloween Ends.

Jim:

Interesting. I would like to see that. I liked Halloween ends from the perspective of ending it. Like like, that that's weird to say. But I got into a fight with a friend about it, and I saw it from their perspective.

Jim:

As a fan of Halloween Mhmm. It it didn't it wasn't really a a great end. Like like, it well, it in the same way you'd never like seeing anything that is your favorite end

TC.:

Right.

Jim:

It wasn't it it wasn't a great goodbye.

TC.:

It wasn't satisfying. No. I can agree to that. If you are a fan of Michael Myers and Laurie and you follow them through all their continuities, it is not a satisfying end. But at this I

Jim:

I remember at the in the theater, I was like, okay. I don't know. I don't remember. I'd I guess I've just also censored enough of it out of my I purged enough of it from my mind that I don't remember For properly

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

About what I do or don't like. I just I remember liking her getting one up on or, like, like, three up on him

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

And and finally defeating him. Mhmm. And then my my reaction to a spoiler here. She keeps the mask. And at first, was like, oh, she kept the mask.

Jim:

I like that. And then it, like, slowly zoomed in toward the window with the mask there. And I just kinda like, do I like that? What does that mean that she kept the mask? Does it mean anything?

Jim:

Am I trying too hard? Is this good? I don't I had a good time. Why am I

TC.:

Second guessing it.

Jim:

Second guessing. Yeah.

TC.:

It it it comes with any franchise that has existed this long. We have expectations. We have assumptions. We have hopes, and and sometimes those are dashed. Sometimes those are exceeded.

TC.:

But I think in the grand scheme of things, I don't have this special place in my heart for Halloween. The first one I saw was Halloween h two o. That was the first Halloween movie

Jim:

I saw. Why you watched it bad.

TC.:

Yeah. And then, in retrospect, going back, I respect the hell out of the original one. I I I understand its import within cinema.

Jim:

The first Halloween is my favorite slasher movie.

TC.:

It's the slasher movie. Like, it it defined so much

Jim:

Different people. Psychos, slasher. Yeah. Well, no. Like like, for some people, Friday the thirteenth, yes, it is a Halloween copy.

Jim:

Mhmm. But to them, that it's way better.

TC.:

Sure.

Jim:

Or Nightmare on Elm Street.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

So just because it it wasn't just because they weren't first doesn't mean that there aren't people that will champion, those others.

TC.:

Sure. And don't get me wrong. I literally wrote Friday thirteenth. Yeah. So I'm well aware of the the longevity and love and the fandom of that franchise.

TC.:

But I respect the hell out of John Carpenter's first one. Like, that that movie, it's the one of the movies that made us for a reason.

Jim:

Yeah.

TC.:

But in the grand scheme of this franchise, I always liked the idea of what John Carpenter intended, which is I wanna make a Halloween movie every year, and we're gonna we're gonna make an anthology franchise.

Jim:

I wanna discuss that

TC.:

Okay.

Jim:

Just just for a little bit, that that you like it. I I like the idea of it as well. However, this idea has been tried a number of times. Has it ever worked?

TC.:

Well, the the thing is that what his intention was was an anthology franchise, not an anthology film. Sure. Because you can look at the Tales From The Crypt movie, and you can look at Creep Show, those are anthology films. Trick or Treat is my favorite Halloween movie. It's an anthology movie.

TC.:

Yeah. An an anthology franchise? Has that been done?

Jim:

Yeah. The way the way Halloween was conceived. Tales from the Crypt is the closest one I can think of. They got two movies. Yeah.

Jim:

And then it and then it was done. Because I and and and here's why I bring that up. Because as much as that may sound like a really fun idea or on paper that's a great idea Mhmm. I don't think people actually like that.

TC.:

I disagree because James Wan proved it. He created the Condren universe, and he gave us all he gave multiple franchise under an umbrella. There's the Annabelle franchise. There's the Nun franchise. There's the Conjuring movies.

Jim:

Nah. That's no. That's cheating. That's cinematic universe style.

TC.:

Ah, okay. Okay.

Jim:

Okay. Okay. Now you I guess, you could argue that cinematic universes are exactly that.

TC.:

Okay.

Jim:

But they're not. Actually, they're not either because cinematic universes always reference each other.

TC.:

And they return to a thing. So, yeah, guess I was being glib. And I'm like, James Wan did it.

Jim:

Because because The Conjuring, they're all stories of the the the two exorcists.

TC.:

Right. Right.

Jim:

And then when a thing was like, oh, everyone responded really well to the Warrens. When everyone responded really really well to the opener with the doll, let's make a whole movie about that.

TC.:

Okay. So then to your question of a franchise and Where it

Jim:

where it does a whole new movie in the next one. The

TC.:

Okay. Yeah. At least because it's labeling it. Sorry. I interrupted you.

TC.:

Go ahead.

Jim:

Well, I I thought of another one, but the thing is that it technically goes three movies, and the third one shat the bed.

TC.:

Go ahead.

Jim:

And that's Cloverfield.

TC.:

Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Weirdly, it because what it comes down to is if it if it's John John Carpenter's Halloween presents Season of the Witch.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

John Carpenter's Halloween presents this. Right? That has been done to great success with National Lampoon and American Pie. Like, National Lampoon presents Animal House. National Lampoon presents Van Wilder.

TC.:

Like, it's a label you put at the top, much like in association with Marvel technically counts as a Marvel movie. The that is a so if Halloween had been a label

Jim:

So do you think Yeah. Vacation six had extra success because of Animal House?

TC.:

National Lampoon's Vacation. Yeah. I think that being able to put the National Lampoon label on it allowed it to be a standard people could ask for. So, like, Judd Apatow became a label. Judd Apatow presents this.

TC.:

He didn't direct Super Superbad or or Sarah Marshall, but they count under his umbrella.

Jim:

I okay. Now I think you're being way more loose with what Yes.

TC.:

I am.

Jim:

The Halloween franchise was intended to be.

TC.:

Right. And to to to get back on point, I had I it's such an a cool idea that has never been executed well. If the idea is to be able to say Halloween subtitle and Sure. And do that every year. People have done stuff like this to varying degrees of success.

TC.:

I I think I agree. The Michael Myers story has been done over and over and over again. It would be worth trying something else with the franchise label. So Halloween, Season of the Witch, rebooting that and

Jim:

I just I want to acknowledge Yeah. That this idea has been attempted by a number of different people over a over a number of decades, and it might just not be a sellable idea because of the way the way people consume media. They don't want things that way. They're not like, that was such a good one. Time for an time for something different.

Jim:

They want they want more of the same, and they want that title to reflect Yeah. The thing that they saw last time. Now that said, this podcast, we exist in this Twilight Zone space Mhmm. Where we can say no in our little The studio

TC.:

Yeah. A studio literally.

Jim:

Gonna we're gonna make it work.

TC.:

And I think we I think even if it's just hey. If the demand the demand is to reboot season of the witch. Sure. That's as simple Okay. As That's what we're gonna do.

TC.:

I do wanna point I've I've given some examples of audiences latching on. Yes. I was playing a little loose, but look at, like, the Coronetto trilogy. We the these the savvy movie watchers and fans of Edgar Wright understood it's going to be more of the same, but not the same. It's not a sequel.

Jim:

It's Sure.

TC.:

Yeah. And and I I think there's there's potential in that. There's potential in in a film series being the star that you're going to see. Like going to see a Tom Cruise movie, going to see a Will Smith movie, you kinda know what to expect because of them. So having the Halloween label allowing for a franchise of films, I'm sort of wandering right now.

Jim:

No. No. I I get what you're saying. I'm saying it's really tough because audiences expect a through line. Right.

Jim:

James Bond may never have a story that in any way connects to any of the other stories, but James Bond is there. That's the connection. That's what people want. And with with Halloween, it needed to be Michael Myers. Michael Myers or or lower Laurie Strode.

TC.:

The the the issue here is knowing Halloween three, my god, if the movie had been good, for Christ's sake, if it even been okay Sure. I think there's a chance that people would've jumped on board for it and been like, oh, I can't wait to see what happens next Halloween. But because that movie was so bad, the studio's like, don't do that again. Get the get the get the mask out. Get the get the mechanic's jumpsuit out.

TC.:

Don't do that again. Give the man give the man a chainsaw. No. That's Leatherface. Don't know.

TC.:

Give him a knife. Whatever. So knowing that Michael Myers as a character has been done over and over and over again, if they they're gonna reboot it again, we're gonna get a Michael Myers movie again. But if this hypothetical this hypothetical Hollywood overlord has said, you know what? We're gonna put Halloween on a label, but make us a good Season of the Witch.

TC.:

Okay. So let's do that. Alright. Now, here's a thought I had, knowing that like, seeing this pop up, I'm like, great. Season of the Witch is all about manipulating and murdering people through screens.

TC.:

We are in an AI revolution right now, a dangerous place. So there's there's some there's some room here to to play with.

Jim:

I, before we get much further into actually putting it together, I wanted to glibly say, Halloween three season of the witch is about, Saint Patrick's Day getting jealous and trying to murder Halloween.

TC.:

Put that on the poster. I'm in. You just leprechaun versus pumpkin? Let's go. So I I but as we we're gonna dive in here, I'm I'm curious.

TC.:

Okay. So having to adjust ourselves to think about the worst of the Halloween movies.

Jim:

You know what? I was think because we recently watched season of the witch. Mhmm. I was trying to remember what the main character's first name was, and I couldn't. I know he's doctor Chalice.

TC.:

Right.

Jim:

That's all I remember.

TC.:

Mister.

Jim:

Oh, mister. Doctor mister Chalice.

TC.:

Everyone calls him mister Chalice in it.

Jim:

I cannot remember what. Is it Dan? Was it Rick? Dan Was it

TC.:

Mister.

Jim:

Mister. It was mister.

TC.:

I'm I'm wondering okay. Because that movie's such a mess. So let's just we know the parts of it, so then Uh-huh. We can we can pull out pull it out of the mix every time we want. What's worth leaning in here?

TC.:

Leaning into the ancient ritualistic, Celtic, druidic magic? The witch magic, like like live up to the title? Or the technology that's messing with people that's somehow harnessing Stonehenge. Like, what what we can do whatever we want with this. Where are where are you I right.

Jim:

Like, they they didn't they didn't blatantly say it, but they were they were trying to say that it's one in the same. Right. The technology is the ancient magic. It's why the the chips had to be made out of ground down

TC.:

Stonehenge. Stonehenge.

Jim:

Right? Because oh, because microchips have have these these bits of rock in them. And what if the the magic channeled through them? Mhmm. And, right, Stonehenge is purported to be a site of sacrifice.

Jim:

Mhmm. So what if what if that that's what was happening? That that's that's a fun enough idea. I'd I'd currently, you can convince me otherwise. I feel like that's pretty central to the premise.

TC.:

Mhmm. Just I I want it to be Yeah.

Jim:

The idea of making Saw Wayne scary again.

TC.:

Yeah. And I'm cool with that. I want it to be witch focused. I want if we're gonna call it season of the witch, I want witchcraft and witches to be a part of

Jim:

this.

TC.:

Because the way Season the Witch currently has it, it's a rich suit wearing dickhead who wants to murder children because he wants to make Halloween scary. Even if it's as simple as making it a woman. Yeah. Like, I I just think

Jim:

Men can't be witches?

TC.:

I've we've discussed this because I I have said that isn't a warlock a male witch? And you said no, and you're gonna be the expert on this, not me. But it's just a it's a a notion of, if we're gonna call it season of the witch, I expect to see some witchy things in this. Sure. I want some witchy things in this.

TC.:

Yeah. So Where's where's

Jim:

the cauldron? Where's the the crooked nose with the wart on it?

TC.:

Sure. Where's the flying on broom.

Jim:

Yeah.

TC.:

Delivering potions in a in a Japan that wasn't crushed by World War two. Yeah. Chi Chi. Yeah. You get it.

TC.:

Gigi. Gigi. Sorry.

Jim:

Gigi?

TC.:

Yeah. From, Kiki's Delivery Service.

Jim:

Who's Kiki?

TC.:

No. Kiki's the witch. Gigi's the cat.

Jim:

Oh. Yeah. I never saw it. Okay. What?

Jim:

Oh. I know I know I know nothing about witches.

TC.:

It's so good. It's the best. Oh, man. That's the best season of the witch right there.

Jim:

Oh, okay.

TC.:

Yeah. It's Kiki's Delivery Service. It's a warm hug of a movie.

Jim:

Alright.

TC.:

Alright. So Halloween three.

Jim:

Halloween three.

TC.:

How like, the the notion I suggest that we're we're we're dealing with screens much differently than we did back then. Having a commercial that gets kids to sit down in front of TV, that's not gonna work anymore. It's it's 2025, the year of our zoos. Right? So diving like, having it be an app, having, like no.

TC.:

It's just Halloween has changed. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

TC.:

In fact, Halloween is much more of the interest of millennials and Gen X than it is of children anymore. Like, the people I see who celebrate Halloween the hardest are not kids. They're adults. So, I I I I think also, the original ending of the movie of Season of the Witch, when it goes to black, the whole closing credits was was originally to be screaming children for two minutes.

Jim:

Oh, wow.

TC.:

Like, of all the children around the world dying. Wow. And then the director was like, Tommy Tommy Lee Wallace is like, maybe we don't do that. Maybe we just leave it silent and ambiguous, but the intention was to have the world's children killed by the Stonehenge magic.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

So to that point, I I think that targeting kids and murdering them, while that's horrifying, haunting stuff, and we can certainly go there with our our villainous tendencies here, it it seems to me that Halloween is much more of an adult holiday now than it is a child's holiday. Trick or treat's not the focus anymore.

Jim:

Maybe. I'd unfortunately, I don't know. I'm not plugged in. I am I am a I'm an adult without a family, and I spend all of my time around adults. So I don't and television doesn't exist the way that it used to.

Jim:

So as far as common culture, I feel really unplugged. Well And I I feel like that's why I don't know what Halloween is popular amongst because the algorithm only tells me things anymore. And it and yes. I don't know if I agree. I agree that I that's what I see, but I don't know if what I see is true.

TC.:

Okay. Well, I'm just trying to lock in on a focus of this movie. So let's do this. Sometimes we see titles for films. I'll tell you scripts I'm working on for clients.

TC.:

I'll tell you the title, and then I'll tell you the premise of the script, and you go, that's not the title. That's not that's not the premise for that title. Yeah. So hallow so Halloween No. No.

TC.:

Season of the witch. Season of the witch. Yeah. What does that what do you what kind of movie what do you wanna do with that title? I'm I'm I'm throwing everything at you, Jim.

TC.:

What do you

Jim:

wanna witches, but or I'm sorry, weapons, but the bad guy wins.

TC.:

Woah. Okay. True. Spoiler for weapons if

Jim:

you Yeah. I haven't just spoiled that.

TC.:

That's okay. If you haven't seen weapons, which is probably hitting streaming pretty soon, it's still in theaters right now, I I think it's worth seeing. We do tend to spoil in conversation too. It's a very recent movie. I do want to discuss that.

TC.:

I want to discuss it. If you haven't seen it, but you have interest in it, maybe Yeah.

Jim:

People probably turned this episode on thinking, oh, that's a million year old movie. I'll I'll listen to this episode. They won't spoil anything. And then I

TC.:

Actually, you know what? Let's not talk about weapons. Let's talk about the movie The Witches. Okay. The Roald Dahl adaptation, The Witches.

TC.:

Sure. Okay. So in The Witches, witches are eating children for power Mhmm. Youth. Right?

TC.:

And at the end of the movie, the witches are destroyed, and, the heroes win the day. Right? Taking the notion of that and the witches winning, that's that's dark and, oh, oh, man. I'm leaving the theater feeling upset about that.

Jim:

Mhmm.

TC.:

That that being the premise, that witches of Stonehenge, these this ancient covenant of witches utilizing technology to to attack the world and make them fear how do say the holiday again? Samhain?

Jim:

Samhain.

TC.:

Yeah. Samhain. To make them fear the and that and then ultimately, in the end, they succeed despite the efforts of our hero. There's something that that the witches win in the end.

Jim:

Sure. We did it. We replaced one rich old man with

TC.:

A covenant of witches.

Jim:

Covenant of witches, and it's the same. No. I'm being glib. I'm being funny. Everyone's laughing.

TC.:

We're all hilarious. We have to pause. We have to pause to all laugh. We aren't gonna pause. You're gonna pause.

TC.:

Okay. Okay. Season of the Witch opens with a guy fleeing a small town that is making masks. He he gets so far, but then he's killed by robots. Yeah.

TC.:

This movie's freaking weird. Mhmm. So let's let's discuss the cold open of this movie. I don't know if we need robots. I don't know I don't know if robots need to maintain a thing here, especially robots that are centuries old.

TC.:

That's crazy talk. Having some sort of magic be as be central to the guards of Samhain, the guards of this coven, that there are there are soldiers being controlled by magic that, stop any leaks as they create these masks, these these items, not just masks, but these items that on Halloween are going to be activated. Yeah. Our cold open is someone fleeing the town, being chased by these these sentries and getting brutally murdered so that he can't get away. Okay?

TC.:

And then the the results of that death are his sister or yeah. His sister is is is

Jim:

Well, you well, originally, in in the original, was his daughter.

TC.:

It doesn't have to be that. It's his sorry. Was just realizing that's the plot to the newest naked gun. Oh. His daughter, is is wants to find out what happened to my my father died.

TC.:

My father has been Yeah. And I think he was murdered by the business he works for. Little does she know and learn to discover, he hasn't worked he wasn't working for a business, he was working for an organization of evil, an actual witch, a coven. Yeah.

Jim:

So already, the I think that change right there, I think you you've touched on a change that I think makes it better. Getting rid of chalice, getting rid of the doctor, and just following the daughter.

TC.:

Yes. Yeah. Okay. Good. We're we're onto something there.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Yeah.

TC.:

So what what does he get a message out to her that, like, perhaps there's a within the town that these these these witches are operating, there is a a field or, like, you have to get past a certain point to get your cell phone, service working. Like, it's there's like a a technological blackout that this guy's trying to get out of. And if this town that is this factory is in has been taken over, Kinda like WandaVision style, where, like, they are they are subject to the coven, the people who live within the town, and they are oblivious to the fact that they are being controlled, and they are weapons themselves. Because I'm I'm I'm just gonna keep babbling.

Jim:

Yeah. No. I'm sorry. I'm I'm I'm trying to I'm I'm not I don't wanna leave you hanging. Trying to put together right?

Jim:

So these witches, they wanna take control. They wanna the the the the season of of the of the inquisitor, of the the witch hunter is over, and and the witches want to bring back the season of the witch when the witches are in control and people fear them and and and respect respect them. And they're the way they want to do this is by stealing Mhmm. The the the world's children Mhmm. Essentially through through death, through through sacrificing them.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

In in this year, 2025. Right? Like, in in in a now time. Right. You are right.

Jim:

Microchips and masks does being triggered by watching television doesn't quite work in 2025.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

An app isn't a bad idea.

TC.:

And if

Jim:

they But how do you justify

TC.:

right?

Jim:

Like, it it feels fake, but, like, you could trying to take real life things and, like, oh, they they're doing it through a game in in Roblox. Mhmm. Mhmm. They they programmed a game in Roblox, and it's it's mesmerizing children to the point that on October 31, they're going to to do an enact a ritual that causes all the kids who are playing that game to Yeah. Explode into Right?

Jim:

And it doesn't have to catch every child, but it will catch enough. That plot sounds it it sounds implausible. Not I don't know. It it sounds it just sounds implausible because, really, Roblox? That's how you yeah.

Jim:

That's actually what would actually catch the most kids, but it feels so Mhmm. What's the word I'm looking for? A trite? Trite. Yeah.

Jim:

Trite.

TC.:

It feels like old man trying to write to a pizza children. Yeah.

Jim:

But that would really that literally would be how you would speak to children.

TC.:

Right. I honestly, I didn't do it intentionally, but suggesting that we target adults instead of kids allows us to be more tapped into what would happen because we don't we can't assume what would appeal to kids. I doubt masks in front of a television in 1982 was was what kids would have fell for anyway. It was already an adult trying to so, you the the witches want to create a an explosion of evil. On Halloween night, at a key moment, they wanna activate their spell.

TC.:

They wanna perform their ritual across the nation and see the most amount of souls for them to consume all at once, whether it's children, whether it's adults. If their plot is, and you said something I wanna come back to, that the the the era, the the age of the witch hunter is no more, and this is their time. This is the year they can finally activate this spell and kill the most amount of people and create the most amount of bloodshed in one fell swoop. That's evil. That's that's could be disgusting.

TC.:

Yeah. Like, that's their their goal. They're they are going to make their presence known to the world once more. The season of the witch has returned. Witches are real.

TC.:

And to to announce their arrival, they're going to murder hundreds of thousands or tens of thousands of people all at once across the world. That's some evil stuff right there.

Jim:

Yeah. And Now we just gotta make it sound not hokey.

TC.:

Right. Finding finding the plausible way of doing this. So now,

Jim:

Okay. To that end. Yes. So let's not do world. Let's do America?

TC.:

Yes. Let's just do America.

Jim:

Okay. So for that, we don't need to worry about Stonehenge. Mhmm. So we can drop the whole a stone has been stolen from Stonehenge, and we're grinding up the stone to spread through the technology. Mhmm.

Jim:

Instead, this is the granddaughters of the Salem witches.

TC.:

The the surviving coven. Yeah. They've they've somehow the the bloodline has maintained

Jim:

hundreds of years, and and their revenge plot is finally culminating.

TC.:

Okay. I wanna yes. And and they have taken over a small town in the Midwest, a factory town.

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

Now why take over town? Maybe the server power necessary to to reach all cell phone technology? Like, there Well,

Jim:

the thing is if you wanna if you wanna do like you said, if you're wanting to do adults, millennials and and, Gen z

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

That's drinking age.

TC.:

Okay.

Jim:

That and and also what's Halloween about? Halloween is about Debossary. Getting dressed up sexy and going out to bars and having a good time.

TC.:

Right. So they are brewery a

Jim:

brewery town? That's that's my first thought. That does that sound fun? Does that sound lame?

TC.:

It okay. It can you know, the anything could be comedic versus horrific, but the idea that they've double, double toiled, and troubled, and crap micro brewed a beer, that is going to be the Yeah. The tonic of their spell. Right? Yeah.

TC.:

I mean, that is silly, but it's all in presentation. Right? Like Sure. If you look at something like barbarian Mhmm. Barbarian is uncomfortably funny at times.

TC.:

Yeah. That's the way Zach Krueger crafts his films. Weapons is hilarious.

Jim:

Same thing same thing.

TC.:

It's dark and upsetting and tonally, like, nightmarish Mhmm. But also, he can relieve the tension with a scare and a laugh. Mhmm. E when equal measure. Nope.

TC.:

Some there's some good comedy, Nope. It's also frightening as hell. And I think Get Out and Us similarly Jordan Peele understands tension can be broken two That

Jim:

is but the central conceit can't shouldn't be silly.

TC.:

Right. A a microbe a beer that is spread across the country that is going to be part of this spell. You're not wrong. That we we are verging into the risk of it being silly. Let's let's work under the assumption we can make it not silly.

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

Because there's a there's another element here I wanna suggest. If the witches have taken over a factory, a brewery town

Jim:

Mhmm.

TC.:

They've created this microbrew. They're through their magic that they as they see it, have controlled all these people and made them sentries The and

Jim:

the Buddy Kupfer, sub subplot actually works here as well. He was their best salesman, come to the factory. I don't remember why. I because I don't think he was necessarily invited. Mhmm.

Jim:

Or was he invited because they specifically wanted to

TC.:

Test it all. Test? Yeah. Yeah. Which is unnecessary.

TC.:

It's a bad movie.

Jim:

Testing the day before was probably a bad time test.

TC.:

It's a bad movie. But having number one salesman, Buddy Cuthbert or whatever.

Jim:

Right? Because they're gonna need people. We can get a whole thing where he's like, yeah. The product sells itself. Mhmm.

Jim:

It's beer. Especially at the price point the company has set it at. I'd like I don't have to do anything. Yeah. The this stuff, I can't keep it on the shelves kinda thing.

TC.:

Yeah. The the the the tonally, if you look at something like Cabin in the Woods, another movie that's both good good fun horror and dealing with some seemingly hokey things and leaning into those tropes lovingly while creating some good good fright out of it. Mhmm. I think a beer, an a booze Mhmm. Like, I think a microbeer, like a brewer Sure.

TC.:

Yeah. That's been spreading and selling itself kind of thing. If there's some additional marketing that deals with the advertising and the marketing of it and the Yeah. The targeted nature, there's a there's an opportunity here to be satirical and discuss how poison is targeted at us every single day. Sure.

TC.:

We have our phones in our pockets. We are being poisoned regularly and willingly. Yeah. So there's there's an opportunity maybe in there for some some satire, some social satire, some social commentary as

Jim:

well. Okay.

TC.:

Having a character die that is then being investigated by this woman Mhmm. That my my father's dead, I need to know why. All signs point to this his job, fighting those sentries. It's a that's a little too AB. Like, we go A, oh, and then B.

TC.:

And now we're in this town, like, there in order to flesh this out, I wanna I'm I'm gonna make a suggestion here, because you said the age of the witch hunter is done. Mhmm. And now these witches are free. I don't want doctor Daniel Challis to be a part of this movie because he's not a good character. But

Jim:

We could make we I mean, we could make him

TC.:

a character. The the last I know this is a that's a Vin Diesel movie, but the final wish hunter. The last witch hunter. Like, actually, that there is one more witch hunter out there who, like a slayer, has been activated that could team up with our our female our our our daughter character. So the daughter character is the audience.

TC.:

She gets to ask the questions. She gets to she gets to be the one that's on the adventure asking the questions. See, made the mistake there. I said adventure, now I'm painting a different type of movie. Yep.

TC.:

But to you take my point that if she's teamed up with someone who has the answers, does that does that help us at all? You can poo poo the idea. I'm not loving it myself. I just wanted to put it out there to This create a buddy

Jim:

is the movie Warlock.

TC.:

Okay. I'm not familiar. Is that the one with Sam Neill?

Jim:

No. No. Okay. It it's the the crap. The what I the only other movie I remember him from, he was the blonde scientist in arachnophobia.

Jim:

Okay. An an ancient warlock does a spell and gets thrown into the future. And there's a a woman there who looks just like the princess from back in their time, and a witch hunter follows him to the future. And so then he teams up with a girl who looks like the princess to to defeat him.

TC.:

He comes from the past to destroy the future. Warlock, Satan also has one son, starring Julian Sands.

Jim:

Julian Sands. That's his name.

TC.:

He plays warlock. Okay. Then we we don't have

Jim:

to mean that that doesn't mean we can't also do

TC.:

It's an homage.

Jim:

Like that.

TC.:

Yeah. It it's only if you feel like it's necessary or if you if you like The the pitch that we have other thing is duo.

Jim:

Like, I don't want it to be a buffy character. Like, what you you you

TC.:

I did.

Jim:

Intimated. They've they've Activated. Activated or or whatever. No. I I would want it to be a person who comes across like a crazy conspiracy theorist

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

Because they they are a witch hunter. They know the truth. They're like, there are witches in the world. People don't believe me. They think I'm a psychopath.

Jim:

Mhmm. And that's why I don't talk to anyone.

TC.:

I've trained my whole life for this. Sure. Actually, you know what? That juxtaposes our villains. If this is a legacy of witch hunters versus a legacy of witches, then there's there's some history to explore here.

TC.:

And and in a fantasy setting where this movie is a success, one of the seagulls can be a prequel to this that see is a period piece in the Salem trials. The the season of the witch, season of the witch, Salem. Right? No. No.

TC.:

Okay.

Jim:

Here's why I say no. Okay. Because I feel like this is leaning too much toward spook spooky action movie

TC.:

Great. Okay.

Jim:

Instead of instead of a horror movie.

TC.:

Instead of a horror movie. Okay. That's fair.

Jim:

It doesn't mean that they're like, you can have some elements of that kind of thing, but but

TC.:

That's alright. I I it really was something I just threw out there as an option. Because you're right. We if if we're really gonna lean into what this should be, it should be a horror movie first. So having a similar to, like, Naomi Watts and The Ring, the singular woman exploring this Mhmm.

TC.:

Horror and and getting the answers through her own tenacity, that might be

Jim:

I wanna go back to the drawing board. What if it is if it is masks? What if it is children? What if it is weird online things that they get into? Mhmm.

Jim:

Right? Because there's there's weird memes. There's even there's weird memes that kids get into where the there there's one I'm thinking of where the message of the character is to kill yourself. It's very alarming, especially to parents, that kids are getting like, are following this this wide eyed creepy creepypasta character.

TC.:

Sure.

Jim:

And and that's its message. So what if we lean into that type of thing? And, like, to the point that that kids are wanting these masks, not that they've always wanted masks, but this one in particular, they they want and then or or or, like, maybe a small grouping of characters or whatever. Mhmm. But a part of the way they behave is literally they put on the masks and then the kids just they just stand there.

Jim:

Like, and it's super creepy and like but they then they take the mask off like, get it? I'm being the so and so character. Did you find the

TC.:

No. No. I was I I was googling just now. I mean, I'm listening,

Jim:

but Yeah.

TC.:

The idea that they're they they're act they're enacting a meme. The meme makes you do this thing. Creepy. There's I know

Jim:

a movie or two are actually or have come out or are coming out that even touch touch on that.

TC.:

There's a meme recently that I'd I'd been aware of, and I don't know what it is. But something like seven eight nine, something like that, or, like Sure. Eight eight seven six or whatever. I don't know what it is. I was just trying to see.

TC.:

But to your point of Yeah. That the younger generation okay. So now you're you're actually touching on something that might work in our favor, which is not understanding Gen Alpha to be like, kids are doing this thing. It's it's weird. They're not hurting themselves, but standing there doing like, look.

TC.:

I'm this creepy character from online. What is that? Yeah. And that it's all building up to them, like, exploding into snakes and bugs. Yeah.

Jim:

That's what it was. Momo. Have you heard of Momo?

TC.:

No. I don't think I have.

Jim:

So we can find a quick description.

TC.:

But it's a it's a current meme?

Jim:

It actually might be a year or two old, but yeah.

TC.:

Okay. So

Jim:

It looks like it it actually is super creepy. It looks like that.

TC.:

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know Whenever I see that, it's like someone manipulated Shelley Duvall from The Shining.

TC.:

Yeah. Yes. I'm aware of that one. Haunting. So so this app and this like, so they

Jim:

It it like, it's a whole thing. I guess it could be an app. It doesn't necessarily have to be, but there's this character. If we wanted to lean in super hard into the the, like, the way that the mask thing worked And the thing is it doesn't have to be technology. It doesn't have to be the microchip has to be on the mask.

Jim:

Like, literally, the process of creating it, they've they've done a ritual. The mask itself is this magical cursed item in waiting. And then on Halloween, all the kids are gonna be wearing them, and they're gonna do the ritual Mhmm. That then turns them all into Masks. Little murder bombs.

TC.:

Little murder bombs. Okay. Instead of them exploding into bugs. Excuse me. I just swallowed spit down on the tube.

TC.:

Who knew? In Momo.

Jim:

No. They they could I think it'd be creepier or or I think it'd be a more visceral engaging horror movie if the kids turn on

TC.:

Their parents.

Jim:

The people who aren't wearing the masks.

TC.:

Do you

Jim:

Than if they just Drop. Fall over with bugs falling out

TC.:

of the mask. Don't you think that might verge a little too close to weapons?

Jim:

It might.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

We don't have to. We can we can go season of the witch route and just have bugs come out.

TC.:

Like I

Jim:

Like, to the end like, so the thing is we don't see that happen in season of the witch until the first bit is done and it happens. Right? Mhmm. It could be a part of the meme. Like, the character spits up bugs.

Jim:

It's funny. So when you buy the mask, you buy these fake plastic bugs

TC.:

And they come

Jim:

out spit of the out the mouth and it's weird. It's weird and gross and dumb, but the kids freaking love it for some dumb reason.

TC.:

Mhmm. And then they become

Jim:

The thing is I don't know how to build the stakes because we established that that's what this thing is. I feel like it's pretty clear our character has stumbled upon a plot where, oh, no. It's real. Mhmm. But no one will believe me.

Jim:

And then at the end, it happens. Well Yeah. And then at the end, our character attempts to stop it from happening, and we decide if it does or does not happen.

TC.:

Right. I I wanna I wanna pitch off this and suggest that especially to to subvert the expectations of anyone who is even familiar with what we're rebooting here, I wanna suggest this. I'm gonna go back to that millennials and Gen Z are being targeted with with a potion. Okay. And that when they're activated, they become murder machines.

TC.:

Sure. But they only attack the youth. That, like, the trick or treaters, the kids that should be enjoying and trick or treating and having a good time on Halloween are suddenly being chased by adults and and are going to be killed by the the the sins of their fathers kind of thing. That's there and this is muddy right now. I'm not I don't have a clear thesis for this, but it's just to go to the social commentary aspect of of what we are what is being wrought upon the the upcoming generation because of the failures of the generation above them.

Jim:

Millennials refuse to grow up, they are destroying the youth

TC.:

If it's

Jim:

to maintain their own.

TC.:

And and in a sense is a commentary on repeating the sins of Oh. Generation boom, sorry, boomer generation not getting the hell out of the way and letting the next generations come up as well. You know me. I'm fascinated by social psychology and social structures and generational structures. I I look at it often.

TC.:

It's something that I'm fascinated by. So there could be room to have more of that commentary in this, that this is supposed to be a children's holiday where kids kids are eating getting candy, trick or treat. How fun is that? That is wrong. Because traditionally, Halloween was meant to be this celebration of Wiccan traditions and witchcraft

Jim:

and Not not even well, what right? Like, it it depends on how you portray. Not even sell celebration is the wrong word.

TC.:

Right. Right. It's it's a ritual. It's it is it's, there's a reason how

Jim:

called All Hallowed's Eve.

TC.:

Right. And there's a reason that the that Christianity, specifically the Catholics, co opted it to be their All Hallow's Eve. Yeah. This is a celebration of the saints. Yeah.

TC.:

Not this paganistic ritual. Because

Jim:

it's the it's the evening Mhmm. In which the the veil between the living and the dead is thinnest.

TC.:

It's thinnest. And yes. And so it's this this is what we perceive it to be. This is what it's meant to be. No.

TC.:

Trick or treating is supposed to be fun. It's supposed to be kids going out getting candy. That's Halloween. No, it's not. It's supposed to be it's supposed to be this evil ritualistic thing.

TC.:

No, it's not. It's supposed to be a fun night of just wearing costumes, sexy costumes, and getting drunk. Like, the the misconceptions of it overlapping on each other to be like, what is this truly about? Who's it for? Why does it exist?

TC.:

And the may maybe I'm layering too much. Again, it's a muddy it's a muddy thesis right now.

Jim:

Mhmm.

TC.:

But getting to the point of we're all wrong. We have stolen all this from rituals past, now we are gonna suffer the consequences in very horrific ways for what we have done to Mhmm. To other people's ideas of what things should be. Sorry. I don't know if any of that made sense.

TC.:

Sure. So then having a singular character who's unraveling this and and bearing witness to an adult who's activated and kills and kills people around them of any age and her being like, oh my god. This is what's this is all about. I need to stop it before it goes nationwide. And not that we ever see nationwide because we should keep it small and focus through her POV.

Jim:

The the town of Santa Vera. Santa Mira.

TC.:

Santa Mira. Yeah. Yeah. Just for the sake of maintaining the horror aspect as opposed to an action adventure horror.

Jim:

Maybe.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

We also don't even need to go to a contrived plot to undermine the commercial aspect of Halloween. Mhmm. What if it's witches that are just that plan on making the veil as thin as possible so that the dead the dead attack the living?

TC.:

Under their control or just open the veil and let

Jim:

Just lift lift the veil.

TC.:

Lift lift the veil so that that the original intent of Sawain Sure. Is fulfilled.

Jim:

Not even necessarily that the original intent. Literally, because because, right, our evil witches are manipulating things to their end.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

And what their plan is is so they want to be they want to be respected again. Mhmm. They want to be feared again. Mhmm. They want to be powerful again.

Jim:

And they but they don't necessarily want to be on the the national stage where everyone can see them and say, there's the witch. Respect the witch. Right. So instead, if people just fear Halloween night again instead of using it to celebrate and be debaucherous.

TC.:

Little heathens. Yeah. Yeah. You wanna you wanna be heathens? Reap what you sow.

TC.:

We're gonna show you what being a heathen really is about.

Jim:

Something like that. I I realized there there's that's even less of a plot to get through. It's like, oh, they're just getting ghosts to attack people.

TC.:

Well, let's let's do this. I'm just gonna rattle this off real quick, and then we'll take our five. Okay. And then come back and see see see if how mull this over. Man is killed trying to escape a small town.

TC.:

Mhmm. His daughter wants to investigate his death. He is found miles and miles into the middle of nowhere, and so she needs to figure out where he came from. When she finds the small town, something's wrong here, and it is the slow discovery of her in this very small town that here, the veil has already been lifted. They have tested their power in a very small capacity, these witches.

TC.:

So now it's trying to find the witches and all and like, oh, they're controlling a town. No. Their plan is to do this nationwide to to lift the veil on the night of Halloween. Now I must stop them before they do this. Something like that, maybe?

Jim:

Maybe.

TC.:

Okay. Maul that over. Let's take a quick five here. It'll be a quick five for us in just a minute for all of you listening. So we'll be right back.

TC.:

Yeah. Here's some spooky messages from six five media.

Jim:

Oh. Yeah.

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Season of the witches. Season of the witch.

TC.:

Witch being a plural in this case. Season of the witch. Right? But it's a coven of witches.

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

We don't wanna change the title to season of witches. No. It's just the season of the witch.

Jim:

Season of the witch. Yeah.

TC.:

Here's here's how I see it right now. I I I we we paced. We scratched our beards. We Yes. We we didn't we just sat in complete silence Mhmm.

TC.:

For five minutes.

Jim:

It's my favorite.

TC.:

That's it. Okay. So here's here's here's what I think. Okay. So, like, I think we open.

TC.:

It's just a man frantically fleeing Santa Mira. It's nighttime, and and he's pursued by the like, these pale eyed thralls, like, witchcrafted thralls that are just men. They're not robots. Robots are out of this thing. And they're and and he he he gets he gets away.

TC.:

It's it's it's like we recreate the opening of the of the movie. He gets to a gas station. He's babbling about about, like, Halloween, the beer, the the brew, right, before, like, the sentries show up and just brutally kill him. And we just and the death the death sets the tone for the movie and the notion that no one escapes this town. The secret stays here.

TC.:

And that's that's our opening, like, cold open. We just see this this fleeing scene against these, like, unstoppable men in men in black types. They look like observers from Fringe.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

They're just pale eyed. Like, the gas station attendant's like, woah. Woah. Woah. What's going on?

TC.:

And they just kill him. Oh, okay. And they're just they they will stop at all costs to and, like and and then, so that's that's we opened the movie that way. Like, it was just, like, a bloody murder of multiple two people, at least, the gas station attendant and our

Jim:

And this guy.

TC.:

And this guy. Right? So then we then we title screen it. We meet our main character. Ellie was the name of the character in the in the original movie, so we could stick with Ellie as as her name here.

TC.:

And she she arrives to identify her father's body. Mhmm. I know we're like, you know, I'm I'm kinda beating out what's already there, but Sure. The the the police, like, the oh, we're in oh, the investigation, like, It's the the way it's been declared is it was a a an armed robbery at the gas station gone awry that these two killed each other in an armed robbery. That he that he killed the clerk, the clerk killed him.

TC.:

And they're like, case closed. Your father tried to stick up a a gas station and he was killed, and he killed someone for it. The end. Investigation over. And she's like, what my why my father would never do this?

TC.:

He's like, wait, what do you know about your dad? Well, I know he's a hard working man. I I haven't seen him in a while because he's been working. Like, he's been working. Yeah.

TC.:

Yeah. What's his job? I I I don't know. We we've

Jim:

We we don't know people as as well as we think we do.

TC.:

Yeah. Like, and she's Like, my father wouldn't do that, but she doesn't really know him. She's been estranged from him. Mhmm. So it's this She just refuses to believe that her father would have have come to this.

TC.:

He Maybe maybe even hinting at he had some sort of trouble. He was a criminal in his past. He had reformed. He he he he got a job online and was working for this company. Why why would he go back to this?

TC.:

Like, I I don't believe this.

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

That's, that's that's my that so that's Yeah.

Jim:

That's your open.

TC.:

That's that's the opening. Maybe even the, Like, she just sees the inconsistency, or she believes in her heart that her father would be this murderer, and this that this this death isn't is inconsistent. Maybe the maybe the I I like the I still think I know it seems silly, but that the this beer, this Halloween, this, like, pumpkin infused micro brew is the is, like, a a key factor here we're not aware of. Yeah. Like, we see characters drinking it.

TC.:

We Sure. We understand that it's this hot new beer that influencers are are promoting it. It's Uh-huh. It's like, oh, man, this this is the beer of the season. I know some of you don't like pumpkin spice, but I'm telling you, this is hot stuff.

TC.:

This is the this is what you should be drinking this Halloween. Crack one open. May may we don't need to lean hard into that sort of angle, but because now it's suddenly feeling like Paul Verhoeven's making this movie. So yeah. So we Ellie just starts investigating.

TC.:

She like, my father got a job. Where did he get a job?

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

So then she needs to be drawn towards Santa Mira. She she she needs to put the pieces together. If he has something in his apartment that says where his job is It's not in town. She hasn't she he didn't say where it is, but if she can piece enough information together even simply even if it's the beer can't like, why does he have so many so much beer in this house? Like, is he an alcoholic?

TC.:

Like, oh, no. He Santa Mira, it's on the bottles. I gotta go there. This must be where he works.

Jim:

I see what you're okay.

TC.:

So then that that will drive her into the eerie Into countryside. Okay. This not countryside. It's a waterside, a seaside brewery village.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

So she she drives there. It's it's seemingly like a quaint brewery town, but the town folks are are polite, but they're too polite. There's something a little too quaint about this. Like, their smiles aren't, like, reaching their eyes kind of thing.

Jim:

Mhmm.

TC.:

And so she's she's uneasy in this, like, the local sheriff and the doctor and the bartender are all saying that kinda discouraged her from staying. Like, oh, you visit, but you don't stay. People this isn't a tourist town. We all work here, we all live here, but the p people just pass through, you can keep driving. Mhmm.

TC.:

The the and the and the brewery has a presence everywhere in this town because it's like, it is it's what this town operates under, and they've

Jim:

Yeah.

TC.:

This even in this town has like, a rich history. Like, it's for a town that no one stops by. It's got some, like, older structures there. It's like, maybe maybe we have some sort of fascination in history that allows her to go, that building's over a 100 years old. There's not a lot of those around this part of the country.

Jim:

Maybe.

TC.:

Maybe.

Jim:

Maybe. I'm I'm having ideas. I wanna see where you're you're kinda what you're fully unraveling here. What what I have doesn't necessarily go too far off of Okay. The the the main road you're you're driving right now.

TC.:

Okay. So she's she's in the small town. There's breweries like, the brewery's just very omnipresent. There's signs and posters and and trucks driving by, and, like, the and it's their pride and joy. Like, this is the pride of the town.

TC.:

It's the lifeblood of this town. We love it. We love it. We're we're proud of it. But this is our town, and and maybe we should just move right along.

TC.:

Maybe, you know, no reason no reason to stay. Did you know my father? Never heard of him. Never heard him. Move along.

TC.:

So then she, like, takes a tour of the of the brewery. Like, she actually goes, like, joins, like, a guided tour of of the, Shamrock. What is it?

Jim:

Silver Silver

TC.:

Shamrock. Silver Shamrock Brewery.

Jim:

Mhmm.

TC.:

Which is funny because it's that's like I didn't piece together that it was Saint Patrick trying to kill trying to kill Halloween. But the the Silver Shamrock Brewery, it's it's sterile. It's disturbingly clean. Like, workers move like clockwork. Their hands are raw from handling, like, all the the ingredients, like the the hops and whatnot.

TC.:

Right?

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

And, like, it it smells like she's I know it's hard to get smell across, but, like, there's a rot underneath the No. No. Underneath the yeast. Hops? That's just the hops.

TC.:

If anyone's lived in a beer town, Milwaukee in the summer, that's a smell.

Jim:

I miss it. I strangely miss it. I hated it when I was a kid.

TC.:

Yeah. Me too. But you're right. It does kinda especially gets that the mix of the, like, the the lake air. Mhmm.

TC.:

Like, the lakeside wind and the beer mix. It's Yeah. It's decidedly Wisconsin. Yeah. There's a smell that's very

Jim:

Very Milwaukee.

TC.:

Very Milwaukee. At some point, we're just getting whispers of or hints of and probably up to this point, hints of the witches, of the coven, of something just just the sprinklings of ideas that there's more to this than just a murder of a man. We already know from the beginning that there's, like, these white eyed thralls. So the movie is waiting for the audience is waiting for this this witchcraft stuff to come back into play. Mhmm.

TC.:

So

Jim:

How far in do you think we are at this point?

TC.:

Oh, boy.

Jim:

Was another thing about Season of the Witch. You're right. It was only ninety minutes, but it felt so freaking long. Like, it felt like it took forever for us to get to Santa Mira. Mhmm.

Jim:

And then we were there forever. Yeah. And honestly, it was probably only like maybe fifteen minutes.

TC.:

Maybe twenty. Maybe twenty and a half an hour. I I think we're at least a third of the movie in already.

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

Like, the give taking our time to be, stylistically, tonally droning and and and build the tension of of the the anticipation, taking a note out of Kubrick's book, which is, like, letting cuts linger just a split second longer than they should. Sure. Like, building up the pace of the cuts, which Kubrick also did in The Shining. Like, the speed at which cuts come starts slowly creeping in. She maybe maybe Ellie overhears, like, a child singing an old nursery rhyme about witches rising on Halloween night.

TC.:

I don't know. Some the the lore needs

Jim:

to You want some more more lore dump before the third act,

TC.:

sprinkled in, like, we see we so it doesn't come out of nowhere. Right? Like, these witches just can't suddenly appear. That's why opening the way I did, classic cold open

Jim:

Uh-huh.

TC.:

Allows the audience to stick around long enough to fulfill that. I know sometimes we complain about it, like, why why tip your hand here? Wait till we're thirty minutes into the movie to go, witches? What? Didn't see that coming.

TC.:

But I I think we we let people know upfront to expect graphic murders.

Jim:

The weird the weirdness? Yeah. I do I do want to note the original Halloween, one of the producers demands when making the movie was that it be bloodless. Mhmm. Mhmm.

Jim:

Or or like minimal blood. That's why there aren't like big blood splatters or anything like that throughout it. It's the same producer on Halloween three and that is why there's no blood in in at least it's my guess. I don't know that for sure.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

But I'm pretty sure that's why. That's why the the robot men bleed butterscotch Yeah. And we don't see any blood otherwise.

TC.:

Yeah. I I I think when we I I like when kills happen after and they're, like, suddenly violent. Like, in where it's like, oh god, I didn't I forgot that this movie's gonna do this kind of thing. Mhmm. So that's not consistently, like, blood, blood, blood, blood, blood, because because you become detoned to it.

TC.:

Mhmm. And so if it's if it's sudden and shocking, then then it has more of an effect of, oh, god. Yeah. Maybe when she, like, hears a kid singing, like a mother, like, hushes it and gets the kid away. Like, dude, don't sing that song.

TC.:

Where did you hear that song? The Internet. She maybe at the brewery. Okay. So, I mean, I'm just gonna keep brainstorming.

Jim:

Yeah. And I'd Thank

TC.:

you for letting me pitch this linearly. I'm just trying to, like I'm just thinking structurally, and this is where my mind is taking.

Jim:

And and that's fine. That's great. I I I do have notes. I have things that I'm gonna wanna either insert or or or possibly You can interrupt me

TC.:

if you want.

Jim:

Yeah. Well. I'll I

TC.:

can keep I can keep

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

Hashing this all out if you want.

Jim:

Well, because so far, honestly, it follows the major beats of the movie we got.

TC.:

Right. We're losing Doctor. Chalice. Yeah. I'm I'm I'm basically, what's going through my head right now is, like, to to honor the reboot and hit the beats, we sometimes talk off mic about, like, did we just say do that but better?

TC.:

Yeah. And I'd and while I'm laying out the structure here, like, out the Yeah. The skeleton of what this this corpse can look like sorry, cadaver? Yes. Okay.

TC.:

I I am aware that I'm hitting the beats that are there. I just don't want it to come off do that but better.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

Having her in the brewery get like, if she snoops in the wrong place and then she's chased by one of those thralls. So we see one of these dudes again. The audience knows what that guy's capable of, and suddenly, unnatural speed and strength, and she just, like, escapes into the woods where she finds an altar or sigils, like, burned in trees. And and then she starts discovering the plot of, like, maybe a sympathetic brewery worker that reveals the truth or that the that the town something that points at this ancient coven that ex that has taken over this town. And maybe even this is the point where she understands that that beer is the elixir, that when when drunk on Halloween, when they activate their their spell, that will lift the veil of the dead and unleash spirits into into human bodies, or or like the whole country.

Jim:

Like, literally the the beer has has prepared the bodies to to take up to take in the the spirits of the dead?

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah. Possibly. Like, that's that's that's a suggestion. Sure.

TC.:

And that, as she tries to like, she's, like, has just that information and tries to flee, but she ends up like, the road just loops back. Like, she can't like, the she finds the gas station, it's boarded up, and the phone her phone dies, and then and the and, like, Santa Mira is sort of a trap in itself. Like, she's caught in the in the spell now. Mhmm. And she can't there's no leaving Santa Mira.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

However the however her father got out, she's not able to break the spell. So now she's trapped here, and oh, yeah. Okay. Like, get getting if she info like, she infiltrates the, like, this the the the the cathedral beneath the brewery. Right?

TC.:

Like, the ritual chamber, and there's vats of, like, glowing beer, and and, like, the harvest idol crowned with antlers or whatever, Samhain Mhmm. Ritualistic stuff. Wicker man stuff, you know? Yeah. The coven chanting and and, like, just inhuman, like, grow like, I'm thinking of, again, like, Rawdal's Witches, like, that first movie, and, like, when the masks come off, they're all, like, ugly.

Jim:

Grotesque. Yeah.

TC.:

Grotesque. Like, so let's get some body horror in here. And the and the witch is just like, hello, Ellie. We see you. They're and they're just feeding off they've been feeding off the hallow like, Halloween for centuries in preparation for this.

TC.:

Their season is about to begin here and now.

Jim:

We are ascendant.

TC.:

This is the we're gonna harvest for mother. Like, mother earth, mother whatever their whatever their totem might be.

Jim:

It's the devil.

TC.:

The devil. They're just gonna erase the boundary between life and death. And and, like, Ellie sees the possessed, and she the town folks are forced to, like, kill each other, like, just getting, like, the bloody like, the the climax of this is reaching so that just having some sort of, like, pyrrhic victory where she blows up the brewery, and it's, like, inflamed at the end, but it doesn't matter because the trucks are already around the country, and people are gonna be partying and drinking those beers at midnight. Okay. There you go.

TC.:

You'll thank you for letting me rattle that off. Yeah. Yeah. But I that's that is that is the the that is my suggestion for a skeleton here. Rip its rip its limbs off.

TC.:

Got some ideas. Let's go, Jim. Rip its limbs off.

Jim:

Alright. So from the beginning, I'm mostly on board. Right? The guy guy comes running out Mhmm. Like, they're gonna kill us all.

Jim:

They're gonna kill us all. Just just like in the movie, And the the guest station attendant can also die. Mhmm. And the daughter shows up. We we meet the daughter because she gets word that her father has died.

Jim:

Mhmm. And she's the next of kin. Like, my father, I haven't heard from him in more than a maybe maybe more than a decade. Right?

TC.:

Sure. He left when I was 16.

Jim:

Old we want her to be. Yeah. But she goes with her boyfriend to see to to identify her her dad, to find out what was going on, finds out some of the information you're talking about. He didn't work at the brewery. Like so because the cops just pretty much straight up said, no.

Jim:

It was this. It's done. There's no investigation. Mhmm. They they don't go to his home or anything like that.

Jim:

They give her the info for her to deal with. And she goes there, and she finds out her dad her dad has been researching this place called Santa Mira. And, like, it's connected to all these things. And and she finds she finds the beer. Like, oh my god, he was an alcoholic.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Through looking around and stuff, no. No. He's he's not drinking any of this.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

He's That's weird. Why isn't he drinking? Like, then looking through the notes, he's marking down like, he's he's marking ingredients like this measured here, unknown ingredients here.

TC.:

Trying to recreate whatever the beer is made of, like, trying to crack the formula.

Jim:

Ultimately, what what she finds out, she may not find out these words, he is a witch hunter.

TC.:

Yeah. Okay.

Jim:

So and so right. What what we don't see, what what eventually will be unraveled is, right, he's he's a witch hunter. He's on to their their plan. He got too close in Santa Mira.

TC.:

Mhmm. He tried to flee.

Jim:

Yeah. And die. They got

TC.:

him. The thralls murdered him.

Jim:

Yeah. So from there from there in in in yours, went to Santa Mira Mhmm. From there?

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Sure. That that could be the case. But her boyfriend doesn't go with it. The reason I even introduced this character is because he is gonna stay in town and look up some other stuff. And so they'll they'll talk about the phone.

Jim:

Hey, I'm finding this out. This is

TC.:

the guy at the computer.

Jim:

Kinda. Yeah. Mhmm. And so, basically, she they they find out the Santa Mira angle. She's like, let's go there.

Jim:

But there there there needs to be another angle for for the boyfriend to follow. It it's that or she hires a private investigator Mhmm. That I figured it'd be better if it was a character. The the characters knew each other. With a relationship.

Jim:

Sure. Sure. Sure. Because he's going to serve a a larger purpose at the end.

TC.:

Okay. Keep it let's keep it simple for now. It's a boyfriend. I I suppose if you wanted to not go the romance angle of it, she has a brother. A brother.

TC.:

Yeah. Who also is like, screw dad. Don't give a crap.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

Yeah. But I'll I'll I'll investigate for you from here.

Jim:

Yeah. So she goes to Santa Mira. My my only problem with that is, like, how many days is she there? Well Maybe it doesn't matter. Maybe maybe maybe she is there for a while.

Jim:

But my portrayal of Santa Mira, I'd I'd actually want it to be like, you're I like what you said, but, like, even a little less. They're they're they're even less inviting. They're they're they're very small town standoffish.

TC.:

Mhmm. Mhmm. When, I traveled during COVID, I did a road trip with, a mutual of ours. Mhmm. And we went north.

Jim:

We went

TC.:

through Montana and why and Yeah. North Dakota, and we would wear our masks because mask mandates. Sure. And the looks we got, just side eyed looks of like, oh, you're an outsider. You're wearing a mask.

Jim:

My initial thought was actually even so so it would be something like that when there are even people. Mhmm. I'm thinking, like, having there be a town that's almost like the town in Barbarian. Mhmm. Not necessarily where the buildings are literally hollowed and burned out.

TC.:

Right.

Jim:

But like

TC.:

Where is everyone?

Jim:

It it's a where is everyone type thing.

TC.:

Sure.

Jim:

Sure. Like, there are storefronts. They all say closed, and maybe if she gets close enough, like, there are things in there but not enough things or not enough of the right things. Mhmm. And as you travel, it'd be one of those things like, oh, all the buildings that are closest to the street, that looks normal enough, albeit closed and no people.

Jim:

Mhmm. But, like, between the as you drive past between buildings, you can see buildings beyond, and those look husked out. Those look look entirely dilapidated. It's all

TC.:

a facade. It's all it's all a veil.

Jim:

It right. And it's it's a really kinda bad one at that. Mhmm. So there's almost no one in this town.

TC.:

So so don't lose your train of thought, but it's just stylistically, tonally, having a character who spends most of the movie alone, there's a lot of silence in this movie.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

That's there there's something that could be built into the stylist movie that it's a very the frighteningness of being alone. Yeah. She's not talking to anyone. Like, oh, god. Like, because we can't have someone muttering to themselves all the time.

Jim:

But Mhmm.

TC.:

Just there's there's something in silence that makes things just unsettling if you do it present in just such a way. But, anyway, continue.

Jim:

And there there might also be a way to have there be some locals that just make themselves very clearly not wanting to be approached.

TC.:

Like the little kids singing in the mob

Jim:

Well, see, I actually no kids.

TC.:

Okay. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Jim:

Well, no. I'm I'm not totally opposed. I'm I'm wanting this town is entirely in thrall Mhmm. To the witches. Yeah.

Jim:

But I guess I'm not fully against the notion that there are some locals that just are quiet and scared and mind their own business.

TC.:

Yeah. Okay.

Jim:

I don't know about a singing kid, though. But the reason I brought the the the buildings behind the buildings, because our character, Ellie, she wants to know what's going on. She can't find anything out. Maybe she even tries approaching the brewery at first, and the guard there's a guard. Yep.

Jim:

He's like, nope. No visitors. Sorry. It's not a thing we do. I know

TC.:

they goes in, and no one ever comes out.

Jim:

Perfect. But she goes, and she she she goes and and and walks through a couple of these weird dilapidated buildings and that's where she starts seeing weird graffiti or sigils or sigils.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Yeah. Things like that. And that start that's what maybe starts happening there. Crap. I thought I had more stuff for the boyfriend to do in between Mhmm.

Jim:

But it really is just a thing for him to basically, he's Ellie never leaves Santa Mira.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

He is our view of what happens on the outside.

TC.:

Great.

Jim:

Yeah. Because the notion was he's following up with as she calls him, like, hey. This is this beer. What's going on with this? Find out.

Jim:

So he's going to, like, local bars and stuff and trying to find out there. I don't know. It's just what everyone wants.

TC.:

And it just keeps showing up

Jim:

too. Like this.

TC.:

Yeah. It just keeps showing up too.

Jim:

Yeah. The the overhead on it is is the cheapest thing ever. We we we

TC.:

I don't even understand how they're making money.

Jim:

On it. Yeah. We can't we can't what?

TC.:

What? You would you said you we can't even keep it.

Jim:

We can't even keep it on the shelves, guys.

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

Because they put it on shelves in bars. But, yeah, that that that kind of thing. So he's finding out, like, whatever whatever her dad was doing is connected. Like, it seems to be freaking everywhere. Mhmm.

Jim:

Mhmm. And Santa Mira, the town, doesn't reflect a town that is making a hot new product.

TC.:

Right. Yeah. Yeah. Good juxtaposition. Okay.

TC.:

I like where you're going.

Jim:

Like, to the point that, like, it there's no way they even have, like, a worker base

TC.:

Right.

Jim:

To run. Like like, maybe she sees I am I'm now imagining almost, like, trying to trying to do the the highway and pet cemetery, just these huge trucks just taking loads and loads of of products Mhmm. Away.

TC.:

Who who this I need to take a tour. I need to see the Sure.

Jim:

Like that.

TC.:

Just getting her to my next plot point was getting her into the tour of the facility, so this sort of

Jim:

motivates her. It was this this was mid second act Yeah. At this point?

TC.:

If we're structurally speaking, yeah, we're, her getting to getting to the the brewery town. Like, yeah, like, getting to the brewery for the tour. Yeah. You're you're looking at mid second act. Yeah.

Jim:

Well, second act is she needs to be denied entirely. Right? So the the town is unfriendly. The brewery pushed her away. The town is pushing her away.

TC.:

If she's chased by one of them thralls

Jim:

Oh, sure. Sure.

TC.:

That gets her fleeing to the woods.

Jim:

She also tries maybe at this point, she tries to leave Santa Mira and finds she can't.

TC.:

Yeah. I think like, in my suggestion of, like what did I say? Sorry. I I I did structure this pretty standardly. Mhmm.

TC.:

So I'm just trying to remember. I had her go to the tour. She's she gets she gets her nose in a place she shouldn't. She's chased by a thrall. She Oh.

TC.:

She's

Jim:

Yeah. Yeah. Perfect.

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah. By by the end of the end of what would be structurally act two is her looping back into Santa Mir so that she can't escape.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

Thanks. So

Jim:

Okay. Yeah. So we don't have to be there yet. She can she can have the tour. She sees something she probably shouldn't have.

Jim:

It it's weird how few employees this place even has.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Right they can write it off like, oh, we had we we we brewed it months we we brewed the last batches we'll need months ago. Mhmm. At at this point, it's just it's all bottled and needs to be shipped out.

TC.:

It's the last of our supply. It's seasonal. This is seasonal anyway. We're we'll we'll be shutting down main manufacturing Yeah.

Jim:

Something like that.

TC.:

At the end of the end of the of the cycle.

Jim:

So that's their that's their justification for why

TC.:

There's no way

Jim:

to no employees there. Crap. I don't I don't know where to plug in the the these these extra bits.

TC.:

Go ahead.

Jim:

But right. So so so that's how she sees then, gets chased out by by a thrall.

TC.:

Right.

Jim:

Ultimately, is rescued by excuse me. A burp.

TC.:

She's rescued by a burp.

Jim:

Yeah. Fizzy lifting drink. Yeah. She she flies away. I said, good day,

TC.:

sir. Okay.

Jim:

By one of the the the CEOs, by by one of the higher ups of the company. Like, oh, no. No. She's she's alright. She's okay.

TC.:

No. She's just a Yeah.

Jim:

That kind of thing. So so then that's sort of how she gets away from from that psychopath. Mhmm. I've done nothing really different from Well,

TC.:

that's okay. You're you're

Jim:

Ultimately crap.

TC.:

Sprinkling on details here.

Jim:

Yeah. I'm I'm running out of steam at a Oh, certain so while she's doing this, he he I wanted him to be researching more of her dad's witch hunter stuff.

TC.:

Mhmm. Uncovering that history.

Jim:

And uncovering how widespread this what whatever he was researching is.

TC.:

This supposed conspiracy theory. And and and believing at first that he's thinking of some tinfoil hat Mhmm. Government black hat kind of stuff. And then, no, I think my dad believed in I think our dad believed in some pretty weird magical stuff here.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

This is this is verging into supernatural territory, and I don't know if I believe it, but he's creating a compelling argument in all these notes.

Jim:

Something like that. Yeah. And then and then all the messages he's getting from Ellie Mhmm. Are sort of weirdly corroborating the weird side of this stuff.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Crap. Yeah. I'm definitely running out of steam.

TC.:

So think So in in I'll

Jim:

just drop the the the couple last bits that I wanna sew.

TC.:

Okay.

Jim:

She doesn't escape or or or she doesn't escape and and and the plan is is going through. But what I wanted to sprinkle throughout was things about her dissatisfaction with her life Mhmm. As is, which having a boyfriend rather than a brother could introduce some more of that strife.

TC.:

She's just a a disenfranchised person who suddenly has, she's launched it's denying the denying the call, the real monomyth stuff here. Yeah. Yeah. It's just like, she doesn't like where a station is life. She denies the call, but she crosses the threshold.

TC.:

She's launched into this She horrific

Jim:

what what we we and she finds out is she is being wooed by these witches.

TC.:

Come Slowly enthralled.

Jim:

Join us. Yes. She's being offered the opportunity to become a witch.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

Because for them, even a a part of it but basically, I I think it would be fun if in the end the idea is she she becomes a witch. She she the movie The Witch Mhmm. And combine it with right? So, yeah, essentially, she she or I guess we could end on a cliffhanger of of does she accept? Because the the plot being the witch hunter got too close Mhmm.

Jim:

And and or they were hunting him right back. And the best way the best revenge against him is to steal her, his daughter.

TC.:

Okay. The I you're yeah. I think you're onto something here. If we consider this a contained film, leaving just a little bit of open endedness for people to walk out and make a, like, I know what's gonna happen next. Like, giving us if she, in the end, can't stop the the the, spell Yeah.

TC.:

From being activated, the veil from being lifted, If she's like, no, no, they're holding her back and she and she's watching the ritual, you know, they're they're chanting, they're chanting, and then, and she's like, start up. And and they, like, let her go and she just stands there helplessly as the is activated. And she's failed, but they still extend a hand to her, like, don't you see? Don't you see what this gives the world now? Fear is real.

TC.:

Join us. Join us. And letting her sit there in that moment of, I I failed. Like, there's no Pyrrhic victory here. She's lost.

TC.:

Yeah. But they're saying, but you can join us and be a part of something really special, and you know you have something special in you. And here's the thing, she's got in for the audience has information she won't have. Because if Ellie is she fails, she watches the spell go off Mhmm. She's like, god, what have I I tried, I tried.

TC.:

It's like, no, no, now be a part of this. If we if we if we create if we craft her character in such a way that she that the audience might go, I think she's gonna accept. Mhmm. But we don't show her take the hand or walk away. Right?

TC.:

The the other element of that, if her brother we'll name him Dan since we can honor doctor Chalice from the original one, mister Chalice. If he finds the information of we're witch hunters. I'm I'm a descendant of witch hunters. Hunters. Ellie and I are a legacy of witch hunters.

TC.:

Not overt. This isn't an adventure movie. If it's just enough information that when he discovers that the the seed is planted with the audience, that when all this thing goes off and we see these blood this blood, these awful murders, and he's watching the fall of society around him as the nation. If the movie ends in such a way that people walk out of the theater and go, you know, if they wanna do a sequel, brother has to fight sister. But we don't we don't cliffhang it like that's an obvious answer.

TC.:

It's just putting that does she choose, and he knows what his purpose is now. There's just you know what I mean? Like, there's just enough for someone to go, oh, so I bet he becomes a witch hunter, and she becomes like queen witch and they have to fight each other. But that's I don't wanna lean too heavily into the adventure of this

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

Instead of just having it sprinkled in so that the horror can come out

Jim:

of it. Rather than I I I tend to lean away from chosen one kind of stuff.

TC.:

Oh, yes. I

Jim:

So rather than

TC.:

That's That's

Jim:

fair. Rather than the witch hunter being a legacy Mhmm. Thing, I would rather like, a part of that character, whether it's boyfriend or brother Mhmm. Part of that character's journey in right? The denial of the call is none of this is real.

Jim:

It's all conspiracy theory. But as he looks deeper, he finds he he could even find other people, other people who are also scared Mhmm. Because they can point to other people who got too close and also died. Yeah. And so he joins a group of witch hunt a a group of witch hunters.

TC.:

Suggested witch hunters. Yes.

Jim:

Not necessarily people brought together by circumstance rather Destiny. Than Yeah.

TC.:

I like that. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm I I in fact, their father being a witch hunter is completely circumstantial. It's not a legacy.

TC.:

He he became one in his research. Yeah. Like, he just chose to hunt witches. So I I'm on board with not chosen one syndrome here.

Jim:

Yeah.

TC.:

Not chosen one storytelling because the the notion of there are no witch hunters left. Our grand our our descendants in Salem were victim to these these evil men who killed them for who they are, but now there are no men like that left in this world. That that line is gone and broken and done with. Any any even if it's remotely in the dialogue, anyone who even thinks they are is a hobbyist. Right?

TC.:

Sure. But the suggestion that season of the witch coming to its fulfillment in the end that the that the witches win.

Jim:

That Mhmm.

TC.:

That hell is unleashed upon us on Halloween night.

Jim:

I would even want, Ellie's invitation. It's not even a come join us. It's a you've already joined us. Just accept that, like, they point to things that have happened throughout. Like, you could only get into Santa Mira if you had If you had if you had done stuff like that.

Jim:

So basically, the whole the right. The notion of looking back and seeing how she had already

TC.:

Done things.

Jim:

Metaphorically signed her name away kind of stuff. Yeah. And so now all that's left is for you to admit it.

TC.:

Yeah. Just say it. Just say it. Yeah. Say I'm a witch.

TC.:

The fun thing in this, is because you you created that we'll call him Daniel character, whether it's boyfriend or brother, that secondary character, we can do two heroes' journeys simultaneously with with the respective beats of Threshold and Calls and dark night of the soul and all those all those standards of monomyth that, construct and, like, layering those next to each other with those crisscross interactions through phone call slash FaceTime, finding a deft way to I know that's on us to we definitely do this. I think we can, and and then we unintentionally or intentionally on your part, honor more of the original that we are rebooting that there is two main characters

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

Instead of just dumb old doctor mister Dan Challis.

Jim:

And then he rescues a robot instead of a person.

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah. And and and having callbacks to the original while severely diverting from it is is a lot of fun too. Removing some of the unnecessary we don't need robots. We don't need Stonehenge.

TC.:

We we'll just make it San Sanway, which is trying to make Halloween matter again.

Jim:

Make Halloween matter again. Oh, I I don't want, like, a a secret temple, like Oh, yeah. Underneath.

TC.:

I had suggested that. Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

Yeah. What what I think would be cool is it literally is the brewery, and maybe on the tour, maybe a part of where she a part of what she stumbles across is a thing they hadn't a part they hadn't cleaned up Mhmm. Yet or some a bit. But, like, I I have this image in my head of them of that sort of the final ritual, the finalization. We see the the blasphemous oh, crap.

Jim:

What's the word? Process the blasphemous procession Mhmm. Making their way through the clean brewery, and they're doing stuff like splattering blood here and there, making marks on things.

TC.:

Wiping their hands. Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

And and and basically, right, profanely def defacing Mhmm. The things in their ritualistic manner.

TC.:

Just desecrating just desecrating, like, all this.

Jim:

Yeah. Yeah. Like, right, all the way through, this is I guess this would be more symbolic since they've already distributed the beer. But, like, walking along the catwalk and throwing ingredients, like like, blood and dead cats or whatever into into vats.

TC.:

A pumpkin, a skull, and a a a a A warm sweater. No. I'm trying to think of the three masks, the three masks from

Jim:

the movie. A witch a witch's face?

TC.:

Yeah. A witch's face. Yeah. Yeah. Do let's oh, wow.

TC.:

Okay. I we we actually found found our way through this.

Jim:

One question I have for you is, what are the Thralls? Where are they from?

TC.:

The Thralls are the people from this town that they've

Jim:

Okay.

TC.:

They've they've taken over, that the people of this town that are are the face of that the only faces necessary for anybody who might pass through and ask questions are still out front, like, the front facing people, but the rest of these thralls are, like, the strongest people that they could control to become. Maybe they're the actual workers of the brewery that used to be there. This big strong men that used to and women that used to operate this brewery.

Jim:

How do we portray that?

TC.:

That they are big strong men?

Jim:

No. That that that's who these the because you you portrayed them not as people in thrall.

TC.:

Yeah.

Jim:

You portrayed them almost as, like, summoned homunculi.

TC.:

Yeah. I'm gonna I'm gonna walk that back. I think Okay. What we could do to to if even if it's never said, we can imply it through, costume design. They're wearing the jumpsuits with their name tags on them.

TC.:

They're wearing the the the uniforms of the factory workers of the brewery.

Jim:

We could actually have a fun I'll I'm gonna say it's fun. We could have a a fun exposition dump Ellie could encounter. There's gotta be a name for the archetype. It's it's the harbinger when it's the bad guy when it's the bad guy's person warning the characters not to go somewhere. But there there's another character.

Jim:

It's often the town drunk in this movie. It's the If drunk or the

TC.:

you're if you're looking at archetypes, it would be the herald.

Jim:

Okay. The herald. So Yep. I think we could have a herald somewhere in the town that Ellie encounters, and he says stuff like, the people aren't the same anymore. Mhmm.

Jim:

I'm not gonna be one of them. Yeah. I don't I don't drink I don't drink what they're selling.

TC.:

I don't drink silver drinks. Rock.

Jim:

And what does he drink? What what gross thing? I just drink straight gasoline. Got any gasoline?

TC.:

Just rubbing alcohol. Yeah. It's, it's

Jim:

But where would he get it? Because he's also trapped in town.

TC.:

Mhmm. He could be he could be I suppose there's always the opening for us to have people you would suggest that people who just, like, keep calm and carry on that didn't need

Jim:

to be there are there are scared Yeah.

TC.:

Townsfolk? They are complicit complicit participants who are like, you don't have to enthrall me. I won't say shit. So that there there are people numerous people in the town that are just don't ask questions. I keep my head down.

Jim:

Mhmm. They leave

TC.:

me alone. They let they won't touch my family if I just let them do what they're doing, and then they'll be gone by Halloween. I just I don't want it. I don't I don't don't don't that's I don't know about that. And so then having the the having a town drunk at the bar who's like, who can expo dump a little bit of a little bit of information.

Jim:

Okay. Sure.

TC.:

It could be something there. Yes. The the last little bit I wanna talk is just homage in the masks at all. Like, do we want do we want any sort of reference to the masks being, like, the three types of beers? Like, if they have a a pumpkin, a shamrock, like a green beer, an orange beer, and a white beer.

TC.:

Like, like, it it because it's, like Sure. Halloween themed. Like Yeah. It could be as simple as that. Like, the designs are the three masks.

TC.:

Mhmm. But now, it's it's booze, which kinda goes to what I had suggested much earlier about, like, the targets of this are people 21 and older or adults young adults out there partying, not children.

Jim:

Is it is it too hokey to say that the beer the this seasonal beer is season of the witch?

TC.:

Oh, that's that the beer

Jim:

called Shamrock season

TC.:

of Shamrock season of the witch. That maybe maybe not. It it really is all an execution.

Jim:

Also, we'd Silver Shamrock technique if we are going to make these witches Salem witches Mhmm. I don't know how important the the the Silver Shamrock is really just there to be an homage to the original movie.

TC.:

Sure. But they could be the Salem witches could have been a coven that came from Ireland, that came from the old world to the new world and then lost. That they fled to the old the new world and were chased by witch hunters. We could create a a mythology of that, that they started in Ireland, that they were a a coven in Ireland.

Jim:

We

TC.:

could. We could. But will we? He thinks staring off into the middle distance.

Jim:

I'm not gonna decide tonight.

TC.:

Okay. We don't have to. Okay.

Jim:

But because there there was a point where I was mulling over the the idea because, right, we're sticking with Santa Mira, and thus we're probably sticking with Southern California. Mhmm. The idea of somehow even connecting this witch coven to Brujah.

TC.:

Please elaborate.

Jim:

Brujah is basically my understanding of it, and I'm sure it's ham fisted and and colonialist. Mhmm. Bruja is basically Spanish for witch. Okay. The They're not always bad the way the way European slash Western Mhmm.

Jim:

Which is nor you usually are. I Brujah, I think, can also just sort of be like what's what's the term? Like like like a not a not a medicine

TC.:

woman. Shaman. Witch doctor.

Jim:

It's witch.

TC.:

It's a witch. It's a witch.

Jim:

But but it's not automatically evil connotation. They they they do folk folk magic.

TC.:

Medicine medicine women Yeah. Kind of thing. Now, you you are right that if we go with Santa Santa Mira, does suggest Mexican former Mexican occupied, Spanish occupied Southern California, and that's fine. It could be that. But if if it's Saint Mira, it could be East Coast, especially, two two pitches in a row that we play in the Bayou, that we play in the Gulf Of Mexico, area.

TC.:

We that we, sensitively, with the with with respect and to help people understand it, witch doctors of voodoo origin

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

We could be playing in Haitian witches and Caribbean witches.

Jim:

We could play in our own backyard. We could put it in Wisconsin, home of the microbrew. I don't know that there's microbrews everywhere, but there's a lot of beers in Wisconsin.

TC.:

It's And

Jim:

we could just make it Saint Mary's.

TC.:

It's Saint Mary's. It could be on Lake Michigan?

Jim:

Yeah.

TC.:

Hell, yeah. It's three different styles of movie. It's Southern California, Lake Michigan, Wisconsin, or or Michigan.

Jim:

What are you putting in the beer?

TC.:

Hey. Okay. Alright. Listen. Okay?

TC.:

We got a whole it's Coven, mom. It's Coven. It's Coven. Yeah. Or Which is Coven.

TC.:

Or which is

Jim:

Coven sounds stupid. It rhymes with oven.

TC.:

Nod to our Wisconsin filmmaking brother in right there. Yep. Yeah. I think, that it just offers us a different style of witchcraft if we but I think if if it's we I think we stick with silver shamrock. I think that we we we keep the the coven rooted in Okay.

TC.:

Saint Patrick trying to kill Halloween. I think it's so funny. That's a good way to put it. But, yeah, coming to that conclusion of watching the the bloodshed, watching the the witches win.

Jim:

Oh, other fun details on the tour, the the tour guide is explaining the origin of their name and all this stuff like, their recipes actually, a lot of beer recipes, derived from from the monks who lived in the the The Alps and and and stuff like that. Our beer, our beers recipe actually, derives from the the The Druids. The the hills. Yeah. It's it's it's druidic Yeah.

Jim:

Recipe. Rooting. Even older even older than most monastic peers.

TC.:

Mhmm. Very well put. Yeah. I think if we lean heavily into the the shocking and sudden bloody deaths in this and then slowly pace ourselves into the silence and the the building tension and fear.

Jim:

I would I would cite there's a handful of movies that I would cite for honestly, I'd I'd I would look heavily at the witch. Mhmm. I'm sorry. A lot everyone refers to it. The Vivich.

TC.:

The Vivich. Dublevee.

Jim:

I I really I really like that movie.

TC.:

It's a

Jim:

great movie. Yeah. It's it's a part of why I can't ever truly write off.

TC.:

Right. Robert Eggers.

Jim:

Oh, that's Robert Eggers?

TC.:

Isn't it?

Jim:

Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry. I was thinking it r it was Ari Aster. It's probably Robert Eggers. That makes more sense.

Jim:

I can't write I can't write him off. I love him. I I think the Northman was the most disappointing one of his to me so far, and I still really like that.

TC.:

Yeah. It's it's Robert Eggers. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

Jim:

Even better. Good. I don't have to

TC.:

Bend over backwards and twist yourself into a pretzel.

Jim:

To say I like Ari Aster. Yeah. But I do. I like Hereditary.

TC.:

Yes.

Jim:

It's just nothing else.

TC.:

Yeah. That totally looking.

Jim:

That Yeah. From Zach Zach Craiger's movies. Mhmm. He he has a tone and a visual style that I'd like and would want to Replicate. Invoke here.

TC.:

Jordan Peele as well is

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

A director. Yeah. So, yeah. That's the idea. Certainly, we've suggested things that sound silly in in just saying them, but in execution, getting them down, creating the right tone.

TC.:

Yeah. I think that there's there's some steam here or some fizzy here. I think I have to ask Eminem now how we did over at Azul Studios. How did we do? Okay.

TC.:

I I think we we did do that thing that I suggested of, like, just do the thing that you did, but better. But the purpose of x y z, of getting from here to here to here

Jim:

Well, we we did change a bunch of things as well. We change

TC.:

making it easier.

Jim:

Necessarily for the we we maybe not necessarily for the better. It might just be same but different Mhmm. Or different but same.

TC.:

But ultimately, that's up to the studio to decide.

Jim:

Yeah. Right? Because because what we I I feel like what we tried doing here, what they did there, chalice was witness to what they were doing and they tried explaining both at the same time, which was this is what you are getting you are falling down this rabbit hole deeper Mhmm. Of what we're doing to the greater outside world. Mhmm.

Jim:

And if and and you are the the more you learn, the deeper you have to get, the harder it's gonna be for you to change Yeah. What happens.

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

And and and it that's really hard to that's actually really hard to a lot of that's hard to convey.

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

That's hard to act. There there there's a there's a lot of reasons that's a a really hard way to go by splitting it in two characters. And and and instead having Ellie's journey of of learning more about all of this happening, actually being her descent into being complicit

TC.:

Right.

Jim:

I think is more compelling. Yeah. And having Dan. Dan be the one outside finding out how insidious this thing is and how how far spread it is.

TC.:

And even just getting to see the climax of this in a bar. Yeah. Like, if he even, like, gives up, but he can't get in touch with his sister, and he goes to just drink. And he's like, I I failed her. What?

TC.:

I don't know. And then when the spell is activated, looking around the bar, and suddenly a fight breaks out, and people are killing each other in front of me. He's like, oh god, oh god, oh god. Like, even if he's like Something like that. Even if he's like, the he has shamrock silver shamrock beer in his hand.

TC.:

It's like on his lips as it happens, so he doesn't imbibe it.

Jim:

You know, actually, what I was because we actually just watched Marvel Zombies.

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

And there's a character who who because I I don't wanna spoil yet another thing.

TC.:

Sure. Sure.

Jim:

Sure.

TC.:

Keep it

Jim:

keep it close. Keep it vague. A a character unwittingly eats some stuff Mhmm. That infects them. That that's actually

TC.:

Yeah. Yeah. That's the the easy way to put It

Jim:

probably spoils it once that scene comes up, but yeah.

TC.:

It's all good.

Jim:

Even even having that, like, things start going wrong and, like, he's like, oh, no. I gotta get out of here, and then his gut starts twisting. Why didn't I try? Why didn't I try the season of the witch?

TC.:

I I like the idea that he stays free of it,

Jim:

and Okay.

TC.:

And then he bears witness to the the insanity that happens before him. So but Eminem, how did we do? I we you gotta let us know if we hit your demand today. You can hit us up if you agree with what we did. Disagree does the does the studio greenlight this pitch?

TC.:

Let us know. If especially if we missed anything. Whatever. Oh.

Jim:

Yeah. I thought of some stuff to to discuss to keep the episode going. Do we do what season of the witch did, which is have a a what do you call it? A Easter egg

TC.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

That shows Halloween and Halloween to Michael Myers and Laurie Strode as being fiction in this world, or do we do an Easter egg that acknowledges that they exist in this world?

TC.:

The

Jim:

Or do we or do we do nothing?

TC.:

Do we

Jim:

do none of that?

TC.:

I don't wanna do either. I I think any if we're gonna put anything on a TV to reference anything, it'll be the original season of the witch hidden in the background. So that's it. But I don't want any. I I wanna find a way to do this with a you know, well, we can put a Michael Myers in the background.

TC.:

We'll put the original Halloween on a TV in the background. But canonizing it in the same world, that is too complicated Okay. To be like, suddenly, Laurie Strode exists in a world where witches took over. That's weird.

Jim:

I mean, American Horror Story essentially did that with their their series, their franchise.

TC.:

Witches took over? Oh, no. They crossed over. We don't have to have

Jim:

memory card. Over all of their seasons. Yeah. And they the season there's a season about witches. Uh-huh.

Jim:

And they play a pivotal role in the season, which is the apocalypse, the end of the world.

TC.:

Okay. You can message us directly at I'm dismissing you.

Jim:

That's no. That's fine. I was done. Yeah.

TC.:

Okay. You can message us which took me over. You can message us directly at studiodemandsit dot com or on Instagram studiodemandsit. If you're not already subscribed to us on your podcast listener platform of your choice, and if you feel like giving us a review, that certainly helps us get out into the algorithm. You can also find us on YouTube and TikTok, where we post videos that include material not heard here on the show.

Jim:

Jim. You can join us you can join the discussion over on Reddit at our subreddit of r/studiodemandsit, or join us on Discord by going to our website studiodemandsit.com and clicking on the, server invitation link, at the top of the web page.

TC.:

And now is certainly the time to do that because we are, as said, approaching the finale

Jim:

Voting season.

TC.:

And voting season has started, and that's certainly a place to start campaigning, get your work, get your oh, and I nearly dropped my mic there.

Jim:

Campaigning. Campaigning for our movies.

TC.:

And if you want even more stuff, we have a Patreon for a couple bucks a month. You can get episodes early, commercial free, extended double length episodes, movie commentary tracks. We, you can, you can also show some love by subscribing to Patreon for free. And it doesn't cost you anything. You just click on it and there you go.

TC.:

A massive thank you to Six Five Media. David will be joining us very soon Woo hoo. For our annual crossover with AZP. Thank you to Six Five Media for everything they do, so please check out some other of those shows. And Jim, unless you have anything else.

Jim:

I don't think I do.

TC.:

Alright. That's gonna be it for this episode. Trick or treat, everyone stay safe out there this Halloween season. Watch out for Witches Brew. Right?

TC.:

Yep. Alright. Okay. We'll be back again soon with another one of your demands. At least one more episode of this of our mainline season to challenge ourselves to take on cinema.

TC.:

I'm TC.

Jim:

Ten more days till Halloween. Ten more days. I I already forgot how it goes.

TC.:

Halloween. Halloween.

Jim:

But they they did repeat it. Okay.

TC.:

Halloween. Silver

Jim:

Shimrock. There you go. There you go. There you go.