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Pull up a seat at our table, where badass women from all walks of life—fashion, beauty, design, music, philanthropy, art, and more—come together to share honest stories, serve truths, and dig into the realities of modern womanhood.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay, I am menu planning for my next guest, and I'm feeling super inspired because I just got back from the farmer's market and the tomatoes are gorgeous. So, I think I'm going to do a really nice, simple bruschetta to have ready when she arrives, which is just, you're going to take some baguette and toast it really, really crispy, drizzle it with a little bit of olive oil, and then you're going to chop up these gorgeous tomatoes. You're going to add in a little chopped garlic, a little chopped basil, and some more olive oil and salt and pepper. And then you're going to spread that tomato mixture on top of each little piece of toast, and you're going to have a lovely just fresh summery bruschetta. With that, I'm going to serve a really chilled white effervescent. It's a little sparkly, but not, like almost like a Vinho Verde.
It's not super bubbly like a champagne, but it's just got a little bit of effervescent. I think that'll be really nice and refreshing with our bruschetta. And then for dinner, I am feeling very inspired because I just saw this gorgeous, huge chunk of Parmigiano cheese. I think it was like a Grana Padano or a Reggiano of cheese at the beautiful market by me. So, I'm going to try to make Cacio e Pepe in the cheese wheel. Have you guys ever seen that? I've seen it at restaurants. I've had it at restaurants, never made it myself. So, I'm going to attempt to make a Cacio e Pepe, like a Bucatini. I love Bucatini, Bucatini Cacio e Pepe in the cheese wheel. If that really goes to the pits, then I'll make it myself without the cheese wheel. And then with that, I'm going to do like a lemon Parmesan crusted chicken cutlet.
So, super light and just a really light arugula salad next to it, dressed with just lemon and olive oil and salt and pepper. And I think that will be a nice balance to the richness of the pasta. With that, I'm going to serve that with a little bit of a chilled red. You guys know if you listen to this podcast, I like a chilled red. So, like a Brunello di Montalcino probably, yeah, or Montepulciano. Something a little bit on the lighter and structured side.
And then for music, I'm feeling like a mashup. I am feeling a little Lana Del Rey. Lana Del Rey came on in the car today. I'm feeling a little Lana Del Rey. I'm feeling a little, I've been very back into like Lauryn Hill lately, so a little Lauryn Hill. I'm just going to mix it up. My next guest is so smart. I could talk to her forever. I want this meal to be pretty simple, so that I can just focus on talking to her because I have so much I want to talk to her about. She's beautiful, she's smart. I've known her for a really long time. She's got a lot to say and a lot of opinions and somebody that I admire very, very much. So, let's dig in.
Hello everyone, and welcome to Eat My Words. I am like, I know I see this every time, but I'm really excited for my guest today for several reasons. First and foremost is that it's been a really long time since I've had a chance to catch up with her, and two, because I think she is and will continue to be an incredibly important voice of her generation and one that I admire very, very much. So, I'm really excited for you guys to get to know her today. She is a 15-year veteran of the beauty and fashion industry whose work has appeared most recently in Porter Magazine, Harper's Bazaar, Elle, the Cut, and Marie Claire. She's the co-founder of 2BG Consulting, which aids fashion and beauty brands and influencers on their anti-racism journeys.
She is the author of her first novel, the Rules of Fortune, and the incredibly powerful and I think essential read for anyone in the fashion and beauty industry, Token Black Girl. She's also a fellow horse girl and a New Yorker, the transplanted to the Midwest, who when she's not watching Love Island, she is researching how feminism and social justice intersect with pop culture, a subject she continues to illuminate through her writing. She is a daughter and a dedicated sister and fan to a bravolebrity. She is outspoken, she is hilarious, and she is smart as hell. Danielle Prescod, welcome to Eat My Words.
Danielle Prescod:
Thank you so much. What a nice introduction.
Johanna Almstead:
You can just play it on repeat now.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Whenever you're just doing your morning affirmations, you can just play it on repeat.
Danielle Prescod:
Thank you.
Johanna Almstead:
Thank you. Thank you for being here and taking time out of your very busy life. I know you have so many things going on and I have so much I want to talk to you actually about. When I was preparing for this. I didn't even know where to start because I have so much that I want to ask you, and I fear we may go on for hours, but I'll try not to. But thank you for taking the time to be here and hang out with me today.
Danielle Prescod:
Of course.
Johanna Almstead:
So, I like to give people context for how we know each other. You were an editor, were you at Teen Vogue? When I was at Kate? Was that where you were first?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I was an assistant at Teen Vogue, but I think we started working together more when I went to Elle.
Johanna Almstead:
Was trying to remember if it was during the Teen Vogue years or the Elle years. But you were an editor and an assistant in places that I was working very closely with when I was running the PR department at Kate Spade. You even came to our camp Kate Spade in the Hamptons. Do you remember that?
Danielle Prescod:
Camp Kate Spade was so much fun. It was one of the first brand trips that I ever did. But you guys were like, there wasn't another brands really doing brand trips at that time.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, we were on the forefront.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, you guys were pioneers and it was such a fun trip. I loved it.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God. Do you remember Baby Tillia? Do you remember my daughter was-
Danielle Prescod:
Of course, in game shows like [inaudible 00:05:54]. She was a baby.
Johanna Almstead:
I was just passing her off to whatever editor would take her.
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly. And we were all willing. It was amazing.
Johanna Almstead:
It was so funny. So, then we both moved on in our careers and our lives, and thank goodness for Instagram because there, I learned that not only were you also a fellow horse girl, but you were writing books while I was also diving into more writing myself.
Did not publish as many as you. You did good there kid. And then you published Token Black Girl and I, to be honest, was floored. I thought it was, so am I allowed to say incendiary? I like that. It was brutal. It was beautiful. It was heartbreaking and really ballsy at a time when I was still afraid to be ballsy, I think. So, I was really in awe of it. So, I want to talk to you about that book a lot, but I also want to ask you first because I'm not sure if this is where it began. Where would you say your journey began?
Danielle Prescod:
My professional journey?
Johanna Almstead:
Your whole whatever you want to talk about.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I was actually thinking today, because they're filming The Devil Wears Prada 2.
Johanna Almstead:
I know.
Danielle Prescod:
And the Devil Wears Prada 1 came out when I was a senior in high school, and I remember going to the movies and seeing it with one of my friends who was also very into fashion at the time. And we lived in Westchester. We saw the movies in Rye. And I know that a lot of people walked away from that movie be like, "Oh, my God, how awful." And I was like, "I want to do that."
Johanna Almstead:
At least you knew what you were signing up for.
Danielle Prescod:
I will wake up with my boyfriend. I will ditch my friend's art show. I will eat three almonds. I don't care. I want to do that. I was so laser focused. And then at that time, there was also the reality television component coming in, glamorizing and showing the fashion industry. And nothing about the lack of diversity in it or the lack of representation deterred me. I was just like, "That is what I want to do and you could not stop me from that." So, after my freshman year of college that summer, I came home and I was like, I'm getting an internship. So, all my friends went away for spring break that year, but I came to New York City to do interviews for my internships for the summer, and I got one at Nylon Magazine, and that was my first time in a magazine. And I was like, "Oh, my God, I did it." Now, I have to work. And ever since then, that's what I have been doing.
Johanna Almstead:
And did you know before that movie that you wanted to work in fashion and beauty? What did you think you wanted to do before then?
Danielle Prescod:
I didn't really have a clear direction. I always really loved clothing though, because I wore uniform for my whole life. So, I really loved when I could express myself through what I was wearing. But I didn't know much about how magazines were made or anything. I toyed around with the idea of being a photographer for a short time, and I took some photography classes. I won a photography contest, a national photography contest, but I'm not that patient. And if you are going to be a photographer, you have to be very patient. You have to wait for the light sometimes. You have to wait to set up many things. A lot of it is the setup. And so, I was like, "Yeah, I probably am not going to do that." And then the only other thing that I saw in magazines was bylines. So, I was like, "Well, I guess I'll be a writer."
So, I knew that someone put the pictures in there and I knew that someone put the words in there, but I didn't know that someone also put the font sizes or the other kind of art that's in there or figuring out how the page gets laid out. I didn't know any of that. And I really, how would you, I didn't know that someone picked all those clothes. I don't know what I really thought where those clothes were coming from, but I just never really thought about where they might come from. So, it wasn't until I was an English major and my internship was in the writing department, and my job was to do a lot of the fact checking and a lot of the research for the editors that were working there. But now that I am older, I realize they were giving me a lot of busy work to get me out of their hair. But I had also read that you were supposed to be really enthusiastic and always ask, "What else can I do?" So, I'm always asking these people what I can do, and they're like, "Go away."
Johanna Almstead:
They're like, "Here, file these. Go research this."
Danielle Prescod:
So, I would like alphabetize the beauty products that come in. I was very organized, but at a certain time, it was just busy work. I was transcribing things and they would say, "No rush on it," but I would try and get it done, like in an hour, of course. And then I noticed that the fashion closet was always busy. It always seemed like they needed help. And then I realized that they were selecting the clothes, and so, they needed you to go on pickups, which is when you, from whatever magazine you are, go to the designer and physically pick up the thing that you want to shoot and bring it back because it's faster than a messenger. So, then when I finished all my work for the internship that I was hired to do, I would always just help out in the closet. And it just was really exciting and glamorous, and that's what I wanted to do. So, I fell into it accidentally.
Johanna Almstead:
So, you were at Nylon first as an intern, and then where did you go after that?
Danielle Prescod:
I went to Refinery29 back when Refinery29 only published one story a day.
Johanna Almstead:
I remember it was like a newsletter. It was just like one thing.
Danielle Prescod:
And we were in a basement in Tribeca. It was great.
Johanna Almstead:
The Glamour.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, there was like four desks. Yeah, it was crazy. And then I went to W Magazine and I actually transferred schools because I was at school in Boston, and I realized that when I got that first internship at Nylon, a lot of the girls and guys that were working there were Parsons students or NYU students or Columbia students, because you can be there all year round. And I was like, oh, I can only be here in the summer. So, I'm actually at a disadvantage because a lot of the editors had familiarity with these people because they had seen them other semesters. They had been getting to know them. And so, I was like, "Well, I actually think I need to transfer school." So, I transferred to NYU, so that I could do more of this work.
Johanna Almstead:
And these were still just unpaid internships, right? None of these were paid yet.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I did unpaid internships for four and a half years.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, wow.
Danielle Prescod:
Maybe five years. Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
That's a long time.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, it is a long time. I know my parents were horrified, but I also, to supplement, I babysat a lot. I became the babysitter for a lot of the editors.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God. Genius. So smart. Totally.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, exactly because I had been babysitting. That was the job I had in high school, so I just kept doing it, which was awesome.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. And then when did you get your first paid job? What was your job that was the first in the industry that was paid...
Danielle Prescod:
My first-
Johanna Almstead:
... Other than babysitting?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. My first paid job, I got at Interview Magazine when I was still a student actually. And I remember, I think I started there in May, and it was so close to finals ending, and I did not want to go to my graduation ceremony because it meant that I had to take a day off from work to graduate, and I was not going to do it.
Johanna Almstead:
You were hardcore.
Danielle Prescod:
Hardcore. But I also feel like now on the other side of it, it seems like such a trauma response that it's just, it's not normal. I would never require that of anybody. And it wasn't explicitly required of me either, but I could tell that it helped me.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, I was going to say, even if no one said it, it was probably implied that it would be very strange for you to take a day off to graduate from college.
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly. Actually, Taylor Tomasi-Hill was the one who was like, "You have to graduate and you're doing it. So, you're taking off," Taylor. Yeah, she was the one who made me do it.
Johanna Almstead:
Good for her.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. And it's funny because I was re-listening, so I read Token Black Girl when it first came out, and then I was re-listening it. It was fun to listen to your voice, but in preparation for this. And I was just totally thrown back to that time and that the general tone of the industry was so absurd. It was like we worked so hard. Everyone worked so hard.
Danielle Prescod:
Everybody.
Johanna Almstead:
There was so much trauma, there was so much, in your case, there was so much racism, there's so much sexism, there was so much weight-ism, body-ism, all of it. It's just so fucking bonkers to me that that was how the industry was. And now, when I think about it, I remember the sea change when I remember when things started to get a little better, and it feels like a lifetime ago. And people say to me all the time, "Was the Devil Wears Prada true?" Well, it's not exactly a true story, but yeah, a hundred percent. I could have written it, but I just happened to work at Prada.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, right. Yeah, pretty much.
Johanna Almstead:
So, it is wild to think back that, "No, it would be weird for you to take the day off to graduate from college."
Danielle Prescod:
I know, but I did.
Johanna Almstead:
You did? Good job.
Danielle Prescod:
I graduated and my whole family came.
Johanna Almstead:
So glad.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
And thanks to Taylor Tomasi-Hill for making you do it.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Taylor. So, you've worked for some of the biggest media outlets in the US now, BET, Elle, Harper's Bazaar. How did working at those places shape you for good, for bad, for ugly?
Danielle Prescod:
I think the older I got and the more that I learned, it actually shaped me less. I think it had more power over me when I wasn't in it. It's like when they say that you should never do the thing that you love, because then, it exposes what it's really like. You could probably love music and then start working in the music industry and you're like, "Oh, God, is this how this song gets made? It's so terrible." And not that the art that comes out of it is terrible, but that the process and the politics and seeing what gets taken out and who is allowed to be there. So, I think that the more I was exposed to it, the less effect it had on me. I thought it was amazing when I was on the outside of it more.
Johanna Almstead:
Interesting.
Danielle Prescod:
And the closer you get to being in charge of being able to make the calls, and then you realize just how hard that is because there are so many other factors stopping you from doing the thing that you want to do.
Johanna Almstead:
I also feel like in the moment, I at least have this, I would forget, you lose perspective when you're in it. And I would meet people that didn't know what I did, and then they'd find out what I did and they'd be like, "Oh, my God. That's so amazing." I'm like, "Is it? I guess."
Danielle Prescod:
I know. That happens to me all the time, especially because now, I don't live in New York, but I have several friends who are editor-in-chiefs now, and it's not that exciting.
Johanna Almstead:
But remember how scary they were back in the day. An editor-in-chief coming in anywhere was terrifying.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. I would be sweating or even a director having to go meet with them, and I'm like, "Oh, that's just my friend."
Johanna Almstead:
Right.
Danielle Prescod:
Or you know. Yeah, totally. Yeah, it's wild.
Johanna Almstead:
It's different. It's interesting. The more you're in it, the less power it has over you. That's maybe a metaphor for life, too.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
So, when did you decide to write a book? Was that brewing for a long time or was that a...
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
When did you decide to write Token Black Girl?
Danielle Prescod:
I had always wanted to write a book. I actually always wanted to write fiction books. And in 2018, I started working on it, and it was my New Year's resolution for three years straight that I wanted to write a book.
Johanna Almstead:
I can relate to that.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. And what was difficult though about that is that the industry had started to shift. So, at that time, I was already a digital editor, and the requirements of working on the internet were just so full throttle all the time. So, every single day, I was editing upwards of 20 stories, and sometimes, I would write, sometimes, I wouldn't.
Johanna Almstead:
And this is at Elle.com?
Danielle Prescod:
This is at BET.
Johanna Almstead:
At BET. Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. So, it was just so difficult to find time, energy, and motivation to do writing I was not going to be paid for, and then on my essentially off time. I was like, "This is so difficult." And I tried and I was writing a really bad novel because it was like auto fiction, and I was like, "This is bad. I don't even want to read this. I don't think anyone else will want to read this."
Johanna Almstead:
I think I, too, have started a bad novel. We're like, I'm just going to write about my life and then I'm going to change the names.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
But not really tell the whole story.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. And I didn't have any real guidance on how to write a book. I was just writing. So, when 2020 rolled around, I was like, "Okay, Danielle, this year is year number three. You said you were going to do this, you have to do this." So, I made myself, I took a trip to Ireland by myself.
Johanna Almstead:
Why Ireland?
Danielle Prescod:
Okay. I read about this couple that got married in Vogue.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
It was a lesbian couple, and they were like, we like horseback riding, our families golf, and we like castles. And I was like all of those things. And they rented out this castle for their wedding. And then I looked up the castle and I was like, "I think I would like to go there." And I didn't have anyone to go with at the time. So, I was like, "I'll just go by myself." And I'm like, yeah, it's a pretty safe, I didn't feel nervous or anything because it's pretty contained.
Johanna Almstead:
Right. You're in a castle.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Fortress situation.
Danielle Prescod:
So, I just like made myself a little horse retreat. And then I was like, "I'll try and write." And what I realized on that retreat that I made for myself was that it was so much easier to write when I didn't have other writing to do, when I didn't have other reading to do. I could read and I could write, and I was like, "Oh, I think what I need to do is just cut out my job." And the year before, in 2019, that girl who was the entertainment director at BET, she took a medical leave of absence from work because we had FEMA laws in New York. And so, she gave me the blueprint. She was like, "Yeah, if you feel burnt out, they have to give you 12 weeks and they have to pay you."
Johanna Almstead:
What?
Danielle Prescod:
So, I was like, yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
How would I miss this one?
Danielle Prescod:
I'm like, "Tell everyone, especially if you work at a Bay Company, like Viacom," I'm like, "You should definitely look into this and you should definitely do it." So, I asked my therapist to help craft a note for me to take this time off, and she did. And I was like, "Great. Now, I get to relax basically for 12 weeks."
Johanna Almstead:
Amazing.
Danielle Prescod:
Except it started the second week of March in 2020.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, no. Shit. So, you're like, COVID relaxing.
Danielle Prescod:
So, I was like, "Oh, I can't go anywhere anymore." So, I had had all these little trips planned for myself because I was like, that's really good for my writing brain to see other scenery.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
But nope, couldn't do any of it. I had to stay home. But what was really cool was that also, everyone else had to stay home. So, it wasn't like I was missing life. I was like, "Well, I have to, and I don't have to go to work." And so, for maybe two or three weeks, I was sulking and sad about how I couldn't go anywhere. But then, I was like, "Look, you're never going to have this time again, so you better lock in." And so, from April to June, I wrote every single day and I basically finished my book. And when you are writing a nonfiction book, you really only have to prove to publishers that you're qualified to write this book.
Johanna Almstead:
You don't have to hand over the entire manuscript, right?
Danielle Prescod:
No, you can just hand over a book proposal. And that book proposal basically says, "This is why I'm an expert in this subject. Here are my credentials, and here's other forms of my writing, and this is why you should let me write it." But I did not trust myself to do that because I had never really written anything professionally more than 3000 words. And the book that I ended up writing was 96,000 words, which is a big difference. So, I was really nervous that I wouldn't be able to.
Johanna Almstead:
That you'd do the proposal, you'd get the book deal, and then you wouldn't be able to deliver?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Got it. Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
And that's really scary, too, because if they pay you the advance and you miss your deadline, you have to pay them back.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
So scary.
Johanna Almstead:
Scary.
Danielle Prescod:
So, I was like, "That's not going to happen to me. I'm going to write the whole thing first." And so, I did it backwards, and then in June, I signed with my agent, and by July, she sold the book.
Johanna Almstead:
Holy shit.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
And how did you find an agent?
Danielle Prescod:
Same way I found an internship. I made an Excel spreadsheet. I did all this research, I query, that's what it's called when you write agents, queried 96 agents.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God.
Danielle Prescod:
And some responded, some didn't. I had meetings with a bunch of them.
Johanna Almstead:
And you weren't actually sending the copy of the book to them? You were just sending a little note that says-
Danielle Prescod:
No, you send the proposal and then you send a sample of the book.
Johanna Almstead:
Right, okay.
Danielle Prescod:
So, then they get back to you if they want to. Yeah. So, I had this whole spreadsheet and I met with people and yeah, that's how I got my agent.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God.
Danielle Prescod:
I cold email them, by the way. I didn't know any of them.
Johanna Almstead:
You didn't know any-
Danielle Prescod:
It was when I was applying to internet magazines. I didn't know anybody. I just looked online. I tried to find email formats that made sense, and then just cold email people.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. So, I would like to just highlight a few key attributes here that I feel like are coming out here. Tenacity, organization, and I would say discipline. You are just very determined, in determination, I guess, right?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Wow. Okay. That's so intense. I feel like that process is still very scary to me, and I think it's amazing that you just tackled it and did it and published a book.
Danielle Prescod:
I think that one of the things I've learned about the book industry or in the book industry is you should just let someone else tell you no. It's way easier for you to tell yourself no, but at least do the thing and then let someone else be like, it's not for me, because that happened a lot. The rejection happens, but then also, other people were like, "I love this," or, "I want to work with you."
Johanna Almstead:
I love that.
Danielle Prescod:
But you have to do both of them in order to get the yes, I guess.
Johanna Almstead:
Right. I love that just in life, let someone else tell you no. Don't be the one that says no to yourself. That's stupid.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay, we're going to take that away with us today. Okay. So, I read Token Black Girl. I think I said earlier when it came out, because it came out in 2022, right?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. And when I read it the first time, what stuck with me was your take-down of the fashion industry, I think because I was still in it a little bit, and the media and the harm that it can cause women and girls. And that was my takeaway at the time. And it was an important one and a good one. And I felt like, wow, everyone in this industry needs to read this because there's so much of it that I was definitely party to, and we all were in many ways, sometimes, subconsciously.
And it made my stomach hurt and made me feel terrible about a lot of interactions that I'd had in my life. And just even thinking about just so many things that we have done and continued to do. But then the second time when I just recently was revisiting the book, what struck me more was the first half or the first three quarters almost of like you as a child, and maybe it's because my two daughters are in the ages that you are talking about in your childhood, but this, it just like re-broke my heart for this little child who was so early on learning to hate her body and her skin that she was in. Can you talk about that and share for people who haven't read the book, what that was like for you? Because that to me is just like, "Oh, it fucking killed me this time around."
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. And what's so challenging about that is that I really did have so much support. I have supportive parents. I had a very supportive extended family. My parents have a lot of friends. I was around them, like all, so many positive influences in my life, but it was so much of this concept that I wasn't good enough and I didn't belong. And I somehow had to change myself so that I could, and those people weren't giving me that message. But it was the kind of messaging you get at school with your friends. And I think it's really common actually, but it just becomes so internalized then nobody talks about it. So, it becomes very toxic for the individual because I wouldn't really say it. It's not like I was telling my friends, "Oh, I feel like I don't fit in with you guys."
Johanna Almstead:
And you wouldn't talk to your family about it?
Danielle Prescod:
There were times where I said stuff out of frustration, but we didn't have necessarily wider discussions about it. No, but I was very shut down, too. I think my parents tried their best to reach me, and I was just like, "I don't want to talk about it."
Johanna Almstead:
Interesting.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
So, for people who have not read the book, you grew up in Westchester County, north of New York City, and you went to a predominantly white private girls school, and you were the only black girl in your class?
Danielle Prescod:
I was one of three.
Johanna Almstead:
One of three. Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
Three of us. Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
I was trying to remember which grade was which. And you talked in the book about not realizing even when you were little, that you were different than them, that you were different than the girls, that you did a self-portrait and you drew yourself with fair skin and blonde hair.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. In kindergarten, we had a self-portrait assignment, and you do it at school. And my mom was like, "How will I know which one's yours?" And I was like, "Oh, you'll know. You'll see me."
Johanna Almstead:
Oh my gosh.
Danielle Prescod:
And it definitely looked nothing like me.
Johanna Almstead:
Wow.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
That must have been, I can't imagine your parents, like your mom. That must have been really hard as a parent to be like, "Whoa, we don't even know." But you said that they didn't try to convince you otherwise.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, they weren't forceful about it. They would be like, "Is this what you think you look like?"
Johanna Almstead:
You were like, "Yeah."
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, exactly. They were not very, "You can't do that." They didn't say stuff like that. But I think that they were confused, as well. I don't know what the best way to handle it would've been, but I also know that in the early '90s, we were not equipped with as much information and as many resources as we have now.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. So, you, at a very young age, started to hate the skin you were in, hate your body, try to control your body, try to starve your body. What's your relationship now with your body?
Danielle Prescod:
Well, I had to have a surgery this year. I had uterine fibroids, which actually most women have, black women were I think at 80%, 85%.
Johanna Almstead:
Wait, 80% of black women have fibroids?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Wow.
Danielle Prescod:
I know.
Johanna Almstead:
It seems like a high percentage.
Danielle Prescod:
Incredibly high.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
And for most people, they're asymptomatic. But I actually don't know if that's true or if we just learn to live with the discomfort and learn to live with pain and don't say anything.
Johanna Almstead:
I was just going to say no one's, yeah, everyone's just gaslighting you.
Danielle Prescod:
Probably. But for me, the older I got, my hormones just got way out of balance. And so, things started changing for me. So, I gained a lot of weight. I had this big bloated stomach where I looked pregnant and everything was just difficult. Now that I have them removed, I'm like, "Wow, look at my life. I can move around easily." I'm lighter.
Johanna Almstead:
Basically.
Danielle Prescod:
There's nothing in there that is preventing my movements from being normal. I just had something in the way. And now that it's gone, I'm like, "Oh, my gosh. I'm so much more grateful for my body." And that is one of the things that makes an eating disorder interesting. It's like you're mentally ill, but you're physically giving yourself an illness. Whereas if you do get something that is not in your control, the flip side of that, just being healthy, you would appreciate so much more. You really take it for granted if it's always been there. And I was always fairly healthy, but now, I feel so much better and I don't think about it as much anymore. That's the thing. I don't have time to think about it that deeply. I wouldn't be able to do half the things I do if I was still weighing my food on a food scale and counting how many nuts I eat. I just would not have time. Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
And how long ago did you seek treatment for that?
Danielle Prescod:
I would say 2019, I froze my eggs. And because of taking the hormones there and you can't exercise and you can't drink alcohol, there's all these stipulations that you have to follow when you're doing the egg freezing. And it caused me to gain a bunch of weight initially, and the hormones made me so hungry, and because egg freezing was so expensive and so time-consuming, I really wanted to get it right. So, I was like, I'm not going to-
Johanna Almstead:
Which tracks with your personality also.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
"I'm going to do this. I'm going to do it perfectly."
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, exactly. I was like, I'm not going to, actually, the first day I was on shots, I went to a SoulCycle class because I was like, "They don't mean no exercise. They just mean people who never exercise." But I exercise all the time, so, I obviously, and I started cramping in the class and I was like, "Oh, I have to stop." And so, I didn't do it after that, but I just realized I gained maybe 10 pounds or something in two weeks from just that alone.
And I was like, "I think I really just have to start addressing this." So, I was in therapy, I stopped seeing this nutritionist that I was seeing. I stopped doing all the supplements and the counting, and it was not necessarily linear. If I got really stressed out, I could probably not eat for the whole day. And it wasn't like one day, I just was like, "Oh, now, I'm a healthy person." But I started trying to become healthier around then.
Johanna Almstead:
I'm really glad that you are happier in your body now.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, me, too.
Johanna Almstead:
It's a big thing.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
It's a big thing to live your life in a body that you don't love, right?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
It's crazy.
Danielle Prescod:
It takes up a lot of brain space that you could use for other stuff.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. And you don't realize it until it's not, right?
Danielle Prescod:
Mm-hmm.
Johanna Almstead:
And you're like, "How did I spend all that time thinking about that and worrying about that?" Okay. Well, now, you said that you don't have time to worry about those things. So, you are now a published author, a twice published author, and you run a consulting business. So, what do your days look like now? What does your life like?
Danielle Prescod:
Every day is different. It really is. I try to structure the week. I'll have days for admin, which is days I have to send invoices, catch up on emails because I find that every single brain is a different brain. So, then I'll have writing days. So, on writing days, I can either do research or I can write. And if I have a deadline, for example, then I have to hit my word goal every day. But then I also got a volunteer job, two volunteer jobs actually when I moved to Milwaukee, because I just think that is one thing to move to a new place and be like, "I want friends. I want community." But I think you have to at least attempt to be in the community if you say that that's what you wanted.
I was always saying that's what I want. And so, that's what I did. I work with an organization called Nextdoor, and I read to kids in the library to help promote childhood literacy. And a lot of them are in very vulnerable home situations. So, they're either in foster care, they might be in a shelter, they might have no one to read to them. And hearing a lot of words, seeing stories, all of that stuff helps prepare you to do better in school, to live your life better. And for a lot of kids that don't have those opportunities, it's like a terrifyingly direct pipeline from being a problem child in first grade to prison. It's like, well, the teachers are like, "I give up." And so, to try and get kids used to keeping their bodies still and listening to a story, because these are all kids that are pre going to school as young as six weeks...
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, wow.
Danielle Prescod:
... Up to five years.
Johanna Almstead:
They're little.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. They're little. Yeah. That's great. And then I work with seniors, as well, where I have a walking club with them and we go on field trips to let them see the city. And a lot of the seniors that I work with are immigrants, so they are new to the city, too. So, we all get to see new places and experience new things together, which is great.
Johanna Almstead:
I love that. That's so cool.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
So, they immigrated late in life? Like they're new to the country?
Danielle Prescod:
They might just be new to Milwaukee.
Johanna Almstead:
Or they just never got out?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. They might just be new to Milwaukee for a lot of reasons, and they might not have a car or a license. And it's not New York City where there's great public transportation. It's like this is like a place where you really do need a car in order to be able to see everything that there is to offer. And it's cold most of the year, so you're not really walking around. But now that it's nice, we do that.
Johanna Almstead:
We walk around. Okay. I feel like this is a question that comes up in my own life, too. How did you find those volunteer opportunities? I'm sure there was a spreadsheet involved. There were some queries involved. Because I feel like a lot of what we talk about on this podcast is community and finding ways to connect and I think that that's an important way, and I think that people or I think I definitely have, in some cases, I have a little block against it. So, how did you find those opportunities because they sound amazing and very well suited?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I just Googled. That was it. When I was in New Orleans, I worked at a youth shelter and I had just found it by Googling volunteer opportunities New Orleans, because there's so many organizations that just need help. They just need bodies. That's part of their pain point that they have so much that they want to get done, but the people who are paid to work there are exhausted, burnt out, just the way we would be at any other job, not paid enough. And so, they need help. And I'm like, if I have a free hour or two during the day, which I usually do because I make my own schedule, I'm able to do that. So, yeah, I'm like the same way you find a Pilates studio, that's how you can find, I'm like, the same. I just Google Pilates Milwaukee and then see all the results that come up.
Johanna Almstead:
Right.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Good. So, can we talk a little bit about your consulting work?
Danielle Prescod:
Sure.
Johanna Almstead:
Because I feel like since the time you have founded your company and some political changes that have happened, what does your consulting work look like now that our government is dismantling DEI initiatives all over the place? What does that, I imagine, things have changed for you guys.
Danielle Prescod:
Huge, yeah. It's basically non-existent. And it's not just the fact that on a very widespread level, the Trump administration is saying that we have to deprioritize DEI or DEI is unfair. But it also that the industry understands that there's no accountability, there's no consequences for anything. And that they know that even if they mess up, they can move forward. Everyone will forget. Everyone will go back to shopping how they said they were going to, and that's it. It's just like they don't really care.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
That's heartbreaking.
Danielle Prescod:
It is. It really is disappointing because we really did spend so much time and energy trying to help make a difference. And I think that in a lot of ways, we were, but now, it's just, I think we're in a worse place than we were before 2020.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
I really do.
Johanna Almstead:
Because I think before, it felt more just cluelessness and lack of consciousness around DEI and the ways your company can benefit from it. And then now, I feel like there's an active anti.
Danielle Prescod:
Yes, exactly. And there's so many things intersecting, as well, like the rise of GLP-1s and everyone's body shrinking back down the rise of the tradwife movement and this...
Johanna Almstead:
Jesus Christ.
Danielle Prescod:
... Push that there are specific gender roles, and there's a right way to be a wife, and there's a right way to be a mother, and a right way to be a woman and how that woman looks. And so, I think that all of those things coming together and just making it totally okay again to just not care. That's what it's like. "Oh, don't make everything political. It's not a big deal." You just look like a killjoy. They have demonized the word woke, so it's like if you say, "I don't know if we should say that or do that." "Oh, well, you just don't want anyone to have any fun. You can't take a joke." And it's like, "Oh,, gosh, this is where we are again?"
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. It feels like we've reverted 50 years.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
At least.
Danielle Prescod:
It's dark.
Johanna Almstead:
It is dark. How do you stay positive?
Danielle Prescod:
I think-
Johanna Almstead:
Because these are obviously issues you care deeply about and in an industry that needs some help.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. I think you just have to protect yourself. I am a very conscious shopper, so I think that where I spend money is very intentional, but I also think that your attention is a currency. So, where you pay attention to, like the people you follow, the people you admire, the people who you put on a pedestal, or who you platform, you have to be careful and mindful about. It's not just like, "Oh, I like this girl's cute outfit." I don't like a cute outfit on a fascist. I'll tell you that. I really don't.
Johanna Almstead:
Fascism just doesn't look good on you.
Danielle Prescod:
Sorry. I am like there are so many cute outfits in the world. I'm like, I don't need to look at this person. I don't need to say, "Wow."
Johanna Almstead:
I don't need to consume that.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. Yeah, you don't.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, I feel like I've tried really hard to be more aware of who I'm consuming. Because some of them were sneaky. Sneaky, little fascist there.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
But also, I think in my world, it's like a little bit of just try to create the little bit of change that you can and have the important conversations that you can, where you can, for as long as you can, and keep going.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. So, your days are spent mostly writing. Are you working on a new book? Are we-
Danielle Prescod:
I am.
Johanna Almstead:
You are?
Danielle Prescod:
I am working-
Johanna Almstead:
Do you talk about it?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. I'm working on two, actually.
Johanna Almstead:
Casual, two at one time.
Danielle Prescod:
Kind of, yeah. That's kind of the goal though, for being a working writer. I always say that I'm a baby author, like I'm still very new to this. I have a lot to learn, but I went to the American Library Association Conference in Philadelphia a few weeks ago where I met a lot of other authors. And one guy I sat next to at a dinner, I think his first book came out 1995.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. So, he's been around the block few times.
Danielle Prescod:
Mm-hmm. He was like, "I spend 8 to 10 hours writing a day every day." And I'm like, "What? How do you do that?" And this man is like, it is a business for him. It's turning them out. I still think that I romanticize it a little bit because it's still new to me. It's just the same way I did with fashion when I first got into it. I was like, I didn't even care how much money I made because I was just happy to be in the room, happy to be there, happy to see the clothes, happy to sit at the show.
Johanna Almstead:
Right.
Danielle Prescod:
And I just was very enamored of the whole thing. And so, it feels a little bit that way with books right now. So, I'm not as, I still think of it as a very artistic thing. And it took me a long time to acknowledge that I was an artist and that this is art because I am a very type A person.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
It is how I am paying for my life, but I don't necessarily approach it in this like, I always thought of an artist as someone who looks at a blank lump of clay and then just sees something. But actually, writing is a lot like that.
Johanna Almstead:
I was going to say a blank piece of paper or blank computer screen.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. You start at zero words, and then you get to 1000, and then you get to 2000, and it grows from there. And you really have to plan out how it's going to end up. So, anyway, now that I realize that that is actually what I'm doing, you also have to help structure yourself because you can get carried away.
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
And so, I feel like I do do that pretty well now. And the two books that I'm working on, one is a book about a couple that goes on vacation and a lot of things go wrong. And it's interesting because when I first pitched this book to my publisher, there was an immigration component to the book. It was a very major plot line. And then of course, I started snatching people up from the streets. And then we realized, "I think we might have to change this," because what's also challenging about book writing, which is a little bit different than the internet. The internet, you can respond right away. You can change your mind the next day if you need to, and you can reach the same amount of people. But book writing or publishing, it's just very long process. So, even if I turned in a finished book today, the earliest it would come out is 2027.
Whoa.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Wow. That's a long time.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
So, things change, and I feel like the landscape is changing so quickly now that you can't keep up.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. And so, you also want to make sure you're doing things responsibly and then be like, "Okay, in two, three years, is this going to look crazy or is this going to look?"
Johanna Almstead:
Right.
Danielle Prescod:
So, yeah, we're working on that. And then another book about not so secret societies, but societies or clubs for women and intense female friendships and how you navigate loyalty and difficult things in your life.
Johanna Almstead:
And both are fiction?
Danielle Prescod:
Both are fiction.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. So, are we like-
Danielle Prescod:
I love writing fiction.
Johanna Almstead:
Are you now a fiction writer? Are we-
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
I think so. Nonfiction is hard because you really do open yourself up to a lot of criticism, and it's like they're criticizing you and your actions, and it's almost like you're not a real person to them, people who are your readers. So, yeah, it's hard to, when I wrote my first book, have to defend myself if I-
Johanna Almstead:
Was there a lot of backlash against that book?
Danielle Prescod:
I wouldn't say backlash, but I would say I think just a harsher lens of looking at my own actions as an individual. But I'm like, I'm human. Of course, I make mistakes. And one of the things that I write about in the book is that black women are not allotted the same grace or allowed the same amount of mistakes that white women are.
Johanna Almstead:
Right.
Danielle Prescod:
And so, the same kind of people who would say if someone had some scandal, it was their favorite influencer, and she is in trouble for something racist. "Well, she's learning or she's changed a lot," but I did something when I was 15. And they're like, "You're awful. You're a terrible person." And feeling left out or feeling bad about yourself is not an excuse for that. And I'm like, "Oh."
Johanna Almstead:
"I was 15 also."
Danielle Prescod:
But this girl who's an adult just did this, and you think it's totally... It's all bad. We're all going to make mistakes. But I just find it interesting, the framing around those. So, yeah, it was just hard to have to defend that.
Johanna Almstead:
Well, and you were not shy about writing about your mistakes.
Danielle Prescod:
No.
Johanna Almstead:
I thought that was one of the things that was so poignant, ballsy, all the things to me was that you didn't gloss over it with a PR lens at all. You really owned some of the harsh, harsh things that you had done. And I think that it's wild that that's not taken into account, right?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
None of us needed to know those things that you did, you chose to write about them.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. I also don't like it when someone writes a book where they become a martyr or something. And then as everyone's like, "I know the real story." So, I didn't want to be that person. I was like, "I have to own up to," and I know, and that's what I was trying to highlight. I'm showing you where I was complicit or when I was an enthusiastic participant in things that I knew were wrong, so that someone can think, "Hey, when was I complicit? When was I an enthusiastic participant in things that were wrong?" I was trying to reach people on a parallel but I just don't know [inaudible 00:48:29] you did.
Johanna Almstead:
And lead by example also.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
I imagine, I don't know, I'm trying to remember when it came out, if I talked to anybody in the industry about it, but I imagine there were a lot of people that were made uncomfortable by it.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I think a lot of people were very unhappy. It has gotten back to me a lot of things. People said, people have called me crazy or that we're on a witch hunt or something like that. And yeah, I find all of that just very interesting because again, one of the ways that this system can perpetuate is the secrecy around it and the fear behind saying, "Hey, this is wrong and we probably shouldn't do this." And then that person losing their job or becoming an untouchable or becoming that person who's always speaking up in a meeting and just allowing that to happen. And I'm like, "Are we all just so cowardly that this is okay?" And I'm like, "What are we all really getting out of this?" There's so few perks now for some free jeans. Hold on.
Johanna Almstead:
Well, I also feel like people probably felt like you broke that code. You broke that vow of silence.
Danielle Prescod:
For sure.
Johanna Almstead:
For sure.
Danielle Prescod:
For sure. But I'm like, I feel like you need to, and the bravest people do. Like that girl that wrote that book about Facebook and all the stuff that's happening inside that company, I'm like, "Yeah, we needed someone to say something."
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. We have to.
Danielle Prescod:
Because this is dangerous. It affects all of our lives. It really does.
Johanna Almstead:
It really does. And I think that's the part that is so important about your book, too, is that you're like, this isn't just a workplace thing. I work in a factory that is churning out media that is affecting young women, young men, people around the world. We are all complicit in it because it's not just some day job that you go to that sucks and is racist and is sexist and is horrible. It's like, no, I'm actually going to a place where we are producing things that perpetuate this stuff in the world.
Danielle Prescod:
And it reaches millions of people a month, sometimes, a day, and really fast, too. You hit publish and it's there...
Johanna Almstead:
It's there, and changing it back.
Danielle Prescod:
.. For everybody to see.
Yeah. And I'm like, yeah. That's why I think the blowback to the Sydney Sweeney American Eagle campaign is so intense right now because it's like, at this time, you thought this was a good thing to do. But again, it shows how far the pendulum is swinging back the other way. And I actually used to really respect the American Eagle campaigns. They were early adopters into the body positivity movement, hiring a lot of plus-size models. They let a lot of the girls on the US gymnastics team right after Larry Nassar was on trial, talk about pride in their bodies. And they have the Airy campaigns, and they have the jeans and who shops an American Eagle, but teenagers, your training consumers, young people shop there, and this is what you're serving them. It's terrible.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. And just clueless, especially when you know because we know how many people are involved in approving something that is going to go out in the world. How that many people all thought that that was a good idea.
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly. It's baffling.
Johanna Almstead:
Or no one was like, "Hey, I think we should just revisit this.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. It's wild. Okay. I could talk about this all day, but I won't make you talk about it all day. Do you have any philosophies that you apply to your work? Do you have a thesis in how you want to spend your days, what work you want to turn out or is it just where the mood strikes?
Danielle Prescod:
I do. I think that I had to shift a lot of my attitude around work, because when you're, especially working in a digital capacity, how much you produce is directly tied to your success. So, you always want to be producing, but that's not very healthy for you mentally, physically, emotionally, it's just not good. So, I really tried to alter the way I approach work, in general.
I try not to torture myself anymore. If it's not coming, it's not coming. If I'm writing and I have a deadline, I have a daily word goal, which is 2000 words a day, which is manageable for a professional writer. It's not that hard. You could write 2000 words pretty swiftly. I could probably write it in three hours or less. So, three hours of your day, that's not that bad. But some days, it comes really easy, and some days, it comes really hard. So, some days, I might get 4,000 words. Some days, I might get 6,000 words, and some days, I might get 800 words, and I have to be okay with that and not torture myself over like it not being the 2000 because the goal is to have 10,000 words a week. So, for five days, you write 2000 words every day at those five, but if it doesn't come, it doesn't come.
And that has to be okay, because I would rather it be good and make sense than just to have it done. This is not busy work. I'm not writing an essay where my professor said it has to be this many words. I'm like, no, I'm writing something that I'm like, it needs to make sense, so I would rather wait. And I'm like, sleeping is important to me, like resting, exercising, volunteering. So, fitting all these other things and not making it just me sitting at this desk. I have to also live life, which I think is a part of being a really good writer. I need to look at other people. I need to see how they say things, see how their hands move. Just observe things, just need to to be good at it.
Johanna Almstead:
And that's a complete shift from what our lives were like when we were in the grind of fashion.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
I don't know about you, but I didn't have a personal life. My personal life was work. My dinners were with editors.
Danielle Prescod:
Yes.
Johanna Almstead:
Weekends away.
Danielle Prescod:
And that's where your friends were.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. My weekends away were with people I worked with or worked for. And I think that it's so wild now because similarly, I can make my own schedule and I can do what I want to do. And it's just such a different, it really takes a long time to shed that pressure muscle of just like, "We have to go. We have to go. We have to go."
Danielle Prescod:
Yes, for sure.
Johanna Almstead:
And it's funny, I'm going to have... You know Deborah? Deborah is going to come on. I just had an email with her, my old boss, and she's like, "I hope I'm still valuable. My days are so different now." And I was like, "Trust me, honey. All of our days are so different," because no one, that's not sustainable. I don't know if you see this, but there's people that I see who are still grinding hard in the industry who were like senior when we were there, when we were, and I'm like, "What are you doing? How are you doing this?"
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Right?
Danielle Prescod:
I think it's interesting that we all, well, anyone who gets out goes through this.
Johanna Almstead:
We all find each other.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. But go through this recovery period where it's like, "Yeah, what am I supposed to be doing?" I would still try and keep a 9:00 to 5:00 schedule when I first started being freelance, and it's like this invisible surveillance that's over you. I am like, "Oh, wait. I don't have to," my book publisher, they're always laughing at me. They're like, "You always email back so fast." And I'm like, "It's because when I was an assistant, if I did not email back someone within 20 minutes..."
Johanna Almstead:
Heads would roll.
Danielle Prescod:
I was living in fear and I still don't know how to really break some of that. It feels permanent. I know that it's not necessary.
Johanna Almstead:
Totally.
Danielle Prescod:
But it's so interesting that all of us are feeling that and, how do you feel getting out of the city helped you with that?
Johanna Almstead:
That helped a lot. That helped a lot. Partially, just spatially, right? I'm not crammed in some office anymore.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
I still have a hard time with the time though, like the business day. Like yesterday, actually, it was very funny. I had my one daughter just got home from campus. She went to go play at a friend's house and have a sleepover. And my other daughter is not at camp this weekend, so she was really bored and I had stuff I needed to do and I had to prep for this and I had work I needed to do. And I was like, "You know what? Just be with her." And it was like 4:00 in the afternoon, but the work day wasn't done. And I was like, just sit-
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, feeling guilty.
Johanna Almstead:
We watched a movie, we watched K-Pop... Wait, what's the K-Pop, something Avengers? I don't know. It's very intense. And I was like, "Go sit with your kid, watch this movie, and then you can do work at night. You can go back. It's okay," but I still have this. I'm like, "Who's watching? I'm not punching a clock."
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
But the fact that I was sitting on the couch at 4:00 in the afternoon on a Tuesday felt like still so uncomfortable for me.
Danielle Prescod:
I know.
Johanna Almstead:
So, I haven't shed at all.
Danielle Prescod:
It's weird.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, it's weird.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. But we do have the freedom and I think that you have to just try and embrace that whenever you can. I don't know. I was going to write about this in my newsletter this week, but Tom Brady has a newsletter. I don't know if you know this.
Johanna Almstead:
I did not know this.
Danielle Prescod:
Tom Brady has a newsletter and he wrote one of the saddest things I've ever read. It was horrific. It was basically about how he's aware that he was not a present father and that he wasn't there for his kids, but he's like, "But I think I did show them discipline and commitment because that's how I was with football," and I was like, "You think when your kid was sick or scared or sad, it mattered..."
Johanna Almstead:
That you were a football star?
Danielle Prescod:
It was so crazy. And I was like, "See, that would've never been acceptable if a woman has it"
Johanna Almstead:
No, God no. Could you imagine?
Danielle Prescod:
But I'm like, "Wow, that is crazy." So, I'm like again-
Johanna Almstead:
And dimensional.
Danielle Prescod:
It is, but moving into a phase of life where I'm thinking, "Do I want to have kids?" I'm like, yeah, I don't want my kid to be like, "You're always working."
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, it's hard. And it's hard, too, when you have a job. In some ways, it was easier when I wasn't working mostly from home. It was like the lines were very clear and here, it's like it's easier in the sense that I can get the work done. I could go and work after she went to bed, but they also see you working more.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
And what's in front of them is what they know. They're not like, "Oh, at that time, when she used to take the train," and whatever, they're like, that was work, too. So, it's a balance, but I also want them to see good work. I want them to know that I love my work. I want them to know that I'm out there in the world. So, yeah, it's like a forever juggling act to be honest.
Danielle Prescod:
But we also deserve our own free time. And I'm like, I try to reclaim it when I can. If I'm like, "You know what? I'm not going to do that today because I don't feel like it."
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, I'm trying.
Danielle Prescod:
I also got that way with social media. If I don't want to make a video today, I don't want to post, I'm not going to. I am not, if you're into this, you have to post every day. I was like, "I'm not a brand." I don't like that when people have to think about you as a person, as a brand. I'm like, that's just weird. It makes us less human. I'm like, "I'm not trying to do that."
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Well, and I think probably what people generally respond to are the ones you do because you're excited about doing them, not because you're churning it out on a content calendar.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, right. Exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay, so what's the best part of your job?
Danielle Prescod:
The best part of my job is that I always, always loved reading books, and now, I get to do it all the time.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
And of course, I'll always love clothing. I love how I can express myself through fashion, but now that I live in Milwaukee, there's less places for me to go.
Johanna Almstead:
You're not turning out looks for your walking with your seniors around Milwaukee?
Danielle Prescod:
Actually, when I do go to volunteering, that is when I get dressed the most because they appreciate.
Johanna Almstead:
They're like, "Girl, I love that look."
Danielle Prescod:
My seniors love it and my kids love it. They love it, but everyone else is super, super casual all the time. And like I work from home most of the time, so I don't really have to do that. And so, I always love clothing, but reading was everything to me when I was a kid and I always wanted to be a writer. And so, now that I actually get to do that every day, I'm like, it's so lucky. Yeah. Yeah, that's really fun.
Johanna Almstead:
What's the worst part of your job?
Danielle Prescod:
The worst part of my job is the uncertainty of it. There are so many factors that influence whether or not a book can get published, when it gets published, if the market receives it well, it is always in flux.
Johanna Almstead:
Right, because even after you deliver it and after it gets published, you can't control the results, right?
Danielle Prescod:
Uh-uh.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
So, it's scary to have that.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, especially for a control freak.
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly. Yeah. It's like the ultimate act and releasing control because I really don't have control over it.
Johanna Almstead:
I like to talk about this on this podcast because I feel like it's very easy to see you and think like, "Oh, she has it all. She published two books. She's writing two more." And if people haven't read Token Black Girl, they won't know. But what sacrifices have you made in order to get to this level of success, achievement, whatever you want to call it that you have in your life now?
Danielle Prescod:
So many. I think early on in my career, I never took a vacation ever. I don't think I took a vacation until I had already been working for six or seven years.
Johanna Almstead:
Wow.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. And that's because I always wanted to be available. And I think that's just harmful. First of all, use your vacation days, especially if you work for a major corporation, they are your days. You don't get them back. You just need to take them, and nothing is going to crumble without you. It's still going to keep moving because they'll replace you if you get sick, if anything happens to you, they don't care about you, so you should take your vacation days. That was a huge mistake.
Johanna Almstead:
Yes.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. And I think I just sacrificed a lot of my own personal wellbeing in the name of working and trying to reach a goal or trying to be successful. So, that includes sleeping or going to the doctor, taking care of yourself. That was one of the things when I went back into therapy in 2019, my therapist was like, "Okay, I didn't tell you that self-care is not doing a face mask." I was like, "Oh, yeah, I do self-care." She was like, "No."
Johanna Almstead:
"No, you don't."
Danielle Prescod:
And I'm like, "Oh. But I am in an industry where self-care has become a commodity." So, we're selling self-care as part of why you need to get this new pair of shoes, why you need to get a new necklace, why you need a new lipstick. It's self-care.
Johanna Almstead:
Right.
Danielle Prescod:
But that is not caring for yourself, listening to yourself, knowing what your body needs. None of that was being done for me. So, I had to learn all that, and I think that was a major sacrifice because then you're now on the other end of I crossed over 30 and I'm like, "Oh, my God. I don't know anything about myself."
Johanna Almstead:
No.
Danielle Prescod:
I just know I'm a worker.
Johanna Almstead:
I don't know how to take care of myself.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. "I'm still not great at it, but I'm getting better, trying."
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
But that wasn't valued, we weren't taught that. I remember I brought this up on another podcast. I remember towards the end of my tenure at Kate Spade where shit was really going haywire. Things were crazy, and it was crazy. And that was when I was traveling two and a half weeks out of every month, and I was just jet-lagged all the time. We were working until all hours of the night all the time. And I remember being, "Guys," looking at my Julie and my Caitlin looking at them and being like, "I don't think this is good for us," and I was looking to them. "I think we need to start. Maybe if you need to go do a workout class during the day, you should do that, or tell me," I don't know. But I wasn't leading by example at all, and I remember just having this inkling that, "I don't think this is sustainable. I think we're about to all fucking fall apart."
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
But that felt covert and rebellious for me to say.
Danielle Prescod:
It did. Yeah. You have to do it in secret. Yeah, I would take my team out in secret.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, totally.
Danielle Prescod:
So weird.
Johanna Almstead:
I remember, this is crazy. This is a little bit on the motherhood thing, but I remember when Laurel Pantin had her baby and she would post about having her nanny or her babysitter or whoever it was, bring the baby to outside her office building, so that she could go downstairs and nurse her baby, feed her child. And I remember thinking that that was scandalous, that she would acknowledge that she was doing it, number one, that she would do it at all. Number two, that she would even publicly say that she was doing it and that she wouldn't be flogged for it. What the fuck?
Danielle Prescod:
It's crazy. When I worked at Hearst, I knew at least three people that went into labor at the office because they were too afraid to take maternity leave because it's like they nickel and dime you down to the hour and minute based on your tenure, how long you had been there. So, they wanted the time after the baby had been born, so they would literally be holding contractions in a meeting, so they wouldn't have take off. And I'm like, "It's not funny. It's terrible." I have a friend whose water broke in the office. Can you imagine?
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. Mine broken at whole foods, so I can imagine.
Danielle Prescod:
That's insane.
Johanna Almstead:
So, when I was pregnant with Celia, I had broken ribs because she was breech and her head was stuck under my rib cage and broke my ribs. So, I was 9 million months pregnant, ginormous, and I had broken ribs and I couldn't sit because if I sat the way that the baby would go, it would dig into the broken ribs. And so, I had to lay down because I would either stand, I could stand because then she would settle, or I would have to lay down, and I didn't ever think to not come into the office. They brought me a couch. We used to call it the fainting couch. They brought me a couch to put next to my desk, and they gave me a laptop, which I had never had a work laptop for some reason. And I would lay on the couch with the laptop on my ginormous stomach and conduct meetings. What the fuck?
Danielle Prescod:
That's insane.
Johanna Almstead:
What the actual fuck? So, yeah, self-care.
Danielle Prescod:
Self-care.
Johanna Almstead:
No bueno.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. So, what is something you once believed about yourself that you've since outgrown?
Danielle Prescod:
I think I used to believe that sometimes, people would give me compliments about being good at something or doing something because I don't really feel bad for me. I was like, they can see that my self-esteem was so fragile that they're like, "Let me say this to her so she doesn't kill herself later."
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, God.
Danielle Prescod:
I didn't believe that I was really good at things, but now, I'm like, "Oh, I actually am good at a lot of things." And so, I feel like I had to outgrow that for sure.
Johanna Almstead:
Wow.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. [inaudible 01:08:05] good enough.
Johanna Almstead:
It's one thing to think that you weren't good at them. It's another thing to think that people knew you thought that you weren't good at them. That's a whole other level.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. Well, I also think that writing is tricky because it can really mess with you. You do have a natural voice in a natural way that you write, but that might not fit the brand voice of the place where you are trying to write, which is that why writing for magazines or publications is a little bit different than writing books. And so, you had to be able to capture a brand voice perfectly. And I would beat myself up if I couldn't get it on the first try or if I got a lot of edits or notes. And I remember when I first got my first assignment for Nylon and it was maybe three sentences and they wrote the whole thing over, and I was devastated. I was like, "Oh, my God, I can't believe this." But it's because I didn't really understand how to do the voice.
But now, of course, I can do that and I am able to have my own voice and mix them together. But it's just becoming a more fluent speaker in any language. But I think that would happen to me for a lot of other things. I used to just think that sometimes, if I was good at something that was unexpected, for example, I was very good at tennis growing up, but there wasn't a lot of black kids playing tennis. So, I was like, "Oh, people are just saying this to be condescending in a weird way." But I was like, "Oh, actually, I'm very good at tennis," or I'm a good writer. People would be like, "Oh, you're such a good writer," whatever. But I'd be like, they are only saying that because they think they have to because they don't see any other black writers. But I'm like, "No, I actually am a good writer. I know what I'm doing."
Johanna Almstead:
I'm glad that you know that now.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
That's good. That's a better way to live, I think.
Danielle Prescod:
It is. But I also think that sometimes, especially for women, I think especially for women of color, this forced humility is a virtue that people expect and want. So, if I am not humble about something and I am saying, "Oh, I'm good at this," or whatever, people are like, "Oh, you're so full of yourself." And you see it in women's sports all of the time.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
So, if someone who is very objectively talented at whatever it is they do accurately says, "This is what I'm good at. I know I'm the best." Everyone's like, "Oh, that's someone becoming, why should she say that?" So, I think that it was a lot of, it was internalized, but it was also a lot of external pressure, too.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. I feel like as I get older, I'm better at number one, knowing what I'm good at, also knowing it and saying it. And I'm also unabashedly proud of my children. I have two girls, and I just was thinking about this on the sideline the other day. There are parents who have kids who are really good and who just are very, don't talk about it. And then there's the really obnoxious people who are really intense and try to coach the coaches and all that stuff. And then I'm somewhere in between where I'm unabashedly vocal about how good my kids are because I want them to hear it and I want them to know it, and I didn't do it. It's not like I'm bragging. I'm bragging on behalf of them. And I'm like, "No, she is super athletic. She's so fast. This is it. This one's an extraordinary rider," whatever. And I am like it feels really good because it's definitely against everything that I was brought up to be like. It was just like, no, we were supposed to be demure and quiet and humble about our accomplishments.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
And now, I'm like, "No, fuck that shit. She's great."
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly. And we should say that. It's good.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Is there anything that you've said no to that you wish you had said yes to?
Danielle Prescod:
I don't think so, because actually I say yes to most things, so much so that I had to learn to say no. That was one of the things. So, I'm like, I barely say no.
Johanna Almstead:
Got it.
Danielle Prescod:
And if I do have to say no, I feel so guilty about it. And still, a few weeks ago I was like, "Oh, I can't really help this person or this person." I was telling my boyfriend and he was like, "You help so many people. You try so hard, you can just let this go." And I'm like, "I still feel sad about it."
Johanna Almstead:
I know. It's very hard for us to say no.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
It's very hard.
Danielle Prescod:
It's very hard. So, I say yes to most things.
Johanna Almstead:
Whether you like it or not.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. I could talk to you for a million years, but we're going to just go on to our lightning round of silly questions.
Danielle Prescod:
Okay.
Johanna Almstead:
They're really fun. Don't overthink them. A lot of them have to do with food because I just like food. What's your ultimate comfort food?
Danielle Prescod:
Mac and cheese.
Johanna Almstead:
You are not alone on this podcast. What did you want to be when you grew up when you were little, little?
Danielle Prescod:
I wanted to be a librarian because I thought the library was the most magical place in the world. They always knew everything.
Johanna Almstead:
It comes full circle.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
What is something you are really good at?
Danielle Prescod:
I'm good at so much. One thing I'm really good at is connecting people, knowing how people are going to mesh together. So, last year, I had a birthday lunch and everybody left at lunch being like, "You always bring the best people together. It's never boring conversation. It's always fun." And I'm like, "Yeah, I think I'm very good at that."
Johanna Almstead:
That's good.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
What is something you're really bad at?
Danielle Prescod:
Math.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God. It's a theme. I swear to God, you're like the fifth person who said that on this.
Danielle Prescod:
I wish that... See, that was one of those that I'm like, "I don't know if it was a self-fulfilling prophecy or if I was genuinely bad at math," but somewhere along the way.
Johanna Almstead:
You decided.
Danielle Prescod:
The girls decided we are not so good at math, and then it stuck.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah, I know. I feel that way about my kids, too.
Danielle Prescod:
I don't know if it's true because, so that was when I was in co-ed school, but then once I went to all girls school, I saw girls being great at math. I'm like, "Huh, I know it's possible. So, maybe not. Maybe that's a wrong thing."
Johanna Almstead:
Maybe I actually do suck at this.
Danielle Prescod:
But now, yeah, it's just true. And I get panicked when I have to do it, and then I'm like, "Ah,"
Johanna Almstead:
I'm really a words-
Danielle Prescod:
""I'm just going to get the calculator. Yeah. Now, I'm just going to get the calculator. Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
It's a very fine line with me and my kids because I want to tell them they can do anything. And if they just try hard, but then I'm like, I also really sucked at math and I felt really bad about it, and I don't want them to feel bad about it. So, it's like a fine line of being pushing them, but also being validating and saying, "Maybe you don't need math. There's calculators. You don't really need it."
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah. It's certainly true that I need less, but it's funny, when I wrote my fiction book, I needed to do a lot of math because I had four different characters on four different timelines. They all just come together at the beginning and at the end. And so, yeah, we had to do math to be like, "What would be 40 weeks from now?"
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, jeez. Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
If we are saying that this is 10 weeks and I have to subtract, I have to be like, "What's your age if he was born now?" It was very hard. There's a lot of it.
Johanna Almstead:
I never thought about that.
Danielle Prescod:
A lot.
Johanna Almstead:
Writers need math.
Danielle Prescod:
You need math. Not calculus, but math.
Johanna Almstead:
But math, okay. Favorite word?
Danielle Prescod:
I don't know if I have a favorite word.
Johanna Almstead:
It's like Sophie's choice. You have to decide.
Danielle Prescod:
I know.
Johanna Almstead:
Just today, it could just be your favorite word today. It doesn't have to be your favorite word of all time.
Danielle Prescod:
I think it probably changes probably every week. Gratitude, my favorite word this week.
Johanna Almstead:
I like that one.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
What's your least favorite word?
Danielle Prescod:
I don't know. There are definitely words. I'm like, "Why is the person using that like that?" I really hate when people misuse words.
Johanna Almstead:
I do, too.
Danielle Prescod:
That drives me crazy.
Johanna Almstead:
Can we talk about the misuse of the word aesthetic in the social media world?
Danielle Prescod:
You know what? Actually, my least fair word is narcissist because people misuse it so much. Narcissist and gaslighting. Oh, it drives me crazy. Not everything is narcissism and not everything is gaslighting. And yes, not everything is an aesthetic.
Johanna Almstead:
But they don't even say an aesthetic. They say aesthetic. They're like, "That is so aesthetic." I'm like, "That's not how you use the word."
Danielle Prescod:
No. And I recognize that language is fluid and it can change, but sometimes, things become a flavor of the week and then it just sticks. And then everyone thinks because they read three sentences on it, they know about it. And I'm like, "That's not what's going on."
Johanna Almstead:
That's not what's going on. Okay. Least favorite food? Deal breaker, like not ever crossing your lips, and you don't even have to be polite about declining it?
Danielle Prescod:
Beans, maybe.
Johanna Almstead:
All beans?
Danielle Prescod:
Like the canned beans.
Johanna Almstead:
Canned beans? Okay.
With like the red sauce. I hate those.
Oh, like baked beans?
Danielle Prescod:
Baked beans. Yeah, that's what they're called. I hate them.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh. My dad couldn't really cook, and I shouldn't say, chose not to cook. And if he ever was left with us, which was not very often to make us food, he would make us hot dogs and a can of baked beans.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, that was like a classic meal. Yeah, I hate it. No.
Johanna Almstead:
No. Okay. Best piece of advice you've ever received?
Danielle Prescod:
Take every meeting.
Johanna Almstead:
Good. Like that one?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
If your personality were a flavor, what would it be?
Danielle Prescod:
Probably something salty, maybe like nachos.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, I like it. Layers, complexity, all different textures.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. Okay, last supper. You're leaving this body and this earth tomorrow. What are you eating tonight?
Danielle Prescod:
Really good penne vodka and carrot cake.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, are you drinking anything?
Danielle Prescod:
I guess I could have some wine.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
I don't really drink that often, so, yeah. Why not, if I'm leaving Earth?
Johanna Almstead:
Okay, so wine, carrot cake, penne alla vodka.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay. And do you like anything in your penne alla vodka, like peas or prosciutto or chicken?
Danielle Prescod:
No.
Johanna Almstead:
No. Street.
Danielle Prescod:
I like it just noodles cheese.
Johanna Almstead:
Noodles cheese.
Danielle Prescod:
That's awesome.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
Got it. Have you ever had a moment in your life when you've had to eat your words?
Totally. Yeah, of course. Oh, my God. I accidentally told everybody maybe three years ago that the Taylor Swift fans were unionizing because I saw this thing that was satire and then it went viral.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God. And it wasn't true?
Danielle Prescod:
No.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, my God. That's hilarious.
Danielle Prescod:
It was bad. It was bad.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, geez.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
It was bad. They're not unionizing.
Johanna Almstead:
No.
Danielle Prescod:
That was like a joke.
Johanna Almstead:
No. Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
If you had to eat one food for the rest of your life every day, you don't have to worry about nutritional value, it'll sustain you. It's fine. What would you eat?
Danielle Prescod:
Bagels.
Johanna Almstead:
Bagels. Do you want anything on your bagels?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, of course. So, if I'm in New York, I get a cinnamon raisin bagel with walnut raisin cream cheese.
Johanna Almstead:
Oh, you double up on the raisins?
Danielle Prescod:
Double. I love raisins. It's so good. But then I also love an everything bagel with plain cream cheese or scallion cream cheese and lox.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay.
Danielle Prescod:
But today, I had a plain bagel with cheddar scallion cream cheese, so I love bagels. I'm from New York.
Johanna Almstead:
I know. I was thinking back to your, don't you talk about that in Token Black Girl, how you were eating a bagel and then someone told you that it was 97 slices of bread or something, and then you didn't eat a bagel for seven years?
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I know. And I love them.
Johanna Almstead:
And now, you're back.
Danielle Prescod:
I'm healed. I eat bagels all the time.
Johanna Almstead:
I was going to say that's like a full circle healing moment.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah. Okay. Where is your happy place?
Danielle Prescod:
The barn.
Johanna Almstead:
The barn.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Me, too.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
We didn't even get to talk about horses. Shit.
Danielle Prescod:
I know. Lot to do part two, just talk about horses.
Johanna Almstead:
We'll have to do a part two. What do you wear when you feel like you need to take on the world? Like big meeting, big date, big event, something, what do you wear?
Danielle Prescod:
I like bright colors and patterns, but lately, I've been wearing oversized pants.
Johanna Almstead:
I love the big pants.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I love a big pants.
Johanna Almstead:
Giant pants.
Danielle Prescod:
I feel like it changes based on what I have to do, but I love a big pant.
Johanna Almstead:
Big pant. Go-to coping mechanism on a bad day?
Danielle Prescod:
Going to bed, taking a bath, going to bed, I love sleeping.
Johanna Almstead:
Me, too.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Shut it down.
Danielle Prescod:
I'm like, yeah, exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
Shut it down.
Danielle Prescod:
Press off.
Johanna Almstead:
I always say it's like one of those, what are they called? It's not a switchboard, it's like a whatever where they like [inaudible 01:20:41].
Danielle Prescod:
Oh, yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
And everything shuts off.
Danielle Prescod:
Exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
That's what it is.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, love that.
Johanna Almstead:
What is one thing for sure right now, in this moment?
Danielle Prescod:
One thing I know for sure right now, I have great family and friends.
Johanna Almstead:
That's so good.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
That's a great way to live.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
Okay, so please tell people where they can find you. Where are you on social media, website, all the things.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, I have a Substack now. This is so fun.
Johanna Almstead:
Yes, you do. We didn't talk about that.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah.
Johanna Almstead:
So, what's the Substack? Tell everyone.
Danielle Prescod:
The Substack is called Highly Recommended, and it's about clothes, cannabis, and career. So, it's really fun and I'm having a good time with it because I don't know, it's very freeing. I get to write about whatever I want.
Johanna Almstead:
Totally.
Danielle Prescod:
Every day.
Johanna Almstead:
I love that.
Danielle Prescod:
And that's like my newest project while I'm working on these books, it's like how I'm balancing my brain a little bit because you can get lost in a fictional world.
Johanna Almstead:
Yeah.
Danielle Prescod:
I don't know how people do it with the Dragon books and all that kind of stuff. I really don't. All my books are grounded in this world in reality, but it's still very myopic when you're talking about three or four characters and that's it. So, you don't really see anything else. Anyway, so Substack, it's called Highly Recommended, and then I am on Instagram and TikTok sometimes at Danielle Prescod.
Johanna Almstead:
And everyone needs to go out and buy Token Black Girl and The Rules of Fortune because we need to support working artists...
Danielle Prescod:
Yes, exactly.
Johanna Almstead:
... Because she's an artist and this is how she makes her living. Thank you, thank you, thank you for taking so much time...
Danielle Prescod:
Of course.
Johanna Almstead:
... To indulge my questions and to share your story. I know that it will inspire people and hopefully provoke some people to do something good. So, thank you, thank you, thank you so much for being here.
Danielle Prescod:
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Johanna Almstead:
Well, that was amazing. I just thought of 14 more things that I didn't have a chance to ask her about. I feel like I could have talked to her forever, but I hope you all enjoyed it. I hope you learned something. Go out and buy her books. Thank you, thank you, thank you for tuning in. As always, I am eternally grateful to all of you for your support and for listening. Please, if you haven't done so already, subscribe to the podcast, share it, like it, follow us on social media. We're on TikTok and Instagram at Eat My Words The Podcast. Tell us what's going on, get in the comments. I'm in the comments personally answering people, so please tell us what you want us to talk about. I've gotten lots of good ideas for new guests, which is so exciting. And as always, thank you so much. Catch you on the next one. This Eat My Words podcast has been created and directed by me, Johanna Almstead. Our producer is Sophy Drouin, our audio editor is Isabelle Robertson, and our brand manager is Mila Buschna. Thank you.