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Dr Dee Dee Mayer is the RelateStrong Director for the Boone Center for the Family at Pepperdine University . She also continues to serve families and couples as a Licensed Clinical Social Worker (LCSW) through both in-person counseling and telehealth at Restoring Hope Therapy in Westlake Village, CA. She spent over 12 years at Oaks Christian School serving in various roles including Associate Head of School for Spiritual Life and Social Emotional Learning.
She is a published author, radio personality, former television co-host and sought after public speaker.
Dee Dee holds a masters degree in Social Work from California State University, Long Beach and a Doctorate in Ministry degree from Azusa Pacific University. Dee Dee has been married to Albert for 27 years and together they have three adult children.
Most importantly, she loves the Lord and leading families, couples, and all people to the abundant life for which we are all designed!
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The Boone Center for the Family helps communities within churches, academic institutions and Christian organizations by providing programs and training to empower the communities' leaders. We are lucky enough to have our programs underwritten by generous donations and grants, allowing us to offer them at a cost making them accessible to the widest possible audience.
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Purchase John's Book:
Mephibosheth! The Search for Identity, Purpose, and Community
She is a published author, radio personality, former television co-host and sought after public speaker.
Dee Dee holds a masters degree in Social Work from California State University, Long Beach and a Doctorate in Ministry degree from Azusa Pacific University. Dee Dee has been married to Albert for 27 years and together they have three adult children.
Most importantly, she loves the Lord and leading families, couples, and all people to the abundant life for which we are all designed!
--
The Boone Center for the Family helps communities within churches, academic institutions and Christian organizations by providing programs and training to empower the communities' leaders. We are lucky enough to have our programs underwritten by generous donations and grants, allowing us to offer them at a cost making them accessible to the widest possible audience.
--
Purchase John's Book:
Mephibosheth! The Search for Identity, Purpose, and Community
Purchase the You Can Mentor book:
You Can Mentor: How to Impact Your Community, Fulfill the Great Commission, and Break Generational Curses
youcanmentor.com
Creators and Guests
What is You Can Mentor: A Christian Youth Mentoring Podcast?
You Can Mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders through resources and relationships to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. We want to see Christian mentors thrive.
We want to hear from you! Send any mentoring questions to hello@youcanmentor.com, and we'll answer them on our podcast. We want to help you become the best possible mentor you can be. Also, if you are a mentoring organization, church, or non-profit, connect with us to join our mentoring network or to be spotlighted on our show.
Please find out more at www.youcanmentor.com or find us on social media. You will find more resources on our website to help equip and encourage mentors. We have downloadable resources, cohort opportunities, and an opportunity to build relationships with other Christian mentoring leaders.
You can mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. Learn more at you can mentor.com or follow us on social media. You can mentor. Why hello there mentor. We here at You Can Mentor hope to add as much value as we can to mentors and mentoring organizations through resources and relationships.
Zach:We have a bunch of resource that we've created to support you, such as books, learning lab cohorts, conferences, and online downloadable resources. Our goal is for you to use these resources yourself or to share them with your volunteers. The best way to get access to all of these resources is to sign up for our once a week newsletter. To do that, head on over to our website, you can mentor.com and give us your info. Thanks so much.
Zach:And remember, you can mentor. Welcome to the You Can Mentor podcast. This is your favorite host, Zach, along with doctor Didi Meyer. Doctor Meyer, say hello.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Hi, everyone. Nice to be here.
Zach:Doctor Meyer is the director of the Relate Strong program of the Boone Center For the Family at Pepperdine University. She's a licensed clinical social worker in California. In addition, Meyer has a doctor in ministry from Isuzu Pacific University. She has over 20 years of experience providing leadership and program management in academic and community health environments. Miss Didi formally served as a cohost for the Movie God TV.
Zach:Okay. It's awesome. She's passionate about Jesus, which is always a good thing, and his church to support leaders and congregations in developing strong and healthy relationships, which is music to my ears. She is a published author, regular guest on national radio programs, and a sought after public speaker. Doctor Meyer, how's it going today?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:It's going great. Thank you for that nice introduction.
Zach:Of course. So what's this about a cohost for Movie Guide TV? I wanna hear more about this.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. I got the privilege of working with a gentleman by the name of Ted Baer who was passionate about working on our media to give good messages. And so I got to be his cohost for a few years and talk about what we need to be concerned about and what we need to be excited about in our immediate choices. So it was really fun to get to do that and get to go to a lot of films and meet people and have good conversations. It was fun.
Zach:Well, so here on our podcast, we actually have a segment. It's called mentoring at the movies, and we watch different films, and we kinda talk about how the characters build relationships with each other. So so that's awesome. Yeah. For sure.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. Learning how to view media is powerful.
Zach:It's a big deal. 100%. Okay. So I I met doctor Meyer through a connection that we have just talking about people who grew up without without a father figure or anyone who has certain kind of wounds, which that's myself and everything she said, I was just like, oh my gosh, she, she, she knows what she's talking about. This is, it is almost like everything that I had in my mind and couldn't say because, you know, I'm just, you know, I'm just not quite there yet, was said by you.
Zach:And so it was fantastic.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Well, thank you. We're all on a journey. Right? And we all have our stories and and we're all on a path of growing. So we're just each at different places Yeah.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:On that road.
Zach:For sure. Well, why don't you introduce yourself and just kinda tell us who you are and how you wound up in this space?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. Thanks for asking. Gosh. I grew up in a family of 8, so I kinda grew up in a litter. There's 5 brothers and 2 sisters.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I'm the only girl in the midst of 5 brothers. My 2 sisters came a lot later, and I grew up in big family, lot of anger issues, lot of addiction in my house, lost my mom to addiction when I was 17 years old, so became a mom pretty early in my life. And so, really, my journey towards healing was looking at I knew there had to be something more. I knew there had to be a pathway out of what I had been shown growing up. And so that kinda sent me on a journey into studying psych and getting my degree in social work, but more importantly, my relationship with Jesus as the great healer and looking at the power of relationships both to do damage and also to transform and change us from the inside out.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And, predominantly, the relationship god offers us and the identity he gives us and the safety that he can provide in the midst of a world that doesn't feel safe at times. So really sent me on a journey of of being a voice of healing, a voice that helped that got into the conversation, and that led me to lots of different things. 1st, a private practice for a number of years, then god called me into ministering and helping families learn how to stay connected with their children in meaningful and helpful ways, looking at stages of development, looking at rights of passage, looking at all those things, and then I ended up at a school. And now I'm here at the Relate Strong program at Pepperdine getting to share this amazing resource around the nation. Really great framework for understanding the pains that guide our decision making and how we don't have to be led by him anymore.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so it's been really fun to step in and just be a part of that journey.
Zach:That's awesome. I I just love how the lord can take the pain that we have experienced in our lives and somehow create it, change our hearts, and help us help people who have experienced the same things that we did.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Absolutely. Yeah. I I love that too. I we we man, when you're given help, a hand up to learn how not to be led by pain, it is amazing what we can do with it, and it is energizing and empowering to not be under its vices anymore.
Zach:So I got a email from you a couple months ago, and I was just, you know, going about my day, checking checking my email. Everything was great. And I stumbled upon this cycle called the pain and peace cycle. And it was a PDF, And I got lost in it for about 2 and a half hours. I mean, I just I just kept reading it over and over, and I was like, oh my gosh.
Zach:This is this is mind blowing. So do you mind just kinda sharing what is what is the pain and peace cycle?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Absolutely. So the pain and peace cycle come from a model of therapy, a theoretical approach called restoration therapy. And here's the reality. I don't I've never met somebody that doesn't have a story of pain in their lives. Pain's an equalizer.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:It doesn't matter who you are. It doesn't matter where you were born. We've all experienced pain, and that pain can cause us to to move towards a variety of reactions. It affects our life, and it affects our relationship. And it really starts with understanding what our core needs are.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:So in the world that we're living in, we have 2 very core needs. We need to be loved, and love informs a sense of self, a sense of identity. And when I'm loved, I know that I have a value and a worth. It's an inherent worth and a value in my being. I don't have to do anything for it.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:It's just inherently there, and that's predominantly demonstrated in in sacrificial love. Like, there's no greater miss message of worth and value and love than someone sacrificing for me. So worthy of love. I'm worthy, and I'm inherently valuable. The The second thing I need to have a strong identity is I need to have a sense of purpose.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:There's a purpose behind. I have something to offer. Right? I'm unique and I'm special and I have something to bring to the table. And the third thing that we need in developing healthy sense of identity is we need to feel like we belong somewhere.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:We have an attachment and a connection to other people. The second core need that we have is we need to feel like we could a sense of trustworthiness in the world around us, and that informs our sense of feeling safe and secure in the world. And to feel safe and secure in the world, we need to know that the world is reliable, that I can when I show up, I can know what to expect, and and it's consistent. Right? So if I if I'm worried about how I'm gonna show up, I know I grew up in an alcoholic home.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I knew I I learned how to tell the signs of whether I was gonna be unsafe or or safe by little things that you would see. When my mom would show up late, I knew, oh, she was probably drinking. So that tells me I I can't rely on things around me. Second thing I need is I need openness and honesty, transparency. I need to know that when you're telling me something, you're telling me the truth.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And then I also need a balance of give and take. This is kind of a justice, right, that there's a balance. There's a negotiation that happens where there's an ease of give and take in our relationship, and that informs our I can develop a strong sense of identity and security in the world, and I approach the world very differently. But none of us get those. None of us come from perfect environments, and you don't have to watch the news for very long to know that we don't necessarily always live in safe environments.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And when we experience those violations, it sends us into a process of coping responses. And what we would say is that we fall into 4 different categories of coping. That we either blame other people, that's where anger and that's kind of, the big way I like to think about it is, it's your fault. You're the problem. Right?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:So all of my behaviors and reactions, whether it's rage, whether it's acting out, are connected to you're the problem. We could also shame, and that's why I'm the problem. If I were different, then maybe I wouldn't be in this situation that I'm in. Another way we we might cope is by controlling our environments. This was one of my favorites.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:If I don't feel safe, then I can start to control everything around me, and then I'll start to feel a little bit better. Right? And criticism, anxiety really flourishes in control. And the last one's escape. I can tap out.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:We see all addictions fall into this category, and what you'll notice is these are neurological fight or flight response. And I think one of the powerful things about the pain and peace cycle is it takes our neurology into account that when you've grown up in an environment where you don't have a healthy sense of identity or a healthy sense of safety, that our brain actually develops pathways of reactions and responses. And these are our natural responses that we begin to learn are the ways that we can stay secure and safe. And so our pain is driven by experiences that we've had that impact our view of ourself and our sense of safety, and we choose some of those coping reactions. Right?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Right? Let me give you an example. K? I'll give you a quick testimony and example if that's okay. Is that okay?
Zach:Oh,
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:yeah. Alright. And And are you with me so far, or do I need to change anything?
Zach:Oh my gosh. I am over here, like, having, like, a I'm just like yeah. I don't know if she's talking right to me because I can't help but just think about my childhood. And I didn't know if I was loved. I for sure didn't have a purpose because I didn't feel like anyone cared about me.
Zach:I didn't feel like I had a spot to belong because I didn't really have a healthy family. I knew nothing about consistency. I couldn't rely on anyone. Everyone pretended like everything was okay.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:You're you're describing my childhood.
Zach:And mine. Oh, my gosh. We are. Yeah. And then then as I grew older, I tossed everything on my father, and I was so angry at him.
Zach:And I I was so bitter. But deep down, even though on the outside, I looked like I had everything together, inside, I was filled with so much shame. 100%. And then just being totally honest, as I get married and as I have kids, when things get chaotic, I control. I, like, I I get the sharp tone.
Zach:I you stop doing that. And and then whenever the kids are in bed, I escape. I just turn on the TV and just numb out. So
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Absolutely. And when you look at the story you just told about your upbringing, don't all of those responses make sense?
Zach:100%.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. And so I'm a 4 r too. I like I dance in all 4 categories. My favorite is probably control, but but, you know, I I I excel at all 4.
Zach:Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so, you know, when you grow up with messages, my core messages that I that I learned about my pain were essentially that I'm unseen. Right? I I have a a quick story. So after my mom died, I'm 17 years old. I have 3 siblings that are 7, 5, and 3.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so I take them because I wanna go get makeup for prom. Right? So I take them to the store because I'm gonna go buy some makeup at the makeup counter in one of the big department stores. And my kids had just lost a mom. My brothers and sisters had just lost a mom.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so guess what they're calling
Zach:me? Mom. Mom.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. Oh, yeah. So I get to the makeup counter as a 17 year old with 3 kids calling me mom. You can imagine
Zach:how
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I was treated. In fact, I never got served. They just avoided me, didn't give me eye contact other than to look really I mean, I was very clear what they thought of me from that get go. And so that really taught me. Like, I'm unseen.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I felt unsafe in the world around me, totally out of control, and unworthy of love. And so to respond to that, I learned that if I can control my environment, that I could keep not only myself safe, but I could keep my brothers and sisters safe. And so I learned to be a big protector. Now here's the problem with that. As a protector, gosh, and a controller, it's really hard to live with me.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Right? Nobody can have a good idea but but me. And if you don't do it my way, I don't feel safe, so I'm reacting really big. I get I get critical. The other thing is I learned when I was unseen, if I if I could just perform, then maybe you might see me so I could earn a little bit of love and attention from you.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so I perform to exhaustion. Like, I'll just drive, drive, drive. And that's hard for not only me, but it's hard for anybody around me. So you can see that in our pain cycle, not only do we have the pains that drive our responses, we have our responses. And when people wouldn't get into line, I could lash out or I could easily tap out of the relationship.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so others' reactions to me were to get angry, were to get frustrated, or were to, like, let go and let me handle everything, which made me feel unsafe, unworthy of love, and unseen all the more. Right? So our pain begets pain begets pain, and these behaviors that we have learned to cope with our pain actually drive us into more and more pain in our life and in our relationships and feed more into the false messages. So the peace cycle comes when we're able to recognize our key pain words. And one of the things that's different about our cycle is, like, anger is something we do.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Our core pain is attached to our sense of self and our sense of safety in the world around us. Anger is a reaction to that. It's not a core part of who we are. So when we can begin to understand the core pains that are the drivers of our behavior, we can replace those with truths that correct those false ideas about our own sense of safety in the world and our own sense of identity. And so and we get that from 3 main sources.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Right? So our truth our first goal in setting up our peace cycle is to recognize a truth that corrects my pain words. So unworthy. Right? My pain word is unworthy.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I know that that's not true, and I know that that's not true because I have a husband and a family who deeply love me and they deeply know me. Right? Safety is a harder one because the truth of the matter is sometimes we're not safe. Right? And the truth of the matter is sometimes we make mistakes.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:So even in our identity, anything that we say, our truth has to be a real truth that fits all of reality. So I can't say I'm safe. I have to have something. So for me, an answer to that is I don't have all the power, but I have some power, and some power is enough. For some people is I I it it would be I'm safe in God's economy.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:But we've gotta find words that are actually true, and I we get three sources of truth. God is first. What we believe about who he is and what he says about us, that's first. The second would be other people, so like a mentor in your organization. Like, that's what we were hope that there's a voice of truth.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:But the most important, even though it's not the most authoritative, is us. Right? Because I have the power to veto any message that it comes from anywhere, whether it's god or a or a mentor. And we experience that in mentoring relationships all the time as we're trying to say, no. You have so much value.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:But if we don't believe it, none of that matters. Right? So part of getting the truth words is having a truth big enough to battle the lies that we have believed and that we have attached to our sense of identity and that we're learning to cope with in a bad way. So when I can be when I can rest in, I'm loved, I'm deeply known, and I am I I don't have all the power, but I have some power. I can step in, and instead of performing to exhaustion, I can have a balance of give and take.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I can trust a team to come up with some strategies, and I can set a realistic goal and expectation and set some realistic boundaries over how much I'm working. My husband can actually do something right. Right? I don't I'm not perfectionistic. I'm not lashing out.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And when I do that, what do you think? How do people respond to me?
Zach:Not good. Right? Whenever you're
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Well, when I'm doing when I'm when I'm giving and taking, when I'm balancing, when I'm not critical, when I'm nurturing other people.
Zach:Oh, it's it's a it's amazing. It is like, who is this new person? And, like, oh my gosh. They are they are a new being almost.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. And that's what this is. This is this is founded on the principles of Ephesians and Colossians that are like, take off that old self. It's got nothing good for you, but here's how you can put on a new self. Here's a strategy and a tactic to be able to put on something new that is actually built on the truth of your secure identity in Christ and your sense of safety that you even though we're we live in this broken world, we can be an agent of powerful influence and change.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:We're not stuck. So it's a really powerful tool of transformation.
Zach:Well and I think this is what's so amazing as mentors is we get to experience these kids, specifically kids from hard places, and we get them in kinda all all of their junk. Right? Like, they have experienced hardships. They have experienced pain. They don't know they're safe.
Zach:They don't know that they're loved. They they don't know that they belong. And so we get to kinda feel them pointing blame. We get to see them walk in shame. We get to see them try to perform their way in in into love.
Zach:But we get to be the truth speakers. Right?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Absolutely.
Zach:And the thing that I love about mentors is we can point them to God. We can introduce them to God and say, hey. Here here's what God says about you. And it's different from what you think. It's different from what this world thinks.
Zach:And then we ourselves can use the words, hey, you're doing a great job. You have value. You have worth. I like being with you. You have a spot at my table.
Zach:And then we get to give them the tools or introduce them to people who can give them what they need to change their self talk.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. Absolutely.
Zach:And we can do all of that in a in an environment where they feel loved, where they feel known, and where they can, while this may take time, but where they can trust us.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Oh, yeah.
Zach:Oh, man. This is good. Yeah. Okay. So so I wanna focus in on we experience a mentee who has pain.
Zach:We get to become those people in their life who speak truth over them. But I wanna spend a couple of minutes and just talk about environment. So for me early on, it was really hard for me not to judge my mentee. And it was really hard for me, out of my fear, to create an environment where they truly did feel safe. And so can you just kinda speak kinda on that for a second?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. I'll do my best. Great. Thanks. Yeah.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Well, one of the things I love about the work that we do is that it's self regulatory. The a lot of things that we do out there are coregulatory, and now let me explain what I mean by that. When we emotionally regulate, it's creating consistency regardless of the emotional dynamics that are around us. Right? I can stay girded in my values.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I can stay girded and connected in the midst of disruption to that. So my being okay isn't dependent on how you're responding. Does that make sense so far?
Zach:Yeah. It's that book by Edwin Friedman.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Failure of nerve. Failure of nerve. Differentiation.
Zach:Oh, yeah. Big time.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Come on. I love that. It's one of my favorite books.
Zach:Yeah. So how how to stay a nonanxious presence?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Presence. Yeah. Present, but not connected. Okay. And so I think that's one of the hardest things to do as a mentor.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And when we're starting to go in our minds in a place of judgment, I think taking the time to be self aware and recognize and starting to ask the questions. What's getting activated in me? One important thing that I think, especially when working with young people, is most relationships in our lives are kinda horizontal and have to have a balance of give and take. Right? Almost every relationship in the world, whether it's business, if you don't have a good balance in of give and take, you have destructive entitlements, you have resentment that that builds, you have all these other things that happen.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:The only relationships in the world around us that don't have a balance of give and take are parent child, mentee, mentor. So being aware of my expectations, what expectation am I putting? What am I doing as I jump into this mentee relationship? And holding that in check is really important Because we're what we're trying to invest in the young people that we're working with is a sense of identity and a sense of safety that they haven't gotten when they should have. As parents, we're throwing love.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:We're saying you are the apple. You are so special. You have so much purpose. You belong in this space. Right?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:You you have inherent value. I see this in you, but it's not reciprocated. We're giving it to them so that one day we'll stop the legacy of that not happening. They'll be able to give out of what they have. See, you and me, we have to create and give out of what we didn't get.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:So what we're trying to stop as mentors is that cycle and to create a sense of safety and security in their environment. Can I be a reliable presence for them? Am I being open and authentic? What they can receive and and give me. Does that make sense so far?
Zach:Oh, yeah. For sure.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so taking advantage of and learning for myself. Like, we can't share what we haven't gone through ourselves, and we all have a pain cycle. We all have a peace cycle. So being aware of what's happening in me so that I can stay differentiated, so that I can say a nonanxious, reliable presence. That's a pathway to build trust.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And in our minds, when we start to follow fall into some of that judgment, taking a step back and going, okay. What happened there? What's going on with me? What's frustrating? Am I frustrated that I can't seem to get through to this kid?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:That can be one of the hardest things when I'm investing, investing, investing, and there's nothing I do that can build trust. And so just taking that and holding that for a minute and holding the discomfort of that for a minute, and then having that motivate you to say, what what environment could I create that might propel this young person? Can I see their pain cycle in what's happening? Now we don't wanna use a pain cycle. Like, it's never a good idea to say, I I think you're in your pain cycle because, you know, that's a little too close to home sometimes.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:That's not the purpose of this. The purpose of this we can weaponize just about anything, but the purpose of this really is to be aware of what's going on in you so that you can be that stable non anxious presence. So you can say, hey. What what's going on for you? I did my I did my study for my masters on adoption, and one of the things that we found is that adopted kids have a mindset of I already got abandoned once.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:So if I can just abandon you by rejecting you, by pushing you away, by then that makes it easier. I that anxiety feels better to me than the uncertainty of trusting a human being. I haven't found the human being I was supposed to trust most in my world wasn't trustworthy. They abandoned me. Right?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:So recognizing when we can do the hard work, particularly as mentors, to recognize what we're holding so that those things that come against us, those coping strategies that come against us, we can turn to helping them identify truth about who they are that corrects those.
Zach:So that's I know my journey, and if you've been tuned into the podcast for a long time, you guys know that I had a mentee that actually stayed with me and my wife for years, and he ended up getting incarcerated. And, you know, this was a decade ago, and as I look back on my relationship with him, I can see now how much fear I was operating out of. Mhmm. I was yeah. There was a little bit of, like, man, this kid's gonna make me look bad or this or this or this, but more than anything, I was scared for him.
Zach:Yeah. And and that should that how how that came out was in control and being super critical, and and I cared more about him making good grades. I cared more about his actions than I did his heart.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. I and I think we all have those stories because we want this so bad. And that's why those three sources of truth, god's 1, mentors are another, but you matters most because we can reject all of those things we can reject. And as mentors, it's so important to hold that truth as awesome as your opportunities in the environment and the space that you provide. It isn't an outcome you're after.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:It's a relationship you're after. Yeah. Right?
Zach:And as I've grown now I mean, I get introduced to some kids and, you know, they're just making some some really, really bad decisions. Yeah. And I find myself wanting to go to the. Don't do that. But instead now, I just take a deep breath, and I just say, lord, all frustration comes from unmet expectations.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Mhmm.
Zach:Lord, help me see this kid how you see them.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Mhmm.
Zach:And help me know that you have a plan for their life and you are in control. In this very moment, Lord, you're doing something and I trust you. Yeah. Then I'm able to speak truth to them. Hey.
Zach:I love you, and you have value, and you have worth. And I just know that I know that even though it doesn't look like it today, god's gonna use you in in amazing ways. Yeah. So.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. And and I I love what you just described because that's such a a process of being aware, what's happening, what's going on in me, what's the reaction I wanna have, and how do I regulate so that I can have a reaction that that allows them. That's that openness. It's open and honest and transparent interaction that you can have with one another that creates a sense of safety and trust. So just being present and saying, I love you.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:You're still messing up. I don't know what to do to help you. You're so much more than how you're behaving, and I don't know how to intervene. I just hope that one day you'll see the value that I see in you.
Zach:Yeah. And it's okay to not have the answers.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Oh my gosh. Because sometimes we don't. Yeah. And and I think as a mentor, sometimes you think you you you gotta have all the answers. I mean, I do this with my kids too all the time.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:You know? Like, those reactions, when you've grown up with a lack of safety of any kind, you're like, I'm gonna control. I'm gonna keep you safe. I love you so much. I want the best for you.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:But but giving yourself the space to to feel what's going on inside of you helps you to show up and listen and be present. Your presence matters most. The outcome is not the most important because you don't have the power. Recognizing the power we have to influence relationship, but not the power that we have to control. We don't have power to control.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:We do have power to influence.
Zach:Yeah. That's great. The last thing that I wanna hit on, which in my opinion, I think this this right here was is the thing that I think is gonna add the most value to our mentors. Can we talk about how do we create validating language? Kinda in your email that you sent, you you said, hey.
Zach:You shouldn't say this. Don't say this, but you shouldn't say this. And so I just kinda wanna go through that for a second.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. You're talking talking about kind of what we talked about with regards to anxiety and that sense that we can sometimes bring that we've gotta have the answer, particularly as a mentor. And so one of the things that I like that you said in your interaction with mentees is the importance of taking a breath and get giving yourself a minute. And a breathing practice and giving yourself a minute sometimes helps stop the words that are about ready to come out of your mouth. Because, again, when we recognize I I have to fix the problem.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Like, if you're anxious, I I want you to stop being anxious. So I'm gonna say, well, don't be anxious. We can get through this. But what we don't realize in saying that is that an for an anxious person, that that just feeds more anxiety and tells them more, I'm not enough. I'm inadequate because I am anxious, and I can't just stop being anxious.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:One of the most powerful things that we can do in the language that we use is active listening. So hearing what they're saying and asking questions. So instead of saying don't be anxious, tell me more about how this is showing up for you because then I might find something that I can help them do, like breathe with them. I might be able to help them remember. Hey.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:You've been through a lot of hard times. Tell me about how you survived in the past because you're such a survivor. So tell me how you've survived in the past when you've had hard things. Is there something you can remember that you did that was helpful or that might be helpful now? So instead of having an answer that's a quick, don't be anxious type of answer or just have more faith or if you just trusted Jesus a little more, listening, providing constructive questions that get more information for you, and then helping them find by listening to them.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:What are some keywords that they're using? Do they have a story in scripture with somebody that means something to them? Draw them. Is David somebody they look up to in scripture? Or is there a story of scripture that you can relate to?
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:I think some so many people in the bible struggled with anxiety, depression, all the things we're talking about. Lots of poor choices in the bible. Lots.
Zach:Yeah. Lots.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. We can relate to people pretty well. So making them feel like they're not alone in the struggles that they're having, making them feel like you're there to listen, a calm, nonreactive presence goes a long way, and a listening ear that asks questions for more information is really powerful.
Zach:Yeah. And I found for me to be that kind of not just mentor, but follower of Jesus.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Oh, yeah.
Zach:I mean, that's an inside job. Yeah. And that takes me spending time with Jesus, that takes me being in the word, that takes me truly making Jesus the most important thing in my life. Yeah. Yeah.
Zach:Yeah.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Absolutely. And here's the other thing that I think. When we're survivors like you and me, we're on the other side. Right? We've created a different pathway, and so we know how to do this.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so sometimes as mentors, we're like, I know how to do this. Jump on board, but we don't recognize that every one of us is different. And the strategy that worked for us may not resonate with someone else. You're you may find a mentor that's just like you that wants to follow every footstep. It's it's uncommon.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:But when we recognize and let other people have their own different story or way of doing things, and the only way we're gonna get there is by listening and asking questions so that we understand before we speak. Do I have enough understanding to speak with wisdom into this, or am I just trying to solve the problem?
Zach:And I agree with you 100% there. The thing that I love about Jesus is Jesus is Emmanuel. Right? He is God with us. Yeah.
Zach:And whenever we choose to follow him, we get Jesus put inside of us.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Absolutely.
Zach:And so I am so quick to say, okay, how do I fix this kid? What is the answer? What's the advice? Do they need to listen to a book or a podcast or do they but at the end of the day, the best gift you can give your mentee is a healthy you.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Yeah. Absolutely.
Zach:Because it's not good for men to be alone. No. And these kids who have experienced some of the, I mean, just awful things, the main lie that they are believing so often will lead them to I'm alone. I can't trust anyone. I don't have a family.
Zach:I don't have a spot to belong. No one likes me. No one loves me. And we get to we get to speak the words of Jesus Christ in those places of
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:pain. And we get to trust Jesus for the outcomes of those. Yes. And sometimes it doesn't happen in the season of time that we're with them. I remember I was mentoring a young man who grew up in a horrible environment.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:He had gotten in trouble for tagging, and so I was part of his probation was was seeing me. And so, you know, I remember driving him home one day, and his mattress was on the balcony of his house. His dad was a heroin addict, and I was like, what's up? And he says, it's just what happens. Every once in a while, my mom will put my mattress on the front.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:It means she's mad at me for some reason, so I guess I'm sleeping outside. And so you invest and you invest and you invest. And it wasn't till years down the road, years after our mentoring relationship had ended, that he called and said, hey. Thanks for investing. You were the one stable presence in the midst of my and whole life, and I wanted to give you an update on what I'm doing now.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And so having the long game is so important in mentoring. You have no idea the influence or impact you're having in those moments. And, unfortunately, you may not see the best seeds that you've planted come into bloom, but it is investing those seeds in a kid and recognizing, man, they're acting out isn't about you. It's about their story and about what they've learned about the world around them. And you're being a presence that is one presence that speaks against what they've learned.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:And it's just powerful. It just happens in God's timing, not ours.
Zach:God's timing is perfect.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:It is. It is.
Zach:Alright. Doctor, doctor Meyer, if people would if they would like to learn more about you or about what you guys are up to out in California, tell me how people can people can learn more.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:You can look up the Boone Center for the Family at Pepperdine University. Just put Boone Center in. You could actually put up relate strong, find me on LinkedIn, and, yeah, those are some ways people can find and access in our programs.
Zach:Well, thank you so much for your time and for your wisdom. It has been a great interview. So thank you.
Dr. Dee Dee Meyer:Thanks so much. Thanks for having me.
Zach:Of course. And thank you, audience, for tuning in. And remember, you can mentor.