Beyond The Job Title | Underrepresented Career Stories

Episode Summary

Conversation with Maria Joyner about her entrepreneurial journey, stepping outside your comfort zone, questioning things, moving to Costa Rica, and taking leaps of faith towards the life you want

  • (00:00) - Intro | Don’t ask if it’s a good idea - just do it
  • (04:14) - Entrepreneurial DNA
  • (07:05) - Questioning Conventions
  • (11:01) - Starting a Photography Business
  • (15:24) - Following Mom’s Footsteps
  • (16:33) - Costa Rican Awakening
  • (18:24) - Rancho Margot Reflections
  • (25:25) - Don’t Ask - Just Do It
  • (28:37) - First Year Wisdom | Maria Joyner's Insights from Life in Costa Rica
  • (36:54) - Practicing Stepping Outside Your Comfort Zone
  • (37:54) - Using Travel As a Vehicle for Change
  • (43:30) - The Most Important Lesson From Practicing Ultra-running
  • (44:32) - Key to Spark Change | Identify The Things You Don’t Want And The Ones That Make You Feel Fulfilled
  • (46:46) - Outro

Maria’s Bio

Maria Joyner is an entrepreneur and marketing technologist with a background in email deliverability, marketing automation, and scaling B2B startups. As the Marketing Automation Practice Lead, she brings years of Hubspot and marketing automation experience to help founders get the most out of their marketing technology stack.

In early 2016, Maria relocated from Atlanta, GA, to Costa Rica in pursuit of a more balanced lifestyle and to embark on a permaculture project. Her journey led her through various regions, including San Carlos, Lake Arenal, and presently Playa Grande in Guanacaste. Maria actively participates in and hosts educational experiences to assist others in making substantial life changes. During her leisure time, she engages in ultramarathon running, photography, mentorship of tech startups, extensive travel, and writing endeavors.

Referenced
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🎙About The Podcast

Join Cesar Romero, as he shares the stories of trailblazing underrepresented SaaS founders, executives, and professionals who have broken barriers and achieved remarkable milestones. Whether you seek inspiration, mentorship, or actionable strategies to advance your career, our podcast is your go-to resource.

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Where to find Cesar

Creators & Guests

Host
Cesar Romero
Helping startups and SMBs build strong customer relationships that drive product adoption, reduce churn, and increase revenue | Community-Driven | Podcast Host
Guest
Maria Joyner
Marketing Technologist | Hubspot Specialist | Growth Strategist | Marketing Automation Expert | B2B Demand Gen | 4X Founder

What is Beyond The Job Title | Underrepresented Career Stories?

The lack of diversity in tech can lead to imposter syndrome, bias, and a sense of isolation that hinders your growth and ambition.

Welcome to 'Beyond The Job Title Podcast,' where we shine a spotlight on the journeys of underrepresented tech professionals and allies within the SaaS industry.

Join us as we delve into the personal development and career insights that have fueled their success.

Discover the stories of trailblazing underrepresented SaaS founders, executives, and professionals who have broken barriers and achieved remarkable milestones.

Whether you're seeking inspiration, mentorship, or actionable strategies to advance your career, our podcast is your go-to resource.

Tune in to gain valuable insights, build your network, and navigate your tech career journey with confidence.

Subscribe now and take the next step toward your own success in the world of tech.

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Maria Joyner | BJT19 - Main
[00:00:00] Maria: the question that never came out of my mouth, not once to anybody, not even the closest person to me at the time, was, What do you think about me moving to America? I didn't ask one person what they thought, I didn't ask one person if they thought it was a good idea, I didn't even ask anybody for advice.
[00:00:18] Maria: this was a decision that I knew was so crazy. Like, Insane. I'm leaving a really, really good paying job with a really fast growing company that I've helped build. I have stock and warranty. We have a, we have a, an investment arm that we're building. We've already invested in two companies. Like nobody in their right mind would have told me to move.
[00:00:37] Maria: And so the question I never asked was what do you think? Um, and i'm not saying people shouldn't ask for advice But usually asking for advice is just opening the door for someone just to you know, tell them why everything isn't gonna work
[00:00:47] Cesar: Hey friends. Welcome to another episode of beyond the job title podcast. Andre host since never marrow. And this is the podcast where we [00:01:00] share the journeys of successful under represented tech, founders, executives, and professionals. And we dive into their personal development journeys in career insights. They have field techs. Success. So whether you're seeking inspiration, mentorship, or actionable strategies to advance your career, this is your. Go-to resource podcast. My guest for this episode is my good old friend, Maria joiner. And this is a conversation about her entrepreneurial journey stepping outside of her comfort zone. Questioning things. Move in her entire life to Costa Rica in the PR. In the pursuit of a more balance lifestyle. Taking leaps of faith towards the life you want. And just overall a podcast about what it takes to. Create change [00:02:00] and personal transformation in your life. So. I really enjoyed. This conversation with Maria and just a little bit, a little bit about disclaimer. We recorded this episode back in November of 2022. But for personal reasons, I ended up not going forward with that podcast project. So I put this on a shelf for a couple of months and then in may. I decided to fully commit to the podcast. Uh, And I remember, Hey, I have this great conversation with Maria and. I want to publish it. So I reached out to her. And she gave me the okay. And I finally got to it and man, uh, Just going through it. I feel. Inspired. Uh, question things and stepping outside my comfort zone. Um, so. I hope that, uh, if you, if you listen to this episode after your, after years into the episode, You feel inspired to seek your own. [00:03:00] Personal transformation wherever you are in your life. Uh, and please, before I forget, Uh, if you find value from this episode, if you enjoyed this episode and you want to support the podcast, please make sure to subscribe so that you don't miss out on any future episodes. Um, And that's it. Thanks so much for tuning in, and here's my conversation with Maria joiner.
[00:03:25] Cesar: Maria, welcome to the Art of Transformation podcast. It's, uh, it's a pleasure to have you, uh, old friend. Uh, and, uh, yeah, I'm, I'm excited for us to dive deeper into your own journey of personal transformation. And, uh, yeah, hoping that we can inspire other people to look for their own transformation as well.
[00:03:43] Cesar: So, uh, yeah, thanks so much for, for joining, um, the
[00:03:45] Maria: podcast. Thanks. Thanks for having me, Cesar. Super happy to be
[00:03:49] Cesar: here today. Absolutely. And before we dive into, um, into it, uh, for people are not familiar with your background. Let's, let's set the context, um, on your background in [00:04:00] your career. And I always like to ask my guests, you know, how did you get into, uh, marketing technology and being an entrepreneur?
[00:04:07] Cesar: You know, what, what were some of the. Like some of the science or some of the key decisions that that led you to to pursue that as a career.
[00:04:14] Maria: So The entrepreneur journey definitely started as a young child Both of my parents had businesses or my father had had his own business essentially from the time I was born Um, and then my mom worked in a marketing agency Um, and eventually went out on her own and had her own agency as well. So seeing um Seeing both sides of entrepreneurship from my parents, the good, which is, Hey, we want to stay an extra day on vacation and we can, because we own our companies and the bad literally walking out the door on vacation and my dad getting a call, he was electrical.
[00:04:51] Maria: He was an electrician. Getting a, getting a service call and our vacation being having to be postponed two days. Um, so I saw like the flexibility of it and then [00:05:00] also some of the downsides and challenges of it. But from a young age, I really didn't know anything else. And so that was the first piece of the entrepreneur journey.
[00:05:13] Maria: Um, And, you know, as I got older, this whole concept of working for a set amount of money that you really can't change and doing that for many years just to make a little bit more money the next year and just that whole concept of a career path, it just didn't really feel right to me. Um, so I think that from, like, a young age, I was already maybe primed, uh, to be an entrepreneur, and I just.
[00:05:36] Maria: From a young age, also really question the, you know, the traditional path that we're taught.
[00:05:42] Cesar: What do you think, uh, yeah, what, what made you question that? Um, it's typically, right, we, we, um, I, I grew up with, with parents who are also entrepreneurs, you know, but my path is a little different because they, for some reason, they didn't want me to be an entrepreneur.
[00:05:52] Cesar: So they were like, you know. Oh, you go to college, right? You get a job. Um, I'm just curious, uh, if there was something innate in [00:06:00] you or if you picked up, uh, signs along the way, um, you know, as you Move throughout your education, you know, college.
[00:06:08] Maria: So I think my, the first memory that comes to mind is when I was, when I was a child, I don't know, seven, eight years old, my dad used to pay me to organize, um, uh, like parts for electrical panels, um, in his, in his shop.
[00:06:20] Maria: Um, and so I would have to take these parts. And for every part I took that was in a big pile and organized it, I got something like 10 cents of parts. And I was like, this blows. I'm like, I don't, this blows. Like, I don't want to be the person doing this. I want to be the person, I want to be my dad who's telling me to do this.
[00:06:36] Maria: Um, so I think that was one of the first memories I had to come to. Like, I don't want to work for somebody and do this boring job or this like poor pay. He wasn't exploiting child labor. He was trying to teach me obviously how to, how to be a good employee, but I think,
[00:06:49] Cesar: so I remember
[00:06:51] Maria: that and then, you know, I was, my parents definitely fed me the, this is the path you have to get [00:07:00] straight A's not straight A's, but straight one hundreds, all these extra extracurricular activities.
[00:07:05] Maria: So you can get into a good college and get a scholarship. And then after you get into a good college, you're going to get a good job. You know, so I definitely was, I mean, not to my parents, but that's what we're fed. So I definitely bought into that. And then sometime in my teenage years, um, I became a, I became a pump rocker.
[00:07:22] Maria: Um, and it wasn't really that, that, that was the change, but it's just, it was the act of starting to question everything I had been told by society. And the punk movement is, you know, question everything to, uh, extreme degrees, um, you know, and all the way to anarchy. And I definitely didn't go that far in my beliefs, but just being exposed to the ability to question things was really pivotal to me.
[00:07:46] Maria: And I really started to realize this isn't the only path, you know, I was probably 14 years old. I was like, this isn't the only path that I've been presented. And, um, so that was another pivotal thing, just. Questioning everything that I have been taught.[00:08:00] And, um, I got that. Yeah, you know, it's it's kind of it's kind of it's kind of funny to think back, but that really that really influenced my thinking a lot.
[00:08:02] Maria: And then the 3rd thing was. I was an academic, you know, I got I got straight 100s. And I always thought that was the path I was going to go down. And somewhere later in high school, I started to realize that in academia, it's really a discipline of teaching people what is right and wrong. What is a And what's not a fact.
[00:08:24] Maria: And I started really to question that because, you know, whoever writes the history books, writes the history, like what I think is a fact you might not think is a fact. And so I started questioning that. And I just, I just kind of was like, Why would I even go down that route? And so I went to another extreme and decided to apply to go to art college, um, instead of going down the academic route.
[00:08:47] Maria: And our college was definitely sort of the final nail in the coffin for, um, anything that would have been a semblance of a normal, you know, go to college and build a career of that. Um, because in art [00:09:00] school. They teach like, and if you go study in discipline, if you go to, if you go study how to be a surgeon, they teach you exactly how to do the brain surgery.
[00:09:09] Maria: Right. You know, they're not like, Hey, go figure this out. You know exactly what you're doing. There's a lot of precision there. Yeah. You have to. Much more difficult career path and so much more time and energy goes into that. Um, so this may not be the best example, but surgeon, you go to art school and Teach you or try to teach you empower you to make something out of nothing It's really hard to have a completely blank slate and decide where to put that first line Or how to or not even have a piece of paper have a material like a like clay or wax And how to make something out of nothing and so I think that in a lot of ways um My desire to go to follow the art school path was much more aligned with making something out of nothing and learning how to do that in a way that wasn't comfortable to me.
[00:09:56] Maria: Like I wasn't, I'm not naturally talented as a painter. I can't draw very [00:10:00] well. I studied photography and sculpture and sculpture was really more of that making something out of nothing that I was intrigued about. Um, but yeah, that's, that's sort of the, the, the different things that kind of led me to where I am today.
[00:10:11] Maria: I
[00:10:11] Cesar: love it. I love that from a young age, you're you question everything. And I think that's probably one of the most important skill sets that we can teach our kids as they venture, because you have a, you have a young son, I have a young daughter, and the world that they're going to live in. You know, when they're, I don't know, 15, 18, man, it's going to be so different, you know, especially with the disruption of AI, uh, and everything that's coming, um, their ability to question things, right?
[00:10:40] Cesar: And to use their creativity to make something out of nothing. I think it's going to be crucial. Um, and we'll, and we'll touch on parenting a little bit. Um, One last question I have on your, on your background, uh, did you ever get to a point where you, where you question, um, either pursuing the path of, you know, marketing technology or, or, or entrepreneurship?
[00:10:55] Cesar: Um, did you ever come across a point where you're like, you know, I've done this and maybe I should try something else. [00:11:00] Maybe I should pivot. Just curious.
[00:11:01] Maria: So I went to art school, um, while I was still in college, I started a photography business, um, because you know, I didn't want to be one of those people who got an art degree and didn't do art.
[00:11:10] Maria: I was very like, that's definitely my path. Like I'm going to be, I'm going to honor this and started photography business and then started taking shoots to figure out what I wanted to photograph. And I really enjoyed. There was a lot of it that I really enjoyed. Um, you know, I did family shoots, maternity, newborn, a lot of portrait headshot work, um, and then I did other things like events and weddings and things that I didn't enjoy so much.
[00:11:36] Maria: Um, and, and through the journey of the having photography business, things became really crystal, a couple of things became really crystal clear. In this business, the way that I was running it, I was literally going to be trading my time for money. So there will be no way for me to scale up or grow without me having to be fully involved.
[00:11:57] Maria: Which is okay. I mean, plenty [00:12:00] of times in my career, and I still, I still probably would, I still probably would drive this, you know, you're not scalable thing home, but that's okay, but that wasn't the only thing that was the first thing. The second thing was I was doing something that I really, truly loved for money and running a business.
[00:12:18] Maria: A lot like that was involved with something I truly love was starting to affect the love I had for the art of photography. Like I would, I was at the point where I would see my camera and I was just like, so that was another piece. So that, and plenty, there are lots of artists who can do that and do that well.
[00:12:37] Maria: And I have so much admiration, but as a young entrepreneur and a young artist, it was just, it was not, it wasn't aligned for me. The third piece was, um,
[00:12:45] Maria: what's it? I was, the third piece was I took a shoot. I never should have taken and, um, and I essentially, and what I learned from that and I didn't, I was too young to know how to scope it right, but essentially it was a shoot for, it was a corporate shoot, um, for, um, a company that the [00:13:00] majority of the organization are women between the ages of probably.
[00:13:04] Maria: 40 to 65. And it was do headshots for them. And so I scoped it. I gave them a good deal since it was a lot of people. It's going to be a green screen. So people coming in a couple of shots and done. Well, what I didn't anticipate and what, what was newer when I was in college was the expectation that we all look airbrushed and perfect.
[00:13:26] Maria: So I scoped this deal or I scoped this project where I did headshots and I did it for a low rate because it was a corporate thing. And then I put in no specifications around, um, editing, you know, like I didn't put in specifications that I would remove all your wrinkles and, you know, change the color of your shirt and then put any post processing contract.
[00:13:44] Maria: And that was a painful lesson. Um, because, because I left it out, it came up with every single woman I photographed, because I mean, at that age, you know, like we've become a lot more aware of, you know, how we look and it was just an awful, awful, [00:14:00] awful project. I got through it. And that's when the whole like realization of where the photography industry was going.
[00:14:08] Maria: And this was. Late two thousands, like where the photography industry was going was much more towards these post processing airbrush, just what we have now. And this was more than 10 years ago. Um, yeah, probably about 10, 15 years ago. And we've seen over the past several years, how that has changed. And now the movement now is, is, you know, trying to not be so airbrushed and, you know, be a little more representative, um, but that was kind of the final thing for me with photography.
[00:14:37] Maria: So I loved it. Like I really love what I did. And the big challenge I had was I couldn't say no. So people, friends, colleagues knew my work. They'd be like, I want to do photo shoots. And I just, I couldn't say no to it. I'm like, like, what am I going to say no to? So to actually close my company, I had to sell my camera.
[00:14:56] Maria: And then I was able to not just close my company, but stop accepting [00:15:00] contracts because then I'd be like, well, I don't have a camera, but if you would like to rent me one and along with the shoot, then I'd be happy to do that. And that limit led eliminated, I would say 95 percent of the people. And then the 5 percent who were willing to do that, you know, I did accommodate, um, but in that photography journey, that was a long story, but in that journey, you know, after all those realizations, social media had just emerged on the scene.
[00:15:24] Maria: Um, and I was like, huh, that looks interesting. And I decided just to learn, just to dive in, learn it. And so I opened a social media marketing company in the late two thousands. And, um, that was my next market. That was my shift, my first shift into marketing, which I never swore I'd be in because I saw my mom run a marketing, like in a marketing agency and all the stress, but that was the first step in a marketing.
[00:15:48] Maria: Was in a social media and then from social that social media, I got really involved in the Atlanta technology startup community. Um, and from there I started mentoring startups, you know, joined one for a [00:16:00] couple of years, had a big, you know, big growth spurt and, or big growth, um, lots of growth. Um, and then, and then made a decision in 2015 to move to Costa Rica, which is where I live now.
[00:16:08] Cesar: Let's, let's, let's pause there. 'cause you mentioned something that you, growing up you saw your mom with the marketing agency and you saw the stress and you swore that, uh, you wouldn't do that to yourself. Um, now on your one of, or your more recent, your one of your recent LinkedIn posts, you shared that what prompted you to move to Costa Rica was that you felt that you were out of balance.
[00:16:33] Cesar: Um, and you and I met, I believe if, if I have my memory correctly, uh, November, 2015,
[00:16:41] Maria: 14. It was the trip, uh, it was a trip that prompted the, or started the seed planted the seed
[00:16:48] Cesar: seed. Right. So what, let's, let's talk about the, the, the Maria before the move, right? What, what was happening in your life that, uh, You started to notice signs that your life was out of balance, right?[00:17:00]
[00:17:00] Cesar: And then what, what prompted you to say, Hey, I'm going to go to Costa Rica and just to go on a trip, right? Let's, let's, let's, let's dive into that.
[00:17:08] Maria: So I think looking back now, I could say that my life was out of balance, but at that time I thought. I had, I mean, I, in my mind, had built my dream life. Like, when I traveled, when you and I met in November 2014, um, I was working at a, it was, I was, it was my only salaried position in my whole career.
[00:17:27] Maria: Um, it was, I was working with a technology startup, an email deliverability startup, um, and We had, you know, I was, I helped found the, I helped, you know, found and grow the company. Then I finally joined it as a VP of marketing and their growth hacker. And we were, we had had an amazing year. We had hired, um, a whole team of people.
[00:17:44] Maria: We, I think we were in the process of like renovating and building out just a super amazing office for recruiting, great culture. You know, very startup culture, ping pong, you know, and beer stocked in the fridge. And, um, I really enjoyed it and I was able to do things that I enjoyed every day where lots [00:18:00] of hats, you know, I was able to work with the engineers and those were able to work product and that's what drove the marketing.
[00:18:07] Maria: So it was really great to be embedded in that. Um, a friend of mine that had started that she started, she started working for me as an intern at my previous marketing company. Which was like, it was Aqua hired. So we, so we came to join the startup. She came over to the startup with me. And so it was just this beautiful thing.
[00:18:24] Maria: And I was like, wow, this is amazing. And, um, and so that's, I was like, so that's kind of, that's how I felt in that mindset. So I get to Costa Rica in November, 2014. Be a cool trip. And we came to this place called Rancho Margo, and it's this self sustainable, permaculture farm, essentially in the middle of the jungle, at, you know, totally off the grid.
[00:18:45] Maria: No cell service, you know, internet, solar power, so, you know, not great internet. And I got off the shuttle there, And I got, I had this feeling and it's going to sound a little crazy to explain, but I had this feeling that like, I look around and I just felt like my soul [00:19:00] shake, like, I felt like I'd come home, but like a home that I'd never known, it was just this, I was just like, what is going on?
[00:19:07] Maria: And that's just stepping off the shuttle. Right. Around like. I just, I was just, it was just this feeling and I never felt like that ever before in my life, ever. And I was like, what was that? And so over the next five days, um, that feeling definitely didn't go away. Um, and I just, I think what, I think I noticed that feeling, but I wasn't able to know what that was, but in my brain, the thing that started to really make me curious about, you know, Costa Rica and then coming back to this place in particular is just how everything worked.
[00:19:37] Maria: Like This farm where they host, they host guests and they have to scale up their water, how they heat the hot water and the food production. And like, if they, if they raise the meat on site that they give to the guests, like, how do you even do that? Like, how do you even start an operation like this? So I had all these questions.
[00:19:59] Maria: And so I think of my thinking, my thinking brain, my [00:20:00] thinking brain was like, I want to come back to explore all these questions and to like, look under the hood and see what's. But I think that thinking brain was being heavily influenced by this other feeling I had, but I didn't know how to identify that feeling I had.
[00:20:13] Maria: So I relied on, you know, the, this is the, this is why I want to come back. So if you remember, um, I don't know if you did, but on the last day of that trip, we did rosebud thorn, which is like my rose of the day, the best thing, the thorn, which is kind of what, you know, suck that day and the bud. Coming up.
[00:20:30] Maria: Yeah, I knew on that trip if I didn't have the conversations and commit before I left Costa Rican soil to come back that it wasn't going to happen ever like a super, super strong feeling that I have, no matter what it takes to figure out how to come back here. And so I told, I talked to the farm that we were staying at and they, they do a volunteer work away program and I got all the details and you know, the timeline and they were like, yeah, sure.
[00:20:58] Maria: Apply in February. [00:21:00] You want to come in this month and yeah, go for it. And so I put that out there. It's the whole group that I was going to go back to Costa Rica. Um, the next year, I swear, like, even when I was saying it, I was like, man, no one in this room believes it, but I'm like, I know what's going to happen.
[00:21:14] Maria: And. We did. And
[00:21:16] Cesar: you did. Came back. And you went back and you did that program for a couple months, right? Yeah. And then after that, you moved permanently in January 2016. Right. And so what, what, what was it about that experience of doing that program, that volunteer program? What was it about the program or the experience that solidified your decision?
[00:21:38] Cesar: You know what, I'm just going to move to Costa Rica.
[00:21:40] Maria: So I would say it was the amount of time that I took to process the fact that I wasn't losing my mind and I wasn't totally crazy is really what it gave me. I'm going to give you more specific examples, but really I came down here for supposedly a month, right?
[00:21:58] Maria: That was the deal was a month [00:22:00] We actually made a company wide perk that anybody in the company could work anywhere in the world They wanted for the month of june 2015 um Yeah, and so I was like, I mean I influenced this obviously i was super excited and so After even when I got there, I was in the, I was in the volunteer, um, like the onboarding and she's like, how long are you staying?
[00:22:21] Maria: And I was like, two months. And I was, I said, two months. And I'm like, I am like, that's what I said. And I was like, let's go with it. And I just, it was just this, I, I didn't even, I was only planning for a month. So I was down there the first month. And even in the first like week of being there, I just. Like, I'm like, this place is amazing.
[00:22:39] Maria: Like, I can't ever imagine a life like this. Like, I would love this to be my everyday life. And then over time, you know, I was there three months in total. Um, and ended up, I mean, the last month I had to come back because a few things happened, um, like financially. So I like had to get back, but. I end up saying three months.
[00:22:56] Maria: And I think the first month it was really like, this [00:23:00] is cool. But then as I really got into the day to day, that's when the change started occurring. Like if I had a question for somebody. I couldn't text them or pick up the phone and call them. Like I would have to go find them somewhere on the farm and be like, Hey, have you seen so and so Oh, blah, blah, blah.
[00:23:15] Maria: And walking around to find people and ask them questions. And I was just like, this is awesome. Like, this is so great. I mean, I can find, I could, I could talk about how that can be annoying too, but I just got more and more. I just felt more and more in love with this whole idea of coexisting with nature and live in a place where, like, we're building natural systems that work with, that work.
[00:23:38] Maria: Like with nature and I just became infatuated with this idea so much to where, like when I left Costa Rica to go back to the States, um, I was like, I want to, I want to, you know, I'm like, I want to build, I want to do my own project, you know, like I, this is what I want to do. This is like the, if you want to look marketing technology to permaculture, I'm like, this is what I want to do.
[00:23:59] Maria: Um, so I think that [00:24:00] whole entire experience and we had, there was just. magical experiences during the whole entire visit. And when I say magical, I mean, things like in June, it rained for 22, like 22 days straight. Um, and when it rained that much, everything was run by hydro electric power while the hydro electric generator got overrun and they had to rewire the entire ranch in three days before a group of like 70 people came.
[00:24:26] Maria: Or maybe it was like 50 people during those downpour. And so when I say magical, I don't necessarily mean, you know, like fun, magical, but just a magical in a way to see everybody come together to accomplish a single goal, like working at night, this pouring down rain to get a new generator set up to accommodate these guests and.
[00:24:45] Maria: So I definitely realized this wasn't going to be easy. You know, that's one of the things I knew with moving to Costa Rica wasn't going to be easy. But it was just incredible to see what goes into making, like, even, it's not even a village, even a really tiny community [00:25:00] function on all elements.
[00:25:01] Cesar: Mm hmm.
[00:25:01] Cesar: What, what, what were some of the conversations that, that you had, um, you know, with your family? About your decision. Um, would you ever like a scare of, you know, people not agreeing with your decision or having them put their fear onto onto you, you know, whatever concerns that they might have risen because of your decision.
[00:25:25] Maria: So, the conversations I had, I can tell you the conversations I didn't have, and that may be easier. So. The conversation I never had, the question that never came out of my mouth, not once to anybody, not even the closest person to me at the time, was, What do you think about me moving to America? I didn't ask one person what they thought, I didn't ask one person if they thought it was a good idea, I didn't even ask anybody for advice.
[00:25:49] Maria: I, this was a decision that I knew was so crazy. Like, Insane. I'm leaving a really, really good paying job with a really fast growing company that I've helped build. I [00:26:00] have stock and warranty. We have a, we have a, an investment arm that we're building. We've already invested in two companies. Like nobody in their right mind would have told me to move.
[00:26:09] Maria: And so the question I never asked was what do you think? Um, and i'm not saying people shouldn't ask for advice But usually asking for advice is just opening the door for someone just to you know, tell them why everything isn't gonna work Yeah, i'm gonna have no space for that with where I was I had no, I had no space for that.
[00:26:23] Maria: You know, I had enough, I had to hold space for other things. So that's the, I never had those conversations. Um, I mean, both my, I had a long term boyfriend at the time. He ended up not liking Costa Rica. So that ended, um, you know, and he, he, he moved with me, but left, but he came to visit and he was like, I'm never effing living in a country like this.
[00:26:40] Maria: And I was like, okay, well, I am still moved with me, but that's, that was. Probably the closest person to me when I told my parents, she might as well think that I was moving to like a war zone. Like my dad was just like, what? And they, I mean, I imagine that my parents were probably like, is she on drugs? Or is she like down [00:27:00] there doing some crazy stuff?
[00:27:01] Maria: Like what is going on? Like, how does, cause it just seemed so out of nowhere because I was like, things were good. Like things were, you know, great. It just seemed like out of nowhere. And so. But I knew I was, I had to be so firm in my decision that I knew that this was the right thing for me, no matter how crazy it seemed.
[00:27:21] Maria: Like I had a knowing that kept, that just allowed me to stay focused on that. Um,
[00:27:28] Cesar: I love that. So you, you knew deep in your soul that this was the right decision. And, and I can see how asking, you know, your family members, your friends, uh, your partner at the time, I can see how they can open up the door for them to plant out, you know, not, not because they want to, but maybe because they're creating their own fears onto your decision.
[00:27:46] Cesar: Right. So I can see how asking that question, Hey, what do you think about, you know, moving to Costa Rica? And I can see how they can, you know, yeah. Put doubts in your mind. So the fact that you were like, no, I'm not going to ask a question. I'm just going to tell people [00:28:00] I'm just going to do it. And I think, I think a lot of us are missing that conviction these days, you know, having a conviction of, hey, this is what I believe this is what I'm going to try out.
[00:28:12] Cesar: If it works, great. If it doesn't, then at least I tried it. But the worst thing you can do probably is when you get to 80, 90. And you look back and you say, man, I should have done that when I had the chance, right? That's probably one of the, one of the worst regrets you can have as a, as a human. Um, so the fact that you, that takes a lot of courage, Maria.
[00:28:37] Cesar: So you should definitely, definitely be proud of that. Um, so now, right, so now how was the first year, 2016, that, that full year, you know, what was, I guess, the most unexpected thing and then, and, and the biggest lesson for you?
[00:28:50] Maria: Oh, that was a year. Um,
[00:28:53] Maria: the move to Costa Rica. Um, we, we left in early January. We flew Southwest to kind of tell you a little story about this. So we use Southwest because Southwest allows to free [00:29:00] check bags. And we also both of my animals registered service animals. So we also we're going to fly with them. So we needed all the check bags we could get.
[00:29:08] Maria: Plus we wanted to pay to check more bags. So our plan was to fly Southwest, which from Atlanta always has a layover. So it was going to be Southwest, um, from Atlanta to Baltimore and then Baltimore to Costa Rica. Everything was set up. I actually paid a friend of mine to fly with us so she could check more bags for us.
[00:29:26] Maria: So I was like, Hey, I'll pay. They can come to Costa Rica. The only, there's two requirements. You pay for your return flight and you only bring a carry on. You can't, it's like, that's it. So there's the two requirements and she agreed to that. So everything was set. And like, I think it was maybe, I think we were planning on leaving on a Saturday and I think it was a.
[00:29:47] Maria: Maybe it was a Tuesday or Wednesday before. So like four days before and somebody messaged me something about, Hey, did you see the blizzard that's going to hit Baltimore? And I was like, what? And so we're getting ready to leave the [00:30:00] country, like leave the Homer and we sold our cars, like, and I'm like.
[00:30:03] Maria: What do you mean the blizzard is going to hit Baltimore? And so I started doing some research and I'm like, Oh my gosh, Baltimore is probably going to be shut down. So I'm like, nothing, there is nothing. We are, we are the 90, like the last 10 percent is always the, the, the, it's always the hardest. You get 90 percent here in the last 10%.
[00:30:20] Maria: And I'm like, there is nothing in this world that is stopping me from landing. And on Costa Rica, I'm like, there is nothing. So I had to tell you what we did. Um, I called the girl, the, my friend who flew down with me and I'm like, look, there's been a change of plans. We're going to fly it up Houston instead of Baltimore.
[00:30:37] Maria: So you have an option. You can ride with us the 12 hours from Atlanta to Houston. All of our crap in the car and our animals and then take the flight or I'll pay for you to fly to Houston. And she was so like taken aback by the whole change of situation. She told me, she's like, I don't know if I can do this.
[00:30:55] Maria: I was like, Oh my gosh, like last 10%. [00:31:00] So We got there, we went to the car in the morning. So we had to drive 11 hours to Houston. We, we checked into a hotel, didn't have a lot of budget for any of this. So we were saying at a really, like we were saying at the like motel eight, I think, really, um, not, not nice hotel.
[00:31:14] Maria: Um, and then we go to pick up the car that morning and I go to pay and I realized it was my wallet at home. Oh God. All these things happen. We got to, we got to Houston. We got on the flight, no problem. We landed in Costa Rica. We rented a car. I drove from, uh, where did we fly? We flew to, uh, I drove from, I think, I think we flew to Liberia.
[00:31:38] Maria: Anyway, I drove from Liberia to San Carlos and we were there. And we got there. Um, so even just getting here was a thing. Um, but it really, like, I just really think it and exercise the importance of I mean, that last 10 percent you just got to you just have to make it happen because everything's going to be happening that there's going to be there's going to be things.
[00:31:59] Maria: And [00:32:00] that was probably pretty good Um,
[00:32:01] Maria: So the first year we moved down here, before I moved here, I had already had a landshake, a handshake deal done for land that I was going to buy to start my own permaculture project. I had recruited two of the people that I worked with at Rancho Margot to come join me on this project and work for me.
[00:32:17] Maria: Wow. And so I felt like I had everything like set, set, ready to go. Yeah. Um, and so those people helped me make sure that I had a place to live when I moved here, that we had internet set up because my Spanish was not great, um, at the time. And I mean, I knew enough, but I couldn't get on the phone and have a conversation.
[00:32:36] Maria: Like for me, the, the litmus test for me when I first got to Costa Rica is, can I have a conversation on the phone? If not, then I'm still not there yet. So help me do all these things. So we lived in almost a community setting like a communal living situation for the first lovely 10 months. So we have myself, my boyfriend, my two dogs, one of our team members, his girlfriend, and then the dog she, um, got [00:33:00] a bit somewhere at that in that, you know, that time frame, um, the other team member, and then occasional people who come over to help cook or do other things.
[00:33:09] Maria: Um, so It was a small house with a lot of people and a very small space, one bathroom. And so that cause that was really difficult. There were a lot of issues with that. Um, so that was, that was something I probably would never do again. Um, we learned a lot from that. Um, it was cool. It was a fun experiment.
[00:33:25] Maria: Um, we did cook. We did grow most of everything we ate. Um, chickens, you know, we had eggs and also chickens for meat. And so we were really true to that principle of growing what we ate and, you know, reusing and recycling and a lot of permaculture principles that taught really discuss, you know, how you plant your garden, how you design your space.
[00:33:42] Maria: So we actively implemented these, these, these principles. Um, and that was really amazing. Um, When we look at like, the biggest lesson learned, I would say if you, I mean, I would say if I had to boil it down to one lesson learned, Is never buy land rights when you move to a [00:34:00] place without really living there.
[00:34:02] Maria: So I got lucky I didn't buy the land. I found I later found out the land I wanted to buy was Um right of possession meaning it had never had Um papers, um, it had never had any sort of title to it Um, and then after I found out all of that Well, yeah, you can buy right of possession and there's things you can do to get titles for that But then I found out it was also in a protected area of the government So even if I bought it the government could come Just take it away.
[00:34:26] Maria: So I dodged a bullet with that, but it's something that I see, you know, happen here all the time, people buy property and then they can't get a water permit because they've frozen all new water meters from being issued in that town. And so I think that was my biggest lesson learned because I dodged that bullet, but then I also, um, And I've also seen a lot of people make that, you know, make that mistake.
[00:34:49] Maria: Um, and yeah, it was a crazy year. And so we did, we did the communal living thing for a while. It really didn't work. Um, and so from there, um, when I first moved here, I was living in the middle of pineapple production. So Costa Rica is [00:35:00] one of the largest exports is pineapple. Unfortunately, pineapple is one of the most.
[00:35:04] Maria: toxic fruits to grow the chemicals that they have to use to grow a monoculture product like pineapple that is pretty susceptible to fungi and diseases is deadly. Um, and the town I grew up and the town that I was living on my friends who grew up there, most almost all of their fathers have passed away from cancer from using the chemicals when the find out when the pineapple farms just started coming to Costa Rica.
[00:35:28] Maria: Um, without, you know, proper masks and everything, um, they've passed away from cancer caused by those chemicals. So we were living in the middle of pineapple production. When I say in the middle, I mean, I can show you a satellite drawing. Like our property was a bunch of trees. And for, for, I mean, thousands of acres, it was just pineapple.
[00:35:45] Maria: So what that meant was whenever they were spraying the pineapple, whenever the person was in the entire closed container, spraying the pineapple, all of those chemicals were blowing into our house. Um, and that was a big motivator for us to get out of that [00:36:00] area. I mean, the land was gorgeous where we lived, but that really, um, was not.
[00:36:05] Maria: And so we ended up moving from that area and we've lived in a couple of places in Costa Rica after that.
[00:36:11] Cesar: What I experienced is getting outside the comfort zone and growing as a, you know, as a person, as a professional, uh, it's incredible, right? And there's the move, right? But there's, there's also, I don't know why you picked up surfing.
[00:36:27] Cesar: You recently did the hundred. Uh, kilometer, uh, over three days. Um, so what, what drives you, what motivates you to continually look for this type of experiences where you're a beginner, right? Where you're on, let's say, an underdog, right? What's worth, where does that come from, right? And what would you recommend to someone looking to get outside their comfort zone, but maybe not to that extreme.
[00:36:54] Maria: Yeah, um, I don't know what I'm maybe I think why I do all those things is to figure out what makes me tick. I don't know. 100 miles. Maybe [00:37:00] I'll learn like what makes me sick. Um, but when we're looking at doing things to get out of our comfort zone, I think there's a couple of. I think the main reason why people don't do things out of the comfort zone is fear of what?
[00:37:11] Maria: Fear of unknown or fear of what will happen. Um, and a lot of times the fear of the unknown can manifest in many different ways. Um, like fear of failure, um, fear of, oh my gosh, what if this happens? Like worst case scenario fears. But all that fear is It's fake, right? Um, it can, I mean, it's, it can be real sometimes, you know, if you're in the forest and you know, you see a venomous snake, that's a very real feel, but it's a threat, right?
[00:37:37] Maria: But all these fears we typically have about getting out of our comfort zones, out of our comfort zones aren't real. They're not threats, you know, they're, they're just fears. And so the more we can constantly and confront that fear and, and do that, the easier it's going to be to push through that. So for example,
[00:37:54] Maria: like by doing something that makes us uncomfortable, we're confronting that fear. So I'm a big proponent of [00:38:00] using travel as a vehicle for change, because I think that when you take, you take yourself out of your everyday environment, put yourself in a foreign place, and maybe even with people you don't know, you know, that's why I love under 30 so much, under 30 experiences, but maybe in a place with people you don't know.
[00:38:17] Maria: You're there as yourself, like no one there knows, has, you know, preconceived stories. They have, they don't know anything about your everyday life. They don't know anything. And you're there just as you. And then you get in that place and you're like, who am I? You know, maybe you don't get, maybe you don't go that deep immediately, but you know, you get in these uncomfortable places and after doing enough, you start being like, who am I?
[00:38:39] Maria: And then from that of who am I, for me, I think travel enables, enables us to ask that question and then give us space to be like, maybe I am this person. Like you come to Costa Rica, for example, you've never gotten a surfboard in your life and you're like, you know, maybe I will try that, you know, like, I don't know, maybe, and you learn that you're like, oh my [00:39:00] gosh, that was so hard, but that was like such an amazing thing.
[00:39:02] Maria: And I want to do it again. But, or. I've never surfed before. I don't want to do that. I don't know. No, I don't. I don't. That's not my thing. That's okay if it's not your thing. It doesn't have to be surfing. A lot of people would not do surfing at all. But whatever that thing is, it's like these thoughts and these fears just kept you from having a great experience.
[00:39:20] Maria: So if you can even go back and think about the last five times that she were nervous to do something or maybe didn't do it or decided not to do it. and had reflipped that script and actually done it, the neurons and the pathways that are paved in the brain just by doing those new experiences are going to make you less likely to have that fear as strongly moving forward.
[00:39:42] Maria: So it's kind of like beating down the fear by confronting our fears by doing things that make us uncomfortable. I love that.
[00:39:50] Cesar: And it's, uh, yeah, he's gonna confront the fear, right? Step into it. And, um, I often regret the things I don't do more than the things [00:40:00] I, I did, even if I fail. Right. Um, so definitely, uh, definitely, um, you know, that's, that's something that we can take away from this conversation.
[00:40:02] Cesar: It's just, just, you, you'll never know until you try, right? Until you experiment for yourself, because you can get advice and feedback from other people, but they're not in your shoes, right? They're, they're not there experiencing whatever it is that you're experiencing, right? So, um, I think there's, there's, there's value there, and there always be people, oh, you know, don't, that doesn't fit you.
[00:40:18] Cesar: Don't try that. Ultimately, you're the one that has the, the choice, right? And, and control over, over that. Um, awesome. Um, I wanted to ask you, actually, I want to try something with you. Um, I call it the rapid fire closing us as we, uh, head towards our wrap up here. And I'll basically ask you a couple of questions and just give me the first thing that comes to mind.
[00:40:39] Cesar: And it's a fun way to to wrap up the episode. All right. So rapid fire closing. First question. Um, one book that has greatly influenced your life.
[00:40:50] Cesar: Uh,
[00:40:50] Maria: I'm going to say The Alchemist by Paolo Coelho. It's the book I read on the plane ride back from my three months in Costa Rica and potentially is what made me, made my decision [00:41:00] to move to Costa Rica.
[00:41:02] Cesar: That book comes out, comes out by that. It's a, it's a famous one. I know
[00:41:06] Maria: it's cliche, but man.
[00:41:08] Cesar: It's a good book.
[00:41:09] Cesar: I read it every year. It's just, it's just a great book. So no, I'm not surprised at all. All right. Second question. One of the most worthwhile investments you've ever made outside of what we already talked about.
[00:41:23] Cesar: It could be an experience. It could be a thing, right?
[00:41:27] Maria: Thank you. Um, thank you. I have to say the, the, the, the trip I booked to come to Costa Rica in November 2014, not to go back to that, but that was a gift I gave myself for my birthday. I bought it in May and there's no doubt that that single experience, I mean, if I didn't have that, I don't know, I wouldn't be here to, I may be here in Costa Rica by some other means, but I wouldn't be here today.
[00:41:50] Cesar: Oh, that makes me so happy to hear, especially because I feel like I contributed to, to that in some way. Um, so, you know, knowing that
[00:41:57] Maria: Caesar was one of the guys who are the [00:42:00] leaders, right? Right. Yeah, I was, um, journey. So
[00:42:03] Cesar: just knowing that I made a positive impact on someone's life. And that's, that's everything to me.
[00:42:09] Cesar: So that's, that's awesome. All right. Um, next question. quote you think of often or that you lift your leg by? I'm
[00:42:18] Maria: going to go again, cliche here, but in the tech realm, um, Steve Jobs speech to Stanford grads. Um, there's a couple parts of that, and I'm not reading it. I'm not reading it, so I'm going to butcher it a little bit.
[00:42:27] Maria: Um, but, whew, there's so much there. Um, if I wake up and more than a couple of days in a row and look in the mirror and I realize that I'm doing something that I don't want to be doing, I need to change it. That's one piece of that. The next one is that your work is going to fill a large part of your life.
[00:42:46] Maria: It's really important to do work that you love. Um, And the last piece of that, I mean, the whole thing is great, but just this coming up right now is that
[00:42:56] Maria: like, like when you're, when we're confronted with death, um, you know, there's, there's like nothing else [00:43:00] to fear and, um, like, like what he says, like we're already naked. So stop living and I'm butchering this, but it's like, stop living your life by other people's, you know, what they think or by their opinions and letting it be shaped by that and really living your life true to yourself.
[00:43:15] Maria: Um, so many great great pieces of that of that. I love that.
[00:43:17] Cesar: It's a it's a great speech. It's a great vision. Actually, I'm going to go listen to it after the recording. Uh, next question. In the last year, one belief or habit that has improved your life.
[00:43:30] Maria: So ultra running. I started in, I ran one race in 2019, but this has been the past, like the past year I've ran ultra, I've done ultra running, trail running consistently for a little over a year. And the consistency that has gone, because it's consistency over intensity. And I, that is not me, how I'm wired naturally.
[00:43:52] Maria: So the consistency of putting in things, small things every day. Um, to do something really large [00:44:00] is the, is a lesson that, um, ultra running has, uh, really, really driven him. I
[00:44:04] Cesar: love that. I'm a big fan of Rick Roll. I don't know if you've heard of him, but he's also a big ultra runner and he credits, you know, a lot of his transformation to ultra run.
[00:44:15] Cesar: Uh, and, um, I don't know, maybe I should try that. Maybe. And last question, uh, to, to wrap it up. What's one, one takeaway that you want to leave the audience with, um, as they. Embark on their own quest for their own personal transformation.
[00:44:32] Maria: It's a lot easier for us to know what we don't want than what we do want. So I think one of the most important things when we're embarking on something has to change, or I want to make a big change, or if you already even know what that change is, right? Um, depending on where you are in that change process is identifying all the things that you don't want Like all the things that are non negotiables.
[00:44:54] Maria: Um and being really clear about those because in order for us to make big life changes [00:45:00] boundaries are being able to set boundaries to who has access to our mental space and You know, just in our energy is really important. So starting with this is a list of things I don't want. I think that's easier to start.
[00:45:14] Maria: And then think of the things that make you feel really good and make you feel fulfilled. Not so much. I want to be a VP of growth at this company, but like, what makes you feel fulfilled being able to, and I'm, you know, you know, being able to. You know, pick up my daughter from school, right? So that, so those things that make you feel fulfilled, those, those things may not be tangibles, but they can be tangibles because once you know exactly what you don't want, and then you see what makes you feel fulfilled, you can start constructing the, the transformation you want with those things in mind versus being like, this is what I want to do as far as a transformation.
[00:45:49] Maria: Cause I think that linear path is like a lot harder to go down.
[00:45:53] Cesar: I love that. And it's a great way to close the episode. And for the longest time, I resisted the idea of putting. [00:46:00] Those on paper like things I don't want. But this year I give in and I have a notebook here that I constantly revisit add to it.
[00:46:10] Cesar: But it's been a very powerful practice and just being clear off. No, this is who I am. This is what I said. And yeah, you know, you're going to go above and beyond to make sure that nothing. Violates those those boundaries. So definitely, um, I would encourage you to do that exercise. If you if you haven't because I think it's Transformation.
[00:46:30] Cesar: Um, but Maria, thanks so much for coming on the podcast and sharing your story. Um, I can't wait to put it out there. And, uh, yeah, you know, uh, we'd love to have you on another episode down the road to continue this conversation. But for now, thanks so much.
[00:46:45] Maria: Caesar. I enjoyed it.
[00:46:46] Cesar: all right. I hope you enjoyed this episode and thank you so much for listening all the way through. I appreciate [00:47:00] you. And I hope that you get some valuable information that you can apply to our personal and professional life. If this story resonated with you and you would like to support the podcast.
[00:47:09] Cesar: Please make sure to subscribe. So you don't miss out on any future episodes. Thank you so much for the opportunity. I appreciate you. And I look forward to serving you in the next episode.