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A Marvel Rivals Podcast hosted by Coach Mills and CaptainCoach, two creator and educators for Marvel Rivals. We discuss all things Rivals including META, balance and the future of development. We will often debate controversial topics that surround the game and plan to bring on many exciting guests from pros to devs!!!
Coach Mills (00:00.28)
What's up, everybody, and welcome to a brand new ClearComps episode. Today we are joined by two exciting guests. First off, you know her, you love her. She is a an insane widowmaker on ladder, a new reworked widowmaker, and we're gonna talk a lot about it. Zaza Stack, thank you so much for coming on the pod. Welcome in, welcome in. Yeah. And we also have returning guest, host of a sick tournament that Captain Coach and I were just a part of.
zazzastack (00:19.354)
Happy to be here, thank you. Thank you.
CaptainCoach (00:19.576)
Yaaaa
Coach Mills (00:29.25)
The Magneto Goat himself per sixo. What's up, bro? Welcome back. Welcome back. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go.
Persixo (00:31.397)
What's poppin'? What's poppin'? That's me. I'm I'm I'm I'm glad I'm glad to be here. You know, it's always a pleasure to get that DM from Coach Mills saying hop on. It's it's always a pleasure.
CaptainCoach (00:32.081)
Yeah!
Coach Mills (00:37.87)
Let's let's I I I I tell you to hop on it all the time. Wait. did I? It's the same fucking character. Okay, well no. I mean it's more like Ash now, yeah, yeah. And that and that's kind of the first thing that we wanted to talk about.
CaptainCoach (00:39.217)
Ha ha ha
Persixo (00:43.129)
That's not true, don't do that, don't do that, that's not true, that's not true.
zazzastack (00:43.962)
Hey!
CaptainCoach (00:44.721)
Ha
CaptainCoach (00:48.581)
Well, no, as you said, Widowmaker in the intro, by the way. I don't know.
Persixo (00:52.983)
Yo
zazzastack (00:53.646)
Yeah, I don't think it's Widowmaker in this game. You say it's the same character, but they completely changed her this season. Okay, come on. Yeah.
Persixo (00:56.987)
You wanna restart it?
Coach Mills (01:06.91)
we want to talk about the Widowmaker rework because I think that before we even talk about how good the character is, I want to talk about like how you personally feel about Widowmaker. Cause I know like a lot of people that played Widowmaker and were Lord of Will W Widowmaker, whether it's you, Nervous, X Lec, no one really likes the rework that It's the same character! I don't care It's the same Widowmaker, it's a Widowmaker, Widowmaker Black Widow, whatever.
CaptainCoach (01:25.571)
It's Black Widow, Bills! It's a Widowmaker! What are you doing? You're throwing, bro!
Persixo (01:26.626)
You you k you said Widowmaker like eight times?
zazzastack (01:26.948)
Black Widow, Black Widow, Black Widow.
Coach Mills (01:36.192)
A lot of people that played her before did not li do don't like the change. They don't like the rework. So w what can you explain why you don't like the rework? What specifically about it you not like? And and then we'll move on from
zazzastack (01:46.758)
yeah, well, I feel like I can speak for most of the other previous Widow mains when I say this as well. We really like that niche of having a hitscan sniper. Now there's no other hitscan sniper in the game who can fill that niche. Also, Widow's previous anti-dive was really, really good. I know a lot of people might say that it's not good, you know, because they've witnessed a bad game of Vine, but like...
she really was strong against the dive characters. That kick and stun she used to have, the stun lasted like so long that yeah, yeah, it was one of the, like definitely one of the best stuns in the game. Yeah, yeah. And you couldn't dodge it because it was auto aim. So literally I spent like half my games like against Spider-Man, for example, I would flick him as he came in, kick stun and then shoot him again. And then he would die from that.
Coach Mills (02:23.886)
Forever. Yeah. You couldn't dodge it either. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:43.369)
And, you know, like it was such a nice combo and like even though Widow's kit was so small beforehand, everything worked so well together and it just gelled so smoothly. And I think we kind of miss out with this new kit. Like we no longer have a hitscan sniper to fill that niche. And the new kit just doesn't really deal with the dive as well and doesn't really like deal with what she used to be able to deal with as well.
Now you kind of have to change up that whole play style completely and play a little more like the other poke characters with a little bit more mobility.
Coach Mills (03:16.598)
Hmm.
CaptainCoach (03:18.437)
They definitely completely change how the character works. I do feel like they made her a lot more generic and kind of bland. You mentioned sniper characters. mean, my first hero shooter ever was Team Fortress 2. There's a character in the game literally called the Sniper and it's pretty much... Sniper Maker.
zazzastack (03:29.635)
Yeah.
zazzastack (03:33.259)
Mm-hmm
Yeah.
Coach Mills (03:37.406)
Y you you mean we don't make no it's gay, I'm sorry, I just kh.
zazzastack (03:39.257)
Okay, okay.
CaptainCoach (03:41.732)
Yeah, so you land a headshot on a sniper, that's a kill. And that's just how the game worked. It was very fast paced. And obviously in a game like that, where there's not as much sustain, obviously burst is so important in a game like this. Would you say that the change of, sorry, having a sniper in a game like Marvel Rivals is something that is too hard to balance? do you see a world or a version of Widow that could function with
Persixo (03:42.609)
Mm-hmm.
CaptainCoach (04:10.161)
the same exact type of scoping for all your damage 100 % of the time.
zazzastack (04:16.651)
Yeah, well I mean personally I think that we didn't have to go for the rework. I don't think the rework was necessarily needed. I think if people just gave her old kit a little bit more of a chance because like so many people just kind of defaulted to her being the throw pick. Even before like I was considered the throw pick for Widow. Like before that Widow was always considered the throw pick from Season 0. So it's like...
You know, people never really gave her old kit that chance and never really learnt it. But once you put some time into it, it was more and more fun. So I don't think the rework was ever really needed, but I think like a really nice medium between the rework and the old version of Widow would be her old kit, like completely go back to her old kit. Give her the infinite sprint and the slam. And I feel like they would be really good together.
Something that would have kept the community happy as well on her old kit is if we replaced the batons with those dual pistols that everyone was literally asking for. I don't know anyone who wasn't asking for them. And then because her batons are part of her cosmetics every now and then, her skins feature her batons, they could always stay as her melee animation. it's like... I feel like that would have been a nice version of Widow to have.
Coach Mills (05:23.566)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (05:37.053)
Mm, which I see.
zazzastack (05:40.245)
And like, if you were to make the dual pistols there instead of the batons as a secondary, you could always like nerf the damage from the sniper just a tiny bit and then, you know, like allow those dual pistols to finish them off but have like fall off on them. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (05:54.45)
You mentioned the infinite sprint they shadow nerfed her jump, correct? So it's actually worse Would you want the old jump with the infinite sprint or the newer one? Which one do you think would be more fair?
zazzastack (06:00.082)
Yeah. Yeah.
zazzastack (06:06.775)
The... I think the old jump with the infinite sprint but you would probably have to limit the slam range if you did that. The only reason I say the old jump is because there's so many parts of the map that are old-wit domains used to be able to park or whatever and you can't reach that anymore. It's so hard to reach most of the spots now. I've found myself, most of the off angles I would push with my sprint and jump
I just can't do it anymore. Like, they're impossible to get to and now I've like... Some maps I just physically cannot get enough off-angles on, you know?
Coach Mills (06:47.736)
So I'm gonna play devil's advocate a bit here just so cause I know the comments are gonna have a lot of c like replies to it. So the first thing I'm gonna say is in your opinion, why do you think they reworked Widowmaker in the first place? Cause and and this these are these are my theories, but I wanna hear which one you agree with. So number one is you could argue that the design is there's there's it's problematic. There's problematic parts of the old design. Whether that's the one shot with Mantis damage boost or the inac you can't interact from range, that may be there.
zazzastack (06:52.825)
Yeah, for sure.
Coach Mills (07:17.74)
Maybe the skill ceiling is too high for the average player. Maybe or the skill floor. Wait, I'm hearing a big fan. I think that's super six though. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know what I hear. There go, now I don't hear now.
Persixo (07:26.191)
Me?
zazzastack (07:29.607)
yep, no, was for Sixer. A massive fan. Isn't it summer over there for you guys? Isn't it summer there for you guys? It's winter here. It's winter, so yeah, Australia. We're opposite to you guys, so...
Persixo (07:31.67)
You can hold a look it's it's about my air purifier. Give me a second.
Coach Mills (07:33.058)
What is? Okay, okay, yeah, no, no worries, no worries. I I can I can always cut this out. Yeah, it's hot as hell. Yeah, yeah. it's winter? my god, that's
CaptainCoach (07:36.379)
Ha ha ha.
huh.
Coach Mills (07:47.191)
I need I I no no no we're good. We're good, we're good. No, it sounds good. I need I need to get I need to get bougie enough one day to where I have like a fucking second house somewhere that's cold in the summer. It's too goddamn hot. It's like it was one six yesterday here. One six. It's too goddamn hot.
Persixo (07:47.835)
Do do you still hear it?
zazzastack (07:50.049)
No, it's all good. It's all good.
Persixo (07:50.649)
Okay, okay. So it was that, okay, okay.
zazzastack (07:57.53)
Yeah, just come to Australia. We don't even get freezing, we just get like... We get cold enough to get snow but not super freezing like other countries do. But our houses have no insulation so that's the only downside. Oh yeah, no we don't. It's pretty hot most of the time so...
Persixo (07:58.225)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (08:13.39)
That sounds that sounds nice.
I mean, still it sounds nice. I mean y'all don't need it seems as like y'all don't need it as much as we do. The insulation and stuff, yeah.
Coach Mills (08:25.588)
but l let me go ahead and repeat the the the three just so I have a good cut. So the first one is there have been people that have argued that the character could the old version of Widowmaker could have been unhealthy, whether that's the the one shot with Mantis Mantis damage boost, the long distance nature of the character means that not everyone can interact. so that's like the first thing. The second thing is the very high skill floor where like a lot of players, like most players could not even play that character at like a like a bare level.
zazzastack (08:29.099)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Coach Mills (08:54.922)
And that's probably why it became the third character, because it's really like unless you had like good aim, you're not even playing that character like you know, you're not doing anything on that character if you don't have good aim, most likely. the pr previous version. and and then the third criticism is you know, the the new version is it's very strong. Like maybe maybe one of the most powerful DPS in the game right now. and so it's a character right now that is good probably in the average rank.
zazzastack (08:58.201)
Mm.
zazzastack (09:03.351)
Yeah, yeah.
Coach Mills (09:22.936)
But like insane in the high rank, which is like more a more natural skill curve. So what do you say in response to to those things about Widow and like your old version of Widow?
zazzastack (09:34.074)
look, I- Me personally, think Old Widow had the potential to do anything New Widow could do. The only thing New Widow is a little bit better at is the amount of damage output, in my opinion. I think that a lot of people-
like the reason for the rework is that a lot of people were already chanting for one. They've always been chanting for one. A lot of people will say that I'm the reason for the rework. I know I'm not the reason for the rework. Devs don't rework a character off of one creator in their community. Yeah. Yeah, I know. It's kind of- it's like kind of funny. It's kind of funny. I mean, I've- at least I got motion, right?
CaptainCoach (10:09.297)
I've seen those comments and I was a little surprised by them. I've seen the, it's.
Coach Mills (10:11.308)
That it is
Coach Mills (10:17.804)
Yeah. Yeah, just reply you're welcome to everyone that says that. You're welcome. Yeah. you know?
CaptainCoach (10:17.925)
Yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (10:22.891)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, but yeah, no, like a lot of people think it's because of me, like there's no do it because of one creator. A lot of people already were going, my god, Widow needs a rework, Widow needs a rework, and I think that's literally just because what I said before, like, they didn't give her enough time or much of a chance to actually learn her, and so that, that meant they didn't have, like, they couldn't see the potential that she could get to.
CaptainCoach (10:23.409)
Hahaha
zazzastack (10:51.737)
Like I feel like in the right hands she was always able to perform. Like always. You know, like I've never been the highest ranked Widow main. I have hit rank one on the Rivals meta site, but there's always like there's Widows who have been to one above all. There's Widows who have been to eternity. Like my peak is one game off of eternity. Like, and I'm just an average person, you know, plays Widow. So, yeah.
CaptainCoach (11:19.641)
I mean, I've seen some of your clips. I've also had you in my games quite a bit. I think you're selling yourself a little short, compared to the average player in that rank, if they were to whatever, go into the hyperbolic time chamber and have to like learn widow. I don't think many people could get to your level to be fair. I, yeah, absolutely. I wanted to ask in that same vein, we're talking highest level of skill that you could possibly reach, middle of the pack, maybe like diamond GM skill level and then.
Coach Mills (11:24.824)
Yeah. Yeah.
zazzastack (11:33.441)
Yeah. Thank you.
CaptainCoach (11:49.296)
like newer player, is Widow better or worse in each of those? So like at the highest levels of play, is Widow better or worse right now? Or was she like her old version? Because I wanna, yeah, go ahead, go ahead.
zazzastack (12:02.517)
I was was gonna say yeah, no, I think her new version, reworked widow, is better in like, every rank on a sense of more people have access to playing her. Like even though people could just select her and learn her beforehand, they-
didn't really like- like that sniper playstyle doesn't appeal to everyone. And even though it is sad that we've lost that niche, right now New Widow is playable to a lot more people because a lot more people prefer that faster fire rate and the amount of movement she does have. So I think in higher elo, like people are gonna play her more because her fire rate is a lot faster and she outputs a lot more damage in that sense.
And then it makes it easier for people who are in like the mid ranks or the lower ranks because they don't have to worry about their aim as much when they have more shots going out. Like they're going to hit more shots anyway now that she's got a faster fire rate. So they're always going to be outputting something, you know? Otherwise beforehand, if they just missed everything on their sidebar, then they wouldn't get any anything out of that.
CaptainCoach (13:02.82)
Right.
CaptainCoach (13:19.439)
Yeah, mean, Mills, I mean, this is something we've talked about a lot and Persicso we'll drag in here in a second. I feel like just over time, pretty much over the last year or so, they've just kind of been going through every character and kind of just lowering the skill ceiling of everything. You would agree with that?
zazzastack (13:36.824)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (13:39.234)
What what do you what do you per six though? Yeah, well, like, do you think that the game has increased the skill ceiling of characters or decreased? What do you what is your thoughts on that?
zazzastack (13:39.609)
I would.
Persixo (13:41.424)
What about that? About
Persixo (13:49.328)
I mean if you looky think about it, like with every character. For example, Magneto, like back in the day when I like the best Magneto in the world, there's nobody better than me. freaking and that I still am. But I you you I was trying to give some credit to other people 'cause Pinky Millon took my chain. But freaking, he took my chain, bruh. He took my heck
Coach Mills (13:56.665)
You still are bro. Come on, come on bro. No He took my two bro This motherfucker. Walk him down melon, this bitch Fuck.
CaptainCoach (13:57.782)
Back in the day.
CaptainCoach (14:02.277)
Ha ha ha ha
zazzastack (14:04.683)
You
Persixo (14:07.314)
That that was my nickname too, Brandy took it, bro. And then but anyway, Magneto, for example, I'm not sure if you guys ever played the Alpha with Magneto, but from my memory, when I played the Alpha, Magneto only had one bubble and he couldn't bubble himself. So it was literally just a projected bubble, right? And I was that that feels nasty, that feels like clunky. Then they were like, okay, let's make it to where he can either bubble himself or a teammate. And I was okay, that's that's fine. Then they give him the two bubbles where it was like himself and then a teammate, and people were complaining because they're like, but you you took away some skill expression, and then finally.
zazzastack (14:08.281)
I'm finding things.
Persixo (14:37.268)
Fast forward to thing and thing. I I'm not sure if you guys have seen thing, but thing started off with just if you just hit a right click, it's 50 shield. Then they made it to where it's like percentage-based damage of the thing, and then it went 100. Now it's like 150. I think it is 150.
Coach Mills (14:50.456)
Fun fifty to the max, yeah.
Persixo (14:51.664)
And then they added like the battle blitz sleep, which I think he needed, by the way. But they added that. And then like with Widow too, like a good Widow, like at least me, like a higher Elo. If somebody picked Widow, like if you knew, like, for example, X like was on the other team, you'd ban Widow because they could just run your lobby. They could just run your lobby. If they have a mantis tool.
Coach Mills (15:06.126)
Yeah.
zazzastack (15:07.487)
Exactly. And you never know when they are gonna run your lobby.
Persixo (15:10.34)
That's no no and no now, yeah. Yo, you you're having chuds like like like like people who just play like Hella and Phoenix. let me pick Widdle because it's literally like they got off angle and just burst you down like faster than Hella and Phoenix can. You know what I mean? Cause I like with Hella Hella and Phoenix, like you gotta like like hit him like think think in the head to do it, right? Whittle could just like like burst your body down like dun dun dun dun dun to your body and you're dead. So I would say, yeah, I would say like low-key, like slowly but surely, they're like lowering the skill like entry to characters. I would say so.
CaptainCoach (15:11.141)
Ha ha ha ha
zazzastack (15:16.185)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (15:30.157)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (15:38.575)
Well, 'cause that's what Captain Coach has said before, and I a hundred percent agree. Is like they're they're creating what is it called? Like homogeneity? Or I don't even know. Like it's like everything's the same. Like it like it like we're we're we're making instead of Widow having this like very unique identity, we're like Widowmaker players were good at Widow and that was it. Now it's just like any hit scan player is good at Widow. Like it's like 'cause they're very s it I mean it's just very, very similar. All the characters are very similar. And we see that a lot in this hit scan catalogue. I mean, like Gene
Persixo (15:59.826)
That's gonna wid all, yep.
Coach Mills (16:08.248)
To Cyclops, to Hella, to Widow. Like they're all just like different flavors. Like maybe there's a reason for that. Maybe it's because it's easier to balance these characters if you just make them different flavors. It's like they all do the same thing, but like you have your little flavor of the month. But I can understand why. we go under, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it legit. Like, like it feels like maybe divers will Well like maybe maybe it's like hard to innovate forever. And they're just like.
zazzastack (16:22.691)
Like you can, you can copy my homework but change it a little bit. Yeah.
Persixo (16:26.393)
Mm-hmm. Literally.
Coach Mills (16:35.106)
This is easy. It's easy to just move these things around and make all these characters like almost the same, but just like slightly different.
CaptainCoach (16:41.937)
Well, I mean, my thing with that is, first of all, I think there is a world where you can keep Widow's pure sniper identity and balance it. I mean, we were talking about it a little bit before the pod. We also mentioned it last week. Zaza, what do you think about just, I mean, I think you were basically saying more or less just reduce the damage of the sniper shot.
zazzastack (17:03.647)
Yeah, it's more like if they were to add those dual pistols because everyone was asking for them so that would have kept the community happy without doing the full rework. And like obviously, Widow's sniper headshot beforehand did almost like a full bar of health, not quite though. So adding the dual pistols by themselves would probably be a bit too much and you'd want to lower that sniper damage a tiny bit so that people have to like do a tiny little bit of tracking at the end to finish that kill.
CaptainCoach (17:32.092)
Sure. So what about headshots do the same amount of damage? Hell, you could even make them do more damage, but okay, only 40 % of the damage is upfront. Now you add a whatever, 60, 80 % bleed that takes down over five seconds. So it'll kill if they don't get attention, right? Like, cause I just feel like burst in a game like this is just, it's such a premium because of just all the sustain. Getting that kill is just so important. And that is what's so hard for them to balance around.
zazzastack (17:33.835)
But yeah.
zazzastack (17:47.662)
Yeah.
zazzastack (17:54.305)
Yeah.
zazzastack (17:58.378)
Yeah. I have thought about ideas like a bleed or something on the headshot or like poison or something like that, know, like kind of in the way of Widowmaker and Overwatch her venom mind can finish off someone. But yeah, if that was a bleed or something from Black Widow's headshot, that would definitely be another idea instead of adding the dual pistols and just keeping the batons in there.
CaptainCoach (18:04.441)
Okay. Or a debuff, you know?
zazzastack (18:25.399)
The, like, if people are wondering what the usage for batons is literally like, I don't use them anymore because Widow's Gun is like way better now. But I literally only use them to get past shields beforehand. And you can just walk up to the shield and beat them up, you know? Yeah.
CaptainCoach (18:37.57)
right.
Coach Mills (18:38.328)
Yeah it's a really
Persixo (18:40.402)
Mm-hmm.
CaptainCoach (18:41.251)
Right, right, right. then to your point then, Coach Mills, about the homo genuity or whatever the word is, like making everything more generic. Yeah, I do think that they're kind of trying, yeah, yeah. They're trying to make everything kind of fall into like a specific archetype, I feel like now, with the regenerative health, know, like Magneto didn't get that.
Coach Mills (18:48.546)
Yeah, I yeah, w yeah. I I didn't go to fucking coll like I didn't I didn't finish college, okay? And like I like I don't I don't know. I'm actually gonna look it up.
Persixo (18:54.236)
Yeah.
zazzastack (18:57.833)
Haha!
Coach Mills (19:09.026)
Homo homogeneity. Homogeneity is what it's yeah. That's that's how you say. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (19:12.441)
Right. So I think they're pushing people into like more of what their strengths are. So like they made the Dino tankier and thing tankier because they just walk down main choke. Meanwhile, Hulk and Thor get this like extra free healing because they're off doing their own thing. So they're kind of pushing people towards different roles. So with like a hero like Widow, I always thought like her biggest issue was once she got her picks, even if you were skilled, a lot of times you just wouldn't have enough damage to kill the tanks.
to really push people off of points and now probably more than ever. So I feel like a bit of it is just them trying to make every hero viable rather than unique. And I think that's kind of gonna be like a big issue with the game moving forward. Just curious to hear either of your thoughts on that because we've seen before they do kind of...
zazzastack (19:52.333)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (20:02.885)
have plans that we don't know about. I mean, with the season nine changes, you know, for a while we were wondering why are they doing this? Why are they doing that to here? And it's like, wait, well it's cause they had the season nine patch coming up. I'm wondering maybe they have something else on the docket, but yeah, just curious to hear your thoughts.
zazzastack (20:19.075)
Did you wanna go fast, Pasekzak? Okay. Yeah, no, I mean, like, it's, it was, I mean, you guys saw my reaction to that, whatever you want. was, I was so excited. I was devastated by it. Like, I don't know. I feel like, I feel like, yeah, it's, it's.
Persixo (20:21.645)
me? no got it. You got it. You got it.
Coach Mills (20:33.751)
Yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (20:35.194)
Yeah.
It sucks.
Coach Mills (20:39.798)
Yeah, I mean you lost you lost the hero that that you that's the that's the hero that you like. Like and
zazzastack (20:43.225)
Yeah, we lost the one hero that like literally the only reason I came to Rivals was because of Widow having a sniper. Black Widow being the sniper character, the hitscan sniper. I was a Widowmaker main, I had 2,000 hours on her on Overwatch. you know, I literally like I wasn't even going to touch Marvel Rivals until I saw Black Widow come out. So that's what brought me to the game. And like, I don't think it's really healthy for the game.
if they're taking niches out instead of like, you know, adding more in because you want to widen, like broaden your range of niches so that more people will come to the game. Otherwise it's just the same thing over and over and over. And I feel like what they did to Widow is they literally just added her to the Poke slot roster and now she's like just like any of them. Yes, they all have their own little differences, but they pretty much play the same, if not extremely similarly.
CaptainCoach (21:39.589)
At least she's S tier now though, right? Yeah.
Coach Mills (21:40.884)
Yeah. Well I
zazzastack (21:41.782)
I guess, I guess, but there is no other hitscan sniper in the game and everyone goes, why don't you just play Hawkeye? Well, Hawkeye is a projectile and he can't do what Aldwit used to do. He just doesn't feel the same. He doesn't hit the same. Like, yeah, it's nice having the one tap headshot, but like, I don't know. It's just...
Persixo (21:41.872)
Beyond S tier, bro.
Coach Mills (21:58.831)
He's also t he's also terrible even when you play him perfectly. He's actually like not not like Widow, that like you could play him in high Elo, like very reliably. like Hawkeye. Like so I w I wanted to I wanna interject this real quick, something about the reworks, because some people are not gonna really understand what you're saying, but I kinda wanna just like give them my perspective on it. Anytime a rework happens to any character, like you gotta understand that the the thing that people love about hero shooters is like people find their community.
zazzastack (22:06.112)
Mm. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (22:06.745)
I mean, I.
Coach Mills (22:27.032)
People find their characters that they really, really like and enjoy. And everyone has their community where it's like, like you see it on X, where it's like the the dive people hate the poke people, and the poke people hate this people. And like everyone, like everyone is like defending each other. Like Thor Nation. We all defend each other. I got s I got like a whole bunch of comments. It's like, I love that you defend Thor on the pod. It's like, fuck yeah, that's right. Let's. But like and and but like he hates Thor because we bullied this his Magneto bitch ass all the time. You know what I'm saying? I love you. But
zazzastack (22:45.463)
and the support players.
Persixo (22:46.168)
I hate Thor.
Persixo (22:51.164)
Hate Thor bruh. Hey Thor. Now it's true though. It's true. Cat just Thanos.
Coach Mills (22:57.058)
But that's the problem is like when you love something and then it gets changed, it's like, I I remember this like there's a lot of things that we don't want to take from Overwatch, but I remember that there was like I think it was I believe it was Aaron Keller that said they wanted to rework characters as little as possible because they understand that there are gonna be many people that delete their game when they do. Like that you you can disrupt a community of loyal people when you completely change a character. Like
Like, I mean, like like as an example, let's just say Cloak and Dagger. Like, what if tomorrow they decided to Cloak and Dagger a DPS? Like you could just completely ruin a community of people if they took out a character that they love and they don't feel like they can relate to that character anymore and like understand that character. So that's that is always gonna happen. The question is, should it ever happen? And on what sit what situations is it justifiable to happen? and I like everyone's gonna have a different opinion on
Maybe some people say yes or no, but it also could be your hero next. Like maybe it's Mag next, or maybe it's Hulk next, or maybe it's Thor, or maybe it's you know, reasonably I think the three that are probably on the chopping block are like Hawkeye, Squirrel Girl, and Wanda are probably on the chopping block as like potential we roll reworks. Maybe we don't care, but maybe someone else would. I don't know. What what do y'all think?
Persixo (24:13.158)
me well
It's funny because like to kind of like go a little bit back, like with Magneto, right? When Wanda's on his team with like the sword team up, it makes his right click like the charged one, and that's n I'm sorry, that's too nasty. I can't do it. Like I would rather use the Emma unenhanced than ha than have the super enhanced Wanda one because in like imagine like like for example like Zaza, right? She she like freaking I don't even know how many hours into Widow and then they change and now that's now now you feel like like you're lost. Like me with Mag, obviously like like to a smaller degree of you, like when a when a Wanda's on my team
Like I like I'll be like a please switch like like not not not even because not even because you're playing Wanda like not even because you're playing Wanda but because you're messing up me like you you like like now you're messing up my comment because as a mag I have like I have like eight almost eight hundred hours on mag like for me it's left click right click left click like like like like boom boom boom like that immediately but with the wanda like I'm so used to like just tapping it and then pressing my like pressing my primary now I have to like I'm stuck in this little dun dun dun like that I I I don't like that at all but
Coach Mills (24:47.432)
Ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (24:48.056)
Hahaha
zazzastack (25:02.147)
Mmm.
CaptainCoach (25:12.955)
Wait, hold up. having a Wanda, you view having a Wanda on your team per six, so is actually a nerf to you.
Persixo (25:21.04)
What they need to do with mag, magbuff, magbuff. What they need to do with that team up is make it so where if you have three rings, when you tap it, he'll just go like a quick, like immediately. Like I don't have like sit here and like, you know what I mean? Like, like keep it the same because like from what I've heard from like Flats and Boger and like a lot of the high elo like mag players, they they say the same thing. They say they'd rather like not have a Wanda on their team because it makes them feel clunky. And it's true. And before, I'm not sure you guys remember, when he re when when they released the update, they didn't get
CaptainCoach (25:46.811)
That's funny.
Persixo (25:51.034)
him the knockback. So it was even worse. So like so it had no knockback and you had to charge it up. And people were like, yeah, yeah, take this out the game. But to your question of I forgot your question. I'm not gonna lie, I forgot it. My bad. I forgot it.
Coach Mills (26:00.896)
No no it well I was I was specifically just talking about like when should reworks be something that they do?
CaptainCoach (26:01.66)
Hahaha
Persixo (26:08.002)
I think rework should happen when like to go back to Overwatch and I didn't really play Overwatch like how you guys did 'cause I ca I you guys like played it, played it, but Sombra, for example. Sombra where her perma invis was like d like like think about it, like she was just always in your back line and then she'll like she'll just poke you out and then and then when you're about to kill her she'll just like like disappear. You know what I mean? out of there. Like that was just unhealthy for the game. Nobody liked it. And then once they introduced bans they like she was permanently banned. So they said, Yeah right now? I don't even
Coach Mills (26:20.906)
Extremely unhealthy, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (26:22.489)
Mm.
Coach Mills (26:34.2)
She's still being permanently banned, by the way. But but but but she she sh she's a she's permanently banned today just because of how people remember her. Not even how strong she is today. Like people hate that character so much that they literally will keep pan they keep banning her. Like even like it's like that's how bad this character was. But like I don't think we have anything even remotely close to that in this game. Like people might think that there is, but there there really is not. Like, not even remotely close to that level.
zazzastack (26:36.345)
I'm an avid sombra hater.
Persixo (26:43.355)
Persixo (26:49.785)
I don't blame him.
zazzastack (26:49.899)
I'm one of them. I'm one of them.
CaptainCoach (26:50.821)
Just like...
Persixo (27:01.671)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (27:03.778)
That was like an extreme level. But it wasn't the only one that got reworked. I think it like the one I like to bring up a lot is Doomfist. He's he he got changed from a DPS to a tank. and and one of the reasons he did is because they thought crowd control was unhealthy. C C so they wanted to remove a lot of that from the they wanted to give crowd control specifically to tanks in Overwatch two and they wanted to remove it mostly from the DPS role. So they had to a character that was completely built on crowd control, they had to take him out of the role because that was like their new philosophy.
Persixo (27:12.625)
Tank.
zazzastack (27:14.199)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (27:31.523)
But that that was like there are people, there are Doomfist Banes that are still making rants and videos about like praying to Blizzard that they will bring him back to DPS today. And it's been like three years. Like they're still asking for it today. Like a and they I mean, and it it's cause you can never you could never play that again. You could never do what you did there. And that gate that character had like like a very, very high skill ceiling, like a million things you could learn and do.
Persixo (27:43.334)
Today. Sheesh.
zazzastack (27:47.691)
I, yeah.
Coach Mills (27:59.245)
And you just can never do that anymore. You can't. Like they just it's y you it's like their character that they liked is deleted, basically. But
zazzastack (28:02.722)
Yeah.
Yeah, no, it's... Can I add on to it? onto the topic. I... When it comes to whether you should or like what time is right to over rework a character, I don't know if you guys picked up in the dev vision that they put out for the over rework that they said, we've tried to balance her. But her last balance change was season 3.5, I believe? And that was her Phoenix team up, which ended up being more useless than the Punisher and Hawkeye team up.
Coach Mills (28:08.236)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, go for it.
Coach Mills (28:32.44)
That's that's a really good that's a really, really good point. Last last it's the last straw or the last thing. If you can't figure it out, right, I I a hundred percent agree with you.
CaptainCoach (28:34.362)
Mmm.
zazzastack (28:36.462)
Yeah.
zazzastack (28:41.183)
Yeah. Yeah, that's the- yeah, that's my point is like if you're gonna rework a character, make it be the last thing you do. If you possibly- if you've tried so many things and you've tried all these different things and like you just don't know what to do anymore, then yeah, rework a character. I think it's fair then, but like if there's still a problem by then. But like yeah, they didn't ever try. They didn't try. And they said they tried, but yeah. Yeah.
Coach Mills (28:59.502)
They didn't even that that's a good point. That's a good point. They didn't even try. They didn't even they didn't even do anything. They didn't they didn't they didn't change anything about her. That's a good point. That's actually a good point.
CaptainCoach (29:01.435)
Howard!
CaptainCoach (29:07.441)
How much do you think that them not trying was them misinterpreting the ranked data that they have because Widow is the universal throw hero? A lot of it.
zazzastack (29:18.637)
think a lot of it was, I'm not gonna lie. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Yeah. You go.
Coach Mills (29:19.416)
Yeah. So so I so I I
Persixo (29:20.24)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (29:23.51)
I have a different theory than y'all. I'm I'm y'all can continue, but I have a theory. My my theory is that this rework has been already done for a long
zazzastack (29:26.894)
Yeah.
zazzastack (29:32.857)
I've heard that they were working on it for a long time, but realistically, season 3.5 is like too early on to be like...
Coach Mills (29:33.666)
That's my theory.
Coach Mills (29:43.001)
Well th they but they said that they've been working on this new team up system for a year. Or nine nine months. So like nine months ago, was it nine months ago? Like three point five? So like for me it it it like I think they decided they probably decided, like, hey, we're gonna rework her and then they just stopped balancing her. You know what I like that's the only thing that makes sense to me, you know, but like but it it is I a hundred percent agree with you that like they didn't even they didn't they didn't try any of the community
zazzastack (29:47.127)
Yeah, and that's fine. Like I actually do like the team up system.
zazzastack (29:54.521)
I can't remember.
zazzastack (30:01.047)
Mm.
Yeah, mean me personally, yeah.
Persixo (30:03.888)
Yeah, makes sense.
zazzastack (30:11.798)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (30:13.174)
recommendations. They didn't you know, there's some people that complained about the kick. There's some people that wanted the the MAC tens. There's some people wanted the different like a biz a bazillion different changes and they didn't do any of those things and they went straight to a rework.
zazzastack (30:22.169)
Yeah. Yeah. Like I feel like they could have at least experimented with a few of them before they went to the rework. Um, like I don't know, I just feel like, you know, the last change being in Season 3.5, whether they were planning the rework or not, they still could have tried one thing here and there. Um, and like I think honestly it's pretty early on in the game to be reworking a character in my opinion, like, or at least planning a rework for a character in Season 3.5 is very early. So.
CaptainCoach (30:48.389)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (30:48.814)
'Cause 'cause my favorite character, of course, is Thor. And Thor did get a rework, multiples, mini reworks throughout his life. And I think he's finally in a state not everyone likes him, like like someone like over here, you know, doesn't not everyone compute like university likes him. But I love the way that Thor plays right now. And a lot of h his identity now is didn't exist when he came out. Like your ability to like one eighty tanks like around the corners and like trap people and like just bullied fucking
CaptainCoach (30:51.057)
That's very true.
zazzastack (30:52.279)
Yeah.
zazzastack (30:58.649)
Mm.
Persixo (31:03.793)
Yes.
Persixo (31:16.796)
Worst change ever. Worst change ever.
Coach Mills (31:18.572)
Magnetos like every single game. you could not do that on launch. And like it took him a long time to like change here, change here, change here, and then they changed how awakening works and they kind of tweaked a whole bunch of things. And now he's in a state that I really like. And they just didn't do that with Widow. That's that's how they didn't do any of that. They didn't do any of those little things.
zazzastack (31:23.8)
Right.
CaptainCoach (31:24.015)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (31:33.696)
Yeah, exactly. Like, that's what they could have done, you know? And that's, I think that was where most of my frustration came from when I reacted to that vision as like, why are you doing this now when you've barely tried anything? And I feel like personally that widow, old widow kit would have thrived in this new meta with all the team ups overhaul and stuff. And I think if we made her team ups the old Punisher one and the old Hawkeye one, be able to switch between those.
CaptainCoach (31:54.267)
Wow.
zazzastack (32:01.207)
I feel like that would have been amazing because the Hawkeye one would have been great for alt fights or against fast moving characters because you get the afterimage of them that you can finish them off with, you know? Or the Punisher one was really good at actually putting out that little bit of extra damage and because it was piercing, it was piercing body shots, no head shots, but you could finish off someone really quickly in the back. And I feel like that would have brought Widow like...
She would have thrived in this team up better, I'm not gonna lie. In the team up overhaul.
CaptainCoach (32:31.697)
Her team ups are kind of just generic damage increases. I feel like they're kind of underwhelming compared to some of the other ones in the game personally. But I think with her old kit, if you gave her maybe a temporary whatever that the gun she has, yeah, I feel like that would be great to be able to swap between them.
Coach Mills (32:34.454)
Yeah.
zazzastack (32:35.095)
They are, but...
zazzastack (32:40.737)
Yeah.
zazzastack (32:47.593)
Yeah. Yeah, it's like the old Hawkeye one and Punisher one were on her old kit, like if they kept her old kit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but if they were on the new kit, it wouldn't really make sense. Like the new ones aren't too bad, but it's kind of like the same thing, just reskinned in my opinion. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (32:54.481)
Oh, her, okay, yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (33:02.758)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (33:03.63)
So my other theory here, and this is based on a combiz a combination of like the state of the game and the way that they're balancing the game. I think that internally they've kind of decided they don't like snipers. And the reason that I believe that is because one, they reworked Widowmaker, and they also have Hawkeye has been very bad. Like he's one of the worst DPS right now, still, and he's been one of the worst DPS for like probably like five seasons straight. He's very bad, he's very easy to dive.
zazzastack (33:15.395)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (33:30.658)
And we're also seeing an increase in like the sustained cycle in this game, which is like C and D gets bubble into block into fade. And then there are really powerful tanks like Cap and Venom that go in, can constantly apply pressure, can bait out these cooldowns and kill through, but it's like not instant, right? Like every engagement takes like eight to ten seconds to come to a conclusion, versus like a Hawkeye or a widow, the engagements could take seconds.
And I'm not saying that that should or shouldn't be in the game, but I think internally the devs have decided we don't want these things to be meta in our game. Like and in the case of Hawkeye, they've just kept him terrible. I actually wouldn't be surprised if Hawkeye's next on the chopping block for a rework. And in Widow's case they reworked her. I mean that that's my theory. I don't know if it I'm right or wrong, but it does it doesn't feel it kind of feels like they've given up on one shot snipers or like the ability to do massive chunks of damage.
zazzastack (34:12.621)
Mm.
zazzastack (34:18.326)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (34:22.629)
Yeah. It's just sad because, you know, like I said, like I don't play Widow, but you know, I love that sniper play style. And it's like, dude, when I'm throwing games, like I got to get all the way to my ultimate before I got to snipe people. Like, what is that? I just want to like...
zazzastack (34:31.746)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (34:37.582)
When I'm throwing
zazzastack (34:38.697)
Can't do that anymore. Can't do that anymore. I was actually, I was in um, I was in Songju's chat the other day because I rated him after Waystream and he said the same thing. He's like, I can't, I can't throw him widow anymore. Like, I don't know, I don't what to do now. Like, yeah, I do good. Like, I used to just go, what do I, what do I want him to like, yeah.
Persixo (34:40.562)
Bro.
CaptainCoach (34:51.067)
She's too good!
Coach Mills (34:51.417)
Ha ha ha.
Pe people people think I'm still trying to win this game. God damn it. That's
CaptainCoach (34:59.601)
Quick side note, is that why it's Widow's get MVP all the time, by the way, is cause there's a performance relative to other Widows are just against throwers. is that it or is that so? I feel like Widow gets MVP's, I feel like Widow gets MVP more than any hero other than maybe like Jeff.
zazzastack (35:10.627)
Wait, why is getting lost?
MVP. Honestly? Yeah, she... I... The reason I think she's getting MVP a lot right now is because the stats still haven't completely evened out from Old Widow. So everyone was getting MVP because they were performing better stats than Old Widow. Especially like damage number wise. Yeah, by comparison.
Coach Mills (35:15.948)
A widow breathes and they get fucking MVP, yeah. It's
CaptainCoach (35:18.939)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (35:31.982)
By comparison. They're like, You're doing three hundred times more than the average widow damage wise. It's like, yeah, of hit in history. That's funny.
CaptainCoach (35:38.71)
It seems like a bit of oversight, maybe something they missed there.
zazzastack (35:40.544)
Mm. Yeah, so I think that's a lot of why she gets MVP a lot right now. I think we'll see... We'll still see her get MVP until they decide to nerf her a little bit because I feel like the little damage buff they did was a little bit too much. Just a tiny bit too much. So I think at the end of this season we'll probably see a slight damage nerf to Widow. But yeah, no.
Coach Mills (36:10.018)
And that's kind of what I really wanted to ask you, because like I know you really want old widow back. And I know you really don't like New Widow. But I am gonna be honest with you, they're probably not gonna do that. Like I I wish they would, but I just remember being in that same spot with Doomfist as the Doomfist player. And I just remember that's like devs, they take a long time to do stuff like this, and even if they do bring it back, it would be a long time.
zazzastack (36:16.171)
Yeah, desperately.
I know, yeah.
zazzastack (36:27.747)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (36:37.452)
like a year before they would ever reel back this decision. And you're honestly more likely to get another character that fits what you like than Widow returning to her old self. So if that is the case, do you still enjoy rivals? Do you still enjoy Widow? Are you just gonna wait and cross your fingers for a character that does you know, meet that? Wha what what's your thoughts? Where are you at?
zazzastack (36:37.985)
Yeah.
Yeah.
zazzastack (36:48.406)
Yeah.
zazzastack (36:58.027)
What?
I feel like it's a little bit of everything. Like, yeah, I still love Rivals. It's a comfort game for me. So it's like, like even though the community can be crazy, like it's still a comfort game for me. So yeah, and I still like how the other hits games play. I just don't have anywhere near as much fun as I used to on Widow. And like, like I used to, I used to feel like I had to work for the wins on Widow.
Coach Mills (37:08.622)
It's like
zazzastack (37:27.321)
Now it feels like I can just sit back and do whatever. And I... Yeah! No! No, yeah, pretty much, pretty much. Like... Yeah, not this dude.
Coach Mills (37:30.928)
you so you feel like every other Pokemon. No, I'm scared We hate poke around here. No, no not not not this guy.
Persixo (37:33.659)
Yeah.
Persixo (37:38.342)
No Nami, I love poke. I love poke. I love poke. It's the best comp. It's the best comp. Not dive. I hate dive.
Coach Mills (37:43.16)
Yeah, it's
CaptainCoach (37:43.44)
I don't know if you know this, Azza, but last season when Cyclops came out, Coach Mills went on his poke arc and his whole season, he's gotten really good at rage baiting because he was just playing poke all season. you got eternity like super quick on Cyclops. Like you just rolled every lob.
zazzastack (37:52.217)
really?
Ha
Coach Mills (37:57.271)
Is the best.
zazzastack (37:59.738)
Oh, that's crazy. That's crazy. Yeah, no, I'm not gonna lie. I just liked working for those ones and like...
Coach Mills (38:00.143)
That character was stupid.
zazzastack (38:08.689)
having a bit of a challenge, like I don't know, like not to say that Poke now doesn't feel like it has any challenges, like it still has its challenges but like every role does, but it's old widow, like playing a sniper character feels so much more rewarding when you're getting value and which in turn kind of makes it more fun to play and you know you feel like you really got to work for it and you always want to improve on it and you know like
I don't know, that was just my perspective on Witter, so.
CaptainCoach (38:38.385)
Per-Persixo, what changes would they have to make to Mag to make you not want to play that hero?
Coach Mills (38:44.83)
Yeah.
Persixo (38:45.11)
What changes would they have for me for me not to want to play him? Yo, chill, chill, chill. I'm not gonna lie. The my like yo, the way my rivals treats Mag, he's like the tank version of Luna. Like, I think like that's like the golden boy. Like, they're not gonna they're not gonna mess with him. He's he's too good. But what they would have to do is make revert it to one bubble, make it to where he I mean, I mean Yeah, one bubble.
Coach Mills (38:47.82)
Like are you are you in love with this? They're gonna do exactly what you say. No
zazzastack (38:47.865)
This is bait for the magri work, okay?
CaptainCoach (38:48.043)
I like, like... dark timeline
CaptainCoach (39:02.788)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (39:09.026)
They remove his shields. They turn him into a DPS.
CaptainCoach (39:09.201)
So change the way he plays, like change his primary.
Persixo (39:14.062)
but he'll do damage though. Hold up. Cause it'll do damage though. Cause because I I'll I mean it depends though. If he's chunky though, like for example, if he's like like like like like 350, 375 DPS, I might do it. I might I might I might get my hands dirty. But if they say 250, I don't I don't can't I can't do that. Like I Punisher, I he's 300, like I play like Moon Knight and I'm it's over for me. I can't do it
Coach Mills (39:15.958)
Yeah man. Per sixo DPS main? my god.
CaptainCoach (39:19.505)
I mean
zazzastack (39:20.185)
Join me.
CaptainCoach (39:34.822)
Meg's kind of the best poke hero in the game right now. Kind of the best.
Persixo (39:37.338)
He's so good. He's the gold. He's the gold.
Coach Mills (39:38.455)
Yeah. Yeah, well we'll we'll we'll talk about Magnerfs in a second. But before we do before we do, I wanna talk about just but outside of the widow, I wanna talk about how do y'all feel about season nine? Like the direction of season nine. Two new team up for every single character. Obvious power creep to the game, but everyone gets more tools. There's a lot more crap going on. So what do you how do y'all feel about that? What it per six I wanna first pass it to you. Yeah.
zazzastack (39:43.961)
I'm
Persixo (39:45.009)
But wait what?
Persixo (40:04.14)
Yo, I can go first for this one. I can go first for this one. I love Marvel Rivals hashtag and like the battle. Sponsored me. I'm just kidding. but freaking I don't know. Genuinely though, this is the best seat, like me, like me personally. Like compared to the Alpha and now, because I love the Alpha, because obviously it's a new game, you know, that's a new game, you love it. But this, I haven't had as much fun on Marvel Rivals since this new season. Like, maybe could I mag and like, because you play mag and they finally gave him something good. but this new season has been amazing. I think for everybody, like, like from like other tanks too.
zazzastack (40:06.103)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, go for it, go for it.
Coach Mills (40:09.678)
Sponsor.
zazzastack (40:33.645)
Ha.
Persixo (40:34.004)
People who play thing. People who play things are having a blast. People who play Emma, they're having a blast. People who play freaking not widow. I mean, you know, not widow, but people who play Yeah, yeah. Literally, I mean, all the poke slop, they love it. They love it, right? Like, I just think this this was a good change, you know, besides like the power people of Venom. I hate Venom. But I think he is not fine. Same with Thor. I'm telling you, I'm gonna hit up Guangguan soon. I'm No, he's no, no, no.
CaptainCoach (40:36.995)
yeah.
Coach Mills (40:41.228)
No.
zazzastack (40:41.611)
Not the old Widowmaids, everyone but the old Widowmaids is having a blast.
Coach Mills (40:44.078)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (40:53.698)
No no no no he's fine, still worry. Buffs no. No, he's so fine. No, no, no, no, no. He's fine, no, no. Perfectly fine. No. He's I'm kidding. Buff Thor.
zazzastack (40:56.441)
Yeah.
She's not talking about the venom, no?
Persixo (41:02.258)
Don't even get me started on Venom. But genuinely, this is the best season of Marvel Rivals. I don't think I'm gonna be ts. There's not much they can do that's better than this. Like
Coach Mills (41:10.498)
Yeah, we show show it go up to the go up to the pick rate of Magneto. Go up to the pick rate of the Magneto. Look at it Sixty per is wait, is that sixty percent pick rate? Sixty percent pick rate, fifty three point eight eight percent win rate. Are we trolling right now? He has more win he has higher win rate than Venom and he's picked three times as much.
CaptainCoach (41:14.319)
Yeah, just just just take this all with a grain of salt right here. Just
Persixo (41:14.384)
Why is Mag S?
Persixo (41:18.874)
Yo, that's that that's AI. That's l
CaptainCoach (41:23.46)
That's pick-rate.
Persixo (41:24.934)
That that's eight.
CaptainCoach (41:27.825)
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Persixo (41:29.19)
That's literally AI though. That's literally AI though.
Persixo (41:36.036)
Okay, but to mag's defense though. To mag's defense. People would rather go against. No, no, no, no, no. I'm gonna cook right now. I'm gonna cook right now. Because because perception is reality, right? People would rather go against a cracked mag than a cracked venom. Because it feels suffocating. Like with mag, you you never feel like, this mag is just he's like you you you always feel like if a mag is diffing you, it's because he's just better than you. You know what I mean? He's just better. You know what I mean? Well, my my my dad's yelling, but
Coach Mills (41:40.034)
Yeah, he has two too strong a defense. That's why that's why we're in this problem now.
zazzastack (41:42.965)
Little cook, little cook.
CaptainCoach (41:45.201)
Bye.
Coach Mills (41:47.489)
okay.
zazzastack (42:00.759)
Unless you're a what I mean.
Coach Mills (42:03.094)
Yeah, well no, I I do feel suffocating cause I know my fucking cloak and dagger's gonna die every single fucking time to their mag. No, I no I'm I'm not I'm not saying it's cause you're good. I'm gonna cloak and dagger's bad. She just keeps ulting into you.
Persixo (42:05.638)
That's not true.
That's not just yo just ice block! Just ice block! Just ice block!
zazzastack (42:10.367)
No, no, no, no, but,
No.
Persixo (42:16.166)
No.
zazzastack (42:18.029)
Look, the issue is the fact that as a widow mane, we always get sold out to my mag for some reason. Maybe it's just me. Maybe it's just me, but like, yeah. Well, even with my slam now, they just wait for me to slam, they just-
Persixo (42:23.28)
I do that, yeah. I know I do it all the time.
Coach Mills (42:25.048)
Y'all ca it's cause y'all can't run away fast enough. They know it's a free kill. Yeah. Yeah.
Persixo (42:28.954)
Literally.
zazzastack (42:32.569)
wait for it, I try and use it last second and they still get me and then and then the whole game when they don't have ult, when they're not solo ulting me, the whole game they are poking me and getting me off yeah yeah with the sword or or with their primary they can sit in the front line being their tanky cells and then they're still just looking at me they're tunneling me and then like like you've got tanks in front of you, other people in front of you like get lost
Persixo (42:32.806)
Just track.
They still got huh.
Coach Mills (42:37.558)
Ha ha ha.
Persixo (42:42.936)
With the sword, with the sword, I
Coach Mills (42:44.726)
Yeah.
Persixo (42:48.081)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (42:57.328)
Good.
Nah nah. She's too lethal.
Coach Mills (43:01.878)
So so how how so how much should we nerf Mag? I'm scared. No, but I'm I'll I'll okay I'm gonna I'm gonna give you the these are these would be my nerfs for next season. I'm gonna see if y'all agree or disagree. Okay? He's my nerfs. You you ready to hear him? I think Venom most likely needs a nerf. I play a lot of Venom. That character's fucking atroc an atrocity. That character definitely needs a nerf. I Black Cat.
Persixo (43:06.566)
You should Mag should not be
zazzastack (43:06.969)
Let's just make it so we can't alt-witter. We'll just make it so we can't alt-witter.
CaptainCoach (43:07.345)
That's a bit of a leading question.
Persixo (43:10.5)
No no. Mag genu I'm telling. Don't work.
zazzastack (43:22.083)
Okay.
zazzastack (43:28.781)
Yeah. Yes. I hate black cat as much as I hate sombra, so.
Coach Mills (43:30.786)
Like what the fuck is that character? Like you can't even track her. but like we don't have to kill her like before, but like maybe make her a little bit easier to track and not be as like the immortality frames, I don't know. Mantis most likely needs a nerf too, because she has like a Yeah, yeah, go for
zazzastack (43:44.214)
I want... Can I just like interject real quick, sorry, with the black cat? I feel like they should make it so that you can actually hit her when she does have her eye frames. Instead of them being eye frames, just make a damage reduction at the least, like...
Persixo (43:45.927)
Yes.
Persixo (43:54.127)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (43:55.253)
Yeah, yeah. Or or you could give her maybe a little bit of shields, but not an iframe. Maybe you know, but you can make her C C she could be CC immune, but then she still takes damage. Or something. Something.
zazzastack (44:00.479)
Yeah. Yeah. Just make it so you can hit her. Because... Yeah. Yeah. It's because like I can't kill her in that eye frame so I have to wait for her to go back but she can do damage to me and I hate it. Like why can't I do damage to her when I can fully see all of her colours? Like she's not even like a different shade or anything like that to show that she's invulnerable, you know? Or anything like that and... yeah.
Persixo (44:08.358)
Yes.
Coach Mills (44:23.938)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (44:25.242)
I think your stealth needs a bit more of a visual indicator, even just like a little animation.
Coach Mills (44:28.286)
What what if what if what if she didn't go full stealth, but she went like almost completely stealth, like halo transparency where you could kind of see like it's like a warping of the air a little bit. You could still kind of see her. So she's not completely invisible. My my my problem is like if she walks into your back line with a whole bunch of coins
zazzastack (44:31.426)
Yeah.
zazzastack (44:40.985)
Mmm, I feel like that would be interesting.
Coach Mills (44:49.024)
She can just do a whole bunch of bullshit and you can just never see her or touch her. It's like she's the fucking yellow flash of of Kodah. Like she's like teleporting around, bro. Like, what the fuck is happening? Like, I don't know where she's at. so I don't know. And then and then, like I said, I think Mantis, like, the win rates, like, don't lie, it's just like way too high. Like, extremely high. I mean, she's winning, I think it's like 59% of the time at like a 20% win pick rate. It's like the one of the highest win rates to pick rate ratios that we've ever seen. Those three.
zazzastack (44:50.957)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (44:57.552)
Okay.
zazzastack (45:00.035)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (45:19.82)
And then Mag, of course. No, I'm skipping. I was kidding. but like if it like that I think like you you said when Mag is better, the game is better. I know that's your thing. I actually don't think that Mag is is that big of a problem. What I would like to see after those three, those are like the big three, which is just it's just literally Venom, Black Cat, probably Elsa and Widow a little bit, and fucking Mantis. After that, it could just be team up tweaks. That's it. You could buff if a team up is underperforming, you could buff it. If a teamup's overperforming, you could nerf it.
Persixo (45:21.042)
Stop lying.
zazzastack (45:25.634)
and WIDDAR.
Persixo (45:28.932)
It's true.
Coach Mills (45:49.475)
Try to make it so every team up is like, you know, reasonably there's an option. You know, one or the other instead of just like clearly one's better. And then that's that's all you have to do, in my opinion. What do you think? Is is there any character I missed off the list? Is there any character that you don't think deserves to be on the list? What the fuck? I I'll I'll I'll No, I here here's here's my theory. as you know, I finally been climbing a little bit today.
zazzastack (45:57.69)
Mm.
Persixo (46:04.583)
Thor.
And
CaptainCoach (46:08.379)
It seems very personally targeted.
zazzastack (46:11.605)
Bye.
Persixo (46:12.146)
Mm.
Coach Mills (46:16.46)
Here's my theory as to why Thor is dom like doing really, really well right now. Cause he's the he is like a Mag hard counter. I think he's like the like Mag doesn't have hardly any counters in the game, but Thor really fucks with him, like a lot. Because you can't really defend yourself like reasonably against a a like a Thor because he just kidnaps you over and over again. And and Mag is in like fifty percent of games. Like there's always like a there's always a a kidnap target for for Thor.
Like Thor is is not gonna be great against a lot of different tanks. Like he hates Emmas like random shit, but he loves mags. He loves fighting mags. But it's like we're natural enemies, bro. I can't I don't know. I actually played a lot of mag today too, it's fun. But I'm never playing him against a Thor. Not doing
Persixo (46:48.178)
It's terrible. It's terrible. Like, the only counter to Thor as max, it's not even a counter. It's like what you have to do is once you see him and like you have to bubble yourself. And if he's in your face already, like already grinding up for the next one, because by the time he he gets you, he'll like your bubbles down. You have to you have to smack him with a right click. If you miss that right click, it's GG. Just go next. Like, just have just do you have it? Thor's yours. It's yours. You can have it, bro.
zazzastack (46:53.417)
Hahaha
CaptainCoach (46:53.615)
I... I... I...
Coach Mills (47:12.61)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (47:14.009)
I really like versing Thor on both old widow and new widow because it was easy to headshot him beforehand so I was able to melt him with headshots and then now even though he has that extra like the hella revive team up or like undead or whatever you want to call it like now you just melt him when he has that anyway because of the new widow like yeah yeah maybe one day I mean
Coach Mills (47:33.858)
Yeah. I mean po po all the Pokeslop characters just farm Thor. Like that's why Thor's never gonna see pro play, 'cause he just gets he just get pokeslopped to hell.
zazzastack (47:42.935)
old widow saw it once, so...
Coach Mills (47:45.032)
May yeah, maybe. His numbers would have to be crazy 'cause it'd just have to be insane.
CaptainCoach (47:49.906)
I think for the Mantis to go back to that, I think part of the reason they've always really struggled with Mantis and why particularly now she's doing so good is because she's always had the choice to be able to use her resources for more damage or healing, whereas like a lot of healers, it's just like you just fire it down main choke and it's balanced around that. So I think that specifically for the devs has been really, I hear myself echoing. I think it might be you, Purrse.
zazzastack (48:16.601)
That's awesome, isn't it?
CaptainCoach (48:17.905)
really hard for them to balance around now that she actually has like main healer type healing while still having the option to do the damage amps because She gets her ult before any support right now if she just pretty much prios healing like it's it's it's crazy while still having all the damage buffs So I think for me, I just got a follow There needs to be a there needs to there needs to be more of a choice I think when making that decision or else you're just gonna have to like lower her output, which I would be cool if they didn't
Coach Mills (48:37.416)
What the fuck?
zazzastack (48:37.529)
W.
CaptainCoach (48:47.729)
lower her output as long as they made it more of a choice between those two things.
Coach Mills (48:51.054)
Well, also what we're seeing too, 'cause I I hundred percent agree with you, Captain Coach, and we're also seeing like this is the first season where she's like really good in two supports and of course she's like the best in triple. So like regardless of the comp you're playing, like you pretty much can play Mantis like almost every time unless you're playing like Groot, Dino or some shit like that. Like a hard brawl. If you're doing that, maybe not, but like every other comp. And she's yeah.
CaptainCoach (49:01.935)
Yeah. Exactly.
CaptainCoach (49:10.127)
Yeah. You're in triple, you just spam damage amp, you're in double, you spam heals. That's why our win rate's high. And I think that really, at end of the day, go back to Mag and Widow being more generically usable. They're just pickable in more situations. Hulk is very situational right now. That means he's just not as good of a hero as other heroes. You can pick something every game. That's, think, why they're trying to make everything a bit more generic is because they do eventually, when they have 200 Marvel characters in the game, they're going to be so overwhelmed that they need to have categories of things to be able to be like,
Coach Mills (49:39.182)
Ha ha.
CaptainCoach (49:40.121)
Or else it's just gonna be, it's gonna be worse. I do think a bit of what we've been talking about so far is future-proofing for them.
zazzastack (49:48.504)
Mm.
Coach Mills (49:49.773)
I I could I could definitely see that. Yeah, for sure. It it does it it it does make me wonder with new characters, are they gonna keep exploring new ground or are they going to, you know, just like keep putting them into the boxes, you know? Like I'll do a little bit of both.
CaptainCoach (50:04.017)
They'll probably do both. They'll probably do both. I really, because like, I mean, if they've shown like within a year or whatever, a widow, like being able to completely change her as a hero pretty much, mean, who's to say they like, they might just throw something at a wall, see what sticks and be like, okay, this is, no one's safe, no one's safe.
zazzastack (50:18.711)
No one's safe. No one's safe from the devs. That's I've learned. I thought we were safe because we got a cool summer skin and it was legendary and customizable but no, we were not safe. We were not safe.
Coach Mills (50:20.532)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (50:26.641)
yeah, that's always a good sign.
Coach Mills (50:26.892)
No the no no no no no y you y that was the s that was the sign that you were gonna get reworked. Like they have to sell that skin somehow.
Persixo (50:29.094)
Got set up.
Persixo (50:34.257)
Yep.
zazzastack (50:34.329)
I was so excited, you know, I literally said in my reaction video to that skin, I trust the devs with everything now. And look what they did.
CaptainCoach (50:42.075)
You know, all they needed to rework? what? Yeah.
Coach Mills (50:42.823)
That's some Game of Thrones level yeah you've you fucked up. I'm sorry.
zazzastack (50:46.893)
So.
Yeah, yeah, I did.
CaptainCoach (50:49.65)
Mm-hmm. that's all they needed to rework about Widow was, wait, hold up.
Coach Mills (50:55.672)
Are you drinking out of a fucking is that a shoe cup? That's a boot cup.
Persixo (50:57.842)
Is that a boot?
CaptainCoach (50:59.057)
Yeah, they just... We've heard a lot of complaints about her kick. Her anti-dive, so I... I just thought this would be funny to have. I don't know where I was gonna use it. That's a boot. Nah. It's not even mine. I don't know where this came from.
Coach Mills (51:04.46)
yeah. Yeah, that's I I like it. Yeah, that's sick.
zazzastack (51:07.929)
Wait, that's crazy! Wait, that's actually a boot! I didn't even realize! I was trying to figure out what it was, I'm like, that looks like a goblet.
Coach Mills (51:15.694)
one thing so per six though we yeah literally Friday or just now we Captain Coach and I played in your tournament. You hosted a tournament with E Igloo? Eglu e Egilu. God dang it, I keep messing it up. But no, that tournament was the it was a it was an amazing tournament. I I actually I want to give you mad props for putting that on because it was so sick. It was so sick. I I I'm extremely excited for the next one.
Persixo (51:30.403)
E D Lou, E D Lou.
CaptainCoach (51:31.919)
Go to tournament.
zazzastack (51:33.017)
I'm
Persixo (51:39.474)
Appreciate that.
zazzastack (51:42.585)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (51:44.141)
Maybe Zaza will come through for that one. That'd be cool. But it was really, really fun. and it was quick. Like, okay, so we so we've talked before about how other tournaments are run. Sometimes they don't fucking end until 2 a.m. Because there's so much downtime. Rou you know, single LM, every single team or s like single LM and ticket placements, domination one round into cutting to top four. Like such a such a well run s you know tournament. and you know, I had I had a lot of fun. I had a lot of fun.
zazzastack (51:46.265)
Hey
Persixo (51:55.728)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (52:12.94)
I did want to talk about real quickly though, there was drama in that tournament with what is called the worst team ever drafted. So how it worked in this tournament was everyone got to draft their team in order. You know, like everyone got to draft their team. And there was one team in particular, Xeno's team, where they drafted what people are calling literally the worst team of all time, because not only did they not win a single match, they didn't win a single scrim. They didn't win a single map the entire tournament. But
Persixo (52:15.994)
Okay.
Coach Mills (52:41.634)
Then they proceed to make TikToks about each other. Everyone's calling each other trash. What are your thoughts on it? tournament tournament host. What are your thoughts on the t Yeah No, it it's my it's my I love watching the TikTok content. It's so funny.
zazzastack (52:47.553)
And they made a diss track too, right?
Persixo (52:47.854)
Yeah, A.
zazzastack (52:54.324)
Yeah.
Persixo (52:54.702)
It's funny, they'll drop one of like like for example, Kobe will drop a video, then three minutes later you'll see Entei post. I'm like, hold on, let me lock in and you go back and forth between the two.
zazzastack (53:00.659)
Yeah! I saw Ante post like 11 different videos of Sully like he posted 8!
Coach Mills (53:00.97)
Yeah yeah.
Yeah, he did. He fucking physics. You gotta pull it up, K. It's so it's so funny. yeah He
Persixo (53:05.53)
And I was and I was tapped in.
zazzastack (53:09.145)
Bye!
CaptainCoach (53:09.261)
Hey, you gotta get paid somehow, right?
Persixo (53:11.258)
Hey, listen. That's like making like making making the best out of a bad situation. You know what I mean? Like like I'm gonna be honest, I don't think they were ever really beefing. I and and I I think he confirmed it later on they were never beefing. Something I'm telling Like, if that like like as a tournament host, no no, it's over. They reheating old food. They're gonna say you're you're reheating old food. But
zazzastack (53:11.722)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (53:16.65)
Yeah Making the back. I You still can, it's not too late. No, I just can't
zazzastack (53:22.647)
Maybe I should have made a diss track.
zazzastack (53:32.281)
I have.
Persixo (53:36.006)
But freaking if that's like the biggest like like like like that funny little drama was like the biggest like issue or like or for example yeah like I'm I'll take that all day and like the feedback has been absolutely amazing from like not even from just like the the the competitors but from like the community themselves. They like, yo, d this was good. It didn't last long. I think the only like the biggest issue we had was like like sometimes the ten minute wait was like ten minutes again. But yeah
Coach Mills (53:42.892)
Yeah, no, it was it wasn't a real you know, a real jump. No feedback it was
Coach Mills (53:52.257)
It was so sick.
Coach Mills (53:59.821)
People don't know what people don't know bro, I've waited I've waited like a fucking hour in between matches before. Like it's it was nothing. Like that's not that w your y'alls would perfectly run. but
zazzastack (54:04.825)
Mmm, me too.
Persixo (54:08.59)
Yeah, like 'cause like we were trying to keep it like, you know, like like 'cause at the end of the day, like it's production in the back, like, like, you know, and then and then like the casters, like we we got Shibby. I'm not if you guys watched but Shibby was going absolutely crazy with the casting. He was amazing. So like like the the least I could do is give him ten minutes. You know you know what I mean? Like like he's he's screaming between between matches. But if that was the biggest issue, I'll take that all day, you know. I'll take that all day. What's up, what's up?
CaptainCoach (54:19.183)
He's great.
zazzastack (54:20.27)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (54:30.412)
So so hear me hear me out. Hear me out, Persexo, Persexo. so for the next tournament, 'cause you you you know, you're the man in charge. I already pitched this, I already pitched this to to IG Lou and Shibby, but well what what you think? What do you think? The captains are gonna be all the players that were on that team, plus the other people involved in the beef. So like Stax Colin, Zeno, seven foot black guy, all of all of those players would all be captains.
Persixo (54:43.218)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (54:54.893)
That would be pretty funny.
Coach Mills (54:58.252)
So then, you know, they all get a chance to prove themselves against each other. Like all of them are calling each other trash, right? So give them a chance Who actually is trash? Give them a chance to draft and prove that they're actually you know, you know what I'm saying? Like that that
Persixo (55:03.871)
So so it's like who who actually is trash?
Persixo (55:11.834)
No, I like it. You know, it's actually funny.
zazzastack (55:13.081)
Why don't you just title the tournament, who is the one that's, like, who is the trash one? You know?
Coach Mills (55:15.465)
CaptainCoach (55:16.633)
I was thinking Rivals creator classic revenge tour would be good.
Persixo (55:16.892)
Who's the tr the trash ball?
Coach Mills (55:21.344)
Revenge tour. Let's go well, cause that that vindic vindif fucking vindication, man. Like like that that has to that would be so hype because then they get to draft from like the same almost the same pool and it's like you know, it's all on you. Zeno gets another chance to draft a good team this time. He can't pick any of the same players he had on his team because they're all, you know, they're all captains too, but you you get the idea, you know? It'd be pretty sick.
zazzastack (55:22.105)
True, that has aura to it though.
Persixo (55:22.266)
Revenge tour.
CaptainCoach (55:25.498)
Yeah.
Persixo (55:28.495)
Not
Persixo (55:34.033)
Yeah.
Persixo (55:43.728)
Cartons, yep.
No, I know I do. I do. No, it's actually funny. E. G, Lou, and Shibbi and I, not really me. I just say an I because I just throw myself in there. But they're actually working on something, something like that. Something like that is is about to happen. It's about to happen. So I'm I'm not sure. I'm gonna be honest. I'm just I'm just spreading propaganda, maybe. I don't know. But but something maybe in the works right now with with like, you know, a little a little N say Entei Kovi, you know, who's because like what what are they calling them? Entei boo-boo and freaking who's Duke. They were frying each other. They were frying each other. So there may be something in the line.
Coach Mills (56:00.611)
Ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (56:11.557)
Ha ha ha ha ha ha!
Persixo (56:15.38)
cooking up so you never know maybe by the time this this drops that's gonna yo hey bring bringing bringing Kobe too you never know like bring the whole team bring the whole team
CaptainCoach (56:16.41)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (56:16.74)
my good. No
zazzastack (56:23.05)
fun.
CaptainCoach (56:24.303)
Just bring the whole team!
zazzastack (56:27.609)
Yeah, you could do a six player podcast, but you guys wouldn't have to do any of work, that's the thing, they'll just argue with each other. And then, and Sevenfoot'll just talk about his... mag donks that he got.
CaptainCoach (56:29.742)
Our... Our first battle royale!
Persixo (56:34.219)
Actually a battle royal Yo could be a special too, yo, hold up.
His mag d his magdunk.
Coach Mills (56:40.182)
I I I a all all all I'm saying is I played a ranked game with Entei today and we we rolled together. Thor cap, it was it was clean. I'm all I'm saying, i he was he was popping off on that cap. so I I haven't read down here. Okay, after that I wanted to talk about magnerfs. There is there's no magnus. you know, we already talked about magnums, but
CaptainCoach (56:41.467)
Hahaha
zazzastack (56:49.241)
I love you.
Persixo (56:50.694)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (56:58.577)
I did actually want to ask what it was like for you as an individual, Per Sexo, kind of like dealing with Nettys because they helped with the tournament, right? Like what was that experience like?
Persixo (57:07.832)
yes, yes. I'ma be
Yeah, it was very I'm gonna be honest. Shout out Arya. If you're watching this, Aria, shout out you. so Arya is like I guess the person who like goes from like the creators to like you know rivals, like like the actual rivals themselves. And I hit her up and I said, Me and E. G Lou wanna run a tournament. We have some creators, we we have Coach Mills, we have mics above you. At the time we only had maybe like ten of you guys, but but like we we pitched the biggest names, you know what I mean? We're like, yo, we we we we got mics above you, we got we got Brooks, we got we got we got we got Coach Mills.
zazzastack (57:17.197)
The goat.
Persixo (57:40.626)
Like, what's up? And then she was like, send us some work of like that. You've you've held stuff like that. And luckily for me, I my last video that I ever posted on YouTube was me holding like an Elo Hell type of video where like I draw uni actually who's in the tournament. She was like, I'm stuck in GM, I'm stuck in GM. So I got a bunch of creators like Raylan, Brooks, Jenny, I got them all together, and like we held like a like a elo hell, and I sent that. I sent a bunch of EG Lose VODs, and they were like, Okay, we we like it. and they offered a thousand dollars at first, then literally maybe.
Maybe like like like five days before tournament she said yeah I upped it to 2000 for you. I was like I was like I was like I was like yo
CaptainCoach (58:17.713)
Nice.
Coach Mills (58:18.222)
Let's go. Let's go.
zazzastack (58:18.393)
Hell yeah.
Persixo (58:21.208)
Yo, so then J3 came in and he was like, Yo, I'll give you a thousand. So three thousand total for like for guy for two dudes who never ran a tournament. Then we have like it was it was insane. And shout out to my my friends in real life because they did a lot of stuff pro bono. Shibbi did a pro bono. My boy Metro. Metro, I cannot give my boy enough glaze. He was back there with with with the production team putting in the work. He's modding, he's modding these things. So shout out him. He he he made the edits for like for like a
CaptainCoach (58:24.326)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (58:29.964)
Hey.
Coach Mills (58:46.211)
Mitro's the goat. He's honestly the goat. Let's fuck it go.
Persixo (58:48.42)
No, he's the goal. He's the goal. Like like like like without him, I'm not gonna lie, I probably wouldn't even be on this podcast right now. I know I would have quit a long time ago. I would have quit a long
CaptainCoach (58:54.85)
Yeah,
Coach Mills (58:55.158)
Let's go. So you know, you know, yeah, you know what they say? You you run an event, you know, they give you some money, it's success. You gotta double or triple that prize pull up, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, hey, earned, earned, earned.
zazzastack (58:57.741)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (59:05.626)
Mm w We're gonna see.
CaptainCoach (59:08.465)
Just to add a little context to that whole experience, right? That was after the Cine Tournament, right? Where there was a lot of community disappointment over them not inviting actual rivals, creators, more people who don't play the game to maybe try to attract new people to the scene. Was that something you ever talked about with Aria? it where you said this was gonna be like
Persixo (59:22.736)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (59:26.896)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (59:37.969)
totally community driven or was that part of the conversation at all?
Persixo (59:41.784)
Yeah, so when me and IG Lou f it was funny, we're in Discord, just chopping it up because like we're friends in real life. Like like I went to high school with him. Like me me, him, and Metro all went to high school together. But we're we're No, yeah, yeah, that's my guy in real life. That's my guy in real life. But
Coach Mills (59:51.107)
y'all did I didn't even know that. That's sick. That's actually sick. Damn. Y'all get you get to keep your IO friends, bro? I don't have any IRL friends anymore. They're all gone, bro. They're working in fucking cubicles now, bro. They have no soul anymore. No, I'm scared, I'm kidding, but it's sad. But they don't they don't ha they don't hang out with me anymore. It's fucked up. Yeah, yeah. Like come on, let's go. Let's fucking go. IR IRL drunk pod. Anyway, sorry. Okay.
CaptainCoach (59:52.791)
sick.
zazzastack (59:53.272)
It's pretty cool.
Persixo (59:59.117)
yeah, no luckily for me.
zazzastack (01:00:00.042)
Yeah, I've got like one and she's long distance, so...
CaptainCoach (01:00:03.97)
rip. Mills, I'm coming to Texas, bro.
Persixo (01:00:04.944)
No no We I mean that's not that that's how it be. But when means you were in VC drunk pop hex no Nah the boot the boot But
CaptainCoach (01:00:16.049)
Nice dude nice. Yeah, I'll bring the boot
Coach Mills (01:00:19.502)
Isso era extra
zazzastack (01:00:21.548)
Okay
Persixo (01:00:25.906)
Freaking Yeah, so we're in DC one day, me, EG, Lou, Metro, and we saw the Cinnat tournament literally like happening. People are like, what the why is why is Jinxie here? Why are all these people? Why is Kingsman in his 18th tournament? Like people were like actually like like not us, not us, like you know, social media. And we're like, why don't we run it? And then and then and then they're they're like, okay. So then we got Shibbi on board, and then Shibi was like, You gotta hit up Arya. And then we hit up Arya, and then I already told you about that. But yeah, the conversation we had together, we were like, Yeah, people people are getting mad.
Because they're inviting like people who have like money already, you know. Like at the end of the day, like if people know you have money, they kind of feel some type of way, like, like, why why is this person who's a multimillionaire competing in a hundred and fifty K tournament? So we were like, we want to keep it to people who actually like are grinding on rivals every single day because it's easy for you to average 300, but you're a variety stream, not 300, like 2k, but you're a variety streamer, like you stream rivals sometimes. Like, yes, it'll be good for a C C V and rivals are like, C C V, we love C C V. But we wanted to keep it very like you know.
Coach Mills (01:01:25.462)
Right. And it and you're gonna like dodge like warn situations where it's like creators that clearly don't give a fuck about the prize pool like at all. yeah, spe yeah, like by wha what do you what do you think about the whole Warren situation, Saza? Sorry, I'm throwing I'm throwing you a curve, but what do think about the words what do you th what do you think?
Persixo (01:01:25.78)
No.
Persixo (01:01:33.318)
Yes.
CaptainCoach (01:01:41.649)
Ha
zazzastack (01:01:42.554)
No, that's okay. I thought it was kind of funny because a few different memes came out of it. Same with my situation, a few memes came out of it. I'm not a big fan of anyone who uses AI, so I don't like the AI ones, but I think that, like, know, exactly your disciple is here. Yeah, yeah, like...
CaptainCoach (01:01:46.597)
Bad luck.
Persixo (01:02:05.264)
Did the sideful
CaptainCoach (01:02:06.306)
hahahahah
zazzastack (01:02:08.127)
Zaza's disciple. There's a new throw character in town. It's okay Zaza, you've- You're okay now. Like there's a new throw character, there's a new throw streamer in town. Like, I thought that was pretty funny.
Coach Mills (01:02:12.658)
Ha ha
Coach Mills (01:02:19.072)
It's actually kinda cra it's actually crazy because now Widow's not a throw character anymore and now it's asked like a squirrel girl now. It has to be squirr but like you know, I it's actually fucked up because I immediately so like people people on in chat probably know that like people that watch my streams, but I like to just whip out Squirrel Girl. I've always liked it since season zero. I actually hit attorney on Squirrel Girl, like playing a lot of Squirrel Girl at one season. but and like no one would say shit to me ever.
zazzastack (01:02:24.407)
And then it's like, squirreled, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (01:02:37.241)
Mmm.
Persixo (01:02:41.564)
She's good.
Coach Mills (01:02:44.812)
The entire time I just randomly wick Squirrel Girl and, you know, play Squirrel Girl and no one would say shit to me. As soon as that Warren situation happened, the first time I swapped to Squirrel Girl, when they're playing like a triple tank bunker hold with Penny, someone said, Are we throwing? I'm like, Bro, what the fuck? I like I I've been playing this character for a bazillion seasons just randomly, and now I'm getting the throwing accusations, you know, like
zazzastack (01:03:05.113)
I still get the comments of, I can't play Widow because of you and it's all your fault. I still get those comments of like, I pick Widow and they call me Zazzastack. Like, so you're not just going to play her anyway because you enjoy her? Like, what?
Coach Mills (01:03:10.869)
Ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (01:03:12.974)
my god.
Coach Mills (01:03:18.181)
Ha ha
Coach Mills (01:03:22.495)
Yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:03:25.233)
So that was obviously the result of another community tournament that was thrown. I also think one of the best ones that the community has had, know, maybe not including all the drama that came with it, which was the Bazem tournament, which was one that I was a part of. Obviously, there's always going to be some sort of drama here or there. As someone who ran a tournament for Sixo, what would your advice be to maybe future tournament?
organizers to potentially, you cause we've seen it pretty much with every tournament with rivals creators. There's always going to be someone fighting about something like how would you try to limit that or, is that something that you shouldn't ever really need to worry about?
Coach Mills (01:04:03.168)
Yeah, over the watch.
Persixo (01:04:07.278)
It's actually funny because the last thing we wanted, me and E. G and Metro, we were like, Yo, like we we don't wanna blow it up like how like all the other ones were getting blown up, you know what mean? So it actually goes from who you invite. Like like unironically, like it was like we were we were like, hmm, d all right, d they're good, yeah, they're good. You what I mean? Obviously, like you never know, anything will pop up, but you have to vet them at first and then like like I'm not gonna bring in people like that are known to be super, super, super, super, super, super, super problematic, because then it's gonna be like it it's it's like a ticking time bomb. Hey, listen, that's my
zazzastack (01:04:27.736)
Mm-hmm.
CaptainCoach (01:04:37.209)
Yeah. Well.
Persixo (01:04:37.222)
Go right there. But that is it's a no, I ride. I'll ride for my boy, but it but it it it really is like a vetting process. Like like like if I just invite a bunch of people who like have nothing to lose, like you know, like if I would like like a bunch of creators who don't care, no filter, have nothing to lose, then the result is gonna be just that it's gonna be like an explosion, people are imploding on each other. But I think I did it, me, E.G. and Metro paid like a very good, at least I think so, a very good like group of people who like we know aren't gonna freaking violate your
Coach Mills (01:04:37.831)
Hahahaha.
zazzastack (01:04:38.275)
You
Persixo (01:05:07.092)
You know, so I I I think it really starts off like who you're picking, like like with that.
CaptainCoach (01:05:07.685)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:05:07.938)
Hehehehe
CaptainCoach (01:05:11.141)
Okay, and then same question, Zaza, as a teammate in one of those tournaments, what would be your advice to future creators or just people who are going through their ranked games to kind of have like a more productive team dynamic? Like what steps maybe do you think could be taken as someone participating to have those tournaments go more smoothly, do you think?
zazzastack (01:05:35.414)
I feel like, honestly I feel like being open to everyone's hero pool is a good start, you know, like I've got a very, yeah, I've got a very limited hero pool and I made that known pretty much from the start of the tournament I was in and like I played in the first Badz in tournament, because that was the second one, and I played in both of them. the first one I was able to one-trick Widow. We didn't win but we did decently and we had a Spider-Man one-trick and we had Mike's Above You on Torch as well.
CaptainCoach (01:05:42.851)
Like right at the- Like, yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:05:53.285)
Right.
Persixo (01:06:03.1)
Max above you, yeah.
zazzastack (01:06:04.279)
So second and Mike's above you, we're both on my team and we're running Widow, like old Widow, Torch and Spider-Man and it didn't do too bad at all and I think, I think just being okay with people playing their comfort character is like a big thing. I think it's good to be able to, like it is good to be able to flex. I'm not gonna deny that. It's good to have a couple different roles in your hero pool but not everyone's going.
Coach Mills (01:06:05.078)
The goat. The goat.
Coach Mills (01:06:20.0)
It so yeah.
zazzastack (01:06:32.473)
to be able to do that and I feel like just being able to be open to that and like accepting of that is a good start. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, early communication. Like, I told my team, was like, yeah, no, I'm a widow ATPU but if I really, really have to, I can go Punisher, Hella, Phoenix, and Hawkeye because Cyclops wasn't out at the time, so yeah. And that's like, I pretty much only have a hero pool of just poke, slop, DPS, pretty much, so.
Coach Mills (01:06:38.146)
Yeah. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:06:38.811)
So like early communication with the team then, yeah.
zazzastack (01:07:02.039)
Yeah, you go, you're right.
Coach Mills (01:07:04.14)
Well, I was I was saying like 'cause like we I mean I scrimmed against Percixo's team a lot. And I remember like I was w I watched back the VODs too. And I remember like Grag 'cause like one of one of our strategies is like we banned we just ban people's like mains, right? Like if people are linear in their mains, we just banned them. And like Per Sixo felt too. There was like one game where we banned Hulk, Mag, and Star Lord, which is Br you had Brooks on your team. So like every single one of y'all's one tricks were banned. And I and I I I I was watching the VOD and Greg's like
zazzastack (01:07:16.652)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:07:24.059)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:07:25.177)
Crazy.
Coach Mills (01:07:31.897)
Damn, did I draft wrong? It's like I play Mag 2. We we are like, I don't know how to make this work. Y'all ended up making it work eventually, but it's like it's interesting how like that's part of the game. Like, so people people are really good at heroes. People get their heroes banned. Uni got a Thor banned a million times. You know, Mikey got his torch banned a million times. Like, some people are have really deep bags. Like part of the drafting process, like some players have really deep bags, and like you can draft them and they can play a lot of different things.
zazzastack (01:07:41.047)
Mm.
Coach Mills (01:07:57.411)
But some people, they they might be more linear, but they're they're so good at those characters that they're more likely to get banned and then you force them to waste a ban on them. And like like there's like that's kind of the thing. It's like that's what creators are. Is every creator's different. Some cre some creators are really they really are specialists. They they really like certain things. And other creators are like, hey, we just play a little bit of everything. And I think that that's kind of I mean, that's just how you dra like that's just how you build a team. That's how you you know, that's that's interesting to me.
zazzastack (01:08:04.365)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (01:08:12.96)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:08:16.61)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:08:20.745)
Exactly, yeah. And I think like, like sometimes just those two mindsets can clash. you know, one, like people who flex have a very like open mindset. They're like, yeah, I can do whatever. And I'm sure like you guys can switch as well, you know? But when you're, when you're a one trick, you're like, okay, I know my best capabilities are on this character. I know this is where I can perform and, like I know, I know what I can do on it, you know?
Like, just as an example, people didn't see the first day of scrims that we had during that Batson tournament. And the first day of scrims we versed Bensa, Ionfist, Pick and Roll Magic, and Ishigo, Penny. And Ishigo was chasing me around the map as Penny, whilst I was also getting rid of all of his nests so that Kingston could like dive in and stuff. And, you know, I was getting rid of all his nests and I was keeping...
Coach Mills (01:09:10.775)
Ha ha ha.
zazzastack (01:09:20.085)
um, Banser and Pick and Roll off my backline most of the time. Um, like they were getting frustrated with my, my kickstun and combos and things like that as they were coming in. So a lot of people didn't see those, that first day of screens, but that actually went like pretty decently. And I feel like we had kind of some, like a little bit of synergy going and you know, we could have worked off of that. Um, but yeah, no, like it's, I think just the mindsets can clash sometimes of just,
what should and shouldn't happen, you know?
Coach Mills (01:09:50.595)
Yeah Yeah, sometimes some of these tournaments they clash in a way where it's like sometimes people want you to be like glue th or like like putty. It's like, hey, no, let's play this like super hyper meta thing. Like but like when when it comes to creator tournaments, like I wanna see Percy on Magneto. I wanna see Captain Coach on Hulk. Like to tune it to within reason. I I wanna w when I'm watching you, not when I'm playing.
zazzastack (01:09:54.104)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:10:00.771)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:10:06.049)
Yeah, I don't think anyone else was...
CaptainCoach (01:10:07.781)
No, no you don't you banned my Hulk Mother effort He's coming to my chat being like hey coach guess what we're banning
Coach Mills (01:10:16.16)
No, no, no, let I I said the same thing to you. I said the same thing to Yuni. I said the same thing to Yuni. I was like, I'm banning your Thor. I'm sorry. She no she Yuni popped into my chat and she's like, or Yuri, sorry, not uni. She she popped in my chat and she said, are we are we 1v1 Thor in today? And I said, I'm banning your Thor. I said, No, we are not. It's I I but that's that's the that's the thing though, is like I play Thor, but like I you know, I I I have the capability to do that because I
zazzastack (01:10:18.721)
That's toxic, Barry, that's toxic.
zazzastack (01:10:36.249)
zazzastack (01:10:42.849)
Yeah. And he's like your conflict character and you know what you can do on him and yeah.
Coach Mills (01:10:43.342)
Flex other things. Like i I'm banning my Thor too, but it's like right, right. And like But like I I would want my you know, if someone's strong on a character on my team, I would want them to be on that character. Cause the reality, like what people don't really understand is if you force someone off their comfort character and like that's where like ninety ninety percent of their hours are, you're probably gonna lose that game anyways if you don't make it work. Like if like if you have how what what's the best w the best way to I like per six as an example, like most hey I'm gonna use you. I'm gonna use you, right?
You you you want your team to to make your mag work. Like you want your team to let you try to play mag, right? Like like what if you showed up to a team and they're like, Now we're playing Groot Triple. You're on Groot. You're like, What? What he talk what are you talking Yeah yeah.
Persixo (01:11:26.298)
I mean, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I think I'm a bad example because I have that like mentality, I'm trying to win. So like if they say, Yo, you gotta you gotta get on penny, I'm on penny. But
Coach Mills (01:11:31.52)
Right. Yeah, but but but but the thing is like are you really gonna win though if you're on a character that you're not good at? You know what I'm saying? Like like you can have the mindset all you want and you can make your teammates feel good if you flex to whatever they tell you to do. But are you gonna fucking win? Are you are you if if are you beating Mal Chronicles in the group mirror? No, you're not. It's not happening. But but but but you but you get but you get the point. Like if if I joined a team and I'm against Captain Coach and like, bro, you have to mirror Hulk him.
Persixo (01:11:36.656)
That's what I'm saying. It
zazzastack (01:11:38.188)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:11:45.827)
Yeah.
That's like my mindset.
Persixo (01:11:49.242)
I actually did though, I actually did though. I actually did though. I actually did though. I actually did though. Nah, I got you.
CaptainCoach (01:11:51.523)
You did. Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:11:58.595)
And I'm like, bro, I'm gonna get fucking clapped. Like, I'm not playing Hulk. And they're like, You're not working with the team, bro. Get on Hulk. That's meta. I'm like, no, I'm not doing that. You know, but but like but that's that's kinda what I'm talking about. It's just like you gotta make people's strengths work or you're gonna fucking lose anyways. Like you're you're not gonna win the game.
Persixo (01:11:59.443)
it's it's over. No no see yeah, it's over, it's over.
Persixo (01:12:07.684)
Dom, I can unhawk.
zazzastack (01:12:08.141)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:12:14.009)
Like, for example, I don't have Nomura in my hero pool so when we're versing dive, I've actually versed a quadruple dive like that in the first Basin tournament. versed them like that and I actually made a video on it and had a lot of cool reactions from them. yeah, Widow was my best anti-dive. You know, with that kickstun, with the combos I could do.
Persixo (01:12:14.159)
yeah.
zazzastack (01:12:38.905)
And that's why I felt the confidence to run Widow into that quadruple dive. Mind you, one of our supports were playing on 20 FPS at Team Fight, so that didn't really help. That was kind of unfortunate. They couldn't, they couldn't like, yeah, it was kind of difficult to patty cake on like 20 FPS and their PC kept like dying and you know, like, it was just one of the many factors that played into a bad game. like, yeah, no, I feel like my strongest against the dive was Widow. And so...
I would always, like, if I were to play Hella, I don't think I would have done the same thing. Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:13:11.758)
Before before the real worker would have died. A lot of people they like they s they like throw out Bucky, but Bucky also could fall over. Like he w at least at least in like heavily coordinated play, Bucky like a dive target. W what it it it's it's just funny watching that whole situation of that tournament and then looking like the recent Persixa tournament with the with the Xenos team, where it was just like they like they could not get anything to work.
zazzastack (01:13:18.583)
Yeah, I think I've got like less than an hour on Bucky, maybe one hour exactly. Yeah, something like that. Like I just don't play it.
CaptainCoach (01:13:23.729)
zazzastack (01:13:34.082)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:13:38.669)
Like they were trying and try it wasn't even like a matter of like people like getting mad at people one-tricking or like playing what they didn't want them to play. Like the every single one of them wanted everyone to do something different and none like it like nothing they tried worked. And it was very it was very entertaining to me, but it's like that can happen oftentimes when you You know, you don't draft a team like like you don't draft a a team that synergizes well. You don't understand what people are willing to do before you draft them. Like it's a good idea to understand like someone's strengths.
zazzastack (01:13:39.193)
Mm.
zazzastack (01:13:51.607)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:14:08.556)
What they wanna play. What they what are they what do they wanna do? Like w before you even draft them onto your team. Like understand them. But
zazzastack (01:14:13.151)
Exactly. Yeah.
Persixo (01:14:15.43)
Yeah, they they they lost in the draft phase, sadly. Like it was like like like i it was like what when I was seeing those videos saying like, this team is scary, you my and my head like it's funny cause think Quad like I think somebody made a video like that and then Quad commented, If you genuinely thought that that team like had a chance against the other ones, like like I know you're like below diamond. I'm like, yo damn Quad, why you frying? But
zazzastack (01:14:19.094)
you
zazzastack (01:14:31.897)
you
CaptainCoach (01:14:35.259)
Quad was- he had pretty strong opinions about that team, in particular. He's a funny guy.
Persixo (01:14:39.396)
Yes.
Coach Mills (01:14:39.566)
Bro, quad's funny man, I swear He's funny.
zazzastack (01:14:41.429)
Mm. Yeah, quad's great. yeah, I mean, I feel like in tournaments, like I know there's been drama in like every tournament, but I don't think anyone intends to cause drama when they're going into it. Like no one wants to be... I mean...
CaptainCoach (01:14:54.929)
I think that's become a bit of a creator meta now here.
Coach Mills (01:14:56.11)
Coach Mills (01:15:00.31)
meta. So I it I'm not Well well it in Well in in response to I mean like this is like it honestly in response to that whole drama I at least the theory of Captain Coach and I is that other there are some creators that want to create a similar situation so that they can grow off of it.
Persixo (01:15:00.854)
No, I was gonna say but the
zazzastack (01:15:01.493)
I maybe, I mean, I never intended to cause drama, like I- I just wanted- I just wanted to try a widow and, you know, show off my widow skills, that's all I wanted to do.
CaptainCoach (01:15:04.429)
Yeah, well sure!
CaptainCoach (01:15:10.017)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:15:24.304)
The come up. They want a come up.
zazzastack (01:15:25.739)
I haven't actually heard much about it, but I guess if it's happening in every tournament, there is a bit of a pattern.
Coach Mills (01:15:28.29)
Like they they they they can they can use Well, it it feels like there's a lot of like drama debates, random things that happen that it feels like people are intentionally stirring the pot to try to, you know, blow up off of the drama. And like you know, like I get it, but you know, I I think when they see, you know, the amount of growth that Kingsman has, like how big he is, they're like, Wow, if we if we emulate that ten percent, ooh, we can get in on that, you know, tough stuff like that, you know
zazzastack (01:15:38.169)
Mmm, that makes sense.
zazzastack (01:15:47.457)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:15:53.434)
Yeah, I don't think it works like that though. It's like, yeah. Yeah.
Persixo (01:15:54.47)
They patched that method got patched. That method got patched, bro.
zazzastack (01:16:01.921)
Yeah, it doesn't work over and over, especially for a shooter game, a hero shooter game. Like, any hero shooter game is too niche for that to work consistently, you know? I mean, I didn't even intend for what happened to happen, you know? I went into the tournament going, okay, cool, it's another creator tournament, gonna try my best, gonna play some Widow, gonna get some cool kills, some cool reactions, and, you know, see how it goes, you know? And hopefully, hopefully we can win, you know?
Coach Mills (01:16:10.878)
Yeah.
You're right.
Coach Mills (01:16:30.456)
Do you have any so th let's just say there's this people that they don't really know you but they don't they don't like you for X, Y, and Z. Do you have anything you wanna say to those people? Is there any d
zazzastack (01:16:36.951)
Yeah. is that, look, I normally ignore the comments that people put under if they're nasty, or I delete them, or my boyfriend deletes them, and I don't really, I don't really like,
Coach Mills (01:16:49.102)
Fair enough.
zazzastack (01:16:52.833)
care about them too much. I think she's not gonna let you hit bro is the weakest comment they could probably put out there. I think that one just makes him look like a dork. But yeah, like I don't really care about the hate. I post content because I want the post content because I enjoy it. Also, it is my full-time job, but also like just in general, it's what I enjoy. It's what I love doing. I just want to make videos. I want to show off what I can do in game. I want to...
Coach Mills (01:16:57.62)
Ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (01:16:58.768)
Ha ha.
zazzastack (01:17:20.055)
like chat to people everyday, you know, like it's, it's, it's what I love doing all the time. So I wake up happy that I can, you know, make content and stream. So regardless of whether people are hating or not, I'm still going to wake up and keep doing that. It doesn't matter how much like hate you throw my way. I know I'm not bad person and I feel like I've proven that more than enough since the incident. Like I feel like I've proven it more than enough. Whether people want to like believe that or not, like I...
Coach Mills (01:17:42.604)
Right.
Coach Mills (01:17:46.102)
Yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (01:17:49.174)
I really just, I'm inclusive, I try to be kind to everyone, you know, like I, and I just want to put out good content and collaborate with people and, you know, have fun. That's what I want to do. I just want to enjoy, enjoy my time. Yeah. Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:17:56.719)
Gr grinding the grinding through the hate. spe speaking of grinding through the hate, Captain Coach, why do you keep getting videos made on you?
CaptainCoach (01:18:06.229)
HAHAHAHA
zazzastack (01:18:06.667)
Yeah, yeah, I've seen some of them. I was like,
Persixo (01:18:08.772)
No My Gold
Coach Mills (01:18:10.286)
No, it it's I no I know not to throw my co-host under the bus because I love my co-host, but Captain Coach gets maybe one percent of the hate that you get and online. Maybe one percent.
zazzastack (01:18:16.398)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:18:20.791)
CaptainCoach (01:18:24.217)
Right, people- Okay, like, I will say like I'm a little bit serious, like when stuff like that happens, but like you're talking about the Brooks video.
zazzastack (01:18:31.001)
Mm.
Coach Mills (01:18:32.162)
Well yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, it's w yeah, one of many, yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:18:36.017)
I feel like I am like the vessel for every Tankman to channel their energy, their anger towards when... Okay, listen, have a... I'm a solo queue, yeah.
Coach Mills (01:18:38.766)
I saw one wait wait wait I saw one comment I saw one comment that said I swear Captain Coach is a sig out by Netties to give creators free revenue and banger videos.
CaptainCoach (01:18:55.601)
Jesus. Jesus. Listen, okay, like with no anger or vibes, like if you're in a three stack and you're making someone's solo tank and the solo tank at the end of the game, says, fuck you DPS your shit cans. Would you side more on the solo tank who had to go through that entire game or the three stack who was,
Persixo (01:18:56.914)
Is that true?
zazzastack (01:18:58.378)
CaptainCoach (01:19:23.787)
Asking the solo tech asses. I was a I was MVP. I had and I hit him with a little Like fuck all y'all I'm out and that's it. Everything else I said was to my chest
Coach Mills (01:19:24.278)
Well you a you ace too but you ace too by the way.
zazzastack (01:19:34.371)
Hehehe
Persixo (01:19:38.05)
you you you you you know what hurts so bad about it is cause Brooks is my goat and this is my goat too bro so I I I I felt like that meme you know that meme of like the wolf and the th the the parents are fighting and then he's just he's just scared? Like like like that's why I felt like no not my goats bro, not my go.
CaptainCoach (01:19:44.017)
You
zazzastack (01:19:44.321)
Hehehehehe
Coach Mills (01:19:44.526)
No, I I lo I
No, no, I I no see Percy, you don't understand because it's like like cause I like I like Brooks too, but like it's so funny to me because a lot of times in game I'll get someone that says like Bro, do you actually like Captain Coach? And I'm like, Yeah, I fucking do. And they're like they're like, Why? And I'm like, 'Cause he's I he's the goat, bro. He he he he's like the d the devil on your shoulder that just says what you want to say but you don't. You know what I'm saying? That
CaptainCoach (01:20:08.113)
What the fuck?
zazzastack (01:20:16.185)
I just hear a lot on the internet and I just like I I know that a lot of things that you read on the internet like you can't believe them the first time you read them a lot of the time so like I've never had a problem with you coach like I've it's it's it's like I I haven't interacted with I haven't interacted with you much but like I've been in your games before and I've never like had an issue with you you've always been nice to me and you know like
CaptainCoach (01:20:30.129)
Thank you.
Coach Mills (01:20:31.458)
That makes one of us. Not scared.
CaptainCoach (01:20:33.955)
Hahaha
CaptainCoach (01:20:41.711)
I feel like we have the same sleep schedule as why we get into games, even though you're Aussie and I'm US.
Coach Mills (01:20:44.436)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (01:20:44.521)
Yeah, probably. I- this is- it's 11.42am in Australia right now, so it's not even midday yet and like, normally I start streaming at about like, 6pm my time and go until like, midnight, so. yeah, I think that's like, early D10 hours for you guys or something like that. yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:20:57.809)
Yeah, I mean...
CaptainCoach (01:21:03.547)
To me it's just, you know, like it's a game, you know, a little bit of gamer rage and gonna hurt anybody. You know, I don't really like back down. I feel like if like, you know, people aren't trying their best to win, I'll let them know about it. And you know, I don't, I don't.
zazzastack (01:21:08.537)
Fair enough.
zazzastack (01:21:14.679)
I don't know, but gamer rage? I don't know, I just kind of, I call into my team and if someone gets mad at me I mute them and then I keep coming over the top of it, so yeah.
Persixo (01:21:21.03)
Keep you keep going, yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:21:22.481)
To me that's a content opportunity, we call that.
Coach Mills (01:21:25.326)
So so
zazzastack (01:21:26.585)
Fair enough.
Persixo (01:21:27.292)
See, he's he he's misunderstood. I I try to tell people he's misunderstood. He's misunderstood.
CaptainCoach (01:21:30.481)
I think if people saw my older stream and clips, it would probably make more sense. I was a bit more of a, I used to play a character, an actual character, like Dr. Disrespect a little bit, and a lot of people...
zazzastack (01:21:37.625)
Mm.
Coach Mills (01:21:43.82)
Yeah, yeah, it it's up it's a little different than Doctors I suspect, right? Like, you know, a little a little not quite not
zazzastack (01:21:44.99)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, except not as bad.
Persixo (01:21:48.278)
Yeah, I I was gonna say No, no.
CaptainCoach (01:21:49.636)
okay, well yeah, alright. Okay! Whoa! I forgot, yeah, thank you for... Yeah, yeah. Before all that... Yeah... So I kind of bring a bit of that to my streams. Okay... Yeah... That was, yeah, was a long time ago.
zazzastack (01:21:53.987)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Really though, the best reference.
Coach Mills (01:21:56.104)
Ha ha ha ha ha.
Yeah, no, you know. You know, I used to I used to host parties a little like Diddy, you know, like just a little you know you know kinda you know like his parties, you know?
Persixo (01:22:06.384)
Yo No
No
zazzastack (01:22:10.785)
Coach Mills (01:22:15.63)
Okay.
CaptainCoach (01:22:19.323)
But yeah, I mean, I've definitely taken some steps to make it a little more obvious. I don't know, to me, I'm not really bothered by it. If you think I'm an asshole, whatever, just don't watch my content. To me, it's just like, yeah, it's just fun. I don't care. I mean, I'm not trying to put anyone down. And it's just like Hulkmane gets mad that his team made him solo tank.
zazzastack (01:22:31.961)
Same with me too, yeah.
zazzastack (01:22:47.501)
Hogman hogs out, so.
CaptainCoach (01:22:48.971)
Exactly. It's like and just for the record real quick, like Brooks, I got no ill will towards that guy. Like, you know, like get your video, get your content, you know, like it's it's fine. Like I said what I said, but I just to me, it's like when people try to like make it something that it's not. And that's really kind of like what bothers me. Like even though like Vickicity did a video on me, I thought that was funny. I told my chum like, yeah, go watch it. It's funny. But like geezer cams and I'm like, like I.
Persixo (01:22:49.094)
Culkman holds out.
Coach Mills (01:22:49.686)
I I I also I don't know what
Coach Mills (01:23:12.032)
speak. It's I I c I comment on all of them. They're so fun yeah, but
CaptainCoach (01:23:16.677)
Most of my streams I'll take like half of an edible and I just go off. I just go, Craig, it's just fun. I just have fun. To me it's fun. Like, Greg Albert's a good friend of mine. He's like the positive Hulk main. To me it's just like, yeah, yes. And him and I used to like play league back in the day and I would do the same thing. It's just, to me it's just like shit talk. It's just fun. But like a lot of people, truthfully, I'm curious to hear your opinions, Zaza. Well, everybody, like I feel like...
Coach Mills (01:23:20.642)
Ha ha ha.
zazzastack (01:23:22.827)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:23:27.586)
Yep. That's the angel on my shoulder. That's the other guy. Yeah, the an yeah.
Persixo (01:23:30.724)
Yang and yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:23:44.399)
games are way more soft and people get way more sensitive about stuff, but maybe that's just me being like an old head in the scene.
zazzastack (01:23:53.508)
can agree to an extent. I can agree to an extent. Like, I think, yeah, people are way more soft in games now. People do get offended very easily and I feel like nobody has super thick skin anymore. You know, it's rare to come by someone who does. But at the same time, like, I think...
Coach Mills (01:23:53.64)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:24:15.767)
Like, it can still get very toxic. It can still get pretty... pretty bad. Especially like, I... I mean, not just saying only because I'm a woman, but it definitely like plays a decent part in some of the hate that I get. Whether people want to admit that or not, like there are... I do see a lot of misogynistic comments. I have people in game make misogynistic comments to me and that's like every day or two that I hear stuff like that. You know, like I... I...
I don't know, like pretty much anything you can think of I've had said to me. Like I've had like threats, I've had misogyny, I've had just toxic stuff, I have people just target me, I get stream sniped all the time and people target me because I'm Zaza Stack or they get in my team and they're like, okay I'm throwing because you're on my team, you know, whatever and things like that and like, or like I don't really care about it, like I've got thick skin myself, I'm unbothered by it all but
CaptainCoach (01:25:04.656)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:25:05.167)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:25:14.795)
to anyone who hasn't been exposed to it for the five and a half years of streaming I've done, you know, like, I feel like other people would struggle with it. it's not, not a very nice space still for people to, to be, you know, it can be quite toxic.
CaptainCoach (01:25:32.518)
Yeah, I definitely agree. I do think the internet has actually gotten like more toxic in some ways, because I think a lot of these people, I I grew up back before like people played online games. So like to me, there's like a comparison. Like to me, I don't view it as serious. But a lot of people I really do think care so much about how they're perceived online. I think that's like a big reason why people not only like use the anonymity of the internet to like say what they want, like,
zazzastack (01:26:01.048)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:26:01.739)
but also the people who do care are the ones out there trying to be on the front lines being like, hey, this, this, and this. I think there's probably a middle ground there where we can look at everything from a different lens where it's not all just like, we're just playing games, guys.
zazzastack (01:26:19.127)
I feel like not as many people are open to agree to disagree at all. People just don't like other opinions, like differing opinions. I think that sets off a lot of the toxicity.
CaptainCoach (01:26:24.23)
Sure.
Coach Mills (01:26:32.212)
Yeah. I mean it it's definitely worse on platforms like TikTok. Like s like short form content definitely like makes it so terrible.
Persixo (01:26:36.996)
it's so bad. No, no. Like the hold on my bad. You you you just sparked an idea in my brain. I started TikTok streaming. Dude. Dude. No, my bad. But like TikTok streaming, like yo, on YouTube, like like like I I'll occasionally get like the like you I'm a better bag than you. Yeah, you probably are. You know what mean? Yeah, but then on TikTok
CaptainCoach (01:26:39.773)
yeah. Yeah.
zazzastack (01:26:41.763)
Did you see my video complaining about the rework? Like, did you see the comments?
Coach Mills (01:26:46.358)
Yeah, I did.
CaptainCoach (01:26:46.628)
I, yup.
zazzastack (01:26:51.591)
it's horrid.
zazzastack (01:26:57.913)
Like, so what? I'm a better winner than you two, yeah.
Persixo (01:27:01.708)
Yo, they'll yo, they'll say some vile things to me on TikTok. I don't know what it is on that app, but when I stream, like like I don't even mean me me I don't mind like like like 'cause like like I I I push for positivity no matter like like I'm I'm not sure if you guys even know, but like if you guys watch my streams, I'm very like like dude dudes will fry me, like fry me in game and then I'll be like chill, I forgive you, chill, like like like don't even wor Yeah, like
zazzastack (01:27:06.977)
Yeah, something in the air.
CaptainCoach (01:27:20.217)
No, you're a great- He is a great teammate. He got on my ass one time, I'm like, okay, that's my duo saying like- cause I was trying to surrender, you remember that? And he was like, no, I don't do that. I'm like, okay, my bad, my bad.
Coach Mills (01:27:20.866)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, bro. You're like you're like a Buddha, bro. You're like
zazzastack (01:27:20.951)
Yeah, like, it's over.
zazzastack (01:27:27.348)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:27:29.03)
Gill yes We don't surrender like
Coach Mills (01:27:31.787)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:27:32.058)
The only time I normally like, if, like I don't really argue with anyone in game. I'm pretty much the same, I'm pretty chill, like I don't, like even if people are frying me I'm like, whatever, you know. Like I don't really care about it, I'll either just mute them and move on or what, you know, just ignore it. But the only time that I ever do have a go at someone? Hey, we can, we can! I'm down to do it one day if you want to! But, yeah.
Persixo (01:27:38.223)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:27:51.899)
So what you're saying is we need a duo.
Coach Mills (01:27:54.242)
why?
Persixo (01:27:54.704)
That's
CaptainCoach (01:27:58.514)
I got it, I'm down, I'm down.
zazzastack (01:28:00.505)
Hell yeah! But yeah, no, like, What was I gonna say? About... No, you're fine, you're fine.
CaptainCoach (01:28:07.493)
Sorry. You mute people who are...
zazzastack (01:28:11.481)
Oh yeah, I only get up people if they like, I don't care if they personally insult me, but if they personally insult a teammate, even if it's a random on a personal level, whether it's their appearance, their voice, or anything like that, or like, you know, how they identify or anything like that, then I'm like, hold on a second, that is not okay to say. don't say that. Or if they even threaten my teammate or anything like that. Could be just some random, I'm just like...
Coach Mills (01:28:12.206)
Yeah, you don't fire yeah.
zazzastack (01:28:39.831)
You can't say that to people.
CaptainCoach (01:28:43.025)
Yeah, I mean, I do think it's important to police community. to be fair, like Mills, I'm sure you've seen me do this at least a little bit. Like that is like a bit of where my stuff comes from. know, like a lot of it's just like, okay, you're doing some shitty thing. I'm going to call you out on it. you know, sometimes like when the game doesn't punish those types of behaviors, you know, it's up to the community to kind of police each other. I do think that is like a big part of it, but back to the TikTok thing.
I think the algorithms are a really big reason why that type of behavior like kind of gets like algorithms.
zazzastack (01:29:10.585)
Mm.
Yep.
Coach Mills (01:29:14.264)
But And I it's not that I think like 'cause I do agree with you, like your original statement, like gaming has become somewhat soft. I think that that has been true in some games where it's like the over policing. I think over policing can get too far. An example of like over policing is there's some games that you can't even calm to your team, you can't type to the enemy team. Like they do they restrict communication in like a lot of ways. Like imagine what rivals would be like if you couldn't even type to your teammates. You couldn't talk to them either.
You know, like stuff like that, right? Like I I think that there's like a line and there's like there's like banter too that's fun. Like the TikTok banter from Per Sixos tournament, I think that's fun. But like the second people would like take it to a new you know, like the old school Halo three level where you're just like, you know, you're you're you're telling people you're gonna show at their house and and you're saying some crazy, you know, slur, then like that's that y you know. We there needs to be a line there.
zazzastack (01:30:05.015)
Like, I've had things like that said to me before, so... Like, I've had some crazy stuff said to me, so...
CaptainCoach (01:30:08.176)
Here, I got a...
CaptainCoach (01:30:12.689)
This was an ex-post from me the other day. J3 said, first time in 10 years of streaming on Command and Marvel Rivals. J3 is like the super chill, nice guy. Standing up for a friend, calling someone an asshole. He said asshole for being an asshole. And I'm saying, you just got to be more creative, right? Because yesterday I told my Thor he has the spatial awareness of a drunk toddler that eats his food from a trough. Ben. So there's a bit of nuance, right? There's a bit of nuance to the.
zazzastack (01:30:16.121)
Mm.
zazzastack (01:30:22.114)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:30:25.913)
Mm.
zazzastack (01:30:35.06)
Ha ha ha ha
Coach Mills (01:30:36.782)
well I this so this this will probably be the last question. I I'm sure you don't want to talk about this too much, but my last question about the Kingsman tournament is it if you could go back and do it all again, is there anything that you would change or do differently?
zazzastack (01:30:38.105)
That is kind of crazy. That's kind of funny.
Persixo (01:30:43.547)
I didn't come up with that.
CaptainCoach (01:30:45.585)
Gotta be creative,
zazzastack (01:31:00.065)
I honestly, I wish I put out my own video about it. I don't think he should have been kicked. I think a lot of people think that I was the one who kicked him when I literally have no DM history with Bazem about anything to do with that. Like literally the only DM history I have with Bazem is, hey you want in on this tournament? Yeah sure. And then so it became I was in the second Bazem tournament you know like.
Coach Mills (01:31:04.109)
Mm
CaptainCoach (01:31:04.913)
Hmm.
Coach Mills (01:31:21.454)
D do do Do you I I know like blame is kind of in a gray area, but do you br blame some of the other people on that team for some of the hate that you've g received? Like 'cause I I think you've received a lot of hate for things maybe you didn't do but other people might have done.
zazzastack (01:31:29.591)
Yeah. I, look, I think... I...
zazzastack (01:31:38.602)
Yeah. I don't necessarily blame anyone specifically. I think as a team in general we all could have done better. Like even myself I probably could have done better but I will be honest I was still having my morning coffee. I had no caffeine. It was 8am and I was tired as hell. you know like like I mean this today I've had my caffeine. I'm a bit more liable but just think like you know how you get out of bed and you're like god like
I gotta get my caffeine, like, you you kind of been like a slump.
Coach Mills (01:32:07.586)
Yeah. 'Cause I mean I mean you certainly I mean, yeah, I mean we we all we've all, you know, played with you and we were in tournaments with you. I mean like you certainly never insulted anybody and certainly didn't call people broke college students or laugh at anybody. You never did any of those things, but but y but even in spite of you not doing any of those things, you probably received more hate than anyone else.
zazzastack (01:32:13.657)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, and I... yeah, I've never done that, like yeah. Yeah. Like, yeah, I think I got scapegoated for a lot of it. I think I definitely could have said something like... Lucy and Sissy were standing up for me.
but I do think they did go a little bit overboard and I probably could have told them to like turn it back a little bit but at the same time like I'd spent three days being told I couldn't play my character by Kingston so I was just kind of like you know in in a quiet sort of space I guess I was kind of just like my headspace was kind of closed
Coach Mills (01:32:55.959)
It sometimes
Sometimes it's h I'm not gonna lie, situations like that are hard. 'Cause like 'cause I I I've been in those situations in real life where it's like maybe someone defends you but they go way overboard and you don't necessarily agree with the way they're defending you, but you feel good being defended. Like any and you're like, I feel like I should be defended, but that doesn't mean you agree with the way they defend like like if I'm
zazzastack (01:33:03.381)
Yeah, I was kind of mixed and like, yeah.
zazzastack (01:33:10.63)
Yeah. Yeah.
Persixo (01:33:15.397)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:33:15.659)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:33:19.423)
Yeah, that's kind of how I felt, yeah.
Coach Mills (01:33:22.602)
If I like like like l I don't know, if like let's say a friend of mine is picking on me and making fun of me and then my other friend walks up to him and smacks him. Maybe I don't want him to smack my friend. But at least but at least he defended me. So I it's I can't like, bro, why are you sma like I can't be like that. You know, I I get I get it. Like I understand how that's weird and like it creates hard problem. I mean it's just especially when things just move so fast, like everything just moves so fast.
zazzastack (01:33:26.912)
Yeah.
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:33:31.057)
That's my goat.
zazzastack (01:33:32.597)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:33:40.302)
Yeah. Yeah. And... Exactly, yeah. And I was, I was like running five times slower than I would normally go because I hadn't had my caffeine for the day so I was trying to like process everything happening in the moment but also be like, wait, I gotta lock in on this game but then what are they, what they saying now? I was like, I was like, my brain was all over the place and like, yeah. Yeah, but...
Coach Mills (01:34:00.601)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:34:04.194)
Plus la I mean like a million people saying things on their stream, people, you know, like it's hard to
zazzastack (01:34:09.291)
I think you like described my mindset pretty well like of yes I appreciate them defending me I thought it was very nice of them to stand up for me against that because it was like it was I wasn't gonna say anything and I was just gonna deal with it and like I was getting on my nose that Kingsman was like saying you know I couldn't play my character pretty much like he wanted me on Bucky or support and I haven't played either of them barely at all in my life so I wasn't like
I feel like half a day is not enough for me to learn that. Especially with time zone difference and I'd have to wake up at 8am the next day and you know like it just wasn't enough time for me to learn how to those characters and yes they might be easy in his eyes but in my eyes I feel like I can't master a character in half a day. But yeah like I I don't really agree with like how overboard things got. I wish I said something about that.
Like, cause I do appreciate being indefended, but like, when they said like, your shits out, talk your shit out, that's why I was like, no, no, I don't, like, I don't do that. Like I just, I, I'm not that type of person, you know?
Persixo (01:35:14.117)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (01:35:16.27)
Yeah, that was that that was kind of it was it was a little bit strange for us. I mean, I wasn't inv invited to the tournament, so I wasn't even in the tournament, but I was kind of on the outside looking in. and like I mean, we played with you in the last tournament and you were like like I'm not gonna lie, like I'm more toxic than you and ranked. Captain Coach is like twenty times more toxic than you and ranked. Basically everyone I know is more toxic than you and ranked. So like for everyone to like start accusing you of all these crazy things
zazzastack (01:35:25.463)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:35:35.289)
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah, and
Coach Mills (01:35:44.3)
It was a little bit strange cause just because like we we've interacted with you before, you know, like it it's not like
zazzastack (01:35:48.19)
Yeah. And yeah, no, it's like even even at the start of that situation, people saying that I like I was the one who got in kicked or, you know, I helped my boyfriend write those documents or whatever. I had no clue he was writing those documents. I literally went to bed and he stayed up on his PC writing them.
and then I woke up the next day and like had to do some content stuff and he told me before I jumped on stream the next day which was the tournament day he's like yeah no I've done this I feel like I have to do this and I'm like you shouldn't put that out do not put that out and he put it out anyway and look like we all make mistakes so I'm like yeah
Coach Mills (01:36:23.202)
It's
Coach Mills (01:36:29.728)
It's yeah. It's kind of another example of people defending you but you know like not like
zazzastack (01:36:36.831)
Yeah, yeah, and I can understand his perspective, like you're feeling defensive for your girlfriend, you know, like I can understand that, but at the same time I was also like, don't do that, it's just gonna make it worse, like just let it die, let it be, yeah. Yeah, and people like clipped me on, there was a clip that went viral of me on stream that day, I think, saying like, yeah, Caps making a document.
Coach Mills (01:36:49.147)
I ran it right and it it it definitely did, yeah.
zazzastack (01:37:03.865)
And he's good at putting docs together. I hadn't read through it because I kind of woke up, got told about it and then jumped on the stream and he was saying that he was just gonna put it out anyway so I was like okay well whatever, you know. Like if he's putting it out anyway I'll just tell people they're just putting it out and you know, whatever. So that clip came from after I knew about it but I didn't help him write it, I didn't know about it initially. I...
I didn't submit anything to Bazem to get Kingsman kicked. I didn't intend on getting Kingsman kicked ever. I didn't even try to get him kicked, you know? I was just gonna try and work around him. That was my mindset. I was like, okay, we can still make it work. It's okay. I'm a very persistent person, so it's like, you know, was like, yep, we can still make it work. It's okay.
Coach Mills (01:37:50.073)
Because by by the way, just for the audience listening in, I played against or I played in a tournament with Zaza. This was the first time I interacted with her, and the entire tournament, Zaza was put on support. The entire tournament. So like, I don't know if you I'd have forgotten exactly which tournament this was, but you were basically put on a team and you were playing support for almost the entire tournament until y'all your team was like backed against the wall. Y'all were about to be eliminated. It was like the first time you got to play widow.
zazzastack (01:37:54.37)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:38:19.724)
And you just cooked everyone. Like you fried the entire lobby. And I remember watching that game because we finished our matches. We were watching your team. And your teammates were like, Zaza, why didn't you tell us you were nice on the widow? We would have let you play. Yeah, we would've let you play. We would have let you play widow if you would've told us. So it's I can understand going into this tournament and it's just like
zazzastack (01:38:31.693)
That was the first Baz and one. Yeah, that's the one I have a YouTube video on.
Coach Mills (01:38:43.224)
You know, you already did the fill like you've shown that you were willing to do the fill thing. Like it's not like you were just like someone that's like unwilling to work with your team. But that didn't stop your team from getting rolled all those games that you were on support. Like your team was just losing over and over again be before.
zazzastack (01:38:45.73)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:38:49.504)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:38:54.489)
Yeah.
I think I also played really bad No Scrims because I was in a very closed, stressed out mindset. Like having everyone going on around me, I was like, I haven't had enough caffeine for this, I'm not awake enough for this, I don't know what to do, I'm just trying to play the game, trying to lock in, but then I've got like three people yapping in my headset and like, you know, it was just kind of chaos and I don't think my brain was ready enough to, you know, awake enough to handle that for the day.
You know what I mean? So... yeah.
Coach Mills (01:39:28.728)
Seems chaos. What what what y'all have any perspectives on it, coach and and per sixo? What do you what do you think? What do you what's y'all's perspective? I I've been talking about
CaptainCoach (01:39:36.761)
All I know is I see more Zazas in ranked than I think any other themed name. There are... Which by the way, I was curious, what'd you get your name from?
zazzastack (01:39:41.561)
There's so many of pastas. There's so many. I come across one every day.
Coach Mills (01:39:43.288)
Ha ha ha ha!
Coach Mills (01:39:47.517)
well
zazzastack (01:39:54.202)
Um, a lot of people think that it's like, weird. A lot of people think that it's zaza like, weird, but it's not. so I, when I was, um, probably like eight years old, um, I got my first online account and it was on PlayStation 3. And, uh, for reference, I'm 21 turning 22 this year. But, um, you know, I was like eight years old and I got my first account on PlayStation 3 so I could play Battlefield 4 on my own account and like...
Coach Mills (01:39:57.846)
Well yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:39:59.207)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:40:22.989)
You know, and my dad was setting it up for me and he's always been impatient when it comes to like letting us choose a name or something like that, you know, like he's like, come on, just throw it out there, you know? And so I was taking too long to pick a name for myself. So he put the first letter of my IRL first name in front of his gamertag. And that's kind of how it became, my IRL first name is Zali, Z-A-H-L-I.
CaptainCoach (01:40:46.449)
I don't know.
Persixo (01:40:49.051)
That's tough, that's tough.
zazzastack (01:40:50.049)
Yeah, so it's a bit of a different one, but yeah, no, so it's the first letter of my first name in front of my dad's gamertag. And it's kind of funny because a lot of people don't know that I grew up in a game of family. And so my sisters also have like as a stack in their name with the first letter of their first name at the front.
CaptainCoach (01:40:51.003)
Cool.
Coach Mills (01:41:06.754)
That's actually that's actually dumb. What games did you play with your dad?
zazzastack (01:41:09.945)
well, Battlefield was one of them. We used to play Battlefield 4 and Battlefield 3 quite a lot. I've always played Battlefield with them, even like the new ones and like even Battlefield 6 when that came out. Yeah, like I- I don't play with them on stream, but like I do off stream every now and then, so.
Coach Mills (01:41:18.434)
That's actually that's actually a ma that's actually amazing. 'Cause 'cause that
CaptainCoach (01:41:21.541)
That's pretty cool.
Coach Mills (01:41:26.03)
'Cause growing up, so my my my mom and dad are divorced, most most parents are. But my how I would connect with my dad is we would always play games. We would always play games. We played Halo three online together, we played all the battlefields together, we would and we would play with my brother who also he lived far away from me, so we would all used to game. and it was the Mills clan. We we we we had a lot of fun. That's game parents gaming together is the coolest thing. it's so fun.
zazzastack (01:41:30.541)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:41:34.189)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:41:42.199)
Yeah.
I don't know, yeah. My mum would play Mario Kart when we were little. My mum would play Mario Kart and my dad was pretty much everything else. would help me out. I was a big Spyro fan, massive Spyro fan. I've got a Spyro phone holder and that's Ignited Trilogy 1.
Coach Mills (01:41:53.361)
nice, nice.
CaptainCoach (01:42:04.923)
Hmm
Coach Mills (01:42:04.946)
wait, I I used to love Spiral back in the day. I forgot even what I played it on. It's the Sega was it Sega? I don't even know.
zazzastack (01:42:09.331)
And I've got like my cabinet back here I've got a Spyro shelf with a big Spyro figure and the Skylander variants and some Cinder variants and all the Spyro games at the back. Like yeah, thank you, thank you. Yeah, and that's like Toothless and that's Overwatch and random stuff down the bottom. But yeah, so I played through pretty much all the Spyro games and...
Coach Mills (01:42:13.293)
Ooh.
Coach Mills (01:42:21.538)
That's an awesome collection. What the heck? That's cool.
zazzastack (01:42:36.109)
Dad used to sit there helping me as well for hours on the boss fights when I was too little to like understand them or beat them myself. And I would be like, dad, I need you to help me, help me beat this boss. I can't get him. Like, I think in Spyro Eternal Night, there was like a train boss or something, or maybe it was a new beginning. I can't remember. It was one of the Legend of Spyro ones, of the first two. But there was a boss that was like a train, train master that kept going around in a ring.
Coach Mills (01:42:45.644)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:43:05.337)
and had to defeat him, I always struggled with that one. Always. Because it would charge at you at random times here and there. And I didn't know how to move on the game back then. Like I wasn't her, you know? So yeah, I used to always get Dad to help me with things like that on games and stuff. But it's mainly Battlefield aside from that though and like other shooter games that I'd play with him.
Coach Mills (01:43:21.09)
That's all that's actually so sick. Man that
Coach Mills (01:43:29.218)
That just gave me a flashback. So people that have watched the pod, y'all probably don't know. So my dad was a Dallas firefighter. He was a Dallas firefighter for twenty-five years. And one of the things that if you don't know about a fire station is when they're not on call, they just do whatever the fuck they want, which is a combination of like cooking and sleeping and watching TV and playing games. So they would have a backroom that was just an Xbox, the original Xbox, and they're just playing Halo 2. And so I would just be I was just at my dad's when I was a little kid, I was just at my dad's fire station, I was just in the back.
zazzastack (01:43:50.713)
That's pretty awesome.
Coach Mills (01:43:55.767)
And people would go on call, people would come back, people would wake up and just random people would just come and play. They'd just fight me in in Halo. Like it but it was just like my dad would be in there, then it'd be like a random other guy in there. But I just I I I completely forgot that memory until you were talking just now. It is a it's a it's a fun memory. But that it's cool.
zazzastack (01:44:09.941)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, no, I've got a lot of fun memories of gaming with my dad. Like, it's not just Spyro and Battlefield that we played together, but they're like the two most prominent ones in my memories, so... Yeah. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:44:12.421)
Maybe, maybe.
Coach Mills (01:44:22.52)
That's awesome.
CaptainCoach (01:44:23.151)
Maybe this explains some things, but my introduction to video games was watching my dad, like when we had family parties and stuff in the room with like my uncles and stuff playing Wolfenstein 3D. That's like the first game, which that game is so cool.
Coach Mills (01:44:36.256)
Oooookay. I played the trailer of that like three times. I like that. Or the the the demo. I could try I played the demo of that again.
zazzastack (01:44:38.169)
I've heard of that one before.
CaptainCoach (01:44:44.177)
I'm talking about the old, old one. I it came out, I think, in like 89 or something.
Coach Mills (01:44:47.643)
the old, old one. Wasn't there a ni wasn't there a like a remade Wolfenstein game? I'm thinking probably the more modern Wolfenstein is what I'm talking about, most likely.
CaptainCoach (01:44:57.113)
Yeah, 3D was what they put on games back then to make it seem like it was some new age thing. Like 3D, like you can move in different, like that's how old it was, right? But it was, yeah, so watching him playing on the family computer and then he eventually gave me the original Game Boy. So I was like into like all the Pokemons and stuff like that.
Coach Mills (01:45:02.894)
Three D.
Persixo (01:45:03.845)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (01:45:18.341)
So I can't relate at all because my my parents were like foreign. So like they c they they came to the US and it was it would just work. It was like me and my cousins though playing, like them, like parents, like that that was like an idea that was like like if someone said game like my dad games, I'm like, Your dad games? Like what is like like it was so foreign to me. I like, What do you mean? Yeah, I
Coach Mills (01:45:33.367)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:45:33.541)
Right.
zazzastack (01:45:34.111)
Yeah, my whole family game. both my parents and my two younger sisters and myself, yeah, I was the oldest of three, so yeah, we pretty much had like a full team of people, you know? Yeah, my cousins also gamed us all, so yeah, like...
Coach Mills (01:45:38.52)
That's awesome.
Persixo (01:45:40.783)
That would have been lit. I was I was playing my cousins. Had a ha had a had a full stack, had a full stack. Nice.
Coach Mills (01:45:45.772)
Yeah, it's sick.
Coach Mills (01:45:50.21)
Although I it I it's I mean it's gonna become more and more common. I feel like every generation after ours will probably be you know, they have gamer parents, right? I mean, at least I mean my I my my daughter and my son, they're gonna I'm putting on aim trainers the second they turn nine, you know? You know it's getting I'm gonna grow the I have y'all y'all heard that story of like it was like it was like a chess grandmaster, he like intentionally married like a another chess grandmaster and like raised like
Persixo (01:45:55.93)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:46:03.952)
Hehehehe
Persixo (01:46:06.392)
They're going bro.
zazzastack (01:46:06.775)
Well...
Coach Mills (01:46:15.426)
three grand champion daughters or something like that. I for there's there's like a story about it. Where he he they they got married with the intent to have kids to make them grandmasters in chess. He had they had three daughters and it all three of them became grandmasters 'cause he taught them from a young age. So I'm gonna do the same thing and make like like hit scan gods, you know what I'm saying? Like perfect tracking and fucking, you know, like let's do No
zazzastack (01:46:34.029)
Hahaha
Persixo (01:46:36.951)
Yo
zazzastack (01:46:37.729)
My dad is a big contributor to my aim actually because even though I used to play Battlefield on console, he always used to be like, okay, shoot him now, shoot him now. He would just go really quickly, shoot, shoot. he's right there, he's right there. He would sit behind me while I was sitting in the chair gaming and he would be making call outs just from watching my gameplay and he was like, you gotta shoot them as soon as you see them. You gotta react instantly.
Coach Mills (01:46:40.971)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:46:49.428)
zazzastack (01:47:07.321)
You have to get them straight away. And he would like drill that into my head every single day that I would play Battlefield. And so I got really good at Battlefield 4 even though I was only like, you know, 10 years old once I started getting good at it. And yeah, no, think a lot of... Even though a lot of the time it was just like noise clutter, him yelling over me in the game, it still made its way into my head and like helped me figure out what I had to work on, you know?
Coach Mills (01:47:09.986)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:47:33.772)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:47:34.255)
How do I home coach?
zazzastack (01:47:36.267)
react quickly and stuff like that so I think that contributed a lot.
Coach Mills (01:47:41.548)
What what is how how how has your family's reaction or your dad's reaction been to the the drama and everything? You know, is it i ha any thoughts about it? Have they have they just been like, Hey, just just just stick it stick it through or what you know?
zazzastack (01:47:48.953)
Yeah, no, my mom's a lot softer than my dad. They're both very me-sided, but as you would being the parent of, know, being my parents, yeah, they're going to be me-sided.
Coach Mills (01:48:06.732)
Right, right, right. Yeah, they're gonna they're gonna s yeah, they're always gonna s I I'm I'm I'm convinced I could stab a person in broad daylight, my dad would be like, Nope, he didn't do it. No he would testify on the spot that I didn't do it and he could have saw it. I I know that for a fact. Yeah Yeah.
zazzastack (01:48:15.801)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:48:17.851)
Be like wait wait wait wait wait wait but like why why did he do it though? Why did he do it though?
zazzastack (01:48:24.249)
Yeah, no, my, but my parents are very like, they're very, they're very laid back and like chill and kind people and they're pretty relaxed about everything. They've never been stroked. They've never been uptight. They've never, you know, worried too much about what's happening. They just, they just wanted to raise us with the right morals and values and stuff. And I think they did a good job at that. And yeah, no, like that's pretty much.
You know, like they don't really care about it because they... I'm a very open and honest person to anyone I talk to. And especially my parents, I'm even more open with them because they're my parents and I've got a close relationship with them. yeah, so like they know everything that happened in detail. They know everything that happened. yeah, no, they're just like, it's okay. Just keep being you. Keep being you. Keep doing your thing and like, you know...
The nice people who want to support you will keep supporting you and don't let the other people get to you. Like the people who are rude or toxic or hateful because they have nothing better to do. That's pretty much what they said to me so... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they're lovely parents.
Coach Mills (01:49:35.918)
Stubby parents, honestly. That's awesome. That's awesome.
Persixo (01:49:37.307)
Mm-hmm.
CaptainCoach (01:49:40.625)
I try to explain to my grandmother what I do and she still doesn't understand. She's 94. So I just say I make videos. She's like, oh, so when she heard word of a podcast, that's like something she kind of kind of gets. She's like, she's she's always like every time I see her, she's like, got a new episode of the podcast. I try to put it up on the TV, but I can't figure it out.
zazzastack (01:49:48.15)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:49:51.822)
Ooh
zazzastack (01:49:58.905)
My parents try to put my Twitch stream on the TV, so...
Coach Mills (01:49:59.758)
That's a that's a that's a W grandma.
Persixo (01:50:00.965)
What can I find it?
CaptainCoach (01:50:04.581)
That's cool, that's cool.
Coach Mills (01:50:06.412)
Yeah, so sometimes sometimes like like my family, like my dad watches the the the my streams and sometimes I'm like I I sometimes I say really sus or weird fucking things on stream and I'm like, god damn it. I c I gotta like tone this shit down. Like I can't let my like I would prefer y'all don't watch. I l I like the support, but like I
zazzastack (01:50:17.305)
God damn it, my parents will watch you.
Persixo (01:50:20.923)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (01:50:25.943)
My parents just have a laugh if I say anything dumb like that, like they just have a laugh at it or they'll ask me when I call them because I call them every day or two just because I live seven hours away from them now.
And I called them every day or two and they're like, yeah, I heard you say this on stream the other day. I'm like, yeah, no, that was just a joke. And they were like, yeah, I thought so. I thought that was a joke. you know, like I never, it's very rare I say anything like out of the ordinary, but sometimes I'll get in wacky games where people are just like interesting, you know? Yeah. I flirt with all the women who play support. Don't worry.
Coach Mills (01:50:44.263)
CaptainCoach (01:50:44.849)
God
Coach Mills (01:50:48.622)
Ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (01:50:49.69)
I'm-
Coach Mills (01:50:54.99)
Well I
Coach Mills (01:50:58.51)
No, I I probably just flirt with men too much, on honestly. Like every time I get or every time I get per sexo in my lobby, I just don't know how to act. I mean, look at him. Let's go. What's up, Granny? Okay, okay, so moving on, a couple of things I want to talk about. First off, what's y'all's impressions of the new map?
zazzastack (01:51:06.777)
Yeah. How do you feel about that? How do you feel about that?
CaptainCoach (01:51:09.797)
My grandma watches this podcast, Mills.
Persixo (01:51:12.173)
Ya this some DLC
zazzastack (01:51:17.933)
Persixo (01:51:23.643)
I didn't even play today. I never got it. I played for five hours today, I didn't get it. I didn't even get it.
zazzastack (01:51:26.157)
Really?
Coach Mills (01:51:26.252)
You've never played it? I love I it's one of my favorite maps that they just initially released. Like the new of the Nuna maps. I think it's very nice.
CaptainCoach (01:51:26.265)
It's so good.
zazzastack (01:51:28.737)
I like it.
zazzastack (01:51:34.967)
I haven't had like a good look around all of it but I actually feel like, in a way, I don't know how they've done it but it's like an open corridor map. I don't know, it's like there's so many, there's so many like pathways and like corridors and sightlines but they're all like, they're not super opened up, they're all their own little sightlines but there's heaps.
Coach Mills (01:51:44.802)
That that's a good
That's a good
Coach Mills (01:51:53.793)
It's w it's it's like it's it's like yeah, I I understand exactly what you mean. I I really don't know how they did it. 'Cause you can create angles, like long angles, but you can also cut angles short with like these these little
zazzastack (01:51:57.454)
Mm. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. It's a very unique map. I actually, I really like it, but I've played it like two or three times I think so far. I don't know how I'll fully feel about it until I explore all of it, but I think it's actually like quite an interesting, fun concept, that little sand tunnel that you can like go under. I think that's so cool.
Coach Mills (01:52:16.494)
Don't explore it.
Coach Mills (01:52:23.572)
I love it. I love it. Yeah. No it no, wait when I first saw it, I was like, You've gotta be fucking me. There's a Spider Man pit here. I was like, This is terrible. And then I fell down and got spit back up. I like, this is the best ever. Like this is great. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:52:24.634)
Yes.
zazzastack (01:52:33.449)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, this is also, yeah. Yeah, I... Yeah.
CaptainCoach (01:52:36.751)
No, I actually have some balanced thoughts about that part of the map in particular. One of my big problems is that there's a lot of toxic gameplay loops that, you know, like Angela knocking you off the map, Spider-Man pulling you off the map. I feel like the game's really like struggled to balance around because it's just such a powerful mechanic that you only have some of the time. I think that it's kind of clever what they did where it's like a pit you fall into. You're out of the fight for maybe like five seconds, but it's not.
as bad as getting pulled off them. Right, so you still get value for it, but it's not so debilitating to where like tanks are just like, I can't play the game. Right.
zazzastack (01:53:06.689)
It still disrupts the play, yeah.
Persixo (01:53:07.747)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:53:12.057)
Mm.
Coach Mills (01:53:13.686)
Well what I what I would have liked, like t kind of to go along with that, you know like the lava pit you get pulled off on the Hydra map? Like imagine if you got pulled off the map and instead of dying, you like take a hundred damage and get spit back up on fire and it does another, you know, fifty damage trickling. You know, something like that. Where it's just like yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Thing with team up is immune. No, but like like I don't know, it's just mechanics that don't just insta kill you. Like do a do effectively six to eight hundred di
Persixo (01:53:14.051)
Gotta play thing and dino, sadly.
zazzastack (01:53:14.861)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:53:21.381)
Terrible.
CaptainCoach (01:53:31.985)
Torch is immune.
Persixo (01:53:34.437)
Can you imagine? Mm-hmm.
CaptainCoach (01:53:35.845)
No dam.
Coach Mills (01:53:43.56)
HP instantly, you know, like that's a lot. It's a lot of fucking HP. But maybe that that creates a map meta. I don't know. Like, I haven't really thought about that.
CaptainCoach (01:53:47.281)
It probably make it easier for them to balance the game. Cause I feel like most of the heroes that I just mentioned, Spider-Man, Angela, they're on the weaker side in my opinion, compared to the top heroes. Cause they do kind of get balanced around the mobility and displacement that they have. And then at the end of the day, yeah, like I probably make them easier to balance. Like I think the maps not being so ridiculous is...
Coach Mills (01:54:06.648)
So without without it, I see what you're saying. They would have to buff yeah other parts of it.
CaptainCoach (01:54:15.86)
It's funny too, it's pretty weird. There is some outplay you can do with it too. I used it as an escape one time because there's a health pack down there in the little sand pit. And then it shoots you back up on the other side of the map and then the healers are just like, where did he come from?
zazzastack (01:54:28.691)
Yeah, he's bamboozled him.
Coach Mills (01:54:30.966)
CaptainCoach (01:54:31.173)
I think the one on the second checkpoint though, where you go up and it's like basically a cut scene, that was a bit much.
Coach Mills (01:54:34.604)
I like it. I like it, dude.
zazzastack (01:54:36.599)
I think I saw that one, that one's, yeah, it's interesting. Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:54:39.776)
I like it. I like it. But maybe it will be tiring eventually. But I do like it.
CaptainCoach (01:54:45.143)
It's better than the party boat on the museum.
Persixo (01:54:48.01)
that's terrible. When they add
Coach Mills (01:54:48.268)
Well well no, I I the reason I loved it is there was an Iron Fist that popped old and chased me and I hopped in there and I'm like, all right, you wanna come? By the time you we get to the fucking bottom, you're old silver. Like, you're not chasing my ass either. So okay, the other thing, hood predictions slash desires. So hood is gonna be a tank, most likely. any desires or predictions about the character? Any anything at all? I
zazzastack (01:54:49.736)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (01:54:58.416)
Yep.
CaptainCoach (01:54:58.427)
Yeah
zazzastack (01:55:15.757)
be cool if he's a brain-shits can tank. You know? Like, it'll be another main that Parasixer could have. Yeah. Mmm.
Coach Mills (01:55:18.508)
Yeah, that's true. They which is
Coach Mills (01:55:24.258)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:55:24.505)
That's what I'm saying, bro. But depends though, because if he plays like tank pool, then it's like I can't No, I want I want him to be up.
Coach Mills (01:55:28.366)
Ooh, I wanted to play like tank pull baby. Let's go. G give me a give me a flanker. Like a flanker with pistols tank. like a pure No, but I want like pure I want it built based on pure mobility. Like give me a lot of movement.
zazzastack (01:55:34.153)
I... I... I won't.
Persixo (01:55:35.235)
You already got one, tank pole. You already got one. That's it.
zazzastack (01:55:40.088)
I want a hitscan tank that has mobility but like no shield. Like I feel like it'd be interesting. Nothing to defend himself like straight away like no blocking damage. He might have a bit of shield maybe to counteract that but like as in like on his health bar not like shields to block but yeah and like him just having a hitscan handgun.
Coach Mills (01:55:47.874)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's yeah, like that. yeah.
Coach Mills (01:56:01.367)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (01:56:08.248)
G give give me a character like Blade that is has more mobility and is tankier but way less damage. Something like that. like, you know, like I can kind of roam, you know, roam around the map and I don't know. Well There's a lot I I do know that that team up with magic is gonna be really strong, I think. If it's gonna be very strong. The huge demon when it finally comes out with them together.
zazzastack (01:56:08.705)
and bit of movement, like some dashes or something.
CaptainCoach (01:56:11.121)
Hmm.
zazzastack (01:56:22.745)
That'd be interesting.
zazzastack (01:56:29.689)
Mm.
Persixo (01:56:32.943)
Yeah. I was gonna say I want like with him, dude, he need he need be like a magneto, right in the front, right in the box, bro. Like that's what I think you you you can but I I I think they should give him I'm telling you, they're gonna give the people are saying, supposedly I don't know if this is true. I don't know if this is true. People are saying that supposedly he's gonna be a hit scan, like, you know, d dual pistol, but with a shield too. So I'm like, Wait, a shield, how's that gonna work? Like a Sigma? Like like kinda like like you like like how Emma's shield is, like you put it out kinda like that, or is it gonna be like a freaking
Coach Mills (01:56:38.158)
Hay
zazzastack (01:56:41.386)
That's what I think would happen to him.
Coach Mills (01:56:45.208)
Don't do it. Don't do it.
Persixo (01:57:03.147)
I I don't even know like how because like I'm looking at him and I can't picture him putting up a shield. I love shields. I love it. Get boo-boo-boo. I love shields. I love it.
Coach Mills (01:57:03.84)
Enough I hate shi enough shields. No more shields. I hate shields. No more shields. I know you do. I hate bro. I am so over shields.
zazzastack (01:57:11.715)
I know I'm a Widow main but like I actually do really like playing against and with shields so... Because because I like as a Widow main you're always trying to look for that off angle and you know like you can still get around it people are always like shields counter Widow shields counter Widow and Groot counters Widow because of his walls but bro you just you have a sprint jump you can go get a different angle like there's so many ways to like
Persixo (01:57:16.987)
That's what I'm saying, it's peak. It's peak.
Coach Mills (01:57:34.924)
Yeah, yeah Yeah, if you're standing straight down main.
zazzastack (01:57:39.457)
counter that yourself, you know, don't have to, yeah.
Coach Mills (01:57:41.122)
I mean t taking angles this is as someone that coaches a lot of players, taking angles is not something that people really do until like mid diamond plus, which means like less than you know, thirty percent of the player base, maybe less than twenty percent of the player base do it. They they sit main and they shoot front line. So Yeah, but it's terrible too. Like it's i yeah yeah.
zazzastack (01:57:50.318)
Yeah.
zazzastack (01:57:58.221)
Yeah. Yeah.
Persixo (01:57:59.547)
'Cause it's easy.
No no no I know it's terrible, but I'm just saying, but like as like as a new player, it's like, I'm Punisher. Well not Punisher. Yeah. On the tanks too, and then they'll just farm the group, and then he's he's he his health bar isn't even moving because like you hit him and then and it goes back up, like it's not even moving. Two final hits, terrible. Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (01:58:03.435)
Yeah. Yeah. You can kind of switch your brain off and just sit there and still feel like you're getting valued because you're getting the like hit markets and you can hear them. Yeah. And the- yeah.
Coach Mills (01:58:09.196)
Right.
Coach Mills (01:58:18.745)
Hehehehehe.
zazzastack (01:58:18.905)
And they're like, I'm doing so much damage, I'm doing so much damage, but it's like, yeah, but you're not securing those kills. You need to secure the kills to make sure the enemy team is down one, because a 5v6 is way easier to win than a 6v6, like...
CaptainCoach (01:58:19.505)
You
CaptainCoach (01:58:32.689)
Yeah, I feel like once you get the 5 or 6, that's when you kind of just farm your damage, because it's like they just won't be able to keep up. Right.
zazzastack (01:58:36.578)
Yeah.
Persixo (01:58:36.955)
You just hold W. You literally just hold W.
Coach Mills (01:58:39.982)
this was a question I forgot to ask you, Zaza, but I wonder, are are you pr are you gonna play in any tournaments in the future?
zazzastack (01:58:47.649)
I look as long as I'm invited to them, yeah for sure. I haven't, I like I will be honest I haven't had a lot of invite since everything. I don't blame people for not inviting me. You know like it was, it would make a lot of noise to see me in a tournament. You know I actually, yeah.
Coach Mills (01:58:52.376)
Look.
Coach Mills (01:59:05.824)
I think that's I mean, I think that's I mean it's probably good. I I I d that's my opinion. I don't know I I don't know what Percyxo thinks.
zazzastack (01:59:10.711)
Like, I love tournaments and one incident out of the thousands of tournaments I've played is not going to change my love for a tournament, you know? Even though it was quite a big outburst, I guess.
Yeah, no, like I still have a very competitive nature. I love competitive games. I always want to win. I never, I genuinely will never ever throw a game, not intentionally. Like I will unintentionally throw by like playing bad by accident. Like I don't mean to, but you know, like I will never in my life intentionally throw a game. Even if someone like locks my character and is like rude to me, I still won't throw. Like it's not, like I still want to try and win, you know?
Persixo (01:59:41.37)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (01:59:52.479)
I'll I'll I'll probably throw. I see I see I I'll throw. Someone bans a character I'm hovering if I if I hover Lord Thor and someone bans it, I'm throwing. I'm fucking throwing. I'm sorry. I'm throwing. Huh? Yeah If if I'm on their team, they're banning it? man. Alright, you bet you better hope I don't hear your voice on the pre-select for six. You better hope. wait, is that for six though? my b misclick, bro, misclick. My bad, my bad.
zazzastack (01:59:54.873)
Yeah, I wouldn't.
I normally look, look, if they take with her.
Persixo (02:00:01.255)
no, I don't blame him for banning that though. I don't blame him. I don't blame him.
zazzastack (02:00:07.673)
If I'm on that team... Look...
Persixo (02:00:08.985)
I don't blame him.
Persixo (02:00:13.239)
You'll go get Dor out, get
Persixo (02:00:19.259)
No, don't do that. we are losing. We are losing then. We are losing. We are losing as a team.
Coach Mills (02:00:19.998)
the twenty percent hit? man, sorry bro. I know. No I'm scared.
zazzastack (02:00:22.649)
Yeah, I mean like like me personally my mindset when that happens is just okay Well, I'll lock heller and I'll try and carry them so I can say I carried them at the end You know like so can say I played well and like I mean I don't ever tell people that even even if I do play really well and like Carry them to the win after they've like done that to me like I don't even say that like I just kind of I can sit with the satisfaction of looking at my stats knowing I got the most finals I got MVP I
CaptainCoach (02:00:49.873)
Mm-mm.
zazzastack (02:00:52.077)
had a good amount of damage and I got my value and I have little deaths and they've got like 20 so I'm like yeah I'm cool I'm
CaptainCoach (02:00:58.043)
See that's that's why you're gonna love playing with me. I'm gonna let him know for you. Don't you worry about that
Coach Mills (02:00:58.616)
Dude dude ca Bro, Captain Coach Captain I I lost a game today with someone on my team and at the very end screen they said every game I play with Captain Coach and Coach Mills I lose. I was like, What the fuck? And then I play against them and I and we win against them. And they type at the end they're like, Why did you throw last game and try this game? I was like, You I was like, what are you talking about? Jesus Christ.
Persixo (02:01:01.733)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (02:01:14.425)
Click.
zazzastack (02:01:21.465)
Oh god. Oh god, bruh. What?
CaptainCoach (02:01:21.817)
Yeah. No, no, you guys want to hear something funny? So Mills and I do a lot. My sub sound for YouTube memberships is basically someone saying if he finds coach Mills in real life, it's quote over for him.
Coach Mills (02:01:37.966)
No no someone said someone t someone said that for me. They literally said that they literally said that if they find me in real life it's over. They like yeah, yeah, no i we we
CaptainCoach (02:01:41.937)
Ha ha ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (02:01:47.268)
It's over for you!
Persixo (02:01:47.801)
What the f what did you do?
CaptainCoach (02:01:50.969)
He went Spider-Man. He went Spider-Man, I remember that game.
zazzastack (02:01:52.761)
God.
Persixo (02:01:52.898)
come on.
Coach Mills (02:01:55.508)
I did, I did. I d I wasn't I okay, yeah, I don't know. He He was indeed It was no it wa it 'cause it was though it was so just r out of nowhere. Like he just Anyway it was this I yeah, it was
zazzastack (02:01:56.629)
man.
CaptainCoach (02:01:58.117)
People are too serious bro. We both started laughing like it was funny as fuck.
zazzastack (02:02:00.589)
They literally are.
CaptainCoach (02:02:05.241)
He was... No, he was typing. He was typing. was just like, man, I always... Whatever. He was going for you, because usually they go for me. He was going for you. was like, whatever, get Coach Mills on my team. Yeah. So funny.
Coach Mills (02:02:14.568)
it's so
Persixo (02:02:15.896)
It's over.
zazzastack (02:02:19.235)
But yeah, like, just sorry, I just wanted to extend on my answer to the last question. I'm always happy to be a part of a tournament. I love playing in tournaments. It's something that I really, really enjoy and I'll always make content about a tournament. I didn't make much content about the one that happened because I didn't want to like drama farm. I don't really want to do that, you know? I just kind wanted to let it die, but...
Coach Mills (02:02:21.676)
No, no, go go go.
Coach Mills (02:02:40.374)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:02:46.604)
I think I 'cause I reached out to you early 'cause I it like I I like I I'm I'm always 'cause I I did reach out to you like when the whole situation sorry, I did reach out to you 'cause I feel like with a lot of those situations you kinda gotta get out in front of it. Like if you have a different opinion than the public, if you don't respond, then that's the truth. Like the whatever opinion that they've made up, that's the truth because
CaptainCoach (02:02:47.055)
Yeah, I'm like that too. If there's content on me, I'll just let it go.
zazzastack (02:02:57.686)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:03:01.741)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:03:06.325)
Yeah, I think, yeah. I think I didn't want to like put anything else out there because the damage control that was already done by other people was kind of like not great. And yeah, and so I didn't really, I kind of was just like, I don't really want to do my own damage control. I'll just, you know, I'll just like write out an apology and like just, you know, let it go. And I just didn't want to put my own out, but yeah.
Coach Mills (02:03:17.228)
It made it worse? Yeah yeah. Like a lot worse, right?
Well
I guess that's fair when like fucking a million people did damage control and made it all way worse. I see.
CaptainCoach (02:03:32.048)
I think...
Coach Mills (02:03:34.646)
Mm.
CaptainCoach (02:03:35.526)
I think in that same vein, kind of with what Mills is saying, where what I've learned is, and why I've been so grateful for this podcast, is people don't necessarily even need to, like, they don't even care what you have to say so much. Just the fact that you're there and, they see you and how you're behaving. Like, they almost just kind of want, like, a signal that, like, okay, this person is, because if you're able to just kind of,
zazzastack (02:03:50.669)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:03:54.872)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:04:00.092)
come and talk about something calmly and give your opinions. And I don't think a lot of people are going to have some crazy view on you. It's more about just presenting yourself at all, really.
Coach Mills (02:04:06.68)
Well I mean it's it's a lot harder it's a lot harder to demonize you when they just they understand you're just a person. Like you're not you're not some crazy like you know, you're just a person. You have you have poppets, you have you know, you play games with your dad, like you're just a person. Like just you know, like I just a perhaps Yeah. And and and and like I mean I'm I'm kind of an unk. I'm I'm twenty nine at this point. I got two kids and a wife. Cap
zazzastack (02:04:08.352)
Yeah, well...
CaptainCoach (02:04:16.017)
Exactly, exactly.
zazzastack (02:04:16.249)
Mm.
zazzastack (02:04:20.182)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:04:24.087)
Yeah, I'm just, I'm just a random person. I'm just like anyone else. just, I just choose to put myself on a camera and out there to the internet. That's the only difference, like.
zazzastack (02:04:35.033)
Mm.
CaptainCoach (02:04:35.513)
I'm literally a nug-
Coach Mills (02:04:36.162)
Captain Coach is in like forty, and then per sixo. I don't I don't know how old you are, but I think of you as really old 'cause you play Magneto, okay? I think you're twenty four? okay. Wha wh I yeah, and and that's the thing that I I'm crazy about, 'cause like when I first got came on like started doing content, I think I was I was twenty four, twenty three when I s first started doing content. And like I got some negativity. What's it? Yeah, yeah, go.
CaptainCoach (02:04:38.897)
Yeah, 40, 50, something like that.
Persixo (02:04:42.297)
I'm young. Bro. I'm twenty-four. I'm twenty-four. I'm a I'm a j
zazzastack (02:04:45.003)
I'm 21.
CaptainCoach (02:04:49.658)
wow.
zazzastack (02:04:49.721)
I'm 21 and I turned 22 this year, so.
zazzastack (02:05:01.881)
When you were doing- wait, can I just like say quickly? You were doing Overwatch content like early in Overwatch, right? Yeah, me and my sister actually used to watch your videos, unironically. Like, yeah, yeah, we used to watch you, used to watch Kefri, we used to watch Spylo, we used to watch like any like coach videos and like DPS kind of videos as well. used to actually like gen- unironically, we used to watch that stuff.
Coach Mills (02:05:09.88)
Yeah.
Persixo (02:05:13.189)
Same. Same. Well
Coach Mills (02:05:13.682)
Let's go! Wait, really? That's crazy.
Coach Mills (02:05:22.414)
That shout out.
Coach Mills (02:05:26.86)
I I I feel I feel like I'm a dinosaur in the space 'cause I've been doing it for like seven years or whatever.
zazzastack (02:05:31.504)
It's kind of funny because now that I'm older and I'm old enough to I started streaming when I was 16. now that I'm older and I've grown a bit more as a streamer and I do this full time now, I'm like, oh wait, these guys are all just people too who also stream. I'm starting to meet all the people that I used to watch because when you're just a viewer, you kind of go, oh, I wish I could do what they're doing. It's so cool, you know?
CaptainCoach (02:05:47.173)
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Persixo (02:05:47.3)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (02:05:57.11)
Right.
Persixo (02:05:58.139)
Mm-hmm. That wall that's like
zazzastack (02:05:59.871)
Yeah, it's like there's a wall there and it's like it feels like a brick wall that you can't push through, you know, but it's cool to see other people doing it, you know? And then it kind of makes you want to do it too. And then like now that I've grown as a creator, I'm like, like I can go back to my sister and be like, yeah, I actually did this with like Coach Mills today. I like did a podcast with him today. you know, she'll be like, I remember watching his videos. Like, yeah. Yeah, like genuinely.
Coach Mills (02:06:19.918)
That's sick. That's awesome.
that's that's actually wild. Man, now I am feeling now I'm feeling really old. Holy shit. no, no, it's okay. No, that's okay. but what I was gonna say is like like I like you always get some amount of hate on the internet no matter what when you're making a lot of content, but not I could not imagine being like I remember even just getting a little bit of hate bothered me back when I first started, back when I was like twenty two, twenty three. Getting a lot of hate
zazzastack (02:06:30.227)
Yeah. Sorry to make you feel...long.
zazzastack (02:06:42.083)
yeah. Yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (02:06:51.648)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:06:53.216)
As young as you are, I just like I I feel like I wish people would just understand, like just a person. You know, like at the end of the like just people are just you know, that's it. Like
zazzastack (02:06:59.979)
Yeah, I'm just a person.
CaptainCoach (02:07:02.275)
Yeah, and it can kind of feel like the end of the world sometimes.
zazzastack (02:07:06.303)
Yeah, like I will be honest, yes, I was like very, very overwhelmed when everything did actually happen because I never wanted drama. I just wanted to be friends with everyone and make some content, you know, and play some widow. Yeah, I just wanted to play a widow and be friends with everyone and make content, you know, like...
Coach Mills (02:07:08.503)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (02:07:18.043)
I just wanna play Widow.
Coach Mills (02:07:19.52)
Yeah. I I I like I like how every fucking Spider Man one trick can just throw every ranked game they're in, but it's just like so expected of them that like none of get ever any any trouble for it. I'm not gonna lie. It's actually
zazzastack (02:07:28.461)
Mm.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but yeah, no, it's like I don't know I I still get a lot of hate every day every single day I'm looking at like a hundred different comments of like you're chopped you're ugly or
you're like this because of because you're a woman or like you know like threats whether they're like unalive threats or you know assault threats or things like that like I I get a lot thrown at me every single day there's there's anything from those categories and on top of that just seeing that online in my messages in my comments things like that even in my emails sometimes
It's like crazy. Even in my business email, I get people writing whole emails to me to just go, you know, go... You know? Yeah. I've had one person send me an apology email because I banned them from my TikTok. I blocked them from my TikTok. And they were like, I realize I've been like such a dick. And like, like I won't say their name because you know, they're just a random view of it. And they were like, I realize I've...
CaptainCoach (02:08:12.227)
What?
Coach Mills (02:08:13.966)
It's just
CaptainCoach (02:08:20.229)
That's not even performative. That's just like mental illness. that's like.
zazzastack (02:08:41.017)
I've been like this and I'm really really sorry. I don't think anyone deserves that sort of hate and like, you know, like I've had one apology through my email like that. But yeah, like aside from that, like I still get threats often and I still get toxicity often. I get misogyny every day. Yeah, and I don't know, I guess I guess I've just like grown thick skin to it because I've been so exposed to it, if that makes sense.
Like, it's not necessarily a good thing, but I kind of need to have that thick skin if I want to do what I want to do, you know? So I don't really let it bother me, and I do a lot away from stream. I work out every day, I eat healthy, I put in the effort in my IRL life to make sure that I'm feeling good about myself, and you know, people can't affect that, so... yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:09:35.439)
Yeah, no, I'm right there with you, Sam. I mean, on behalf of the community, mean, just from watching your streams and just everything, like you've said today, I think the Marvel Rivals community is honestly lucky to have someone like you, like truthfully, truthfully. Because I go through some of that stuff, too, and it sucks. And it's probably not even half of what you face. it's just not.
zazzastack (02:09:48.185)
Thank you, that's very sweet. Thank you.
zazzastack (02:09:59.551)
Yeah, every single game there's like there's always someone like, Kingsman was right or like you know like I got Azaz to stack on my team it GG's anyway or like you know things like that just just little comments with like little jabs like that's every single game or something I actually
On Sunday, which was you guys' Saturday, I did a collaboration stream with DJ Swang and Zaytex. Zaytex is a hitscan player for YWL. And DJ is another Widow player. Yeah, yeah, he was the one who picked Widow in ProPlay before her rework. yeah, so he did a VOD review and some coaching for me and DJ. And DJ and I went and played some ranked games afterwards. And-
CaptainCoach (02:10:30.383)
I saw him pick Widow and Pro. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:10:45.299)
every single game we had someone who was like being weird to me or like toxic to me or like yapping to me or something like that and DJ's like I don't I really don't know how you do this these people are just weird as fuck like I don't know how you do this and I'm like I mean when it's every day like you just kind of become like whatever about it you know you just kind of like ignore it and just move on with your life you know like
Coach Mills (02:11:06.584)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:11:12.921)
I don't ever feel the need to stoop down to their levels, you know? Like, otherwise I'd be fighting everyone on the internet every day, but it's really not worth it, you know? Like, I don't know.
Coach Mills (02:11:12.982)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:11:22.626)
Yeah. I mean Yeah, honestly I don't know if I could do it. I probably would just fight with everyone twenty twenty four seven. I'm not gonna lie. I would just I would just be yelling at everyone like the whole stream, just yelling at people. But I I you know Yeah, I guess I guess so. I guess so. That's actually my Pung Fu Pen is my son's favorite favorite favorite movie. I've I've I've watched it legitimately. We will watch it multiple times a day. Like
CaptainCoach (02:11:29.371)
you
zazzastack (02:11:34.393)
You just gotta find your inner peace, you know?
zazzastack (02:11:43.865)
Concrete Pan is guarded. It's a good movie.
Coach Mills (02:11:51.402)
A you comfortable panda. yeah.
zazzastack (02:11:51.406)
That's me with How to Train Your Dragon. I love How to Train Your Dragon. That's why I've got like the Toothless Shelf and stuff. Yeah. I've got like two rows. I don't know if you can see them. These two rows are just How to Train Your Dragon ones. Of the Pops. I-
Coach Mills (02:11:57.488)
that's also too. We we do like watching Hajjani Dragon too. I love I love it.
CaptainCoach (02:12:06.321)
What did you think about the live action? I thought it was pretty good.
zazzastack (02:12:09.195)
I liked it. I thought it was pretty cool. I actually saw it three times in the cinemas when it came out. Yeah, no, saw it. So I saw it in the normal cinema. First time. then because Cap didn't realize that he'd booked the normal cinema, he thought he bought the 4D one because he wanted to take me to the 4D screening to make my day with it all that, which was really sweet of him.
Coach Mills (02:12:13.432)
okay. So it was you really liked it. I
CaptainCoach (02:12:13.828)
Persixo (02:12:14.981)
Ree sheesh.
zazzastack (02:12:38.049)
Yep. This guy just wants to sit right in front of me while I'm No, he looks like a Toothless. He looks like Toothless. Yeah. But no, his name's King Philip. My OGs on stream, my community OGs, they named him that. It was kind of like a majority vote kind of thing.
CaptainCoach (02:12:42.353)
Is your cat's name Toothless? A little bit, that's what I was thinking.
Coach Mills (02:12:43.859)
Yeah, he does, he does, he does, yeah.
Persixo (02:12:44.923)
Tav it.
CaptainCoach (02:12:51.889)
Coach Mills (02:12:52.026)
okay.
zazzastack (02:13:07.687)
he's stuck. But yeah, no, it's kind of like a majority vote kind of thing and it just kind of stuck, I guess. We just having like jokes about it and it just kind of like stuck that we were just calling King Philip. yeah, but yeah, no, my so my boyfriend, he he booked the normal cinema, thought he booked the 4D cinema. And then, you know, we went and saw the normal one.
CaptainCoach (02:13:10.009)
Hehehe.
zazzastack (02:13:31.577)
And then he's like, okay, I'll book it in 4D so you can go see it in 4D because I want to take you to the 4D cinema anyway because I know you love How to Train a Dragon. And so he booked the 4D cinema, the big one in Sydney that they have.
Coach Mills (02:13:46.028)
It's like with where air and splashy water and everything, like stuff like that. It's like moving chair.
zazzastack (02:13:49.913)
Yeah, yeah, with the water and like the air and the moving chair and stuff like that. It was really cool. Like think of, you know the test drive scene where they fly Toothless for the first time, where Hiccup flies Toothless for the first time? That one was like so cool to experience, like really cool. It was awesome. Yeah, and like it, like, you know, you've got like the orchestra music playing at like full blast and you've got like the perspective of like flying on Toothless in the movie and like it's so cool.
Coach Mills (02:13:53.054)
Persixo (02:13:53.847)
hex no.
CaptainCoach (02:13:54.26)
wow.
Coach Mills (02:14:05.326)
'Cause it like it like moves your chair, right? And like air.
zazzastack (02:14:19.449)
I- I- that's something I'm like, yeah, no, that was like a very, like one of my favorite experiences with it. Um, but yeah, so we watched it in 4D together and then my sisters were like, hold on, we want to watch it with you guys too. So we booked it in 4D again, I went and visited my sisters, I went and watched it with them. Sorry, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Coach Mills (02:14:20.302)
That's actually dope.
Coach Mills (02:14:31.798)
Okay.
CaptainCoach (02:14:33.073)
You
Coach Mills (02:14:38.52)
That's awesome though. Shar shared experiences like that is sick. I I just like how that movie is very similar to the like very, very similar to the the the the cartoon one. Like they didn't completely No, I know I like it. I like that it's similar. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Cause I I some I don't like it when they completely change up the story. I forgot what there's another one that did completely change up the story and it wasn't that popular. People didn't like it. I forgot what it was.
zazzastack (02:14:49.869)
Really? You dislike that? you do like it? Yeah, yeah, I, yeah.
zazzastack (02:15:04.729)
There are a few actually that are like that. Where they've like changed it. There are a few that like have deviated from the main story but I, yeah, I think that was definitely one of my favorite things. I mean the director was the same director between the live action animation.
Coach Mills (02:15:18.668)
Yeah. And they got the same they got Gerard Butler. The same guy. Yeah, I love I li I I I he's one of my favorite I I lo I actually love I I don't think Yeah. I don't think I've seen a better one.
zazzastack (02:15:23.385)
Yeah, yeah, exactly for Stoic. I love that too. I thought that was awesome. He was really good at Stoic. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:15:24.987)
That was cool.
CaptainCoach (02:15:32.029)
It's funny that you say that because there's with my family we all got the movie The Incredibles one Easter just as like a gift. We ended up watching that movie in our home three times in one day. We were just like upset. We loved it. It's so Incredibles for like my family. That's like all of our favorites like my dad.
zazzastack (02:15:38.389)
yeah.
Coach Mills (02:15:38.55)
Ooh.
Persixo (02:15:39.973)
Peak.
zazzastack (02:15:43.577)
Ha
Coach Mills (02:15:48.817)
yeah, it's l legitimately the best speedster that's ever been on television. Like not even close. Best written speedster. Best written. Dash. Well, 'cause like yeah, I mean I I watched a big a big ass long YouTube video about it, but it's like really hard to write speedsters because they I like theoretically should have no problems with anything. Like if you make them too fast, like you make them like like how they do with Yeah, like the you know, like the quicks or it was it Quicksilver? No, yeah.
zazzastack (02:15:49.364)
Yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:15:53.229)
for sure, for sure. Dash.
Persixo (02:15:56.357)
Good dash. Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (02:15:56.749)
Hahaha
zazzastack (02:16:12.771)
They're gonna have some sort of weakness. Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:16:18.626)
Time in a bottle, you know, he's like running around in slow motion. It's like if you're that fast then like you you should never have any ops. Yeah, and like the flash show. Like they always have to constantly like make him lose to like dumb shit because otherwise he'll never lose.
Persixo (02:16:25.892)
Nothing should stop you, yeah.
Persixo (02:16:33.979)
Bro, you're spitting because there was a there was a scene where a dude on a motorcycle, like he hit him and he knocked it, like, and then he went on a motorcycle and then he's the motorcycle's outpacing him. I'm like, what do you mean? How is a motor a dude on a motorcycle outpacing you, bro? Nah, terrible, terrible.
CaptainCoach (02:16:35.045)
Banana peel.
Coach Mills (02:16:45.354)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And then like the whole thing about like his biggest op is Captain Cold, which has like a cold gun. It's like motherfucking you can run at a bazillion. Like what are we talking like but that's the thing is like speedsters should not ever be that fast in my opinion. Or if you write a story about them, you can't make a traditional op their problem. Like it has to be a deeper problem than that, like a I don't know, like a problem of self or something, like a internal conflict. I don't know. I don't know what it is. But anyways, I I love the Incredibles. It's it's amazing.
Persixo (02:16:54.703)
The speed blue is run at him.
Coach Mills (02:17:14.798)
And they're working in the they're working on the third movie right now. But they're not time skipping, which some people don't like, but yeah, they're not they're not gonna tell you do any big time skip on that movie. but one thing I wanted to to to kind of wrap close things out or wrap things up a little bit, I wanna ask about what changes, if any, would you make for next season? Besides the widow re like bringing widow back. I know you want that. But like besides that, besides that, what changes
Persixo (02:17:17.54)
in there.
CaptainCoach (02:17:17.634)
let's go.
zazzastack (02:17:37.248)
I I was thinking that.
Coach Mills (02:17:40.558)
Well it this could be buffs, this could be nerfs, this could be changes to rank, this could be whatever you want it to be. No double bands. I I don't care. What w what what changes do you want to see in nine point five?
zazzastack (02:17:50.755)
Did you want to go fast, Psyxa? Okay. Yeah, no, I, personally, I always want to see Black Cat naft. I am never a fan of her. I hate her as much as I hated Sombra in Overwatch. And I was a very strong Sombra hater. But yeah, no, like I, or at least, I want to at least be able to...
Persixo (02:17:51.385)
No, no, you got f you gotta first. you gotta first you gotta first.
zazzastack (02:18:14.893)
deal some sort of damage to her while she's in her iframe state. I feel like if her full, fully like full rose colored like figure kind of like comes at me like that you you kind of expect to be able to hit it like she doesn't look any different in her iframes.
So you kind of like feel like that's okay, that's where I've got to aim. But then you have to quickly remember, that's right. She goes back to her spot and then I can shoot her. Like I like at least differentiate the color or something like that or make it so that you can do something to her in that state. Like yeah, CC immune would be great maybe. like, you know, yeah. And then you can hit her. Widow I think will.
Coach Mills (02:18:54.571)
And you can hit her. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:19:01.093)
I'm pretty convinced Widow will get some sort of damage nerf, just a little bit. Unless they're planning on power creeping everybody else again, which I feel like would be a little overboard. And I don't think that, like, the power creep would work, so I'm hoping that they do, like, nerf... Not just because I hate the rework from a original Widow POV. I just hope they nerf her damage a tiny bit, so that it brings her more back into line and she's not always, like, a pick or ban.
Yeah.
Persixo (02:19:32.379)
Nice. I mean I I got I got a plethora of things. I got a plethora. I I I I'll run through it real quick. I'll run through it real quick. For people who can swing, you either pick manual swing or easy swing. You can't have a button. Yo, no, no, no. I'm spitting crazy. You have to be another thing. No, no. I'ma c I'ma go quick. Bro, I'm s
Coach Mills (02:19:35.212)
Okay, well what is it? What is it? Tell let's hear it, let's hear it.
zazzastack (02:19:35.821)
Go for it. Go for it.
Coach Mills (02:19:44.49)
No, I I can we kick him? Ca can I kick can I can I no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no you no way wait wait wait I'm not letting you no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no We're pausing right there What the fuck you talking about What do you mean?
zazzastack (02:19:45.209)
Mmm.
zazzastack (02:19:49.017)
That's interesting. That's- I've never thought of that.
CaptainCoach (02:19:54.833)
Hehehe.
Persixo (02:19:58.031)
You can't have the best you can't have your cake and eat it too. Like, like, like that that's impossible. I think. I don't care about no skill expression. I want you either pick, you either pick manual or you pick or you pick easy. That's what I want to see.
Coach Mills (02:20:02.827)
It's it it increases the skill expression of the character. What
Coach Mills (02:20:11.198)
you get to pick the bubble yourself or bubble an opponent pre match and then you can never move it ever. Fuck you. Bro, bro, bro. You gotta understand that the versatility that that gives to Venom is amazing. Like I can give myself C C immunity anytime I want. Like like and it's for annoying shit. Like if if if a Jeff tries to eat me, I can easy swing it to slam the ground. If it like if I don't have to turn around to grapple away. Like those the the
CaptainCoach (02:20:12.482)
Ha ha.
Persixo (02:20:15.013)
Can Don't don't get me mad.
Persixo (02:20:24.655)
I've heard enough.
zazzastack (02:20:39.254)
I was...
Coach Mills (02:20:40.748)
That though the utility of that is amazing. And all you're doing is you're making things awkward for people. That's all you're doing, is like well y you literally just went on an entire rant about Wanda making your fucking character awkward and now you're like, fuck you, I wanna make your character awkward. Okay, alright, okay.
Persixo (02:20:46.405)
Good, good, be awkward. F Venom and and Spider Man.
zazzastack (02:20:47.489)
Yeah, I was...
Persixo (02:20:55.266)
Yo.
zazzastack (02:20:56.858)
Persixo (02:20:57.379)
I yeah, I got some more too. I think, I think, like for example, for example, like when Venom or Spider-Man use a swing but doesn't hit anything, I think it should still consume your swing because you still activated it. I think that's fair. Listen, hear me out. Because I'ma cook, I'm a cook so hard right now. Because Daredevil, for example, right? Not sure if you know this, but Daredevil can spam his his like hook. He can spam it until he hits something. I'm not sure if you guys know it, because he could spam it. So I'm like, what the f that make this makes no sense. I think if you press the ability and you didn't get value out of it, that's your fault.
zazzastack (02:21:00.151)
guys.
Coach Mills (02:21:06.183)
my god. That's not
zazzastack (02:21:21.569)
It's kind of annoying.
Persixo (02:21:27.363)
Bucky, he misses his hook. he he he he can keep doing it until until he hooks somebody. You're you're gonna be like that.
Coach Mills (02:21:29.196)
You y you know you're like you're you know you're gonna br you're gonna break the character for any low rank player that plays these characters because they're gonna fucking miss. No you are though Like like no one can pick Okay, go sorry, go
zazzastack (02:21:32.259)
feel like that's a bad point, but like the...
Persixo (02:21:37.167)
We're not worried about them. We're not worried about them. I'm playing, I'm playing. I'm playing. I'm playing. I'm playing. It's a joke. It's a joke. Please don't don't hate me. I'm joking. Okay.
zazzastack (02:21:42.105)
I just want to say that I was I was just you're right I was describing the widow rework to people as if like imagine if spider-man lost his ability to swing anywhere or like Pull anything like that That's how I described the widow rework from an OG like as an OG widow to the widow rework if people wanted to know how we felt Imagine the spider-man was just the amazing man and not the amazing spider-man. Yeah
Persixo (02:22:08.015)
The amazing man. Not even amazing, he's the the man.
zazzastack (02:22:09.881)
And like, Venom couldn't swing and it took all of that. People play Spider-Man and Venom because they have that capability to... Not just because it's their favorite Marvel character. They also do the playstyle of swinging around the map and having that mobility. that's that character's playstyle. With Widow, we like the sniping niche and what we could do with that. Yeah, yeah.
Coach Mills (02:22:35.342)
The h the hero fantasy, right? Yeah, the hero fantasy.
zazzastack (02:22:39.821)
People play the character because they like that niche. So when I got reworked, I'm like, imagine if Spider-Man just had all of his web swings taken away from him, and you were just running around doing whatever.
Coach Mills (02:22:51.63)
Yeah.
Persixo (02:22:52.655)
Good. They they they need to remove that. They need to remove that.
Coach Mills (02:22:54.792)
okay okay, all right, all right. First keep spitting keep spitting some some nonsense.
zazzastack (02:22:56.717)
That's how I see the wood ever rework from OG to new. Keep going, keep going.
Persixo (02:22:57.211)
Alright, I got you. I'm not even done. I'm not even done. I'm not even done here. So this one's about Magneto. And you guys can call me crazy. because he's S tier. He's not S tier. I'm not going for that. He's not S tier. But I think Magneto does need something. What Overwatch did correctly for Sigma, because I love Sigma. I'm a Sigma advocate. I love that character. I love Sigma. I love that character. I love his personality. Release me, all that, right? The one thing they did when they added perks was they gave him that, that where you can like float-like, like kind of like hover a little bit. I think Mag should have.
zazzastack (02:23:06.979)
Didn't Kosh bring up the website?
Coach Mills (02:23:08.076)
He's definitely S tier, but keep g continue.
Of course you love s all right keep going, sorry.
zazzastack (02:23:19.361)
I like this trailer. Really cool.
Persixo (02:23:27.245)
something where he could like like if I hold space he can like and that's it just just that nothing crazy no no no no no I don't mean I don't mean I don't mean I don't mean like like no no no I mean like let's say this the floor and then like on that on that freaking yeah like like you know on the on the
zazzastack (02:23:33.003)
I don't want Magneto flying to my high ground, okay?
zazzastack (02:23:42.314)
Just a little hudda.
Persixo (02:23:46.319)
Panther map how like on like that high ground to like is it by Panther? I what has it's like glassed off at first, you could break the glass obviously. Yeah, the make it to Red Back is just flow up there. I think that's I at least me. I don't know. Let me know if am I waddling? Yeah, I give them that. Give him a give him his and I think I think no one would complain. I think no one would complain. I genuinely think no but
Coach Mills (02:23:52.29)
Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and you float, yeah.
zazzastack (02:23:57.338)
That's the height of Widow's new jump, by the way.
So you'd be on the high ground with me.
Coach Mills (02:24:07.126)
Yeah, I mean I stu stuff like that is pretty they they're not gonna change his win rate meaningfully, but they if they might feel cool.
CaptainCoach (02:24:07.761)
I'm in.
CaptainCoach (02:24:14.587)
They did that with Adam. Adam was a hero that was supposed to be immobile, but could take the hits as a healer. And then they just gave him flight. I why can't they do it with Mag?
Persixo (02:24:14.725)
That's what I'm saying.
Persixo (02:24:22.767)
That's what I'm saying. And plus now if Spidey pulls me off the map, I could like oooh to try to like maybe, maybe make my way back. You know what I mean? Like instead of me having to pop my ult first all by y'all reminded me about my ult. I don't even want to talk about that. But instead of me popping my ult, which takes me, which takes me freaking ages to build, I could just
Coach Mills (02:24:29.184)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:24:38.711)
Yeah, they should nerf it.
Persixo (02:24:44.769)
Flow up right back up, maybe you know, and that's another thing. They need to buff Max ult, they to make it so where he's he's in tune with everybody else. Because what how I'm confused. Why are they buffing Star Lord Ul Punisher all and then support ults, and then everyone's getting it freaking within 30 seconds, and then I'm getting it in a minute 30. By the time I have mine, you have you have your second one. I think that's terrible. I think they they overcompensated for Magneto, and I I think it was like in season 1.5 or season, I don't even I don't remember what season they did it. In essence, I think it's unfair because even with the sword it's.
Coach Mills (02:25:10.388)
You want him to get his ult faster, is what you're saying?
Persixo (02:25:14.683)
It's still unfair that But it's just like if you think about it, Mag's all like at this point in the game, it isn't even that good. Like, like the reason why it's not no
zazzastack (02:25:16.429)
I don't want to get solo mag altered more often.
Coach Mills (02:25:23.564)
No that's that's so cap. What are you talking It's like the best tanko.
Persixo (02:25:25.157)
Wait, wait, wait, hold on. Let me cook, let me cook, let me cook, let me cook, let cook, look. It's not that good in higher No, in higher Elo. It's not that good. Because in higher ELO, in higher Elo, it's more used to like give your team breathing. Like, like, okay, breathe. Like everyone breathe. Right? Wait, wait, wait. No, no, no. It's great. It's great. But remember season zero, season one? Yo, you're dunking on everything. You just dunk dunk, dunk, dunk. Then out of nowhere, out of nowhere, cloaks are fading. Freaking mags are bubbling. Strangers jumping up and shielding. No, no, we can't have that no more.
CaptainCoach (02:25:25.969)
Mm-mm.
Coach Mills (02:25:36.97)
You think you think that's bad? You breathing is great.
zazzastack (02:25:40.473)
I feel like that was value.
Coach Mills (02:25:47.0)
Bro
People people people are actually counterplaying? You just want people to just k what are we talking about?
Persixo (02:25:56.025)
That's terrible. That's terrible. No because
CaptainCoach (02:25:58.501)
Ha ha ha ha ha.
zazzastack (02:25:59.021)
think that's more of a result of people learning how to play the game battle.
Persixo (02:26:01.753)
That's exactly so make it to where Matt gets his all equal now because before the reason they nerfed is people felt oppressed. They're like, I can't do anything, I can't do anything. So so so then they nerfed him. They nerfed him. So then bring it back. Let's get lit.
Coach Mills (02:26:10.554)
my god. You you do you do you you do know that like any buffs to Magneto from this point will probably put him into a tier where he will get banned like consistently, right?
Persixo (02:26:19.577)
I don't think so. I don't think so. Because remember when 'cause people thought Mag was S tier and then they buffed him, gave him the Gambit Sword team up and they gave him the double bubble and his ban rate didn't even go up. So I'm just saying that Magneto when the game Wait I was about to up the the the quote, but when Mag is meta, the game is meta. I'm just trying to say it. Like like Mag needs to be meta, bro, 'cause people at least me, right? As a Mag player, I like We don't we
Coach Mills (02:26:36.041)
my god.
He but he is mad at right now! We don't need to buff him!
CaptainCoach (02:26:42.321)
I feel like I need to snag Persicso's helmet so I can be immune to his mind control here. Like, he's trying to get into my head. He's trying to get into my head.
zazzastack (02:26:48.202)
Hahaha
Coach Mills (02:26:48.562)
Yeah, he's on some nonsense, bro. Yeah, yeah. If anyone needs buffs in the tanking category, it's strange. Strange is compared to Magneto, he's he's he's having a hard time this patch. Mainly because his team-ups are ass. I'm not gonna lie.
Persixo (02:26:51.109)
No, no, I will die for Magneto, bro. I'll die for that character, bro.
zazzastack (02:26:56.217)
So.
Persixo (02:26:57.473)
but he's bully fuel.
Persixo (02:27:03.724)
No bro, they nerfed him.
zazzastack (02:27:04.153)
My whole community thinks I'm secretly a strange main just because I play Portal fights really well somehow. I don't know how I do it, but I just Portal fight and I know where to put my Portal, I know what to shield, I know how to play Strange in a Portal fight. And everyone's like, Zaza, we know you secretly practice Strange on an alt account on stream, we know you do that. I'm like, I don't! I haven't touched this character except for Portal fights.
Coach Mills (02:27:10.656)
Let's go. Everyone should.
Persixo (02:27:28.101)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (02:27:29.176)
Sometimes it's sometimes you get enough practice, like you know, over time you learn the character. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:27:32.875)
It's just Portal fights, that's it. That's all I've played on him.
Persixo (02:27:34.627)
Now speaking of portal fights though, why are people like in the big 2026 still putting it in the air and like looking down? Like that's terrible. Like dude
Coach Mills (02:27:41.409)
It's terrible.
zazzastack (02:27:41.529)
The only time I ever asked people to do that was when I had old with our alt because then I could plasma burst on top of the whole team. Yeah, but that's like the only time I'd ask for that.
Persixo (02:27:47.083)
Plasma them, yeah. But that's as bad 'cause you drop down like to into into into nakedness. Like you're just you're literally dropping to your death, so
Coach Mills (02:27:48.11)
Yeah.
Yeah. J to to explain it to people that are listening in, the the to give you some general tips about how to portal well, you need to think about what is being covered, what line of sight is being covered, because your portal is literally a shield that you can use to block enemy fire. You need to think about where your your teammates are hopping out of. You don't want them to hop out straight into fire. You want them to be able to use the portal as cover. And you also need to think about where they're gonna go after they're out of the portal.
So you need to think about is there a place like if you can face it away from the enemy team into like a cubby so your supports can hop out, go to the cubby, and then play from the cubby, play from a piece of cover, that's really what you want. Like all three things is possible. Now, sometimes you have, you know, a millisecond. You just need to fucking get on the point. You know, you can't perfectly do it, but it it you know, if if people keep doing these dumb portals that just like get you killed instantly, like there's a lot of them that are out there and
zazzastack (02:28:17.198)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:28:25.358)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:28:34.616)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:28:42.592)
Everyone should know how to play strange. I I'm gonna say this. Every single player, I don't care who you main, if you don't know how to play strange, you're throwing. Because ever you don't know when you need a portal. If you're the first one dead, and that's the only way to touch the point, you got a portal. Everyone has to know how to do it.
zazzastack (02:28:55.769)
At least learn how to put a portal down so that you can do it in an overtime fight. Even if you play Strange badly, at least learn how to put that portal down.
Coach Mills (02:29:04.962)
I mean, ideally you play cause what happens a lot is people will swap, they'll have fifty percent ultimate, then you you end up holding for a bit. You still wanna be able to maybe clutch, right? Like you're trying to win the fight, right? you wanna know how to hit your ultimate. Right. So like if you know how to play strange, if you know how to hit your ultimates, like you're gonna win more games just because of that. And so many people just are they just refuse to learn it. And I'm I'm I'm I'm gonna crash out if a DPS walks at a spawn and doesn't fucking portal. I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna lose I'm gonna lose my shit.
Persixo (02:29:16.505)
And strange builds it fast too, is all he builds it fast, so
Persixo (02:29:32.665)
It's terrible. It's actually terrible. Like I have my ult. We're gonna lose the game. Wha what are you saving your ult for? It's it's bad, no, it's bad, it's bad.
Coach Mills (02:29:33.631)
I don't like this shit.
zazzastack (02:29:37.689)
Mm.
Coach Mills (02:29:38.026)
Yeah, yeah. Especially when it's a dumb fucking old. Like I swear like something
CaptainCoach (02:29:43.619)
One of the, yeah, I was gonna say one of the biggest buffs you could give to Dr. Strange is actually nerf his portal to where if you swap to him, it's a 30 second cooldown. That would actually be a buff to the hero even though it's a direct nerf to him, because no one else would be able to use it. It would only be for if you start Strange and are on him for the entire game. Yeah, so you'd have access to portal if you pick him. That would actually make him.
zazzastack (02:29:44.033)
I've definitely, sorry, you go, you go, have fun.
zazzastack (02:30:05.635)
so it's not universal.
CaptainCoach (02:30:11.471)
so much easier to balance, I don't know.
Coach Mills (02:30:12.844)
It would make it would make portal worse though, 'cause you have to you you know the the utility of portal you worse. Well no, I'm just saying that you you would have to be dead. Like you would always have to be the first dead in a fight, is what I'm saying. You know what I'm saying? Like right now the portal portal can be anybody.
CaptainCoach (02:30:18.777)
lower the cooldown to compensate. It would be such a massive buff.
CaptainCoach (02:30:28.537)
Yeah, but other teams wouldn't have access to it, so his win rate would just skyrocket. Yeah. Even if it's...
Coach Mills (02:30:31.906)
That is true. That is true. I mean how how I guess you'd have to play to die. 'Cause I'm trying to think of like how relevant would that all often come up. I if you play to die, it could be really relevant.
Persixo (02:30:41.411)
Yeah, 'cause playing strange, I'm gonna be honest, sometimes it's sometimes you're actually nerfing your team playing strange.
CaptainCoach (02:30:42.993)
Nah. You don't have to die. You just gotta be good at strange. You can portal anywhere you want to anywhere you want. Think about it. Like I play with this. I was... Yeah, you can put the portal anywhere on the map. Anywhere. It doesn't have to be right in front of you. I know a lot of people, you can unlock it and put the... You can go off to the side, oh we're about to lose. Or someone just died.
Coach Mills (02:30:51.693)
you're saying like portaling your team back to point just the way you're alive? Right.
Right, right, right, right, right. 'Cause right right now it's kinda like a it's like a universal cooldown that anyone on your team can use, but then you're saying you just bind it to just stranger then yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:31:06.179)
It would actually make him such a cooler hero if they actually just...
zazzastack (02:31:11.543)
and then when one person absolutely stuffs it up you can potentially have a chance to get the portal off again.
CaptainCoach (02:31:19.217)
What do you mean?
zazzastack (02:31:20.537)
Like when someone, you know how some people just kind of do it and then they cancel it on accident, like, you know, something like that, you know. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:31:25.625)
yeah.
Persixo (02:31:25.957)
Terrible.
Coach Mills (02:31:27.694)
Hmm, yeah. I I is I'm still I'm still on the fence about cause we've talked about this before. I'm on the fence about strange portal being healthy or unhealthy for the game. Cause like on one hand it can be really annoying and toxic, people just coming back, ulting through portal, delaying fights a million times. But I also do like the aspect about it where it's like you can come back. Every fight is winnable, right? And like comeback mechanics in games are often really good. When when a game can still be won, even when you're behind for most of it, I mean those wins feel really good.
CaptainCoach (02:31:29.018)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (02:31:37.689)
Mmm.
Persixo (02:31:46.873)
The comeback mechanic, yeah.
zazzastack (02:31:49.337)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:31:56.834)
They do feel really good. So
Persixo (02:31:57.059)
That's my yeah.
zazzastack (02:31:57.401)
Mmm.
CaptainCoach (02:31:58.814)
To me, just having a whatever, like two and a half minute cool down on the people will just swap to a hero for is to me is just, it's just bad design. Like I get the idea that it's, yeah, I think it's cool, but there's other ways that you could go about intro. Cause it's like, okay, that means venom gets less value because venoms will swing to point to get back quicker. That means Spider-Man gets less value. So a lot of heroes.
Coach Mills (02:32:08.63)
You think so?
Coach Mills (02:32:20.822)
Yeah, but also also characters that can cancel the portal give more value. Like Strange and Hulk and Rogue and Luna Freeze or
zazzastack (02:32:21.369)
Hmm.
zazzastack (02:32:27.189)
Yeah. I think... I... Well, I think there's enough counterplay in the game right now to try and cancel that portal if you're, like, aware enough of it starting. I think there's enough people in the game who can actually go and, like, stop it or do something about it, you know? But you just have to, like, be aware of, like, when they switch to Strange, you know? You just have to keep checking your tab in that final fight. You know?
CaptainCoach (02:32:27.867)
Well that wouldn't go away though. That wouldn't go away.
Coach Mills (02:32:51.66)
I I think I'm I'm mostly pissed that like you should you should be at a huge disadvantage when you portal back to point because the it the opponents should have every bit of the space. They can position anywhere they want with any bit of cover. They have all the space in the world. But like ninety nine percent of the time, what are people doing? They're AFKing on point, they just die instantly when the portal pops out. And it's like Yeah. And it's like
zazzastack (02:33:11.641)
and they don't try and hold that space.
CaptainCoach (02:33:13.477)
Just the healing from the spawn door is, that's such an unfair advantage.
Coach Mills (02:33:17.208)
Well you you you could you could you could do you could fix that. We could start there. How about we make the portal open for half the time? You gotta get out. You gotta get the fuck out right away. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like it it doesn't it doesn't doesn't stay open. So like people have to jump the fuck out of it. It's open you jump the fuck out of it, right? Like
Persixo (02:33:25.125)
Like ten seconds out of twenty, ten instead of twenty.
CaptainCoach (02:33:27.749)
That'd be better.
zazzastack (02:33:33.702)
I think it should be open as long as it takes for someone to revive plus one second on top of that. I think that's it.
CaptainCoach (02:33:40.016)
Hehehehe.
Coach Mills (02:33:40.428)
And then then yeah.
Persixo (02:33:40.641)
Or the i maybe you can't jump back through it. Once you jump through, like you can't jump back through 'cause like some people it's in in some fights, like yo like for me as mag, I'll I'll jump out, I'll get burned, I'll put up my shield, jump back in, g get get the get the spawn health, and then c come right back and then just rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat.
Coach Mills (02:33:44.842)
Ooh, that's another interesting idea.
zazzastack (02:33:46.282)
Mmm, and you're like locked, locked into the fire.
CaptainCoach (02:33:48.017)
I
Coach Mills (02:33:55.202)
I mean, what shouldn't happen is when I pop it on strange, I jump out and die, and then I get to respawn and then jump out again. Like, that should never happen. Like, that's some nonsense.
CaptainCoach (02:33:55.761)
I
Persixo (02:34:01.593)
Yeah. It's because you know why that happens and like sometimes it doesn't, 'cause the overtime mechanic. When when it's an overtime, I think your your cooldown, I think the respawn is like almost like 18 seconds when it's when it's overtime. But when it's like normal, just normal play, it's I think twelve. So theoretically you can go out, get burned, and jump out again, which is insane. Which is insane. I mean you're Hulk, of course you do. You just jump right back in, jump right
CaptainCoach (02:34:01.893)
Ha ha. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:34:02.861)
Mm.
Coach Mills (02:34:07.202)
Right.
Coach Mills (02:34:19.704)
Yeah, that's
CaptainCoach (02:34:19.921)
I kind of like the in and out running around. You get some pretty night fights.
Coach Mills (02:34:23.899)
Hey, I mean you're a Hulk, but it's the same thing you're complaining about though.
zazzastack (02:34:27.971)
Well, I will say though, I do like going in and out of the portal still on Widow as well, because I've got that movement on Widow and sometimes it's just what I need to outrun someone in an overtime fight getting in and out of that portal.
CaptainCoach (02:34:28.624)
No, I-
Persixo (02:34:32.005)
I mean, so do I, so do I.
Coach Mills (02:34:37.228)
Well it I guess like ten seconds could give you more t you know, ten seconds. You get ten seconds of it, maybe is
zazzastack (02:34:42.039)
Yeah. Like I- when it comes to an overtime fight and I have to play on the point, I have- I would like to think I have pretty decent movement and positioning for an overtime fight. Like when you kind of caught in that brawl as a character that's not necessarily a brawl character. And I would say like when there's a portal up, I definitely use it to go in and out of it all the time and like I run around like a little maniac and no one can catch me.
Coach Mills (02:35:04.206)
I I'm not gonna lie, I do like the Tom and Jerry ass, like someone goes in on the other side and then you chase them out there, and then y'all are in like your own little mini battle, like I don't fucking know where. Like it's interesting.
Persixo (02:35:05.541)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (02:35:11.573)
Yeah. Yeah.
Persixo (02:35:15.322)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:35:17.871)
Yeah, I've used enemy portals to escape death and get my Hulk form back, just hiding off in front of their base pretty much. There's a lot of really nutty things that can happen from those types of fights. yeah, still think it's such an advantage for defense too, in particular. Just that whole mechanic being able to swap. But yeah, I I got some ideas. You wanna hear mine? For me it's...
Coach Mills (02:35:41.39)
I could see. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What w w what changes?
CaptainCoach (02:35:44.946)
It's just mostly looking at the team-ups and taking a look at the ones that are just optimizations to your output and trying to make those a little bit more interesting so that they're actual... We talked about Zaza with niches, niche heroes kind getting removed. Okay, maybe you homogenize things a little bit so the game's easier to balance. You have the hitscans, the brawl tanks, the shield tanks, whatever. But you give them more diverse playstyle options.
zazzastack (02:36:00.409)
Mm.
CaptainCoach (02:36:14.095)
So I think Hulk is a decent example of that, but really I think the supports have some really game-changing ones. The cloak ice block, that completely changes the way you can play her. So that ability, I want to see that level of uniqueness and utility brought to other characters so they're not just optimizing for max damage, right?
Coach Mills (02:36:35.192)
So like s like not like strange, right? Like change up strange once. Yeah. Get
zazzastack (02:36:35.801)
Can I?
CaptainCoach (02:36:37.455)
The strange ones are awful. They're- they're terrible. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:36:39.341)
Can I just throw out like a hot take? I feel like, I feel like I feel like each character shouldn't have any more than like one get out of jail free card ability. You know, like a s- like, Manta Sleep and like, Lunar Freeze and like Cloak Fade. Things like that. I feel like everyone should, like, if they have one, leave it at one. You know, if they stuff it up, that's their own fault, you know?
Coach Mills (02:37:03.224)
So sp s you and Spiderman players agree on something. But yeah, yeah.
zazzastack (02:37:07.705)
I mean, yeah, look, look, I have seen all the frustration around C &D's multiple, like, get out of jail free card abilities. Like, I either call them get out of jail free card or like, oh shit button. But yeah, no, like, I think that, you know, if you stuff it up, it's on you. Like, with Old Widow, that was her stun.
Now it's her slam, you know? If I stuff up the positioning of my slam or the timing of it, then I'm not gonna have it for when I actually need it. Like if they hard dive me and I've already used it, that's my own fault, you know?
Coach Mills (02:37:43.49)
It it gets a little tricky, in my opinion, because at the end of the day, you can have multiple people coming after one person, right? Like, like, you know, like let's just say get like as a hypothetical, let's just say Luna has one freeze, right? Like, and that that can be if you hit the freeze, you win. Like in Overwatch, Ana. If you hit the freeze, you win the d the duel with Tracer. But all of a sudden, when it's D.Va and Winston and and like a million other people coming after you, it's not necessarily the case. Like, kinda like in this game where it's
CaptainCoach (02:37:43.673)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:38:05.176)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Coach Mills (02:38:13.166)
When it's Venom and Cap and Daredevil all after you, like, there is no right, but is does team effort just mean you just die? Cause like cause Venom's cause cause e even with Cloak and Dagger having all these utilities, she's still winning only like fifty five or forty-five percent of her games, maybe forty-six percent. She's still losing. No, but she's she's she's not she's rarely gonna see pro play. She's losing in Celestial Plus lobbies.
zazzastack (02:38:17.401)
but then that becomes a team effort.
zazzastack (02:38:23.787)
No, because your team should be making the effort to help you survive that too.
CaptainCoach (02:38:32.697)
Yeah, but she's OP. She is.
zazzastack (02:38:34.829)
But she's... yeah, well... well...
Coach Mills (02:38:40.204)
So like regardless of the frustration people have engaging with those cooldowns, she's not winning like Venom's winning. Like I play I abuse Venom a lot. I promise you cloak and daggers don't matter to me at all. Like, yeah, they buy time, but what are they they're not they're not doing thirteen hundred damage to me.
zazzastack (02:38:48.021)
I think.
zazzastack (02:38:52.354)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:38:54.235)
It's a skill issue.
zazzastack (02:38:54.925)
Like, I don't necessarily think it's OP, like I'm not in the mind frame of like, yeah it's OP for her to have like three different abilities that like basically save her from things, but like, I just don't think any character should have that much. Like I think it's more of a skillful thing of knowing when to time it and getting better at timing it and getting better at making people force that out of your kit.
Coach Mills (02:39:18.39)
Mm.
zazzastack (02:39:23.545)
you know by whether it's playing better positioning whether it's you know working on your aim whether it's like you know like just rotating the right way or anything like that you know like there's so many different things that you could be doing on your character to make it hard for them to force out that one ability and I feel like yeah
CaptainCoach (02:39:45.148)
See, I view it differently. I think that there is a measurable amount of, like, every hero has things that they're good at, things that they're bad at. And just having all your stats and whatever for cloak defense isn't necessarily like you only player in that way. Like, it gives you opportunities, like, you know, with a mag bubble, for instance, you use a mag bubble to go in and get kills. I think it's, I've been full DPS-pilled with cloak players. I think most of them don't know how to maximize their.
I think you can play her so much more aggressively. think you can play her in melee range, like with tanks, and they're just not doing it. I truly believe it's a skill issue, and I think most cloak and dagger players are playing the old way still.
zazzastack (02:40:13.481)
Mm. I agree with that, yeah.
Coach Mills (02:40:17.208)
Like turn defense into offense, is what you're saying.
zazzastack (02:40:24.761)
I feel like they just like to... A lot of C &D players play that character so they can relax a little bit more, in my opinion. They still have to be attentive and they still have to time everything correctly, but I feel like you're not always... Not having to think about aim as a massive thing because aim is a big mental effort, especially as a hitscan player or someone who plays like snipers.
CaptainCoach (02:40:34.383)
I... yeah.
zazzastack (02:40:52.521)
big mental effort in my opinion anyway.
Coach Mills (02:40:54.606)
So you think her negative win rate is mostly just because people are just not adapting to her properly, is what you're saying?
CaptainCoach (02:41:00.933)
I think it's partially that. are you asking me?
zazzastack (02:41:02.617)
somewhat. No, that's fine, that's fine. I was just, I was just adding to it, sorry. Yeah, you go, you go.
Coach Mills (02:41:04.396)
No, yeah I'm I'm asking you Captain I'm I'm asking you Captain Coach. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, no worries, don't worry. Sorry, I I should have said
CaptainCoach (02:41:09.893)
Well, I think it's a little bit of cloak players not adapting to playing aggressively enough, I think, is part of it. also, yeah, at the end of the day, you need two supports on your team. So if there's better ones in the game, there's just never going to be an equal.
Coach Mills (02:41:16.206)
Because
Coach Mills (02:41:20.654)
'Cause like when we
Coach Mills (02:41:26.894)
'Cause we we both we both played in the per six of the tournament and and we had our fair share of losses to Dylan Dubbs's team. And to be honest with you, I I I would much rather Dylan Dubbs be on fucking cloak and dagger than than rolling our ass on Mantis, which is what he was. He was rolling the fuck out of every team on Mantis. Because like if you're a good player that can do all the things that you're talking about, I think there's far more broken things you could be doing in the support roster than sustaining.
zazzastack (02:41:37.751)
I saw those school boys screenshots.
CaptainCoach (02:41:42.118)
They were.
Persixo (02:41:42.551)
Amantis.
Coach Mills (02:41:55.66)
Like I I I I I I just I feel like Cloak and Dagger is more frustrating than she is good. And maybe that that does demands balance because I think frustration can be balanced and it has been balanced, you know. we talk about it with Spider-Man pulling off us off the map or getting one shot, but I just don't really think that she's particularly good and in the hands of good players they have better things they could they would want to do. But that's just that's just my opinion. I don't know. I I a lot of people have different opinions on that topic.
CaptainCoach (02:42:20.965)
Mills, if we ever do our duo support climb to eternity, which I'm still down for, will, Cloak and Dagger is gonna be what I play, I think. And I'm going to play like a very aggressive, like upfront melee style. I'm gonna be brawling and I'm gonna be doing my suck. I've only played her one game. I've only played her once.
Coach Mills (02:42:24.866)
We should, we should. I wanna do it. I wanna
Coach Mills (02:42:34.134)
Yeah, we can. I don't know. Wait, should we it would be funny But wait, how how would how w I'll just by the way, if we do do this, I wonder if it should be a vote. Like or you just wanna just let j us pick, or should it be like a vote?
CaptainCoach (02:42:48.081)
I mean, I've done it on Mantis. I've done a support climb on Mantis. I did it to Celestial. And this was back in like season two. And yeah, I had like over 70 % win rate.
zazzastack (02:42:51.769)
Mm.
Coach Mills (02:42:55.222)
I I just don't wanna I know that people are gonna get pissed off at me if I say we're gonna do a support climb and I just play like Mantis and kill people, which is what I would do if I was trying to climb a support, but like they're gonna get mad at me, so like
CaptainCoach (02:43:03.001)
Yeah, I got the same kind of flack. So yeah, I'll do cloak. She's a supporty type support, defensive in nature. Doesn't require a ton of aim, about timing of abilities. Yeah, I'm down. It'll be fun.
Coach Mills (02:43:09.613)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:43:13.282)
We'll just we'll just be Cloak and Viz back lines or some shit like that or so the cloak low key backlines. Alright, let's we should run it up. we we we have this thing where we any time a community like the community flames us for anything, we wanna prove wrong. So that's why I did the hit scan or the the poke slop to eternity, 'cause I was like
zazzastack (02:43:27.609)
Mmm.
zazzastack (02:43:32.289)
I feel that too, but I know I couldn't really like stick to it unless it was like a dedicated challenge that I'm like doing on a fresh account, you know, like I'd have to, I'd have to like make myself.
CaptainCoach (02:43:38.737)
Mm.
Coach Mills (02:43:41.167)
I was about to say magic to Celestia or something like that. I was sorry. That would be That would be crazy I would watch. I would watch. I would I would a thousand percent watch. It would be so fun. You sh that would be so f I think it'd be fun.
CaptainCoach (02:43:47.313)
That would be good
zazzastack (02:43:48.677)
Some people have asked me to do that, some people are some people are like, Zazza, so when are you learning magic? Like, when are you taking magic to eternity? And I'm like, don't know if I will. I have thought about a DPS Luna or a Doctor Strange arc because my chat thinks I'm secretly a Doctor Strange main so I feel like that would be a fun one to do. Or a DPS Luna, a lot of people want to see my aim translate to support.
CaptainCoach (02:43:54.863)
I would too.
Coach Mills (02:44:08.43)
Yeah.
zazzastack (02:44:16.383)
And I think Luna's like the best one for that, so a lot of people have asked for that too. Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:44:18.274)
Yeah, you would fry you would fry you would actually fry. Like like yeah. My yeah, yeah, Luna. Luna is I I don't know. Luna's the character I think people should be complaining about. And not not cloak and dagger. But that the I I I just just supports that fucking kill you is what I have a problem with. Not supports that survive me, but anyways. Per six though, I have a question for you. If you were not a Magmane, who what would you be?
zazzastack (02:44:30.586)
Mm. She's good, hey. She's good right now.
Persixo (02:44:43.887)
What's up?
CaptainCoach (02:44:47.739)
Bro's always running thing, You love him?
Persixo (02:44:49.613)
I love thing, I'm I love that character.
Coach Mills (02:44:49.748)
No, but like but like legitimately if you could if you had to do it all over again back in season zero and you had to be a different main, you couldn't be a mag main, what would it be?
Persixo (02:44:58.819)
Okay, so I played the Alpha, as I I I keep saying. but in the Alpha I was actually I played Squirrel Girl. I don't know why. I like I like Squirrel Girl. Right? 'Cause well no no no no I wouldn't be a squirrel girl player though. I wouldn't be a squirrel girl player because I 'cause I ended up switching to Mag, you know what mean? So So I didn't like Squir I I liked playing her 'cause it like satisfying hitting like the like like like like the double acorn and plus back then she had like the Spider Man team up where like it'll stun everybody. Like it was like it it's the better version of what she has now. But
Coach Mills (02:45:06.766)
Let's go.
zazzastack (02:45:07.853)
So you would be the new throw pick.
zazzastack (02:45:17.76)
narrowly avoided it.
Coach Mills (02:45:22.442)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was yeah. Yeah.
Persixo (02:45:26.061)
I think genuinely like season zero, I would probably be on the more main. I would probably main the more on some like genuinely like I I love the well
CaptainCoach (02:45:33.35)
Wow.
zazzastack (02:45:34.563)
Eww.
CaptainCoach (02:45:35.921)
That's so random.
Coach Mills (02:45:36.344)
Dude, bro, you love playing the the the the no having fun, like the bodyguards of the game. Like you like to just say like fuck you, Spider Man, fuck like and like no one it's
Persixo (02:45:41.189)
That's fun to me. Like, bro, I remember
CaptainCoach (02:45:41.947)
Ha ha ha ha
Persixo (02:45:46.787)
I hate Spider-Man. Like yo, like I I f a lot of people don't know. I I I'm actually a Lord no more. Dudes don't know this. I actually I I I I yeah.
Coach Mills (02:45:53.276)
What the f you should have whipped it out in the tournament, bro!
Persixo (02:45:56.325)
But the issue is it was because in the beginning of the season, because remember, I was like half I was half Magneto, half half no more. So when I when I played DPS, I played no more. So I had 19 hours on Namor for like seven seasons straight. So I never got the Lord yet. I never got it. Then one day I checked my I checked my thing. I like, wait, I have Lord No Moore. So I had so I didn't play no more for like since like like eight seasons straight. I didn't play no more. So then I was like, I'm a Lord of Noore. But I I just like his place, at least back then. Like when he had the Ice Squid, the Gamma Squid whatever. But the Ice Squid, that squid.
Coach Mills (02:45:58.879)
no.
Coach Mills (02:46:08.289)
shit.
Persixo (02:46:26.449)
Was a ma yo, you I agree. He should be able to look listen, listen, he's have an enhanced version, he's have a squid, he does this where he throws out four squids, like like four squids, and one heals, one's the undead one, one's the ice, and one's the gamble. And make it to where his his bubble heals him. Make it to where his bubble heals him.
Coach Mills (02:46:26.622)
I'm telling you, we need more squids like all kinds. Flaming squid, fucking Healing Squid, CC squid.
zazzastack (02:46:27.289)
Hmm.
zazzastack (02:46:31.833)
Look
Coach Mills (02:46:46.668)
Let's go.
zazzastack (02:46:49.027)
I would hate to be on Squid Duty as a Widow Man. I'd hate to be on Squid Duty.
Persixo (02:46:51.515)
That'd be so fire, right?
CaptainCoach (02:46:51.855)
Let's just have one squid that just is holding a sword and just swings at you.
Persixo (02:46:56.343)
Literally no like he he he he has two on his back, he has two like two two like like terrace on his back. I love no more man. I don't know why I add gravitate to those characters. I love
zazzastack (02:46:57.081)
Little like, buccaneer squid. With a cutlass.
CaptainCoach (02:47:02.5)
Yeah, a little pirate.
Coach Mills (02:47:04.879)
so what that's I mean, hey th there's something for everyone at Hero Show. That's why I love the the the genre. Yeah. so so what the question we like to end off people on is if you could have a hero, you know, a Marvel hero and you could imagine their kit as well, what would you want in like what character would you want in Marvel Rivals and what would the kit be?
zazzastack (02:47:11.191)
Maybe it's reflective of the personality. I'm joking. I'm joking.
Persixo (02:47:11.641)
Yep. Maybe. I I'm I'm a plain dude. Not a plain dude.
CaptainCoach (02:47:13.439)
Hmm, very much.
Coach Mills (02:47:32.494)
If you have any that you can think of.
Persixo (02:47:35.097)
You go first.
zazzastack (02:47:36.898)
I'm not gonna lie, literally like my two favorite Marvel characters are in the game and you know, I'm pretty happy with them. I mean, I uh, it's Black Widow and Hela. They're both, they've both always been my favorite. I don't really, I don't read the comics. I haven't read the comics, so I don't-
Coach Mills (02:47:42.67)
okay.
zazzastack (02:47:56.938)
have a big knowledge of anything outside of Marvel rivals and I've only watched a couple of Marvel movies and I've been watching more since I started playing the game because my boyfriend's like hey you gotta watch them if you gotta play the game you know you gotta know about it you know yeah yeah so I yeah I've been slowly like making my knowledge of Marvel characters bigger but yeah no Black Widow and Hello, Our Voice has been like so
Coach Mills (02:48:08.684)
Yeah, you gotta you gotta watch. You do, you gotta watch, yeah.
zazzastack (02:48:21.709)
badass to me and I'm like, yeah, they're so cool, you know, like I want to play them, I wish I could like, like they look so cool, you know, and Hela in like, for example, Thor Ragnarok, I really enjoyed that movie, I thought that was super cool. I loved Hela's performance in that, she was really, yeah, she was like so good in that movie and I like, I was like, imagine if, like, I used to say this to my sister, imagine if there was a game where we could like play her like that and now...
CaptainCoach (02:48:36.049)
She is... ...Dope. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:48:50.421)
I can actually like play her as she was presented in the movie and you know, like I feel like her whole kit is very well resemblant of like how she appeared in that movie as well. Even though, and like Black Widow, even though she was a sniper, like I still really liked her character before Rivals. I still liked watching her. She was my favorite Avenger always. And like... Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, she was always just like...
CaptainCoach (02:49:13.585)
She's one of the only ones that can calm down the Hulk.
Coach Mills (02:49:16.364)
Ha ha ha.
zazzastack (02:49:19.993)
I guess I just kind of like that they're badass but they're also kind of mysterious in a way and then they're just like, are good at everything in their own way, you know?
Coach Mills (02:49:31.2)
I I I it's it's it's a little weird 'cause like so I've been wa re watching I I told Chad I was re watching or I I said on the last spot I was I'm watching X Men with my daughter and my wife and my daughter. so we watched X Men one and I was watching it back and I'm like fucking gene Like I saw that and I was like it was it was like a surreal moment for a second. I like, I play as these characters and some of these I fucking hate. Like my perception of the characters are different now than they were when I watched the sh and I'm like and I'm like cheering on Wolverine and I'm like I was like
Persixo (02:49:54.82)
Mm-hmm.
zazzastack (02:49:55.469)
Mmm.
Coach Mills (02:50:00.174)
Hugh Jacken, of course, is tall as hell, t tall, dark, and handsome in the in the in the movie, but in the game he's just like this fucking rodent. and and and I think and it reflects his playstyle. But it's just it's it's just interesting to me. It's like but that that's cool that you have already have your two gay characters, but but maybe maybe there'll be more sniper type characters. Like there's a lot of sniper characters
zazzastack (02:50:07.971)
Berserker rage!
zazzastack (02:50:16.512)
Yeah, yeah.
Persixo (02:50:19.716)
Like bullseye.
zazzastack (02:50:20.159)
I don't, yeah, a lot of people say bullseye but I see I don't like I said I don't have that knowledge of like extra people who would be snipers I can't really think of anyone other than maybe Black Widow's sister, you know? Huh? I want, I want, I really just want something to fill that hitscan sniper niche like if they're not going to like fix Widow up, you know?
Coach Mills (02:50:29.314)
He will probably have aimbot. He will probably have aimbot. He'll probably have tracking bullets. Bullseye? Yeah, you probably.
Persixo (02:50:33.242)
Yeah. But
Coach Mills (02:50:44.674)
So some not everyone's gonna understand this, but some people in chat Bullseye and his primary is like the needler from Halo, where it has like soft tracking. Yeah, the purple gun. Yeah, and then and then enough add in the explosion. That would be so fucking cool. no, I'm sorry.
Persixo (02:50:52.398)
Wait, you're talking about like like like that purple that little small purple gun? Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:50:52.433)
Mmm.
Persixo (02:50:59.184)
That's like Sky from Paladins, if anybody knows all my paladins people. My bad. My bad.
Coach Mills (02:51:03.694)
Dead game. Nomsk. I'm sorry. what what what what what character what about you per sexo?
zazzastack (02:51:03.865)
That game, bro, that game.
Persixo (02:51:09.656)
I got you, but real quick, you mentioned how you were watching the X-Men movies like how you look you looking Wolverine. So I grew up loving X-Men. I I I could cares about MCU. I like I'm gonna be honest, I don't watch any MCU movies. That's not me. I don't I don't care. But but comics and and none. I don't I I think I watched the original Avengers. I think like with my family, but like I'm good. But yo, I was an X-Men guy. Like I love X-Men. Like every X-Men movie I watched. I don't know. I I I I I I heard about it. My chat's telling me now.
Coach Mills (02:51:12.65)
Yes, sir.
Coach Mills (02:51:20.044)
You don't none
zazzastack (02:51:25.625)
I'm like the opposite to that, like...
Coach Mills (02:51:25.864)
You gotta watch What? They're so there's some good ones. I mean I like X Men too. You know the you know the new Doomsday? I don't know if you saw the Doomsday trailer. It it has it has the old X Men characters in it. Like you have to you gotta watch that. You gotta watch it. What do you mean?
Persixo (02:51:38.936)
I mean, I might watch it because of that, but like I'm I'm cool. I'm cool off the MCU, but I don't know, maybe, but maybe maybe one day. Maybe one day. Maybe one day, maybe one day. But to your point, it was funny because I grew up loving the X-Men. Like for me, I loved Magneto. I loved Wolverine. Wolverine at some point in time was one of my favorite superheroes ever. I come to Marvel Rivals, I hate Wolverine. I can't even stand the thought of Wolverine. Like it actually altered my brain chemistry. I can't I used to I'm telling you, I used to be a little kid. I used to Wolverine little costume. Like I used to love Wolverine.
Coach Mills (02:51:44.012)
You lit it that's lit y that's what you do, bro Okay, okay, good.
CaptainCoach (02:52:02.129)
You
Coach Mills (02:52:02.171)
Ha ha
Persixo (02:52:08.88)
I would not I'm getting overexcited. Anyway. two characters. Two characters that I would love in Marvel Rivals is Nightcrawler. That's my hiking GOAT. I think he should have been added to the game as one of the OG people. I know he's gonna be Dive, and I hate Dive, but I love Nightcrawler. I just love I just love the fact that
Coach Mills (02:52:23.554)
Is good.
It's gonna be so fucking cool, you know.
Persixo (02:52:28.504)
Because he is I'm not sure if you guys know his lore, but he he's like he he looks like dun demonic, right? But like but like he's like he's he's like a devout Catholic. You know what I mean? So I love that, like like how Daredevil too. they they kinda do it in Mario Rivals, but but like they don't really lean into like his you didn't know his his religion. But I hope wait, wait, wait, with with Nightcrawler, they they lean into that 'cause like that's like his whole character. Like like like everything he talks about is like like is like strict is like scriptures and psalms and all that. So I I would love that, but I hope they do it right. I hope they don't nerf my boy, man. and then secondly
Coach Mills (02:52:34.786)
Yeah, he is. Yeah.
zazzastack (02:52:49.017)
Mm-hmm.
Persixo (02:52:58.418)
I would say Colossus. And but the issue is with Colossus, is that he kinda would he be like a thing? Would he be like an Emma? You know what I mean? He he kind of fits the niche of both. So I wonder how they're gonna do that. Make him CC immune. He's just he's just a metal dude. He's just a metal dude. Like, I mean, for me, like that that that's
Coach Mills (02:52:59.872)
Mm.
Coach Mills (02:53:08.738)
I don't even know his four po his full powers besides just being big and metal. I mean you could go anywhere with that, I guess. Yeah, I don't even know.
Persixo (02:53:18.872)
So I want I want Colossus to be like a like a an like kind of like a rogue thing type of type of archetype or maybe like or maybe just a full just like like tank in the like like brawling to like thing. So I would say nightcrawler and colossus because I'm I'm adamant about the X-Men. I love the X-Men. Not Wolverine though. Not Wolverine. After what he did to me. Not Wolverine.
Coach Mills (02:53:26.272)
Okay.
Coach Mills (02:53:39.342)
What well Captain Code, I know you always give your responses, but what about for an X-Men? If you were gonna add an X-Men.
CaptainCoach (02:53:46.385)
Well, you guys, last week's episode, you guys were talking about how much you liked X-Men 97. So I've actually been watching that. Yeah. It is. It's very entertaining. Beast is pretty cool. I wondered if they would do something where he uses his science to maybe heal or be some kind of like hybrid, but, because he, like mostly in the show he's...
Coach Mills (02:53:52.842)
yeah. you're watching it finally? Let's fucking go. It's so good, bro. It's so good. Yeah. It's so good. I love it so much.
Persixo (02:53:56.804)
My chat told me to watch that too.
Persixo (02:54:04.377)
Mm-hmm.
Coach Mills (02:54:13.772)
He is a strat he is a strategist, right? Like the he strategizes, right? Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:54:16.045)
Right. He's... Right.
Persixo (02:54:17.028)
But he's tanky though. He he he's like kinda like big, like in the movies. Like I I'm not sure if you guys watch the X Men movies, but he
zazzastack (02:54:21.493)
They just might give him like a decent hitbox on strat though, like more of a... you know... You know like how Daredevil's built in-game? You know how Daredevil's kind of built and he's got that wider hitbox a little bit but he's still like small and you know like same size as the DPS but he's just a bit wider? Like I feel like... yeah.
Persixo (02:54:26.82)
Like a brig?
Coach Mills (02:54:29.016)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Persixo (02:54:29.936)
And I thought.
Yeah.
Persixo (02:54:41.92)
Yeah, so
Coach Mills (02:54:45.966)
It would be cool if they I really like what they did with like Dino and Storm. Maybe maybe not the power level of those, but the idea that you have abilities that heal. You know, like you like team ups that heal. So like you what if you had the beast, he comes out and he has one team up that's like going into the strategy side and has like a healing sustainability. And then there's another one that's like the beast side and it's like more of a
Persixo (02:55:09.912)
Like agile, like
Coach Mills (02:55:10.008)
Like a tanky ability, you know, like so you can you can choose the man like the the scientist side or the fucking the monster side, you know? Like Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then you can build him either way, you know. I think it's kinda interesting.
CaptainCoach (02:55:11.067)
Yeah.
Persixo (02:55:17.944)
Also like kinda like a hybrid, like a hybrid type of
CaptainCoach (02:55:18.171)
Be cool.
zazzastack (02:55:19.117)
Mm.
Persixo (02:55:23.45)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:55:24.601)
Yeah, Magneto has always actually been my favorite X-Men. Yeah, so.
Persixo (02:55:28.59)
You know Ball. I'm glad you know Ball.
Coach Mills (02:55:29.688)
Let's fucking go. Did y'all hear Adam Driver got casted, I think. I think it's official Adam Driver as Magneto. The new one, yeah. Yep. Which I don't know if you know who Adam Driver is per sexo, but he was Kylo Wren. I don't know if you saw the new Star Wars, the most recent Star Wars. He was in he was in a he's in a bu he's in a but he's in a bunch of he's in a bunch of movies. He's a very good actor, but yes, yep.
CaptainCoach (02:55:34.989)
really? As Magne-Do? wow, that'll be cool.
Persixo (02:55:41.04)
I don't know any actors, I'm gonna be honest.
Persixo (02:55:47.344)
I don't even know who Kylo Ren is. I don't know, I know about Star Wars. I'm not cultured.
CaptainCoach (02:55:49.295)
zazzastack (02:55:50.531)
First living under a rock, even I know that, and that's saying something.
Persixo (02:55:56.398)
Wait! Black hair? Long? Like here?
zazzastack (02:55:59.438)
Yeah, and it's got like big lips as well and like a decent sized nose too. It's got quite like a strong jawline.
Coach Mills (02:55:59.981)
Yep. Yep, yep, yep, yep. K just a
Persixo (02:56:02.695)
what's his name? What's his name?
Coach Mills (02:56:06.476)
No, I'm I'm I'm spacing. Kyler just type in Kyler Ren.
Persixo (02:56:10.288)
Let me see. Actor, let me see. This guy! I yo, it's funny because when you said that name, like his face like flashed in my in my head, but I was like, nah, I'm tweaking. Yeah, this guy. Okay, okay.
zazzastack (02:56:10.295)
Yeah, type in Kylo Ren, it'll come up.
Coach Mills (02:56:12.355)
although that's when he was younger. Yeah, Adam Driver, yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:56:19.969)
I don't know how into Magic the Gathering you all are, but I started playing a Hulk deck in that and I really like it because I've always been a green-red player. So I played a Hulk deck and I was playing with against my friends yesterday. It was super fun.
Coach Mills (02:56:27.18)
Let's go, let's go.
Coach Mills (02:56:35.586)
The new magic set is sick. I I know Emma Emma Liath got into magic actually recently 'cause of the new magic set. So another there's other other casting news is Ryan Gosling as Ghost Rider is officially announced. I don't know if you saw that one. I'm very excited about that one. That's gonna be very sick. I cause I can't wait for Ghost Rider to be in the games. A hundred percent. It's gonna be really sick.
CaptainCoach (02:56:51.377)
I saw that one.
Coach Mills (02:57:02.422)
but the the sorry, the character that I really want in the game is I want Shang Chi. I I keep forgetting that I want him really bad.
zazzastack (02:57:07.353)
Ooh, that's actually a good one. I know that one. That's actually, that would be cool. That would be really cool. I keep...
Coach Mills (02:57:10.7)
Yeah. It you could probably make him a DPS or a strategist. You could probably do either.
zazzastack (02:57:16.461)
I kind of keep forgetting that he's Marvel, I'm not gonna lie. I kind of just think of him as like his own sort of movie, you know? But yeah, no, I feel like it would be very cool to see Endgame. I'd love to see that, yeah.
Coach Mills (02:57:18.616)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:57:22.722)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:57:28.076)
Yeah, I I random tangent. So like that movie reminds me heavily of a movie called Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon, which is which is like a like an old Chinese fighting movie back in the day. And I used to as a little kid I used to watch that movie and I used to love watching that movie. and then fun fact, the other day I did a twenty three in me test where you like find out your DNA. So my mom came from the Philippines, so I like I have never known what I am. Like my dad's white and my mom's like Filipino.
zazzastack (02:57:48.931)
Mm.
Coach Mills (02:57:53.826)
But I actually turn out it turns out I'm like nine percent Chinese from like mainland China. So that's actually kinda cool. You know, I've been I've been watching Crouching Tiger Head and Dragon since like four years old. and it turns out I'm you know, it's it's kinda cool. But anyway, sorry, just random tangent that I did I randomly found out.
zazzastack (02:57:57.709)
Huh.
zazzastack (02:58:04.619)
Huh.
zazzastack (02:58:08.937)
Yeah. I randomly found out that I had like Welsh and Scottish and like all those European countries in me and I'm like, I- because I didn't know where my my crazy curly hair came from because my whole family's got like blonde hair or black hair and no like brown thick curly hair, you know? And apparently it's come from like a bit of Irish on my dad's side or something, so...
Coach Mills (02:58:19.854)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (02:58:33.703)
but yeah, I mean, that's pretty much everything I wanted to talk about. Is there any hot takes, any final statements, any things you want to say before we wrap things up?
Persexa you first? Do you have any f No no The fucking GOAT The GOAT the
zazzastack (02:58:45.017)
Not anything I can think of.
Persixo (02:58:45.89)
my bad, I had to turn on my AC. I had to turn on yo, I'm not gonna lie, I've been burning without this AC, but I tanked it for y'all. freaking No No, I'm not gonna lie, like I like I'm not sure. Like look at my skin now and then look in the beginning of the video, like I'm I'm glistening now, I'm trying to glisten. any hot takes? I mean you guys already know man. I think Magneto should always be the meta. I think he should be the standard of every single tank. Genuinely, there's like no troll. This is no troll. I think that people can all agree that they have issues with every tank and it feels oppressive when.
zazzastack (02:58:51.577)
It's perfect temperature here today, so...
CaptainCoach (02:58:52.241)
A true tank!
Coach Mills (02:58:59.918)
My man's been
zazzastack (02:59:02.681)
zazzastack (02:59:08.563)
god.
Persixo (02:59:15.474)
When Angela's meta is bad, when Cap is meta is bad, when Venom is meta is bad, when when Thor is meta is it's absolutely atrocious, the game should be deleted. Nope, but when Dino is meta, garbage. When when Groot is meta, horrible. But when Mag is meta, the game is better. And everyone can say they they they can try to ignore it, they can try to look away, they can try to look away, but we but we we can all agree that when Mag is meta, it doesn't feel oppressive. When any other tank is meta, if it's oppressive, it's nasty. And yeah, that's my take. It's not even a hot take, it's it's the take. It's it's
Coach Mills (02:59:20.706)
No, no, it's it's the fucking best that the game could possibly be when Thor is meta.
zazzastack (02:59:31.385)
I know I pro-made it, right?
Persixo (02:59:45.414)
No bands, no bands, no bands. No
zazzastack (02:59:45.581)
Well, I guess... I...
Coach Mills (02:59:46.412)
So banning your mag in your next tournament. I'm just like, you know, I need to say that. No, he's I don't think you want that, bro. I'm a I'ma drop Mikey, bro. I don't think you want no fans. He's like, no, no, no, no.
zazzastack (02:59:52.727)
Hehe!
Persixo (02:59:55.918)
No no not.
zazzastack (02:59:57.53)
I guess my only hot take is that like, if we aren't going to give Widow her sniper back, we need to fill that sniper niche. Because I feel like that's a whole pool of players that are going to slowly become more more disinterested without that sniper niche in the game. But it's not the same, that's the thing, it's not the same! That's like, that's like worse than the people saying just main Hawkeye, bro! That's like worse than the people who say just...
Persixo (03:00:13.242)
Tell him to main mag. I'm playing, I'm playing, I'm playing. I'm trying to I'm just I'm trying I'm trying to recruit. I'm trying to recruit. Tell tell your audience to come to Mag. Tell your audience to come to Mag.
Coach Mills (03:00:17.782)
Yeah!
zazzastack (03:00:25.657)
I would not enjoy playing Magneto. I would not enjoy playing Magneto, bro. I'm sorry. I would not. I would not. I need like a squishy, movable, sniper character who is like a glass cannon. That's what I want. Give me a glass cannon sniper.
Coach Mills (03:00:27.182)
There's no way Miss Henson tell me.
Persixo (03:00:30.69)
What no
Coach Mills (03:00:34.318)
Holy shit.
Persixo (03:00:41.072)
If you squint, like you can play mag and like squint and like No You could do that with mag with a sword. That is true. That is true.
zazzastack (03:00:46.553)
I want to shoot people from across the map with my sniper in the head. He can't headshot though. He can't headshot.
CaptainCoach (03:00:53.943)
I got one. They need to revert the hotfix for the alt charge for supports. I stand by that. I just do not think they had enough time to really be able to get an idea of the impact. I thought that I personally, I played, spammed like 30 plus games the first night. It was probably the most fun of the day games I ever had.
zazzastack (03:01:01.453)
Yes.
Coach Mills (03:01:02.612)
that's the that's your that's your thing.
zazzastack (03:01:18.657)
I think they should have just given it a week at least, at least before that hotfix. Yeah, I don't even feel like it was a week, it was like less than that.
CaptainCoach (03:01:21.454)
I agree.
Persixo (03:01:25.316)
I was looking for Mag in the hot in the hot fix, I didn't see him.
CaptainCoach (03:01:27.249)
Hahaha
Coach Mills (03:01:27.298)
But my my theory guy I I I actually really did like it before, but I still like the game now. My theory is that some of the win rates on some supports were just like extremely, extremely low to the point where they they pressed the big Uno reverse button. That's my theory because looking at like I said, like look at the cloak and dagger win rates, it's like like I said, it's only like forty five, forty six percent. It was probably forty two.
CaptainCoach (03:01:44.389)
Yeah, they panicked.
Coach Mills (03:01:54.678)
Or some shit like that. And that's why they pressed the button. I'm not saying they should have. And I'm not saying they shouldn't have just maybe hotfixed it a different way. Because they could have. But that's probably why they did that. you know, like to give them the benefit of the doubt, I don't think that they just they just pressed the button for no reason. I think they had data and they were less like, yeah, no. These people are free falling in ELO. And I and I know your your take is they should, they should, they should. Yeah, but like when people are like maybe C1 and they're fucking
zazzastack (03:01:58.158)
Mm.
CaptainCoach (03:02:13.444)
Sure, but.
You gotta let your player base grow.
Coach Mills (03:02:24.472)
Free falling to Grandmaster three or whatever. Yeah, but I I'm just saying I'm just saying like that's where they got afraid of 'cause like that's the type of shit that could make people leave. So that's why they pressed the button. That's probably why. Yeah. But I like I I don't a hundred percent blame them for doing that, but I I can understand why you Right.
CaptainCoach (03:02:27.43)
Good.
Persixo (03:02:29.274)
God.
Persixo (03:02:35.577)
Makes sense.
CaptainCoach (03:02:35.932)
for sure. They panicked. They panicked.
CaptainCoach (03:02:41.657)
It's still better, in my opinion, but I like where the game's at.
Persixo (03:02:46.734)
I mean Hulk gets it in two seconds though, but we don't talk about that anyway.
Coach Mills (03:02:49.941)
CaptainCoach (03:02:50.789)
gets it as in he he dies in two seconds?
Persixo (03:02:52.28)
No no, it's all he gets his old so fast is it's unbelievable. I d I no.
CaptainCoach (03:02:55.129)
He got it faster before because he has to play so much slower now because the damage is so high. Unless, unless you get like.
Persixo (03:02:59.502)
Not but think about it. He got the clap, bubble, then gr then the the reduction, then bubble again, then clap again, then bubble again. No, terrible, terrible.
zazzastack (03:03:00.269)
Winner gets hers super fast now.
Coach Mills (03:03:03.854)
See see Katzikush just come on my side, the Thor side, the anti-mag side. Come on. Don't let this guy win. Don't let this guy win.
CaptainCoach (03:03:05.041)
He gets it faster than mostly everyone, yeah.
Persixo (03:03:12.64)
CaptainCoach (03:03:13.915)
Hulk First Store, that's iconic, man.
Persixo (03:03:15.182)
Add knockback back to Hawkin as all too. Add knockback back to Hawkin.
zazzastack (03:03:18.061)
feel like I'm in a standoff between three Tank mains and I'm just here... I'm just here chanting for my character but like no one cares. Because Widow hits on Tank. Fair enough. I don't blame you guys if you banner this season. I do not blame you guys at all. She's definitely in a good state for like more people.
Persixo (03:03:20.72)
Bro.
CaptainCoach (03:03:20.815)
Ha ha
CaptainCoach (03:03:24.799)
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Coach Mills (03:03:25.428)
Ha ha ha.
Persixo (03:03:28.048)
I agree. I I'm w I'm with that.
CaptainCoach (03:03:28.355)
I ban Widow
Coach Mills (03:03:34.36)
No I
I just I hate well Elsa more than Widow by Rain. I still hate Elsa. F why'd they buff that fucking hero? That's the only thing that I look at the patch list and I'm like, what the fuck? Elsa's o like almost back to prime. Yeah, she's almost back to her prime self and it like why? That character's insane.
Persixo (03:03:41.412)
That ultimately is to get nerfed.
zazzastack (03:03:42.126)
Fair enough.
zazzastack (03:03:45.961)
Mm. I feel like Elsa was in a good spot before. She was in a good spot before it.
Persixo (03:03:46.234)
Terrible.
Persixo (03:03:52.236)
No no no no no no her primo was different though like her primo will suck you like it'll literally suck you from across the cart like that that was terrible No no no no no like I'm talking about you'll be standing here and she'll ult like this and you'll just
CaptainCoach (03:03:52.57)
I'm a
Coach Mills (03:03:57.754)
It will do what?
zazzastack (03:03:57.786)
It still does! It still does! Yeah! No, I've- Yeah!
Coach Mills (03:04:04.159)
yeah yeah no i it i i it was it was a little busted there. But I'm just saying like the character's power level is really high.
zazzastack (03:04:07.385)
heard that happen to me a hundred times still.
Persixo (03:04:08.783)
No yeah.
CaptainCoach (03:04:10.021)
If my toe on Hulk grazes like the horn sticking out of the gull rock, I'm in. They got me, she got me. I get sucked in.
Persixo (03:04:15.961)
yeah it's done. You're done.
zazzastack (03:04:18.969)
I didn't even have to be touching the Glartrox and I get sucked into it.
Persixo (03:04:19.372)
I think honestly, it I'm gonna be I think a good change and let me know if I'm my I know we're ending back I had to get off my chest. With Elsa all I yo, I think what it should do is if like it should have like a sweet spot, right? Where if where where if if you touch that sweet spot it'll it'll take you. But if you're on the edge, it'll like it'll maybe like stu like bump you and stun you for like let's say stun you for like half a second. You know, something like that. Because it's it's unfair that like
Coach Mills (03:04:26.872)
Ha ha.
CaptainCoach (03:04:36.966)
bump.
zazzastack (03:04:39.097)
Mmm, that'd be cool. I like that too. Yeah, that'd be nice
CaptainCoach (03:04:39.577)
I like that. I like that actually.
Coach Mills (03:04:41.408)
Ooh Per Sixo's first good take on the pod. Let's fucking go. Woo Let's go. No, I'm just kidding, I'm kidding, I'm kidding, I'm kidding.
Persixo (03:04:45.038)
That's crazy. No, that's that's that's wild. That's wild. Because hey dog F y'all bruh. F every single one of y'all bruh. I'm I'm I'm making a tweet right after this. Never come to the
But it makes no sense that like on Hulk, if his toe graze or Mag with his hand out, like his fingernail touches it, it it just absorbs me into it. I think it should like like at least like stun maybe like I I hate stuns in the game, but I think for an ultimate to stun you like like you know what I mean? I I think that's like fair if the ultimate stuns you. So I think either cause like think about it, it's either it stuns you f like you're stuck in that animation and then man, hold the
zazzastack (03:05:05.816)
Mm.
CaptainCoach (03:05:20.431)
Your bubble doesn't free people from it either. It's total BS. The MagBubble doesn't get you out of it.
Persixo (03:05:23.533)
No yeah.
Coach Mills (03:05:25.418)
Yeah. Yeah, I I I actually have a problem with a lot of these abilities and ults that are a little too easy to hit. Like they're like like I ha I have the same problem with like Luna's Days. It's like it's not a skill shot anymore when it it's impossible to hit. Yeah, I mean it's po it's impossible to miss. Yeah, you y like it's the same thing with Elso, you just can't miss these things.
Persixo (03:05:26.882)
Makes no sense.
zazzastack (03:05:27.437)
Bye.
zazzastack (03:05:37.081)
Mm.
Persixo (03:05:38.028)
Yo the AoE of it is like so so massive.
CaptainCoach (03:05:45.265)
I just real quick before we end I Told my chat with the guests we had on today because they're asking where I am so someone saw the picture and said clear vibes podcast?
Coach Mills (03:05:56.463)
What the fuck shit
Persixo (03:05:57.985)
Yo
zazzastack (03:05:59.169)
That's crazy bro. No, that's crazy. Okay, okay.
Persixo (03:06:04.578)
No, no, W W Yo, can I shout out your audience who watches this real quick? Can I shout out real fast? Thank you. Because they come into my chat and they're like, yo, when's your next time you're on the- I get it maybe like twice a week. They're like, yo, I go I go back to that episode like like like every so often. I'm like, my episode? I I didn't even do anything crazy that episode.
Coach Mills (03:06:08.334)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, of course.
Coach Mills (03:06:20.674)
People people people are honestly you've been a very requested coming back guest. I've been waiting to get you back on for a while.
Persixo (03:06:25.016)
Yo, like, it's insane. I'm like, what did I do? I all I said is Mac all I do is glaze Mag and they love it. Like they don't even agree with me. They don't even agree. They don't even No, they don't even like Mag. They're like, you but I like Mag, but I like him. I like him though. I'm like, I appreciate that. I appreciate that.
CaptainCoach (03:06:25.509)
Yeah, you have been.
Coach Mills (03:06:30.414)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
zazzastack (03:06:31.033)
I've got an army of mag laces with ya, like...
CaptainCoach (03:06:31.121)
You bring the energy man, you bring the energy.
Coach Mills (03:06:40.864)
Let's go. I I think yeah, I like I like Persexa too. It's I it's actually kinda hard to not look at you, you know? okay, okay. anyways, anyways Okay, anyways. Prosexa, where can people come and support you? If they like you, they want to see what you're about. How can people support what you're doing?
zazzastack (03:06:40.995)
Fair enough. That's a good thing, that's a good thing.
Persixo (03:06:48.196)
What are we yo, do I gotta follow a restraining order? What's up? Get him off my- get him off my pod. Get him off my pod.
CaptainCoach (03:06:49.978)
Alright, now you need the helmet.
zazzastack (03:06:52.225)
NNNN
Persixo (03:07:05.9)
yeah. Percyxo on all platforms. I'm gonna be honest. If you search for Percy, I should pop up anywhere. I'm gonna be honest. I got that much motion. I have no motion. Please follow me. Please follow me. Listen, if you watch Captain Coach or Cap Coach Mills, don't follow watch me. Watch me, please. They they have money. I I don't have money. Please watch me. I don't care. I'm shameless. Please, please watch me. Zaza Stacks audience, watch me. Play mag too. Trust me. Join join the army. Thank you. I appreciate it. Don't don't No no they got the other the don don't let them fool you. Please support me. Support me.
Coach Mills (03:07:12.268)
Let's go.
zazzastack (03:07:19.737)
You're gonna resist stealing the viewers!
CaptainCoach (03:07:23.322)
What the fu-
zazzastack (03:07:24.482)
my god.
Coach Mills (03:07:26.546)
CaptainCoach (03:07:26.705)
You
zazzastack (03:07:28.365)
Just because I have numbers doesn't mean I'm rich, Australia is expensive, okay?
Coach Mills (03:07:30.295)
Ha ha.
No what the
Persixo (03:07:35.406)
That's it. Go
CaptainCoach (03:07:36.625)
Cut! Cut!
Coach Mills (03:07:38.279)
and and stay tuned for your next tournament, which is gonna be sick.
Persixo (03:07:43.604)
true word tune in because Coach Mills and Captain Coach may be making a return to that so it's that that that's that that's out of my that's out of my payroll. That's out of my payroll. That's not me. That's that's like Shibby and E. G. and like they handle that. I just handle inviting people. That's all I do.
CaptainCoach (03:07:48.719)
Bro, you gotta get me on the caster desk, I'm telling you, I'm money on the caster desk.
Coach Mills (03:07:54.99)
Ha ha ha.
CaptainCoach (03:07:56.145)
Alright.
Coach Mills (03:08:01.162)
And Zaza, where can people come if they they like what you're about, they want to support you, they wanna hang out, they want to get to know you more? Where can people come support you?
zazzastack (03:08:10.381)
Well, my tag is Zazastack on all platforms. Z-A-Z-Z-A-S-T-A-C-K. Yeah, there isn't a single platform where that isn't my tag. But I mainly stream on Twitch. I stream on Twitch from Tuesday to Sunday. And I do stream on TikTok as well, but not all the time. So if you, you know, like, if you want to come get to know me and my community, my Twitch is the best place to go. So yeah.
Coach Mills (03:08:39.256)
Thank you. Thank you guys so much for coming on the pod. I really appreciate both of y'all coming on. Y'all are both welcome back anytime, and we'll be very excited to have y'all back. Yeah, let's let's come on. Come on then. No, I mean next next week's pod is gonna be cr i I mean, light's probably coming on that one, so it's gonna be, you know.
CaptainCoach (03:08:40.449)
yeah.
zazzastack (03:08:44.077)
Thanks for having us.
Persixo (03:08:47.224)
Alright, next week. I mean if you need me.
CaptainCoach (03:08:48.559)
Super fun.
Persixo (03:08:57.228)
Hey, run it back. No.
CaptainCoach (03:08:59.409)
This is honestly, this is one of the most fun episodes I think I've had. This is a good one. Yeah.
Coach Mills (03:09:02.349)
This has this has been extremely good, extremely good. So make sure you smash the like, subscribe, check out Zaza Stack and Persexo in the links down below. Thank you, and we'll see you next time. Bye. What the
zazzastack (03:09:03.819)
I'm glad. I'm glad. Thank you guys for having us on.
Persixo (03:09:04.91)
Hey, I I do my best, man.
Persixo (03:09:12.91)
Hashtag ignite the battle. See ya.
CaptainCoach (03:09:13.669)
Bye!
zazzastack (03:09:14.713)
Bye.