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Welcome to University of Minnesota Extension's Nutrient Management Podcast. Each month we bring you the latest research in nutrient management for crops and how you can incorporate the latest tips and best management practices to your farm.
Hello, and welcome to the Nutrient Management Podcast from University of Minnesota Extension. As always, I'm Jack Wilcox with Communications here at Extension.
Jack Wilcox:It's that time of year again for the Fall Fertilizer Outlook. We'll talk about what's upcoming for the rest of the season and what decisions need to be made. I have three guests with me here today. Can you introduce yourselves, please?
Jeff Vetsch:Hi. This is Jeff Vetsch. I'm a research supervisor here at the Southern Research and Outreach Center in Waseca.
Brad Carlson:Brad Carlson, extension educator, work out of the regional office in Mankato. We work statewide dealing with nutrient management and water quality issues.
Daniel Kaiser:This is Daniel Kaiser. I'm a nutrient management specialist with the Department of Soil, Water and Climate. I'm located out of the Saint Paul campus.
Jack Wilcox:Jeff, let's start with you and talk about prices. If prices are expected to stay how they have been, what are some alternative decisions that farmers might want to consider?
Jeff Vetsch:Yeah. Well, we'll just we'll talk about prices first. I I got some information from DTN. It was Todd Neely who put this out on August 5. And anhydrous has been trending down as has UAN, 32%.
Jeff Vetsch:Anhydrous is down about a $150 a ton from the May high, but that is still $200 greater than last year at this time. And we expect, you know, people are gonna be thinking about preordering and prepaying and making those contracts here sometime in the next, you know, three to six weeks or or less if if it's available to contract for to purchase. So just that's that's what we're we're looking at right now, still higher than last year at this time. UAN is also down from the May high about $40, but still and also down from last year about $40, but still not, certainly not cheap and and on a price per pound event standpoint. MAP and debt prices are greater than last year at this time.
Jeff Vetsch:Potash is about the same, and urea is down about a $160 from the May high, but still a $140 greater than last year at this time.
Brad Carlson:And I looked at, some stuff that I think Russ Quinn put out, and and, the the one thing that I find a little a little strange is that, actually, the UAN 32% is cheaper on a per pound nitrogen basis than urea is, which is really odd. The urea prices, because of the amount of that that's coming out of The Middle East and some of the issues in The Middle East, urea prices really been kind of a roller coaster. If you look at the wholesale price of anhydrous, it's at, roughly 60¢ a pound, certainly high, but we kinda dealt with 60¢ nitrogen this spring. And so I guess it's not not that unusual. As far as whether or at what price point the local retailers are gonna come into, I'm not exactly sure.
Brad Carlson:Those decisions usually get made at kind of a higher level with the retailers, and so the the retail agronomists simply are kinda told what they're going to be, and so a lot of the folks I have contact with that don't have those prices yet. You know, I it's gonna be obviously contracting fall anhydrous. I don't think really any of them are or will contract spring urea. And so usually, those prices don't show up until January. So the fact that the urea and 32% are high right now Probably doesn't have a lot of bearing on a lot of people's decisions.
Brad Carlson:But I think, you know, looking at the I think spot delivery at the ethanol plant in Janesville by me is roughly about $4 a bushel right now. It's actually old crop is actually a little lower than that, although new crop is a little higher than that. And and so that puts us at a price ratio of point one five. You know, not ideal. You know, long term, we're usually at point one, but point one five is, you know, kind of where we've been at now for the last year or so.
Brad Carlson:But also remember, those are wholesale prices, so that's not necessarily where it's gonna be at once it gets transported up up to Minnesota.
Daniel Kaiser:Yeah. And I think we had some stuff at some points approaching point two, and that you start looking at the, MRTN calculator. I'll probably talk about that a little bit here later, but, that tends to adjust things back quite a bit. I mean, if you look at the MRTN, you know, normally, I talk to most growers about planning using the point one. The point one five is usually kind of within that it's it's about the range of where the the m the actual MRTN for the point one is moving forward.
Daniel Kaiser:But you start getting into some of these other price ratios, then it starts to get expensive really quick. And, I mean, really, right now, I mean, the only thing we really should be focused mostly on is anhydrous. That's one thing about urea and UAN. I mean, if you look at timing wise, spring application are better options in UAN right now. This isn't a good idea, although I do tend to hear people talk still about looking at residue decomposition in different treatments in nitrogen, and it's just kind of a waste of time with the cold conditions we have, and winter tends to stop that process pretty quickly.
Daniel Kaiser:You know, it'd be interesting to see. I mean, I've kinda heard I don't know. I mean, just talks about I mean, we start talking about phosphate. I mean, that's been high for a few years. I mean, really, some of the tariff issues with that, in terms of the imports are really what we're gonna have to see, think less than maybe to hopefully get more into this country.
Daniel Kaiser:I don't know exactly how much is being produced, but I'd kinda heard that, there wasn't a whole lot of production going on in some of the areas. You know, that's been probably a year or so ago, so I don't know really what's going on right now. But, it's been a challenge. You know? You know, it'll envy the growers that are out there looking at, especially the, the balance sheets and looking at their fertilizer expenses.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, really, right now, I think the main goal most people should be is trying to figure out what exactly do we need and, focusing mostly on that. And at least with nitrogen, if you're doing fall application and getting some of that contracted, is probably not the the worst thing in the world. And then some of these other nutrients, The soil test, I mean, really for phosphorus, I mean, I can kinda beat a dead horse over and over and over and over again. I mean, it's kinda what we tend to do, but there is some options there when it turn when you start talking about trying to save in some spots if you're trying to cut cut back on costs. So and there are some options.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, just focusing on, though, on what's gonna give you the more return on investment. I mean, nitrogen's kinda always gonna be number one, especially when it comes to corn production.
Brad Carlson:And I think it's also worth kinda noting that that the the the anhydrous the anhydrous price is always going to be lower than the than the the the urea and UAN prices. And I I think very particularly, most of our anhydrous is produced in The United States as domestic, and so availability really shouldn't be an issue going into the fall. We do know that a lot of these high prices are related to the tug of the price on world markets. And, you know, even so the price of, you know, the high price of urea is gonna tug the price of anhydrous up, but getting the fertilizer shouldn't be a huge problem this fall. You know?
Brad Carlson:And then as I mentioned, I guess we'll just have to kinda wait until until this winter to find out where we're at for the spring stuff.
Daniel Kaiser:Yeah. And you gotta remember, mean, global markets are one thing, but you're also, you know, factored in the you know, with anhydrous, it takes a lot of natural gas. So, I mean, that's always kind of the problem with and where we've seen fertilizer prices jump. It's been not as much world supply as, I mean, it's kinda currently, but it's been tied to some of our energy prices. And all I said, we'll see.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, that's it it's kinda hard to tell anybody really what to do right now because you never you don't really know what's gonna be happening in the spring and, you know, kinda where things are at. I mean, typically, we would expect about I don't know. I mean, Brad, Jeff, probably about a 5% higher cost in the spring versus fall, but you just don't know because, a lot of these these issues kinda globally are changing. You know, they change quite a bit that we it is really hard to make any plans, for what we're gonna see here in the spring.
Brad Carlson:And another factor is transportation costs. You know, fuel prices have been high lately, and that that really factors in. I was looking at a price chart, like, particularly for potash, which is coming out of Canada. I don't think there's been much going on there with changes in, you know, in in tariffs and that kind of stuff. So I look a lot at at what's going on with that as as, fluctuations in transportation costs.
Brad Carlson:And I you know, you see what you see the the price bottoming out, like, in the middle of winter. You know, actually, that probably just had to do with what it cost to get the stuff here on rail. So that's also another wildcard. You know, the other factor that I don't think we we know really the answer to, I haven't seen yet the Minnesota Department of Agriculture tracks fertilizer sales, is have the high prices resulted in lower use and demand. And and, of course, if if that is the case, that will tend to drag the prices lower too, and and I don't think we have an answer to whether that's happened yet.
Daniel Kaiser:And I'll be curious in that too, Brad, because they somewhat can see that with some of the fertilizer checkoff funding because that's based on tonnage it sold. I was a bit surprised going into last year. I mean, we didn't have the nitrogen price as as high as they were. I mean, it was mostly DAP prices, but the, the amount coming in really didn't seem like it was a whole lot different. But, you know, I think you look at farmers, think you're willing to absorb some things maybe initially in the short term, but this stuff starts, going more into the long term.
Daniel Kaiser:I think we'll probably start to see I would just expect to see some changes here moving forward.
Jeff Vetsch:And that little bit less tonnage sold and a little bit lower use rate could explain the price of UAN 32 declining here over the last month or two as well.
Jack Wilcox:What's been the feedback from farmers about how the cropping season has gone? You all went to Farm Fest a week ago. What did you hear?
Brad Carlson:Well, I think the the main comment we're hearing is how good the crop looks all over the place, and particularly the the dark green color, you know, really kinda late leads into what we've been saying a long time about the nitrogen cycle and our our good organic matter levels across most of our berry soils that we have in Minnesota and the ability to mineralize nitrogen the growing season. In general, we've had ample moisture. Certainly, there's been plenty of heat. I mean, there there are some pockets that have been dry, but but conditions have been really ideal for mineralizing a lot of in. And so we're really feeding that crop with a with a lot of nitrogen just simply from from natural sources.
Brad Carlson:You know, the other thing that I heard from one farmer who told me that after a large rainfall here a couple weeks ago, his soybeans were lodged, and he went out and and was pulling his soybeans, and they were they were coming up to the vines were were almost head high, and the distance between the nodes and the pods was, like, eight inches apart. And I said, well, you know, if we're we're we mineralize all that nitrogen in cornfields. It happens in soybean fields too. And so soybeans will respond to nitrogen with excess growth. And so that was kinda evidence of that also.
Brad Carlson:You know, in the end, I don't think he's probably gonna have a lot of issues with with that causing yield and and other problems in that bean field. But even the soybeans are telling us that there's been a lot of nitrogen mineralized this year.
Daniel Kaiser:And I'll be somewhat curious because it seems like we have these high yielding years, and there seems to be more pressure than when we get these high yielding years since you're exporting more off the fields to jack their fertilizer rates up the next year to account for that. But we get these good years. I mean, it doesn't necessarily mean that we need more consistently, over, you know, over time. I mean, yeah, you you look at, phosphorus and potash. I mean, you look at the p and k export In fields, I mean, we know that that's all tied to yield, but, there's still quite a bit out there.
Daniel Kaiser:So if your soil tests are high enough, I mean, it's so it's why it's it's a good time to soil test because the price of soil test, meanwhile, it's gone up over time. I mean, it it still is relatively cheap compared to some of the input costs out there. So even if you're, you know, looking at trying to save costs and going to, you know, maybe from two and a half acre grids to zones or from zones to splitting the fields into a couple larger areas. It's just the least nice to know where things are at just to kinda start making some decisions moving forward. I mean, we don't have necessarily that same option for nitrogen.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, you could pull some fall nitrate samples, but unless we've had excessive rainfall, I would suspect that most of those numbers are gonna be near normal, but we'll see. I mean, you know, Jeff's got data or some field sites, and, you know, all myself and Fabian Fernandez do just be kinda interested to see what some of our numbers come back this fall when it comes to residual nitrates. Because, you know, looking at it, I mean, the the the thing that if you look at microbial activity, I mean, a lot of what really benefits microbial activity in terms of soil conditions is the same soil conditions that tends to benefit crop growth. And, you know, that's kinda where I think it's kind of a mistake to think some of these areas we have high mineralization are areas that need to be fed more with, or areas that are high. You really need to have necessarily more fertilizer because these are areas that tend to mineralize more in.
Daniel Kaiser:So, you know, we'll see, Brad. You know, I had that same I don't You told me or somebody or the the grower called me too, and we talked through that. And it kind of interesting scenario there be makes me think that, the other nutrients are probably not limiting in that field either because you don't normally get soybeans that tall, and that's not necessarily the a good thing in the end. But, but, yeah, some of the things we're hearing this year, it's it's interesting. I mean, options, alternatives, you know, earlier in the growing season, I was getting a lot of questions on foliar.
Daniel Kaiser:There was some outfits really pushing, dissolving urea and water and applying it as a foliar and having some sort of replacement value of the foliar versus soil applied in. I mean, that when I first started here in in Minnesota, methylated urea liquid, they were talking like a seven to one replacement. That didn't last very long. I mean, I know there's always when prices increase, you know, trying to grasp at these little things that could help in terms of saving on costs, but you gotta be careful with some of this stuff because we just don't know. I mean, that's generally why you'll hear me just talk more about stuff that we know that has more of a benefit in terms of making decisions.
Daniel Kaiser:So you just have to be careful because there's all sorts of things out there that, you're gonna come out of the woodwork here. I would say fertilizer prices are high again this fall that are gonna really push you towards buying products and things that can save on fertilizer costs. So it's just one of the things to kinda be careful when you're buying that stuff to make sure you've got enough information to make an educated decision on whether these things are worth it.
Brad Carlson:Well, and we know that the loss processes of nitrogen are water based. And so the years where we see nutrient deficiency symptoms and where we see the need for higher nitrogen rates tend to be those really wet years. You know, conversely, a year where it just seems sort of ideal, you know, it's likely that lower nitrogen rates are probably going to be just as good as as the higher ones. I know before we went on the air, we were talking a little bit about this. And, you know, Jeff, you were taking field notes on some of some nitrogen rate trials, and and you're kinda seeing the same thing.
Jeff Vetsch:Yeah. I was I've taken notes on trials here at in Waseca in Southeast Minnesota, and I was over in Southwestern Minnesota, Lamberton on Tuesday of last week. And the Southwest, I was just I was just really surprised. A couple of end studies and really only the nitrogen check, the zero end treatments, really looked end efficient. All the other even low end rates that are less than a 100 pounds of end per acre looked quite good, and a 100 pounds or something around that looked like it was gonna optimize yield in in both of those studies, which is pretty surprising.
Jeff Vetsch:But at the same time, it it aligns with what you'd mentioned earlier, Brad, is that area has had some timely rain, but it's certainly not been wet by any means. It's probably been on the dry side. Crop still looks fantastic, but clearly there was some a lot of end mineralized from that soil. And I think that's generally the consensus across much of the state, but there certainly are some areas in West Central and Northwest and in Extreme Southwest that are in that drought category, and those might be areas, as Dan mentioned, that might be of interest is to take deep soil nitrate samples this fall after that crop comes off. And I don't know that I would necessarily sample the soybean fields, I think that's kind of hit or miss, but if you've got a cornfield that's gonna go to corn again, and it and it was good and green and lush, and maybe was a little on the droughty side, it might be a field that you could find some deep nitrate in and maybe save some money by reducing your n rate in there for that next corn crop.
Brad Carlson:And, Jeff, I'm kinda curious. We didn't talk about this ahead of time, but have have you been getting any drainage out of the drainage plots at Waseca? I know there's been a lot of conversation I've had with people. They're like, well, the tile's still running. I think a lot of cases, that tile is running in a year like this as you're dealing with a a high water table spot.
Brad Carlson:It's it's certainly not coming from the top down. I mean, maybe we've had a few of these in spots. There's been big rainfalls four inches or something like that. You know? But but in general, you know, if if tiles running is probably coming from the bottom up, that's not necessarily gonna take nitrate with it, you know.
Brad Carlson:And so we look at a lot of the flush of nitrate that goes into tile lines in late May and early June, you know, kind of petering off as it gets towards July. Without a lot of that top down drainage, you know, that nitrate is gonna just still be in that profile to feed the crop too. So beyond mineralization, I mean, there could still be some leftover nitrogen from last fall too.
Jeff Vetsch:We had very little tile flow here at Waseca in April. Well, actually, going back to March. March, April, and May. But then since mid to late June and especially in July, we actually had pretty consistent tile flow. Sporadic, but we had two or three very large rainfall events.
Jeff Vetsch:We had a a 2.4 incher that was in the early July that that came over three days, then we had another two and a half incher on the July 20, and then another 2.6 inch event that was at the end of July in the first half of or first day of August. So those events, we got a little tile flow in every one of them, which is kind of unusual that we seem to skew to significant portion of our tile flow this year to July and August and not April, May, and June, but, you know, that goes with coming out of a a bit of a drier fall last fall and then very minimal and not excessive rain at all this spring, just basically enough to get the profile, you know, full, and that was about it. So that does agree totally with what you're saying, Brad. There's just very, very little end loss that I see in this in the in most of these areas this year. I will I will say though that there have been a few spots in Mower County and a couple others that have had some extraordinarily excessive rainfalls and also came very high intensity.
Jeff Vetsch:So how much leaching and denitrification do you do you get when you get six, seven inches of rain in a period of of a day or two days, you know, a lot of that on some of the sloping ground, that water runs off and doesn't leach. In areas where a little more flatter soils and poorly drained, obviously, can certainly drive some denitrification. And our site in Grand Meadow looks pretty tough this year. We were over there a couple weeks ago doing chlorophyll meter readings, and yeah, it's a significant amount of N was lost at that site because it's that's been one of the wettest areas of the state this year.
Jack Wilcox:What are some tools that might be able to help farmers as we think about first principles this season?
Daniel Kaiser:Well, I think, certainly, fertilizer prices being where they're at. I mean, focusing on what's gonna make you the most money is really what's more important. You know, I've kinda just been amazed. I've been in well, I've been doing research since 2001, but I've been here in Minnesota since 2007 and just my time here. Some of the changes in you know, if you look at inputs, what people are really looking at going into, you know, shifts towards more higher cost inputs, like growers using starter fertilizer, switching from ten thirty furrow to some of these low salt blends, just some of the changes people have made and kind of where the costs have been, which to me, they really don't seem to make a whole lot of sense.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, particularly with, like, micronutrients and some of those things that you know, it's interesting. Some of the older surveys that were done with through the AFRIC program, I know there was one where they're doing some grower focus groups that's been probably ten years ago. But, one thing that still sticks in my head is, you know, the growers saying that fertilizer is a known commodity, so they know the value of it. So, like, with PKN, they kinda know what they're getting out of it. So it seems like then they're looking kinda beyond that, and it seems like I get that idea in some of these magazine articles for some of the things now that they're really seeing push in front of them more and things that still when we look at the research, there's really no research out there that really justifies some of the practices.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, I mentioned this before. I mean, a lot of fertilizer additives. You look at a lot of these biostimulants. There's a lot of stuff out there now. I'm looking at phosphorus to try to add it in.
Daniel Kaiser:These phosphorus, not necessarily extenders, but situations where they're trying to make available more of the the soil bound phosphorus. And it just looking at you know, when I look at a lot of these things, I kinda look at the pro or I kinda think probability that these things are going to work. I mean, there's a lot of things out there. While there might be maybe a one in a 100 chance that they might work, there's still, you know, 99 times out of a 100, they're not gonna work. So you're spending money on something where could have been diverted into some other input that had a higher return on investment.
Daniel Kaiser:So I am working right now kind of actually, I have it open on my computer right now. The the corn in rate calculator updates, we haven't added in the 2025 data. One of the changes that you're likely going to see going into this next update will be a separation of the Southeast Minnesota. This would be the drift list or the the you don't wanna know for, like, a soil type. It'd be mostly silt loam soils in those areas, separate from what we'll call Maine, which will essentially be the rest of the state South Of I 94.
Daniel Kaiser:So South Central, West Central, Southwest, those areas will be covered in Maine. So that's kind of the first step. It doesn't make a huge difference. So if you start looking at the changes, there is a slightly lower nitrogen, MRTN value for the Southeast, versus the rest of the state, but we're kinda at the point where I have enough data. And that's kinda one of the things I have been avoiding with that, that update splitting out the state is because there just isn't enough data in some of the areas.
Daniel Kaiser:Southwest West Central versus Southeast, I don't see a whole lot of difference. So there isn't really enough in the numbers there where I'd really get concerned about that. If you wanna go in, should be hopefully coming here before the end of the summer here. So instead, I'm just kinda getting in right now and getting the numbers in just like, kinda take a look at them, spend a little time with the database before I I ship it over. You know, there are few other things we've been talking about.
Daniel Kaiser:You know, specifically, I think Jeff could talk about this too. It's fall applications in South Central. I mean, looking at some of the numbers we have, maybe going more towards a recommendation system where we're recommending 75. Well, we're kinda still not sure about those numbers of the of your total and need be applied in the fall and going if you're going with a fall application, kinda focus more on a fall spring split in in some of these areas. And that's one of the things, I said, we're looking at right now is some of the NBNPs, and there's some things that have kind of you know, you look at the last five, ten years have really stuck out that really need to be looked at for changes for some of the areas of the state.
Jeff Vetsch:About ten years ago, I was talking to a local retailer, and and he talked about some of the customers on farms that had a lot of challenges with fall in, where they had to come back and make a correction or adjustment, that they decided to go with this reduced rate of fall anhydrous around 70% or something like that, and then come back with a planned side dress, and that sidedress would pick up the rest of the total end rate, and then possibly if it's been a year when maybe there was a really lot of end loss, or the economics are starting to look better for the crop prices, maybe you could tweak that a little bit. So I did some studies back in mid twenty teens, and that practice actually, was impressed. It worked quite well, we put 70% on as a fall anhydrous with a uriate, or with a nitrification inhibitor. And then we put the rest on as urea at about V4 to V six with a urease inhibitor, just left it on the soil surface. And that treatment was as good statistically as in all pre plant applications.
Jeff Vetsch:So I think that is an option that is somewhat kind of weather protected, but at the same time allows growers to get some on in the fall and not feel like they had that risk of trying to do everything in the spring, and it also allows retailers to have some flexibility as well. So that is something that I think we're kind of encouraging, I think, moving forward, It's also something I think as a practice that we need to look at and research even more intensely here in South Central Minnesota here in region.
Brad Carlson:You know? And and we talk about tools. You know? One of the things that we focused on with the nitrogen smart educational program now for the last decade is the understanding. We all know that that one size doesn't fit all or more or less every year is slightly different.
Brad Carlson:And and so we talk about a lot of the factors that cause you to need more or less nitrogen. You know, we just got done talking about the fact that this year probably we needed less. And so the the nice thing about that system, Jeff, is it allows you to go further down the line before you make a final rate decision as far as, you know, are we going to have a high demand year this year? Is it drier? Do we have residual nitrate?
Brad Carlson:Are fertilizer prices high and so forth? I mean, when when fertilizer prices are high and the price ratio, gets out of whack, the return to nitrogen comes down, and we recommend lower rates of nitrogen. So, delaying that final rate decision until spring, that too is a tool that we can use to try and increase profits. You know, I haven't talked about this a lot here because it kinda gets back to Dan's beating a dead horse, but we've talked I've talked for years about the the analysis of the adult farm management program farm records. You know, once again, in 2025, the least profitable farms spent 35% more on fertilizer than the most profitable farms.
Brad Carlson:And so, you know, the again, we don't know exactly what's going on there. We don't have the the details on that, but there's just been this long term trend that people aren't that aren't making money or spending too much money on fertilizer. So I guess it just kinda prompts people to take a look at close look at what they're doing and and really only use what they need.
Jack Wilcox:What are some fertilizer decisions that might be best put off until maybe spring of twenty twenty seven?
Brad Carlson:Well, I already mentioned that that the total rate is something that you can maybe get a handle on, particularly if you use the system Jeff was talking about, one that we are really high on, which is applying, you know, two thirds to three quarters of our nitrogen in the fall. And this, of course, is in in the heavy soil parts of the state, not in the Southeast where, of course, it's all recommended in the spring. But very particularly, that that total rate can be adjusted based on a lot of those factors. Do we have residual salt nitrate? Do we have high fertilizer prices?
Brad Carlson:Is it been an an especially dry year, and we expect there to simply to be some carryover and so forth? You know? And in fact, in a lot of cases, some of those decisions can really be even put off all the way until side dress time. You know, we want most of the nitrogen put on before the corn reaches its rapid growth phase. You know, on average, that's happening about the second or third week of June.
Brad Carlson:And so, you know, that final those final decisions oftentimes can wait, you know, all the way out to that that point in the growing season.
Daniel Kaiser:Yeah. And it's really a challenge, I think, for anything else. I mean, growers have gotten pretty accustomed to fall application of DAP and MAP. One of the challenges of that and one of the things that we're working on with the project here at the university is looking at the overall availability of the nitrogen. With early applications, I would suspect the bulk of that's probably nitrified by the time you hit the point when the soil is is frozen.
Daniel Kaiser:But that's one of the things we're working on now. I mean, it'd be nice, you know, with where prices are at to be able to take better advantage of the nitrogen that's in that, that we could, you know, reduce some of the cost because it does help if you can account for the nitrogen in it. It does help on the cost per unit p two zero five. I mean, there's a big difference if I'm, you know, buying a product like that for just the phosphate or if I can account for the nitrogen because it's not a lot. I mean, if you put on a 100 units of MAP, I mean, you're only getting about 10 pounds of nitrogen, but it's it's something, I mean, there to do that.
Daniel Kaiser:So I'm not gonna sit here and propose that growers just simply go to spring application with that because I know there's some issues there with that because spring tends to get pretty compressed. I think last year, we had a little bit more time or this well, 2026 Had a little more time, with some earlier springs and maybe being get be able to get into some of the fields a little bit earlier, but, that's really the thing. It's it's just looking at where you can take advantages of cost savings as much as possible. In nitrogen, you know, kind of some of that that split is probably something that you could look into just to at least reduce some of the costs upfront and then just make some decision decisions in spring when you see things as they're unfolding to make a better decision on what the total N rate would be.
Jeff Vetsch:Yeah. And to add to that, Dan, you know, we think about sulfur, and people like to put that in their fertilizer blend in the fall. But if you've if you're applying ammonium sulfate, which is kind of, you know, my my choice for sulfur source, again, you're gonna get more of that nitrogen likely or still around if you put it on in the spring, and did not put it on in the fall. Now if you're gonna put something always in the fall, but you're also gonna put some on with the planter, well, then maybe elemental sulfur in the fall is an acceptable source if you're gonna apply some with the planter or something early to make sure that you have some sulfate source out there in the spring.
Daniel Kaiser:Well, certainly too good, Jeff. That's a good point with ammonium sulfate. I mean, you know, looking at this split fall with a side dress, if you're slinging on some urea with Agurtain, there's no issue with mixing some AMS within at that point in time, maybe cutting the rate back and going with, you know, maybe 50 pounds of actual AMS per acre for most fields. I think that's where you're gonna see the response to. The nice thing about ammonium sulfate actually in when you look at in season surface applications, you don't have the volatility from the nitrogen, so you don't need to really protect it from loss like you would with the urea.
Daniel Kaiser:So there's a little bit of some flexibility there. One of the things I will mention is we have a fair amount of research when it comes to sulfur timing. And if you're gonna be putting on sulfur, as long as it's on by that v six time frame, we don't tend to see any yield reductions. And if you've been doing it previously, a lot of the soils will build over time, and you'll see some carryover from one year to the next. I mean, really, if you're putting on you know, I've heard some growers upwards of twenty, thirty pounds, there should be some carryover from one year to the next.
Daniel Kaiser:I mean, particularly with some of the the elemental forms that that's an area where it could be trimmed back a little bit because in most cases, five to 10 pounds in those circumstances should be enough unless you're dealing with a pretty eroded soil with a low organic matter than the rates, you know, twenty, twenty five pounds have been adequate. But we've done a lot of work on this. It's interesting to see, though, the thoughts in some people, you know, with sulfur that a little bit is good, but a lot's better. And, you know, kinda what I'm seeing is, I mean, still, the removal is about 25, maybe 30, upwards of 30 pounds. If you look at what's taken up into the plant and what's being removed in the grain in total, that exceeding that doesn't really seem to make a whole lot of sense.
Daniel Kaiser:But that is one thing, though. If you are doing some dry applications, AMS with urea could be mixed together, and you could focus that more in season, and you could eliminate some of the the issues with volatility because you don't have that with AMS.
Jack Wilcox:That was Jeff Vetsch, lead researcher out of the SROC in Waseca. Brad Carlson, educator in Mankato. And then Daniel Kaiser, nutrient management specialist here in Saint Paul. Thanks very much, guys.
Brad Carlson:Thanks, Jack.
Jeff Vetsch:Thanks.
Daniel Kaiser:Thanks.
Jack Wilcox:Do you have a question about something on your farm? Just send us an email here at nutmgmt@umn.edu. Thanks a lot for listening, and we look forward to seeing you next time.
Jack Wilcox:We'd like to thank the Agricultural Fertilizer Research and Education Council, or AFREC, for supporting the podcast.