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A daily podcast delving into the biggest stories of the day throughout the sports betting and igaming sector.
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And it's all about the brand, but a great brand with a not good product is no good. A great brand with an unbelievable product and then unbelievable back office, this is Nirvana. Hello and welcome back to another episode of iGaming Daily, supported by OptiMove, the creator of positionless marketing and the number one player engagement solution for sports betting and iGaming operators. Today on the show, we're joined by Neil Manashi, CEO of Supergroup, which most listeners will know is the operator of the Betway and Spin brands. We're here today primarily to discuss what Supergroup is doing in Africa. We know that Africa is a huge and diverse continent and that there are several markets that are now establishing themselves as big business for iGaming. And where we find those markets, we also tend to find Betway, which tends to occupy the top spots in those markets. So today we're here to talk with Neil about Supergroup's African strategy, as well as a few other global issues. Neil, thanks ever so much for joining me. How are you doing? Thanks, Charlie. Thanks for having me. No, not a problem. Really appreciate your time. In your most recent earnings call when you were reporting 2025 results, you told investors that Africa is supergroups, so growth engine. Could you just outline the size of the opportunity that you see across different African markets and maybe just give us a glimpse of which jurisdictions you're seeing the most success in? OK, well, Africa is one of our growth opportunities. Obviously, Africa makes up about 40 % of our group revenue, and it's been the largest region for the five consecutive quarters. And everyone knows the TAM in Africa is estimated to be $11 billion in 2025 and expanding to $22 billion by 2030. So obviously, this growth is underpinned by population growth, mobile money penetration, smartphone adoption, and obviously rising casino engagement. South Africa is probably the most mature market and we the top operator there. It's well regulated, record casino volumes in our recent quarter, quarter four. Obviously continued momentum we're getting there with our Jackpot City brand. And we obviously are fully compliant licensing environment. em We've seen a market we launched in February 2025 was Botswana. We've seen great growth there, sustained growth, great numbers, customer numbers. and we've put in position there as well. Obviously, I mean, one or two that we're not doing so well in is Nigeria. We obviously redefining our strategy in Nigeria is totally different to the rest of Africa. We do see lots of upside and it's obviously it's a large market and and it's and we are mobile first. So so we're honing our product there. But we've got lots of other countries coming online. We recently said that that that we're only going to probably do one more this year, which is going to be in Namibia, because that's near Botswana and South Africa. And we see great grand residents there. But we've got pipeline of three to six markets coming in the next 18, 24 months. But the idea is we're in about eight of them now. So we'll have nine plus we got a cascina offering. there's lots of stuff that we are we are hoping to achieve in Africa with product and then with our back office services. Yeah, certainly an exciting region to be doing business in them. And you mentioned that you've got podium positions maybe in some of those Southern Africa markets like Botswana and South Africa, maybe not doing as well as you perhaps wanted in Nigeria. But what sets you apart from the competition in those Southern African markets? I guess um what is the remedy to the situation that's in Nigeria, I guess? Okay. So listen, what sets us apart? First of all, we've been in Africa now for over 10 years. So this is not an overnight wonder. Remember, we took our international expertise and we brought it to Africa with a team dedicated to the African continent. Obviously, there's unmatched payment ecosystems. We have about 150 different m mobile money integrations across the continent. We've got an unbelievable product, front-end product that's built for Africa, it's made for Africa, and obviously it needs honing in certain markets. Loyalty programs. programs, efficient marketing mechanics. And I think the big thing for us is Betway, the brand, the worldwide sponsorship. You know, we do the major football leagues, the English Premier League being the biggest, we win about 60 % coverage there. We do the Italian, the Italian league, La Liga, etc. Right. So we've got and football being our number one sport. So you get this global brand presence that you see in Betway within the localized marketing to go with it, plus the local teams on the ground. And it's all about the customer engagement and keeping the cost, the customers in entertained in our ecosystem and being best of breed. And that's what it's about. So it's front office marketing and in your back office, which has to deal with these millions of customers that that you're you're engaging with on a daily basis. oh Absolutely. but one thing I noticed when I was looking through that, um, presentation for your 20 to 25 results and Q4 results was, that I mean, I think it's labeled in the report itself, exceptional casino growth. think it was 32 % quarter on quarter growth. And do you think that's driven by sort of changing player habits in some of these markets as they begin to mature? Because you might assume that a lot of these markets are sports betting first, or do you think it's about that sort of cross-selling operation? And as you mentioned there, Neil, keeping players within that ecosystem. Yes. So obviously we, they, Betway is sports-led brand, but it's obviously got online casino. And the customer who comes to play at Betway and bets on sports and then plays on casino is fundamentally different to the pure play casino customer who comes to our Jackpot City brands. But it's all about, you know, it's the payment mechanisms, it's the integrations into our platforms. It's all about what the customers like to see in a sports product and a casino. Casinos obviously always been, there's always been land-based. And across the world, mean, our business supergroup today, actually 80 % of our revenue comes from casino. Even though Betway makes up about 55 % of our people coming through Betway, but it's still 80 % casino. So we are an online casino business. The sports just gives us the interaction. And then the casino is where obviously where where it's like lottery style, where they can win big amounts, et cetera. So so so we've seen that for for for a long time. It's different customers. different genres and, and, that's what we've played through from the beginning of time. Remember super groups history when we founded a long time ago, we started, started in casino. We only really got into sports in 2011, 2012, right. And then Africa. So, so we are casino at heart, but with this unbelievable sports brand and sports product. Yeah. You say this unbelievable sports brand and product, and it's going to be a huge year. It's already been a huge year for sports in 2026. Obviously the World Cup is the headline event. I'm just really curious to see what the strategy is for the World Cup across Africa. And does that change in markets like South Africa and Nigeria where those teams will be playing at the World Cup compared to maybe Botswana who aren't going to be there? So, you know, listen, it's all about content. Sport is about content. So obviously the World Cup is a major event for us. uh I think we got about 40 % of the countries we in are actually in the World Cup. So it takes South Africa, as you mentioned, Nigeria, England, Spain. So that ultimately gives the custom engagement in those countries. Listen, it will be amazing if South Africa and Nigeria get through to the knockout rounds. It's all about custom engagements. it's the World Cup just normally would, if you didn't have the World Cup, we then wouldn't have those matches. So it's a continuation of the English Premier League season. It just gives us another six weeks of content. And so we're really looking forward to it. Listen, there are a lot more teams in this year's World Cup as we all know, because they extended the draw, which means that in the earlier rounds, let's see how the favourites do. So remind everyone, our business is all about the favourites drawing or losing. We just need one or two of the favourites to draw and lose. because of the multiple bets that people place. So if all the favourites are winning, it might not be so good for us in the early rounds, but of course there are many rounds. But again, it's engagement for a season that would normally have ended in May, June, and then it kicks off here. So listen, we're really looking forward to it. And I think another stat they gave me was that 88 % of our 2025 revenue are countries that are represented in the World Cup. really going to be another great season. let's see how it goes. Right. Yeah, indeed. think we're all excited about it. And just a couple of follow-ups, if you don't mind on that. You say that it's the extended or the expanded format and maybe your business is about just hoping that some of the favorites draw or lose. There are perhaps some concerns about competitive balance early on in that tournament. Have you got a plan for? keeping players engaged during those games that might not be so competitive. Yes. So they obviously casino. Obviously, that's one part. Listen, the the AFKON we we saw saw saw an AFKON tournament also in early rounds. had this. It's getting the pricing and your margin strategy right. You know, in a big volume business like us, when when when you can have two, two and a half million customers in a day in your software, you've got to make sure your pricing is right and the margin and the way you set the pricing. Listen, we find lots of people, but multiple bits, cumulator bits, you know, five legs, seven legs, 10 legs. So so as long as the pricing is right and and but what we have found and I'm an accountant by training is the mass eventually the favorites do not always always um win. And we just need a few of them not to win. And then it's all good. And and you've got the next day and then you've got the next round and you've got the next event and you've got the casinos and the other sports events that that are happening. That's tennis. Cricket, all of those kinds of things. So it's not just about the football, but yes, the industry as a whole has to be on its pricing. then just one more on the World Cup. You said that it's a continuation of the Premier League season, if you like. Do you think that on one hand it is a case of, yes, it is an extension of the Premier League and football season, but also it's a huge sort of acquisition opportunity for that way to get new players into the ecosystem? Yes, absolutely. know, absolutely. It's listen to actually m advertise in the World Cup and with FIFA is super expensive. So so we don't do it. As you know, we all over Arsenal, Man City, we all the main betting partners, all the Premier League. So what we'll do is we'll advertise digitally around around the World Cup. And listen, the better the our countries that we operate in do. the actual mall, mall, the customers come back. But I think it's such a huge event. It's like this. It's it's football on on the world stage at its best. Right. So by its very nature, people are engaged. Right. So listen, the timing's a bit different because it's in obviously America, Mexico, Canada. So it'll be for late, late night viewing. But maybe that also helps out our casino business. Right. Which, which, which, which we know it does. know when when they come and play in the sports. they also come and play in our casinos. absolutely. And the World Cup, obviously massive and it's going to be huge. But perhaps, you know, in Africa, not the biggest tournament of the year, because we've just had AFKON. First of all, I have to ask you because we're talking on a day where the Confederation of African Footballers has reversed the result of the final and uh Morocco are now the champions. How does that, first of all, is that something that you're going to maybe pay out on for punters? And how difficult is that for you to make a decision on? Well, first of all, first of all, Jesse Settigal have now taken it back. and, and uh I'll argue in their case. Listen, I mean, according to Afkon, the rules are if you let me leave the pitch, then you forfeit the game. Right. So, Alison, it's never happened before. So I think it's, it's, I'm going to play. and cloud now let's let's see what happens we've obviously paid out and um on on on senegal winning and then let's see what the what what what happens with their case coming and then and then and what they give you but i'll turn to condition i explicit we pay out based on the event happening at the time otherwise you know we can have this going back and forth all the time so so so let's see but yes it's a crazy scenario this yeah it's uh yeah It's actually upsetting, right? Because it's sport and it shouldn't come to this, you know, it should be the end of it ever wins wins and that's how it should be. But listen, we've seen this in Formula One a lot. Remember when they come and they disqualify. So we have seen it in sport, but never at this level, especially at such a big tournament. I mean, it's definitely not happy. Listen, I think there's no team in the World Cup is leaving the pitch. I think that we can be certain of. Yeah. And I don't want to let that sort of overshadow what was otherwise a brilliant tournament. And it really was a high quality tournament. And I just wanted to ask you about whether there were any takeaways from AfCon from an operational or a strategic point of view that you can sort of apply to the World Cup later this year. No, I think it's more that it's just, it's for us, it's the engagement of how many of our customers come back into our software, into our apps. And I think we saw a huge uplift and every World Cup that we've had in the past, we've seen this. you know, it's making sure we're ready, making sure that our systems stay up or stable. We can pay off quickly. that's what we built to. And we built this durable systems, you know, whether it's Betway Africa or our global Betway globally, it's all the same. Right. So listen, and I think because it's in North America, Canada. We are really big, Bitrate is really big in Canada, super interested to see what happens there. So we are really looking forward to it, right? Fantastic. Well, Neil, we'll take a very short break and we'll come back and we'll continue our discussion. to meet additional operators. They're going better than last year. There is such a buzz. Being able to meet face to face. A lot of good people I've met. New companies I haven't seen before. Far more exciting than, you know, your traditional conference for sure. Welcome back to iGaming Daily. Today I'm joined by the CEO of Supergroup, Neil Menashe. Neil, a significant development that Supergroup has had over the last year or so is the launch of the XAR Supercoin in Africa. Could you outline why you took the decision to launch a stablecoin and talk to us a little bit about how important a diverse range of payment methods are across Africa? Okay, as I mentioned, we've got 150 different payment integrations. So we launched the ZAR Supercoin. I mean, obviously chose South Africa because we're able to do so there and be the number one player there. So it's really to offer our customers a faster, lower cost digital payment option. We've obviously done it in partnership with a large consumer exchange in South Africa, Luno. And obviously we will list it on other exchanges. immediately available. You can buy and sell on Luna. But what we're to do is we're going to add it to our ecosystem. We said in probably the second half, I mean, to the first half of this year that you can cash out from Betway into our super wallet. And from there is you've got you into your super coins and then you'll be able to use your coins. And if you want to come back into Betway, it's a seamless transfer. The real reason being is One of the most expensive methods we have in South Africa, particularly, is vouchers. And it's really expensive. And we've got people depositing in, cashing out, and depositing before they've even got their cash outs, which means we've got a huge cost of getting money into our system. So we're the super coin will help our margins there and become more slick and more organized for our customers. So it's a long road. This is the beginning. of a very long journey. know, stable coins are known in some markets, you know. So there's lots of opportunity from a financial ecosystem. But we're starting with this. We've got to get adoption and then using it across our ecosystems. uh Ideally, we would like it to be in all markets we operate in Africa. uh I think the world is finally getting there. Even with cryptocurrencies, I think there's been much more adoption. oh across the world, but it's a long play this, you know, it's, it's, it's going to take a while, but, but for us, we're at the forefront of it. And we really excited, excited when you were able to see what it can do and, and, and, and, how to. Yeah. You mentioned that it might help you with, with your margins and maybe expanding that globally might be quite useful when we're in an ecosystem in which regulation is getting tighter. uh taxes are rising. You did an interview recently where you mentioned that tax rates between 15 and 25 % are a reasonable range for an iGaming company. Could you expand a little bit about why that is and explain to listeners why it gets so much more difficult when it gets above 25 %? Yes, so that's the range we like to see. Remember, in a business there, there lots of different costs. So one of them is obviously the gaming tax. The other one is you have to pay m for all your content providers. You have to pay money on that. You then normally run, we run about 22 % of net gaming revenue for marketing. So you've got marketing expenses, then you've got all your GNA, your operating expenses. So to get to keep your margins of our total EBITDA margins of 25%, it's good to have those tax rates between 15 to 25. When they go more, it you have to become more super efficient in your ecosystems, meaning the marketing rates, etc. that you have to spend have to come down. And it's all about the durability of that ecosystem. What we do find when they go taxes too high, what then happens is you obviously lose smaller operators. But one thing we don't want to do is the customers go to the legal or the unregulated market. Because there they got no customer protection. So we see a lot of that is when you over tax an industry so no one can make any money, you actually just land up the countries, land up losing all the taxes they would have collected. And it goes to these illegal unregulated operators, which then have no rules. And sometimes when customers win, they don't even pay them out. Because who's the customer going to complain to? Right. So it's getting that fair balance. And I think there always has to be a fair balance. It's the same way as to be a fair balance with corporate taxes in countries as well. Right. If you overtax people leave, it's the same story here. You just got to get that ecosystem working fairly. And then the government takes the money that it makes and it, and, and, and, and it can use it on, on its, on its, on its own in internal spending projects. Yeah, you're absolutely right. And this is, this is something that we talk about a lot on the podcast as well. It's well documented that as we speak, it's two weeks now until those tax rises come into play in the UK, with 40 % of GGR for casino and 25 % on sports betting. How do you assess your position in the UK market as those tax rises come in and do you have to make mitigating measures in order to offset that? Yeah. So firstly, you know, One thing about Supergroup, we listed on the New York Stock Exchange in 2022. And one of the things we have 4,200 employees. We've now got about 2,700, 2,800, or even a bit less. So we are continually becoming operating efficiencies everywhere, right? Wherever we can. I mean, we caught out in Q4 earnings that we thought that the hit in the UK will be about $30 million pre-mitigation. So we've got stuff, obviously we believe marketing rates will come down, we'll become more efficient. The smallest operators now cannot afford to operate in the UK, so there's less competition. We've obviously put a lot of effort in our product in the UK. So we've seen a lot of up-clifts. I think we grew the UK about 60 % in 2025. I think the industry grew at 3%. So as long as we can get that in check, we obviously still lots of room to grow. We're not the number one player. We have a very small. you know, single digit market share in the UK. So for us, there's upside because everything has to get in check. said, in all these markets, you can't keep spending and spending the competitors. You've got to bring EBITDA to the bottom line. And I think you're going to see people having to hone on their ecosystems to keep this efficiency. You talk about operational efficiency as well, Neil. And just wanted to touch on super group. I game in North America, in the US, and because I think there's something that you did last year was decide to close down in the US. Could you talk to us a little bit from an operational level about why the US is such a tough market and talk about why you don't think there are those clear, durable advantages for you there that you mentioned in your investor call. Yes, so I think listen, we tried in the US, we spent hundreds of millions of dollars. I think really what happened in the US, again, to compete in this business, you need a great product, great marketing and a great back office and obviously a great team to support that, right? We were up against big competitors there, especially the two biggest um owned 80 % of the market in sports. The amount they were spending on marketing was, you know, we just couldn't compete with plus The ecosystem in the US with with you got to have land based partners, the taxes you have to pay, the share that they want, all the different costs that involve meant that your breakeven was like four times anywhere else in the world. And what happened is we're in seven or eight of these states. So what was happening is we're putting all our development into the product in those states. Actually, when we cut it and we cut some some European countries like Belgium, France, Portugal, et cetera. that we couldn't see a path to profitability. We could hone our resources on the markets where we're making lots of money, Canada, Ontario, Mexico, UK, Spain. And we've seen, you've seen the super growth of, of, of, of super groups, EBITDA and revenue. It's because of honing in on where we can make money. And that's what it's about. You can't be everywhere. Same way I can't be in every African country tomorrow. Maybe in five years, I can cover a lot more of it. And we'd hope to. But it's the same principle. You really it's not just about put a website up, market a bit and they arrive. That's not what this business is. This is hardcore being the best of the best in in in order to compete. So from the US, we learned that lesson. But what came out of the US, the product we developed for the US is what we've moved the whole of Betway Global to in Canada. So wasn't a waste. So wasn't a total waste. We learned lots of lessons. But I think that at least we tried and we realized the part of which you'll find now in some of the markets. how, how let's say, Fan, Duel and Draft Kings are in the US, we found ourselves, we are them in some of these African countries. And, and it's all about the brand, but a great brand with a, with a not good product is no good. A great brand with an unbelievable product and then unbelievable back office, this is Nirvana. And this is what we, we, are striving to do. Obviously closed down in the, in the US markets, but you say there that In Ontario, in Canada, you're going from strength to strength. I'm just curious about what some of the differences are between those US markets and that regulated sector up in Ontario and where the strategic differences are that makes it viable for you to be there, but not in the US. Okay. So we've been in Canada for like 25 years. So you've got this customer base that you were ready, are able to spend 20 % of your marketing money. So you've really got a marketing budget. that you don't have to cover. Remember, these businesses are all about having a certain scale with good marketing every month. And then you get these operating leverage in your EBITDA open above these amounts. But in America, you're starting from zero. So you have to build it up. So I remind people that competitors in America have been there since 2012. it was the same way we've been in Africa for last 10 years, they've done the same. So it's very hard. And you've got to get the product right. I think Canada and all the other markets, New Zealand, et cetera, we've been there for a really, really long time. Fantastic. And throughout this interview, Neil, you've mentioned a few things. One of those is having a brilliant brand. And I don't think you can have a brilliant brand without having some of those high profile marketing sponsorships that you mentioned earlier. You you have a lot of coverage in the premier league. One landmark agreement that you've penned recently is with Formula One as being its first official betting partner. That sounds like very exciting news. So well done on that deal. How big of a deal is that for you and what's the strategy behind that partnership? listen, we obviously started with Williams F1 first, obviously doing Williams and that was more about aspirational and F1 and all the glitz and the glam that go with F1 and that sponsorship has gone really well. You see that we do two, do Betway and we do Jackpot City. So that's gone well. So F1 came, we've done a betting product, an exclusive betting product in certain regions that are only available on Betway. And I think that's an interactive way to bet on F1. And it's more a way to bring customers into our ecosystem. There's lots of people who follow F1. The betting hasn't been as good as it is now because we get all the data from F1. So it's bringing all of that together and then partnering with F1. We have to try these things. We try lots of new marketing things. We used to sponsor West Ham on the front of shirts. Obviously that's coming to an end. We came to an end last year for us. But this year you weren't able to, I mean from next year you weren't able to sponsor on shirts. That's why we took the thing to Arsenal. We want marquee brands, you know? And then in country, we do marquee brands. We do the Springboks in South Africa. We do Simber in Tanzania. We do the Bedway Premiership in South Africa. We take marquee landmark brands and sports, and that's who we associate ourselves with. But I remind people that branding is only a certain percentage of our worldwide marketing spend. You we've got a lot of money to spend worldwide. It's not only on brand. Brand forms the important part, but it's all the other segments. And that's where it all comes together. So F1 fits into that. it's early days. It's just started. You they had the first race where they had our product. Let's see how it goes. It's a super, the second race. It's a super interesting season. think if one's really interesting, I think the Netflix series took F1 to another level, but I think the fan engagement, you can understand to understand what actually goes on. Right. And so, yeah, so it's good. Yeah. So it's something different. Fantastic. Well, Neil, look, I've really, really appreciated you coming on the show. Some really fascinating insights and a great, great to chat. And yeah, again, thanks. Thanks for coming on the show. and I'm sure we'll speak again soon. That's Neil Menashe, CEO of Supergroup, the Betway and Spin operator. And to our listeners, thank you ever so much for joining us today and come back tomorrow to keep up to date with all the latest global gambling news.