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The lizards pair the Cuban Quai d’Orsay Coronas Claro with Suntory Whisky Toki. The lizards do a deep dive on Cuba’s new approach to cigar pricing, they debate Cohiba and Trinidad becoming luxury brands and they read a listener email.
Released every Tuesday, the LOUNGE LIZARDS podcast helps listeners navigate the experience of finding and enjoying premium cigars (both Cuban and non-Cuban) and quality spirits. Episodes are normally around 90 minutes long and feature a variety of different topics including food, travel, life, sports and work.
The podcast features eight members: Rooster, Poobah, Gizmo, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Grinder and Bam Bam.
This is not your typical cigar podcast. We’re a group of friends who love sharing cigars, whiskey and a good laugh.
Join us and become a card-carrying lounge lizard yourself! Email us at hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and be featured on an upcoming episode!
**Gizmo:** [00:00:00] Welcome to the Lounge Wizards podcast. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars, as well as whiskey, travel, food, work, and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo, and tonight I'm joined by Rooster Puba. Senator Anne bam.
Bam. And our plan is to smoke a cigar, drink some whiskey, talk about life, and of course, have some laughs. So take this as your 30th official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Plan to meet us here once a week. We're gonna smoke a cubit cigar tonight, share our thoughts on it, and give you our formal lizard rating.
We do a deep dive on Cuba's new approach to cigar pricing. We debate Cohiba and Trinidad becoming luxury brands, and we read a listener email all among a variety of other things for the next hour. So sit back, get your favorite drink, light up a cigar, and enjoy as we pair sun to read Japanese whiskey with the K dors SE Corona's, Claro.
Our first K dors, say on the pod tonight. [00:01:00] The Coronas Claro, a beautiful sharp wrapper from this marker. The first one we've done. Uh, we, I think all of us in this room really are loving this cigar, so I'm so glad that we're doing this as our first, uh, K dors say. It's a little hard to find, but we'll get into that beautiful wrapper.
It's 42 ring gauge by five and five eighth inches. So boys, let's cut this thing. See, we're getting on the cold. Draw the Coronas sclero.
Oh my God. This marker has an interesting history. I'll tell
**Bam Bam:** you, honestly, it's the most citrusy cold draw. Yeah. I think you'll ever get on any cigar. It's amazing.
**Gizmo:** Wow. You know, honestly, I think this cigar was made for you. Well, as a guy who calls out citrus as much as you do, it's true.
**Bam Bam:** No, I'm serious. It's time to get offended by that
**Senator:** Why? But that's a flavor you
**Gizmo:** seek. No, it's not bad. I like
**Bam Bam:** it. This is really a unique stick. Very unique.
**Gizmo:** Definitely citrus, a little like shortbread. [00:02:00]
**Poobah:** Yeah.
**Gizmo:** Hmm. Draws wide open. Yeah.
**Senator:** Mine, mine's perfect. I took the tiniest bit off the end and it's
**Gizmo:** wide open. Yeah, it's amazing. Same wide open. Same. Yeah, same.
**Poobah:** Perfect. Tight. Tight. And you know, in virtually not invisible seams, but very tight seams.
**Gizmo:** Um, so this is fresh, right? 21. Yeah. Yeah. January 21 Rooster. And they're from the RGUs factory. Rooster gave me my first one ever. Yeah. Same from, yeah. Rooster found these same, turned us all onto these. Yeah. Yeah.
There's with, they're well regarded. So let's light this thing boys. The Coronas Claro by k Dors se a once again, a 42 ring gauge by five and five eight inches. A cigar that originally came out in 1974 and, uh, has been a staple of the K Dors SE line ever since.
Not as popular. Well, I shouldn't say popular, not as easy to get [00:03:00] as the QD 50 or the QD 54 from K dors se. Um, but this cigar is beloved. Wow.
**Bam Bam:** Really beautiful flavor right off the bat. Wow. Yeah. Yeah.
**Senator:** I'm getting like a creaminess that I didn't remember the first time I smoked this. It's like a
**Bam Bam:** creamsicle.
Yeah, orange. Orange creamsicle. Yeah, orange cream. Exactly. It's
**Senator:** outrageous. Wow. It's outrageous. Yeah.
**Gizmo:** I mean,
**Rooster:** the citrus is like an orange peel orange,
**Poobah:** honestly,
**Bam Bam:** it's almost like an, it's like an infused cigar. It's so flavorful.
**Senator:** I'm deadly serious. All I'm getting is orange creams
**Bam Bam:** and it's Senator. I'm right
**Gizmo:** there with you.
With you. This is incredible. Yeah.
**Rooster:** And the reason why these are so hard to find is because they only roll like once, once a year, maybe twice
**Gizmo:** a year. Is that right? Must be very expensive. And I find that every box that I've seen is from the RGUs factory. How much are these? It's about 400 an hour box. Yeah.
And it's about to go up. We could talk about that too. I like everything
**Senator:** else. I think we're gonna be placing a
**Gizmo:** bulk order. Oh [00:04:00] yes. Master.
**Senator:** Master Creek
**Gizmo:** Master. Quite, yeah. You know what, this is one of those cigars, the, and we've talked about it a little bit like all day today, knowing we were gonna do this on the pot tonight.
All day today I have been thinking about smoking the cigar. Yeah. It is just one of those cigars that just has, I, it's like branded my brain with
**Bam Bam:** Well, it's, it distinguishes itself with the flavor that it has.
**Gizmo:** It's, it's just refreshing. It's, it's very different. It's delicious. Very different. Yeah.
**Rooster:** It's not mild.
It's like a medium. Like a medium. Yeah.
**Poobah:** Medium.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. You guys getting any spice on this? Like, not yet.
**Bam Bam:** Really? No. Not for me. Not yet. I'm enjoying the, the citrus note, the creaminess.
**Poobah:** To me it, yeah, to me it doesn't, it, it's very unique. It doesn't taste like anything in the Havana essay catalog that I've had.
Um, really, I wouldn't say it, it's very, it's, it's, it's [00:05:00] differentiated. I agree. I think from, you know, if you, I couldn't tell you that this tastes close to really, um, anything we know, any, like, yeah. Like, you're, you're not like, oh, well this is like if this cigar, you know, made it with this cigar and had a baby like that, this is what it would taste like.
I, it, it's really very, I think it, it's very unique.
**Gizmo:** I wonder if you would be dismissive of, of this comment. I would say that people who, like the cigars that we've done, the El Ray del Mundo, and the two, if you like them, I think you will
**Poobah:** like this. Yes, absolutely. Cuz it, it does have some of those, it has some of that, but there's a more, like, for me it's like there's a deeper, richer experience in the background that's going on.
There's something I, I can't pinpoint exactly what it is. Maybe I'll get there, but there's something special about what's, there's a balance, I guess, in this cigar that's unique.
**Gizmo:** I agree with you. I, I think it's [00:06:00] complex and I think for a cigar that's, you know, a year old or two years old, three years old is the oldest one I've had Yeah.
To deliver what it does. Yeah. At the price point it does, is it's a very special
**Senator:** cigar. Yeah. I mean, we talk about how there are certain Cubans that smoke really well young, and I might put this at the top, . Yeah. I mean, no, totally. This does not taste like a 2021
**Gizmo:** cigar. No. Yeah. It's crazy. No, it,
**Poobah:** it, it doesn't.
And the size is wonderful. It is. .
**Rooster:** Now, we all, we also had the 20 eighteens, right? Yeah. Do you remember any, uh, flavors like from
**Gizmo:** I've had both eighteens. I've had both, and they are
honestly
**Bam Bam:** neck and neck to me. To me, this is a bit more flavorful than the one you gave me in the past. Yeah. I'm getting more
**Gizmo:** here out of this, the younger one I am.
Yeah. I, I think they're very neck and neck rooster. But it also plays to the idea that the, the latest, the recent crop has been just very, very strong. So strong in quality. I mean, not strength. Yeah. I mean,
**Rooster:** it's [00:07:00] amazing with the defor that we have had, you know, lately
**Gizmo:** how good they're smoked. Yeah. They're the RAs
**Bam Bam:** that Mon twos, Mon twos,
**Gizmo:** mons.
Oh yeah. Yeah. We've been, uh, we've been very, very lucky with the, with the recent boxes we've gotten. So, um, K Dorsy, uh, was founded in 1973 and was commercially available in from 1974, which is when this cigar came out. and right now they're only making three cigars in regular production. This cigar, the Coronas scleral, there's a number 50, uh, which is a 50 ring gauge by four and three eighth inches, which petite re robusto.
And then they also make a rib robusto, I guess it would be a larger rib robusto, uh, 54 ring gauge by five and three quarters called the QD 54. So we've had them all, um, we all have boxes, I think of almost all of them. This one takes the cake for me and the market, and it's very different than the other two cigars.
Yeah. Not even close. Yeah. Agreed. Um, what I found cool about this as I was reading that, that this brand, obviously it's named, kind of [00:08:00] leads to this, this understanding, but the impetus for the brand came from the French economy and finance minister in the 1970s, um, who proposed, uh, creating a cigar with a light flavor that could be paired well with French products like, uh, champagne and Foy gra.
And that's how, uh, they brought this to COA tobacco in the early seventies and. Kind of created a French inspired marker of Havanas. Can you say fu gra again? Fo Foy. How do you pronounce it? . Dude, lemme tell you something. It's, I have had such difficulty with the intro thing. It's fo fo
**Bam Bam:** gra
**Gizmo:** dude. Fo gra dudes in, man.
I'm, I'm with live. I'm having a hell of a time with the intro thing that I'm doing with all the Spanish names on it. Like, oh, you're doing great. Poor Laga. That, that's not easy actually. poor. I sitting with three Spanish, you guys who speak? Yeah, three guys who speak perfect Spanish. One's Dominican. One's Puerto Rican.
The other day at the clubhouse, they couldn't [00:09:00] pronounce . Very challenging. What was it? Vora Foy. Gra the ladder. Sorry guys. I'm embarrassing the, uh, the French contingent of the lizards. But anyways, so, um, you know, this is long time been a, uh, a local mark. Um, Focused almost entirely on the French market. And that changed in 2005.
So you really couldn't get these outside of France until 2005.
**Bam Bam:** So three standard production. But we know of another cigar called the ball back. Is that a regional? Yeah, regional. Yeah. For
**Gizmo:** what area? I don't know. I think Rooster. Rooster, right? Yeah.
**Bam Bam:** Here, look. Yeah. Rooster's
**Poobah:** a big spender. The
**Rooster:** ball deck I only got, I got like a five or
**Gizmo:** something.
Yeah, a thousand bucks from that. It was made for Lebanon. , the ball back was made for Lebanon. Lebanese is, that's
**Poobah:** cigar from what? I, I haven't had one, but there was like a lot of hype around it. Mm-hmm. . And, uh, then I think what we, uh, what I heard back was, eh, men's and men's in [00:10:00] the cigar versus the price.
Like not worth of money. Yeah. Like a lot of regionals, but, yep.
**Gizmo:** So the, uh, the Coronas Claros just another. , uh, programming note on these cigars, they only come in a semi boy nature box of 25 cigars. It's the only way to get 'em. Mm-hmm. . There's no other configuration. This was
**Rooster:** called the, there was a cigar called a Claro Claro that was discontinued in 1995.
And then, you know,
**Gizmo:** this came and then turn it into this corro and claros. Got it. Not to
**Bam Bam:** jump ahead, but has anyone taken a sip of this really delicious Japanese scotch? I haven't.
**Gizmo:** Let's talk about it.
**Bam Bam:** I mean, I really like it. It's light, but very flavorful. Yeah. Now,
**Senator:** grinder's not here, but I'll be the scotch police for you.
Go. We can't call it a scotch. It's not from Scotland. It's a whiskey. It's
**Bam Bam:** Japanese whiskey. Whiskey. Whiskey. So, uh, rooster Roo.
**Gizmo:** You would like this? Is it like the hibiki?
**Bam Bam:** I haven't had that, but it's so smooth and little. A little light, but very tasty.
**Gizmo:** Hmm. That's really nice. [00:11:00] Pears
**Poobah:** great with this cigar. Yeah, a summer.
**Rooster:** Summer whiskey.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. So what is this called again? Senator SUNY Suntry. Sun, Japanese whiskey. Don't they make beers too? They might. That's Sapporo Sapporo. I thought Sun Tori
**Poobah:** too. I'm not sure. Love Sapporo beer. I would imagine that that whiskey is that whiskey hard to find? No, no. It's relatively ubiquitous.
Yeah, I would buy
**Gizmo:** that. Yeah. That's really nice. I kind of like it.
**Poobah:** That's, I was just thinking with Covid maybe. I mean, the funny, I mean, I mean, no before that it wasn't, but, or with like the supply chain problem,
**Senator:** this is pretty readily available. And the funny thing is a lot of places have it because sort of like we were talking about, um, we mentioned many times, uh, Johnny Walker Black Label.
That's great. Mixed like with club soda. So like you'll see a lot of places like that make like a whiskey cocktail. They'll use SUNY in it. Hmm. Um, but this is the first time I'm having it. Neat. Or I mean, we [00:12:00] have ice with this, but with nothing else in it. and, um, it's pretty pleasant. It, it has a little bite for me, but the, the nose is extremely floral.
Yeah. Very summery. And, um, it's a pretty light, just nice easygoing summer.
**Bam Bam:** Yes. Whiskey. Yes.
**Gizmo:** Yes. Yeah. I think summer is a nice way to put it. I think it
**Bam Bam:** works great on the deck. Exactly. You need maybe three chips of ice with this guy and this cigar man. Wow. Yeah. In the shade. 80 degree day.
**Poobah:** Yeah. This cigar is
**Gizmo:** good.
Yeah.
**Senator:** I mean, take a puff of the cigar right after you take a sip of the whiskey. Yeah. I, it really like accentuates, like that's ridiculous. Creaminess that you get in the cigar.
**Bam Bam:** I'll take credit for the pairing.
I had nothing to do with it. He
**Gizmo:** was just standing there when he, I was just watching you guys grabbed it. .
**Poobah:** I was witness.
**Gizmo:** So what do you guys think about like a beer with this. You. I think it'd be a go moon. Blue moon would be great. Like [00:13:00] the wheat we beer with the,
**Senator:** or any Belgian beer would really well, like a Belgian
**Bam Bam:** triple good
**Gizmo:** call
**Poobah:** rooster.
Yeah. It's interesting. I'm noting the, noticing the labels orange. Yeah. You know , right? Or is that yellow's marketing? It's orange.
**Gizmo:** It's like a, yeah. Yellowy orange. So good.
Yeah,
**Poobah:** it's a good cigar. It's very enjoyable. It's burning like razor sharp. Yeah. Nice.
**Bam Bam:** Now as I think about where I would slot this in, yeah.
Could you smoke these once a week? Have one stick a week? If I had
**Gizmo:** more of them, I'd smoke them three times a week. I
agree.
**Poobah:** Really? Oh.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. I'm kind of there with you, Absolut. Oh, wow. Okay. I would smoke this cigar a lot.
**Senator:** Wow. I mean, if I had boxes of this during the summer months, I'd smoke one every day. I'd blow through 'em.
Yeah. Daily. Oh, that's,
**Gizmo:** I'm not kidding. That's great to hear. This is an absolute daily driver for spring, summer outside.
**Poobah:** Fantastic. I think for almost any, I mean, it's just a really solid cigar. Yeah. Um, [00:14:00] and like, I'm not a huge fan of, of, uh, of qd. Hmm. Um, but, um, the other, you know, the other ring gauges, I'm not like really bullish on those.
I,
**Gizmo:** I, I agree with you. I, I think the 54 tastes amazing. I like that. Uh, I just don't love that ring gauge. I was, you know, uh, Senator, I think, uh, and I were talking about it the other day at the Lounge. Maybe you and I were as well, the only, the only cigar in a 54 that really I, I think about a lot and chronic crave is the E two.
Um, most of the other stuff in 54 I like, but I just don't love that ring gauge. I just wish that that flavor was delivered in something closer to this, you know? Yeah. Yeah. The fifties. Good. But it's just so different than the 54 in this. Yeah, it's, yeah. This is the best QD out there. Awesome. That's
**Bam Bam:** awesome.
Remind me again, the ra, the wrapper. That's a natural. It's a
**Gizmo:** Colorado shade. Colorado Shade. Colorado. Colorado Shade. Okay. Ton of flavor. It has like a reddish Hutu it. [00:15:00] The wrapper.
**Poobah:** Yeah. Awesome. It's like Colorado Claro, but it's a Corona Claro. Yeah.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. Really, really nice. The size
**Rooster:** is so good. It is. It feels so good
**Gizmo:** in your hand.
**Poobah:** Perfect. It's 42 by what? 1
**Gizmo:** 45 and five eights. Five and five eights. I don't know what that converts to it. A great one. 42. 42 by 1, 42. It's a great ring gauge. Yeah.
**Bam Bam:** Honestly, a delicious pairing. Agreed. Yeah. I mean, I
**Gizmo:** think it's a perfect pairing. It's excellent. Bang
**Bam Bam:** bang, home run. Yeah. Unexpected
**Poobah:** home run.
Excellent. You know, a lot of, a lot of people like Orage cigars, you know? They do. Um, why do you think that
**Gizmo:** is?
**Poobah:** Well, I think they give, well, they give off a lot of combustion. And that's what
**Senator:** I was gonna say. Like, I reach for a pargo, like the, the cigar that puts out more smoke than anything in my humidor is a parus E too.
Yeah. When I've had a rough day and I just want clouds of smoke, that's exactly what I pull for [00:16:00] that
**Gizmo:** reason. Yeah. Yeah.
**Poobah:** You just turn into a chimney, you know, there's times when you're just like, I just want plumes of like crazy smoke. But this is like, this is a sophisticated cigar. Yeah. Not that an E two isn't, cuz it's refined.
Or a Kanye. Mm-hmm. , they're really good cigars. There's, but this has a lot this size, this particular size I think is, uh, it looks elegant. It's very sophisticated. I like it. And that they, the smaller ring gauge just can deliver. Sometimes they just really deliver.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. I think flavors totally right. I think you're totally right.
Sorry,
**Senator:** giz, just to go back to the, the whiskey for a second. Sure. Uh, the price point on this thing was ridiculously shocking. Good.
**Poobah:** Shocking. So cheap. 40 bucks. 40 bucks. 40 bucks. Is that right? $40. Thought it was like Japanese and
**Gizmo:** exotic and imported .
**Senator:** No, they have some. So the thing is, there's no age statement on this, but the Japanese whiskeys that do have eight statements, like a lot of single malts, those get higher in price.
Like Haki.
**Gizmo:** I wanna say, I didn't realize this didn't have an age [00:17:00] statement. I didn't catch that when we bought it.
**Poobah:** I've like never been with someone, like an individual and they've been like, like, let's get some scotch. And they're like, abike .
**Gizmo:** You guys spend more time with pagoda
**Poobah:** Love Aki. Haki. Hibiki .
**Gizmo:** Um, it's great.
So, so is, is the whiskey a blend?
**Senator:** Yeah, it is. It's a blend. Blend. It's a blend.
**Gizmo:** Is that why it's a Never
**Senator:** is I, I presume.
**Rooster:** Well, what about like Johnny Walker and stuff like Black Label? Is there your
**Gizmo:** statement on there? Yeah. Or
**Senator:** that, I guess that there's an example like Johnny Walker, the, the, the black label.
Now they put a 12 year age statement, but I guess what's in here is probably so young. They, they're, there's nothing really to advertise. Yeah.
**Gizmo:** Puba is happy. Yeah. Oh yeah. I think it's funny that this, that Senator's drinking blended Scotch
**Senator:** I'm a man of the
**Bam Bam:** people, what can I say?
**Gizmo:** Uhoh, I, in between
**Poobah:** the gar, I'm a, I'm [00:18:00] looking at this blended scotch and I'm about to stroke out, thinking about drinking it. This blend, this goddamn blend . Meanwhile, pleasantly, meanwhile, pleasantly surprised. Says the guy, says the guy sitting
**Senator:** here with his shirt tucked in just coming from his, uh, country club.
**Poobah:** Touche. Fucking big
**Gizmo:** shots. So let's, uh, we talked about it, uh, I think an episode or two ago. So, and, and Puba wasn't here, so I'm, I, I know he has some pretty strong opinions on it. So, uh, ha. Bonos announced in the last week or two that, uh, specifically they're changing the model and how they view Cohiba and, uh, Trinidad, uh, as global luxury brands.
And they're gonna be changing the pricing to kind of match what's going on in Hong Kong, where, where they're paying ridiculous prices for gray market and direct [00:19:00] cigars, and it's gonna affect everybody. It's disgusting. So, you know, pub and I, and, and Senator and all of us on the group chat, were having a really good discussion If Puba had some really interesting points about it, um, because I'm, I'm certainly a little fearful of what it's gonna do to the overall market, yet the rest of the markets are gonna go up about 7%, but these are gonna go up quite a bit, apparently.
So I'm curious what you're, what you think,
**Poobah:** uh, uh, well, I think that, well it sounds to me what little information we have. Cause it's not like everyone has so much information. There's been these press releases or these, I don't even know, Publica, you can't tell truth from fiction. But it sounds, the general consensus is that Cohiba and Trinidad are gonna go up.
And that's significantly, and that's probably true and possibly sustainable because it's almost like, if you think about like high-end real estate and when there's like a, like, you know, in a, in a weird real estate market, sometimes the high-end [00:20:00] stuff like holes, it stays. People are paying cash. We're can afford it because, you know, they give zero fucks.
They have money. So there's, so I'm getting to something. Yeah. Yeah. But so what I'm, my, what I'm questioning or wondering about or curious about that when this plays out is a couple of things. One, . Okay. Let's say hypothetically these prices are going up cuz you see sellers and retailers, like they're raising prices, like as if the stock that they have has already been up, like has already been tr you know, they're, they're like ahead of the inventory that they haven't even bought at the higher price yet.
So that's a whole other scam. Absolutely. A little gouge thing that's going on. And that doesn't create the best goodwill for anybody doing business. That's one. And, and, and the second thing is, is due to the taxes in Europe, and it's not just, it's not just London in the uk. Spain, right. You know, Spain. Yeah.
The, [00:21:00] you know, these are semi-socialist countries. I'm not getting political, but they just are that the taxes are much higher. I mean, if you're gonna go off and live in, you know, uh, you know, Norway or like Sweden, like, you're definitely paying a lot of tax on everything. Um, and that includes tobacco. So, uh, how, how, what's the market gonna is the demand?
My thing I'm curious about, and I'll put it to the group, is, I mean, will a Brit in that market pay 37 more than 37, 38, 39 $40 for a parus? Rob Robusto will, will they? Is there a market for that? I mean, will, is there, I don't, you know, maybe Haos say knows something that, you know, everybody else doesn't know.
But to me, with inflation and people with having less money in their pocket, I mean, everybody, that's the question they put to the group. Will this materialize in the, in some of the more standard production [00:22:00] stuff? I just don't know. Or is this just hyperbolic? I, I, you know, know
**Gizmo:** what I mean? My opinion is that that Hobans is being incredibly reactionary to what has happened, you know, with Covid V and with demand and with their, uh, manufacturing issues.
I feel that this is more reactive than a really intelligent, you know, finance, marketing play by them to adjust to the current circumstances cur agreed. And the other thing, and I think is gonna catch
**Poobah:** up in a couple years. And the other thing that I find in inter interesting, and I'm not gonna pretend to be an expert on, uh, Havana's SS essay's distribution model, however, I would imagine that Pacific Cigar and Hu and, and h and F certainly get, it's not like.
They certainly get volume discounts. It's not like, well, we're raising the price. Well that means we're raising it on at the same exact rate as every distributor, as every [00:23:00] regional distributor is getting the price raised on them. Exactly. Well, if so, if I come to Hunters and Franco, or if I go to, if I'm a regional distributor, it's not like they can distribute every single cigar throughout the entire two distributors throughout the entire world single-handedly.
It has to go touch a lot of different hands. So I'm gonna now like so they can, haque can just predict, everyone can just predict what the end user price is gonna be based on, not based on how many hands it touches to get to the end user. I don't buy that. In other words, like I don't buy that. This is just an arbitrary price hike.
And Havana s a is just gonna charge the distributors this. And they have no negotiating power whatsoever. Bullshit. And this regional distributors have no negotiating power bullshit. do big retailers have no negotiating power with their distributors? Bullshit. So I just don't, I just think that it's not this black and white, like this is going up this percent, this percent, this percent and everything's gonna trickle down.
I could be wrong [00:24:00] about all this and maybe it's just, you know, you're dealing with the communist country and they're just gonna raise the price and it's arbitrary and it's gonna be what it's gonna be and they can just say, fuck you to the world. I mean, I don't know.
**Senator:** So I'll, I'll say this here. Here are my thoughts.
Yes, they can raise the price arbitrarily and in the short term, find people who will pay it. And I say that cuz like, you know, gizmo, you described what they're doing as this is now a luxury product. They're sort of trying to build the pricing model around that. Obviously as a person who is a watch collector and loves, loves watches, that model around luxury goods is such that every year they come up with a percentage increase.
It is completely arbitrary. , right? There doesn't need to be covid for them to say, all of a sudden we're gonna increase at 9%. It's whatever they think the consumer's willing to pay. Now what I worry with cigars versus a, what I would truly consider a luxury product. Mm-hmm. [00:25:00] like a high-end watch or a high-end handbag for women or some of these other things that retain value and are not consumable products that like, you know, you smoke this cigar, poof, it's gone.
Mm-hmm. , right? Like you wear that watch or you know, a woman wears that handbag and it exists 10, 50 years from when you bought it. Yeah. And it's still worth
**Poobah:** a a lot of money. Well, Louis Vuitton handbag doesn't go outta style now it you pass it
**Gizmo:** down. Exactly. That's right.
**Senator:** Exactly. Yep. And so what I worry with cigars is in the short term Sure.
Are there people in London, Hong Kong, New York, LA that will pay whatever ridiculous price for some of these cigars? No doubt about it. But what I worry about is long term. with pricing. So ridiculous. I mean, you describing like $40 for a D four. Is that going to continue to capture Younger and I mean younger, not by children, right?
I mean younger by like folks in their, you know, late twenties, thirties who are getting into cigars, um, or early [00:26:00] twenties even, um, who want to enjoy this product. But at that price point are gonna say, well forget that I'm gonna spend $40 every time. And so I worry while the demand right now is so. When all of us age out of that market that that's right.
But we're not here. Fantastic point. Yeah. I hope that there'll be that next generation that's gonna say like, this is a really intriguing hobby and product that I'm really passionate about, but if the price point is set too high, when people don't have that level of disposable income early in their life, they may be killing.
I worry that they will, they're gonna kill their own market. Exactly. They're killing their own market. That's my take. I worry about the long term implication. Right, right. I think short term, they know they can get away with it and they'll obviously make more money. There's no doubt there. But I do worry about the long term impact that could have on demand in the industry.
**Bam Bam:** Here's a question. Uh, in the luxury world, so what you're wearing on your wrist, the less they make of that reduces the distribution, and of course the value goes up because they're not as available. This is a little different. Do you, do you see [00:27:00] any of you, do you foresee a, a produ, a reduction in production?
Well, there to increase
**Gizmo:** the cost of these cigars, there has been a, a de uh, uh, well, there has been a decrease in production simply because there's been a brain drain. Of, of, of rollers and of rollers. And talent. And talent, like I saw a picture from last week at the Parkas Factory, the right wing room, rolling room.
See, I, half of the chairs are empty and sitting up on the desk, I can show you the picture. It's crazy. It was from last week. Now
**Bam Bam:** it's awful. But I see that as more of a legitimate reason to raise your prices than just arbitrarily raising them. Because a lot of guys in Hong Kong are buying
**Senator:** cigars. Right.
But they're, they're clearly set themselves up to arbitrarily continue to do this by saying, we're now viewing this as a luxury. Good. Yeah, that's the luxury. Good model. And it works because if you're buying a $10,000 Rolex and next year it's 11,000, well, I have news for you. Either way that watch is gonna be handed down for the next three generations.
Plus of your life. Yeah. Of, of your, you know, future families. So absolutely. They can get away with that, because it's very easy to rationalize paying an additional [00:28:00] thousand dollars for something that's gonna last for a hundred years, but with a cigar. No, I do not think it's the same boat. Right. Agreed.
This is a product that is consumed and totally agreed.
**Gizmo:** Let's,
**Poobah:** you're done with that. Assume them. It's gone. And it, it's, you know, $40 a stick is a lot of money. Wow. . And in a market and in, in some of the, like, you're like, London's not a smoke friendly place. Yeah. So that market, I mean, you know, it's hard to find places to smoke there.
No, you could smoke, you could smoke in a shop as mm-hmm. tasting a cigar in a shop. But like the men's clubs and all those gentlemen clubs have made it illegal.
**Senator:** Well, the only thing I will say in London, so where they've gotten really clever, I mean, there's still a very strong cigar culture in London. I've spent a good amount of time there.
What all these places do now they build, uh, sort of like we now, uh, because of Covid experience, you know, everywhere got these outdoor tents. The restaurants had to do that for outdoor dining, even though you were in like an enclosed tent. So what they do in London is all these restaurants and even hotels, a hotel I used to stay at all the [00:29:00] time there, right off the lobby, they have a bar.
You then walk out on this little patio and it is fully enclosed in a tent with heaters. And you can smoke cigars there. Cool. And you can even buy cigars from the hotel to come out. It's out, there's outdoors, right? So they get around that rule. That's by all having these outdoor, technically tented structures that are, for all intents and purposes, really indoors, heated and you can smoke.
So they have found at least thankfully, clever ways
**Gizmo:** around it. That's pretty cool. And, and look at our neighbor to the north. You talk about taxes and, and, and Pro Canada, you know, well that's their own problem. I mean, they have a major tax problem. Yeah. You know, and they also cover the bands up with, with, uh, generic bans.
So this, if you were to buy this Corona, Coronas Claro that we're smoking now, it would come with it like an army green band on it with a very plain FLA that said K Doce, Coronas, Claro, uh, Cuba. And they are not allowed to sell them with any sort of, uh, fancy ban. And, you know, obviously they cover 'em up.
But a price of a D four in, in [00:30:00] Canada is probably. 40, $50 because of tax. Wow.
**Senator:** Believe very high tax. I mean, even alcohol there is outrageous. It's horrible. You wanna buy just like a bottle of vco, it's like 90 US dollars. Wow.
**Gizmo:** It's ridiculous. That's
**Bam Bam:** insane. I will not be moving to
**Gizmo:** Canada ever. So
**Rooster:** as the prices go up, I think we might have to smoke like instead of six, like only four a day.
**Bam Bam:** That was a, that's a problem. That's
**Poobah:** a big problem. That's cold. Coldest shit up there, Canada.
**Gizmo:** That's true. It's not, not moving to Canada. Fuck that. No way. Fuck that. So it'll be interesting, interesting to see what happens here. So I want
**Bam Bam:** one last question on this topic. We can move on. So what is actually happening in Hong Kong?
I'm not really aware. What's the
**Gizmo:** specific, it's, it's, it's been a, a land grab, kind of like it was for wine 15, 20 years ago. Now guys are hoarding cigars. Now they are into single malt scotch and cigars. Yeah. The thing
**Senator:** to understand about Hong Kong very simply, um, cause I, I have family ties to that part of the world.
um, there are more billionaires per capita [00:31:00] in Hong Kong than anywhere in the world, period. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . So you just think about Right. Luxury, good. Not more disposable income. Exactly. Yep. Cigars, you know, wine, single malt scotch. Yeah. And they hoard
**Bam Bam:** it. And at that level
**Gizmo:** you don't, you don't care what you're saying.
It's just a big dick swinging contest. You know, they're buying, you know, Macallan, you know, these crazy bottles of Macallan go up for auction. Almost every one of 'em is going to Hong Kong. You know, it's, yeah. And
**Poobah:** they's, listen, let's face it, the culture too, the business people, from what I understand, party balls.
Yeah. You know, major actions. Like, like they definitely like, you know, they're not like Elon Musk, like hanging out smoking apl on his, I don't know, one of his friend's apartments that he crashes at. It's very odd. , you know, like, yeah, I don't, I don't have a hou, you know, he doesn't have a house Bezos, you know, like he's not sitting on his deck smoking a 54 ring cage, , you know, E two like , you know what I mean?
Yeah. Like, but these guys in Hong Kong, I mean, dude, these guys are ballers, [00:32:00] bro. Like, they're like crazy ballers. Like there's definitely a culture of like, like less break open wine and like do all this
**Gizmo:** stuff. Like
**Poobah:** they go, do they have they go for it.
**Bam Bam:** Do they have eight balls there? ? ?
**Poobah:** I don't know. I would imagine isn't, isn't the or Well, no.
I guess that stuff's made in Mexico or, well, that's in South America. I don't know. I don't know. Probably not. Don't isn't. Was it the Orient is known for the other opium drugs? Opium. Opium, yeah. The opium. The right, the opium tree. The triangle. What was that called? Like remember like all the Rambo movies?
What was the, the, the, the heroin triangle. Come on, chime in the triad. .
**Gizmo:** Come on Rooster. You know more drugs
**Poobah:** come from Canada
**Rooster:** than
**Poobah:** Mexico. Oh
**Bam Bam:** really? Or Columbia. Are they, do they tax eight balls up there?
**Poobah:** About Jesus Staples. This is 1987 [00:33:00] fucking less than zero over here in the corner. .
**Bam Bam:** Alright, move it
**Gizmo:** along, bud.
Oh God. Oh, wait. So
**Rooster:** Havana's essay raises their prices every year, right? Yeah, about 67%. 7%, yeah.
**Gizmo:** Just across the board. Yeah. Every year. Yeah, that's pretty normal. So that on most of the markers, that's what's what you're gonna see on Cohiba Trinidad. Uh, the Linea line, we did that cigar from Monte Christo, and, um, there was one other.
**Poobah:** They raised their prices six to 7% every year. Yeah. Right. So, so, great. So you know what we should all do? We should all order tons and tons and tons and tons of cigars and then we should just hold on to them like we haven't No, no. Well, we smoke 'em all and then, and then six and 7% plus with the age on 'em, you add a couple percentage points more.
Next thing you know, you got a lot of margin, you've got some kind of black market business going on. We'll
**Gizmo:** do it. . I've heard about that. .
**Bam Bam:** No, I think that's better than a
**Senator:** laundromat business. I, I, I, just [00:34:00] going back to that, this is one of the things that frustrates me. You know, I gives, you'll obviously see on these forums, people posting about price increases and all this stuff.
And demand is, you know, through the roof and the supply can't keep up. And like for me, all of it is just like, there should be no panic about this stuff. They raise prices every year. N 90 something percent of the cigars, the Cuban cigars that we smoke. . It's just a normal price increase. But the only thing that's gone insane is Cohiba.
Yeah. In Trinidad and Cohiba, I'm sorry. Everyone knows this. Like, I could care less if those cigars become a thousand a stick. It doesn't impact me. I don't have a single box of Cohibas in my
**Gizmo:** Hiba, a lot of people. Right. But what I look at is what if RGUs is next? You know,
**Senator:** I'll be fucking rioting in Cuba, in support of the Cuban people.
My friend
**Poobah:** senator's gonna have a, a headband on his shit. . He'll be wearing
**Bam Bam:** a wife beater with a baseball
**Poobah:** bat in his hand.
**Senator:** with a machete in the other hand. I mean, I've met You go to war
**Rooster:** and, and why, why Trinidad? Yeah.
**Gizmo:** That is a really good question. I, you know, because [00:35:00] Trinidad is not, I think that's a, a, a.
I don't know if they call it a, uh oh. I think this is very easy.
**Senator:** Pro easy. The answer to this, it's a luxury. It's, this is very easy. I mean, if you just think of the Cuban Marcus, right? Like Trinidad and Cohiba were like the, the Castro, like diplomatic, highly regarded brands, and the pricing for them, even before this crazy increase reflects exactly that.
I mean, if you look at what you pay for almost any Trinidad, it's way more than you would pay
**Bam Bam:** for any other. Yeah. Honestly, even, even the colonialists are, are, you know, they're pricey cigars for the shape that you're getting,
**Poobah:** right? Yeah. But like, I never, I'm not paying a premium price for a viya. No, don't love it.
Like they've been just sitting in my humidor like, those aren't that great, Ben. Sorry. Yeah,
**Bam Bam:** Ben, I'll bend those and I want colonials all day long. I wonder
**Gizmo:** what a, I wonder what a, uh,
**Bam Bam:** I like it. I don't love it. I. I love, I love
**Gizmo:** the colonials. I like the veggies. I like the media. Media Luna.
**Senator:** Yeah. I mean the only thing I'm sad about is just the Fundeds is gonna go up to a ridiculous price.
[00:36:00] That's
**Gizmo:** probably be 15 is Aldi is, it's
**Bam Bam:** unbelievable. They're hard to get. Anyway,
**Gizmo:** they were 900 before this was announced, so I think after they're probably gonna be 15 to 1800 a box. Ah, forget it. Which I'd rather smoke loosies,
**Senator:** but I love the Cohiba price increase. and, and in fact, Puba the other day when we were at the lounge, you were talking about, uh, through some of our, our networks of collectors that, that we associate with, um, the one guy who's, uh, a really crazy collector.
Do you remember the other day you mentioned a specific guy? Yeah. He actually posted on one of the things that we're part of, uh, that he could care less, that the price of Cohiba went up. That he doesn't have any cohibas in his human room. Yeah. This guy's got an
**Poobah:** outrageous collection. Oh, he has an outrageous collection.
Yeah. That guy has an outrageous collection. Yeah. He doesn't care. Right. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny, he, well, he's more from my, the person we're talking about, not to go to, but he's, he leans towards our world. Right.
**Gizmo:** A little bit more cardus up in Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. I'm just glad this, this announcement was not specific to either of the, [00:37:00] the, any of the, uh, markers that we're really in love with.
Right. Yeah. Like
**Senator:** I said, I'd be on the next plane. Yeah. ,
**Gizmo:** I'm not kidding. In support of the keeping people
**Poobah:** supporting. I, I, I'll say, I mean, I, I know we're in this vortex now, but I mean, I will say like there's certain stuff like, you know, like Lucid, the loosies were not easy to come by for a long, long time.
You know, 8 98 boxes aren't easy to cut. There's a lot of stuff that just is not easy to come by. I mean, so
**Senator:** it's all reasonably priced.
**Gizmo:** Yes. If yes, yeah, you can still get, get a Lucy, Lucy for 24 bucks, 20 to $24 a stick. That's reasonable. That's double Corona, and
**Senator:** that's worth, that's less in price worth Every dollar, you know, most dat off Churchills.
**Gizmo:** Absolutely right. Absolutely. But
**Poobah:** those are vulnerable to stuff because the leaf that they use, it's, they pop up and they go away. Sometimes they go away for decent periods of time where you can't really find them. So I'm just saying it's not a layup all the time, you know? Yeah. [00:38:00]
**Gizmo:** All right, boys. We're into the second half of the K, dors, se Coronas, sc Claros.
What's everybody think about this thing? Um, I'm in
**Bam Bam:** love. It's great.
**Gizmo:** Yeah.
**Poobah:** Yeah. The flavor
**Gizmo:** hasn't changed much, much. No. It's consistent. Yeah. Consistent. But it's, which I
**Senator:** like, cuz I love the flavor. Absolutely.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. I'm still trying to figure out an answer to what Puba said when we kind of first got into it.
You know, what, what is, what is so special about it? The complexity. Like, I can't figure out what it is. Mm. Is it that it, it's kind of hitting the, the several areas of your tongue and your mouth with, with various flavors. The delivery's so smooth. Like, I'll, I'll
**Senator:** take a stab. Yeah. Take a, take a stab at that.
I mean, for me it's that it starts out. with a lot of citrus, maybe a little floral. And as you smoke further along, like I get a little bit of nuttiness almost with the cigar, and there's like a creaminess that just ties it all together. And to me, it takes a very refined smoke to be able to do that, where all the flavors just [00:39:00] married so perfectly.
And I think this cigar has done that.
**Gizmo:** Yeah, absolutely. At a year of age. Yeah. . It's crazy.
**Poobah:** It's crazy. It's
**Gizmo:** crazy. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, when we smoked the Segal two, go back to Cohiba for a second. When we smoked that cigar. Hmm. That was a cigar. That was three years old and we were all San, you know what, maybe with some more time.
Yeah. It'll even smooth out more, you know? And what do you need five, six years, seven years to smoke a cohiba and really say, wow, it's in its sweet spot. Mm-hmm. . That to me is not a luxury product when they're selling it at a year old. That's right. They're six months. That's right. There you go. You know, and you're gonna pay what?
For that box that I got for 4 25, you're gonna pay 1200. Now. That's crazy.
**Bam Bam:** That's, that's, that's crazy. That's a head
**Gizmo:** shaker, man. That's crazy. I'll tell you, they better make sure their quality control is tip top if they're gonna call it a, a Rolex. Yeah. You know,
**Bam Bam:** we'll be smoking Philly blunt soon. ,
**Senator:** speak for
**Gizmo:** yourself then.
Hey, bam. Before the next pod can you go to 7-Eleven and get us some cigars? I'll get the blueberry
**Bam Bam:** ones.[00:40:00]
**Poobah:** Perfect. You know, and let's see, who knows? There's a lot of, a lot of propaganda that comes out of, um,
**Gizmo:** Cuba
**Poobah:** and the Cuban government's mouth. And, you know, this, they could, they could just be like, fuck it, we're just gonna try this. And if it doesn't work, we'll just make adjustments and not tell anybody.
Like they just, they can do whatever, you know, they're in complete control of the whole catalog. So it's just like,
**Rooster:** but you know, once the cigar prices go up, they're not coming back now. No. You know, once the raise that. Prices on Cohiba boxes. I mean, that's gonna be it.
**Gizmo:** That
**Senator:** is true for every single luxury good period, right?
Yeah. Yeah. The number of people, cuz obviously I, I love the watch community and people say, oh my gosh, the price of watches have gone through the roof. It's gonna come down. Right? No it's not. No, it's never
**Poobah:** coming down. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz the secondary market is just going to, people are just gonna ho grit, white knuckle it.
Yep. You know,
**Bam Bam:** so supply has a lot to do with that. So when you limit supply, those values [00:41:00] retain, they they stay. That's right. Yeah. Now, with cigars, they're gonna continue to produce volume. Will people stop if what happens when people stop buying Cohibas or they see a reduction in sales and they're continuing to produce that volume, that luxury cost has to come down.
Otherwise they're gonna sit on a shelf.
**Gizmo:** Well, they might reduce production. Oh yeah. Or all the
**Senator:** cohibas will be in
**Gizmo:** Hong Kong. Right.
**Poobah:** Yeah. I I, I, it's interesting because you know the economics of, you know, what's happening in the economy. I, I mean, you could arguably say like, you know, the mid-market customer maybe fuck 'em.
Yeah, yeah. You know, maybe they're saying, Hey, look, I see, we see where the economy's going. Yeah. There's inflation. I mean, maybe it's, they're thinking of, maybe they're thinking about it in a way. Like, fuck the mid-market customer. We're gonna go after the high end custom. The people will actually have the money and raise the price, and we'll just, you know, it's not, you know, maybe it's not a terrible strategy.
Uh, uh, you [00:42:00] know, uh, because the, the, the upper, call it 10% of, you know, people in terms of wealth, just let's call it, you know, across the oceans. Right. They don't give a shit. Yeah. They don't care. No, you're right. They're not gonna really care. So like, you know, do I think that they've done all this, like, you know, The, I don't see the Cuban government doing like, extensive market research on the topic , but like, it is like they're one of their biggest
**Gizmo:** exports.
**Senator:** I hear they do a lot of good market research in the jails
**Gizmo:** in Cuba. . Yeah. Yeah,
**Poobah:** exactly. Well, I mean, you know, so who knows? I mean, uh, you know what it is? When you're in that much control and you have that much monopoly over something, you can kind of just experiment and do whatever you want and see what happens.
And you can just course correct and it doesn't matter. Yeah. Y you know, it's not like anyone can make what they make. They just can't. [00:43:00] And, you know,
**Gizmo:** you know who I think this actually helps really well, uh, which is unfortunate, is I think it really helps the counterfeiters, you know, the, the counterfeiters I think are really gonna benefit from this, not only in the ability to charge more, but in the fact that people are gonna be dying to get their hands on these cigars at any sort of,
**Bam Bam:** Yeah.
And if they drop their price a bit, they'll
**Gizmo:** go for it. Just a little. Yeah, just a little bit. That's awful. They're getting better with the bands. They're getting better with the rolls. They're getting better with the boxes and the codes. I mean, ha, bonos, you know, this is, hasn't done enough to prevent that.
And I think this is only gonna increase the counterfeit market.
**Bam Bam:** This whole thing is just negative. It's not good. Yeah.
**Poobah:** We'll
**Bam Bam:** see, you know? But on the flip side, everything in general is more expensive. Fuel is more expensive. Fu food is more expensive. Construction materials are expensive. Services are expensive.
Doesn't something have to give? But don't you think that, does everything just continue to go up and up, up? It's
**Poobah:** temporary.
**Rooster:** I think , I don't know. I don't know about that.
**Gizmo:** Construction cost and all of that. I [00:44:00] believe that think it's gonna happen. It fluctuates. It does fluctuate.
**Senator:** No, in fairness, right? Like that is how inflation works.
Like it, it is always temporary in the sense that like, there's like a period Yes. At some point. Yeah. And then like you have the fed take action, like the, you know mm-hmm. , this is how it's all cyclical of
**Poobah:** this. It is. But it lasted a hell of a long time. Yeah. From Nixon through Carter . It wasn't over, no, it was years and years and years and years.
So, you know, the end may, cuz it will, I mean, it is cyclical. That's the way the economy works. It's gonna, it reaches a pinnacle. Mm-hmm. and then it just, it just collapses on itself. So, you know. But sometimes that can take a while, a while. Um, if history says anything, it's that article in the Wall Street Journal that, that, that, that was over the weekend, was like, yeah, this is, this is like a mirror image of, you know, Nixon Carter and like it started under Nixon and it just continued under Carter and it was just brutal.
And it even trickled over into ra, I mean Reagan into the Reagan [00:45:00] administration. And then it kind of started to correct a little bit, but it took a long time. Do you remember the interest
**Rooster:** rates in Reagan
**Poobah:** era?
**Gizmo:** Six, 16% percent. Yeah. When we bought our house, we paid 16%. Yeah, I heard about
**Senator:** that. I cannot even imagine.
**Gizmo:** I know. Sounds crazy. I know. I got my card during, I got my card during Covid for 0.0 for the entire term . They were so desperate to move cars, by the way, during Covid,
**Poobah:** that's another prod, that's another challenge for the listener Dodge. I saw commercial the other day. You probably need like an 800 credit score to get this, but Dodge.
Uh, ram, you know, like the PI ram, the pickup? Yeah. 0% financing for 72
**Gizmo:** months. That's what I got two years ago.
**Poobah:** Wow. That's crazy. Yeah. They're pushing this commercial, pushing this. Why Aren
**Senator:** are they offering that now? The demand for cars is outrageous. Maybe
**Gizmo:** the demand for their cars isn't, I don't know. Well,
**Poobah:** honestly, well, they make a really good product.
They make a great truck. They make, now they make a really good one. You know, you go back 10 years, not so. now. They make a really good product. They're a really
**Bam Bam:** good product. I think it's an interesting strategy because [00:46:00] most of the pickups on the road are Chevy and Ford. Yeah. F fifties, number one. And they control the market.
That's the thing. Dodge, they don't have such a big market share. So when they offer financing rates like this that are so attractive, absolutely. People are gonna go to that.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. Yeah. But just wait till the Tesla truck comes out. . It's gonna take over. That's right. Cyber truck. Yeah. Listen,
**Poobah:** anything, anything, anything.
Musk touches is, he's a Midas. Absolutely. It's all this guy is. That's right. Believe in anything he sees around corners. The guy's up at night looking at a lava man.
Doing, doing, doing fucking math, figuring out how to put shit into space. I mean, micro on, dude. Microdosing, l sd. He's like, yeah, he's exactly, he's microdosing. L s D and like he's crazy dude. He needs to get into cigars. Musk. Yeah. , he'd buy them all. He'd buy, he'd go and buy them masterpiece. We need produce
He'd say, this is unfair. And he'd go and he'd, he'd send a, a ship [00:47:00] to Cuba and buy everything at two x and then sell it for one, you know, for half the price he bought it for to democratize cigars. Something we need to do. Yeah. That's what Musk needs to do. We need to
**Gizmo:** get on his radar. Mm-hmm. ,
**Poobah:** get in with that guy.
We gotta talk to Amber Herd. Yeah, she, oh, she was connected. Johnny Depp's.
**Gizmo:** Oof. So it's funny, Elon is connected to everything. He's got the cars, he's got SpaceX, he's kind of owns NASA now. And the Johnny Contract. And the Johnny and Johnny Depp trial. Twitter. He just bought Twitter. Just bought
**Poobah:** Twitter. I mean, he's in everything.
He's in everything. It's like this. Johnny Duck trials on him.
**Gizmo:** Starlink, he's, the reason that Ukrainians are able to communicate with the world is because he, he gave them internet access via starlink. And he doesn't own a house. He doesn't own a house. He like couch surf. Surfs. Yeah. He lives with his friends or something.
It's amazing. I'm gonna start couch surfing.
**Senator:** doing math. If RGUs prices increase, we're all
**Gizmo:** gonna be couch. There we are. Yeah. Couch surfing. Yeah.
**Poobah:** We seriously, I'm about to sell all my possessions and just like, you know, [00:48:00] move to South America. Disappear.
**Gizmo:** sounds wonderful. It does. It sounds so nice. I had a friend that moved to Panama, actually retired at 52.
Him and his wife moved to Panama. Never, never came back to the us. Just gone Wow, wow. Living something's going
**Senator:** on in Panama cuz Pagoda is always talking about us doing a lizard trip to Panama. Ooh,
**Gizmo:** I would love to do that. I've never been there.
**Poobah:** Bam.
**Bam Bam:** Bams sister's been there.
**Poobah:** Yeah. Yeah. Old girlfriend. I used to go.
She loved it. We went to Panama. She was staying in a bungalow and uh, with a, with some other guy that she used to date before me and she got like beat up. They got like beat up with like clubs and shit and robbed. Yeah. It happens. You know, shit happens down there. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. Yeah. I can't go there.
We'll see you tomorrow in Cuba. , that's, that's for today,
**Gizmo:** So this cigar is picking up and strength from me a little bit. A bit. It is in a [00:49:00] really nice way. Yeah. It's nice. Awesome. It's picking up just a little bit heating up. It's a fantastic cigar. Yeah. This is, this is, I don't know man. This is the, at the top of the pyramid for me as far as Great Cubans Yeah.
That are in regular production. This is really, really solid. Yeah. Great. So I, it
**Poobah:** is a great stick. So at this point in the cigar, compared to the 18 that I had the other day, this is where you start to just. See the difference. There's, to me, I, but in comparison, if you compare and contrast these, I can taste some rough, some, a little bit rougher edges coming down the stretch here, but nothing that's like off-putting, it's just a little more, it just, the 18 was more rounded
**Bam Bam:** out.
I feel the exact opposite. I'll say I am creamy and the citrus and a bit of floral, and that's picking up for me, but it's still so smooth. Yeah, I,
**Senator:** I agree with them on this. Yeah. I, I, I think the flavors are still consistent. I'm not getting many rough edges and I like that it's picked up in strength. I do.
Yeah, I [00:50:00] do too. And I don't know if it's its youth or what the case is, but it's picked up in strength in a nice way, not an aggressive way. Right. And I say I like that because when you have the first third of this cigar, my fear, the first time I had it and, and now I think this is probably only my second time having this cigar, was that this would only slot in.
In like the afternoon that I would never light this up in the evening and where this is now flavor-wise, I would absolutely smoke this immediate easily. Yeah,
**Poobah:** yeah. Oh sure. It's a solid smoke. When we
**Bam Bam:** all first smoked this, that was the assumption that we made. This is a good afternoon cigar, but number two here in our hand.
**Gizmo:** It's because maybe, maybe that
**Rooster:** was the 2018, so it was, it was a little bit, you know, it had smoothed off
**Poobah:** maybe, you know, maybe,
**Bam Bam:** yeah. I liked that. It's still delicious. Yeah. That I took that right down to the end. Yeah. And I will, this one here. Yeah, no doubt. Yeah. And
**Gizmo:** so burning great. Oh yeah. Didn't touch it up at all.
Yeah, it
**Senator:** burns phenomenal. I haven't touched this up a single time. No, I
**Gizmo:** was talking a lot. I touched it up once just cuz I was using It's really well constructed [00:51:00] cigar. Yeah. Yeah. Really nice. So I wanna go to a, an email chain. I've been going back and forth with a listener Max out of Australia. Um, and he's a, he's a big fan of the pod.
Loves what, uh, loves what we're doing. By the way, he made it, uh, he put a hashtag in one of the emails. Kirsti Ali needs a cheeseburger. I thought you'd appreciate that. A callback to . Something you said on an earlier episode, Kti Ali needs a cheeseburger, but, uh, he had a, he had a couple great points. Uh, one of 'em, he was saying, you know, he said, I'm sure you're aware of Australia's ridiculous ta uh, tobacco taxes.
So we were just talking about this and the scarcity of the premium outlets is an issue. So he says that he's smoking a lot of unbranded, unbranded, uh, Nicaraguan, uh, box press cigars. I guess maybe in the line of like a patron drone or something. Mm-hmm. . Um, but it seems like a lot of folks in Australia, cuz I've seen similar things to what Max has said here, that, um, that they're reaching for non Cubans because it's just so cost-prohibitive to get them.
That's
**Senator:** awful. I have to say, I, I, look, I've never been to Australia, so I will not [00:52:00] at all claim to be an expert, but I'll never forget, um, when I lived in DC at one point, I remember. I was on the rooftop of my building and these two Australian guys were up there and they were just pounding beers and having a good time.
And we started chatting. I was smoking a cigar up there and the guy said to me, he goes, the prices in this country are incredible. He's like, I just walked down to this supermarket. I bought like a, a 30 rack of beer. He's like, I couldn't believe I paid like 25, $30. He's like, in Australia, it's more than double.
Can be even triple that. The guy just beer. He said like, walking in a an American supermarket was like a kid on Christmas, just could not believe the prices. So I believe when he says the prices there are probably outrageous, cuz it seems like everything is really, really, really high. Yeah,
**Gizmo:** it's terrible.
Well, I mean, friends of a bonos, uh, retailer, I love, I mean I, I don't think I, I would say a low percentage of their customers are actually in Australia because they out, they, they send a send out [00:53:00] so much because of the tax. You know, it's just so prohibitive. Yeah, it was terrible. So, uh, another thing from uh, max, uh, by the way, max, thanks for writing us and any other listener wants to write us.
The email is on the, uh, the end of the episode, so please shoot us an email, what you're smoking, what you want us to smoke, but he recommended a couple things to us, so we gotta try the whistle Pig 10. I've had that. Yeah. Pretty good. That's nice. Yeah, we'll try that. And then, uh, you also put on the list, Ashton Heritage Pure Soul is a, uh, new world that he's from.
So we should put that on the list and try that. Nice. And then another question he had, and, and Senator and I actually discussed this the other day. He asked if we were gonna be doing any cognac.
**Bam Bam:** Oh, we were just
**Senator:** talking about that. I am entirely supportive of this. We absolutely have to do this. Yeah, I just say that because I think we all know like cognac is iconic with cigars.
Absolutely. And none of us really drink cognac regularly. And , my dad actually likes cognac, so I remember sometimes I'll ask like, oh, do you want a little cognac? If I'm over at, at my parents' place mm-hmm. and we're having a cigar and I have to say it, it it, it's very single malt scotch. Like yes it is.
The flavor notes. [00:54:00] It pairs really well. And I haven't dove into that world to be able to say, I know a ton about cognac or I know exactly even what to pick beyond the big brand names that we're probably all familiar with. So I'd love for us to do a little bit of a deep dive
**Gizmo:** at some point. Yeah. He, he recommended, uh, Davidoff XO and a Remy Martin Club were two of them that he mentioned.
He also said by, I'll just end this here. He said, uh, the wife and I are off a weekend away, so we have packed the Paul Ro and the Royal Albert Glassware, uh, as well as the full her Fedor. So Senators Impact
**Bam Bam:** knows no bounds ,
**Gizmo:** it's democratizing champagne. I love this. But he said, uh, keep up the good work legends.
So thank you Max for the nice email. Great email. Great. Now we love hearing from Thank you. So please, uh, please do reach out to us. It's very good to hear from. Yes. Thanks so much. That's wonderful. Yep.
**Poobah:** Yeah. Paul Roja. Paul Roja, baby. I w I wish I had more to celebrate today. Yeah. ,
**Gizmo:** how was your golf game? Can you celebrate the golf
**Poobah:** game?
Yeah. What'll just [00:55:00] score today? What was the score? No, it, it, it, you know, it was, it was, uh, it was, the conditions were beautiful weather-wise and hit a lot of good golf shots. I just didn't, they had aerated the greens, so the greens. . Puffy, they're plugged. I mean, they're, they're, they're just, yeah. Mm-hmm.
they're just, it's like, so it was a little bit, it's hard to judge the speed, and then it's also hard to keep the putt line mm-hmm. . So you've got two things working against you because it's not like you just put it and it gets online and you can kind of visualize how the ball's gonna get to the hole.
It's like, you just have to jam it. It'll, it'll slow down. It'll slow down, it'll slow down. So like, if you've ever seen like, um, like the really old footage of like Jack Nicholas putting like in the sixties or something, and you see like the balls going, going, going, going, and then when it gets to the whole hole, it just kind of stops.
Yeah. So if you're not used to putting on greens like that, making the adjustment. early season, cuz everyone, all the courses are already your score's going up so you're Yeah, you, you just can't get the ball in the hole. It's not like I didn't hit it good or any of [00:56:00] us, cuz it was all of us. None of us could get the ball in the all
It's like you're putting like, literally the ball, like you're putting, and like halfway through it jumps like an inch in the air and like, and like a centimeter to the right. And you're like, uh, okay, , I guess my birdie bid is done. , I'm gonna move on. And, uh, let us try and make this four footer again over like, over the moon.
Like moon, like a, like a moon face. Like, geez, you know, so, so it, the, that part of it is, uh, gets annoying, but Yeah. Yeah. How, how are the
**Senator:** cigars on the course? What you smoke? Um,
**Poobah:** What do we smoke? D four. There you go. But I don't, I I try not to like, uh, do too much. It's distracting. Yeah. It's, it's, I'm handling the cigar.
I'm worried about the cigar and the cart and the going in the back and forth and putting it in the grass and picking it up or handling it. . It's just, it's too much. It's too much. Yeah. Yeah. You know, like I played with my brother, uh, down in Florida a couple months ago and it was like every time I put the [00:57:00] cigar down, you know, in the cart, cuz I don't carry like an ashtray cup thing with the thick tender.
Like, I don't do that. He like, I'm like, before you get the cart, just let me pick the cigar up. Like every time boom, the cigar just flies recoils off the fucking drain off where you put your drink. Like into my, down to my, I'm like, dude, like fifth time, can you just not be so focused on going to your ball and just give me one second before you hit the gas.
Anyway, so sometimes it gets a little
**Bam Bam:** distracting. .
**Gizmo:** All right, boys. You guys ready to do the, uh, formal liquor rating on our Yeah. Yeah. Sun, Tori, Japanese whiskey.
**Bam Bam:** I like this a lot. Uh, I'd give it a nine. Okay. Wow. For, bam. You know, I'll, I'll explain later, but I really do like it. Yeah. Senator,
**Senator:** this is harder for me.
Um, I'm between a seven and eight and I'm just trying to reconcile in my head which to [00:58:00] give it. Yeah, I am too. And I think I'm gonna have to give it the benefit of the doubt in that the price point is spectacular on this. Yes. Yep. $40. Yeah. There are so few whiskeys at $40 that I would name and say I really enjoy that taste like this.
Yeah. It's really good. And so I'm gonna, I'm gonna round up and I'm gonna give it an eight. Yeah.
**Gizmo:** I am in the same category, N eight. Puba.
**Poobah:** Okay. I'm rethinking now. It's a relatively decent argument. Don't let us in. Influence
**Gizmo:** you. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's out
**Poobah:** there , you know, like I have to, it's not a, it's a fair point.
It's not a Monty two, but I'm not gonna rate it that way. I'm not gonna rate it that way because I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna give it a seven because that's what I think it is. But yes, for the price point, you can make an argument that it, that it hits above, it kind of hits above its pig, it's above, [00:59:00] it punches above its weight class.
Yep. I guess is
**Gizmo:** what you're saying. So the composite lizard score scores an eight flat, flat eight. Rookie score. Wonderful score, which I think is a fine score for the now exactly. To both, uh, to Puba and senator's points. If this was a $70. , I think it would be a six or a seven for me at 40. I'm absolutely, I think it's totally great price for, for this scotch.
And I gave me this whiskey, and I think
**Bam Bam:** it's an eight. Sorry, I gave it a high score because I haven't had whiskey like this that tasted like this. Yeah, it's, it's got a little citrus to it. It's um, it's really easy to drink. There's, for me, the bite was minimal. I had ice in it, of course. Um, I haven't had a, a whiskey like this at all,
**Gizmo:** ever.
I will say though, it's unique. I think the attempt to pair this with this specific cigar is a reason that we are enjoying it as much as we are. I think this with a a, a heavier new world or a heavier Cuban not gonna work, I don't know if we would've rated it as high
**Senator:** probably. Right. I think that's true, but the only caveat I would have is I just think on a hot summer day, [01:00:00] almost anything we're smoking, we don't want like a really rich Macallan or something with just like a ton of body to it.
Good point. That's fair. On a hot day, I would take this with any cigar.
**Gizmo:** F
**Poobah:** the more I think about it, um, I'd buy this. Yeah, I would too. I I'm actually thinking about it like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Weather's turning. Like I, for 40
**Gizmo:** bucks, I, I may have to buy the
**Senator:** scotch. I mean, imagine sitting in your pool lighting up one of these, and with, with the, with this,
**Poobah:** that's what I was just thinking about.
Oh my God. Yeah. I, I mean, you know, for the money. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's still a. , but we composite, but but it, but it punches above. Yeah. It's, it's it's weight class. Yeah. Little,
**Gizmo:** you know, uh, I totally agree. It's, it's really light in color too, right? It is. Without, I'm seeing that. Yeah. I was worried. It's not
**Bam Bam:** very, I was a little worried about that.
I was, it looked reminiscent to a doe and which is really light, not
**Poobah:** flavorful.
**Rooster:** I mean, that's [01:01:00] kind of typical with
**Senator:** Japanese whiskeys. I think that's what I was just gonna say. So that's the thing. Japanese whiskey, they're all lighter. Even the ones that are like 12 years age, they're lighter. It's a very different style.
That's why I'm very curious. We'll, we'll, I'm sure do Hibiki on another episode.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. We, pagoda, pagoda said he wanted to do that, so we'll do that one here. Yeah. It's
**Senator:** a different style, but it really has a place. And why I am really impressed with this is I, there are not many lighter SCOs that I enjoy. I, I hate Dow Whitney 15.
I've said this many times. I actively hate it. I will not drink it if someone brings it. Um, Glen Ramey, 10 .
**Poobah:** It depends on how bad of a day yet. ?
**Senator:** No. I I really won't. If you walk in his
**Bam Bam:** house with Dawin, he's gonna turn you around and leave. Yeah.
**Senator:** I've had one person bring that here once. There's a reason they're not invited back.
Oh boy. . Oh, anyway. Uh, but the other thing I was gonna say, you know, we did Glen Ramey 10, that's another really light, it's like a pale like straw hay colored, uh, scotch. And I know [01:02:00] Grindr likes that. Um, and especially during the summer, but I, I would drink this over any of the lighter single malts that we've rated.
A
**Poobah:** hundred percent. Yeah. It's pre it's nice. Yeah, it's nice.
**Gizmo:** It's, uh, good pairing. So we're coming to the end here, boys of the Coronas. Claro, what are your, uh, what are your thoughts here before we rate this thing? I'm down
**Bam Bam:** to less than a half inch. Yeah. I'm getting there and I Great steak. Yeah, I could,
**Gizmo:** I want more.
Yeah. I wish I had 10 boxes of these. Yeah, I really do. I really do. Well, prices are going up, so good luck. Yeah. Yeah. Good luck with that . They're,
**Poobah:** they're hard, they're hard to find. Oh, yeah. Oh yeah. They go Isn't at the price of, I've literally seen these go up and five minutes
**Gizmo:** later gone.
**Poobah:** They're gone.
They're gone. They're, yeah. Yeah. I mean, you used to be able to get a box of these for like two 70. Oh boy. It's, oh
**Gizmo:** boy. I've unheard of. Oh
**Rooster:** boy. Now you're looking at like,
**Gizmo:** you know, close to four. If not over now. If not over. Yeah. Yeah. All right, boys, let's do our formal lizza [01:03:00] rating on this thing. The Coronas Sclero Rooster, you're up.
Yeah, I'm
**Rooster:** gonna give it a nine. Excellent. Really good
**Poobah:** stick. . Yeah, I'm with you. It's an, it's a nine for me. The, the, the, the, the, you know, it's, it's, it's sophisticated. It's balanced. It's refined. And I'm shocked at how well it smokes young. I do think it gets better with age, given the one that I had, like anything else.
Uh, but that notwithstanding, this, this, the, uh, you know, you can't, the construction, everything about it, uh, is a, is a really, it's different. It's d it's, it's, it's different. Um, and it's in a really, really good way. Like not in the squash supreme way than, don't hate me cuz I'm saying that. But it's just n it's, it's a be it's just a really balanced, very, very good cigar.
So I, I appreciate, uh, you guys procuring these and, and, and, uh, and sharing them just because that's what it's all about. I, I just, it's. It. I, I really enjoyed [01:04:00] it. So it's a nine for me. I, I really like the cigar, so
**Gizmo:** my love, love the ring gauge too. Oh, the ring gauge. Love
**Poobah:** the size. I mean, the size is wonderful.
It's perfect. There should be more, better cigars in the size. Absolutely. Absolutely. In my opinion.
**Gizmo:** Agree. So I, I've been debating this as we've been discussing it and smoking the cigar. I, to me, again, I, I go back to my earlier comment and I really believe it. I think this is at the top of the, the, the Cuban regular production pyramid.
I just don't know where, uh, what other cigars really perform at this age. At 21, a little over a year old at that are, that are really, really punching, let's call it punching above your weight class, whatever you wanna say. I think this winds up with any other great Cuban that's in regular production. So I'm giving it a 10.
**Bam Bam:** My man. Wow. My man. Wow.
**Gizmo:** I, I g I mean, it's, it's, it's ripe. If, if, again, decimals coming to play, I'm in the middle of that. But it's a 10 all day for me, my man today. .
**Senator:** Okay. For me, um, [01:05:00] it's easily a nine. I think it's an outstanding smoke. I cannot believe how much I love this cigar. Yeah, yeah. Me neither. What I would say, the only reason that I, I didn't give it the 10.
It's not a fault of this cigar. What did you give it? It's a A nine. A nine, okay. It's not a fault of this cigar. The reason it's not a 10 for me is for my palate. Is it like the perfect flavor profile for my palette? No. Is it an absolutely outstanding cigar and like one that I wanna have frequently? Yes.
So, like, you know, a 10 for me is gonna be like, if I could craft my own cigar, this is gonna be the flavor profile. That's the only reason. But I say that because I don't wanna discount this stick. This card did nothing wrong. Yeah. Just for a 10. It's gotta be perfect for my palette, but man, I'm so glad we did this.
**Bam Bam:** Yeah. Excellent. Totally. Nine nine is an elite. That's an elite score. Yeah.
**Poobah:** Yeah. Score. And, and I think that you're not out, this is not the po the point of view expressed here. Is not an, it's not an outlier. These are loved [01:06:00] by, I've never heard a negative thing, a negative comment about the cigar. Totally.
I've never read a negative comment like, oh, it's overrated. They suck. It's all hype. This is bullshit. Where, you know, you see that, you know, there's, even if ours that are polarizing even about
**Gizmo:** D four s, I've seen people say D four is on the bottom of my list, which I don't understand.
**Senator:** Another do I? They're they're out.
Yeah. They're totally
**Gizmo:** out disavow. Yeah, but I've never seen it about dis but
**Poobah:** like, this isn't absolutely, this isn't like a polarizing smoke. Like, like how some cohiba VI are, uh, you know that that's polarizing some, even some um, uh, yeah. Some parus stuff can even be a little bit polarizing. If you're on kind of the other end of the flavor pro spectrum or whatever.
This cigar does not seem to be a polarizing cigar. I think that like you gift this to. , you know, Cuban cigar, glove, they're gonna be like, this was, that's cool. Yeah. Like, they're gonna take it in hand and be like, nice. Like nice. Yeah. You know, almost no matter who you are, because it plays in the [01:07:00] middle, it, it, it, it, it's like, it's got this unique thing, but it's not, it's, it's balanced and it just does, it's, it does nothing wrong.
Absolutely. Right. Right. It just , I, I mean, I touched it up once, only because I was talking and I, you know what I mean? But that if you just keep smoking this, it burns like a razor. I mean, everything is perfect about it. Yeah.
**Bam Bam:** So, I'm, I'm going 10. All right. And I'm going, oh, so
I'm
**Poobah:** sorry. I'm
**Bam Bam:** sorry. No, it's okay.
Sorry. I love the commentary. I'm going 10. And just to piggyback on what you said, from, uh, the, the characteristic, uh, characteristic of being an outlier, it's an outlier from the point of view of the flavor profile. There is no cigar that I've ever had that gives me this flavor. It's just, it's very unusual.
Yep.
**Gizmo:** Yeah. 10. I totally agree. So our composite lizard score on the Coronas Sclero from K Dorsey is a 9.4 boys. Wow. Pretty special smoke. Wow. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. You know, and I, I wanna just say, uh, [01:08:00] comment. Has Grindr had this yet? I mean, I think he would love, so Grinder would love funny.
**Senator:** He would, he love it.
So he has, so, funnily enough, after Grindr, uh, after his baby girl arrived and he was finally able to slip out for a smoke, I think you re, you remember I had sent a, that's right photo that's of him in the lounge here at my place. And the cigar that I gave him after he had his baby was exactly this, because, yeah, that's right.
The first time I had one from Rooster, I thought Grindr would really love this cigar. He
**Poobah:** loved it. Yeah. Loved he loved it. Yeah. I can. Cuz QD is in his wheelhouse.
**Gizmo:** Mm-hmm. . I bet if he was here, he'd give it a 10. You know, and I wanna say one thing about, uh, that Senator said when he, when he was, uh, saying why he gave it a nine and not a 10.
This, to me, in every way, despite the other cigars, I, I prefer and smoke, I guess, on a regular basis because I can get them more frequently. This really is a perfect cigar for me. It's a perfect cigar for my palate. It's interesting, it's different. It's, um, it's, it's sweet. [01:09:00] It's, it's got everything. So it is that for me, that is why it's a tent for me.
I, I would smoke this as much as I possibly could. So, let me ask you a question, .
**Rooster:** So what, what would you do if you had a reserver, like a Reserver? ,
**Gizmo:** like rate it wise. Yeah, I'd smoke it. I don't know. Maybe
**Bam Bam:** take our, maybe take our clothes off. It's so good. .
**Gizmo:** I d don't have to give it an 11. Yeah, maybe.
**Senator:** Well, that's cool.
I'm very doubtful of that. I think I'd throw it in the Lake . I'm sorry. Like I, I just don't love cohiba flavors, so I, I, I, I mean, not just Cohiba,
**Rooster:** even this, a lot of other
**Senator:** reserves. Oh, if it's a RGUs Reserve, yeah. I'll, I'll be, uh, bam. And I'll both have our clothes off. Oh yeah. .
**Bam Bam:** Yeah. Yeah. I'd be chasing all of you around the room.
And you'd be running for your lives. .
**Gizmo:** That's a horrible visual. It is. It's
**Poobah:** horrible, horrible visual. I'm gonna sue you for
**Bam Bam:** trauma
**Gizmo:** Mental, uh, mental anguish. Heard from Mental anguish, PTSD [01:10:00] trauma. Ptsd. Uh, all right, boys. A 9.4 for the K dors SE Coronas Sclero. So glad we did this tonight. What a smoke. Don't, don't buy them.
Yeah, we don't buy our recommendation. They're all, they're all fake. . Yeah. You don't want 'em, . If you do find any, send them to us. Just email me, I'll give you the address. We'll take 'em off your hands. No problem. All right boys, awesome cigar. And, uh, we'll see you next week. Keep smoking. Thanks so much for joining us tonight.
Hope you enjoyed it. Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. If you have any comments, questions, if you wanna reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking, email us Lounge lizards pod, p o d, that's lounge lizards pod gmail.com. You can also find us on Instagram at Lounge Lizards Pod.
We really appreciate your time and we'll, uh, we'll see you next [01:11:00] week.