Kaley:
Hello, everyone, thanks for tuning in to The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast, where we share biblical Truth for any girl in any season. I'm your host, Kaley Olson, and I'm here with my co-host, Meredith Brock.
Meredith:
Well, hi, Kaley, I am honestly so excited about today's podcast.
Kaley:
Yeah, me too.
Meredith:
But we just got done recording with our friend Meghan Ryan Asbury, where we talked all about this feeling in life of being behind. And before you start filling in the blanks about what that means, y’all, this is a feeling everybody struggles with no matter what season of life. Maybe you're wrestling with like I feel behind because I haven't gotten married yet. I share how I felt behind when I was trying to get into college and nobody in my family had ever done that before, and I felt like everybody else knew what they were doing and I didn't. And so, this feeling pops up for all of us, and Meghan really gives us some super helpful, scriptural, biblical handles on how to wrestle well with this feeling behind.
Kaley:
Yeah, it was so good. And I mean, Meredith, what you said is so true; it can speak to any girl in any season, which, a lot of the episodes — I would say most of the episodes that we record here on the podcast — really would speak to you if you were 18 years old listening to this or if you're 58, in a totally different season, because it's something we all struggle with. And sometimes, I know, guys, you and a friend might be in different seasons of life, but one of you is struggling and comes to you and just says like, “Hey, I need help, or let me share with you what's on my heart,” and maybe you don't really know how to relate or pray for her. It can be really hard not to be overly spiritual with your response, because sometimes, Christian women can be like that. I don't know why, but that's how we are.
Meredith:
That's true.
Kaley:
And we are here to help you not be, and so, that's why we put together a resource called “For the Girl Who Needs Hope: 50 Biblical Prayers for the Hard Moments.” You can download it in our show notes below for free.
Meredith:
I know, yes, it's so good; make sure you get that. But, friends, I'm ready. Let's jump into this teaching. Let's welcome our guest for today, Meghan Ryan Asbury. Hi, Meghan.
Meghan:
Hi, friends.
Kaley:
We are so excited that you're here. Meghan is a longtime friend of the ministry, who we love dearly, and she's about to be a newly published author of a book, like a book book!
Meredith:
It's a big deal.
Kaley:
One that you hold in your hands ... has like 1,000 pages. Not this one, though; I don't think it has quite a thousand pages, but to Meghan, it might feel like that. But today, she's joining us from Nashville, Tennessee, where she and her new husband live. I've known Meghan for years now, and, Meghan, one of my favorite things about you is that you're a very intentional friend, not somebody who's going to show up and ask you how are you when you sit down for a coffee or go on a three-mile walk around the neighborhood, but instead, you ask questions where the other person gets to be really honest. And so, I thought it would be fun, before we get started today, for you to give our listeners some tips before you get into your teaching. So will you share with us one or two of your favorite intentional questions that you like to ask your friends?
Meghan:
Absolutely. So I'm going to give you two serious ones and then one funny one I've really been enjoying lately. But the serious ones are: I love to ask people what they're dreaming about, if there's anything they're excited about or passionate about or just looking at the future going, I think this could be really cool if I tried this, or maybe one day ... Because I think it just gets people excited to share what's on their heart. And then, another question I love to ask is: What is something you need help with but are afraid to ask for? And sometimes people need a second to answer that one, but I think just coming alongside a friend and instead of waiting for them to ask you for help, giving them space to share what they could possibly need help with.
Kaley:
That's awesome.
Meghan: But on the lighter note, someone asked me this a couple weeks ago, and I just keep asking everyone: How many owls would you have to see in a day to think something is wrong?
Meredith:
I mean, that took me a minute to —
Meghan: Truly.
Meredith:
— process what it was. I thought about the —
Kaley:
Meghan, that's a great question ... the Tootsie pop, I don't know why I went to the Tootsie pop commercials, because [inaudible].
Meghan:
Yeah, but for real, how many would you have to see in a day to be like something weird is going on?
Meredith:
Five ... I'm going to say five. I don't know why five; I have no logic behind that. But if I saw two owls in one day, I'd be like, huh, that's kind of cool, must be like mating season. And then, if I saw three, I'd be like, that's wild.
Meghan:
I don't know; I was kind of thinking three.
Meredith:
And then, if I saw five, I'd be like, it's the apocalypse; it's going down.
Kaley:
I was kind of thinking three, because I thought, OK, it's summer; when we go on walks, it's very normal for us to see owls. If I ask my son what an owl says, he says, “Hoo-hoo.” It is very cute.
Meredith:
Aww, that's precious.
Kaley:
But if we saw more than two owls, if we saw three, I think I would be a little freaked out by [inaudible].
Meghan:
That is the most common answer ... is three.
Meredith:
Three?
Meghan:
Yeah.
Meredith:
That's so interesting. I believe that, that is three, and the fact that I chose five is a perfect reflection of my personality.
Kaley:
I think what everybody listening to the podcast needs to be aware of is, Meredith and the Brock family have quite the animal situation at their house —
Meredith:
Always.
Kaley:
— all the time, and so, maybe that's why you went with the five number.
Meghan:
Yeah, maybe I wouldn't be so weirded out if there were three in your yard, Meredith.
Kaley:
That's true.
Meredith:
That feels very normal to me, like, three owls.
Kaley:
Just add it to the raccoons and —
Meredith:
The raccoons in my kitchen.
Kaley:
— all of the other animals that you've had at your house. What is your number, Meghan?
Meghan:
Oh, definitely three. Two is like, huh, that's interesting, and three is like, whoa.
Kaley:
Three is kind of biblical, the rooster crowed three times when Peter denied —
Meredith:
Wow, Kaley —
Kaley:
Biblical Truth for any girl in any season.
Meredith:
— I love it. I love it so much.
Kaley:
Let's get on with the show.
Meredith:
Let's do. So we mentioned earlier that Meghan is a newly published author of a book called You Are Not Behind: Building a Life You Love Without Having Everything You Want. And today, she's here to share a message with us on this topic, and we really are so excited to lean in and listen. So, Meghan, take it away, my friend.
Meghan:
Thanks, y’all. So to start off, I would just love to know, Meredith and Kaley, have you ever felt like you are behind? And if so, how?
Meredith:
Yes, 100%. You want to go first?
Kaley:
Well, being in a parenting/new-mom season, I remember when I got married years ago, nine years ago, thinking, Oh, this is when we'll start our family. And it didn't pan out the way that I thought it would, and so, now that I am a few years older than I originally thought that I would be having kids, I kind of sometimes get stuck in my head and think, You're older than you thought you would be, or this is happening later. And I just feel behind, like I'm kind of starting out later when I could've been a mom to a 5-year-old or whatever. And I easily forget this is how it was supposed to work, but it can make me feel behind sometimes.
Meredith:
Interesting. The first thing that came to my mind ... Meghan, you know this about my story, but our listeners only know bits and pieces of this, but I come from a very low-income family, and I was the first one in my family to graduate high school traditionally, and I had nobody in my family to help me navigate getting into college and even how to do college. And I remember, I mean, it was such a panicky, everyday feeling, that I woke up and had this overwhelming feeling like, I'm behind.
I don't know what I don't know, but I know that I don't know how to do this and I'm behind. And I don't know how to catch up with everybody, all my other peers, who were just like, their moms were showing up and helping them go visit colleges. And I'm like, what colleges can I even apply to? How do I apply? And so, it was this aching panic every single day, all through my junior year and senior year. And I would even say as I entered college, I, every day, had that feeling of like, I know that I'm behind, I know that I am, because I don't know what I don't know. So that's the first thing that popped into my mind.
Meghan:
Yeah, and both of those things are so real, and I had asked some friends on social media to share with me what made them feel behind, and I'm just going to share a few of those answers. And one of them was, comparing what I can afford to other people who are my age and in similar jobs as me. On the note of jobs, people said they feel behind in their career, they don't know what they're doing, or everyone else seems so much more confident further ahead or has a higher position. Some people even shared that they feel spiritually immature compared to other people, and somehow, other people are more godly than they are; what neighborhood people live in; or what car they drive; whether or not they're married or have kids. There are a lot of women who shared that they struggled with body image and feeling like they were behind compared to how other people look, or just the natural, "milestones" that we have in life of graduating college or getting married, buying a house, moving to a certain area, having kids.
And I've personally felt behind in pretty much all of these ways. I was single into my 30s and wondered, as I watched friend after friend get married, when my turn was going to be. I felt behind in my career, just watching a lot of friends climb kind of a corporate ladder while I chose to work in ministry. I've moved a few times to new cities at different points in my life and felt like I was starting over and at a deficit compared to everyone who had been there longer than me. And so, I feel like it's really common for us to feel kind of like we got stuck in a life maybe we didn't want or ask for, but we can look around so easily and think everyone else got the memo on how to get what they want.
And so, maybe as you watch people graduate to a new phase of life and you're the only one who feels like you're standing still, it can be easy to look around and wonder, Did I miss something? Did I miss a step? Did I not hear God right? Did I make a mistake that led to this place where I'm just not where I thought I would be? And so, I just want to start by saying, all of those feelings are really valid and you're not alone in that, but I want us to turn to God's Word to just look at what it means to live in a place where we don't have to feel like we're behind or trying to catch up. And so, in Psalm 34, specifically verses 8 through 10, I'm going to read them first real quick. "Taste and see that the Lᴏʀᴅ is good. Blessed is the one who takes refuge in him. Fear the Lᴏʀᴅ, you his holy people, for those who fear him lack nothing. The lions may grow weak and hungry, but those who seek the Lᴏʀᴅ lack no good thing" (Psalm 34, NIV).
So the question is, do we really think that this is true — that we can taste and see His goodness where we are right now and that we really lack no good thing? And I think the answer is yes, this is true, but we get so distracted by the "good" others around us have. And as I've personally felt behind, I really wanted to take some time to look into what is making me feel this way and is it possible to overcome it? And so, as I kind of walked through this journey of writing this book about feeling like you're behind, I discovered three things that we need to address that are making us feel this way, and then three ways that we can kind of combat and overcome that feeling.
And so, the first of those things that we need to address that keep us feeling behind is shame from our past. I think often we can feel like there's a direct correlation between something we've done and the reality that we're currently facing. And I think that while yes, it's true that our sin has consequences, it does not make us perpetually and permanently behind in life. It's really easy to want to look at God like a vending machine in the ... if I did this, then I get that. And personally, I kind of have a little bit of a colorful past in college. I was not walking with the Lord, and I made some choices that I'm really not proud of. And for a long time, I lived in fear that I was not going to get some of the things I wanted in life simply because I had sinned and I had disobeyed God.
And while yes, we need to confess our sin and bring it to the Lord and repent and walk away from it, we don't need to live in fear that God is going to punish us. God doesn't always work on the “one plus one equals two” sort of time frame. And there's just so much misconception about the idea that our sin equals these drastic consequences, when the reality is, Romans 8 tells us that we're free from condemnation, that we don't have to live and we don't have to hide in shame, but instead, we can bring it to the Lord, we can address it, [and] we can ask for forgiveness. We can choose to live a different way and move forward and trust that He still has a good future for us even if we have made mistakes.
And so, if you're in that spot right now where you're thinking, I am where I am, and it's my fault; it's my fault that I did this, I just want to come alongside you and say that the Lord loves you, that He delights in you, that He has forgiven you, and that He still has a good future planned for you regardless of what you have done. And that's the beauty of the gospel. The gospel's the Good News that our sin does not keep us in bondage, it doesn't keep us where we are, and that we can look to the future, whether it's in our life right now or in eternity to come with hope of what's ahead.
And so, the second thing that we can look at as we're kind of feeling behind is the fact that we're not making space to grieve our unmet expectations and disappointment. And I don't know about y’all, but I struggle with grief. I don't want to feel sad. I don't want to address the things that are hard and the expectations that have not been met in my life. And especially, there are people who I can look around and they have just experienced so many more hard things than I have, and it feels almost unfair for me to feel like I need to grieve something that hasn't happened yet. But the reality is, when we allow ourselves to be both honest about the pain of disappointment and hopeful that God can change it, we can experience His love and His kindness for us where we are right now.
And I think when we take time to grieve and we take time to just say, God, this is not the life I wanted, these are not the circumstances I asked for, and I'm honestly struggling to trust that You have good things ahead, we can actually start to experience who God is, and we can start to experience His love for us. And I know that there's probably some listeners who are in spaces of really, really deep grief right now, and I just want to take time to say that I'm sorry. I know that when you're walking through something that just feels so unbelievably painful, hearing that that's a great place to experience God's comfort may not actually be that comforting.
And that's OK. I think you can be honest with the Lord about your pain and the lack of trust that you have in Him in that moment, because He's going to meet you in that. And when we experience His comfort and His kindness, we are better able to trust that He has good things ahead. And so, if you're someone who just doesn't like sadness and doesn't want to experience that grief, I just want to give you an invitation to just get honest, because God has good things ahead, and He also has just so much that He wants to pour into you right now in the midst of grieving, where you aren't where you thought you would be or you're not who you thought you would be at this particular point in life.
And the last thing that we need to address as we're kind of fighting this feeling like we're behind in life is our misunderstandings of the difference between contentment and idolatry. And so, I think in Christian circles, contentment can kind of feel like an ambiguous thing ... like, we're supposed to be content, but what does that really mean? And I personally have really had a misunderstanding of contentment and thinking, If I'm totally happy where I am right now and I don't want anything, then maybe I'll finally get it. And I think that's something that, especially when I was single, got thrown around a lot, of, it'll happen when you least expect it, or God doesn't tolerate idolatry so you can't idolize wanting to be married or then you'll never get married. And then I found myself trying to manipulate my desires around wanting ... Because I wanted something, if I could just manipulate myself and God into thinking that I didn't want it, maybe I'd finally get it.
And that's just not what true contentment is. And desire and contentment are not mutually exclusive; you can want something and be honest about that and still be content where you're at right now. And Paul talks about it in Philippians: being content. He acknowledges that he has wants and that he is lacking in some areas but that he trusts God is the ultimate source of his contentment. And so, especially this side of eternity, we can really struggle with feeling content, because we're never going to be content this side of eternity. We're always going to have that inner desire for life to go back to the way it was in the garden, for us to be with Jesus.
Now, I say that, idolatry is something that we maybe won't admit that we do struggle with. I think it's really easy when you're feeling behind and you're looking around at what other people have to start to idolize some version of your life that doesn't exist. And I do think that this is a space where you can get honest with God, and you can ask God to tear down those idols in your heart, because we can't want something too much. But back to the thing with shame: Just because you want something doesn't mean you're not going to get it. God doesn't work like, Here ... as soon as you don't want this, I'm going to finally give it to you. But we have to trust that God's plan and God's timing is perfect, and we can surrender even in the midst of really desiring something to be different in our life that God has a good plan and that His timing is perfect.
And so, just reminding you that when you stop wanting something, that doesn't mean you'll get it, but when we are obsessed with something that we don't have, it keeps us from living in abundance right now. So once we kind of tackle our shame, once we make space to allow ourselves to grieve, and once we kind of ask ourselves those honest questions: Am I idolizing something in my life? Am I seeking contentment for my circumstances? There are three just really practical things that we can do. And granted, these aren't, you do this and you're never going to feel behind again, but they are things that can help with that daily struggle of looking around and wishing we were somebody else and wishing we were somewhere else.
And so, the three things we can do to combat this are: quit comparison, get in community and practice celebration. So I'll start with comparison. One of the biggest tools of the enemy's in making us feel behind is the people around us and the people on the internet. And I love Hebrews 12, where it talks about running our races marked out for us, and I think we can get so caught up tripping because we're looking around at everybody else's races. And I don't know if y’all like to run. I go in and out of my sort of running eras, if you will, and I'm in one right now, where I'm trying to get back in running shape. And there's this app called Strava, and Strava is where you record your run, and it gives you your time, and you can be friends with people on it.
And so, I like to use Strava because I like to know how far I'm going, how long it's taking me, and not because I'm necessarily trying to run at a certain pace or go a certain distance, but just, I like to keep track of that stuff. But when I get on Strava and I look at everybody else I know that is running ... Now, granted, I'm running in Nashville, around my neighborhood, and I've got friends running in Charlotte, around their neighborhood, and I've got friends running 5K races on the weekends or training for marathons. And I can so easily get tripped up by looking at everybody else's times and their paces and thinking, I am not where I'm supposed to be.
But the reality is, we are all running in different places, going different directions and at different paces, with our eyes on the same prize, and that is eternity with Christ. And so, if I'm looking to the person to my left and trying to keep up with them, I'm going to trip and fall, but if I keep my eyes on where I'm going and the fact that while we're all at different spots, we're all heading in the same direction; I'm better able to run my race at my pace. And so, here are some just practical ways to kind of combat that comparison in your life. And one of them is the most obvious: just get off social media and get off your phone. And I know that it's a great place to connect, but if you find yourself [comparing] every time you're opening up Instagram and you're seeing something that someone else has that you don't, it might be a good time to just take a break.
And that break can be for 24 hours, that break can be for a week, but I think just taking that time away and looking at the reality of your life in front of you instead of comparing it to other people, you're going to better have a space where you can feel like you really enjoy what's right in front of you. And with that, I think practicing gratitude is something that we often just miss the value of. And when we practice gratitude, which we'll talk about when we talk about celebration, you just get grateful for the life that's in front of you and that you better appreciate what you have.
And then, some other small things are: Go outside. I think there's something about all of us working at our computers all day, and it can get really easy to think your life is this little square box. But go outside ... appreciate nature. There are so many studies about how being outside and looking at the sunrise or the sunset just kind of helps you feel less anxious and it calms down your nervous system. And then, one of them that might not be just super obvious is: Find something to do outside of yourself. Go volunteer for something at church or an organization that helps the impoverished in your city. When you actually start to do things that are for other people, you're not so much thinking about yourself, and that helps you not struggle so much with comparison.
Because, as we talked about with the idea of contentment and idolatry, contentment and comparison can't coexist. If you're constantly comparing yourself to somebody, you're never going to be content. And I think we also have to call comparison what it is, and it's a sin; it's coveting what other people have. And so, if we're better able to acknowledge what it is and then actually fight against it like we would fight against other sin, then we won't get so tripped up in comparing ourselves to other people.
The second thing you can do is get in community. And I think something I've noticed a lot is, we think if someone is not in our exact season of life that they cannot speak into our season of life, and we do the same to them in reverse. But God has called us into community, and if you have the Holy Spirit inside you and the other person has the Holy Spirit inside of them, then we do have something to offer in those friendships. I would miss so much if I only hung out with people who were in my season of life. And I think we throw this around a lot because we really, for some reason, love to feel special in our pain. We say, “You don't get it,” and we discredit what people can speak into our lives because we feel like they're not in the same spot; when the reality is, like I said, if you have the Holy Spirit inside you, we do have something to offer.
And so, maybe in this season of life, you are single and you are wishing that you had more single friends, or you feel like your married friends just don't understand what you're going through, instead of just writing off those friends, I say, dive in, go deeper. Ask them what they know about God [being] married that you might have not experienced about God [being] single. If you are friends with people ... I'm in a season of life where everybody I know has kids, and I don't have kids yet. And it could be really easy to be like, all right, well, you don't understand my struggles at work because you're a stay-at-home mom; when the reality is that stay-at-home mom has so much wisdom to offer me that I don't even know. And so, getting into community with people who aren't in the exact same season as you is such a life-giving way to stop feeling like you're behind in life because it makes you feel less alone.
And the last thing is practicing celebration. And so, back to Psalm 34; I'm going to read the first three verses: "I will extol the Lᴏʀᴅ at all times; His praise will always be on my lips. I will glory in the Lᴏʀᴅ, let the afflicted hear and rejoice. Glorify the Lᴏʀᴅ with me; let us exalt His name together" (Psalm 34, NIV). When we praise the Lord and celebrate His faithfulness both in our past and our present, we find so much more joy and satisfaction in where we are right now. And I think it really is possible to love the life in front of you, and one easy way to do that is to celebrate. And I think we're really good at celebrating big "milestones" in life, but I think we discount those smaller, more intimate moments that we can come alongside each other and celebrate.
And so, I think even down to ... This is my favorite example of a way to celebrate. I get my hair done every three months, and I always get it done on a Friday so that I can go out and do something afterward, because my hair is already freshly done. I don't know if y’all do that. But inviting people to just be like, “Hey, let's go out and have fun because my hair is done today.” It doesn't have to be a wedding or a baby or a job promotion; it can be small things, and inviting other people into what's going on in our lives in community allows us to just be happy and allows us to celebrate.
So choosing to celebrate ourselves and others is one of the best ways to overcome the cynicism we can feel toward our circumstances. And I think it's easy to look at future possibilities to rejoice and miss out on rejoicing right now, and things like, Well, I'll celebrate when I get here or when I finally reach this milestone. And I think just look at those things that you're grateful for and that you're practicing gratitude for, and choosing to celebrate those with other people is a great way to overcome that feeling like you're behind in life.
And so, after we've kind of looked at the shame and the grief and the contentment and idolatry struggles that we have and that we actually choose to quit comparison and we get in community and we celebrate, there is a truth that because we live in a fallen world, we're probably always going to struggle like we're feeling behind because this life is just not it. But we don't have to succumb to the defeat and get distracted by where we are lacking. The enemy would love nothing more than for us to focus on where we are not, because that keeps us from walking in obedience and living in abundance today.
So I just want to end with this reminder that we're not behind and we're not ahead and we're not trying to catch up. We're not looking to a spot to arrive. We are here with the one life on earth that God has so graciously given us, and it really matters that we stop living in this cycle of feeling behind so we can focus on using the gifts that He's given us for His glory. And once we arrive at the place we want to be, the reality is, the arrival point always moves. I mean, it was so easy for me to think that when I get married, I'll stop feeling like I'm behind, or when I finish writing this book, I'll stop feeling like I'm behind.
But the reality is, the second I arrived at both those destinations, there was somewhere else I was trying to go. And so, I think just acknowledging that everyone feels this in some way, shape or form ... you are not alone, but we do have things and tools right in front of us to live in fullness where God has us. So I just want to encourage you that, friend, you're not behind; you're right where God has you and where He wants you to be, and you're not missing out on some better possibility or future, but you might be missing out on what's right in front of you.
Meredith:
Wow, Meghan, I love, love, love that you're closing this great message with: You're not behind; you're not ahead; you're right where God has called you. And the reality is, you're right where God has called you to be able to obey Him today in whatever He has called you to do. And I just want to endorse fully ... I'm just sitting here reflecting on my own life and these kind of three points that you made about where you might be struggling or what it might look like or why you're struggling with feeling behind. And I was reflecting on each one with that example that I gave of when I was trying to go to college and I didn't know how to do any of it. And man, that point that you made about shame from your past, for me, it really and truly looked ... And I don't think I could have put my finger on it at that time. I wish I had your book, because it would've helped me so much.
But I felt so much shame, and I had made some really bad choices when I was in high school and got tangled up in some stuff that was not great and was a very sinful lifestyle. And I did feel shame about that, but I felt more shame about where my family came from and the fact that I didn't have the resources, the financial resources, or the knowledge that all these other kids had as they were going into college. And I really did feel so much intense shame around that, that I remember just wanting to cover up all the time. And you know what it took for me to really move out of that shame was community. It was two incredible people in my life who stepped into my life and began to speak truth over me.
And again, to endorse what you've taught here, Meghan, one of the biggest things that they taught me during that season was how to pray. And they said, “Always start your prayer with thank you, because it puts your heart in the right place.” And I would say to them, “Well, what do I have to be thankful for?” And they would say, “The air, the fact that you have air to breathe. The fact that you woke up this morning and you had clothes to put on.” That was the place where I was at. It wasn't thankful for like, woo-hoo, yeah, I got into this college; it was the very, very basics, but it positioned my heart to a place to see I really do have good things in my life, and I serve a good God who's continuing to provide. But I needed people in my life to help me, move me out of that shame. I know that I would not have been able to do it alone.
And so, for our listeners who are hearing this today, I don't know, maybe you are struggling like I did. It wasn't like this immense amount of shame because I made this one choice and I wish I could cover it up, it was more like I felt shame about where I came from. And I felt shame like, I'm never going to be like everybody else because of where I came from. And, y’all, it's wild to even think ... here I am 43 years old. When I was going through that, I was like, 17, and I would've never in a million years been able to put myself in the position I am here at Proverbs 31 with a happy marriage and a beautiful family, and I have a master's degree now.
What? That 17-year-old girl would've been like, no way. But I did feel so behind, Meghan, but look what God did as I took those little steps of obedience just to say, OK, Lord, I trust You. I feel so ashamed, but I'm going to keep calling this out, I'm going to invite people into my life, [and] I'm going to continue to be thankful. And God moved so dramatically in my life, so I just want to endorse the message you've got going on here, Meghan; this is really good stuff.
Kaley:
Yeah, that is good. I keep thinking, Meghan, whenever you were talking about your third point of contentment and idolatry, I had the thought of growth seasons come up in my mind, and I wanted to ask you guys, because I'm pretty sure I know the answer, but I'm just going to ask anyways: Have y’all ever felt stuck in a season of growth with the Lord where you're like, I can't push past this, I feel like I'm falling behind spiritually in some ways, because I keep ... like, He won't let me through it? Have y’all ever felt that way?
Meredith:
I definitely have. Meghan, you go first.
Meghan:
Yeah, I think one thing I think about a lot is, we just so badly want to outgrow our need for the Lord and our dependence on Him, when the reality is, dependence on the Lord is the goal. Our independence is not the goal. And so, when I find myself ... I mean I'm kind of in a season like that right now, where I just am like, Lord, I don't feel like I see any forward progression in our relationship; I feel kind of stagnant. And just that we're going through the motions, and remembering that it is the Lord's love for me and my love for the Lord that keeps our relationship going.
And sometimes, that love is just not feel good and happy; sometimes it's just going through the motions. And both of y’all are married, and I know that you know this, of, love is both a feeling and a choice. And you walk through life, and some days, it feels really good, and you want to bottle up all that feeling, and then sometimes, it's just, no, we're here, and we are committed to one another, and we're going to keep showing up. But it can feel like, yeah, I want to move past this ... I want to graduate to this next "phase," when reality is, we never graduate from our dependence on God.
Meredith:
That's so true, Meghan, my goodness, this independent woman right here who is speaking ... that has been a consistent battle for me. But when you asked that question, Kaley, I automatically thought about, when I think about growth seasons, the period of time that I'm talking about, when I was trying to go to college and I had just become a believer, and I was living with this couple who was really mentoring me. If you look back at that period of my life, sometimes I'm tempted, I was experiencing explosive growth, where every day I was learning something new and changing and working so hard to break old patterns in my life that I had learned growing up. And it was massive growth season.
And then, I left their home and I was going to college, and I had all this time on my hand to read these great books and study my Bible. And so, again, it still felt like maybe not as explosive, but I was still experiencing slow and steady growth in my life. Then I got married ... same thing, it's just me and my husband, and then I had kids. And, y’all, I'm just going to be honest, all of a sudden, the time that I was previously able to give to my spiritual growth, if you're defining ... It all depends on how you're going to define spiritual growth, because it gets a little tricky. But I have learned: I had one kid, then I had two kids, then I had a third kid, [and] I currently have a fourth kid in my house. I keep adding all these people, and they all need things from me.
And that time that I used to have to give to growing spiritually ... Again, it's all how you define it, I started feeling like, Lord, I'm just stagnant, and I'm falling behind. I should be growing more. But, y’all, I am here to tell you, it looks so different in each stage of your life. Right now, growth for me genuinely looks like laying myself down on behalf of the beautiful human beings that the Lord has entrusted to me. In this season of life, it means, literally, this morning, I was able to get up and read a psalm. Uno ... one.
Meghan:
Hey, that's OK.
Meredith:
One psalm at the kitchen counter before all the people that the Lord has given to me to love and care for needed me. And so, spiritual growth for me right now is sacrifice of myself on behalf of someone else; when in the past, it was more pouring myself into learning what the Bible says, being able to give myself intentionally to growth. And I can tell you, I'm 12 years into this parenting journey now, and the growth looks different. You know what it looks like now? Patience. I'm far more patient with people than I was 12 years ago. And the only way to grow that way, grow patience ... I mean, I'm sure there's other ways but to have people pulling at your patience constantly. It's not from a book, it's not from a spiritual discipline, even —
Kaley:
You got to live it out.
Meredith:
— and you have to live it. And so, I guess what I'm getting at is, there are seasons of spiritual growth that you need. I needed those years when I was in college to deeply engross myself in the Word and deeply engross myself in learning some really good habits. And now, the season of growth for me I needed was to just, man, chisel off the sin in my life, the selfishness in my life, by being in the fire with other people.
Kaley: Sometimes growth is advancement. I mean, Meghan, it is ... sometimes you are moving from one thing to the next, and there's where that feeling of being behind lies. But I think that that's the lie we get caught up in as we think that growth is only advancement.
Meredith:
It's only moving forward.
Kaley:
It's only bigger; it's only more fruit; when in some seasons, growth might look like depth. And you can't rush growth, or growth might look like pruning so that there's room in the future ... But I just couldn't let the podcast end without addressing that, because I think that while we're looking at all of these physical things that we deal with ... like Meghan, you gave examples at the beginning, where people can see how they might be behind, I think that that's a reality for a lot of people, is just feeling like, man, if I've been a Christian for 20 years or whatever, shouldn't I be further or whatever? But how do I trust God with the season that I'm in spiritually and say, This is really hard right now, but I know that You're still moving, and I know that You're still doing something, and I'm going to be content in this circumstance and not try to rush past this, and I know You'll move me whenever You're ready.
Meredith:
Goodness gracious, this has been a good podcast.
Kaley:
It has been a good one.
Meredith:
Meghan, thank you so much for coming on today.
Meghan:
You're welcome; thank y’all for having me. And yeah, I echo everything that you both said, and sometimes from external circumstances, growth looks like moving backward. And God does not move and work on our earthly timetables and our definitions of being where we thought we would be, and yeah, the Kingdom is upside down, and therefore, sometimes this looks upside down [inaudible].
Meredith:
Amen. Amen, Meghan —
Kaley: [inaudible].
Meredith:
— no better way to end this. You guys, if you've listened to this message today and you're like, gosh, I need more of this; we really want to encourage you to pick up Megan's book, You Are Not Behind. You can visit the link in our show notes today, and also, make sure you connect with Meghan on her Instagram; it is @meghanryanasbury. Or, you can just go to her website, alwaysmeghan, and that's M-E-G-H-A-N — don't forget the H in there, folks — .com. And we are so glad you were on the show today, Meghan.
Kaley:
Yeah, absolutely. And you guys, we pulled a resource from Proverbs 31 Ministries that we thought would be helpful for you today if you resonated with this message or if you've got a friend who's navigating feeling behind; it's called “For the Girl Who Needs Hope: 50 Biblical Prayers for the Hard Moments.” Maybe if you go back to that question Meghan asked that was one of her fun intro questions, to ask a friend like, “Hey, what do you need right now?” and your friend is like, “Man, I need hope or I'm desperate or I need prayer,” you can give her this resource. And we've linked it for free for you in the show notes, so download it today, and it'll go straight to your email.
Meredith:
That's right. Well, friends, that's it for us today. At Proverbs 31 Ministries, we help you know the Truth and live the Truth because we know it really will change everything for you.