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NET Society is unraveling the latest in digital art, crypto, AI, and tech. Join us for fresh insights and bold perspectives as we tap into wild, thought-provoking conversations. By: Derek Edwards (glitch marfa / collab+currency), Chris Furlong (starholder, LAO + Flamingo DAO), and Aaaron Wright & Priyanka Desai (Tribute Labs)
00;00;00;00 - 00;00;20;03
Aaron
Hey, guys. You know what I did, yesterday for about three, three hours or so.
00;00;20;05 - 00;00;22;04
Chris
I hope something constructive.
00;00;22;07 - 00;00;34;27
Aaron
It was, I, I don't know if it's constructive, constructive or not, but I spent about, like, a ton of time in the Twitter space x space NFT trenches. It was completely fascinating. You guys curious?
00;00;34;27 - 00;00;37;25
Derek
I'm actually curious what people are talking about. What are.
00;00;37;26 - 00;00;38;13
Pri
These people?
00;00;38;13 - 00;01;14;28
Aaron
Yes, please. So it's it's folks, I have never seen their handles. They have some of them huge followings. It was kind of wide ranging. It started with folks really like grappling with this question, like post meme coins, like, why would I care about NFTs? And there was like some folks that were pre around during the, you know, the last cycle that were making the case to these meme pointers about why this is interesting, why they should be paying attention, what the reason why or the or the reason why they believe that NFTs may go up in value over the next, you know, a couple quarters to a couple of years.
00;01;15;00 - 00;01;38;04
Aaron
And so that part was super fascinating. Just kind of seeing this back and forth between, like, the meme coins and like the NFT years about why this is like an interesting space. The group seemed to be convinced that it was an interesting space. And then they got into different artists and like who they should collect or care about and I'm happy to report that they seem to love Cryptopunks, but they really, really don't like people.
00;01;38;04 - 00;01;50;29
Aaron
Like they spent like literally like over an hour, just like shredding people for reasons that were like completely mystifying to me. And then it went into a anti-Semitic rant for about 20 to 30 minutes, which was bizarre.
00;01;51;08 - 00;01;52;22
Derek
As per usual, after.
00;01;52;28 - 00;01;53;22
Aaron
Yeah.
00;01;53;24 - 00;01;57;00
Pri
Wait, let me guess, is that the the Jewish people control and it.
00;01;57;01 - 00;02;19;23
Aaron
Is pretty much. Yeah, that was the that was the, the core thesis, at least one of the, the speakers. And then yeah. But it was it was just kind of super fascinating just hearing all these great, I mean, creators that I personally didn't know, collectors that in person they didn't know or follow, like, and don't see my feed kind of intersecting with some of these meme collectors, which I don't know that well either.
00;02;19;25 - 00;02;33;07
Aaron
Like all kind of grappling with what happened in the past. And, you know, it was just kind of a fun echo to see what may stick if NFTs come, come back, which I personally think, they're going to come back pretty hard pretty soon.
00;02;33;10 - 00;02;37;02
Chris
Was this just one Twitter space or were you jumping from spaces to spaces?
00;02;37;02 - 00;02;49;01
Aaron
It was one for one. But I have been jumping from spaces to spaces, and I actually think it's like a good time to get back in the trenches. Chris, put on your helmet, get on your vest to deal with the shrapnel, but like it's time to get back in.
00;02;49;03 - 00;02;59;19
Chris
Oh my God, I don't know, like you just told me. Like you spent three hours on the island of Misfit Toys and that like that somehow was supposed to put me back in.
00;02;59;21 - 00;03;01;23
Aaron
There was so many people on it, though, man.
00;03;01;25 - 00;03;03;01
Chris
I mean, people who.
00;03;03;02 - 00;03;04;22
Aaron
Like hundreds of people.
00;03;04;24 - 00;03;15;16
Chris
All right. Dude, I mean, I don't know, like a mercenary group of, like, meme coins looking for their next set of carcasses is not something that I'm getting fired up about it.
00;03;15;19 - 00;03;18;27
Aaron
I'm not saying you should get fired up about it. I'm just saying it's happened and.
00;03;18;29 - 00;03;22;20
Pri
I'm struggling to understand why they don't like people. I love people they.
00;03;22;20 - 00;03;43;16
Aaron
Think it, they thought, and I don't think this this is true, that the sale wasn't justified in some sort of way and that he doesn't have a as large of a collector base that I think all of us know. He kind of does. Yeah. So I think it's more of that, that aspect, just like this Eyewatering number that his work sold for and just skepticism just related to.
00;03;43;16 - 00;03;47;18
Pri
That, I guess, like that always happens if you're like at the top, you're gonna always have haters. You know.
00;03;47;18 - 00;03;48;14
Aaron
It kind of felt like that.
00;03;48;14 - 00;04;23;18
Derek
I'll add one thing here, which is just like the road of like the there is a tried and true pathway here of folks who have been critical of pop cultural art for, I mean, like for as long as art has been made. And I think it's really easy to look at, you know, outputs from an art, from an artist or, you know, something that's just like as, I don't want to say the word polarizing, but it's like in your faces what people does with his, with his art or art practice and just like judge it on the merits of like, what you're looking at and the, the emotions that that it's evoking visually without
00;04;23;18 - 00;04;58;05
Derek
kind of paying attention to, like the networking that has been done by people by virtue of just like being on the internet, making work, like committing to a practice where like he was doing every day for 14, 15 years and just like conveniently ignoring, just like the, you know, the the path to get where he is today. And just I think if you don't if you look at people through the lens of like, you know, his large Twitter following and, and you know, the maybe I think zap it or whatever words people want to use to describe like his his quick process and the, you know, the the call and response he does around cultural
00;04;58;05 - 00;05;17;28
Derek
events every day. I think it's really easy to kind of like, criticize that as not having the artistic integrity of other work, but like, it's so often so wrong and so misguided. And this judge that like, it's hard to even take some of these criticism seriously when you don't, when you're not even taking in the entire the, the entirety of what the practice actually is.
00;05;18;01 - 00;05;26;07
Aaron
It takes that to really appreciate that. And I think that's what the serious collectors have done. But that's hard to translate on Twitter. You know, you just see him posting.
00;05;26;10 - 00;05;55;26
Derek
It is I, I also feel like that means it's kind of working. Like I love it when people are like, wait, it's just a a squiggly line, like, why are people buying this squiggly line? Or it's just, you know, a Jpeg of like SBF in jail with, you know, PD it's just, you know, this QR code, it's just like this little, you know, 24 bit little caricature that, like, you know, I could do with I like that.
00;05;55;28 - 00;06;15;10
Derek
Like, if people are talking about it, to me it's doing its job of like evocation in, like cultural spaces. And it's up to people to do the work to kind of like figure out why. Why am I even discussing people right now? Why am I even discussing the chrome squiggle or crypto punk, or a QR code on a QR code on chain?
00;06;15;13 - 00;06;23;11
Derek
And if you never get past that question, then like you're just going to be stuck in this cycle of just like reducing everything down to their visual outputs.
00;06;23;14 - 00;06;28;26
Aaron
But at the same time, you know, like that debate may be why he's going to be iconic, right?
00;06;28;27 - 00;06;29;27
Derek
Totally.
00;06;30;00 - 00;06;41;18
Pri
Yeah. I mean, the fact that, yeah, I mean, he's people can I think just if you're getting talked about already winning, I guess you've already already cut through the noise. You're kind of already you're already there.
00;06;41;18 - 00;06;56;01
Aaron
But you know, they were talking like about janitor Pepe's punks. You know, it seems like there's still like, lots of fans that are kind of floating around this stuff. So it was it was interesting to just kind of hear it so that that's your report from the trenches is not convince Chris.
00;06;56;01 - 00;07;17;13
Chris
But no to exist. Oh, I'm not a trench denier. I'm not a trench denier. I realize trying to exist. I'm a big fan of the Mariana Trench. You know, I'm a trench guy. Erin, what prompted you to do this? Was it the sort of buzz around NFTs being back, or did you just want to hurt yourself?
00;07;17;20 - 00;07;38;05
Aaron
It was more the latter. Just some some afternoon masochism. And I came back from a couple meetings and just on the site, I actually I increasingly find myself on X, slash Twitter. Just I like the audio content there. And I'll run something in the background. One of the NFT groups like just captured me there. The spaces they they claim that NFTs were dead.
00;07;38;05 - 00;07;42;14
Aaron
Chris. So I had to click to to learn more. So it lured me in.
00;07;42;14 - 00;08;06;23
Derek
You know, it's crazy. And I like it's easy to forget this, but like X is such an amazing product. I'm not a shareholder or anything or I'm like, I mean, this is not even a political take whatsoever, but like the fact that there is a product where like you have people singing together in text and audio in real time, like I'll flip open Twitter or X, and there will be six spaces on topics that I can just jump into real quickly.
00;08;06;23 - 00;08;27;16
Derek
There will be like ten different conversations happening about things that I'm interested in that I can like, jump into and start messaging around. And you pair that with the fact that we've got this 24/7 ledger where people can, like, express economic transactions against these conversations, like take a step back and think like, that is just wonderful. That is so insane and so cool.
00;08;27;16 - 00;08;43;02
Derek
And like, I don't know, man, once in a while, like, it hits me how amazing this stuff is when paired with one another. And yeah, I'm with you, Aaron. Like, it's it's fun to kind of just like, jump into these things and refine views in real time. And that has never before been possible.
00;08;43;07 - 00;09;06;19
Aaron
Yeah. Just how big the internet is, right? Like it's such a vast ocean. It just is. It's hard to wrap your head around. It's so I, I, I've Chris on the NFT side like I see it. You know, it has been notable to me at least like, just talking to folks that are in crypto in and around New York or looking at my timeline and just there's a lot of bearishness, except for like the NFT community.
00;09;06;22 - 00;09;25;07
Aaron
I think it's like people that are geeked on Bitcoin are super like happy, and people that like NFT seem pretty positive. And everybody else is just so despondent and like, negative and, you know, kind of like lost. There's something to that now.
00;09;25;07 - 00;09;51;28
Chris
There is something to it. I, I agree, I, I've seen it out there. There's that energy floating around the part. I'm having a little trouble with is, you know, like I tend to just get to things quicker than other people. And, and so when I'm looking at this, I'm trying to figure out, right. Like, is everyone just getting the same head fake I had four months ago around the case for why NFT should come back, and then they didn't.
00;09;52;00 - 00;09;59;29
Chris
Or was I just like, you know, four months too early to a conclusion that NFTs should come back and now they actually are.
00;10;00;05 - 00;10;18;25
Aaron
I think it could be the it could be both and I don't I could be getting had faked. Right now the only counter argument or argument for the second point there that people are kind of catching up to you is historically, you know, NFTs really run up when Bitcoin runs up. And I just think, I think that that's going to happen pretty soon.
00;10;18;25 - 00;10;38;17
Aaron
Like I'm just anticipating this, like reflexive run up in in Bitcoin right now. It just seems like the laser eyes like are moving and there's more and more momentum just happening around Bitcoin. And that actually is what kicks off NFT runs. It's not eath price like we know that like as ETH runs up the NFT market kind of softens it's way.
00;10;38;17 - 00;10;44;29
Aaron
The Bitcoin price that gets people juiced up about collecting scarce digital network objects.
00;10;45;02 - 00;11;09;25
Chris
Yeah. Ether's its price is in a good place for NFT activity like ether UK is always a, a nice, you know, sort of number to, to get people thinking about, you know, how can I get a leverage return on the East via NFTs. And so, you know, it never has to be one thing. Often it's a whole bunch of things coming together that, you know, get the stuff cooking.
00;11;09;27 - 00;11;36;05
Chris
And the NFTs still remain like really one of the few transparent and fair markets. And, you know, we can kind of er, quote, transparent. But one of the fairer markets in crypto at the moment, you know, alts I mean, my God, if you ever want to get lost in the woods, you know, alter so, so, so deeply lost in a forest of darkness and pain right now that yeah, NFTs look really good.
00;11;36;08 - 00;11;54;13
Aaron
Yeah. Maybe people are like intuiting that. I feel like sometimes like that's what crypto is good at. It's bad at the implementation, but it's kind of good directionally about things. It's like, it just seems like the the nose is always pointing in the right way. But it doesn't seem like it always has the follow through. So maybe that's happening here again.
00;11;54;13 - 00;11;54;29
Aaron
Chris.
00;11;55;01 - 00;12;01;12
Chris
Yeah, since we are an NFT land, have you guys spend any time with landowners as OG's Infinite Gardens?
00;12;01;15 - 00;12;02;15
Aaron
I like them.
00;12;02;17 - 00;12;11;08
Pri
I like them too, especially when you zoom into them and, like, move them around and they're all connected. It's actually quite beautiful. It's very different from his other work, I feel.
00;12;11;11 - 00;12;12;22
Aaron
Yeah, it's more complex.
00;12;12;25 - 00;12;43;18
Chris
I, I find myself returning to it a bunch. The day I minted it, I merged a couple gardens. I do some flowers in there. Dark mode or night mode, whatever. Let's call them that. Really spectacular. And so. Yeah, that's, been a great drop. And the price of it super cheap, it's like one is the purpose of it, you know, partnership, partnering with, protocol Guild, splitting fees, you know, fund Ethereum development.
00;12;43;21 - 00;12;53;03
Chris
The programable aspect. Shout out to Aaron here. You know, it checks a lot of boxes and it looks really nice.
00;12;53;05 - 00;12;58;19
Aaron
Yeah. It's great to see him kind of, like, move in this direction. I'm definitely a fan, personally.
00;12;58;21 - 00;13;23;22
Chris
Welcome to Net Society. I'm free to say. And this week we're covering a wide range of topics from our NFT keys back to how tough you want your robot. As always, these are our own personal opinions and not of our employers. I don't have an employer, so you know, they're one and the same. But for, the other folks on the pod, they now have air cover widely, speculate and, hope you enjoy the show.
00;13;23;24 - 00;13;25;16
Chris
Well, let's fucking go.
00;13;25;19 - 00;13;44;29
Pri
It's kind of interesting to me that, like, in light of the trenches talk and like that whole meme coin community coming back and seemingly like the timeline feels like there's people I haven't heard of coming back and there's a little bit of interest and excitement. People are definitely watching it. I do wonder, like what that means for just the larger free market too.
00;13;44;29 - 00;14;04;01
Pri
Like you saw that good vibes FB come back like, I don't even like that was like the Reddit. It was like a Reddit designer mod that gave a bunch away to some like OG community members. And I think like we launched it in the right way, but I thought that was like intriguing to see, like a PHP set that was like the first new PHP set I think I've seen move.
00;14;04;01 - 00;14;26;10
Pri
I haven't like charted any of the other PvP set, but I always feel like people are leading punks and then like fees are kind of like a leading indicator of people getting back into the space. And I thought that was like a notable thing that in like the Sam Sprite masquerade stuff felt like uniquely different than, you know, what's been going on over the prior couple months.
00;14;26;12 - 00;14;44;06
Derek
Yeah. I'll also say, I don't know if you guys were following the RTX code drop yesterday with William Watkins, but, that was I meant that a few that was the, I think, the first algorithmic code based work that I've joined an auction for and maybe over six months. I'm trying to think of the last one that I've done.
00;14;44;24 - 00;15;04;21
Derek
Maybe I am, because but I think that was last fall or, towards the summer. Yeah. I mean, it's really it's a it's a really special collection. There's only 50, I think, Sophia and the Art code team did an amazing job kind of bringing that to market. It was. It was a quiet auction. I think there was maybe only 50 or 60 people that were submitting bids, but, I mean, it sold out.
00;15;04;21 - 00;15;25;04
Derek
I, you know, the bid timer kept getting extended. I think the I ended up getting minting out at like a collection floor of 0.26 or 0.27, or maybe it's a little higher, maybe 0.36 or 27, but either way, very cool collection. And I guess I think just to echo what what everyone's saying here, the thesis remains intact.
00;15;25;04 - 00;15;46;10
Derek
I mean, it's obviously been five, six years since a lot of us were really excited about what NFTs were and unique objects on chain and, being able to use that as a vehicle for creative work. And we still have great artists that are doing, you know, their first drops or, you know, their there's the early in their career that are making work and finding networks that will be built around them.
00;15;46;10 - 00;16;09;27
Derek
You've got established artists like Sam Spratt who are able to do that at, you know, a, larger level with a larger network and playing with the constraints or whether it's one of one or these, you know, one of one of axes that are handmade or hand coded. And we've got FPGAs that are, you know, new collections that are launching that are, you know, finding economic success because there's an audience that wants to be a part of those communities.
00;16;09;27 - 00;16;38;05
Derek
And yeah, it's fun to see. Obviously like it. The the buzz isn't around, but I would say there's there are networks that are being formed around artists and projects and protocols that are using NFTs as, the object of expression. And it hasn't gone away. And maybe I think the vibes are, are continuing to kind of like come back in and yeah, I'm, I'm enthusiastic that, that this is the start of a, another kind of like leg of interest.
00;16;38;12 - 00;17;04;00
Aaron
So I am too I, I also just feel like, you know, people feel the regulatory clarity coming in. So it's like safer to play around with some of this stuff, which I do think the bad vibes kind of came from the last administration. I was actually thinking about that a lot this morning. I just feel like that last administration just took the joy out of a lot of different things that it definitely, like kicked all joy out of out of crypto, like completely.
00;17;04;03 - 00;17;05;10
Aaron
And so I feel.
00;17;05;13 - 00;17;08;22
Pri
Except for the memes. The memes are pretty good. I miss the Gensler meme.
00;17;08;23 - 00;17;25;27
Aaron
The memes were good, but they were all dark, right? Like it wasn't. There wasn't like a joy to it, right? Like, like the levity. And I feel like the entire internet, like, lost that. And I still think there's way too much of this. Like, nihilist nihilism that's kind of across the internet, that it feels like that's beginning to fade a little bit.
00;17;25;28 - 00;17;52;02
Derek
Can we can we actually unpack that? Because I think that's a really astute comment, Aaron. Like, there was so much creative expression with what around capital formation. And like we saw this with things, everything from like bored apes to generative art to DAOs to, I mean, like it felt boundless in 2020 and 2021 around how you could use crypto to kind of like build networks and form communities and do creative stuff on chain.
00;17;52;04 - 00;18;19;28
Derek
And I do think that, like these subpoenas, these investigations, these, you know, these settlements that basically put the innovation in a very specific box, definitely limited both how founders could operate and also how collectors it chilled them chilled like the the technology. It chilled the market in a very real way. And I think meme coins were really a function of, well, what can we do that doesn't kind of trip the Howey test or securities laws, okay.
00;18;19;28 - 00;18;39;13
Derek
There's no expectation of profits. These things are you're basically trading a chart that's on, you know, some charged momentum. And it's a, you know, an idea and an expression of a concept. And if you believe in it, then the number will go up. And if you lose faith, the number will go down. And it really was like something that's skirted around how securities laws in the US worked.
00;18;39;13 - 00;19;07;13
Derek
And as a result, that's where like a lot of the attention, both on the issuer and the collector side maybe ended up. And now I think to your point, Aaron, it's like we're seeing the pendulum swing back a bit and we are seeing people get excited about this canvas that is blockchain and that allows people to kind of like use the properties of this technology in ways that are creatively interesting again, and go a little bit further out on the curve than they would have been, over the last administration.
00;19;07;13 - 00;19;27;26
Derek
And I think maybe what you're pointing to is like that starting to kind of seep back into the DNA of of this space of builders, of collectors, of participants. And you know that kind of stuff tends to kind of like grow and grow and become more important and interesting, and it starts to get more people involved. And, yeah, new standards get created.
00;19;27;26 - 00;19;34;17
Derek
And so maybe what we're seeing here is just like the earliest signs of that pendulum swinging back and people getting geeked out again. Yeah.
00;19;34;17 - 00;19;52;08
Aaron
I mean, and I think it's like the weird thing in the with the internet where all that enthusiasm just got like memory hold super fast and the only thing that was left is like just, you know, there was like a shred of that in Derek. The only thing I'd quibble with is like, meme coins were incredibly PvP and nihilistic.
00;19;52;08 - 00;20;27;24
Aaron
To like it all doesn't mean anything. I know that there was definitely some folks are playing around with the more humor community building stuff, but it definitely just felt like the worst parts of crypto to many folks. And oftentimes to me. And people forgot all the great things that you can do with network communities and great ways that we can, you know, help build an ownership economy where, you know, creators can get their fair shake or different ways to organize groups online or I think even said this, Chris, in some tweet thread a couple weeks back, I think I still am processing it just like that.
00;20;27;27 - 00;20;40;15
Aaron
Kind of like silly, absurd absurdity of like, sup dogs and all that stuff, like people like that and they miss it and I'm feeling myself missing it. Maybe that's why that Good Vibes PvP set had hit like a chord with some people.
00;20;40;17 - 00;21;09;19
Chris
Yeah, I mean, sometimes you just literally need to spell it out and, you know, just calling your project good vibes maybe was the right choice for the moment in time to remind people. I mean, we certainly memory hold things faster and faster. I was really surprised at sort of the lack of coverage or the lack of reflection around the fact that we hit the the five year anniversary of Covid, you know, like a week or so ago, all that launching.
00;21;09;21 - 00;21;39;18
Chris
Yeah. Everyone's just like, oh, my God, we're gonna pretend that that's never going to happen. And so, you know, as the NFT space starts to, rebound and I don't know, apparently you've got, a generation of trench warriors who who didn't know me circling around this phase, it will be interesting to see, you know, which lessons people actually do resurface from the last go around and, which ones they choose to completely ignore and try again.
00;21;39;18 - 00;22;00;13
Chris
Now that the the dark cloud of the Biden nanny state has been lifted from the face of, expressive NFT internet capital formation, you know, who knows? Can we do it better? Yes. And some parts of this will do it better. And that's how we push forward. And some of this, they're just going to run it right on back.
00;22;00;13 - 00;22;10;11
Chris
And we're going to see some, incredibly stupid reductions. But you know, that's life. And that's that's why we roll with it. So let's see what tomorrow brings.
00;22;10;14 - 00;22;35;15
Pri
Yeah, I'm just excited that the optimism is kind of coming back a bit like people want to jump back in and actually like play on chain and, and do things. I mean people were definitely doing that in the mean coin trenches, but so what the reason that like I mean, I understand like there was some levity. It was more like nihilistic, but like at a certain point when like the chart would literally go up for four minutes and then all the way down like that, that just is not fun.
00;22;35;15 - 00;23;02;02
Pri
I mean, I can't imagine that's fun for anyone except for your the person who sold in those four minutes. But I do think people that went there probably missed like the community aspects of it, the like lightness of it on the timeline, the fact that it was actually not like so innately political, like, I mean, I feel like you kind of in other aspects of crypto, it might feel a little bit political, but in this it's just like, hey, like, do you like this art?
00;23;02;02 - 00;23;24;07
Pri
Like, I think it's really beautiful. Cool. Like, let's do it. You jump in the art blocks, discord. There's people like discovering, you know, generative art and like the history of art and sharing books are really like, I kind of missed that quite a bit. And I think other people do too. Like, there was a curiosity and discovery that just kind of has been lacking over the last couple of years, and I think we're kind of like finding our footing again.
00;23;24;07 - 00;23;49;01
Pri
But I think to your Chris, to your point, Chris, like I, I do hope that some of those like playbooks of like, hey, I just launched a piece that the floor just went from 0.05 to 15, and now I'm going to raise a monster round and create the next Marvel Studios. Like, I'm sure we're going to see that again, but I wonder if it looks different or if, yeah, people are just like kept it the wiser man.
00;23;49;01 - 00;24;05;06
Aaron
Like, well, I think I think that's part of the good vibes story, my understanding. And I could get this wrong, but I think, OpenSea is enforcing Unchained, royalties for that project. The project itself now has some, like, working capital to play around. I don't know exactly how that works, but I someone mentioned that, so like, I could be off base on that.
00;24;05;06 - 00;24;20;26
Aaron
But if that is the case and there's like avenues to bring on chain royalties back, I or, you know, royalties, I know they're not exactly on chain, but just royalties back to creators. I think that that's a great move. And I think that was a big piece of the puzzle, too.
00;24;20;29 - 00;24;25;02
Pri
That was a big piece of the puzzle. I mean, that's kind of when things kind of fell apart. That's when the royalties. Really.
00;24;25;05 - 00;24;53;05
Aaron
Yeah, because I think there was really these positive flywheel business models that were getting built, you know, where you could actually like bootstrap media brand or all these other, pretty cool ways to think about communities and creation using like, the royalty is the the lever for that. And I feel like, you know, pugs and some of these other folks tried tokens such as tokens don't really work that well to build these, like, you know, value accretive and positive flywheels.
00;24;53;11 - 00;24;58;23
Aaron
It's kind of more like negative flywheels around a lot of token projects which which we've known. So maybe that's coming back.
00;24;58;25 - 00;25;24;07
Chris
I want to veer for a second here and talk about the, the Penghu ETF and not specifically it, but just the idea around it. Right. Like this. An ETF used to be this really sort of exotic and out of reach financial product. You know, once upon a time and now it's becoming rendered this everyday thing. Right. There's a half a trillion ETFs floating around.
00;25;24;07 - 00;25;46;20
Chris
There's ETFs that are literally like in the hottest ETF category. Last year was we're going to only hold one stock. And we're going to take leverage on it so that we can like triple the volatility around the returns of like one single stock right. Like we're normalizing all these like out of reach things. But then are we to what end.
00;25;46;20 - 00;26;14;00
Chris
Right. Like you know how many like penguin holders are actually going to buy this ETF or is Luka really just doing this as like providing sort of this ancillary secondary benefit to his community? But in a way, like the community's not really going to interact with it? I don't know, like it's, you know, there's there's something about and I'm looking at this from like my product product guy lens, right.
00;26;14;00 - 00;26;30;20
Chris
Where like if you're really just doing this to reinforce, you know, a value proposition around your core group of NFT holders without really considering who's going to buy this thing, what's what's the probability of success here? Or like the the impact of it.
00;26;30;22 - 00;27;13;02
Derek
Yeah, I mean, it's a good question. So listen, I, I think that you're asking a great question, which is like segmentation for this, this financial product. As we know, most of the people that engage with the Penghu pudgy penguin products are on chain and crypto native. And I think if if they believe that, there's an audience out there that may want some exposure to the things that they can natively do on blockchains, whether it's hold NFTs or speculate on potential upside or asymmetry for meme tokens directly just through, you know, spot markets, but that they need kind of like these regulated financial vehicles to to kind of get that expression that maybe it makes
00;27;13;02 - 00;27;33;18
Derek
sense. I think the, the question you're asking is like, is there actually any people out there that want that type, that flavor of exposure? And I don't yeah, I don't know the answer to that. I would say my gut says probably not today, but, you know, maybe there's an argument to be made that like, listen, you'd have to paint a really interesting bull picture for pudgy penguins.
00;27;33;18 - 00;28;01;24
Derek
Like, they would have to be like, you'd have to kind of like, maybe underwrite that investment as, like, being, getting proxy exposure to NFTs or the NFT market broadly. Maybe there's this huge brand recognition around pudgy penguins that you can't otherwise access because there's no public vehicle and you can't buy the paint. Penguins themselves and or maybe meme tokens blow up again, and this is the best way to get memetic exposure to a corporate entity.
00;28;01;27 - 00;28;18;05
Derek
You know, you'd have to kind of squint your eyes a little bit to, like, find someone who wants to kind of diversify holdings into something with, with, with this type of, with this type of risk profile. But maybe they're out there, or maybe pudgy penguins executed that at some level. That makes that the more interesting proposition in the future.
00;28;18;05 - 00;28;31;13
Derek
And this is really just the first the first time they're able to kind of build those pipes for distribution, to get to, to allow people to, to do that, in this way, even though it that, that those pipes maybe won't get filled in, in March of 2025.
00;28;31;15 - 00;28;36;29
Aaron
Yeah. I don't think it's I, I didn't view that as a move for now. I view that for move over the next couple of years.
00;28;37;01 - 00;28;40;26
Pri
Was I just think, a marketing thing now, like I almost read it as marketing.
00;28;40;27 - 00;29;11;19
Aaron
Like to me it's it reminded me of when we saw like DCG and all these other folks set up trusts and other structures so that traditional investors like, had an option if they wanted exposure to Bitcoin. I mean, it is still very hard to custody this stuff, to hold this stuff, to spend time in the trenches. And it's very easy to like open up Robinhood or, you know, some older version of Robinhood and like, you know, gain exposure by buying the page's ETF.
00;29;11;21 - 00;29;34;07
Aaron
So, I mean, I think that the projects that do kind of bridge this traditional world and the digital world, the digital economy and traditional economy really well, they tend to succeed. I think Bitcoin has done a really great job with that. I think it's in a good position to do a really great job with that. I think we'll see over the next couple of years, you know, other ecosystems and assets, do that too.
00;29;34;13 - 00;29;35;29
Aaron
So I don't know, I kind of view this.
00;29;36;01 - 00;29;37;15
Pri
Waiting for the product. Yeah.
00;29;37;15 - 00;30;01;25
Aaron
I mean, I, you know, and I think that people will want exposure to online media. And this is one way to tap or this is the beginning of, of having the traditional markets have a stake in on chain online media and look like I never I've never held a buggy that never really appealed to me. But at the same time, I do think after Denver, they had a really nice presence there.
00;30;02;02 - 00;30;13;01
Aaron
You know, seeing these types of moves, it does feel like they're they're pushing the, the envelope in in ways that I think are going to be productive for other folks in the space. So kind of hats off to that team for doing that.
00;30;13;03 - 00;30;19;16
Pri
At least I agree they're executing. Also, they're really good at putting GIFs on like every platform have, you know.
00;30;19;21 - 00;30;21;21
Aaron
I have I even even.
00;30;21;23 - 00;30;37;03
Pri
Animal emotion like it's like or whatever. It's like one of the first GIFs I see it, I'm like, yeah, I'm like, that's actually kind of cool. Yeah. Like I've seen, like random Instagrams like have that have. I don't even think they realize it. But the like post the Pedri like reaction gifs.
00;30;37;05 - 00;30;42;05
Aaron
I've seen in Giphy. You know, like when I search for things to just, like, randomly.
00;30;42;27 - 00;30;48;21
Pri
Like kind of clever way to, like, get more virality around your image.
00;30;48;21 - 00;30;55;20
Aaron
Can I pivot a little bit, Derek or Chris, have you, have you been looking at these like MXGp, MXGp things around quad at all?
00;30;55;23 - 00;31;21;06
Derek
Yeah I have I'm still yeah, I'm still wrapping my head around it. I, I obviously think it's I think broadly speaking, you know when you, when you see fragmentation early on around a disruptive technology here, synthetic intelligence and I, I think the natural inclination is just like, well how do we optimize this to get things to be more interoperable, to be more composable, to to have these Legos connect in more interesting ways?
00;31;21;06 - 00;31;55;15
Derek
And I think MXGp is the is Claude's open source, maybe like gift to allow some of that connectivity to start happening around open source. And yeah, I think it's I think it's cool. I haven't had a chance to tinker around with it myself, but I've seen really cool ideas on Twitter of how people are using it, you know, prompting into immersive environments or prompting into, you know, software to create music or like, you know, and like and just like the more stitched together a genetic infrastructure, being able to traverse web apps and speak to them more cleanly.
00;31;55;27 - 00;32;03;11
Derek
So I'm. Yeah, I would say, like broadly excited about MXGp and, and the early experiments around it. But how are you using it, Erin?
00;32;03;12 - 00;32;27;05
Aaron
It's really that I mean, it's like it feels like it's opening up kind of like new ways to create media or like, connect together. You know, I think the web's kind of in an island, right? Like you need an online service to interact with it. But I think what these, MXGp tools do is they open up your, you know, apps running on your computer to interact with the web, right, or AI systems, and then get distributed via the web.
00;32;27;05 - 00;32;50;03
Aaron
And it's just it's pretty cool to to witness. Right. You get like the power of all these programs that are on your computer that can get translated through AI and then published right onto the internet. So it just feels like that the toolkit for creators is opening up. Right? Chris, you should check this one out. It's like an MCP that lets you talk to Ableton, which is, online music system.
00;32;50;03 - 00;32;57;06
Aaron
And you can create like via prompt, just like 1980s synth wave music, like, right there. It's pretty cool.
00;32;57;08 - 00;33;13;08
Chris
I've seen them. I'm definitely keeping an eye on this stuff. You know, the demos of like some enable being able to hop in a Unity or Blender or you know, Ableton is great, right? Because there is that learning curve. You know, it took me a couple weeks to get my head around like resolve.
00;33;13;10 - 00;33;13;26
Aaron
Right?
00;33;13;28 - 00;33;41;10
Chris
And like, you, you know, that barrier to entry to learning any, any, you know, piece of like sophisticated creativity software. Right. Like you really do have to ask yourself, am I prepared to spend a couple weeks to become barely proficient at something and that that's been wiped away? Yeah, I'm going to wait on the mQTT stuff. You know, a couple more months until someone is sorted out how to, you know, spin these things up in virtualized environments.
00;33;41;10 - 00;34;03;18
Chris
I yeah, I don't want, you know, cloud being able to like, you know, talk to everything on my machine. But like, you know we've had VMs forever and so we're not that far off from someone, just you know, wiring all this shit up and you being able to, yeah, jump into any sort of program and just, you know, speak in natural language to have it do things.
00;34;03;20 - 00;34;27;03
Aaron
Yeah, I think they're hyper insecure. So I tried not use it on and anything but like a pretty clean computer where you don't have any assets or digital assets kind of related to it, because I'm assuming people and there's some pretty gnarly stuff in there over time, but I don't know, it also has like kind of that early, you know, like garage type feel to it where you're just seeing like a lot of interesting little watering holes pop up around.
00;34;27;03 - 00;34;46;09
Aaron
It makes me think it's going to get pretty big. We'll see something pretty interesting around this tech over the next couple couple quarters years, whatever the time horizon is. But looks like it's it's going to enable us to create some really cool shit and makes me think the metaverse is going to actually be easier to populate with stuff.
00;34;46;09 - 00;34;58;15
Aaron
Right? When you see all the ability to like, render stuff. Right? And in these more advanced software systems that are needed for 3D graphics, like all that stuff is just going to become really easy to do. It seems like.
00;34;58;17 - 00;35;24;01
Pri
It would actually be pretty smart to create like an an MVP kind of MKV compatible open environment where you could, like, take any asset and like put it into this virtual world, and or any intelligence and like embed that into an asset and like use it in an open environment where I'm seeking MVP could easily plug in that actually would be really cool because you could like control the whatever's in this virtual environment, like through a simple prompt.
00;35;24;01 - 00;35;25;22
Pri
I find that to be interesting. Yeah.
00;35;25;23 - 00;35;53;00
Aaron
Control it or just create it. Right. So the like yeah toolkit. Right. But it's really like we we would I meant this in the last cycle. Right. Like these metaverses and that people they didn't have objects. But if you literally just have to click a button, install some little bit of software, and all of a sudden you can create entire universes of 3D generated objects, like, I just don't see how the metaverse thesis doesn't play out at that point.
00;35;53;09 - 00;36;02;15
Aaron
I just feel like that's been the big issue. It's just like doing something, being able to build in those ecosystems, like the cost looks like it's going to go down dramatically.
00;36;02;17 - 00;36;20;18
Derek
Yeah, I firmly believe that's the the case. I, so Pree and Chris were both at my, my investor conference out in New York last week, and I did a fireside. I did a couple of fireside with a few AI founders in my portfolio, but one of them was, someone who's basically he has two businesses right now.
00;36;20;18 - 00;36;54;08
Derek
One is called Atlas. They basically work with some of the leading game developers in the world. Folks like Square Enix, to basically speed up the environment creation, using AI by like 90, 95%. They, you know, will basically train up, their models on, previous levels or previous IP, and then it just speeds up the ability to kind of like edit geometry and, on demand and like, you know, create the foundational architecture for, for a gaming level in, like, you know, a fraction of the time the other part of their business is focused on decentralized systems.
00;36;54;08 - 00;37;18;21
Derek
So like being able to they they've built their first protocol on top of the tensor stack, but basically using bit tensor inflation and emissions to subsidize miners who submit answers to prompts that are coming in on a front end. So let's say I want a 3D editable geometry for, cat or a castle or, hand brush or, you know, a paint easel or whatever it may be.
00;37;18;23 - 00;37;44;14
Derek
I simply walk up to the UI and within kind of 60s, I have, perfect 3D geometry that I can throw into a gaming level, very quickly. And there's already creators who are using that system who are building out full fledged, like gaming, like immersive environments that look incredible and like they're adding obviously, like physics, physics, logic after that to make it like, you know, responsive and all of these things that a normal game developer would do.
00;37;44;16 - 00;38;06;00
Derek
But watching these experiments, it's just like so obvious that we're we're moving into a world where natural language and vibe coding 3D is just going to be like, you know, a huge, huge thematic, part of like the at least the, the, the metaverse story. So it's something that I'm paying a lot of attention to. And, and I'm close to and excited about air.
00;38;06;00 - 00;38;08;04
Derek
And so I totally agree with what you're saying here.
00;38;08;07 - 00;38;18;21
Aaron
Guys. I don't want to I mean, it's like we're back in 2021 talking about the metaverse. And it's optimism. Like what's what's this fucking what's happening.
00;38;18;23 - 00;38;23;11
Chris
This that's a very special episode of back to the future. Oh, you know.
00;38;23;11 - 00;38;24;21
Aaron
That that's the title.
00;38;24;24 - 00;38;46;06
Chris
It's funny. I mean, to go even further back, right? Like, as we're having this conversation, I'm thinking about someone that used to work with, I don't know, like 2007 ish. Right. And her husband worked at a VFX shop in Hollywood. And what did he do for a living? He rendered hair and, you know, let's just say was Madagascar or Ice Age?
00;38;46;06 - 00;39;07;17
Chris
I can't remember what. You know, what the first like, major non Pixar, film was. But that's all he did for a living. And he was part of a team who did that for a living. Was just render CGI hair on animals. And, you know, now, now anyone can just, like, conjure that with natural language. Such a short period of time, too.
00;39;07;20 - 00;39;15;27
Derek
It's crazy. It's crazy. I love the I love the hair story. Chris. We're we're unbundling hair designers in real time.
00;39;16;00 - 00;39;24;11
Chris
Yeah, VFX hair has come and gone. Is it? Just check that one off the list where we go from there. What else you got on the on your list?
00;39;24;11 - 00;39;52;00
Pri
Cory, we could talk robots. I feel like there's a lot of robot conversation. I don't know if you guys thought any of the big, like, you know, Nvidia takeaway is. But I feel like there was quite a bit that was discussed there, and a lot of it felt kind of robot centric, like because some of it was I mean, some of it was just like regular humanoid robots, but then also that little like Disney robot that they had, which is actually quite cute.
00;39;52;04 - 00;40;00;03
Pri
I just feel like that seems like where things are going, like, that Nvidia G that Groot and one and there's.
00;40;00;03 - 00;40;06;18
Aaron
Even like there's some new spatial models that are identifying things that better. Yeah, the robots are coming.
00;40;06;20 - 00;40;15;28
Pri
I mean, that feels very ripe. And I feel like there's so much more conversation around, like the figure robots and whether or not people want like the form factor to be even more like humanoid.
00;40;15;28 - 00;40;25;03
Aaron
Or do you want a humanoid robot? I don't want a humanoid robot. I, I want no humanoid robots. They creep the fuck out of me, to be honest.
00;40;25;03 - 00;40;26;26
Derek
You want a robot, but you want robots.
00;40;26;26 - 00;40;28;15
Aaron
Yeah, I want fun.
00;40;28;15 - 00;40;31;11
Pri
Small robots that Disney ones really cute.
00;40;31;12 - 00;40;31;29
Chris
Like, do you?
00;40;32;05 - 00;40;38;10
Derek
What? What makes the humanoid robot creepy? Is it the head? Is it the arms? Is it the legs? Is it the whole thing?
00;40;38;10 - 00;40;47;27
Aaron
Like, would you. It's like a it's a killing machine. Like, I don't want, like, I don't want like RoboCop living with, like me or around me like 24. Would you like.
00;40;47;29 - 00;40;50;28
Derek
What about, like Wall-E? Like, what do you tolerate? Like you'd like.
00;40;50;28 - 00;40;51;15
Aaron
Tolerate a while.
00;40;51;15 - 00;41;07;04
Derek
Yeah, yeah. I think you're on to something here because, like, there is something esthetically pleasing about cool. A cool ass robot in my home. Like. And, like, helping me do things that a humanoid robot would do. But I think it's the head. That, or it's like the fact that it's shaped like a human or that.
00;41;07;04 - 00;41;10;04
Aaron
It can crush your skull, like with its, I.
00;41;10;04 - 00;41;11;21
Derek
Think the Wall-E, the Wall-E.
00;41;11;21 - 00;41;12;15
Chris
Robots will be.
00;41;12;15 - 00;41;29;25
Derek
Able to crush your skull and then run run it over. I just mean, like, I think there's something visually about a, big a figure like person, no pun intended. Just like an actual, like, human silhouette that's living with me that I think is just like a maybe a I don't know, it might be a bridge too far psychologically.
00;41;29;27 - 00;41;47;13
Pri
I think it's just like self-preservation. Like you as a human don't want to think about, you know, transhuman. I mean, some people might get excited by that, but you don't want to think about another. Maybe it maybe it's like evolutionarily you don't think about, like, other species replacing you, even though it isn't like a species, like an animal species.
00;41;47;13 - 00;41;53;06
Pri
It might just feel like it that it once it had to, like, actually wrap your head around.
00;41;53;08 - 00;42;12;29
Aaron
You're you're right, curve right side of the belt, curving this pretty on the left left side of the bell curve. Like computers always have errors, and like you don't want something that could crush your skull. Just like hanging out in your living room. Like, sure, you want to put this and use it for a defense purpose. Like, I guess, go for it.
00;42;12;29 - 00;42;20;04
Aaron
I mean, that's a weird thing to say, but like, I could see use case. They're not in my house, you know, like, not not around me.
00;42;20;07 - 00;42;21;03
Derek
Not by my kids.
00;42;21;06 - 00;42;25;01
Aaron
Yeah. Like maybe in a store. Like maybe like a warehouse.
00;42;25;04 - 00;42;44;27
Derek
That's interesting. I wonder. I mean, this is an interesting point. I. Yeah, I wonder if, like, some I'm enthusiastic about robots. I just think they're they're coming. I mean, like, I wrote about this in my essay about like, I think about the collapse, the the collapse of labor costs through things like the cost of inference going down over time.
00;42;44;27 - 00;43;17;07
Derek
And just like GDP inflecting up into the right with like cost structures going down into the right because of, of these, you know, synthetic intelligence systems. And I think the exact same thing around labor is going to happen around robotics. I think it's going to replace, you know, a lot of the physical labor that we pay an arm and a leg for today, around the world, when you can kind of buy a $15,000 robot that isn't college trained, that doesn't require medical, or health or, you know, basic, you know, cost of living and can work 24 hours a day, like it's just going to it will change in inference.
00;43;17;07 - 00;43;37;07
Derek
And the cost of inference will do for intellectual labor. I really do feel strongly that, like these robots will do for physical and manual labor. That being said, I'm wondering, just by virtue of this conversation, whether like some of that gets stunted, at least on the personal side or like at home because of what you're flagging there, and which is just like sometimes people just don't want that in their home.
00;43;37;13 - 00;43;52;28
Derek
And, and I'm wondering if some of that growth gets stunted just because this is such a, it might be too psychologically daunting to like, have a, have that around you 24 hours a day. And I don't know I don't know the answer to that. I'm just it begs an interesting question.
00;43;53;01 - 00;44;04;19
Chris
Well, it's on Gen X to make that, purchasing consumer decision. We're the ones who are going to be. And when I say we, me and maybe Aaron. Aaron, you. You're next. Right.
00;44;04;23 - 00;44;09;02
Aaron
I'm right on that Frenchman. Yeah. Okay. Call us the Oregon Trail generation.
00;44;09;29 - 00;44;17;20
Chris
I see, so it's on me to decide. Do I want RoboCop in my house so I don't choose RoboCop?
00;44;17;26 - 00;44;19;26
Aaron
Chris. Yeah. Don't do that.
00;44;19;28 - 00;44;32;29
Chris
I do want to say I'm going to be 78. And assuming the PlanetSide cooking, I have to decide, like is, you know, am I going to get a RoboCop to shovel my, shoveling my walk?
00;44;33;01 - 00;44;40;29
Aaron
And I'm saying get a smaller one that's like fluffy and cute and that will just do that to like a, like a robot dog of some sort.
00;44;41;01 - 00;44;46;15
Chris
It's it's the same thing. You're just. I don't know if you're caught up in form factors, man.
00;44;46;18 - 00;44;53;13
Aaron
But it matters. I mean, like Google Glass, right? Like, like form factors matter. Like, I think some tech doesn't get adopted because of the form factor.
00;44;53;15 - 00;45;04;16
Chris
You want an opposable thumb and a hand capable of gripping tools, minus the creepy T-1000. Overtones.
00;45;04;18 - 00;45;13;10
Aaron
Like a really weak opposable thumb, like one that can't grip itself so firmly and, things around it. Well, what.
00;45;13;10 - 00;45;23;05
Derek
Happens when you can't open the the the, whatever the the jar of olives, Aaron. You know, and it and it can't also because it's a grip is weaker than yours.
00;45;23;06 - 00;45;28;23
Aaron
Smash it on the ground and clean up the mess. I don't know, man.
00;45;28;26 - 00;45;30;13
Derek
Oh, my God.
00;45;30;16 - 00;45;42;00
Chris
I'm hearing, like, a whole new generation of, like, consumer packaged goods emerging for totally awesome robots for the scares.
00;45;42;02 - 00;45;44;12
Aaron
I think they're they're reviving everybody.
00;45;44;12 - 00;45;45;19
Derek
The audience over here.
00;45;45;22 - 00;45;45;27
Aaron
Yeah.
00;45;46;00 - 00;45;51;12
Derek
We completely reconfigure our, our, our capacity to to create consumer products.
00;45;51;17 - 00;45;51;26
Aaron
To.
00;45;51;26 - 00;45;56;09
Derek
Fit. We. So to fit the world this week robots week.
00;45;56;09 - 00;46;02;22
Aaron
Thumb to robots. Yeah. I mean, honestly, get rid of the thumb. I think we're in good shape. Maybe that's that's the big trick that we need to solve.
00;46;02;24 - 00;46;15;29
Chris
All right, Aaron, so what I'm hearing is we're going to retool every single tool we'll use. Society of invented. Just so you're not squeamish about the fact that, your program droid can't kill you? Yeah.
00;46;16;02 - 00;46;17;22
Aaron
Cool. I'm excited for that.
00;46;17;25 - 00;46;19;29
Chris
This is so distinctly American.
00;46;20;01 - 00;46;20;22
Aaron
Oh, yeah.
00;46;20;25 - 00;46;33;24
Pri
I was actually just thinking about it, like, why don't like gorillas or apes? Like, why don't we feel threatened by them when they had, like, a similar, like one standing? They obviously resemble humans we don't like, I guess a we don't live with them.
00;46;34;01 - 00;46;39;21
Derek
Yeah, I would argue we do. I don't want to stand next to an ape without a glass barrier between us.
00;46;39;27 - 00;46;47;29
Aaron
Exactly. But you're going to put a machine that can, like, compress tens of thousands of pounds of pressure and its hands, like next to you. Okay. Come on.
00;46;48;02 - 00;47;04;00
Derek
I'm. I'm slowly getting convinced there is point of view here. What have you guys. Have you guys actually seen one of these? Figure robots are like, the Boston dynamic. Robots are the ones doing flips yet, like, in person, I haven't, and I kind of want to just, like, I want to feel it out before I make any snap judgments I saw.
00;47;04;06 - 00;47;22;11
Aaron
I think I told this, I saw a dog at the Denver, like one of the robo dogs, and it was really interesting because it was a, human, like another human dog, a normal dog there with a human. And the the dog was completely freaked out by the mechanical dog, and it was like some deep psychology going on there, like it was like, what is this thing?
00;47;22;11 - 00;47;25;05
Aaron
And it looked completely terrified by it.
00;47;25;07 - 00;47;28;28
Derek
Yeah, I can imagine. Where are you? Out with the robots.
00;47;29;09 - 00;47;42;05
Pri
I'm very pro robot. I never I think it's insane that humans drive. I think it's insane that I'm doing my laundry still, like. Yeah, why am I doing any of that stuff? Yeah. Prisoner a colossal waste of your time.
00;47;42;08 - 00;47;45;02
Aaron
Your inner American coming really through right now.
00;47;45;04 - 00;48;02;15
Pri
Yeah. Like I am firmly on the, like, let's go, robot side. Whether or not it's humanoid or not, I actually don't care because I just want the work done. The output is all I'm looking at. Ideally it's like a cute robot, but if it's not and still gets it done, like I'm fine, I'm good. I'm not like scared of a humanoid robot.
00;48;02;15 - 00;48;22;09
Chris
I think we're we're seeing the, the red blue cultural divide coming out here. And Aaron wants the three kids in a trenchcoat version of robots that can demonstrate teamwork when they need to muscle up. And he just wants, like, ex Mossad robo everything following her around.
00;48;22;16 - 00;48;24;18
Aaron
These are the questions that we're going to have to grapple with.
00;48;24;22 - 00;48;38;20
Pri
Maybe I'm just a millennial and like, I've just, you know, I like having that stuff done. It's just nice. Like, you're going to make me a little accessible when I wake up and then clean it up after me. Like, yeah, okay, cool. Amazing.
00;48;38;21 - 00;48;45;02
Derek
It does sound nice, actually. Yeah. All right, I might be my pendulum might be swinging back to me side of things.
00;48;45;04 - 00;48;47;05
Aaron
You got me with. You got me with the.
00;48;47;05 - 00;48;48;20
Derek
Morning I say evil.
00;48;48;22 - 00;48;51;21
Pri
Like, do you care? Whatever does that what it looks like.
00;48;51;21 - 00;48;52;28
Aaron
I don't really I think we.
00;48;53;01 - 00;48;57;27
Derek
We need strong thumbs to get that unassailable crack. And we're going to need some strong. You just need it.
00;48;57;29 - 00;49;04;18
Aaron
You just need a spoon in the back. And you can just, like, squeeze. You can just plop that out.
00;49;04;21 - 00;49;05;13
Derek
I got.
00;49;05;17 - 00;49;25;08
Aaron
Like, two index fingers that can hold it, you know, can't move that that far apart. You could definitely design something for your a bowl dream pre I think though like these are difficult questions we're going to have to grapple with. And I'm worried about like Silicon Valley. Like not having the emotional intelligence collectively to to make some of these decisions.
00;49;25;08 - 00;49;38;22
Aaron
But like I'm on board with the vision. But I just think I could see a couple false starts here and, and or surprises, which gets me kind of excited when looking at projects or teams or the future. I just I have a feeling it may look a little bit different because of some of these other factors.
00;49;38;28 - 00;49;54;09
Chris
What if the, first home robot is, like, completely tilled on, like, Aurélien, stoicism and cold plunges and that's all it tells you? Aaron. You should get in your -20 degree tub right now. Yeah. Know, I just want those eyeballs.
00;49;54;11 - 00;49;57;05
Aaron
Yeah.
00;49;57;08 - 00;49;58;22
Derek
This was a fun one, guys.
00;49;58;25 - 00;50;04;24
Chris
I think we've gotten way out there. So, welcome back to the pod, Derek. And, this is net society.
00;50;04;27 - 00;50;05;18
Aaron
And I thought, guys.
00;50;05;25 - 00;50;06;17
Chris
So, yeah.
00;50;06;19 - 00;50;14;04
Derek
This our crew.