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Social Justice - A Conversation
Announcer 0:00
You're listening to local programming produced in KU NV studios. The content
Wesley Knight 0:06
of this program does not reflect the views or opinions of 91.5 jazz and more the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, or the Board of Regents of the Nevada System of Higher Education.
Charles Stanton 0:18
Good evening. This is Professor Charles Stanton, I'm a professor of Boyd School of Law,
Blanca Pena 0:23
and my name is Blanca Pena. I am a third year law student at the Boyd School of
Charles Stanton 0:26
Law, and this is Social Justice a conversation,
Blanca Pena 0:30
a conversation.
Charles Stanton 0:33
Well, good evening, everybody. Welcome good to have all of you back listening with us. Professor Charles here with my cohort, Blanca, and just a couple of things I wanted to talk about, but, but, but one item which we can, I think, can open up the show with, has to do with the performance of bad bunny at the Super Bowl. And I will admit that I am, I am not really a devotee of of the bunnies music, but I was enormously impressed by the performance that he gave, and what I got out of the performance, really was that he was trying to promote a unity between people, people getting along well together. I think the flags that were displayed and all those different things were something that were inspiring. I was inspired by it. I thought it was a really it was a really good show. I was in the car yesterday, and I was listening to Piers Morgan, who was a commentator on CNN, and he had worked for the BBC, and he was talking, and he he sort of, he's sort of a conservative voice, but he was talking about the performance, and he said, he said, you know, he said, I've basically seen every halftime show, you know, since the Super Bowl started, he said, and to me, he said that was by far the best show that he'd ever seen. So So I was listening to that. And then he brought he brought on a guest, Megan Kelly came on, and she was completely the opposite of what Pierce Morgan had said that, you know, she she didn't like the bunny, she didn't like his presentation, and all those different things. And I'm listening to this thing, and I know that Megyn Kelly is very conservative, so, you know, I took that into consideration. And a lot of people, just because of political considerations will will be negative. I mean, I think any objective person who listened to what he said and the way he performed and the atmosphere around it wasn't that. It was an atmosphere of inclusivity, of bringing people together, but then, but then, as the thing is wrapping up, the icing on the icing on the cake came so the cake was baked, but they needed icing, and the icing, the real reason why she felt so strongly against the bunny was because he sang in Spanish. So I'm listening to this sound, saying to myself, you know, you can't win. You can't win in this, in this, in this culture, because what is our country supposed to be about? But but the expression of our unique identities, which this man is trying to present in a very powerful message to to all of us. And I thought of myself when I would go, you know, to the to the to the Opera House in New York City. And you I would go to some of these operas, and some were in Italian, and some were in German, and they would go on for hours, but nobody who was presenting those musical those musical productions would be considered to be anti American or anti patriotic. It was it was part of their culture. It was part of the history of of their the nation in which they came from, the the people who wrote these plays and operas and arias and everything. Yet, when this man sings with pride about his his background and his his ancestry and the hope that people can, you know, come together, and all the rest of those things, he's criticized for speaking and singing in Spanish, and I just don't get it.
Blanca Pena 4:52
No, I share that sentiment with you too. I don't understand why we're so bothered by a man celebrating. Multiple cultures and celebrating unity and the Americas as a whole. But that same anger isn't translated to the Epstein files and to horrible people that actually do horrible things throughout the world, to so many people. I, you know, unlike you professor, I am a big bad bunny fan. I I've loved reggaeton since I was a little girl. I grew up listening to it. I grew up on Daddy, Yankee dono mod, like all of those people. And I even saw bad bunny in concert a few years ago when he put out his other his previous album, unvenano sinti sinti, and he's great and and I just, I would just like to say his, his performance was very meaningful to me as someone who is here as a Mexican immigrant in America, because he touched on so many aspects of our culture. Even there was just a lot of easter eggs. You know, there was the the kid who was falling asleep at the party, who he had to wake up. You know how many times I've fallen asleep on a row of three chairs because my parents wouldn't leave the wedding, the quinceanera, the party like, whatever it was, and you know, not to mention the flags or even just the he played a song towards the end called El aagon, which talked about how in Puerto Rico, they experience blackouts a lot because their power grid isn't stable. And so it talks about how the US claims Puerto Rico as a territory, but it does nothing to help. And it talks about the resilience of Puerto Rican people during those times and and how they come together when the government isn't putting forth what they should be and how it's always the community that puts everything that they can back into the island, to get the lights back on, to celebrate each other, to make sure everything, everything and everyone is fine. And there was so many other things, but it just, it was great to watch it. It was great to see someone be such an inspiration for so many people. I loved when he gave the Grammy to that little boy, you know, depicting who he was back then. And I mean, just 10 years ago, bad money was bagging groceries at a at a store, at a grocery store. I don't know if you knew that, but just 10 years ago, he was just doing, doing that, and then on the side, writing some lyrics and trying to make some music. And 10 years later, he was able to win Album of the Year and perform on the biggest stage in the world, arguably, and and it's just, it's great to see. I love seeing it. I I don't even want to, I mean, just, I hate entertaining the hate because, because it's so it's a waste of time. In my opinion, people are mad for the wrong things. Spanish is just a language. You know, he's not dividing anyone he's been making, he's been making Spanish music his entire career. You know what? I mean? It would have been different if bad bunny made music in English his entire career and then just for the Super Bowl translated everything in Spanish, that would have been a little bit like, Okay, why? Right? But he was just performing his songs the way that he wrote them and the way that he recorded them, it makes no sense to me why these people are so angry about it, and not even to mention English is not even the official language of the country. So what are we really doing here? We're just wasting time while the billionaires are eating babies.
Charles Stanton 8:35
Yeah, you know, it's interesting when you say that, because it just struck me listening to these different commentaries that this this man took this enormous pride in his upbringing and his background and his culture. What is? What is that block that prevents our society from accepting that and embracing that was what struck me. And you know, I've seen that so many times, not just with Latino artists, but with black artists as well, where there's always like, you know, they'll be reviewed, but there's always a qualifier as to how their performance is interpreted instead of just seeing, you know what this person did, what that what that contribution was, that transcended their ethnicity or any of those things. But in many ways, it's, it's part of our it's part of our culture that we, I guess, look down on people because we feel well, we know because we came from a certain place, other than when, other than where they came from, that makes us superior. But in the eyes of God, everybody's the same. There's no superior. Everybody is, you know, creature of God and a creature of, you know, I guess you'd say being in the world as equals with everybody else, that seems, it seems to have gotten it. What seems to have gotten lost, you know, you mentioned you were talking about, you know, you know, Jeffrey Epstein and all these different things. And I it just struck me that the people who are moralizing and judging the bunny are the same people who are basically covering up yeah, the scandal, which is day by day, becomes more and more horrific as we get the testimonies, not of not of even the victims of the of this evil, but the actual testimonies through their own words and emails and texts of the actual people who are behind this thing, yeah, who are basically, who basically represent the power structure of the country that that reveals itself without any illusions, as totally corrupt, yeah?
Blanca Pena 11:18
I mean, yeah, people, people are placing their frustrations in the wrong place. For sure, I thinking about what you said about seeing the art for what it is. I remember thinking about like, remember Kendrick's performance last year, and how that was also very like, impactful. It did have a political message, message, and it said a lot about who he is as a black American, right? And I was thinking about it, and I even had seen this on social media too, but people were saying that that performance was in English, and that also went over people's heads. So it's really not even about the language. I just think people are easily led by what they're told. And seeing last week how Pam Bondi was just on on one to say the absolute least. I mean, I saw the picture of the Epstein survivors behind her with their hands raised and everything. Because I think the line of questioning was like, if you feel comfortable, stand up, if you're a survivor of Jeffrey Epstein, they stood up, and then the next question was, raise your hand if you have yet to speak with either Donald Trump or the Department of Justice about any of this. And they all rose their hand, and Pam Bondi was just ignoring them. And I mean, I don't even these people don't deserve these jobs. These people deserve to be far away from any power that they could possibly get, because it's, it's insane the way that she was deflecting and gaslighting and lying and lying.
Charles Stanton 12:52
Well, I'll just, I'll just say this. I'll just say this when you're put in a position to be the Attorney General of the United States, that is a very high calling. It is not it is not a minor position. You, in many ways, are the regulator, the interpreter, the the delegator of the law, you are a woman as well. These crimes are so horrific that they deserve a societal response of huge proportions because the nature of what, what has been going on and what, and and in many places, still goes on over the past 3040, years, is, is just an abomination. And I will say this, and it was one of the things I was thinking about, you know. And we were talking about, you know, you know, the bunny and you know, the way, the way Hispanic people have been treated throughout this whole situation with the, you know, deportation and everything, there's a connection, I think, between in that, between that and the Jeffrey Epstein thing, and the connection that I see is just as just as people of minority, background and ethnicity have been treated in this way, is also the way women, young women, girls, have been treated for many, many generations as well, that you have people in authority in various fields in our country who have. Participated in all of these crimes, to harm women, to harm children, and to act with impunity and do whatever they're going to do, knowing full well, knowing full well that because women do not have equality in our country, we can get away with a lot of this stuff. Now, people will say, well, well, how can you say, how can you say, Professor, that women don't have equality because there's more women in the country than men. Yes, there are more women in the country than there are men, but that doesn't, that doesn't equate to equality. I mean, I mean, if you just look at the abortion decision, the abortion decision basically says a woman doesn't have a right to do what she wants to do with her own body. So if you, if you operate from that baseline, then all these other things become, become feasible, reasonable. Yes, the people can. Oh, well, you know, it's part of growing up that somebody could be abused or something, or or, you know, maybe people misinterpreted what these men were doing, but there's no misinterpretation of what they were doing. If you, if you go through, if you go through a lot of the emails in what's what's been released, and what's been released is only a tip of the iceberg as to actually, what was going on. What not just some of the men that have already been identified, but I can imagine, with a whole slew of people in not just the United States, but all these other countries who are participating in this thing. Why isn't there? Why isn't there the national outrage against this stuff, that all these terrible things have happened, and you have, you have all the ramifications people committing suicide and all the rest of this stuff, and yet the country, like it, doesn't seem to be it doesn't seem to be responding as the way I imagined that it would when all this stuff started to come out.
Blanca Pena 17:05
Yeah, I can't even tell you how many times in the past week or so, I've just gone down the rabbit holes of seeing what is on the files. And it's, it's atrocious, it's, it's, it's things I couldn't even begin to imagine that others could do to other people. It, it really goes so far. I mean, I don't know, I don't know how much you've seen, but i A few nights ago was literally reading about this little girl who who got her, who was skinned while she was alive, and she was just this little baby girl. I think she was around like seven or eight years old. It was horrible. And I don't know how we can go on about this, but you know what? You know what? I think the reason why they're doing all of this for, I mean, the government has had these files for years, right? You would think that anybody who saw these things would want to release them immediately, but they kept them, and they went so far as to redact names, not not victims' names, not survivors' names, but the people that were clients, right? And I almost feel like they're doing this to test us, to see how numb we can get. You know what I mean? They put this the you said, the tip of the iceberg. They put the tip of the iceberg out, and they see that everyone is still paying taxes, they see that everyone is still clocking into work, they see that everyone's still going to school, that that to them, lets them know that what they're doing can be continued, yeah, and that they will face no consequences at all? Yeah, and I think, I mean, I don't know the answers to this. I'm just a 24 year old girl, right? But I wish there was an answer to how we can respond to these people, because we've seen it in history done before, right? We've seen, we've seen regimes fall and empires collapse because they did more than what they should have. But I don't know how it's going to work out here in the modern days, with all of this going on. It's, it's, it's inexplicable.
Charles Stanton 19:10
Well, I think, and I've said this before, and I've said it, I've said it in my teaching, and I've and I've said it in other places. I think the only, I think the only response, the only response that we can have now to try to change the dynamic, is to have the victims, to have the victims go to the White House and be at the White House every single day, every single day, they can be at the White House, all these people who are victimized and shame, if that's possible at this point, which is a debatable point, shame the people who are part of this and shame the man who's in charge of the country they're so less. Yes and confront. Well, if, I think, I think if, if there can, if there can be more. You know, when, when the civil, when the civil rights movement started, it was basically considered as hopeless, that there wouldn't, there would never be any civil rights. But then, you know, Rosa Parks got on the back of the got out of the back of the bus, and people, people acted, and people marched and people protested. But I think, I think what has to be done is those, those victims, have to have to change the their modus operandi, going to these hearings, listening to what these people have to say, that's not going to work, because they're not, they're not going to tell the truth. They're they're invested. They're invested in people not finding out the truth. So the only thing that you can do is show show them that truth, show them what they've done to you by making that commitment, that you're not going away, and this is going to be a daily thing, and you're going to be at the White House every single day until you get satisfaction as to what was done to you, because there's no other way to do it at this point. Because these people, as you say, you're not going to appeal to their morality, but you can, you can appeal to their to their special interest, which is staying in power. And eventually, I think this should, I think this should be done all over the country, not just in the White House. I think in every single state, the people who are, who have been, have been victimized, should be at the state capitol, pressuring the people who are in those positions, whether they be the governor, the Secretary of State, or the senators or people in the House of Representatives, to get justice. Because to me, to me, these are, these are the most horrific crimes that you can commit. There is evidence of these crimes that is worthy of federal investigation, and there's no reason why this, this can't, this can't happen to me. That's how I look at it. Yeah, you know, I totally agree, yeah. And I think I think that, I think that what you were saying about, you know, testing the waters. I think that's very true. Because I think there are they are they are seeing how far they can go and what they're doing and what and what our and what our reaction is going to be, yeah, in the same way we were talking before we went on the air, about the senators and Congress people who they were trying to indict people who had served our country in the military, you know, as to telling, telling everybody that, well, you know, we served in the military, but we were not there to obey stuff that's illegal. And they were, they were going to whoever they were going to prosecute them. They were going to, you know, demote people who had a very great service record. They were going to, they were actually intending to take senator Kelly and put senator Kelly back on active duty. This is another insane, insane thing that we do. But ultimately, though, ultimately, though it's the people, though it's us, it's what our country, what our country needs to do. You know, we do, we're here, you know, every, every Monday night, to do this show, and we try as best as we can to speak the truth as to what we see. You know that I think at this point, from what's going on is it is certainly an objective truth. It's not, it's not the truth because you say it or because I say it, it's the truth because it's there in front of everybody. But it depends. It depends on, it depends on our, our population, taking these things as seriously, I think, as it must be taken, because if you're, if you have a society that that's willing to go along with how these, these women, young women and children, have been victimized, that is like a scary thought. You're just racing. Well, okay, it happened. What can we do about it? Well, what you can do about is you bring people to justice who committed these crimes. Because if you don't do that, then the law is meaningless.
Blanca Pena 24:39
I think we've just lost. I mean, not we, but they. I think they all just lost a sense of of even just bottom line professionalism, right, like the things that were supposed to be bare minimum we don't even have anymore. And I mean, it was, I don't know if you saw this, but last week on Twitter, I saw that one of the. Yeah, it was either the ice Twitter account or the DOJ Twitter account, one of those, or DHS, whichever one it was, but they were getting into little tips with Cardi B about because she criticized them, and then they told her something about something that she had done in the past. What are we doing here? What are these government agencies doing? Getting into arguments with celebrities on Twitter. It's insane. And again, I think I've said this before in the other shows, but it really should have ended way back, like way even, even when that man tried to run for the first time, right? It's like he mocked a disabled reporter. He talked about grabbing women by the pee. He like, even in the 90s, he refused to rent to black people, like, like, this was already a person. He dodged the draft so many times. He humiliated his first wife, now she's dead, buried in his golf course, not even tending to where she is. This is a horrible person. This is a person that cares about nobody but himself. And I really, really struggle to see the appeal and the loyalty and where that comes from and why we keep not we again? Why they keep making excuses for him? Right? Because if I have yet to see one video of this man speak about policy in an intelligent way, speak about the country in an intelligent way, it's insane. One of the things that struck me watching Pam Bondi was, you know, they were asking her about all of these horrible people, these pedophiles and stuff like that. And she's like, Well, why don't we focus on the stock market? Because that's been doing really well. Oh, okay, I get it. So, so, because the stock market is doing well, then old man can touch little babies like that is your that's your equation, that's your excuse. Yeah, I saw this, this post, I You could tell I'm just on the internet all day, but I saw this post that was like, Pam Bondi fails to realize that Nixon did not get arrested, but his Attorney General did. And I think that was very interesting to say, because it's true. She's acting as if she has immunity. She's acting as if she will be protected. She's acting as if nothing is going to happen to her. So she goes to these hearings, she puts her right hand up, she says, I do. Or she puts her hand on the Bible, and she says that she won't lie. And then she gets up there, and then she lies over and over and over again, acting as if consequences don't exist. And that should trouble us, if the people in power start acting like there will be no consequences for anything that they do that should scare us, because that means, like I said, they're going to be testing the waters, and they're not going to stop as long as we let them keep going.
Charles Stanton 27:54
Yeah. Well, I think, I think that's exactly true. I think that, I think that a large part of the country has tuned out the reality of what's going on today. But I also think I also think that that the retention of support for what's going on has to do with the long rooted history of our country, ours, our country, in many ways, has never been able to escape its founding, the racism, the mistreatment of, you know, the slaves that were brought over from Africa, the thievery of the land of the Indians, etc, etc. That's part of America. And, you know, you you accurately state all the deficiencies that are going on. But a lot of these people fall back on the idea of the White nation, white nationhood, populism, all this stuff. Yeah, that's like, that's like the stop gap, that even though the country is dissembling and everything, this is what they've always been taught, and this is what, this is what they rely on, that even though the economy's tanked, you can't afford to buy food, the medical care is gone. We have the white America in their minds, in their minds, and
Blanca Pena 29:25
that's what they think it should be. But thank you all for tuning in tonight. We'll see you all next week.
Charles Stanton 29:31
Thank you so much. God bless. Bye. Bye.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai