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Unashamed Unafraid is a show dedicated to being unashamed about sexual addiction recovery and unafraid of coming unto Christ for healing. Pornography and sexual addiction are not something you are stuck with to manage your whole life. We share real stories of recovery, the best resources, information from experts, and answer anonymous questions with those who know. All to help you on the path of being 100% healed from pornography and sexual addiction.
Speaker 17: Tryna walk the walk.
Truth on the mic, no shame
here, just real talk.
Came from the outside, never fit in.
Now we tell the story
and the healing begins.
No front, no mask, just telling the truth.
Keep it real, keep it raw,
speaking straight from the booth.
If you feeling like an
outsider, this one's for you.
Uh.
Yeah
Speaker: Welcome to Unashamed,
Unafraid, where we are unashamed of
sexual addiction recovery and unafraid
of coming unto Christ for healing.
We have Mike, uh, I call
him Sacramento Mike.
This guy is like- Yep
awesome because he, he used to
live in Sacramento and that's
where I first met him, uh, not in
Sacramento, but I met him at boot
camp, and he came up from Sacramento.
Yes, sir.
Um, boot camp in Alaska.
Speaker 2: Mike's in my
phone as Sacramento Mike.
Speaker: Mine too.
As Sacramento Mike.
Yep.
Good times.
Totally.
Yep, and we got his son Weston on here, to
be part of this amazing conversation that
we're just about, about to have, soâ¦
And we have James on here.
What up, James?
Speaker 2: How you doing, Chris?
Speaker: Fan-freaking-tastic- So good
⦠'cause I get to hang out with you.
Speaker 2: I know.
Get to see your beautiful face.
Speaker: I'm super excited
to have you on here, Mike.
Um, I know- I'm
Speaker 2: excited to be here
⦠Speaker: what's cool is, like,
you're actually in studio.
So you live in Hawaii now.
And you're here in Utah recording
with us right now, 'cause what have
you got going on here this weekend
and what, what brought you here?
Obviously you came just for the
podcast so you could record.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: But what else,
events did you put around
Speaker 3: this- Yeah, I
just thought- ⦠recording?
⦠while I'm here, I might as well just
go to my daughter's wedding, too.
Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Yeah.
So- Yeah, you, you- ⦠obviously
here for the podcast.
Speaker: You, you probably told
her, you're like, "Hey, I'm
coming to Salt Lake to-" Mm-hmm
record a podcast.
That's probably when
you should get married.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah.
Schedule it around this.
Speaker: Yeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Totally.
Even though we scheduled this yesterday.
Speaker: And in fact, she's
actually, like, getting married
today, which is amazing.
Speaker 3: It is today.
Yeah.
Speaker: So there's no way in hell
my wife would be, like, "Yeah, sure.
Go ahead."
Right.
"Go record a podcast that day."
Speaker 3: I would love my wife to be
here, but she is a little occupied-
Yeah ⦠putting together a wedding
. Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker: Totally.
Speaker 3: For about six hours from now.
Speaker: Yeah.
Yeah, totally.
Well, we'll, we'll get you
recorded and then, uh, get you off.
Get you off to your wedding,
Speaker 3: yep.
Speaker: So you guys can- No worries
jump back into it, so.
Yeah.
Um, dude, tell us, like, start us
off wherever you wanna start, man.
Just, like, growing up, did
you grow up in Sacramento?
Speaker 3: I did grow up in Sacramento
area, in Fair Oaks, and, uh, pretty
much was there from about age nine.
The majority of my life been all in
California, and, uh, that's where,
you know, I grew up in a traditional,
LDS family, and mom, dad, and six kids
going to church and all that good stuff.
I always loved it growing up.
And about age 11, I was hanging
out at a friend's house and she
said, "Hey, check this out."
And we went out into her garage
and she pulled out a big stack of
pornographic magazines underneath
her dad's La-Z-Boy chair.
So when, when I opened that first
magazine and I saw that first image,
something triggered inside me that
felt internal, that turned on some
desire I had a need, it felt like
a need to thrive, to see more.
And, you know, obviously this
is, uh, a very long time ago,
and it wasn't as easy to find.
Speaker 2: Sure.
Speaker 3: But the enemy knew.
He knew what I was seeking, and
he helped me find it all the time.
Mm-hmm.
I found it in garbage cans, in bushes.
I know that kind of sounds weird that I
was looking in garbage cans, but I mean,
you know, I f- that's where I found it.
I found it in bushes hiding, in
bathrooms hiding,, at friends' houses.
I found it all over the place, and I
just really feel to this day that that
was just the enemy placing it before me.
Speaker: When, when you found it at
friends' houses, did they know about it
or, or
Speaker 3: uh, both.
Yeah.
Sometimes, sometimes some of my other
friends would find their dad's stashes
and, you know, we'd look at it together.
Sometimes I would just find it.
I was, I would have people hire me w-
to watch their dogs while they're out of
town, you know, and I would go snooping-
Mm-hmm ⦠you know, and find it.
And sometimes it was n- not
even, uh, pornographic magazines.
Sometimes it was pictures of the couple.
You
Speaker: know?
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 3: You know, taking
pictures of each other and-
Speaker: Polaroids.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker 3: Stuff like that.
That was amazing to me 'cause
it was actual people that I knew
in- instead of just randoms.
Speaker: The Mind and body, as soon
as it sees something like that as
a young kid, it just grips you.
And I, I think that just goes to show we
are designed to be sexual beings, right?
Yeah.
And, we need to learn how to, to manage
it and have a healthy relationship
with it, but- Right ⦠but with, as
soon as that comes in, I mean, we've
all experienced that, where- Mm-hmm
you see it even for the first
time and it's just captivating.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And the body gets in it, , the mind is
in it, and it just takes off from there.
And so you take off from there, man.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
So I found myself in a situation where me
and a couple of friends were, were looking
at magazines together, and the older
brothers found out, and , they joined
in, and I was very much forcibly sexually
assaulted by one of the older brothers
. Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: And while the other
brothers kind of watched and learned.
Speaker 2: Hmm.
Speaker 3: Like, and so it, it,
uh- It, uh, it kind of broke me.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: It broke me 'cause it's not
something that I wanted, and it's not
something that I was seeking, and I was
so confused 'cause I was maybe 13 or 14.
And you know, I'm 6'1", 205 now, you
know, 0% body fat, all muscle, but-
But , I was a late bloomer, you know?
I know I graduated high
school, I was 5'6", 140 pounds.
Yeah.
And so I was a small kid.
I was a small kid, and I didn't have it in
me to defend myself at all, and there was-
Speaker 2: Yeah
⦠Speaker 3: three of them and one of me.
So, I didn't know what it meant.
I didn't know what it meant.
I, I was very confused by it all.,
I thought it meant that
maybe I was gay now.
Like, I just didn't know.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Um, I was, I was very
confused, but the one thing I
knew that did feel good after that
was more pornography . Mm-hmm.
Right?
So I kept finding it.
Every gas station- Everywhere ⦠had it.
Yeah, they had the little magazine
section, and there was the, had the
little covers in front of them, you know,
18, you had to be 18 to look at those.
Speaker: So do they still
have stuff like that?
I, I didn't even, I've never
even paid attention to it when
I'm out there in California, so.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
I'm sure that those sections still
in the stores- Mm-hmm ⦠obviously
still exist, but I don't know.
- This was something I was never
gonna tell a soul in my life.
I was completely and totally
ashamed, embarrassed, all the things,
Speaker 2: about the assault
Speaker 3: and the- About the assault
and the pornography ⦠and the
Speaker 2: pornography.
Speaker 3: Right?
Yeah.
'Cause that's what led to the
assault- Yeah ⦠in my eyes.
Yeah.
And so I wasn't gonna tell
anybody, but I knew- Do you
Speaker: remember what you
were feeling inside about that?
Speaker 3: So let me add a little
bit, a little bit of detail.
I think this might have comforted me a
little bit at the time, but those same
two boys were soon after that arrested for
raping their own stepsister and sister.
Speaker 2: Oh, wow.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
And so I kind of just thought, "Well,
they got what they deserved- Mm-hmm
It's fine."
Right.
I wish I would've said something just
to add to whatever charges or, or- Sure
⦠whatever, you know, consequences they had.
Um, never saw 'em again.
Mm-hmm.
Never heard from 'em again.
I, I have recently
kinda tried to find 'em.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: The older one, he had
committed suicide about 10 years ago.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
So- The one who initiated this?
Speaker 3: Yes.
Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
Speaker 3: And so hurt
people hurt people, right?
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I don't know what
these guys grew up with.
I don't know what kind of
environment they were in.
It was a very mixed family at
the time, and there was a l-
uh, a lot of issues, obviously.
Speaker 2: Clearly, yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
And, you know, he ended it all-
Yeah ⦠by suicide one day.
And I feel sad about that.
Maybe he never got any type
of healing, you know, for him.
I eventually got it for me, but,
you know, typical story, it's like
as you get older, I'm thinking,
"Well, the next step in life, and
I'll be able to quit pornography,
and it won't Be a problem anymore
." Speaker 2: yeah.
Speaker 3: I had always thought
of, of going on a mission.
That was always my, my dream, my
thought, and when I saw my life
going a different direction, I,
I kinda had a big wake-up call.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: Uh, this was kind of the first
moment where I had woken up on the beach
in California and had been using drugs
the night before, and I woke up just
thinking, " What am I doing with my life?"
like it's just going a
totally different direction.
And I had an experience that morning,
kneeling down on the beach in prayer,
you know, by myself and, and, uh,
just really felt that God was real
. Speaker 2: Hmm.
Speaker 3: And kind of snapped out of the
drug phase that, that I had been using and
just really felt a presence in my life.
It was life-changing 'cause it helped
me, uh, really instantly just quit
all the drug use but, still didn't
really feel God's love for me.,
As I've gone through a lot of different
stages of life, you know, I, I think
what I've, what I've boiled it down
to is I believed God was real, but I
didn't, I didn't really believe myself
to be his child 'cause why didn't
he protect me from those things?
Speaker 2: right.
Yeah.
Speaker 3: You know, why not?
Speaker 2: Yeah.
So that day on the beach,
how old were you roughly?
Speaker 3: I was, I was 18.
Speaker 2: 18?
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 2: So at that time, if you were
to describe, say, the characteristics
of God, the nature of God, who, who
would he have been to you at that time?
Speaker 3: At that time, uh,
I would say just nonexistent
No, not in my life
Speaker 2: Yeah.
But enough that you prayed still.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
I think I always hadâ¦
My, my brother, uh, accused me in a
good way of always, of saying that I've
always had, like, a believing heart.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: You know?
I think I've always had just that
basic belief- Mm-hmm ⦠in God, but
to me he was a little bit nonexistent.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
He was fairly uninterested in your life.
Speaker 3: That's a
good way of putting it.
Why would he let me go through all that?
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Why would
he have me do all that?
And so I just kinda went through the
next couple of decades, quite frankly-
Mm ⦠with that same mindset, you
know, 'cause none of those steps in
life- Mm ⦠that I was supposed to
do were solving my pornography use.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Right.
So God was kind of this distant
person that just kinda put the
whole thing into motion and then
took a step back and let it all go.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
So I went on a mission, I
cleaned up the drug use.
I- Where'd you go?
I went to Ecuador.
Speaker: Sweet.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Loved it.
Loved the people there.
Loved every minute of it.
Had a, confession about halfway through
my mission- Mm ⦠of some prior, you
know, things to, prior to the mission, and
mission president just said, "Okay, thanks
for talking to me, and you're all good."
Yeah.
Um, so I stayed out there.
And I truly loved my mission a- and I
loved the people there, and I love a
lot of my companions, and have still
good friends, you know, 30 years later.
Some of my people that I trust the
most in life were met on my mission.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So that was great.
Came home, got married
pretty much right away, and-
Speaker: Where'd you guys meet?
Speaker 3: So we actually met at a,
mutual friend's wedding reception.
She was arriving and I was leaving.
I was leaving with some friends that I had
met on my mission, and, I just thought,
""""I need to know more about that girl."
Speaker: So those of you
that are on dating websites,
just start going to weddings.
That, that-
Speaker 3: There's one tonight
Speaker: in Provo
⦠Speaker 3: so we started
having kids right away.
You know, we did, we did get married
in the temple, had kids right away.
Weston here is my oldest.
He is 26.
Six.
Yeah.
Yep.
Speaker 4: He's a good dad.
He remembers my birthday.
He knows.
Speaker 3: He remembers how old you are.
Speaker 4: He remembers my age.
Speaker 3: 9/29/99.
Speaker 4: Boom.
Speaker 3: Okay?
Speaker 4: 9.
Speaker 3: I know that.
Then I just have to do
the math from there.
Um-
Speaker: My daughter's, like,
a month younger than you.
Speaker 4: Oh, yeah?
Speaker: Her, her's 10/27/99.
Th- there you go.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
You know, I, I was doing all the right
things as far as raising my family and
staying active in church, but I always
had this secret pornography problem.
Uh, something that I had always told my
sons and young men in church was that
pornography is, is not good, but that's
not necessarily the evil i- itself.
It's that eventually It progresses
to something beyond just looking at
images and videos- Yeah ⦠right?
It usually will escalate to something
else, , acting out in some inappropriate
way, sometimes illegal ways.
At about age 29, I had transitioned
into law enforcement, and I loved
the work and I loved the job.
Admittedly now though, looking back, I
have to see that the trauma that I was
responding to every day at work, and
then compounding that with pornography
use, my life was going downhill.
A
Speaker: mess.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was going downhill quick.
Um-
Speaker: You're probably using
porn even more because it's now,
definitely a coping mechanism for
all the crap that you're seeing.
Speaker 3: For sure.
' Cause you were in Oakland, right?
You were a cop in Oakland.
I
was in Oakland, yes.
Speaker: And there's probably
not very much crime out there.
Speaker 3: No, no, no.
It's actually a crime-free community-
completely..
No, we, uh, I mean, obviously I could sit
here and tell stories for hours about some
of the things that happened in Oakland.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And at first it
was exciting and it was fun.
That's all it was.
Uh, yeah.
And then eventually what happens is
you start working overtime to make, you
know, make ends meet, and you stop doing
the things that you liked to do before.
I stopped mountain biking, I stopped
hiking, I stopped snowboarding,
I stopped everything that was
fun, except maybe Call of Duty.
Weston could probably attest to that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I can attest to that.
Pro- bu- probably not the best, outlet.
Yeah.
But, um, yeah.
Yet
Speaker 2: another, yet
another numbing and coping
Speaker 3: mechanism.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I was a mess.
In 2009, I went and talked to my
bishop and did basically what we would
probably call a minor disclosure- Mm-hmm
and, um, of, of most things.
Speaker: And was that on your choice, and
did your wife have anything to do with it?
That was on my- Did she
know about it at all yet?
Speaker 3: So I had, I had finally
talked to my wife because it was
just eating me from the inside out.
Yeah.
Just my soul was just rotting,
and I finally talked to her about
the pornography, but that was it.
Speaker 2: Not about the other things?
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker: And, and what was her response?
Speaker 3: She was very hurt.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 3: She was very devastated.
I had kept this hidden for 20 years.
And, um-
For sure there was still
stuff I was hiding.
You know, with the internet becoming
a thing, it, and being able to see
someone's history, you know, knowing
that she might see something that I
had searched up, I would have these
little minor confessions along the way.
Be like, "Oh- Yeah ⦠I
saw something last night.
Sorry.
Won't happen again."
You know, but never the full truth.
Right.
Um, I was actually able to kick
pornography for three years, about
three years, and I felt good.
Um, then the, uh, the work-related
PTSD started to kick in.
Speaker 2: mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Speaker 3: And I knew that the best
coping mechanism for me was gonna
be to turn back to pornography.
Mm-hmm.
Um-
, Speaker: You said you were sober for,
like, three years from everything?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Everything.
Speaker: Sweet.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Um, I was happy, I was healthy, I
was doing some fun things in my life.
And then, you know, you start to-
I don't know you just slowly stop
doing the things that, that actually
brought some joy into my life.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker 3: And then just get
completely absorbed into work.
And, uh, eventually I was having some
temptations that I did not like, and
temptations that I knew were wrong,
temptations I had never had before.
And what I did is I, I intentionally
introduced pornography into my life again
to hopefully stop those temptations.
Speaker 2: Mm.
Speaker 3: To say, "Okay, maybe if I do
this, then it won't lead to that- Mm-hmm
because I can kinda curb it."
We would get, hit on a lot as officers.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
There was definitely physical-
The women ⦠temptations there-
Yeah, the women ⦠at work.
I would never act out at work
or do anything like that.
I didn't wanna risk my career.
Mm-hmm.
But I hated these temptations.
Speaker 2: Sure.
Yeah.
Speaker 3: And whether it was just
like like touching on the arm or
something, you know, and, um, a little
bit of flirting or whatever it was,
Speaker: And what was your relationship
with your wife at the time?
Speaker 3: It was good.
Yep.
Pretty much always had a good
relationship, um, but there
was always a, a disconnect.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 3: You know, I, Iâ¦
Now looking back, it's like, yeah,
things could've been better for sure.
I was not a very present father.
Uh, which is why I brought this guy
along here- ⦠so he can talk maybe
a little bit about that, and maybe he
has a different perspective than I do.
But myâ¦
I mean, I, I have a, I have this--
I made a lot of mistakes in life.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And, but my, my biggest
regret is not spending more time
with my kids when they were little.
I-
Speaker 4: I mean, to your credit, and
growing up and as I was getting older
and into my teenage years, maybe I
started to notice you feeling a little
bit more distant, but, but really, I
think you and Mom always did a good
job of being there for us and, and-
Speaker 3: Well, Mom did at least.
Speaker 4: Well, Dad was a cop, and
that was cool, and like, you know,
it's cool to have a, a cop dad.
And-
Speaker 3: Yeah
⦠Speaker 4: I knew he was busy
with work a lot and had worked the
graveyard shift, and had to sleep
a lot during the day, you know?
So I don't, I don't think I
ev- ever held resentment there.
But now looking back out of my
teenage years, I do see just
ways that the marriage could
have been better, and, and I do.
I, I, I never once thought like,
"Oh, Mom and Dad don't love each
other," or something like that.
Okay.
But, but just looking back, I do see
more moments of distance and- Things
Speaker: probably started clicking when
you're, you're like, "Oh, that makes
sense of why they were doing this- E-
why they were-
Speaker 4: Yeah
⦠Speaker: this way towards each
other- Yeah ⦠during that time."
Speaker 4: Yeah, or just seeing
more stress in the home, you know?
dad, he, you know, he never
lashed out or was never-
Speaker: Yeah
⦠Speaker 4: violent or anything like that.
But yeah, you just now
connect the dots kind of.
You probably
Speaker: were looking up to him
like he, he's this badass cop dad-
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah.
that was just amazing.
I mean, luckily pretty early.
Speaker: you probablyâ¦
I mean, you said it was cool to
have- It was ⦠a dad as a cop.
Speaker 4: I mean-
Speaker: And so you'd
look up to him as like-
Speaker 4: We loved, you know- ⦠my
dad's a badass ⦠when he had to
bring the patrol car home, right,
and come home in uniform, like
nothing, pretty much nothing's
cooler than that as a kid, right?
Right.
For sure.
But pretty early on, Iâ¦
He, he didn't really want cop
work for me, so like it wasn't
ever a career I thought of.
And, and I'm the oldest, so maybe my
siblings have a different perspective
there too, but I just knew work's
busy, you know, he's, you know, gotta
sleep, gotta work at night, whatnot.
Mom definitely was the one at the
events and much more involved.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Which I think is fairly
normal, and I, and I can accept that.
But I, you knowâ¦
I, I've heard recently, you know, nobody
ever, uh, is on their deathbed and thinks,
"Man, I wish I would've worked more."
Speaker: Right.
Speaker 3: You know?
It's, I wish I would've been
more present at some of those
types of things, you know?
But I, I'm trying to make up for it now.
I live far away from my kids,
but we're still coming over
here to, to Utah or California-
Yeah ⦠for, for plenty of events.
We don't miss a whole lot now.
The end of my law enforcement
career, well, I would say w- in
the very last month, the last 30
days of my career, I responded.
I had three people die in my care.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: Mm.
Um- Wow ⦠felt their last heartbeat.
Speaker 2: I remember you telling me
Speaker 3: Okay.
And watched their last breath.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: And doing CPR on a guy who
was partially dismembered, and doing
one chest pump and watching blood shoot
out his femoral artery and thinking,
"Well, that's not gonna save him."
Speaker: Right.
Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.
You know?
Um, and the third one was a
16-year-old kid hit by a train-
And it destroyed me.
And I've connected a lot of dots
since then through a lot of therapy.
Speaker: This like literally
broke you in that moment?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Now I had, I still had my own
personal issues with pornography
and, inappropriate acting out.
But what this incident represented
or what it basicallyâ¦
You know, it wasn't
necessarily this one incident.
It was that, this was a 16-year-old
kid who was the same age as my
son, , thinking about how this poor
kid, 16 years old, just gets his
license, jumps in grandpa's truck,
and is killed by a train.
Nightmares for days and suicidal thoughts.
And I, I came back to work after a,
a long weekend, and I actually stuck
my own duty weapon to my head and had
about six pounds on a 12-pound trigger.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker 3: And in that moment, that's
when I, I swear it was an audible voice.
If you were with me, Chris, you
probably would've heard it too.
Mm-hmm.
The voice said, "Mike, there's too
much good in your life for this.
Put the gun down and go get help."
Mm.
And I Did.
I went and got help
What work didn't know about
was my personal issues at home.
But I still had the PTSD from work,
and so over a two-year period of
time, they eventually just retired me.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: And basically the doctor
said, uh, "I would never want your
suicide on my conscience, so I will
never sign you off to go back to work."
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker 3: So I said, "Okay.
I guess it's onto something else."
Speaker: Well, and that, that
was probably, like, a huge thing
because that was who you were.
Speaker 3: That is who I was.
Speaker: You, you were this, this
cop, this badass cop dad, and-
Speaker 3: Yep
Speaker: That's how you were known.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Even though I don't ever think that Iâ¦
I don't think I ever truly
believed I was a badass cop-
Okay ⦠because I had this dark side.
Speaker: Iâ¦
And I meant, like, just the- I
Speaker 3: know what you're
saying ⦠the identity
Speaker: of a cop,
Speaker 3: right?
But that's still what I
wanted to identify as.
Right?
'Cause it was at least admirable.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: People thought I was cool.
They would ask me questions and
advice and- Mm-hmm ⦠wanna
hear stories, you know?
And so that was, that was me.
And you
Speaker 2: gotâ¦
Yeah.
And you got to help people,
and you got to- Yeah.
Yep.
Speaker 3: Yep.
I can look back now and see how
much I, I got to help people, you
know, but in the, in the moment
it was like I felt like a failure.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: All these people dying
around me in my care, and, um-
' Speaker: These three that you talked
about, they're-- That's not the
only deaths that you experienced.
Speaker 3: Oh, no, no, no.
There were hundreds.
Many, many, many
more.
Speaker: Hundreds.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker: But these are just
really impactful to you.
But those
Speaker 2: were the three
that compounded and Iâ¦
Yeah.
Speaker 3: Those basically were the,
the last three rocks in my backpack
that, that made me fall over.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
I couldn't handle anymore.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So now I'm
in this identity crisis.
Speaker: Right.
' Speaker 3: Cause I don't know who I am
and I don't know what I'm supposed to do.
And I've lost income, literally in,
in my, in my mind, I lost my identity.
I didn't know what to do.
Speaker: So how many years ago was this?
Speaker 3: This was, this
was all eight years ago.
Speaker: So 2018.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker: So this is, like, right
before you came to boot camp.
And I, I remember-
Yeah ⦠meeting you at boot camp.
No,
Speaker 3: I was
Speaker: fresh.
And we hadâ¦
Sitting in the, that, that
lodge in the cabin- Mm-hmm
and just in that front living
room, we were all just balling
just- Yeah ⦠because itâ¦
at that point, you were still wrecked.
Speaker 3: I was deep in therapy
and trying to figure things
out, and completely, medicating
myself with pornography.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Which had
escalated to some acting out-
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm
⦠Speaker 3: that, I hated about myself.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I had been doing
lots of different therapy.
I really wanted to get better.
I just- Yeah ⦠didn't know how.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I had no idea how.
And- Were
Speaker: you working with a therapist just
for the, the mental mindset, or were you
working with them for the porn issue too?
Speaker 3: Just mental.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker 3: Just mental
work-related issues.
Speaker 2: Work-related PTSD.
Speaker 3: Correct.
Okay.
Speaker: Not realizing
what porn is doing to you-
Speaker 3: Right
⦠Speaker: and destroying
Speaker 3: you.
I think, I think, though, I think
I did know what it was doing to
me, which is why, December 8th
of 2018 changed me forever.
Because that was the night where
I decided the only way to end all
of this is to take my own life.
Speaker 2: Hmm.
Speaker 3: I have a captain who
came to my house, and he made me
change the code on my gun safe,
and only my wife had that code.
And I was, I was seeking a way
to, to end my life, and she found
me in the closet curled up in
the fetal position, ready to die.
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: And she wasn't even
supposed to be home . So she came
up and she said, "What can I do?
What do you need?"
I said, "Take me to the hospital
right now ." Um, on the way to
the hospital, I, uh, decided toâ¦
I, I put together a quick plan.
We were about to pass a large bus,
Speaker 2: hmm.
Speaker 3: And I knew that if I jumped
out in front of that bus at 70 miles an
hour, that it would take care of the job.
And, uh, just as we're about to pass
the bus, my wife takes a hard right
and exits the freeway at a, on an
exit that was not the right exit.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
And I just said, "Why did you do that?"
And she said, "'Cause God told me to."
Speaker: Ooh
Speaker 3: That was the first moment in my
life that I recognized God's love for me
Not just his existence,
but his love for me
Speaker 7: Mike, Weston, dude, it was
so awesome, awesome having you guys on
here today Yeah, I get to the Rangers.
It was super cool.
All the way from Hawaii,
we got these guys here.
And Weston's over in Colorado.
Yep.
So it was cool to get everybody here.
And, with that, guys, let's listen
to Gratitude by, , Brandon Lake