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Each episode of GAIN Momentum focuses on timeless lessons to help grow and scale a business in hospitality, travel, and technology. Whether you’re a veteran industry leader looking for some inspiration to guide the next phase of growth or an aspiring executive looking to fast-track the learning process, this podcast is here with key lessons centered around four questions we ask each guest.
GAIN Momentum episode #9 - Selling Tech by Managing Change | with Jeff Bzdawka
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Jason Emanis: Welcome to the Gain Momentum podcast, focusing on timeless lessons from global industry leaders about how to grow and scale a business in hospitality, travel, food service, and technology. I'm Jason Emanis here with my co host, Adam Mogelonsky. How are you, sir?
Adam Mogelonsky: Doing fantastic.
Jason Emanis: Very good. Our guest today is Jeff Bzdawka.
Jeff Bzdawka: You got it right.
Jason Emanis: Chief Executive Officer of Knowland Hospitality Veteran even spending 20 plus years with Hyatt. Hello Jeff, how are you?
Jeff Bzdawka: Doing great, Jason. Thank you. And if you haven't heard it before, your voice is very calming and very soothing. So, I'll try not to nod off at the conversation today, but great to be with you guys.
Jason Emanis: Sounds good, Adam.
Adam Mogelonsky: So format today is we frame this podcast around four key questions that we ask that are very important for entrepreneurs and hoteliers and everyone who is an aspiring tech vendor would love to know. So, we're going to dive right into the first question. Jeff, when it comes to scaling a business, what is the single piece of advice you would give entrepreneurs from your perspective as a professional in hospitality technology?
Jeff Bzdawka: Adam, that's a great question and one that honestly, it's somewhat challenging to answer, especially when you say that. single piece of advice and saying we've got that filter and narrowing it down. I'd suggest it's really how you as a, having a responsibility for a hospitality technology company and a company that is caring for and delivering services to the industry.
It's to really be very careful in how you look at him to find your product offering thing all too often. Entrepreneurs and founders of technology companies get fixated on the technology that they miss that they'll lose focus or forget about the importance of that total package. There's more than just the technology platform for the feature set itself.
unfortunately, you know, with the number of years I've spent in the industry, I've seen many great ideas, many phenomenal products die on the vine because the founders, those that bring those ideas forward. Didn't necessarily think through all that was required to bring their product to market and thinking through activation and scaling the full package really including deployment and support.
So suggested really need to think broadly. And it's not just if you're a SAS company software as a service, it's more than just the software. You really need to look at it all encompassing. And be sure you understand not only what it is you're bringing forward, but how it is being viewed and received and how it will be ingested on the customer side.
Jason Emanis: I like to talk with software providers that start with the problem. They can articulate the problem that they're solving with their software and make that connection. And I think that's probably a lot of what you're talking about. A lot of times people are creating technology for technology's sake versus, hey, this is the problem we're solving.
And it's not just for these three. It can address these 12 different types or something like that.
Jeff Bzdawka: Absolutely, Jason. You know, starting with the end in mind and understanding the problem, or I phrase it maybe even slightly different, realizing you're delivering and helping deliver an outcome. What is that outcome? What is the intended benefit of your end user? You know, although I am CEO and have responsibility for a hospitality technology provider, My background, I've had the opportunity to both work as a hospitality technology provider, but also as a hotelier you had mentioned, you know, 20 years with Hyatt over two separate stints, gives me that opportunity to really understand, first and foremost, the problems that encountering and, you know, how you can endure Bring solutions to remove friction and deliver an outcome, but need to be very outcome focused.
Adam Mogelonsky: I'm wondering you've spent so much time at Hyatt, and you're bringing that expertise over to the vendor side in hospitality, and that's a very unique combination of skill sets you don't quite see. And I'm wondering, could you speak to one specific example that you might have for how that knowledge transfer has applied and helped you?
Jeff Bzdawka: you know, and I really think, you know, also, Adam, in looking at it, it's helped me both as a hospitality technology provider, understanding, you know, the business and you gentlemen know as much as I do that the industry we're selling into is really complex. you know, and it's not just selling into or developing solutions for an individual property.
There are so many other stakeholders beyond what happens on property, from an ownership group, to a management company, to a brand or a chain, each have different needs and expectations. So really having had that opportunity to work for a company such as Hyatt, The opportunity to really understand and appreciate just how nuanced and complex the business is itself.
But then also, I think, you know, when I rejoined, as I mentioned, two separate stints at Hyatt in between years 12 and 13, I had the opportunity to work for Pegasus Solutions, ran the Global Commission Processing business, now known as Onyx. Center source and responsible for global service delivery that as I gained those experiences, you know, that really helped, me look at and think differently on how I interacted with the vendor community when I have responsibility for global hotel technology.
So kind of walking a mile in the shoes on both sides has really, you know, helped, I think, open my eyes to be able to provide better solutions. I think you know, Adam, another, you know, example is our industry has so many great individual pinpoint solutions offered by many different companies, taking the time to understand the integration and how that comes together and, you know, well intended technology.
Often breaks because of those points of integration. So really having that opportunity from to view it from both sides helps me empathize, both whether I'm a provider of solutions or procuring solutions.
Jason Emanis: Yeah, it was the word that came to mind. Empathy. That's powerful.
Jeff Bzdawka: Very much so.
Adam Mogelonsky: I have one more follow up question, and it's more so for context. You worked at Hyatt on the buyer side. What motivated you to move over to the seller side, to the vendor side?
Jeff Bzdawka: So, I was often asked around annual performance time, if I was a flight risk at Hyatt and I am who I am largely because of a pilot with a number of years and, having worked at in a technology provider space in the private equity world, it was just it provided me. It was the right opportunity.
It was the right private equity firm, which I think for founders and entrepreneurs. And as they look at me, the capital impossible exit, understanding, you know, the private equity firms and, Sarah is one of those private equity firms. I really, respected would love to work with. And then, you know, the opportunity for, me to, you know, exercise muscles that I hadn't exercised for a while, obviously being a big organization like Hyatt and then going in and running an organization much, much smaller, really gave me an opportunity to learn and grow and bring that forward.
And, group and events is critical to the recovery of the industry and my passion is hospitality. And this was an opportunity for me to carry on the legacy of one of the best business advisors, mentors and friends I had, Bob Post, who unfortunately passed away as a result of COVID. Who was before me at Nolan. So, there was a lot that went into the consideration, for me to leave the friendly confines, sitting in Chicago here I can say friendly confines and you know, moving back into, a PE backed hospitality technology provider. It's very exciting and very different, obviously.
Adam Mogelonsky: Yeah, it's always a mixture of factors, but that's very good to know. And I love hearing about people's background. For question number two, what are the common pitfalls or failures you have witnessed that business owners should look to avoid when scaling their business?
Jeff Bzdawka: Another great question. I think I touched on a bit of it in the first, but I would start probably with Jason. I think you said this as well. It's not understanding the operational and or technical environment your clients and prospects are operating with them. You may be the, you know, selling a particular solution, but recognizing what the pain points are, what the anticipated outcome, how whatever solution you're bringing forward will fit into that ecosystem is critically important now, more so ever more so than ever, as things continue to evolve and operate.
Integration is critical and you as a provider us as providers of solutions need to own and have responsibility and understanding how those solutions will be integrated. And it's not just that activation, but how do they stay integrated and how to ensure that they continue to work after that initial day.
Another area is really understanding that on the client's side, underestimating a client's ability to embrace change management. We're selling solutions, and as new solutions are coming in, even if they're replacing older technology or incumbent solutions, there is a high level of change that is required.
And change does not come easily. And... oftentimes in talking with others you know, in the hospitality technology provision space, get frustrated with their backlog of implementation. So there's often a kind of a common theme is the person who bought isn't necessarily the person who is responsible for activating and there's many other priorities and factors in play in the success of your solution and how it is viewed once in your customer is largely dependent on their ability to embrace change and manage change management.
So underestimating that and candidly not taking ownership of that. Oftentimes ends up in a either frustrated customer. Or, you know, just ultimately something that doesn't work and ultimately delivering, it doesn't deliver, you know, the outcome. So, a few different things wrapped in there, but I think it really comes to meeting the customer where they are, understanding and appreciating where they are, empathizing that your solution, while it's going to bring value, is also going to bring change and possibly friction.
And helping your customers and clients manage through that, I think is oftentimes underestimated.
Jason Emanis: how are you managing that, that change management do you rely on customer support? Is it salespeople who, who stick with after the sale, they're sticking with the account? What's that look like? Yeah, your
Jeff Bzdawka: Jason is a little bit, of all of that, plus a bit more. And I'm gonna go back, before my days at Noland. And when, One of business units, that Pegasus had the selling central res platforms. And that is huge. That is, you know, the FEMA and what we ended up doing is we took on some of that responsibility in addition to ensuring that we were not overselling over promising what the solution could actually do and taking the time to understand it was properly configured.
We also took on responsibility for change management and project management. And we redrew where that line was of responsibility. We inserted ourselves into the organization. So really it depends on the size and the complexity of, you know, the solutions. in the case of Noland, you know, we have a very consultative onboarding process.
Our platform is largely driven based on competitive set information, and we take the time to educate our users that competitive sets change in your competitive set may be different in a group and event space than it is in transient. So taking the time and investing in proper onboarding in a consultative onboarding process, number one.
Number two is after you activate the customer, that you follow up with that customer a week after activation. 30 days after activation, 90 days after activation to see if they have any questions to see if their business needs changed. And then what we also do is, you know, monitor activity in a software as a services company.
We all have the ability to monitor our customer engagement with our platform. And using that data to understand not only how they're using the platform and inform changes on how you can improve the product, but notice if there are fundamental mental changes and how your customers are using the platform, you're proactively reaching out to the customers.
I noticed you used to log into our system two, three times a week. Something changed and for the last three weeks, nobody's access. Why is that? Well, Sally left and she didn't pass that training along or something along those lines happened. So you really need to own the customer, not just up to activation.
But ongoing in after and you can learn so much from those interactions to inform product And then the ability as you expand as we expand our products and solutions It's much easier to bring those in by staying in control It's not a you know, get them implemented and move on you really need to own that customer engagement model
Jason Emanis: your Pegasus example reminded me of where I came from. It's a complicated. implementation and we had several project managers on the big deals, the big implementations. You even, you had to have a project manager. So the project manager worked with, support and also many times, most times sales people were, they stayed in the, in it as well and an executive, there was always being an executive sponsor as well.
And it, you know, it just took it to the village, I guess. Yeah. Yeah.
Jeff Bzdawka: Exactly. Taking that village, taking the time at kickoff to make sure everybody understands what their role is and what is expected of them, encouraging full and active participation, not just observation you know, and instill that sense of ownership and you take time and especially in those larger implementations, you celebrate the successes, you have periodic check ins and learn and evolve.
As you go forward
Adam Mogelonsky: That was the perfect answer. We could spend another hour talking about that. We're going to move on to the third question,
Jason Emanis: Yeah.
Jeff Bzdawka: Okay.
Adam Mogelonsky: What do you see as the key opportunities and challenges for hospitality technology companies in 2023 and beyond?
Jeff Bzdawka: All right. This is a softball, three words and labor you know is the answer But so that's one the second is tied to the first, Fewer team members wider areas of responsibility need to really, you know, turn information or turning data into information, you know, taking on creation of actionable insights and data can be used to help automate and better inform.
So labor data and just, you know, the pace of change will be a challenge. You know, as the saying goes, the pace of change we see today is unlike anything we've ever seen in our lifetime, but it's going to be far, it's far slower than what we'll see tomorrow. That recognition and embracing the fact that what worked yesterday may have to get changed, you know, tomorrow.
I think our, the hospitality industry is evolving their operating model and will need to continue to evolve their operating model. So, again, it's not a set and forget. You need to continually to evolve. And with that evolution guests and customer expectations are changing as well, and we all need to be well informed there and keep up with what those changing expectations are.
I probably shouldn't just limit it to guests and customers, but colleagues as well, but largely driven by the challenges with labor.
Adam Mogelonsky: you mentioned in a previous answer, you mentioned changing comp sets, competitive sets, and I wondering if you could explain a little bit more in terms of leisure versus group and how comp sets might be different. How do you see the competitive landscape of hotel products changing?
Jeff Bzdawka: first, I think it really there is a meaningful and sizable shift in expectations that it's not just selling a room. You're selling and providing experiences. you know, leisure is here to stay. I'd like to refer to group and leisure as leisure, travel as well. the evolution of the way we work and having these types of conversations utilizing technology is going to evolve how hospitality ends up in servicing and caring.
For guests. You know, we may be on the verge of, the single largest crisis in commercial real estate, but with that opportunity with that challenge comes, I think, some great opportunity for the hospitality industry, groups and events are changing, and we're starting to see a new demand sector come.
From companies that have either gone fully remote or predominantly remote, that there still is a need for collaboration, for culture change, for innovation, and the types of events they're getting a bit longer you know, are the recent data is showing we're seeing a sizable shift of smaller meetings going from one to two days to two.
three to four days, you know, somewhere in that two to four day range, they're getting longer. And I think part of that is people are not necessarily, and especially in groups and events feel the need to make that one day trip. We can communicate this way, but you know, to really build relationships. And that we would have been able to get through coming together in an office space, the hospitality industry is starting to fill that particular gap.
And that type of need, it's a different type of need, different type of sourcing than it is with transient. And your transient business, you know, is sourced differently. They have different, expectations. And your products may be different that you're looking for so understanding that We may compete for a hotel directly across the street from us As it relates to leisure, business because people are coming to chicago, for instance to experience chicago Where I may i'm looking to fill a group in event space I may be more along the lines, competing with a com, with a hotel in Memphis, or a hotel in Charlotte or up in Milwaukee.
And really understanding the differences between your mix of business, where your source markets are, your feeder markets and group and event isn't necessarily the same. Feeder markets a as leisure. And, you know, I would go as far as then also suggesting that as, leisure travel, you know, the revenge travel and the insane growth we saw with leisure travel, that is going to start what towing and people will be pulling back a bit on their spend levels where group and events are starting to come back into the forefront and some are Actually referring to the this year looking at the next year is the year years of groups and events, but back to change, changing expectations, changing dynamics, how business is sourced, it's sold and plan is evolving and changing.
Adam Mogelonsky: Jeff, we're going to move on to the fourth question here. What are the key things innovative leaders and entrepreneurs should prioritize and focus on to gain traction for their business?
Jeff Bzdawka: All founded foundational and empathy Jason going back to one of our prior points, but to keep it really simple and press the three areas, you know. Solving a problem in a pain point to make our customers lives easier. It's all about removing friction to become indispensable. So the first one, understanding and solving for a problem, speaking in the language of your customers.
The second, and we really didn't touch on this earlier, but it comes to, you know, the activation. Avoid what I'll refer to as abandonment of technology. you know, with proper training and user engagement, I would suggest that our industry and we're probably not unique in this space, but we do not get full value for the technology we put in place.
We all, and it's human nature. You've got emerging technology. I'll refer to it as yellow labs and you just get something in place and something new comes and we're off running it to the next fall. Instead of taking care and making sure that the technology is in place, operates as intended, gets the outcome, and your staff is fully trained and understands how to use it, in delivering you know, those experiences.
And then, you know, change, is the opportunity as well as the challenge, you know, as entrepreneurs, as leaders of business. You need to get comfortable, you know, with that change and to be able to evolve with it as well. And I probably, with that change, I would also suggest that the success of an organization, an entity, really lies in collaboration.
I often like to say collaboration breeds success. And as entrepreneurs, as providers of solutions, we need to be comfortable with partnering. And we also need to be comfortable with partnering with possible competitors in the spirit of coopetition. Understanding and recognizing you can't answer every question and you can't be an expert in everything. Pick your partners wisely. Tight integration. And again, that collaboration and being open to the collaboration. Don't be afraid of it will lead to success.
Jason Emanis: Jeff, do you get involved in a lot of these integration partner relationships? Because they can be tricky, like you said, they can kill a deal because the integration never happens. Cause it can be so difficult to get, you know, the other partner to do what they need to do. And then there's blame game and then everything just falls apart.
And I think. In my experience, it's been several people need to maintain that relationship, and it's always helpful if the guy at the top, the gal at the top is in it.
Jeff Bzdawka: Yeah, which is very much spot on Jason. And I've been around the block enough times that I've experienced great partnerships as well as a few that have altered. And if I look and take a step back, yeah. And what is the difference. I think it really it starts with. Having trust and building a relationship and that understanding in the forefront, taking the time to ensure that you're partnering with you share the same value set and that you look at business and especially in a service industry.
You have the same view of caring for your customers, caring for guests and taking the time to build the relationship, building and establishing the trust, Ensuring you've got top down and bottoms up level of engagement is critical, you know, to the partnership. Don't have hidden agendas. Don't hold any punches.
Be willing to talk about things that are not working. You know, it's human nature to shy away from broken things and only talk about the things that are good. But the only way you'll learn from and create better partnerships and better relationships is learning from those friction points and where you may have failed or faltered.
Why did you fail? And then how do you learn from that and bring it forward?
Adam Mogelonsky: Yeah, I guess there is a Japanese expression for adversity makes the best friends. I, it's on the tip of my tongue, but that's almost the perfect lesson to end things off here. Jeff, can't thank you enough for coming on. There's been fantastic lessons.
Jeff Bzdawka: Gentlemen, thank you. It's my pleasure. I enjoy watching the GAIN podcast. I was thrilled to have the opportunity to join you today. Thank you.
Jason Emanis: Thank you
Adam Mogelonsky: Thanks.