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Released every Tuesday, the LOUNGE LIZARDS podcast helps listeners navigate the experience of finding and enjoying premium cigars (both Cuban and non-Cuban) and quality spirits. Episodes are normally around 90 minutes long and feature a variety of different topics including food, travel, life, sports and work.
The podcast features eight members: Rooster, Poobah, Gizmo, Senator, Pagoda, Chef Ricky, Grinder and Bam Bam.
This is not your typical cigar podcast. We’re a group of friends who love sharing cigars, whiskey and a good laugh.
Join us and become a card-carrying lounge lizard yourself! Email us at hello@loungelizardspod.com to join the conversation and be featured on an upcoming episode!
Welcome to the Lounge Lizard podcast presented by Fabric of Five. It's so good to have you here. It's a leisure and lifestyle podcast founded on our love of premium cigars as well as whiskey travel, food, work, and whatever else we feel like getting into. My name is Gizmo. Tonight, I'm joined by Rooster, senator, chef Ricky, and Bam Bam on a plan to smoke a cigar, drink some bourbon, talk about life, and, of course, have some laughs.
Gizmo:So take this as your two hundred and twenty fourth official invitation to join us and become a card carrying lounge lizard. Mix here once a week. We're gonna smoke a Nicaraguan cigar tonight, share our thoughts on it, and give you a formal lizard rating. We discuss the postponement of the Habanos Festival. We debate the future of Cuban tobacco, and we share the importance of lounge and shop owner hospitality all among a variety of other things for the next two hours.
Gizmo:So sit back, get your favorite drink, light up a cigar, enjoy as we pair 12 years age Knob Creek, Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey with the Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust Sobre Mesa, Salida Red. A Gran Corona from Nicaragua on the pod tonight, boys, and it's from Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust. It's called the Sobremesa Salida Red, and it's a 46 ring gauge cigar by six and one quarter inches long. And boys, rooster's already at a nine because
Bam Bam:Yeah. I guess so.
Gizmo:This has a pigtail.
Rooster:That's two points right there. This is like a rat tail.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Alright. Three points. Steve is back in the room.
Gizmo:He's back in the room. It's been A bit. Thirty weeks or so, about half a year since we did the last one from Steve Sock on this podcast. And the reason why we're bringing this one in is this is beloved Industry wide, we're gonna talk about how it did on some other lists and stuff, but people are loving this cigar.
Bam Bam:What are you guys getting on the wrapper? Because for me, it's a very strong pungent aroma.
Senator:I mean, I'm just getting, like, strong Nicaraguan tobacco.
Bam Bam:It's more like I'm getting like a black licorice type thing for me.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. It's a little acidic for me. I'm getting some acidity on here.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Chef Ricky:Almost vinegar like. Yes. Like a very sweet vinegar.
Bam Bam:Steve, you better not fuck this up tonight, boy.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's cut this thing.
Senator:Our cease and desist just expired after the creme brulee.
Bam Bam:It's reinstated.
Gizmo:So we do have a footband on here. It's gonna have to
Rooster:come off. What do you guys think of a rapper?
Chef Ricky:Dark. Very dark.
Bam Bam:Very Liga nine esque.
Gizmo:It's like a dark chocolate bar. My draw is great.
Bam Bam:My draw is a touch
Senator:Yeah. Mine is tight.
Gizmo:Mine's, like, just perfectly resistant. I'm gonna live with it.
Bam Bam:The heat should open it up.
Gizmo:I think you'll be fine. Very flavorful cold draw.
Bam Bam:Yeah, but it's almost identical to the aroma of the wrapper for me. Like Chef said, it's a bit acidic, little black licorice thing.
Gizmo:I'm getting some berry there.
Senator:I'm not sure if I'm liking this right now.
Gizmo:You haven't even lit it, Bam. I know.
Senator:Tell us about the turpentine in your glass too while you're
Bam Bam:at it. That's damn right as well.
Chef Ricky:Oh, that's going be the case. This is probably somewhere in the fifties.
Bam Bam:Hope you guys had some dinner tonight.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's light this thing. The Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust Sobremesa Solita Red. And again, it's a 46 ring gauge cigar by six and one quarter inches long.
Bam Bam:The dimension is beautiful. Love this size.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. Feels really good in the hump. Yeah. Yeah.
Gizmo:It's a little bit bigger than a Corona Gorda. This is my first cigar in four days, boys. So I'm very excited to be here with
Bam Bam:you, Tony. That's surprising coming from you and
Gizmo:then I've been a little busy.
Bam Bam:The jar right off the light is actually pretty good. Very flavorful.
Chef Ricky:It's been a week for me. Made me grab some extra cigars.
Gizmo:That's nice on the light. Full flavored cigar. Definitely Nicaraguan. I don't think we'd have any problem calling that out blind.
Bam Bam:Rooster is going to put some hair on the bottom of your feet when you're done with it.
Gizmo:Let's see. Wow. A lot of flavor there.
Rooster:Well, don't think it's that full. The flavor is Really? But the body
Bam Bam:The body?
Rooster:There's not a lot of strength.
Senator:Yeah, I agree with Rooster. It's smooth, it's flavorful, no question, but I'm not getting a ton of strength.
Chef Ricky:No? I'm getting some tingly on my tongue. For me, that usually means strength. Bingo.
Bam Bam:It must be.
Senator:Mean, Giz, do you find this to be strong in strength?
Gizmo:No. I should have said full in flavor was what I was meaning. I don't think it's like a nicotine kick right now.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I meant full in flavor, but definitely more mediums medium full for me in body as well. That's for me. I'm not accustomed to this.
Gizmo:It's just it it has those classic Nicaraguan like those that it's like really, really deep chocolate and combined with earth, combined with a little espresso, maybe a little cedar there.
Chef Ricky:Yeah, no sweetness. No sweetness. No sweetness present.
Gizmo:As of right now. Which is fine for me.
Chef Ricky:I'd love a little, just for the sake of balance. Right now it's very deep, dark and rich. I
Senator:mean, get cocoa though. Definitely cocoa.
Chef Ricky:But it's like there's cocoa powder, not like
Senator:chocolate. But like with a faint bit of sweetness. I wouldn't say there's no sweetness.
Bam Bam:I agree with that, and definitely on the retro. Actually, a traditional draw, I'm getting that typical cocoa powder. If you ever put your nose in a deep rich powder of cocoa, that's what I'm getting.
Rooster:Or like bitter chocolate, like a This dark bitter chocolate
Chef Ricky:is so earthy, I'm getting mushroom on the retrohale.
Bam Bam:That's there too. I get some mushroom.
Chef Ricky:I'm getting mushroom on the retrohale.
Bam Bam:Touching minerality.
Chef Ricky:Like a salty No, I'm getting like freshly harvested fucking cremini mushroom or something like that, not even complex mushrooms.
Bam Bam:Not much salt for me though.
Gizmo:I do really like the retrohale.
Bam Bam:I do too, it's nice.
Gizmo:Very smooth.
Bam Bam:Surprisingly smooth. Yeah. Like easy. Yeah. And it's cocoa y.
Gizmo:And very flavorful. Yep. And what I like about the cigars we've had of Saka's, unlike a lot of other purveyors who put out you know, Nicaraguan puros. This is not a Nicaraguan puro, but it's pretty much as close as you can get to it. Right?
Gizmo:Yeah. It doesn't hit you with that pepper bomb on the light.
Bam Bam:And I will
Gizmo:say He's not a pepper bomb punch in the face guy.
Bam Bam:Sure. What rooster's drinking with this is
Rooster:a
Gizmo:perfect I was do how you feel that?
Rooster:I was just gonna say that.
Bam Bam:Because I know shit.
Rooster:You do know shit.
Senator:From one old boy to another. Correct.
Bam Bam:Guinness would taste delicious with this thing.
Gizmo:So, Rooster, what are you drinking? Guinness Zero?
Rooster:Guinness Zero, and it is delicious. I think a stout would absolutely pair real
Bam Bam:No good doubt, with this yeah. A
Chef Ricky:porter, an oatmeal stout, something like that would go really good with this. Yeah, absolutely. Now did you pick that because of what we were smoking today or you were just in the mood for
Rooster:Everything I do is well planned. Should've known
Chef Ricky:that. Can't wait to reach that level of wisdom. Oh, it's quite
Bam Bam:You've got forty more years. Yeah.
Rooster:According to BAM, one hundred and fifty.
Bam Bam:Correct old chap.
Gizmo:This is really good. Yeah. Like the flavor profile. I'm really happy right now.
Chef Ricky:It's opened up. It's opened up.
Bam Bam:How much is this?
Gizmo:So this cigar, you can it's it's MSRP. Let's put it this way. It's MSRP is just a touch under 18. At small batch with our code, you can get these for about $16.50. So a box of 13, these come in boxes of 13.
Gizmo:MSRP on those is $2.33. With our code, you can get it for about $2.15.
Bam Bam:This should be a very nice end of evening smoke.
Rooster:Or a morning smoke. First thing in the morning.
Senator:Babe's faces. You said that
Bam Bam:with a black Are you serious, Ben?
Gizmo:Black coffee. Yeah. I don't
Rooster:think this has strength.
Gizmo:Agree. I
Rooster:This has a lot of flavor, but this is not like a Padron ninetieth. That has strength.
Gizmo:Is super There
Bam Bam:are no rough edges. Would
Rooster:think If you're that looking for a fuller cigar after a decent heavy breakfast
Bam Bam:Well, this is the fit the
Rooster:is excellent.
Gizmo:This is
Bam Bam:a great post dinner cigar, end of evening cigar, great winter cigar next to the fireplace. I think this is any time of year. Yeah. Summertime, Yeah. You'd light this up?
Bam Bam:Would you
Senator:have a Padron in the summer?
Bam Bam:Yes. This is wow. And to me, there's no reason
Senator:not to have this. I think a
Rooster:Padron is Padron Exclusivo is fuller than
Senator:I agree. Yeah.
Bam Bam:But for me, it's so for me, it's I'm getting a much that gives me a smoother experience than what I'm getting tonight.
Rooster:This is very I
Bam Bam:don't get the smoothness that you guys are getting.
Rooster:I think that gives you a sweetness you're not getting from this. There's little bit of sweetness, but there's
Bam Bam:more sweetness in that for sure.
Chef Ricky:I think it's going to open up. Mine's even lightened up a little bit. It's gotten a little sweeter. It's not as earthy and
Bam Bam:dark as
Chef Ricky:as it was in the beginning.
Bam Bam:I'm not taking my typical deep draws on this for sure. Pretty shallow draws.
Chef Ricky:And you said your jaw was a little tight, right?
Bam Bam:It's opening up. It's fine.
Senator:Mine was tight and now it's perfect.
Bam Bam:Yep. Yep.
Senator:I'll just say because it hasn't been said that the wrapper on this looks really, really good. Not veiny, very smooth.
Bam Bam:Tight seams.
Senator:Well rolled, really well constructed. A plus presentation wise.
Gizmo:Agreed. So let's talk about the makeup of this cigar, boys. Like I said, it's coming out of Nicaragua tonight like all soccer cigars do. The rapporteur the wrapper is Ecuadorian Habano. The binder is San Andres Negro from Mexico, and the filler is from Nicaragua and USA, Pennsylvania.
Bam Bam:Your neck of the woods.
Gizmo:My neck of the woods. This is really nice, man.
Bam Bam:It's got a good rapador on it.
Gizmo:Gorgeous. I I must I'd like to know. I'm gonna count how many words I say in an episode.
Bam Bam:That's a pretty good one, actually. Rapidor. Rapidor.
Senator:You know
Gizmo:what? I saw Ecuador. My my eyes were ahead of my mouth. You know?
Chef Ricky:It's great. He saved you the edit because now you gotta keep that
Gizmo:Now I gotta keep it. Soda. Exactly. So, boys, sobremesa means over the table, And this is the third one that we're doing on the podcast tonight. Obviously, Steve Saka uses that name, Sobramesas, for a lot of different lines.
Gizmo:So this specific Soleda Red was a special limited production of the Soleda line that is crafted a touch stronger and then is aged a year before it's put out. So what's cool about this is that one of the other Sobremeses we did was the Cervantes Fino. We did long, long time ago. It was discontinued shortly after we did it in October 2023. This cigar effectively replaced it.
Gizmo:According to Steve Saka, he says, my to my palate, the Salida red is superior to my beloved Cervantes Fino. It retains all the nuances of Dutch pressed cocoa, Indian Ceylon cinnamon, and anise with a sweet clover honey finish, just heavier in body with more depth.
Bam Bam:Pretty spot on. I think so.
Rooster:Yeah. There is a baking spice. I just couldn't tell whether if it's nutmeg ish or cinnamon.
Bam Bam:More nutmeg than cinnamon for me for sure.
Senator:Yeah. I agree with that.
Gizmo:Yeah. So the original Sobremesa line, as we talked about, I think on that first episode when we did Sobremesa, came out in 2015. And then in November '24, Steve announced this variant of Sobremesa Solita. Again, the Solita red, the blend is made up of a dark Rosado grade one Ecuadorian Habano wrapper. So I didn't note that before.
Gizmo:Mhmm. Dark Rosado grade one. So I guess if we put this in the light, we're gonna see kind of that dark red hue to it. Which we love. Which is awesome.
Gizmo:Yeah.
Senator:Alright. Let's get our flashlights out.
Bam Bam:Okay. Let's give it a try.
Gizmo:We're technical here, Ben.
Bam Bam:Correct,
Gizmo:though. Yeah. That's really nice looking.
Bam Bam:Yeah. It's beautiful.
Chef Ricky:Oh, that is.
Gizmo:So I'm happy that we're back to Dunbarton. So the reason why we're doing this specific cigar is this ended up on Half Wheels number 13 cigar of the year. It ended up as number two on the consensus, which if you remember is where Half Wheels takes all of the media that's not related to a retail operation, takes all the media ratings, puts it all together. This was number two consensus for 2020. This specific cigar.
Bam Bam:Nice.
Gizmo:And finally, it was Half Wheels Reader's Choice winner for 2025. So the readers that voted voted on this one.
Bam Bam:There's some density to this. Pretty dense tobacco. I think it commands a little respect. You're smoking it a little slower than a typical cigar.
Rooster:It's also burning slow.
Bam Bam:And it burns slow so I think there's a lot of value. You're getting a lot for your money
Senator:with those characteristics. I'm just amazed how smooth the delivery of this much flavor is in this cigar. The blend is really, really good. That is excellent. And I'm now, like, I don't know, quarter of an inch in, like, now starting to get some sweet notes that are popping up, which is great.
Gizmo:How would you describe the sweet notes? He called them honey.
Senator:To me, it's more like
Rooster:Like a
Senator:sweet It's more sugar than honey. Sweet or cocoa? I'm just trying to think of how to describe the type of sugar that I'm getting.
Chef Ricky:It's like agave nectar. It's like a good in between where agave nectar is a little sweetener.
Rooster:I'm not
Bam Bam:sure if it's an agave nectar, but that nectar concept I think kind of feels right.
Chef Ricky:Nectar of what? I don't know. So you can't just stick with my agave nectar? No.
Senator:I don't know. For me, it's a lighter, simpler sugar. If you sprinkled some sugar on something, it's a very simple, light sweetness.
Bam Bam:Almost, I don't know, like a rock candy type thing, if you've ever had that, and you put that in your cocoa, that's kind of what I'm getting. Yeah. That rock candy does have some nuances of like a honey type thing, depending on the type of rock candy, so that could be fairly accurate. But I'm not getting honey.
Rooster:Or maybe like caramelized sugar.
Bam Bam:Maybe. There you go.
Gizmo:What other sizes does this come in? So this specific cigar only comes in this size. The Salida red is a one off in this size.
Bam Bam:Brilliant size. Good Vitola.
Gizmo:So there's also a Salida Churchill and Cedros in in Cedar. There's a Salida Toro, Salida Robusto, and a Salida short Churchill. The Salida red is a little bit more of a step up in oomph, I think.
Senator:I wonder why he decided just one Botola for this.
Rooster:I don't know. Maybe the rapper is hard to find or lucky.
Gizmo:Or maybe he just wanted to offer his cigar smokers that like something a little bit more full. Mhmm. Offer them something in the line. Because I I find that the other cigars that we've done with the Sobremesa name on it and even the Cincompromiso, they're not really
Bam Bam:No. That full. No.
Gizmo:No. They're more medium, I would say.
Bam Bam:I find it interesting that this Vitola is delivering so much flavor just visually. You don't expect it.
Senator:Sorry, I think the Cincompre Miso is definitely medium full.
Gizmo:That's fair. I haven't had one of those cigars in a while. Really enjoy that. I should look back at that one.
Bam Bam:They are good. This has given me a lot of value. I kind of like this a lot.
Gizmo:I do too. I gotta say. I'm shocked at how slow it's actually burning.
Bam Bam:Yeah. That's that's very cool.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's talk about some news. First up, very, very excited about this. We have a Lounge Lizards 98 plus rated cigars sampler at smallbatchcigar.com. Correct.
Gizmo:So it has six cigars in it. I'll run through them. The Kellner LE 80, the My Father MF Blue in Toro, the Avowed New Dawn in Toro, the Stoic Encourage, the original one, the Aladino Cameroon in Robusto, and the Aladino 85 in Robusto. So six cigars.
Bam Bam:Prime time lineup, boys.
Gizmo:And what's crazy is this is the first time that I'm mentioning this on air. We have not said this on air yet. It was put up on Instagram, and I know some folks found it. They emailed us. It is currently sold out.
Senator:Wow. Incredible. That's insane.
Gizmo:So I'm hoping that by the time this hits air It's
Bam Bam:organic in the way that happened.
Gizmo:Absolutely. I mean, I'm hoping by the time this hits air that our listeners out there, Lizard Nation, can go on and get more of these samplers. I think it's a killer sample sampler. It's a great price. It's a $125 for those six cigars.
Gizmo:Plus, you can use our code and get 15% off plus free shipping. So I really, really encourage all of our listeners to run out and get it. If you can't email small batch and and ask them when it's coming back, we really, really love your support. And I can't like I said, I can't believe it's sold out. I I didn't know that until I just looked at it now.
Bam Bam:That's very cool.
Senator:So this is Nothing gets by lizard nation.
Bam Bam:Correct.
Rooster:Did you did you know they were doing this?
Gizmo:Yeah. So I didn't know that they were putting it together until Dave sent it to me and said, hey, what do you think of this? And then he and I made a few tweaks to make it 98 plus. I think it was originally gonna be like a 92 plus. Made a couple tweaks, went 98 plus, and that's the sampler that came out.
Gizmo:So I think what this is gonna be is an ongoing collection of cigars that we rate very highly that are available at smallbatchcigar.com. So, you know, I'm hoping maybe twice a year, a couple of times a year we're going to refresh this sampler. Yeah. Or create iterations of it as we go because the only one out of that sampler right here that's limited is the LE 80. So once that's gone, it's gone, of course.
Gizmo:Mhmm. But as we as we continue to go through cigars and rate them well, the ones that are available at small batch hopefully will end up in samplers. That's incredible.
Senator:I mean, cool part of that is there are not many samplers you're going to get a $60 cigar in.
Bam Bam:That's correct. You're not going to get a sampler full of highly rated cigars.
Gizmo:Right? So I was very proud of that and I'm even more proud that it's sold out because it's one of the only samplers on their website right now that's completely sold out. That's cool. Pretty cool. So thank you to Lizard Nation out there.
Gizmo:We really appreciate the support. Alright, boys. Let's go to another news story now. This one, we don't love to see it, but it happens fairly regularly. Placencia has suffered has suffered a barn fire in Nicaragua.
Gizmo:I saw that. So one of the large curing barns in Esteli on the Placencia farm caught fire a couple Fridays ago. Allegedly, it was near Finca El Tuco, which is one of their more high profile farms. Thankfully, nobody was hurt. However, a lot of tobacco was lost.
Gizmo:So, apparently, they issued a statement saying that no injuries have been reported, and they expressed their sincere gratitude to the Esteli fire department and all first responders for their swift action and professionalism. The company also expressed its appreciation, and I love this, of the immediate support offered by fellow manufacturers and members of the Esteli cigar community. Quote, the solidarity and willingness to assist reflect the spirit of collaboration that defines the region's tobacco industry.
Bam Bam:Very nice.
Gizmo:So it's cool. I did see that our friend Rafael Nadal put up a note. They were helping AJ Fernandez was helping Placencia. You know, there were some other companies as they as they noted here that were helping. I just think that's great because you know, we saw what happened at AJ Fernandez's factory last year, and obviously they got a lot of help from other companies in the area.
Gizmo:So it's nice to see that even though that these people are competitors, they're still helping each other in the face of of these different kinds of adversity. So very unfortunate that that tobacco was lost, but thankfully, nobody was hurt. So I am very happy that by the time this episode comes out, I will have been at the Pro Cigar Festival in the Dominican Republic Cool. With Pagoda. He and I are going.
Senator:And Pagoda's still there. Correct.
Gizmo:He never came home. So I'm very excited about it. We're going to all the events, the white party, the gala dinners, bunch of factory stuff. So Nice. We're going with the friend our friends from La Aurora.
Gizmo:So we're very thankful to those guys for bringing us along. So I'm very excited to report back how it goes.
Bam Bam:You're wear a button down?
Gizmo:I am. I'm pretty much only taking button downs.
Senator:I can't wait to see Gizen all white for the white part.
Rooster:By the
Gizmo:way, I have I have an awesome all white setup.
Bam Bam:Are you gonna bring an all white hoodie?
Gizmo:No. Okay. You're gonna be very impressed with what I wear.
Bam Bam:Oh, I know I will.
Rooster:Tell us.
Bam Bam:Do you have white sneakers?
Senator:I do. White Under Armour shorts.
Bam Bam:There you go.
Gizmo:Of course. You got a white And of course, my white ass legs.
Bam Bam:How about a white white white beater?
Gizmo:There you go.
Bam Bam:Alright.
Gizmo:Maybe I'll just do that on top with the shorts. Oh, yeah. And the white
Bam Bam:For the night event.
Gizmo:Yeah. For the evening for the gala dinner.
Rooster:Exactly. With a blazer.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. It's time now to go to our pairing.
Bam Bam:K.
Gizmo:We have the twelve years aged Knob Creek Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey on the pod tonight Sent in by an old friend of ours, Lizard O in California. And cheers, boys.
Bam Bam:I have to say Yeah. The aroma when you get your nose close to the spirit is off the charts incredible. It's really nice. Heavy vanilla, caramel, butterscotch. Toffee like.
Bam Bam:Wow. Very, very Drinks that way. Smooth. Cheers.
Gizmo:Cheers, gentlemen. Cheers.
Bam Bam:Very nice. You're gulping, chef. You're out.
Chef Ricky:I was excited.
Bam Bam:Do we have any ice in
Senator:the room? It is hot. Yeah.
Gizmo:So it's bottled and bond 50%.
Bam Bam:You gotta take small sips, let it cool in
Gizmo:your mouth.
Chef Ricky:I'm just
Gizmo:gonna have to adjust.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Yeah. It's very flavorful. I'm not opposed to it, honestly, but this is quite a long drink.
Senator:Does this have enough structure for you, chef?
Chef Ricky:Oh, yeah.
Bam Bam:It's like burning the whiskers off his face. I'm loving it.
Chef Ricky:I'm loving it. I think it's gonna do really well. I I tell you what, it would have done really well with the very first third of the cigar. Let's see how it does now because right now I'm feeling the cigars really creamy and nutty. And let's see how it goes with the spirit.
Chef Ricky:Wow. It's pairing.
Bam Bam:It's a bit overpowering right now.
Chef Ricky:The finish is long. The finish is there for days.
Gizmo:I will say I think this is a wonderful companion for this cigar. I think it's very complimentary.
Bam Bam:I don't know. I'll tell you why. Why? The finish is so long and strong.
Gizmo:On the cigar? No.
Bam Bam:On the spirit. On you have to wait. I think I just took a puff after a drink. I couldn't tell what I was getting from the cigar because it was just so overpowering.
Chef Ricky:I had that experience last week with the scotch.
Bam Bam:Yeah? Yeah. I think you have to wait for that finish to dissipate.
Chef Ricky:It's going to take a minute for the palate and the olfactory to adjust to the heat here.
Bam Bam:Not that I'm opposed to this drink, it's very flavorful,
Rooster:but
Bam Bam:I don't know about the pairing.
Senator:I think the only challenge for me is the flavor profile of the bourbon pairs well, but just the strength of this bourbon, the finish being so long, like Ben was saying, that's where starts to compete with the cigar. Definitely. Very accurate.
Bam Bam:That's happening right now.
Gizmo:I think it's pretty damn good.
Chef Ricky:I think it's delicious, but if this were used to make an old fashioned, it'd be the perfect pairing with this stick.
Bam Bam:You're still able to discern notes on your cigar after that drink?
Gizmo:I am. I'm sipping it very lightly. I'm taking a
Bam Bam:Me little too.
Senator:He's getting notes of Knob Creek.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I mean, honestly, that's what's happening. I can't say that it's bad. I'm enjoying both, but I can have this drink without a cigar and be very satisfied because of how flavorful it is.
Senator:Yeah, this is like a great after dinner Totally.
Bam Bam:I'm surprised actually. So I
Gizmo:will say another nice thing I like about this bourbon, price point on it is 65 Nice. So for a twelve year aged bourbon with an age statement on it, $65 is pretty damn good. Yeah. And it's very accessible.
Senator:Yeah. What's Weller 12? 200? Mean, $2.50?
Gizmo:It's crazy. But that's also secondary. Think if you actually get it from a retailer at the right price, I'm sure it's touching 100 maybe.
Bam Bam:You know, the good thing here is we're rating each item separately. I'm not always rating the pairing. We don't do that, right? I think that
Senator:Tell everybody that.
Bam Bam:I know. That has its merits, the drink has its merits, and the cigar definitely has its merits. Just may not be together. Now that said, senator, what would you pair this incredibly strong drink with?
Senator:Mean, for me, like a a really full bodied cigar. So, like, I think a lot of, like, Padron family reserve cigars would pair really well with this. The Padron ninetieth for sure would pair well with this. A Liga nine might pair well with this.
Bam Bam:Maybe,
Senator:yeah. Like truly full cigars.
Rooster:Like a La Flor Dominicana chisel.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Oh man, Lord. You may not survive that pairing. What about you, Giz?
Gizmo:I'm loving it, man. Mhmm. Honestly, I think it's a fine pairing. I I do hear what you're saying with the heat of of the spirit, but for me, it's pairing very nicely with the cigar. I've I've been retrohaling quite a bit.
Gizmo:Me too. I'm getting a lot from the retrohale. Yeah. The drink is not killing the palate such that I'm not tasting the cigar.
Bam Bam:I'd like to hear what Lizard O pairs with this spirit.
Rooster:He smokes a lot of Cuban cigars.
Bam Bam:I am not having a Cuban cigar with this thing. Mm-mm. That's not happening.
Rooster:I don't
Gizmo:think he
Chef Ricky:do that. I don't think
Rooster:he smokes a lot of New World.
Bam Bam:A lot of
Rooster:guys in around town.
Gizmo:Lot of folks out there in Lizard Nation are drinking bourbon as their primary pairing for every cigar, including Cuban.
Senator:How can I you hear that, but like with a Cuban cigar, I don't know how you're ideally reaching for like a 100 proof bourbon as opposed to like an 80 proof bourbon?
Bam Bam:It's impossible to have a Cuban cigar with this. Maybe the Maduro one by Partagas.
Chef Ricky:For the sake of pairing, it might be a bit much, but if they're accustomed to this drink and it's what they enjoy, that's why they drink it.
Rooster:But do you find your palate kind of adjusting to this as you take sips Is as you go each sip getting?
Senator:It's getting better, but it's still a lot. So for me, what I've started to do that's actually helped a lot, I mean, the finish is so long, I'm taking now the smallest sips, and that's helping
Gizmo:That's what I've been doing the whole time. Very little sips.
Rooster:Very little sips. Any water? Anybody? Yet.
Bam Bam:I was
Chef Ricky:gonna say we don't know what lizard o, if he drinks this on the rocks.
Gizmo:I think he drinks it neat. Neat? In a Glencairn glass.
Chef Ricky:Look
Senator:at you, Giz. Alright.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. So this is tricky because you have to take a small only
Senator:took five years. I'm impressed you pronounced it correctly.
Gizmo:It only took five years.
Chef Ricky:You have to take a small enough sip where you don't get overpowered by the heat, but large enough where you actually get flavor. Because if not, you're just left with the flavor of the heat. You're not getting any of the sweet nuances that the bourbon offers. And that's where I think the pairing shines. So it's it's kind of in between.
Chef Ricky:You got to be careful. But I could see this if you're drinking it with ice, God forbid, I could see it might tame it a little bit and maybe pull out some of that sweetness.
Bam Bam:It may adulterate it. Water or ice. It's kind of standing on its own two legs nicely.
Senator:I do really love the flavor on the finish of this burger.
Gizmo:Me too. So do I.
Bam Bam:Me too.
Gizmo:It's delicious. Is like mouth watering. You wanna keep reaching for it.
Bam Bam:Correct. Yeah.
Gizmo:Which of course then gets dangerous. Correct. So boys, we're coming to the end of the first third here on the Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust Sobremesa, Soleda Red. What's everybody thinking?
Bam Bam:I can no longer taste it.
Gizmo:Stop it.
Bam Bam:It's an excellent cigar.
Gizmo:I think right now my favorite part of this is the retrohale. I have been retroing almost every draw, if not every other. Yeah. It's just creamy, so flavorful. All the senses are being hit.
Bam Bam:Yeah. And it goes through
Chef Ricky:the nose.
Rooster:That's the
Bam Bam:cigars I said. I think the traditional draw is just as good as the retro for me.
Rooster:My cigar actually got very tight, and then it opened up. But it took a few draws. And I took another cut, but it just opened up. For maybe about half an inch, it was very tight.
Gizmo:I don't know what was going on.
Senator:I think the flavor is outstanding, honestly. Agreed.
Gizmo:I do too. This is excellent.
Senator:Smooth, full flavored. This is as good of a Nicaraguan blend as you'll find.
Bam Bam:Keeps your attention. That's for sure. You know what I would love to pair this with is the Abuelo seven.
Senator:Pam's gonna say this every episode.
Bam Bam:I am. I'm in love with that rum. I can't stand how good that stuff is. Tell me this wouldn't go great with that.
Senator:Have you talk about that and Pooba about g four. Alright.
Chef Ricky:Speaking of which, did g four come up in the last meeting?
Bam Bam:Hello, my name is Love By
Gizmo:the way, for listeners out there, we did see Pooba, what was it, a week ago? Yeah. At the North Lounge. We had a great evening hanging out with Bubba.
Bam Bam:He There
Gizmo:he sends his best. Alright. He can't wait to get back. He's in Florida, I think 90% of the time now, it seems. But he's very well, and he sends his best to all of lizard nation out there.
Gizmo:We had a good time, man. We had some great food, great cigars.
Bam Bam:Cool.
Gizmo:Great drinks. Their pores up there are unbelievable. Yep. So, yeah, it was a really good night. Pagoda made it too.
Gizmo:Rooster made it.
Rooster:Yep. It was nice to see Pooba.
Bam Bam:That's awesome.
Rooster:It had been a while.
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Chef Ricky:If I wasn't stuck at the restaurant, I would have showed up with a gift bottle of G four just for
Bam Bam:him. Alright.
Rooster:You would
Senator:have loved that.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's go to some more news now. This one I think is obvious that we're gonna discuss it. The Habanos Festival has been, quote, indefinitely postponed.
Bam Bam:I wonder why.
Gizmo:So we'll go through their statement here and then we'll talk about it. The organizing committee of the Habanos Festival announces the postponement of its next edition, which, by the way, was supposed to start on February 23, with the aim of preserving the highest standard standards of quality, excellence, and experience that characterize this international event. The Habanos Festival is an emblematic meeting that brings together fans, experts, distributors, and specialized media from all over the world every year to celebrate the culture, tradition, and prestige of the Habano. The decision to postpone it seeks to guarantee an optimal environment for the full development of all its activities, presentations, and experiences. This sounds like.
Gizmo:The priority of the Habanos Festival is to offer its participants a comprehensive experience at the height of the relevance and prestige that this event represents internationally. The postponement of its celebration is a measure aimed to protecting the experience and guaranteeing its excellence. The organizing committee is currently working on setting a new date, which will be announced in a timely fashion through the official channels of the Habanos Festival. The organization appreciates the understanding and continued support of distributors, sponsors, media, and fans, and reaffirms its commitment to return with an addition that honors the tradition, passion, and legacy of the Habano.
Rooster:Do you think they would ever consider having it outside of Cuba? I think they're gonna have to. I mean,
Gizmo:I I don't see a situation in which, in the near term, it's gonna make sense to put it back there.
Bam Bam:You know, infrastructure issues, financial issues
Gizmo:Ethical issues.
Bam Bam:Sociological. Everything is now coming to a point where everything in that country is completely affected and will never be the same.
Rooster:Yeah. They should do it in Panama.
Senator:I'll be there.
Gizmo:Yeah. I think if they're gonna do it anywhere, it would probably be in Dubai or Hong Kong or even That would the make sense. But it is crazy. I mean, we've talked so much about this coming. We knew this was coming.
Gizmo:Right? I mean, we knew it was gonna happen with everything going on in Cuba. We've talked a lot about what's going on in Cuba. But to see it on paper, to see the festival postponed, effectively canceled, would say. Correct.
Rooster:It's pretty wild.
Gizmo:Yeah. And to me, it's really telling a bigger story that's much bigger than cigars.
Bam Bam:It's reality.
Gizmo:Because for the you know, ownership group of Habanos, which is half owned by the Cuban government, for them to admit that they are unable to put on the festival you know, and listen, if they could put it on and sacrifice a couple things, they would absolutely do it. I mean, remember when we went to the Partagas Festival that first night
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Gizmo:A few years ago and the entree was, I think, a spam with a pineapple on a stick?
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:Like, they're not worried about the quality of
Chef Ricky:the Serious?
Gizmo:Oh, yeah. Yes. Am I wrong?
Bam Bam:No. You're not wrong.
Gizmo:Wow. It was pretty brutal. So my point in saying that is if they could have done absolutely anything to make this happen, I think they would have made it happen. So the idea that they're admitting that it's this bad to cancel what is really for the Cuban government a major tourism event, which they are desperately in need of, you know, cash infusion, you know, bringing hard currency to the island, this admission is pretty huge. Sad.
Gizmo:So the question I have for you guys, and I really wanna I wanna hear your thoughts on this. I've I've had two real questions that have been brewing in my mind. Number one, start here. What do you think happens to the Habanos Festival? Do you think like BAM said, does it happen outside of the country?
Gizmo:Does it happen again in Havana? Will it ever happen again?
Chef Ricky:I think it has to happen, and it's gonna happen outside of the country.
Bam Bam:I think it would be preferred to stay within the boundaries, probably not until after all this dust settles, and that could be a very, very long time.
Gizmo:It could be never.
Bam Bam:Who knows? No one knows.
Rooster:Ideally, you want it to be in Cuba. You want it in Havana. You want people to experience that, which is a very special place to have it in. But currently, and the way the situation is and we don't see that situation changing anytime soon. So until then, how can they have it?
Rooster:I think they'll probably just not have it for a while.
Senator:I don't know. I don't think this is a question of like, what's ideal? Like, they need this. Right? Like, literally need this.
Senator:So I think in the immediate term, while it's not ideal, they're gonna have to do this somewhere else. The amount of money that they raised just from that auction alone is huge for them.
Gizmo:It's like what? It's in the double digit millions, right? $1,015,000,000, something like
Senator:They have to figure something out as far as a short term solution, but long term, why I don't think it could ever stay outside of Cuba is because since they need this, the tourism part of it is huge as well. Yep. And so it's like they can't just leave all that money on the table that would be flowing into hotels and Airbnbs and restaurants. I mean, Factory tour. I mean, people do all kinds of stuff there.
Senator:So I think long term, they're gonna have to figure out a way eventually to be able to do it, you know, back in Havana. And, you know, to Gizmo's point, there's not a high bar for what needs to be in place for them to try to pull it off there. But in the immediate term, there's no question they're not gonna be able to do it there.
Gizmo:I mean, I think really at the baseline of this, what they're admitting is that they do not feel that they are capable to provide sufficient housing, food, water, and travel Power. And power to three or 4,000 people coming in. And these are not casual, you know, religious organizations from Texas or the Canadians who, you know, are going to the beach. These are folks that are coming in and expect a very, very high level, high quality experience. There a lot of these folks are very ignorant, as we know and we've talked about, very ignorant to what's actually going on on the ground there.
Gizmo:They don't care that outside outside of the walls of that party is just pure just feels very inappropriate. It does.
Bam Bam:With what's happening.
Gizmo:But I think if they could have, they would have. And I think that sure. You know, that's an obvious And
Bam Bam:ways around this. If they can they've got luxury hotels. They're all on generators. They have running water in those buildings. You can host them there.
Bam Bam:Can have
Gizmo:The fuel is a problem
Chef Ricky:there.
Bam Bam:I know. You can have you can have your bank with in one of those beautiful hotels. The factory tours, that's a problem. They can all be put on temporary generators with temporary water pumps and filters. They have to buy all this.
Bam Bam:Their Chinese partner would have to bring some equipment in to make this happen. It's doable. At what expense? It would be enormous undertaking technically to make it happen, but it's doable. But is it worth it?
Gizmo:Yeah. And are the Chinese or whoever else willing to do it? It doesn't seem like that at this point.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. At the very least, I'm shocked they're not doing the auctions online to at least keep that revenue going.
Gizmo:Yeah. Well, the thing about that revenue, Chef, is that it is supposed to go to the Cuban health care system as a charity, and I'm using my finger quotes as I say that in the room here. So, you know, I think that for them to put it online, that probably would dismiss the validity of the charitable quote unquote
Chef Ricky:And paying doctors $40 a month. Money Let's must be the call
Gizmo:it $10 a month, Jeff.
Bam Bam:How much did they raise from that last auction that they had?
Gizmo:I think it was $1,215,000,000, 20,000,000. I don't remember. That money
Bam Bam:go to the hospitals? Did it go to help anybody?
Senator:You didn't see all the new CAT scan machines at
Gizmo:the hospital?
Bam Bam:Oh yeah, forgot about that. Yeah, correct.
Gizmo:I mean, listen, it's at the point where I'm reading that if you need dialysis in Cuba right now, like, the hospitals don't have electricity to get you dialysis.
Bam Bam:They're doing it in a garage.
Gizmo:It it is absolute just I don't see how it's fixed in the short term. And honestly, I don't know how it's fixed in the long term without some, you know, revolutionary idea of how to support eight, nine million people and their needs. Yep. So this leads me into my next question, which for me is a bigger thought and and really something I've been chewing on and I wanna throw to you guys. What in your view as with the information we have in front of us today, what in your view is the next one to three years of Cuban tobacco?
Gizmo:What does that look like? The next one to three years. Is is thing are things gonna just keep steamrolling ahead? Something gonna change? If you could, given all of the information we know right now, which is not a complete picture, so I'm asking you to kind of guess.
Gizmo:But if you had to put money on the table and and bet on what's gonna happen, what do you think the next thirty six months, let's say, of Cuban tobacco looks like?
Senator:I mean, to me, there's no question that the quality is gonna have to suffer. Mhmm. I mean, we've talked about how when we started to notice an improvement in the quality of Cuban tobacco, that there were individuals leading these factories who placed a greater emphasis on caring about the people who worked there and making sure that any of the bare minimum essentials that these folks needed that they didn't have access to, they tried to find ways to make sure they did, and that these employees were coming there feeling much better about themselves and their lives so that they could do their jobs than in the past that maybe a different approach at different periods and points in time were taken. There's no way given the situation that that country's in that, like, it's remotely possible to do that. You can't.
Senator:It doesn't matter who's running the factory, doesn't matter who's employed there. There is not enough resources to possibly make sure that these people show up to work and are able to even think about their jobs as a primary thought throughout the day. So to me, it's impossible that the quality can be maintained when the conditions are that poor for all these people that have to work there, and then you factor into it like downtime that is obviously gonna be a part of the everyday operations of these factories with no power. Yeah, no water. Constantly water, sickness, you know, people calling out all kinds of stuff.
Bam Bam:Like a food.
Senator:Yeah. There's just no way that you can maintain quality under those circumstances. So I think we always talk about runs like, I would be willing to bet pretty confidently that the next few years are not gonna be a great run out of Cuba.
Gizmo:I think we're going into another dark period. Correct. That's where I think we're
Bam Bam:I agree with you.
Gizmo:If we were to be offered right now twenty twenty six boxes of our favorite Cuban cigars at a significant discount, let's just say, I don't think that I would purchase those boxes. Mhmm. Because at the end of the day, number one, we've said this before and we heard this in Cuba, we've heard it elsewhere, happy people make good cigars. And like senator said, if you're worried about feeding your children, putting clean clothes on their back, getting fresh water, and then for yourself, how do you go to work like you just said and focus on rolling dried tobacco leaves and give a damn about it? I know I wouldn't.
Gizmo:Yeah. And that's even if you can get there.
Bam Bam:If I were if I were a dictator, dictator bam bam.
Gizmo:It it it plays.
Rooster:Yeah. For sure, it would be dick bam bam. You. DBB.
Bam Bam:Thank you for that. And I had an industry that was vital to my nation, right? And I have probably hundreds of millions of dollars elsewhere in the world that my small little family and group of friends have control over.
Gizmo:Apparently the number is somewhere between 17 and 20,000,000,000. That is known. Is hidden in offshore accounts in hard currency.
Bam Bam:Wouldn't Tater Bam Bam break off a piece of that to fix that industry, and help all the people in that industry to kinda bring it up and at least maintain quality.
Gizmo:Dictator Bam Bam's not sounding like much of a dictator, I must say.
Bam Bam:Well, I'm just saying, for my industry that's so vital, why not prop up the They need to prop up that industry.
Rooster:Man, it is a huge revenue generator. They have the money. I mean, this is the only thing that they're exporting is
Bam Bam:what are they doing with the billions of dollars that they're hiding? Why not use it to fix your primary industry? Now, there's gonna be backlash because most of Cuba doesn't get a chance to work in the factory, so they're gonna be up in arms, right? So you gotta come up with a solution for that. Take break off a billion dollars to help out the rest of the country.
Bam Bam:Break off $3,000,000,000. That's a ton of fucking money. You can do a lot with that over all of the provincial locations and the Habana's factories. You can bring it back to life. Doesn't take much, but they're not doing it.
Senator:I don't know. These problems are so fundamental and systemic that Yeah. I don't think it's as simple as break off a
Rooster:few billion dollars. Easy answer.
Senator:Yeah. A few billion dollars will not solve power for that island.
Bam Bam:No. But it could solve power for the factories. I could make
Gizmo:that work. Me me go another level
Senator:here. Enough because these people at home don't have power, don't have
Bam Bam:I'll make sure my workers are all fed and their families. I have billions of dollars, don't forget. Just turn
Chef Ricky:it to a Ken.
Senator:Don't forget. Bev really loves this idea of being a dictator.
Gizmo:He does. He's very passionate about
Bam Bam:Don't forget, I have billions of dollars behind me. I can feed all those families in all the factories. I can bring power and water to those factories only. Fuck the rest of the island, I'm gonna take care of those factories. If that's what my primary
Rooster:Do you know what a huge uproar that would be
Bam Bam:for Like I old said, so then I break off another billion or 2 to handle social services.
Gizmo:You're a bad dictator. Me go another level deeper on this. Forgetting in the factories, about the tobacco in Pinar Del Rio? The lack of fuel out there, in which Havana is bad enough out in these provinces, outside of the capital. We don't even know what's going on out there.
Gizmo:You know, those stories really aren't even being told.
Bam Bam:The raw products, yeah.
Gizmo:Raw product, you know, there's no water, you know, moving water, you know, gasoline, fuel to move tobacco around. I think that, like senators started, you know, this conversation with that we're entering what we're calling a dark period again, I also think that there's gonna be a severe tobacco shortage coming in the next few years because how do you produce tobacco under these circumstances?
Bam Bam:I don't think it's possible.
Gizmo:Horse and buggies. When employees are compromised, fuel, water, everything else, I I don't know how you keep things going. That's tough. The other thing too that I think about is given what we know about a significant other piece of the Habanos ownership in Chengdu, who is currently in Chinese custody, I don't think that piece of the business has been transacted. So that's a large piece.
Gizmo:And then you have half of the business is owned by the Cuban government, which is flailing right now. So you have maybe 90% of the ownership of that company is floundering right now. So Sounds like a great time for us to buy. Does Habanos even go from there? Does Habanos exist in three years?
Senator:Yeah. I mean, I'm sorry. I think there's no question Habanos will persist forever. Mean, it's like they're a publicly traded company. It's not like they have shareholders that can force them out and things like that.
Senator:Correct. They can do whatever the hell they want. They're gonna hold onto it and run into the ground if
Bam Bam:they In don't in hindsight, I think the Chinese partnership was a colossal mistake. You mentioned Dubai earlier. I don't see it being that far fetched. Someone in that royal family over there that loves Cuban cigars, and there are a lot of them, they can easily afford. Could have partnered with them long ago.
Bam Bam:I don't know. It would have been a completely different scenario. You're I I
Senator:I don't know. The only wild card in this is don't forget, there are plenty of Chinese billionaires that are gonna be wondering where their Cuban cigars are, where their Cohibas are. So, like, you know, there will be some
Bam Bam:Where's my investment?
Senator:To try to figure out a way to solve for this because
Bam Bam:point. Yeah.
Senator:I just can't imagine, like, the amount of money that in a market like Asia that is spent on these Cuban cigars that these guys are all of a sudden gonna say, oh, guess I'm on to smoking Nicaraguan cigars.
Gizmo:Like Correct.
Senator:They're gonna throw money at the problem to try to find some way to make sure they still get what they want. True.
Gizmo:Interesting times ahead here, boys. Oh, yeah. Really curious what's gonna happen. I've been thinking a lot about this, and we only have, like I said, a piece of the information. It's so early on that really there's a limitless amount of ways that this can go.
Rooster:But any of the money that's outside of Havana that's in these Swiss bank accounts or wherever it is, that's not coming back to Cuba. No. Never. That's the money for the regime or whoever's in charge.
Bam Bam:They're hoarding the money for themselves.
Rooster:They leave, they're gonna just you know, it's for them. Yeah. The Cuban people are not gonna see that money.
Bam Bam:Well, hopefully, the international community will hold them accountable and brought to justice as they deserve.
Gizmo:And then help the Cuban people get back on their feet, which is a A colossal tall of an order as you can have. As you can Oh, yeah. As you can have. So I'd love to hear what Lizard Nation thinks about this. You know?
Gizmo:Where are you thinking that Cuban tobacco, Habanos is gonna be in the next year, next three years? It's really an interesting time. And I honestly, I think it's fascinating that we in this room and Lizard Nation but it's fascinating that we've kind of gone on this journey of falling in love with Cuban cigars, diving as deep as we possibly could into Cuban cigars, being pushed away by prices. And
Senator:Cuba the country.
Gizmo:And Cuba the country.
Senator:Leave the cigar piece even out of it.
Gizmo:Cuba. A 100%. That's well said. All of that. And now we are here when who knows what's gonna happen to these things that we love?
Gizmo:Mhmm. Who's gonna who knows what's gonna happen to the people there that we love? I I mean, it's just such a crazy situation.
Bam Bam:Yep.
Gizmo:And again, like I said, I wish more people were talking about it and not whitewashing it to make some money on YouTube revenue. Know?
Chef Ricky:And what does it mean for New World cigars if Cuban cigars go under? Right?
Gizmo:What's wrong that? New World cigars are already benefiting from it.
Bam Bam:They are. I was about to say But what
Chef Ricky:does it mean for us with that price point increasing over time? All cigars are
Bam Bam:going up in price.
Chef Ricky:That's true. There's less competition.
Gizmo:Yeah. There it's not gonna go down. I think what we're gonna see is that companies are gonna pivot to either producing more cigars or allocating more cigars to Europe, Asia, and elsewhere. But at the end of the day, I think that, you know, it that's not gonna change too much. Now if Cuban cigars become legal here, that's gonna be interesting.
Gizmo:If for some reason things continue on and the embargo's lifted, that's a real possibility too. Unlikely but possible. That's a wild scenario as well.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I've imagined ten years from now.
Senator:During your dictatorship? Correct.
Gizmo:So are you on your yacht?
Bam Bam:Where I lifted by embargo. No, the embargo was lifted off of me, right, because I'm the dictator, and my people are able to travel back and forth to The United States whenever they wanted. I rebuild my nation slowly, block by block. That's gonna take a very, very long time.
Senator:And a lot of change orders, Bam.
Bam Bam:Oh, you better believe it.
Gizmo:I don't think this is dictator Bam. I think this is architect Bam. Yes.
Bam Bam:They're not gonna be that bad.
Rooster:A dictator never lets his people leave. Correct.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Like I said, I'd love to hear from Lizard Nation on this, so please do email us. Send us some voice memos. I'd really love to hear what you all are thinking about this conversation and the idea of change happening here to this thing that we love and the island that we love and and the people there. It's really really really interesting.
Senator:I would also, if any listeners make it to Cuba this year, to share their experience
Bam Bam:Cool. That'd be great.
Senator:Crazy We read and follow stuff from folks who are crazily making these trips in this really difficult time, but not with the depth that I would love if there are listeners that have actually somehow done this and just to get a firsthand account of kinda what they're seeing there.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. It's time now to go into some listener email. And this one is our is from our friend Lizard Tyler in Pittsburgh. He says, hello, lizards. I was listening to the story of member x, y, z, and the wife, and I was laughing the whole way through even not knowing the players.
Gizmo:It had me thinking back to the old days in the men's card room at the golf course. The rule we had, and this only worked in pre cell phone times, was that if your wife called asking about you, you had to buy a round for everyone in the room.
Bam Bam:Alright.
Gizmo:Barring it being a true emergency, of course. I am not sure how your lounge is set up, but maybe a penalty of some sort like that might be in order. If your significant other shows up to the lounge to drag you out by the ear, then you owe the lounge a box of cigars to be shared by the community. I am dying to know if there was more afoot with the way member y decided to spring this on member x without notice. Hell, yeah.
Gizmo:I appreciate all the work you guys put in so that you can keep the rest of us nonlocal lizards entertained and informed. Cheers. Lizard Tyler from Pittsburgh. Senator.
Bam Bam:Pittsburgh.
Senator:I like this idea. Sounds like we're I knew you would. Sounds like we're owed a box of cigars.
Bam Bam:Poor lizard x. Bam.
Chef Ricky:It sounds like you have a new smoke buddy out in Pittsburgh.
Bam Bam:Maybe. Yeah.
Gizmo:Was there anything else to Lizard Y getting up and opening the door and allowing this all to play out? Like, I know you can't go into
Rooster:deep detail. Do you think
Gizmo:he just wanted to seat in the circle and get off the bleachers?
Senator:I think there could have been a little bit more to it.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Could be some past transgressions that took place between
Senator:the two of them. I I got the sense after the fact.
Bam Bam:You mean that big smile on his face? Was it a tell? Waving? Correct.
Senator:I got the sense that Lizard x has put some of his friends in uncomfortable positions in recent time.
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Senator:And I sensed that there was some satisfaction that this all finally came home to roost for
Bam Bam:this Tremendous satisfaction.
Rooster:But apparently, this has happened before with lizard eggs.
Bam Bam:Yep. Well, yes.
Rooster:This is not
Gizmo:the first time. Which is crazy because for all the time that each of us and all of us collectively have spent in cigar lounges.
Senator:Oh, we've never seen that before.
Gizmo:This has never happened.
Bam Bam:Ever.
Gizmo:I have I I've never even heard a story of this happening.
Bam Bam:Not ever.
Senator:The only ridiculous thing like this has ever happened, believe it or not, at our lounge here, was some, like, young kid was a member at some point. And I say kid, like, probably it's like early twenties. And Oh, he was
Gizmo:a melon, this kid. Remember.
Senator:Yeah. He was not not great, and he's no longer here, thankfully. But I remember him and some of his buddies were, like, playing poker in our poker room here, and this kid's mother showed up just like the story we told with the guy's wife and like banging on the door, trying to come in, gets in, and starts berating her son, and literally grabbed him and dragged him outside. And I'm like You're spending your college tuition on a motorbike. It's like, you should not be in a cigar lounge if your mother is telling you when you need to be there or shouldn't be there.
Senator:I mean, that's
Bam Bam:just That's a problem.
Senator:Insanity, correct.
Chef Ricky:Should not be in a cigar lounge if you live with your mother.
Senator:That too.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Wow. I wasn't there for that.
Gizmo:So I I don't know if we talked about this, but what's worse, your mother showing up or your wife showing up? The mother. The mother. I think mom showing up as well.
Senator:Yeah. That's even more embarrassing.
Bam Bam:They're close together. They're both awful.
Gizmo:I think mom showing up is worse.
Bam Bam:Yeah. As a 20 year old?
Gizmo:Yeah. But the wife showing up in the moo moo is pretty bad.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That's a bad look.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's move on now. This one, we're gonna go to our friend, Lizard Randy, who wrote us a few weeks ago. Told us the story of his friend, of course, who passed away. So I wanted to share his follow-up because we asked him to give us some more context.
Gizmo:He said, hey, lizards. Lizard Randy here. Thanks a bunch for selecting me as lizard of the week. It was really great to hear your answers to my email question. It makes me feel good to know we all have some kind of special connection to the joy of cigars.
Gizmo:As for what happened to the walk in humidor of Cubans, well, let's just say maybe I thought he and I were better friends than we were. I was traveling overseas when he passed and didn't find out until a month later when I returned. He had enough money, but his family didn't and thus began the jockeying of inheritance and the liquidation of valuables. He was an art collector as well. I spoke with the executor of his estate who informed me the cigars were entirely sold off before I even returned.
Gizmo:I doubt for the right prices considering most of his family could have cared less about cigars. Anyway, I was a little surprised by how it all shook out. One thing, though, at his memorial at his memorial, they had h up and half coronas and mini scotch bottles in each gift bag. That's pretty cool.
Bam Bam:That is
Gizmo:Which was a nice touch.
Senator:Bag at a memorial service.
Gizmo:And remember, so it seems that not all were sold off. I wish I had more juicy details for you here. This was a few few years ago before the dark times of Cuban cigars in which we currently live. I hope the seller went straight to Bon Roberts or f FOH, but I highly doubt it. They were most likely liquidated to the masses who appeared out of the shadows upon his passing, but I really hope I am wrong.
Gizmo:Thanks again, Lizards. Great episode, and I'm looking forward to the next one always. All the best, Lizard Randy.
Bam Bam:That's a nightmare. That's unfortunate. That's a nightmare scenario.
Gizmo:Yeah. I mean, your friend to a pass, you don't find out for a month Yep. That he did. You come home, and his stuff was fire sailed
Bam Bam:Correct.
Gizmo:By the executor. Yeah. That's a bummer.
Chef Ricky:And he was a neighbor, right, from what I remember?
Gizmo:I don't know if a neighbor or colleague. I don't remember the the specific detail.
Chef Ricky:I thought he was a neighbor.
Gizmo:They got close enough that they were smoking smoking together quite a bit.
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Senator:Sorry, I'm still stuck on the gift bag. I like that idea. The gift I've bag is a never ever been to a memorial service where I've seen gift bags handed out.
Bam Bam:Oh yeah.
Senator:But honestly, it has made me think I would wanna do that at my own funeral. That's pretty cool.
Rooster:Yeah. I would go more often.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Let's go to another email now. This one is from lizard will. He says, hi, lizards. Will from The UK here.
Gizmo:What can I say? I only stumbled across the pod in June 2025 when I also found FOH, but it's been a fountain of knowledge, entertainment, and laugh since then. I'm currently working my way back up the list from episode one after having listened to the latter ones at first. My first episode was your interview with Robin Hamlet. It was hilarious.
Gizmo:Although, maybe not as brilliant as the Fundadores Gate with BAM, and he says he wasn't in the wrong in my opinion. There you go. I also just wanted to say a massive thank you to senator. His recommendation of the Pascal Jolivette Sancerre twenty twenty three has gone down as a treat with both myself and the wife, missus Lizardwell. Personally, I'm also trying to work my way through your eights and above cigars.
Gizmo:It's slightly harder on some of them as The UK market is a tough one. I thought I'd also recommend one for you to sample on the pod, the AG cigars one zero nine, an Ecuadorian wrapper over Nicaraguan binder and filler. I was sent one by a friend, and it was brilliant. I did a little bit of googling, and it looks like it's Alex Gonzalez who owns AG cigars who used to roll the Michael Jordan m j '23 customs in Cuba. You remember those?
Gizmo:They're like Yeah. I don't know. Are they 11 inches long? Nine Yeah. Inches
Senator:It's crazy. 11.
Gizmo:So potentially a brand to put on the list to look out for in the future. Anyway, I just wanted to say I'm thoroughly enjoying the pod. The guys make it brilliantly entertaining. Actually, laughing out loud to the point my wife thinks I've lost my mind. I like that line.
Gizmo:Keep up the great work, and here's to many more great episodes to come. Cheers from good old blighty lizard Will. Very
Bam Bam:nice. Good old boy. Correct. Old chap.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. We're coming into the last third now on the Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust, Sober Mesa, Soledo Red, and the Knob Creek twelve years aged Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey. What's everybody thinking of the pairing right now?
Bam Bam:I think they're both delicious in their own way. Would you
Gizmo:say independent of each other?
Bam Bam:Yes. Correct. I love the cigar. I'm getting a a a touch of walnut, some peanut. It's really and the retrohale is outstanding.
Bam Bam:A little coffee still. The minerality and earthiness for me has dissipated. It's very, very pleasant now, which I didn't mind that earthiness at all, but this has kind of gone on a little bit of a journey. Great, great, great cigar.
Chef Ricky:Did it get at all spicy for you? No.
Rooster:Think I got a little bit of pepper.
Chef Ricky:A little bit of pepper.
Rooster:And the coffee is more like an espresso
Chef Ricky:for I think I'm a little further on.
Rooster:Like a black coffee.
Chef Ricky:Just a little bit. But I'm getting a little bit of pepper. It's not bad. It's not overpowering. Especially with the bourbon in I it.
Chef Ricky:It works
Bam Bam:do love the nutty nature of this cigar. To really quite
Chef Ricky:me the nuttiness comes through a lot more on the retro.
Bam Bam:Yeah, I'm getting it both. That's what I love about cigars like this. All your senses are being tingled, The traditional draw and the retro, both are satisfying as hell.
Rooster:And the cigar has picked up in strength. Think it's a little bit fuller now.
Bam Bam:But actually for me, it's gotten even smoother. Don't know how that's It's
Gizmo:so smooth.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. We had a stretch there where we were going into emails and whatnot, and for a moment I started to pick up some sweetness. It kind of felt like a thick pancake with the slightest amount of maple syrup and pecan.
Bam Bam:I could see the maple syrup, yeah. And the pecan for sure.
Chef Ricky:Yeah, and so that was like the creamy nuttiness I was getting, and now I'm entering this point where it's kind of peppery, just a little. It's not overwhelming pepper. It's just on the back end, but it's still creamy. It's still nutty. It's a very, very, very delicious cigar.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. And as for the bourbon, it's kind of smoothed out for me and my palate's adjusted. I'm not getting so much of the heat anymore. So now they're kind of working in unison with one another.
Bam Bam:Yeah, the heat never really bothered me. It's just so full flavored and that finish is so extraordinarily long. I have to wait a while before I take a drag of
Rooster:the salt.
Chef Ricky:And you feel you still do now?
Bam Bam:I prefer them in separate environments, let's say. Gotcha. Mutually exclusive of each other. I would enjoy this drink without a cigar after dinner and be very satisfied. The more I think about it, I feel
Chef Ricky:like the home run pairing in the room is sort of the unspoken one, and that's Rooster's pairing.
Bam Bam:Oh, the Guinness, yeah.
Chef Ricky:The Guinness with the cigar.
Bam Bam:I think that would be a great, delicious pairing.
Rooster:It is good.
Bam Bam:I bet. No doubt about it.
Senator:I mean, there's not one thing wrong with this cigar for me. It's it's perfect. I love the flavor. It's like built a little bit in strength, which is nice because I think we were talking about how like it was incredibly smooth, not much strength early on. In terms of the pairing, you know, for me, I really like the flavor profile of this bourbon.
Senator:So Mhmm. You know, my only complaint is I just wish it were dialed down a little bit in strength, but what I've done to solve for it is, like, just taking small sips.
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Senator:I think the flavor is working nicely with the cigar, so overall, I'm pretty happy.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Or delay the smoke right after a drink for me.
Chef Ricky:That helps. It's funny you see that because not one of us has refilled yet, It's not because the bourbon's bad, it's just because it really requires you to drink it slowly.
Bam Bam:Yeah, it's very satisfying.
Gizmo:Yeah, take very little sips. Correct. I'm finding the cigar, while it has picked up in strength, I feel like it's moved just a touch more earthy
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Gizmo:Yeah. And and like deep espresso is still there, but more earthy I think is the word I wanna use.
Bam Bam:It's gone away.
Gizmo:I'm not getting pepper. No. But I'm also not getting sweetness.
Bam Bam:I've the earthiness has gone away for me and it's more nutty for me.
Chef Ricky:You didn't get any sweetness even earlier on
Gizmo:since you third. There was, you know, there was a little bit in the second third. Not really much to write home about. Not that I'm complaining. I I feel the same as senator.
Gizmo:I think this cigar is excellent. Now the question I'm gonna throw to the room here is where would you slot this given all the commentary that we just talked about? Well, we talked about Because this does have, I think, a unique it's a unique profile. I don't know if it sits after the other Nicaraguans that we smoke. Does it sit, you know, instead of?
Gizmo:Does it replace those in a sit? Where does this cigar land for you guys?
Rooster:I think if you're gonna smoke just one cigar, this completely fits that
Bam Bam:Yes, profile, agree.
Rooster:If you're going to smoke multiple cigars, this could be a nice finisher. Maybe even after a Padron, this could be a finisher because it doesn't have that sweeter notes that you get out of the Padron, but yet it gives you a very smooth, very balanced
Bam Bam:satisfying.
Rooster:It's got a lot of espresso, it's got some earthiness, and the last third has actually picked up a little bit in strength.
Gizmo:So it
Rooster:would be a good finishing cigar for me. But it's also very versatile. I mean, could really smoke at any time of the day.
Bam Bam:Well, for you it's breakfast.
Rooster:Could be.
Chef Ricky:My wife is awesome, but she won't allow me to smoke next to the fireplace. Actually, no, I won't say that. She has told me I can't, but I won't allow myself to smoke near the fireplace.
Rooster:What's wrong with you?
Chef Ricky:It's nothing
Senator:She told him he can't.
Chef Ricky:No, no, no.
Rooster:She said yes.
Chef Ricky:No, it's not the right setup. She's told me I can, but it's it's just it's not the right setup. It's not it's not rooster setup. But if there was a fireplace I could smoke this by, this would be a cigar to smoke by that fireplace.
Rooster:You have a fireplace, a wood burning fireplace in your
Chef Ricky:I do, I do. Family my, as I said before, your opening seems very tall, so you could comfortably sit by it knowing that your smoke is going to go out.
Bam Bam:So that's true. Your fireplace is elevated a bit and it's
Gizmo:got a ledge. It's off the floor.
Bam Bam:Correct. So you can park your chair against that stone ledge, is really quite nice. Kind of put your cigar toward the fireplace and kind of continue to blow into it. That works for you.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. I mean, my my fireplace is on a ledge, but my opening is still not as large as yours.
Rooster:Just take the door out. Just put
Chef Ricky:a It could open. Took the door out. No. Opened there's a door that I could open.
Rooster:Put a screen there.
Chef Ricky:No. It's two bi fold doors and there's screen, a but I'd have to hold my cigar fairly low. I feel
Rooster:No, you like don't. You don't have to do that. No.
Chef Ricky:I don't know. I don't know.
Rooster:Hold your cigar anywhere you want. I'm sorry. I'm gonna try it one day. She's looking over, hold it in your right hand. When she's not looking, hold it in your left hand.
Chef Ricky:I got the kiddos in the house. I don't know. Maybe that's my hesitation. When they're off
Gizmo:key to rooster wife.
Chef Ricky:When they're off to college, I'll I'll I'll I'll give it a shot. But
Gizmo:senator, what is the slot for you?
Senator:So it's a very good question because I don't know, and that's like the only problem. Right? Like I just said, like, my experience thus far has been perfect. I don't have a complaint. I'm not in any way unhappy with the cigar.
Senator:Mhmm. But I don't know where I would regularly put this. I can think of, you know, on an occasion, like, you know, Rooster said, if you're gonna have one cigar, sure, I would pull this and and smoke this. Sometimes, maybe, I'd put it before or after a Padron, but I would never really feel confident or great about that decision. Like, I'm not sure.
Senator:I don't know if this is trying to be similar to the experience that you would get in terms of body and strength and flavor as a Padron, trying to be lighter than that, trying to be fuller than that. That's the part that's unclear, and that's just the only challenge for me in, like, would I smoke this often? And the answer may not be that often because I really don't have a clear, like, distinct lane Mhmm. For this based on what I already smoke that fills my rotation.
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Rooster:I think you could smoke a Padron, let's say an Exclusivo. You could do it before this, before the Exclusivo, or after. Because the Exclusivo gives you the sweeter note. It's kind of like having a meal, and then you have a dessert, which is obviously sweeter. So you could have a Perron Exclusivo after this.
Rooster:So that would kind of satisfy the whole experience.
Chef Ricky:So what you're saying is this is either your only cigar or cigar three or five in the mix.
Rooster:It could be a finisher. It could be the last cigar, or a Padron could also be a last cigar, or it could only be the only cigar of the day.
Gizmo:I don't know if I like the Padron example.
Senator:Yeah. My only problem with that is I mean, I'm smoking this word, you know, in the final third, like, I'm not craving an ex Luisivo
Rooster:right now. Mhmm.
Gizmo:No. Where I'm Yeah.
Senator:And it's like, when we've done some other cigars that have completely surprised me, and I've given even wildly high ratings to, like a CAO Box Press Brasilia. Mhmm. That cigar was like so mild in the delivery of flavor that I wanted an Exclusivo after it. Correct. And I knew I would always slot that before an ex Luisivo.
Senator:Probably? My father blew. Yeah? Like Nicaraguan cigar,
Gizmo:but
Senator:so much more mild than like or a lot sorry, Honduran, but tastes like a Nicaraguan cigar. Mhmm. And it's like, I knew I would always want that before an ex Lucivo, and I would chase a Padron after having that cigar. This does not make me want like, this delivers so much flavor that, like, I don't need an ex Lucivo after it, but I don't know that I always want this in place of an ex Luisivo, so I'm
Gizmo:stuck. You are exactly where I was at asking this question. This cigar to me is a total wild card.
Bam Bam:You could decide to end your evening with this if you're looking for something else to end your night. You could do that.
Chef Ricky:Would this
Gizmo:be has the sweetness for me that I want So that's you? Ending my night.
Bam Bam:Okay. So you prefer
Gizmo:That's for personal.
Bam Bam:You prefer that sweeter milk?
Gizmo:I want something like h up and half corona or the Davidoff Belly Coast. So that's my finisher, Jeremy. Because I
Chef Ricky:I was just gonna say, would this be easier to slot if it were a quicker smoke?
Bam Bam:Well, hold on. That's another question. No.
Gizmo:I don't think so.
Bam Bam:You're talking dimensional difference.
Gizmo:No. I'm not talking dimensional because sometimes
Senator:It's sweeter, he's talking flavor. Sometimes but I'll it's reach much for
Gizmo:more the aging room concerto to finish my night. To me is like milk chocolate. I crave that sometimes. Interesting about this cigar is, and I want the listeners to actually think about this, and I want all of us to think about this. I think this is one of the rare ones that for I think the score in the room is gonna be pretty high tonight.
Chef Ricky:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:That's my assumption.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:I don't think that's actually gonna align with how often each of us is gonna smoke the cigar.
Bam Bam:I totally agree
Gizmo:Like, I could buy I think I think I could buy a box of 13 of these cigars and it lasts me
Bam Bam:A year.
Gizmo:A year or two.
Bam Bam:A year. Yeah. Yeah? Not two years, but I think
Gizmo:a year. I don't know if I'd I I don't know how often I would reach for this. It's a wild card.
Rooster:Like, you know, a cigar that comes to mind is the number 35 by Pedro, and I could easily do that after this. Yeah.
Gizmo:Yeah. I don't know, man.
Bam Bam:I kind of am aligning with what's happening in the room now. It'd be Like, you would want this
Rooster:to
Bam Bam:last This is just satisfying. I don't think I'd want anything after it for me.
Gizmo:I'm not craving another cigar right now.
Bam Bam:Oh, well, we're gonna have another one,
Gizmo:but I know, but I'm not craving one.
Rooster:Sure. So right there, mean, that's an example. What would you smoke after this?
Chef Ricky:You know
Bam Bam:I don't know, but I just wanna smoke something.
Gizmo:Okay. He's out of the house. He wants to take advantage.
Bam Bam:I have an idiot with me. I'm probably gonna do that.
Chef Ricky:A brisket night on Senator's back deck with this, and you might have one cigar in you, just maybe because of time or whatnot.
Bam Bam:Chilly wind. This would
Chef Ricky:get that satisfied. The wrapper is thick enough where it'll hold up. Definitely. It's satisfying enough where you feel good smoking one. And yeah, I think this is After dinner.
Chef Ricky:After dinner, quick one out on the back on on the deck or whatnot, chilly night, but tolerable, and this is the perfect cigar for that.
Senator:I don't think I'm not saying I don't think Giz or or maybe others are saying that, like, on an occasion that there's not, like, a place for this cigar. There is. But it it's not, like, with regularity that I would know where I always wanna put that. Like, when I think of my lineup, like, I know I always want an aging room Sonata before I'm gonna have an ex placebo.
Gizmo:Yes. Mhmm.
Senator:I know that if I'm not gonna have a Sonata and I'm gonna have a My Father Blue, I want that always before the ex placebo. I don't always know where I would want this. Can I have it before after? Sure. But there's just, like, not an obvious answer for me to that question with regularity that, like, when I'm pulling cigars out of my tower, I'm like, here's gonna be the lineup every single time.
Senator:I just don't know every time really where I would want that.
Rooster:You know
Gizmo:how I'm gonna describe this cigar? This cigar to me is a pinch runner.
Bam Bam:In a pinch?
Gizmo:In a pinch. Like, it's on the bench. You need something different. You need something that's gonna deliver exactly what this is in that moment. In a pinch.
Gizmo:It's like a pinch runner in baseball.
Senator:Or a pinch
Gizmo:hitter. A pinch hitter or pinch or, you know, somebody running as You know?
Chef Ricky:He's a
Rooster:big sports guy.
Gizmo:That fucking pisses me off so bad.
Senator:That's great.
Chef Ricky:Why? I love that line. Big following anything else is fucking
Bam Bam:great. I love
Gizmo:It fucking pisses
Chef Ricky:me lizard obey is great at using that stuff.
Bam Bam:Oh, man.
Gizmo:But that's where I'm thinking of this cigar. Like, I'm gonna take this to pro cigar when I go next week. I'm gonna take one or two because I'm gonna be smoking a lot of Dominican cigars, and I'm gonna be looking for
Chef Ricky:A change.
Gizmo:That little change that is very specific, that's what this cigar is.
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Gizmo:But it's not gonna slot regularly for me.
Bam Bam:Okay. That's
Senator:fair. And now again, you know, where this is different, it's like if you're primarily a Dunbarton cigar smoker, I'm sure there's a pretty clear place where you would slot this cigar. Good point. You know, when you're smoking Padron and My Father and Aladino and Aging Room and all these different brands, like, that's just what complicates it where it's not as obvious where you would smoke it. So, like, I get why Saka made this.
Senator:Like, it's an absolutely brilliant blend. Totally. And I think in his lineup, like, there's probably an incredibly clear position to slot this cigar. But when you also then take into account all these other brands, I think that's just where it becomes more complicated.
Bam Bam:Yeah. We're creatures of habit, and we've kinda developed our palettes based on everything we've reviewed and adopted.
Gizmo:But I think no, Ben. But I think we've been pretty open to new entrants. Really? To the point where I
Bam Bam:Did you hear what everyone just said?
Gizmo:No. No. No. My point, is that when we
Senator:find what we've named are things we've been smoking just for only the last year.
Gizmo:Dude, think about that that smoke of that sample.
Rooster:Look at
Gizmo:the sample. Exactly. We we found all of those cigars in the last six months. All of us are smoking those like every week, if not every day.
Bam Bam:No. Understood. But compare those cigars to what we're getting at No.
Gizmo:My point is is that I'm saying I'm arguing your point that we're creatures of quote unquote habit.
Bam Bam:Yeah.
Gizmo:I think at any moment, any of us are okay with anything in our lineup being replaced.
Rooster:Yes.
Gizmo:Like hard stop. We don't give a shit.
Bam Bam:Except for this cigar.
Gizmo:But this doesn't have the place.
Bam Bam:That's right. It's like a point. This this is like a bowling ball rolling down the aisle, the lane, and hitting all the pins. It's just it's disruptive. It's a disruptive cigar because you don't know where to place it.
Rooster:This is disruptive?
Bam Bam:Well, it's disruptive in the I argue the decision
Senator:making process. It's disruptive enough. Because for me, like, those cigars that we're naming, like, they were so disruptive that they basically said, like, screw whatever cigars you were normally making in your lineup. Like, now I'm taking that slot, and I have a clear place
Bam Bam:Correct.
Senator:Everyone else get out of the way.
Bam Bam:That's true.
Senator:And this isn't disrupting enough that like it's pushing out those other seat belts.
Bam Bam:I see that.
Chef Ricky:Those are starting lineup.
Gizmo:This is a pinch runner. Yeah. Or pinch hitter.
Senator:Or pinch hitter. I think the hitter works way better. I'm sorry.
Bam Bam:What is it, Giz? Which one is it? Yeah. The fucking
Senator:Big Sports Guy. But
Rooster:I think you're right. I mean, this this cigar is not that easy to fit No. In what you're smoking daily.
Bam Bam:It's not.
Rooster:So you're not going to be smoking this on a weekly basis, but once in a while, you might pick it up.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Right? I think what Giz said a moment ago is spot on. I think we're gonna do well with this one tonight, but
Gizmo:It doesn't align with how often it's going to appear. Correct.
Senator:I agree with that.
Gizmo:But I think it has a place.
Bam Bam:Just it's
Gizmo:so odd. Like, my brain is discombobulated with this this cigar tonight because I'm really loving it. Yeah. But I'm not thinking about when I'm gonna have it again.
Bam Bam:It's a bowling ball.
Rooster:But what if you were just gonna have one cigar? Would that fit?
Gizmo:I think tonight is a good example of that because this is my one and only tonight, and I think it's going to be satisfying.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:Not gonna reach for something else, but nights like tonight are very rare for me. Mean, would I reach for this cigar if we weren't doing it on the podcast tonight? Probably not. I'd probably reach for something else and be one and done. So it's unique cigar
Bam Bam:Yes.
Gizmo:For all the reasons Correct. Stated
Senator:But you know, just the last thing I'll say, you know, when I think of the Saka cigars that we've done, like the regular Sobremesa, we did that cigar.
Bam Bam:Mhmm.
Senator:So like I had bought maybe a couple boxes after we did that. I now have probably almost smoked through all of them. Delicious cigar. And that took a while. I mean, the first Sober Mesa, we had to do what?
Senator:Two years ago?
Gizmo:It's a long time ago, senator. It was episode one forty. That's almost a 100 episodes ago. Yeah.
Senator:Yeah. So it's like that was a cigar that I really enjoyed when we reviewed it. I bought a couple boxes, and similarly, like, that didn't replace anything in my lineup. Mhmm. It was a wild card.
Senator:It was like and I can think of, like, the last one I lit was within the last month. I was just looking for something different, and I picked it up and I smoked it, and I had only one or two cigars, and that was it. It was perfect, extremely satisfying, but, like, it's kinda the same here. You know? I I think what I love about the Dunbarton cigars that we found is, like, they are a great source for greater variety, and I love the flavor profiles.
Senator:I just because of what we also smoke, I'm not sure that, like, you know, they push out any one cigar in the lineup. Mhmm. But I'm very grateful that they're there because every time I want variety and I've picked one up, I've been very satisfied.
Bam Bam:Love variety.
Rooster:I mean, it's one of those cigars when you're standing in front of the tower and you can't you cannot make up your mind what you're going to smoke tonight. This this could be as the wild fish is the one.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Correct. Yeah. Yeah. It's a good point.
Rooster:So it's good to have this box,
Gizmo:I think, a dear to have. Agreed. Alright, boys. Let's go to another listener email now. This one's from Lizard Peter from Nottingham.
Gizmo:He says, dear lizards, on many episodes, the question of humidification of cigars is discussed and the importance of achieving the optimum relative humidity, including dry boxing, is stressed in terms of getting the best out of a cigar. The relative humidity percentage in one's humidor is again often talked about, including that the lower the RH that you smoke, the better for Cuban cigars. However, what I would be interested to know is the RH percentage of the actual cigars you smoke on the pod at the point of cutting and lighting them. In other words, if when you cut the cigars and checked the cold draw, you had a humidimeter humidimeter, those things on Yep. Amazon or similar and could test and give the actual reading.
Gizmo:I suggest this because you clearly take great care to ensure the cigars are as close to optimum RH when you smoke them as is possible. This way, listeners, if they have a humidimeter, could ensure any cigar they are matching to the lizard's experience is at least at the same RH. Incidentally, as it is relative humidity, would it make any difference if you were smoking the same cigar in Havana rather than New Jersey, I e, if the RH is shown on the meter were the same? As someone who just has a desktop humidor, Boveda, Ziploc bag, and acrylic storage jar, all regulated by Boveda, I think that sometimes when I smoke a cigar that performs poorly, that is the RH which is not correct, may be due to a faulty ceiling of the humidor. Hence, I am thinking of buying a humidometer.
Gizmo:Incidentally, the cigars I have are either Cubans or Fabrica five. Very best wishes. Lizard Peter from Nottingham.
Bam Bam:Good cigar choices.
Gizmo:Great cigar choices. Yeah. A couple things here.
Bam Bam:Sounds like a lot of work for you.
Gizmo:Well, no. It's a couple of things here. Number one, I think the humidometers, which I do have one, I think chef actually gave me my humidometer many years ago. I think those things are inaccurate at best. And what I mean by that is if you take the end of a cigar and you put it in and you you read it, you pull it out, you put it in again, you read it, every time you touch a different leaf in that tobacco, you're going to get a different reading.
Gizmo:Then if you take the cigar and you flip it around, you cut the head, you do the same thing, you're gonna get three or four more different readings. What I think is happening with those humidometers, number one, is I don't think they're actually that accurate scientifically, quote unquote. I think they're wildly inconsistent, and I don't think it's actually giving you an like a composite understanding of the RH in the cigar. So I don't think that it's valuable for us to get data crazy here on humidity at the cut or the light. More so, I think it's about finding the technique, the process, the humidification that works for you and your cigars, like we have found for us.
Gizmo:In your environment. In the environment Yeah, that works for our reviewing
Bam Bam:and it differs from home to
Rooster:home.
Gizmo:Exactly. And like he said, New Jersey's different than Havana, which is different than Nottingham, England, is different from Australia, which is different from a dry place like Arizona or Las Vegas, right? So to me, it's getting to the point that you can create a consistent experience for yourself that works for you that then you can kind of align with what we do here. That's what I would say. Because even in the room here, we all keep our cigars differently.
Gizmo:Now the review cigars, I keep at the same, you know, humidification. I dry box the same way. I go through the same process for all of our review cigars. But each of us in our individual towers, humidification, humidors, whatever, it's always different.
Bam Bam:A touch.
Rooster:But our towers are pretty dialed in. Like, all the Cubans are around 62%, 63%, and all the new worlds are around 65%. So give or take one or two, the variant, they are calibrated to the best of our knowledge. We try to calibrate them every so often, at least I do. Yeah.
Rooster:Every six to eight months, I'll do that. Especially Pagoda. Pagoda. Oh, yes.
Bam Bam:Yes. Big calibrated. Very scientific at that house.
Gizmo:But what I will say is I don't think pulling Rh data of what we're cutting here is actually valuable to someone outside of the room or outside of our process. The thing for me that's most important is that when we're smoking and we've learned this after all these years is trying to create the same exact situation for every single cigar so that we can create a very solid basis to rate,
Senator:you know, each cigar. And I think just very simply, it's like the storage RH is really what's most important. Right? So, like, I couldn't care less if we've stored a cigar, let's say, at 62 RH, and we put this humidometer in it, and at one end, it's reading 61, and at another end, it's reading 63. Like, who really cares?
Senator:Like, what is actionable for the listener is store that cigar ideally at 62. Mhmm. It's all the same.
Rooster:And what are you gonna do once you cut once you cut it and then you put the meter in? Oh, it's too wet or too dry. You're not gonna smoke it?
Bam Bam:Yeah. Right.
Gizmo:I have done that, though, with cigars that are too tight, especially Cubans. When I've cut them, I've tried them and then I put them back in my humidor. And I've found that I get like a
Bam Bam:They open up a little to
Gizmo:40%, like reclamation rate on those cigars that would have been unsmokable if I tried. I just put them back and let them sit, let them dry out both ends. And the other thing you have to think about too is if you have cigars in your tower, one end is capped, the other end is open. Of course, the open end is gonna be drying out or humidifying whatever you're doing to it faster than the end that's not. Mhmm.
Gizmo:So when you, you know, cut that head off the cigar, then you're creating a situation which I guess maybe it's a little more equal. I don't know. But for me, the humidimeter is not a great tool
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Gizmo:For what we do. I've not enjoyed it. I've not really used it. It doesn't really work for me. Have you have any of you guys used it?
Rooster:No. No. I I haven't.
Chef Ricky:I bought another one after I gave you that one, and I might have used it once in the last three years. So
Bam Bam:It's a good investment.
Chef Ricky:Sturdy. Twice.
Gizmo:Boys. Let's go to another one. This one's from Lizard Keith. Sent a picture of the Aladino eighty five anniversary of Reserva and Robusto. He says, boys, look what came in the mail yesterday.
Gizmo:I absolutely love the box. It's a keeper. Question for you guys. I bought the sampler from Fabrica five. Do I need to let them rest in the humidor, or are they good to go from the truck?
Gizmo:I only have a small desktop humidor. A tower would be nice, but at my age of 74, it's probably not a good investment. Not as old as Pagoda or is it Rooster? L o
Bam Bam:l. Correct.
Gizmo:It's Rooster. Can't find the latest libation rum. I tried Total Wine and ABC. It's a no go. I think he's talking about the Don Pancho eight, which even we have really had a difficult time finding.
Gizmo:Have you found them online anywhere, senator, that has been easier? Because we cleared out the local store, and they looked at us and said, hey. It's gonna be a while before we get any more of this stuff in, which is a bummer. But it's hard to come by, and it's such a great price. It's a sin.
Gizmo:He says it might be a handy thing for retailers to mention cigars are good right from shipping or they need to, quote, rest for a bit before enjoying them. As always, keep up the good work, lizard seagull. So the answer to your question on Fabrica five, when you get them in, I think two weeks is the minimum, ideally thirty days of rest once they come off the truck. That would be my recommendation. Have you guys done anything shorter than that when you've gotten Fabric of Five stuff?
Gizmo:Rooster? Mean, you're off the truck
Rooster:Not all the Fabric of Five, but other stuff, yeah. Same day. Yeah.
Bam Bam:At least one.
Rooster:Some smoke fine.
Bam Bam:Out of the box, we
Rooster:try one.
Senator:Yeah, I do think the operative thing, can say there's a hard rule, I think there's a recommendation, but you don't know unless you try, and so sometimes you try something off the truck after just a few days, and you're like, wow. Like, this is ready. This is awesome. Other times you try and you say, this is why I should have waited, and it's one cigar, and you make sure that the rest of them get the time that they need.
Bam Bam:Exactly.
Senator:The other thing that I think makes a huge difference in terms of, like, readiness to smoke is the temperature or time of year wherever you're located. So it's like That's a good point. Buying cigars in the summer when it's hot and it's humid off the truck, it is almost always going to be a disappointing experience. I mean, those have sat in a delivery truck at 90 degrees, however much humidity Yeah.
Gizmo:Some like trailer in the UPS yard
Bam Bam:or something. Soft brownies by the time you
Gizmo:get them. Exactly.
Senator:Where it's like in the winter, I feel like, and I we would experience this a lot with Cuban cigars, we used to be able to order them, you know, more readily. When you would order in the wintertime, oh my goodness. Like, you'd get some boxes off the truck. They were pretty ready to smoke. Yeah.
Senator:So the time of year and the climate that you're in at that time really, I think, also plays a role in, like, how long that's gonna need to come down to whatever it should be at.
Bam Bam:One thing I do go by is the feel of a cigar. So if I get a new box and they feel fairly firm, not spongy at all, I would risk smoking one out of that box right off the truck. I'm kinda hedging it a little bit with that. That's one barometer that I use. If it's soft, then it's not even worth trying any of those cigars.
Bam Bam:Put it away for a month, three weeks. Try try see how it feels. If it starts to feel like it's, you know, a little firmer, I think you go for it and try one.
Rooster:I mean, the cigar should have a little bit of a give. It shouldn't be too spongy or like And
Bam Bam:that's easy to test without wasting a cigar.
Gizmo:The other thing for me too, you know, is is time in transit. And if there's like a 69 or a 72 Boveda in there, that's gotta sit for me.
Bam Bam:And they always come at that.
Gizmo:I can't stand retailers that ship 69. I know all of them do. It drives me insane. I wish I wish they shipped like 65. But generally, if I see that or I see it and it's been in transit for three, five, seven days, you know, some places you get it in a day.
Gizmo:That bovada has not had that much of an effect in a day. But in a week, it definitely has. So in those cases, I
Bam Bam:changed it.
Chef Ricky:So if
Bam Bam:you're getting that cigar with a 69 Bovada and it feels okay to you, would you try one?
Gizmo:If it's been in transit three to five days
Bam Bam:Even if
Gizmo:it it has a 69, I'm not even gonna touch it. Gonna throw it.
Rooster:I'm gonna
Gizmo:try it.
Bam Bam:Alright.
Gizmo:Yeah. Now if it's a day in transit or something, and it feels okay, then I would try it. Potentially. But generally, I'm waiting because I try to give myself the best shot of enjoying
Senator:Sorry, can we talk about the cigar for a second? Yeah. In the last third, I was getting more earthiness that was being described before, which was actually disappointing me because I had, like, completely it seemed lost the sweetness. I left the cigar and even actually let it almost go out and relit it, and the cigar burning cool, I'm getting like cappuccino right now.
Bam Bam:I don't disagree with you, dude.
Senator:It's awesome.
Bam Bam:Yeah. I don't disagree with you.
Senator:It's like coffee and creaminess. It's a
Bam Bam:sweet cream for me, kind of.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah. I gotta pick mine up from
Bam Bam:the ashtray. Yeah.
Chef Ricky:Yeah. And mine's done.
Bam Bam:Outstanding stick.
Gizmo:It's a great cigar tonight, boys.
Chef Ricky:Yeah, dude.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. It's time now to go to our lizard of the week presented by Bond Robert cigars. Our lizard of the week. Lizard Chase this week is gonna win a 10 count box of Bond Robert cigars from our friends over there. Thank those guys for helping us out with that, and, congrats to Lizard Chase here.
Gizmo:Gonna win a 10 count box of great cigars. He says, hey, lizards. Lizard Chase riding from LA, Lower Alabama. It seems that Warped has been hit or miss for the lizard, so I wanted to offer some recommendations to help tilt the scales of balance. Warped has been one of my favorite brands since finding this beautiful hobby.
Gizmo:I wanna start by saying that I couldn't agree more with the lizard's opinions of the Warped Black Honey. It's an overpriced and overhyped cigar that needs to be completely rethought. That being said, I'd recommend the GR 88
Bam Bam:Idiav. Devil's hands
Gizmo:the devil's hands, burn on a rose, the Santer, and the Corto x 46 for a medium smoke or the Corto Maduro x 46 and companion for a darker profile. I'm currently sitting here listening to the latest pod smoking a GR 88 pairing beautifully with the last of my La Mariolita. My man. Great rum. Many more bottles of this and other rums coming to my bar.
Gizmo:Thank you guys in advance. My question for the lizards today. What are your guys' recommendations for brick and mortars and other industry leaders to get the next generation involved and interested in cigars. I am 26, and I feel incredibly lucky to have found this hobby at a younger age through my pure interest in cigars and the ability to share them with my father, Lizard Steve. This is a question Lizard Steve and I revisit regularly and would love to hear the opinions of the lizards.
Gizmo:Lounges can often feel intimidating, overwhelming, and at times almost judgmental for someone who doesn't know their way around a humidor, proper lounge etiquette, or cigar verbiage. My belief is that hospitality will be the leading force to welcome the next generation of lizards, Someone who doesn't just see you as a transaction, but a lifelong customer. Someone who welcomes you with a smile and makes your experience something they look forward to having again. Someone willing to educate the importance of premium cigars. Someone to help them understand that infused and flavored cigars are a waste of both money and more importantly time.
Gizmo:Someone who realizes that cigars could save the next generation, getting them out of their doom scrolling cycles and instead into a cycle of putting down their devices to connect with their fellow lizards. As someone a part of the next generation, I think it's important to state that I don't want the ritual, craft, or the aspect of community to change. Rather, the quote, this is how it's always been mentality. This is a hobby that has to invite the next generation or the tradition will not get preserved. I'm interested in your thoughts.
Gizmo:Finally, I wanna thank each and every lizard for taking the time out of their busy lives on a weekly basis to bring one of the best forms of cigar content out there. I'm sure I speak for many lizards when I say that the ninety minutes a week plus that I get to unplug with you guys and listen to you boys and the old boys get together is one of the more exciting things I look forward to weekly. That time I get to spend with lizard Steve each week discussing the pod, all while sharing the many cigars and spirits we have bought because of this pod, is something that I will never forget. I will be able to look back one day and smile about all the cigars, drinks, and time we have shared because of you gentlemen. I can't thank you guys enough for that.
Gizmo:You guys have created lasting memories and traditions that I hope to pass on to my kids someday.
Bam Bam:That's a great email.
Gizmo:Thanks. Lizard Chase, and he writes at the bottom, hashtag wizard for
Bam Bam:life. Fantastic.
Gizmo:How cool is that, man?
Bam Bam:Very, very cool.
Gizmo:I love the idea of wizard Chase and his father, wizard Steve, sitting around every week and discussing the pod and sharing a cigar together and going through their week or their day or whatever it is, I just think it's so awesome that they're able to have that experience.
Bam Bam:You know, if you I just have to say something. If you're a young guy or a gal and you walk into an establishment and you're feeling judged, if that proprietor's not helping you in making a selection, if they're not helping you go through all the options, educating you, that's a place you don't want to spend any time in. And we've been through that at our former place. Lack of hospitality, it just it's it's untenable. This is not a place where you wanna be.
Bam Bam:This hobby requires hospitality. It requires everyone feeling comfortable to speak their mind, to commiserate. And if you're not getting that at where you're going, you've got to find a new place. It's awful. True.
Bam Bam:I
Rooster:mean, it's always this is a kind of a hobby that nobody knows everything about cigars. We're always learning things.
Bam Bam:Constantly learning.
Rooster:And there's a lot of times that you're sitting at the lounge, like even our lounge, and a newbie comes in who does not have a lot of experience. And you kind of don't want to sound as if a person who knows everything, but yet you want to ask the person, well, what kind of cigars do you like? What have you smoked? Can I make a recommendation? But not be overly you don't want to tell him what to smoke.
Rooster:You want to ask him, what does he like? What's his flavor profile? And then what you started out doing? And then maybe you give him a recommendation
Chef Ricky:or two.
Rooster:And then go from there. But always be hospitable.
Bam Bam:And that's how you're going to keep the younger generations.
Chef Ricky:You know, this isn't something our lounge does, I noticed a lot of lounges hold tastings, right? With brand ambassadors or certain markers. Do you think that that would be a good first time experience to see what a lounge is about or to see what the membership base is like in that lounge?
Gizmo:I don't know. I feel like in those moments they're on their best behavior.
Senator:I couldn't agree more.
Gizmo:I don't think that's a good representation because all the guys at the lounge who may be dickheads normally are trying to impress Sure. The rep from Rocky Patel.
Bam Bam:But
Gizmo:Okay? To get, you know, extra cigars or whatever it may be.
Bam Bam:You could learn a lot from those seminars.
Gizmo:No question about that. But to the question of does that give you a good representation of what the lounge culture is? No. Definitely not. No.
Gizmo:Education, certainly. Yeah, yeah, I'm not dismissing the education of a tasting event. For me, the thing is, and we've talked about each of us walking in the lounges, and even when someone new walks in here, I mean, at the end of the day, walking into that lounge, having a little anxiety, being a little nervous, being unsure if you're a good fit for them, vice versa, I think that's totally normal and is healthy. The idea though is that you sit down, you slowly start to ingratiate yourself into the conversation, into the community over time. It's gonna take time.
Gizmo:Don't act like an expert. Ask great questions. Be curious. Be interesting. It's it's that's the way you get in, I think.
Gizmo:Now if you sit down and you're a blowhard and you're telling everybody you know everything, like you said, Brewster, I think you're gonna lose. But if the culture is the right fit for you, you'll figure out very quickly that you're the right fit for the culture. And if it's not, go find a different lounge.
Chef Ricky:Or join it with Lizard Steve with your dad. At the end of the day, you'll have someone to sort of bounce things off of, and if the culture is that bad, at least you have one person that you know you could rely on.
Senator:I think the most important thing is just be yourself. Anyone I've ever connected with in a cigar lounge, whether they have been smoking cigars for a long time or haven't very much at all, if they're authentic and they're being themself, those are the kind of people that you wanna be around and wanna spend time around. We've told this story a thousand times, when I first met Giz, he said, I'm a novice cigar smoker. What he was smoking, I wouldn't smoke any of those things. He still is.
Senator:True. But he was early
Gizmo:I don't in pretend to be an expert.
Bam Bam:You're a global insider, however.
Gizmo:You say that, I don't. But I don't pretend to be an I'm a sponge man.
Senator:My point is he was early in his journey, he was authentic, he was being himself, and that resonated with me. And the same thing, even when I joined that place, it's not like I was evangelizing what I smoke. I would sit there, and I remember Bam was the one who said to me, Do you only smoke Padron? And he had to ask me that. It's not like I sat there and I'm like, only Padron makes great cigars and everyone should smoke them.
Gizmo:That's just
Senator:what I liked. He happened to notice it. We chatted about it. You just gotta be yourself.
Bam Bam:But that environment in that place, it's this small group of people that made that place.
Senator:Totally.
Bam Bam:Without us, and after us leaving, I'm not sure what that place is like now, but a newbie walking in there now
Senator:Well, the average age shot up, like, to 75.
Bam Bam:That's also true. But regardless of age, though, if you don't have, there's gotta be a group of guys in there that are open to having conversations. These discussions worked because we were open to having a discussion.
Senator:Yeah. Mean, to your point, the guy who spent the most time there, he smoked one cigar, one type of cigar
Gizmo:Twice a day.
Senator:Twice a day
Bam Bam:That's right.
Senator:Every single day for his entire life. That's right. Mean, talk about the opposite of being curious.
Bam Bam:That's the
Senator:guy wouldn't smoke anything else. Right. But it's not interesting to be around in a cigar lounge.
Bam Bam:It's true, but that type of person, he was always open to having a chat. He was very friendly. He meant well. I'd rather have that than someone that sits back and is very distant and thinks they know everything, and I can't have a chat with him. So that's the flip side, I think.
Senator:Gotta be friendly. It's true, but I just think the cigar education piece of a cigar lounge is really critical.
Bam Bam:Think all
Senator:of us, like, at lounges that we've been a member of at some point or another that we've enjoyed, like, someone has, like, shared a cigar with us, opened our eyes to something maybe we were less familiar with. Like, that's you know, I can can go to a number of places to, like, have a nice conversation with someone about random things in the world, but, like, there are a few places, it's only a cigar lounge, where, like, someone just might hand me something or share a story with me. We discovered being able to travel to Cuba from Lizard Phil here. Those are the kinds of conversations he could have told us about visiting Belgium, and like, okay, that would have been a fine conversation, but I probably could have learned that in a 100 places that have nothing to do with cigars. But talking about going to Cuba and cigars and and kinda how to navigate a place like that, those are the things that you really can only get at a cigar lounge, you want to find a community where there's that kind of exchange and information sharing.
Bam Bam:And the interesting thing, that conversation was enough for us to actually go to Cuba.
Gizmo:Yeah, six months later, we went with Lizard Phil.
Bam Bam:It's big.
Chef Ricky:Was
Rooster:And we had no idea. Correct.
Bam Bam:We didn't know where we were getting into. Relax, old boy.
Gizmo:All right. So let's go back to Lizard Chase's question really quick here. What are the recommendations for brick and mortar owners, lounge proprietors? What are the ways that they can help foster what we're talking
Bam Bam:about? I think you've perfectly defined it ten minutes ago. Being open to educating your patrons, being friendly, being a pro.
Rooster:Asking questions, finding out what have they smoked in their cigar journey, where are they coming from, what is their flavor profile, and then make a recommendation.
Bam Bam:But ultimately, they've got to be hospitable.
Gizmo:It's all about hospitality. They have to
Rooster:be hospitable. Well, you're running a business. How can you run a business without being hospitable? Well, we know many We places don't
Bam Bam:have an example of that.
Rooster:I know.
Gizmo:I know. We call it North Korea
Rooster:for Correct. A
Gizmo:It's very odd. You can't run a hospitality business like a transactional retail business. It's just a matter of fact.
Rooster:Well, first of all, the owner of the brick and mortar should himself be well educated about cigars, and sometimes they're not.
Bam Bam:True.
Senator:The know your customer piece is the biggest one. I mean, the table stakes are like, be a nice, decent human being and be hospitable. But what's really gonna build a relationship with a No, no
Rooster:a customer.
Senator:You have to. And it's like when we talk about North Korea, forget the hospitality piece that obviously was severely lacking. It's like the fact that in all those years we were members there, and we purchased more cigars than anyone who was a member at that place, there was never a time in years that that proprietor actually took the time to understand what ice smoke or anyone in this room
Gizmo:Well, he took time to understand what a rooster smoked because he went through locker.
Rooster:Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Believe me, he went through all of your locks.
Bam Bam:He told us all about what you had. We knew exactly what you had.
Rooster:He was he was looking at your the bands and the ash tray.
Gizmo:That's true.
Bam Bam:That's true.
Senator:But my point was just, you know, the guy never once recommended a cigar that I should try based on what he saw I'd like and consume. It's true. And to me, that is complete malpractice. If you're a cigar retailer, like, that's your whole job. Like, I talk about things I hate buying.
Senator:Like, I hate going into a clothing store, a mall, like, anything like that. I hate the experience. You're like hounded by all these people, they're usually not very helpful. But like I had shared, I think we talked about this years ago once, and Giz actually took me up on it and had a good experience. Nordstrom?
Senator:Yeah. We talked about Nordstrom. I'm like
Gizmo:Hey, we're big Nordstrom guys.
Senator:I knew it. It's it's the simple thing like if you, you know, need a suit or some kind of formal wear or something, there are certain Nordstrom locations where like you walk in knowing you you already don't enjoy the typical experience in a place like that, and the odds that you'll find someone who will ask you like, what are you looking for? What do you typically like to wear like this? What kind of cut would you typically buy? And like, they'll just pop out of nowhere with like three good options.
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Senator:You'll try them on, you'll be in and out in like twenty minutes flat.
Bam Bam:Those are great questions.
Senator:And it's like that's understanding your customer. They're asking you to understand and then inform your purchasing decision, and retailers have to operate the same way.
Gizmo:And I'll put one more thing on this. I think I've seen with lounge owners, and even retail shop owners who have seating or even are talking to their customers, if you're not a people person, being in a hospitable business, a hospitality business, it's not the right fit. Like, if you're not interested in if you wanna be that grump, you know, like the two guys and the Muppets that sit in the the balcony and just bark, I mean, if that's your personality, being in hospitality is not for you. Not that you need to be bright eyed and bushy tailed the whole time, but you need to care about what your customer wants and needs. Like Senator said, you need to try to serve them.
Gizmo:You need to give more than you take, ideally, as we always say. You know?
Chef Ricky:Was just going to say, being in hospitality requires you to be a chameleon. You have to be able to relate to all of your guests and understand them and get to want to know them. If you don't have that fire in you to get that done, you're wasting your time. So
Gizmo:Well said. Alright, boys. We're coming to the end of our evening now with the twelve years aged Knob Creek, Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey, and the Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust Sober Mesa, Salida Red. Any final thoughts before we go into the ratings tonight? Very good night.
Gizmo:I'm happy with the pairing.
Bam Bam:I'm happy with the two products.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. Send your text message of your ratings for both the pairing and the cigar, and then we'll get into our ratings tonight. Alright. It's time now to go into the formal liquor rating tonight on the twelve years aged Knob Creek Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey so generously provided by Lizard O. Bam.
Gizmo:Bam. You're up.
Bam Bam:I'm in a nine. I think there's a lot of merit to this. I would drink this again. You know, I'm not sure if I would go out and buy a bottle of this, but I really enjoyed how rich this experience was. The finish was so extraordinarily long, so that, for me, gave me a ton of value.
Bam Bam:I think the nose is my favorite part. The vanilla, the butterscotch was just so pronounced, and, you know, the heat really didn't bother me with this pairing. As I said earlier, it was just so overwhelming in flavor. It muted the cigar experience just to touch, so I had to delay my smoke as I took a drink, but I think a nine is a great score for this, and I would happily drink this again.
Gizmo:Strong nine. Alright, Jeff.
Chef Ricky:I'm also at a nine. I think the heat was something that your palate just needed to adjust to over time. It did take a while because the heat was high and the finish was long. But I would say towards the tail end of my maybe three ounce pour into glass, I was really enjoying it, you know. Did the heat dissipate
Bam Bam:for you?
Chef Ricky:It did. Me too.
Bam Bam:It did,
Rooster:it did
Chef Ricky:towards the end, yeah it did and it wasn't really fighting the cigar as much as it was in the beginning. But yeah, know, Bam, to your point with the vanilla and the caramel butterscotch, I was getting a ton of toffee notes here. It was really the nose was super delicious. And I think had I think that would have really carried through entirely if not for the 50% ABV here. But even with that, this was a very, very long enjoyable drink.
Chef Ricky:Great for colder nights, cooler nights. And just, you know, this is this is even a bourbon that if there's that moment where you can smoke a cigar, but you want to feel fulfilled, this is probably the perfect sip.
Bam Bam:100%.
Gizmo:So for me, it's also a nine. I love from the first sip, like you said, I think it took some adjusting to get down to where the heat was quote unquote bearable without the ice or the water, which I'm glad we did not do. I'm thinking that all of us in the room are feeling the same way. I'm glad we did not go
Senator:to water
Gizmo:or ice on this. False. No, I'm serious. I thought it was a good burger.
Senator:You'll see
Rooster:in my
Bam Bam:Did you put water in
Gizmo:yours?
Senator:At the very, very end, right before we
Bam Bam:Can somebody pass some water? Wanna try it.
Rooster:I'll try
Chef Ricky:it fresh. I don't know the end is the because by the end it aerates and it oxidizes a little bit. You lose some of that heat naturally.
Gizmo:You know what they say, oxygen oxidizes. Correct.
Chef Ricky:I might do it at the beginning just to try it, but at the end, I don't know that.
Gizmo:I love the huge flavor. I love the long finish. I love the price on this.
Chef Ricky:That's a great point.
Gizmo:12 year age,
Chef Ricky:you know? Huge flavor.
Gizmo:Huge flavor. Yeah. It's huge flavor. The finish, like you said, is
Rooster:so long.
Bam Bam:It's delicious.
Gizmo:I just think this is a big win. You know, I do think that this does trend pairing towards stronger cigars. Now, obviously, we didn't know what we were gonna smoke tonight flavor wise. None of us had had this specific cigar, me included. I thought this was gonna be a better pairing, you know, profile wise.
Gizmo:Flavor wise, I thought it was very good. Next time I drink this, if I were to pair it with cigars, I'd probably go for something a little stronger. However, I think it's a really good bourbon, $65. It's a home run. Twelve year age statement.
Gizmo:Can't be beat. You could find it anywhere. Win, win, win, win, win. It's a nine for me.
Senator:Senator. So I'm also at a nine. This is one of the most enjoyable bourbons we've done in a
Gizmo:long time. Shout out, Lizard O.
Senator:Yeah. He did a really great job. The nose is intoxicating. Like, for whatever reason, this is just one of the best smelling bourbons. It's like so odd to say that, but like, I will it will stick with me
Chef Ricky:Mhmm.
Senator:What the nose of this bourbon is like. The rich flavor that this thing delivers at this price point, like, stands on its own even without thinking of having this with a cigar. Like, we were talking about having this after a meal. Mhmm. I could see, like, after Thanksgiving, like, this would be a great drink to pour.
Senator:The finish is so long, so delicious. It hits all the right notes. The the one thing for me, you know, why it wasn't a 10 is the heat is just a bit more than I would want. Now what I couldn't understand is understanding that Lizard O normally smokes Cuban cigars, I struggle to understand how this can pair particularly well with Cubans.
Bam Bam:That's right.
Senator:So what I did right before rating is just put a little bit of water to see what that does for this, and it really tames it. Really? Now is it as you know, is it gonna deliver that crazy rich long finish? Absolutely not. Some shorter finish, but the flavor is still delicious, and, like, I could drink this in the summer or with a Cuban cigar as long as there's some ice or a little bit of water in there.
Senator:So that adds more versatility to it, which is great, but, you know, we've been spoiled to I think find a lot of like truly perfect or exceptional spirits that don't require water to even smoke with a Cuban cigar, or to have that level of versatility, and so that's the only reason I still went with the nine and not the 10, but for all those reasons, it's a very strong nine. I would happily drink this again. I really like this bottle, by the way. I'm just gonna say I think it's a beautiful bottle. Even, you know, Chef mentioned making certain cocktails with this, the rich flavor this imparts.
Bam Bam:Mean Old fashioned would just sell. Oh my gosh.
Chef Ricky:Is perfect Old fashioned.
Senator:It'd be excellent. So for all those reasons, a strong recommend at nine.
Bam Bam:So I also put some water in, just a touch, and it tamed it dramatically, but the flavor, as you said, is still there. I'd like to hear from Lizard O. I think I asked this maybe twenty minutes ago. I'd like to know if he's putting water and ice with it because that is the only way I can see you smoking a Cuban cigar. With the spirit, you have to add a little water.
Gizmo:I will ask him.
Bam Bam:Yeah. And you should try it.
Gizmo:I will. Yeah. I'll try it after we stop tonight.
Rooster:Yeah. I doubt he does.
Gizmo:I I'm with you on that.
Bam Bam:Yeah. Yeah.
Gizmo:Yeah. Yeah. I think so, but I'll find out. Yeah. Alright, boys.
Gizmo:The formal liquor rating tonight on the 12 years age Knob Creek, Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey is a nine point zero. Let's compare that to the other Knob Creek we did. The nine years aged on episode 102 scored a 7.8. So this is quite a bit better than a nine point zero. And, boys, it's time now to move into the formal lizard rating tonight on the Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust Sobremesa, Soleda Red.
Gizmo:Rooster, you're up.
Rooster:I really like the cigar. I think right from the beginning, the the size of the cigar was perfect. The 46 ring gauge by six onefour, it's a great size. And I'm kind of glad that this only comes in that Botola. It makes it easy.
Rooster:You want to pick up a box, that's the one you want. The construction of the cigar was pretty good, although right in about the last third, I had a little bit of an issue, but it kind of self corrected. So no points taken off for that. The cigar started off with a nice chocolatey note. It was creamy.
Rooster:That chocolatey note kind of became more like a deeper espresso, like a dark espresso note. It picked up and it kind of started off kind of like milder side of medium, and then it picked up a little bit in strength towards the end. But it was still a very smooth, balanced smoke. I love the flavors of the cigar. I would definitely buy a box of the cigar.
Rooster:The question remains where it would fit in rotation. If you were having multiple smokes in a day, how does it fit? Do you smoke it at the end, or do you smoke something else after this? The last third of the cigar actually did get a little bit earthier for me. And lost there was a little bit of a sweetness that was coming through maybe in the midway point, which wasn't overpowering, but it was there a little bit.
Rooster:But towards the end, I kind of lost that.
Bam Bam:Now you picked it up at the end.
Rooster:I picked it up, but it was covered in ash, so all I got was ash. Not a good idea. So I'm at a solid nine on the cigar. I think it's definitely worth and I'm kind of glad that it only comes in a 13 count boxes. So it's easier to swallow that price point.
Rooster:I would definitely buy a box. Again, I'm not going to be smoking this maybe once a month, if that. But it would be nice to have this box in your tower because you know, when you're looking for something different, this kinda hits that spot.
Bam Bam:Sure.
Rooster:So I'm at I'm at a nine. Alright. Senator.
Senator:So I'm I'm right there with Rooster. I'm at a strong nine. What I really liked about this cigar, it was full flavor all the way through. Like Rooster said, in terms of strength, like, it was on the milder side of medium to, like, medium for definitely the first half even for me, I would say. And then the second half, like, is when it started to pick up a little bit, which I liked, and I think it ended, like, medium full, which was nice.
Senator:In terms of the flavor profile, I mean, the cocoa note that we talked about, like, early on, I really enjoyed. Midway through is when I started to get a bit more creaminess, which was nice. In the final third, there was a significant period where it got very earthy, like you were saying, and that's when I was worried that the last third was gonna disappoint. But for me, at the very end of the last third, I just suddenly got like this blast of coffee and cream. If I got that through the whole final third, I may have even been at a 10.
Senator:Like, it was so delicious. It just was a portion of the final third. It wasn't necessarily characteristic of the whole final third. The construction, at least on mine, was flawless. I I really have to give Saka credit.
Senator:Like, these were mine at least was really, really well made. It's a handsome looking cigar. I love this in terms of variety. I think for me, like, what precluded the 10 is even at the very end, I never was able to answer the question for myself of, like, where would this slot in the rotation? But I would buy a box.
Senator:I do think I prefer this to the regular Sobremesa. So I'm really glad that we did this. And, yeah, it's just a it's an excellent blend. I mean, I you know, for me, if it just could have maintained some more sweetness all the way through, like these small little things, like, that's what could have reached the 10, but, you know, who am to complain with someone who's blended a nine point, you know, cigar? Obviously, he's done an excellent job here.
Senator:So really nice.
Rooster:This is a cigar that you have to pace yourself with. Totally. You cannot smoke this too fast.
Chef Ricky:Correct. It's It's
Rooster:gonna heat cigar up on you. It almost doesn't allow you to
Chef Ricky:smoke. Yeah, Right. So
Gizmo:for me, it's also a nine. I mean, how to rate the ultimate wild card smoke. I think if I look back at all the cigars we've smoked that we've loved, they kind of are in this purgatory of rotation. Where does it fit? How does it slot?
Gizmo:Where do you put it? How often do you smoke it? This one is probably at the top of that list as far as the question marks around it. What's crazy is how great of a blend it is. I think it's a really, really good cigar.
Gizmo:Like Senator was saying, I think this is well superior to the Cervantes Fino that it replaced that we reviewed. I think it's better than the other Sobremesas I've had, certainly than the Brulee, which Tood
Bam Bam:up, totally.
Gizmo:You know, isn't really in the same family, but it is a Sobremesa. I do think I prefer the Sincompromiso to this cigar. I like that number four. I think that I like that line better than this.
Bam Bam:Well, that's very berry forward, that
Gizmo:guy. But that's also an easier cigar for me to reach for very regularly. Mhmm. I do think that the price is very fair on this for the experience we had tonight. I think all of us got a pretty damn good long smoke out of this.
Gizmo:Maybe an hour thirty five, hour forty five, something like that. I think it performed very, very well. Brilliant construction, great combustion, amazing flavor. All around, a very, very good cigar. For me, it wasn't perfect.
Gizmo:I really enjoyed it. A lot of question marks here, but I'm very, very happy with the cigar tonight.
Bam Bam:I would like to know what question marks you have specifically.
Gizmo:Where it's gonna slot? When am I gonna smoke this cigar?
Bam Bam:Yeah. Yeah. Other than that, Any other questions with the cigar itself?
Gizmo:I think the very good. It's not a perfect blend for me. Again, not to the point that I'm gonna be reaching for it very often, but I think it's excellent. I think you did a great job with it. Everything about the cigar worked very well.
Gizmo:It just wasn't perfect.
Rooster:But are we really rating the cigar?
Bam Bam:Here we go. I
Rooster:mean, I mean, are we are we keeping in mind, like, where it's gonna fit in our rotator?
Gizmo:I'm not rating it based on that. I'm not rating it based on that. I do think that that's interesting about the cigar that none of us can really place it.
Senator:Question is what what did you want more of that you didn't get? I definitely said for me what I wanted more of that I
Gizmo:didn't get. I would have loved a little bit more sweetness. I would have loved a little less earth, especially in the last third. Aside from that, it's a very good cigar. It wasn't perfect for my palate.
Gizmo:All those other question marks aren't factoring into my rating tonight. If they were, it might even be lower. It's not. For me, it's a nine. Chef.
Chef Ricky:I've been waiting for a while to say this. For me, this cigar was brilliant. Excellent. I think everything about it was intentional. We're all having a hard time trying to figure out where to slap the cigar, but yet a box is only 13 cigars.
Chef Ricky:We'll go back to the initial aroma on the wrapper. Lightly acidic, sweet all at the same time, and then you light it in that initial puff, you get some licorice notes, which isn't very common in the cigars that we smoke. And from there, it just developed into some cream, some nuttiness, a little pecan. I mentioned that sort of light maple syrup on a thick pancake happening for me. The final third, I got a little bit of black pepper, just a little like, hey, I'm here, but not enough to overwhelm the cigar or overtake it.
Chef Ricky:So I appreciated the depth that it delivered. I loved how handsome the cigar looked. I love that, you know, I barely needed to touch it up. I did touch it up just a little bit to straighten out the burn line, but that was just more OCD than anything. For me, the cigar delivered well.
Chef Ricky:After my palate adjusted, it held up well to the 50% bourbon ear. So I really enjoyed this. Maybe it's not an everyday smoke, but I'm okay with that because there's only 13 cigars in a box. So I think it was very well done on Sakwa's part. I really enjoyed the cigar and for me it's a 10.
Gizmo:All right, Bam.
Bam Bam:Wow, after all that, it's a 10. So I'm at a strong 10. Wow. Yeah, I am.
Gizmo:Listen, I don't dispute it.
Senator:No, no, no. Respect this.
Gizmo:It's totally valid. So here's
Bam Bam:my thing.
Gizmo:Both of you guys.
Bam Bam:I wasn't expecting the experience that I had because the aroma on the wrapper, as Chef mentioned, really threw me off personally. I didn't like it. And that first eighth of an inch, just a few minutes after lighting, it was great off the light, but I couldn't place it. It felt for me a little I felt a little overwhelmed by the cigar, and it settled in at by the half inch mark, and it then started that whole journey for me. I mentioned this.
Bam Bam:That final third wasn't earthy for me. The type of earthiness that I was getting was more of a walnut, which in and of itself is kind of minerally, but peanut as well, which for me, there was a balance. And I got creaminess. It was a velvety smoke for me all the way through. I felt fully satisfied, honestly, from beginning to end.
Bam Bam:And I was getting after I got past that walnut nuttiness, it did get a little it ramped up in sweetness just for me at the very, very end, and honestly, the bloody end of it, at a half inch, was very smooth and creamy. For a cigar that's so full flavored, that's pretty rare. And taking it to in count in the price, this is something I will definitely smoke again. So I'm at a strong 10. Really love this cigar tonight.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. The formal lizard rating tonight on the Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust Sobremesa Salita Red is a 9.4.
Bam Bam:Very nice score.
Gizmo:Great rating. Let's compare that to the other five Dunbarton Tobacco and Trust cigars we've done on the pod on episode 110. We did the Muestra de Saka, the Bewitched, scored an 8.7. On episode 128, the Sin Compre Miso number four scored a 9.4. On episode 140, the Sobre Meso, Espino, so the little brother to this that got discontinued Mhmm.
Gizmo:Effectively for this scored a 7.8. So a big jump there. On episode 179, the Umbogog in bronze back scored a 9.3. Very close. Bam, give that a 10.
Gizmo:On episode 195, the Sobremesa Brule in Robusto scored an 8.2. Yeah. So this is tied with the Cincompromiso number four
Bam Bam:A great cigar.
Gizmo:And a 9.4, the best Dunbarton's. Good cigar. Very, very good night tonight,
Bam Bam:boys. Excellent.
Gizmo:I mean, both entrants were awesome tonight.
Bam Bam:Like I said, they both stand on their own two legs independently. They're fantastic products. Very well done.
Gizmo:And I really wonder when I'm gonna have either of these again. I'm serious. I think that's a fair comment. But I don't
Bam Bam:know if that matters. If it's a great product
Gizmo:It doesn't matter to the rating. It does matter to the conversation.
Bam Bam:But if it's not for you on a weekly, monthly basis, it could still be rated highly if it's a great quality
Gizmo:product. It did rate highly. It did. Did. Did knock it for that.
Senator:Correct. But it's right. I mean, look, I mean, have plenty of, you know, special occasion cigars that we Right. Give a high rating to.
Gizmo:Certainly.
Senator:We smoke those a few times a year.
Bam Bam:We're gonna put kids on a pit. I'm done.
Gizmo:Alright, boys. A great night tonight. We have to congratulate again lizard Chase and lizard Steve, his dad, for winning lizard of the week. They're gonna win a 10 count box of Bon Robert cigars. Of course, boys, we have to thank our presenting sponsor, Fabrica five.
Gizmo:Great cigars coming out of Honduras. Mhmm. Check them out. Fabrica005.com, and use our code lizard pod for 10% off the entire store. Of course, small batch cigar boys, our sampler, I'm hoping it's back in stock soon.
Bam Bam:Oh, yeah.
Gizmo:It's out of stock right now as as of this recording, but use code lizard 15 for 15% off your entire order over there, including our sampler. So hopefully, they get that back in stock very soon. Let's review one more time, boys. The 12 years aged Knob Creek Kentucky straight bourbon whiskey scored a nine point zero, and the Dumbarton Tobacco and Trust Sobre Mesa, Salida Red scored a 9.4.
Chef Ricky:And we have to thank Lizard O for this amazing
Gizmo:have thank Lizard
Chef Ricky:O for
Gizmo:the awesome Nob Creek, which again, rating a nine at 50%, how hot it came in
Bam Bam:For a bourbon?
Gizmo:Turpentine for BAM. Correct. Everything. I mean, that's a really good rating.
Bam Bam:So In this room, it did really well.
Gizmo:So he also sent two more that we're gonna do in the coming months. Wow. Wow. Wow. Yeah.
Gizmo:He's awesome. Really appreciate Lizard O. And, boys, what a great night tonight. Awesome. And, we'll see everybody next week.
Gizmo:Hope you enjoyed this episode. Thanks for joining us. You can find our merch store and ratings archive at our brand new website, loungelizardspod.com. That's loungelizardspod.com. Don't forget to leave us a rating and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform.
Gizmo:If you have any comments, questions, if you wanna reach out, say hello, tell us what you're smoking, email us. Hello at loungelizardspod.com. You can also find us on Instagram at loungelizardspod. We really appreciate your time, and we'll, we'll see you next week.