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In this episode, Deloitte Well-being leader Jen Fisher discusses the business case for investing in well-being through three perspectives. You'll hear a behavioral science view from Deloitte Insights research manager Dr. Kelly Monahan, gain insights on what a leader thinks from Deloitte's Chief Talent Officer Mike Preston, and gain some practical tips and advice on how to embed well-being and flexibility into your own team from Deloitte Consulting LLP senior manager Lindsey Sitek.
The WorkWell Podcast™ is back and I am so excited about the inspiring guests we have lined up. Wellbeing at work is the issue of our time. This podcast is your lens into what the experts are seeing, thinking, and doing.
Hi, I am Jen Fisher, host, bestselling author and influential speaker in the corporate wellbeing movement and the first-ever Chief Wellbeing Officer in the professional services industry. On this show, I sit down with inspiring individuals for wide-ranging conversations on all things wellbeing at work. Wellbeing is the future of work. This podcast will help you as an individual, but also support you in being part of the movement for change in your own organizations and communities. Wellbeing can be the outcome of work well designed. And we all have a role to play in this critical transformation!
This podcast provides general information and discussions about health and wellness. The content is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. Never disregard professional medical advice or delay in seeking it because of something you have heard on this podcast. The podcast owner, producer and any sponsors are not liable for any health-related claims or decisions made based on the information presented or discussed.
A better bottom line
Jen: Have you ever had a day where you just couldn’t get out of bed?
When you felt that your energy had been zapped?
I certainly have. There is a time when I had to redefine well-being for myself and make it a priority of my life. And I also realized that I wanted to help others do that too. That’s what led me here as the Well-Being leader for Deloitte and your host of the Work-Well Podcasts Series.
Hi, I’m Jen Fisher and I’m so pleased to be here with you today to talk about “All Things
Well-Being.”
I travel quite a bit in my job and I’m constantly meeting people at all different types of
organizations and at all different levels. Do you know what question I get the most? “How
can I get a title like yours?” I know it’s a unique title and one that I’m really proud of. But it all starts with building a business case for investing in well-being at your organization. And today I want to help you do just that. We will be talking to a Researcher about why well- being is so important to high performance. We will talk to a Talent leader about what organizations should focus on to build a better bottom line; and we will talk to a Team Leader who can provide practical advice on how to embed well-being into the day-to-day.
Mike Preston: I settled on this notion that we’re a leadership culture, focused on the development and well-being of all of our people. And that was based on our own knowledge of our people that really spoke to what drove the millennial generation; because at Deloitte that’s about 55, approaching 60 percent of our population. We have to design structures and systems that will engage and attract talent because the research is out there.
Jen Fisher: The building block of any great business case starts with science. “What does the research say?” Today we’re joined by Dr. Kelly Monahan. She’s a Subject Matter Specialist at Deloitte Center for Integrated Research. Her research focuses on the Intersection of Behavioral Economics and Talent issues within Organizations. Kelly and I, along with our colleague Mark Coteleer, authored the paper Does scarcity make you dumb? It’s a behavioral understanding of how scarcity impacts our decision-making and control.
Jen Fisher: So before we dive into this conversation, can you define what you mean when
you talk about “Scarcity”?
Dr. Monahan: Yeah, so we do take somewhat of a different approach than you might traditionally think of. What we’re talking about when we talk about “scarcity” is really the mindset that is invoked when you face an unmet urgent need. So we know as humans that we’re biologically wired to respond to certain needs. But we really wanted to understand
what’s happening in your mind as you’re facing that unmet urgent need. Today, or
historically, I should say, it was food, shelter, and clothing. Those basic needs were our
source of scarcity. However, we’re making the argument in this paper that it’s less-and-less physical resources, and more-and-more cognitive resources. So, time, mental energy, relationships, and loneliness, and we’re starting to see that a state of scarcity looks really different than how it looked previously; but it manifests itself in the exact same ways to our brains.
Jen Fisher: So when you’re talking about mindset, it could be scarcity, it could be real or
perceived.
Dr. Monahan: Correct. And I think that a lot of places and in our work places were seeing a lot of perceived scarcity. So people are showing it every day. Physically present, but they
are mentally elsewhere. There’s a great example of this that might help bring this to light. There is a study done out of Newhaven, Connecticut, that examined the impact train tracks had next to an elementary school. They thought that the physical noise had of been impacting learning. So that should come as no surprise that the students who sat on the side of the building where the train was passing by were much less behind their classmates who sat on the other side of the building. But the magnitude is what surprised researchers. Those students were merely a year behind simply because of the rattling trains that were passing by. And so what researchers out of Harvard have proven is that today we might not have physical, rattling trains going through our offices; but in our brains, we all have a
sense of train that we’re constantly being pulled away from. Again, whether that is time, a deadline, relationships, or a sense of feeling overwhelmed, that causes us to face that scarcity and puts us just as behind as rattling trains would be.
Jen Fisher: It seems like for many our own human nature, as you said, needs to be constantly on the go, doing, accomplishing, is at odds with our mental capacity to make good decisions and operate at our best.
Dr. Monahan: Within the paper, we talk about three specific ways that scarcity makes us dumb or influences us. The first is that it creates a lot of noise within our brains. So we’re biologically wired to respond to an unmet urgent need. Back in the day, this was very positive for us. If we saw a lion on the road, our fight-or-fight response was immediately kicked in and we responded appropriately.
Jen Fisher: Run and get out of the way.
Dr. Monahan: Yeah. Absolutely. So today in corporate America, we’re not necessarily
facing lions, but we’re facing a different type of unmet urgent need, that might come in the form of time, relationships, even resources. So unfortunately, our brain does not differentiate between the lion in the road or a really tight deadline, or competing priorities. Biologically and hormonally, we actually respond the exact same way. In the long-term, this creates a lot of obvious stress. We then have to decide if we should take the flight-or-fight response, or do we take on the task at hand. This, quite frankly, just exhausts us. Then the third thing is we experience decision fatigue. There’s this fast, leading study that one of our
colleagues talks about. Which describes where judges in Italy were granting parole simply based on time of day. So if you went before the judge earlier in the day, you were much likely to have a less biased and more rational decision made on your case. But as the day progressed, you were much less likely to be granted parole.
Jen Fisher: Because of the fatigue.
Dr. Monahan: Yes, because of decision fatigue. So scarcity really just biologically brings on these three things: 1) the constant noise and interruption to respond to the need; which then forces us to make trade-off decisions, which then leaves us really fatigued throughout the day.
Jen Fisher: So is there ever a time, from all the research that we know about stress, stress in itself can actually be a performance enhancer. It’s chronic stress or stress over a long period of time that then becomes detrimental and leads to health problems, burnout. I think that scarcity, in some ways, or at least in business can be used or come to life in a similar way. So people can use scarcity to enhance performance in the short term. Can you talk a little bit about that?
Dr. Monahan: I think that is a fantastic point. The fact of the matter is that scarcity does work in the short-term. It motivates us to act. As we talked about before, it does motivate that flight-or-fight response. So you will see high performance in a short term. However in the long term, we know that it’s not sustainable and that burnout is going to happen. And
you’ll actually see in the long term the diminishing levels of performance. So while you may get that short term spike; in the long-run you’re going to be far worse off. There was actually this fascinating study just “The Upside of Scarcity” that researchers out of Princeton University conducted. Basically, they wanted to look at grocery shoppers habits. They went to a wealthy suburb in Princeton and randomly asked participants, “Do you know approximately how much money you’re spending within your grocery basket?” “Would you know about how much, per unit, a bushel of apples is this week?” And the wealthy participants had no clue. They were off. But then they went into some of the more socially economic depressed areas in New Jersey and asked the same questions. Those shoppers
knew, almost to the penny, what was in their cart. So we know that when we’re facing an unmet urgent need, it does make us an expert in the very thing we lack. Dieters tend to know much more how many calories they are consuming, compared to someone who is not. So it does breed a sense of expertise in the short term, but of course long term it is not worthwhile.
Jen Fisher: That’s a fascinating example. I also feel like rest and recovery doesn’t have to be like “I’m taking six weeks off.” It doesn’t have to be something big. There are things that you could do throughout your day to build recovery into your day to kind of take you out of that scarcity mindset is really what we’re talking about here.
Dr. Monahan: Yes, you’re spot on with that and we know from the research that as humans, we’re really bad at taking care of our future selves. It’s called a cognitive bias,
which is the planning fallacy. So in the present, we tend to make decisions that have long- term consequences and cost. Such as rest and recovery. What we’ve found and in some of the research we’ve actually been doing here at Deloitte is if we can get managers and leaders to take 15 minutes a week to focus on their mindset (ex. Why are they there, etc.)? Almost re-center their purpose of why they are leading teams and really just a check-in on themselves; it has had a tremendous impact on Employee Engagement scores. We’ve seen, honestly and quite surprisingly, upwards of 20 to 30 percent Employee Engagement this
year in those targeted regions where we’ve just had managers take a step back for just 15
minutes. Because if you tell them “You know what, you need to go change your mindset” or
for the next 12 months you need to increase employee engagement…
Jen Fisher: It feels like a big huge thing that I have to do.
Dr. Monahan: You don’t even know where to start. But if we say, “You know what, take 15 minutes to start what we call “Mindset Mondays,” to really focus and plan your week
accordingly. And during that time turn off your emails. Do those small behaviors.” You will reap a cumulative effect like some of the meditation research has. The more you do it, in the long term the better it actually becomes.
Jen Fisher: One of the things that I often hear, especially from busy professionals that have a career, a life, and a family, is that they don’t have the time to focus on themselves and their well-being and it feels like a mountain to climb. So they just don’t.
Dr. Monahan: Right. I think the challenge is, especially in corporate America, we’re always looking for the big solution, the big change. And rarely…there’s really no example I can think of.
Jen Fisher: And fast results.
Dr. Monahan: Right! And fast results! Change these 10 things and prioritize all 10. But research suggests that it’s really the small behaviors that you have to practice over and over again. Sometimes that takes a lot of discipline and that’s a much harder message to infuse than trying to present leaders with a 10-step change program that’s going to solve
the well-being issue that’s happening. What the research shows is that we’ve looked a lot at high-performing athletes, especially Olympic athletes, and we wanted to understand what really differentiated those that performed well during the Olympics. So you were already a high performer, but really what separated those. It was the small behavior changes they made during practice (not even during the performance). And so I think there is a lot of application to that when we think through it. People and the way that they go about their life, what are those small habits that they can start to change. It is all about creating that mental space between yourself and the environment, and being able to control at some level. I think find those 2, 5, and 10 minute slots; and that goes back to discipline, turning off the email, putting the phone away, creating that space to really center yourself and make that a priority.
Jen Fisher: One of the things is that… and somebody gave me this advice along the way. If you look at my calendar, I actually block time on my calendar for breakfast, snack, lunch, snack, dinner, or if I see that my calendar is starting to get too full, I block the rest of the time so no one can schedule it and that is time for me. But building that into your everyday life reminds you to do these things until they become habitual.
Dr. Monahan: Yes, and I think to your point, you have to be so intentional with it. So you can practice, but if you’re practicing the wrong things, it doesn’t matter. So I think that being intentional is spot on.
Jen Fisher: Even if you say those things, I know for me and my own personal self, if I get an email, I am going to read it. The fact that someone is telling me not to respond, it’s still going to have an emotional response. So if it’s an email that is disappointing to me or tells me, “on Monday, I need you to do X, Y, and Z…” and I was planning to do something else on Monday morning, it still does elicit an emotional or hormonal response in your body.
Dr. Monahan: There is actually a science describing what you’re just saying. I’ll tell the science and what my boss is now doing as a result of it. Neurosciences show that we think in one of two manners. Top/Down processing, which is when we are rational and logical. But Bottom/Up is when we have the sensory information. We just respond to the environment
around us. So when you read the email, you’re Top/down rational cognition that is saying “No, don’t respond to this email this weekend.” Is involuntarily being interrupted by the
Bottom/Up processes stimuli. You can’t do anything about it. It’s just the way we’re wired.
Jen Fisher: Interesting.
Dr. Monahan: And so my boss recognizing this in doing this science, what he does now,
and there’s this amazing feature in Outlook to delay delivery. So he now does all his emails on Saturday morning, but knowing that no matter what, we will involuntarily feel the need to respond, delays it until we get it Monday morning.
Jen Fisher: So let me play devil’s advocate a little bit. For me, I would actually rather get an email on the weekend and be able to process it and plan my week, because I’m a
planner. Whether there’s a planner fallacy or not, I’m still a planner. I would find it more stressful to get a whole bunch of emails on Monday morning, than I would to get it on the weekend and actually be able to kind of plan how I’m going to deal with it on Monday morning. I think like with any good science, or any good research, there are probably different points of view on that.
Dr. Monahan: So that raises a good point, which I think is a reoccurring theme; and that is there is no “one size fits all” to well-being. We’re all individuals with different preferences. I think what is not happening enough is those communications in the workplace. So whether or not we prefer weekends on the email, or emails on the weekends, or do you want to come on Monday morning, have your cup of coffee and get your 20 to 30 emails? The more we can dialogue and be open with each other, we will work better that way.
Jen Fisher: That’s probably the communications key to well-being, but also so many other
things in our life, right? Let’s shift here and talk a little bit about the future of work and
what we’re seeing, and what you’re seeing in terms of what the future of work looks like for all of us; and what is the role of well-being? Does it become more important, less important, or different? What are you seeing in the research when we look at the future of work because it is changing so rapidly?
Dr. Monahan: It is and I’m going to say this pretty strongly. I think well-being in the future of work is going to differentiate high-performing firms. Not only is it going to be able to attract, but it’s going to be able to retain high-quality talent. Because there’s three things that we’re seeing in the future of work that is changing. The first is, what we do is
fundamentally changing. So sometimes it’s funny to think back that 150 years ago,
98 percent of the economy was agriculture. We were farming. Now it’s less than 2 percent. So what we’re seeing is this net job growth in highly cognitive human areas. So we know technology is coming and that it’s here. Automated technologies are taking over some of the routine repetitive work. So what’s left over is the highly cognitive, creative, intellectual work. And as a result the mind becomes that much more of a differentiator in high performance. When people are facing scarcity in manufacturing settings or whether they are doing tasks quite literally done with their hands, the distractions in their minds maybe
weren’t as important or weren’t as influential to their performance. But now when you and I are going to be tasked with actually coming up with new ideas, creating intellectual capital, and solving some of the large organizations most difficult problems and working with them to do that. You have to be in the right head space. You have to have the well-being to do
so. So I think we’re going to see a fundamental shift toward companies thinking this is nice to have, to understanding. Just like Henry Ford did back in the 1920’s when he was applauded for making the 40 hour work week from 9 to 5. He did that simply because he realized that workers were more productive. It was an economic gain and I think we’re going to see the same thing in the future of work. Rest recovery and well-being is going to differentiate and actually make us more productive in the long run.
(music)
Jen Fisher: The research is just one dimension to the business case, but now let’s look at the organizational perspective. What’s truly on the mind of leaders? I spoke with Mike
Preston, Deloitte’s Chief Talent Officer.
Mike Preston: You know it’s really kind of interesting for me because at a personal level, this is one of my core values. When I think about what defines me, I’ve always had kind of a work hard, play hard mentality. I didn’t think of it in the early days as well-being for my health, my sanity, or dealing with stress. It was just who I wanted to be. So I’ve always had a desire to be involved in sports and do things outside to have a whole life, if you will. I came into the CTO role and I wanted to think about what our talent strategy would be. I settled on, together with the leaders, this notion where we’re a leadership culture, focusing on the development and well-being of all of our people. So the well-being component was part of our strategy from the beginning and that was based on our own knowledge of our people through survey work that we’d done and outside/in information we gathered that really spoke to really what drove the millennial generation. At Deloitte that is about 55, approaching 60 percent of our population. They want to be developed and value inclusion.
But the fourth component is well-being. We have to design structures and systems that will engage and attract talent because the research is out there. We do think, of course, that it drives better performance when people can be their authentic self, they bring their whole self, they’ve figured out what their mission in life is, and they’re grounded, if you will. So well-being is a fundamental aspect of the culture we’re trying to create at Deloitte on the Talent side.
Jen Fisher: Right there at the end, you mentioned culture. There’s a lot of research and data out there that talks about investing in well-being and have it as a bottom-line issue. We know that it lowers health care cost, absenteeism rates, turnover rates, and things like that. That has all been tracked and I think that’s important for any organization.
Mike Preston: For sure. But when I say development, I’m thinking of developing leaders holistically, at work, at home, in their personal lives and the communities. We want to create people who have a mission in their own lives who we can help support. I think of it like this, people are along their life’s journey with us and it’s our job to help them integrate their personal life with their work life along each individual journey. I don’t think the two are mutually exclusive. We talk about work-life fit, which is where we started. We talked about work-life balance. I think it’s about integrating and having a life that is multi-faceted where work and life connect. They coexist. You make priorities and you sometimes lean one way or the other. But I didn’t really think about the absenteeism savings and what it might do to some of our cost around healthcare. What I thought about was the notion of an engagement index and if I can create a strategy where people were more engaged and I knew well-being would be part of that, we’d have lower turnover, healthier people that wanted to stay longer, they’d have an affinity for the brand. Even if they didn’t go on to be future Partners, Principals, or Managing Directors, they would leave and be colleagues for life. And so I think we’re on the right track because our turnover is at an all-time low right now; the turnover of our high-performers is at an all-time low. So people do have an affinity for the brand. Our
scores on our own internal Talent Surveys are going up. We get high marks on well-being. We’re not where we need to be yet, so I don’t want to over-sale it. We went up about 10 to 12 points last year on the well-being related questions, but we still are in a fairly stressful business that has demands, deadlines, and a lot of effort that it takes to deliver world-class services to very demanding clients. What we’re starting to learn is if we manage that stress and use it to our advantage to make sure we get things done, but also build in recovery time, we’re able to integrate well-being into the work.
Jen Fisher: What roles, specifically, do you believe that leaders play in fostering a culture of well-being in an organization? What guidance, what advice, and what role do you think leaders at all levels of the organization play in fostering this kind of culture?
Mike Preston: Yeah, it’s a great topic. Because everything that happens at Deloitte, happens at the team level. The Client Service Team is the organization structure that gets things done. And when you take it all the way up to the top, you start with Cathy Engelbert. As our CEO, does she walk the talk; does she talk about well-being; does she talk about well-being; does she include it in her own actions; and she ABSOLUTELY does. So what we have are a group of leaders who understand that our business can be stressful and that well-being is an important part of defining what we want for our Talent culture. When you get into the actual client service delivery teams, they get stressed by deadlines and they have a lot of work to do. And so the idea of role modeling the behavior at the team leader level, whether that’s a manager to a senior, or a partner to a senior manager, it doesn’t really matter where you are in that hierarchy. You do have to role model it and you do have to have discussion around it. Even if you can’t always have balance or integrate personal during a crisis time when you’re trying to hit a deadline. You should still be talking about it; you should still model it; and value and protect people’s time off once they get to a point
where they can take some time off. Because it’s not going to be linear. They can’t take it off exactly pro rata or throughout the year. There’s client deadlines, things happen. But the leaders have to set the example. They have to actually take time off themselves. They have to actually be careful about sending emails on the weekend that are not urgent and I do that on my own team. I have a standing agreement with anyone who works with me, that if I send you an email about something, you get to it when you can get to it. If I have an urgent request, I will note that in the requests. Or I’ll pick up the phone and call you on your mobile. There is a difference between me sending something on a Saturday and me expecting people to respond on a Saturday. I’ve created that understanding with my team. I think all of our leaders need to do that. The way I’d like to see it happen is at the beginning of a project that a team is organizing around… let’s say it’s to deliver technology products or a deliverable, or a tax return, or whatever it is, you get the team together at the beginning of the project and you talk about their role, the deliverables, and how this is going to be a lot of hard work for 6 to 8 weeks. You talk about here’s the team and whose going to do what. Included in that dialogue should be some conversation about well-being. Go around the table and talk to people about what they would need over the course of the next
6 weeks that would make this an even better place to work for them. Somebody might suggest that they want to go home early on Thursday nights because they play in a soccer league or their child has a performance. Whatever it is, when you talk about it openly at the team level, you’ll find out pretty quickly that most team members are willing to cover for other team members for things that people feel are important. Not every time; not every day; but my even talking about it, you create some option value with your people that you care about. So fundamentally, it’s about role modeling the behavior as leaders on all levels, and when we do that people will believe that we’re serious.
Jen Fisher: So what do you say to the team leader that thinks conceptually that this is an idea, but that’s not really how these things playout? Or when it’s crunch time, it sounds like
a nice thing to do, but how’s that really going to affect my client work or my team in being
able to get things done in terms of my team being productive. Because that is certainly
some of the fear that exist. All of this sounds great and sounds nice, and why wouldn’t we do it, but when the pedal hits the metal, how do I actually do this in a way that isn’t going to negatively impact me as a leader and impact the project that I’m on. What guidance do you give those team leaders?
Mike Preston: Yes. I do think you do have to let people once in a while, even in a crunch time, have some space if that’s what they need. There is nothing wrong with some stress. What’s wrong is stress without recovery. And if we don’t build in recovery, you’re not going to have a high performance team. So from the team leader standpoint, it can really be about self-survival for them because if they burn their people up, they won’t have a high- performing team and their deliverable won’t be as good. And they are going to have to find new players to inject in the team and maybe some of our team leaders would say that’s fine, just give me a new person. Well that’s not the culture we want. We want a culture where people feel as though they are working for a high-performing team, delivering world- class services, and they get the chance to do it while having an integrated work and
personalized. So I would just tell that manager that’s in crunch time, it’s okay to be in crunch time and it’s okay to be demanding. But you’ve got to create an environment where people want to work on your teams. Because if you do, you’ll get better people, you’ll progress further with the Firm and I think you’ll be happier.
(music)
Jen Fisher: It’s sometimes easier to actually create the case for investing and well-being than it is to really show to your leaders what it means from a day-to-day perspective in a work setting. Culture here is key. If you can’t embed well-being into the employee
population, then it becomes just really lip service. So as an individual, as a team leader, and as a team member, what does well-being look like and how is it activated. Let’s talk to Lindsay Sitek, a busy Manager at Deloitte Consulting, to get an idea of how well-being behaviors can be implemented on teams.
Lindsay Sitek: I learned a couple of years ago that there is more to well-being than just being active. It probably just took going to a doctor and having just some bad news
delivered. I’m young and here I am with high blood pressure, a little overweight, and I’m thinking “What the heck?”
Jen Fisher: So tell me a little bit about what life as a Consultant is like.
Lindsay Sitek: Well if you ask 50 different consultants, you’d probably get 50 different answers. But I’d say some of the things that would come out would be: challenging, fast paced, you’re surrounded by high performers so you’re always on, and at times it can be
really tiring. I would add that Consulting is all that I know. I joined Deloitte as an intern and then full-time. So Consulting is what I live and breathe every day; but at the end of the
day, I do find it extremely rewarding. You’re giving back to your clients, you’re helping them
solve all of their biggest problems.
Jen Fisher: Great! So tell me a little bit about when you started to become focused on well-being in your own life and how that has translated to the way that you manage your team and deal with others within your organization.
Lindsay Sitek: Sure. So if I think about my adult life, I always thought I was focused on well-being. But when I think about what that means to me; I’ve always ran and I’ve always
exercised; and I’m thinking “what the heck, I’m active and this isn’t working.” So at the same time I was staffed on a long-term project, on the road Monday through Thursday, and I just thought something needed to change because I was too young to feel like I’m living an unhealthy lifestyle. So as I found myself being more aware of my own well-being, I was also taking a step back and thinking about my team. It was on this longer-term project where it was a grueling project, and morale was a little bit lower and I noticed that making small little changes made a tremendous amount of difference. Little things like Monday nights we’d go to the grocery store; and something as small as that, when you’re on the road and you don’t have access to your normal refrigerator, you realize that you don’t need to be eating out all the time. I found that making small changes for the team not only improved my mental attitude, but the team’s attitude as well. When you think about it from a Consulting, you’re serving your client with a better and clearer mind.
Jen Fisher: Absolutely. One of the things that we’ve learned at Deloitte on our journey in well-being is the whole notion of role modeling behavior and permission. Which is incredibly important for team leaders like yourself. This simple act of going to the grocery store or going to the gym together not only does it build comradery and trust with the team members, but with you as their leader they are looking and saying, “Oh I am getting this permission.” If you’re not doing the things to take care of yourself, then they are not going to believe that it’s okay for them to do that as well. So Role modeling behaviors is really important.
Lindsay Sitek: You know one of the things that I have at my desk and it might have been somewhat from you, is a well-being basket. The basket has a yoga guide, etc. People walk by my desk and say, “Take this home for the night and try it out.” It has an adult coloring book, which some people kind of… “Well, I’m not going to sit down and just color.” But it’s just having those things out in the open and in the environment adds a fun element. If you have a little mental break and want to do a brain teaser, it’s a nice stress relief.
Jen Fisher: And it goes back to the notion of permission. Having it there, visible, and you promoting it to people to try it.
Lindsay Sitek: I think this is all from me being a team leader perspective, but I am a team member on other projects. Even when I was starting my career, it sometimes feels a little intimidating to talk about things like, “Should I be responding to emails on the weekend?” But as a team member, I would just encourage everyone to have that conversation because your managers may not even realize the example that they are setting.
Jen Fisher: Or the impact that it’s having.
Lindsay Sitek: Yes, they might think that they are just getting caught up on emails and not expecting the team to respond. But as a manager, if you don’t have that conversation with some of your junior team members, or if the junior team members aren’t having that conversation with the managers, no one knows what the others expectations are. As the
more junior team member you’re thinking, “Wow, I’m getting an email from my manager. I need to drop what I’m doing and respond immediately. “That is not a healthy behavior or anything we would want to encourage.
Jen Fisher: I’m so glad you brought that up. I think that is so important. I can pretty much tell you that the conversation with your manager would go well. I think as a team leader, you want to know those things and you want to understand the way that your team members want to work and what impacts their well-being. As a leader, if you can understand that then you also understand how you can get the best from them and help
them perform at their best and help their clients at their best. What organization doesn’t
want that? (music)
Jen Fisher: On a personal level, are you feeling less tired? How is your rest and recovery looking like? Because that is an incredibly important aspect of well-being as well.
Lindsay Sitek: Yes. I am feeling less tired. I’m feeling more balanced. I found myself more patient and calmer. I felt generally happier. So the mental state and change in my mental state was evident from some of these small little things. Thinking about the health aspect, my blood pressure has gone down and so from that aspect, little things like that have helped me feel well rested. I believe that when I’m well rested, I’m bringing a better version of myself. I’m more productive during the work days and I’m just a better leader overall.
Jen Fisher: You don’t have to have the title of well-being leader to bring well-being to life at your organization. I really hope that some of what you’ve heard today will help you make well-being a priority in your personal and professional life.
I’m so grateful that Mike Preston, Kelly Monahan, and Lindsay Sitek could talk with us about well-being. Thank you so much to our producers and thank you for listening.
You can follow along with the WorkWell Podcast Series on Deloitte.com or you can visit
various podcatchers, like using the key word “Well-being” to hear more.
If you have a topic you would like to hear on the WorkWell by Deloitte Podcast Series, or maybe a story you’d like to share, reach out to me on LinkedIn. My profile is under the name Jennifer Fisher; or on Twitter @JenFish23. We’re always open to recommendations and feedback. And of course if you like what you hear, please share, post, and like this podcasts.
Thanks and be well.