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After trying every short-term trick and tactic to grow his audience, podcast veteran Mark Steadman realised that serving listeners with generosity and consistency is the only way to succeed. Mark works with best-selling authors, TED speakers, TV personalities, impact entrepreneurs, and coaches to help them grow and monetise their podcasts.
You are a Helpful Podcaster. You’re a seasoned, soulful entrepreneur who wants to turn your insights into content fans look forward to, and new listeners can't wait to binge. By leading with your expertise, being consistent and showing authenticity, you’ll build trust with your audience and get paid to do the work you love. Mark is here to help you on that journey.
[00:00:00] Mark: Is your podcast helping? More to the point. Who is it helping? Today we're gonna dig into the ingredients behind a helpful podcast so that you can build stronger, longer lasting relationships with the people you want to work with.
[00:00:19] Hiya, Mark Steadman here and uh, you are very welcome to the podcast owner's manual. Your handy guide to looking after your podcast and yourself. Today we are talking about helpful podcasts. What are they, how do they benefit you, and how can we make it easy on ourselves to create them?
[00:00:44] Now what, so what, what is a, what is a helpful podcast? Um, this isn't a judgment on your work. This is more a framework for trying to think about the work that we do as podcasters. So this is something that is forming the, the foundation or the basis. Of some stuff that I'm gonna be talking to you about over actually the next two to three months. Um, it all stems from this idea of creating something that perhaps benefits the recipient on the face of it more than perhaps it benefits us.
[00:01:24] We can do that because we are creating, we, we have this one to many ratio, so, Sort of by design really, that that's already built in. We are going to be benefiting more people because not everybody's gonna buy our products or services or work with us. That's why when we talk about funnel, that's why it's in that shape, right?
[00:01:48] The, these people, if you wanna think of it in those terms, are at the top of the funnel and the people that we can best serve that are really gonna show up for us as we're showing up for them. They're at the, at the, the thinner end of that funnel and. What we are gonna start with, of course, is looking at who we serve as podcasters.
[00:02:11] Now this is work that I've been in investigating more and trying to understand more, really getting into the psychographics behind the listener. I've done work with marketing experts and work with people who know their onions when it comes to positioning. And those two things combined really give us start to give us that sort of framework for what our podcast is going to be.
[00:02:45] So we start by going right back to the very basics. Who is the person that we want to be? Enjoying or appreciating or getting value from our work. Now, I think I've mentioned this before, but when I look at, when I talk about this show, I have my actual clients in mind. I'm not really making this for other people.
[00:03:08] I'm making the podcast owners manual as a way to add value to my existing clients. Yes, I'm absolutely gonna post episodes on LinkedIn and talk about it, and it's on my website for it for anyone to hear. , and that's simply because by making something for the exact people I already work with, because I don't work with everybody, I get to then sort of define that audience.
[00:03:33] I, I then get to make something that fits just that audience because I'm thinking about who this is for. I'm thinking about things like, what do the people who work with me have time for? What don't they have time? Do they really care about this particular microphone or this new piece of software? You know, there's so much about podcasting that's changing every day.
[00:03:55] There's literally a daily news show about podcasting, which I listen to every day and there's always something new to talk about, but I don't talk about it because it doesn't really serve. Or 99.4% let's say. I dunno why I picked that number. Doesn't really serve my audience or the audience of the podcast owners manual.
[00:04:14] So right from the. I'm thinking about that now. If I was starting this show from scratch, and maybe if I was starting a show that wasn't tied directly to my business, or even if it was, to be honest, I would start with the, with the idea of the listener persona. So that's the basic building blocks of any brand is starting off with a, an avatar or a profile or a persona, someone that you can conjure.
[00:04:42] Put a, put a name to a face or a face to a name, either way, and create some, create a profile of them. What keeps them up at night? What interests them? What influences them? Who are they influenced by? What is their communication style? Where do they like to hang out online? All those kinds of things that you can then start to weave into your podcast because then you are thinking about the problems that they have and how your work actually helps them solve that problem. I've been doing this recently, uh, with someone from right from the ground up, and what we come out of it is so different because we go in with this right from the beginning, thinking about the listener and how we can serve them.
[00:05:27] As you are listening to this, you are more service, service orientated than most people. Most people don't think like this. Um, I, I work on shows that are not perhaps direct clients where this isn't really the case where they are having a podcast so that they can have a, a podcast, you know, they can, it's, it's very little work for them.
[00:05:49] Someone manages it for them. They're not really that invested other than it gives them that opportunity to hop on the mic. Demonstrate their knowledge. You can usually tell these shows. They're the shows that have a three minute intro where yeah, there's a Guest on, but we haven't heard them for, for the first three minutes because the host is wanging on about their own stuff or, or they've, they're, they've rewritten the guests, Wikipedia.
[00:06:14] Page or whatever, , we, we know what these shows are and we know what these shows aren't. Right. You know, you are a service orientated podcaster, but it, it's so useful and helpful to really go back to that beginning, that fundamental thing, that fundamental profile so that you can almost have a picture of a person in your mind when you are delivering things.
[00:06:37] Right now, that person is looking at me and saying, yes, mark, I get it. It's time to move on. . So, funnily enough, uh, one of my, uh, one of my points in here, which we'll get to is, is, uh, being clear and concise, which is something, uh, some Kool-Aid that I could, um, stand to drink myself. So next up is, this is relatively new in this sort of idea. The helpful podcast if you like, and I actually think it's really pivotal. Um, it's about having a central question for each episode now. I studied, uh, at the feet of Simon Bachelor, who is someone I, I, uh, I have, uh, infinite time for, just as a human being, but also as a, as a marketing brain as well.
[00:07:27] And he's the co-creator of the better, bolder, braver, uh, coaches marketing community. And one of the things that he talks about is how we, we create content that solves a listener question effectively answers a Google search. That's, that's what we wanna do. Now that makes total sense to me, and that's, that's a, a good sort of starting point for creating a blog post, which you, that might then turn into, um, a solo piece of podcast content.
[00:07:59] Or you might get your camera out and record a YouTube video. And literally using a phrase that a, uh, that someone might search in Google using their language. That's really key. Using the language that they know, not the language of a domain expert. Um, also not being afraid to you to answer the wrong question because so often we get this in podcasting, we get it in marketing, it's in lots of different places.
[00:08:25] People ask the wrong question, and what we wanna do is we don't wanna deliver that answer because. It, yeah, we could deliver the answer, but it's probably not actually gonna help 'em. So what we wanna do is steer them towards the right question. And then usually there isn't an answer to that one. It's just, here's another question, right?
[00:08:45] But that kind of thing is really useful. So don't be afraid to use the wrong question in your, uh, in, in, in a, in a title of an episode, for example. Now, this central question, if you have, uh, a guest, that episode needs to focus pretty much entirely, or, or all lead to the answer to that central question.
[00:09:13] Another great way of doing this is, is flip it on. It said, rather than think about the Guest, think about. The question itself. Think about, brainstorm a bunch of different questions. The the top questions you get asked by your clients, that's a really common thing that people talk about. What are the top 50 questions?
[00:09:31] Maybe 50 is a bit too many, but you know, top 10 questions. Start. Start with that 10 to 20 if you can. If you can manage it, what are those top questions that people are always asking you for me? Yeah, it is stuff like, what mic should I buy? Um, what headphones, why do I need headphones? Various things like that.
[00:09:50] And I haven't gone into, you know, I go into those things in, in various pieces of material, but I, I haven't created sort of specific, um, episodes about them. And perhaps there's a reason for that. But I think the main reason is I'm not pitching my show to people who are starting a podcast. You already have one. That's why it's called the Podcast, podcast Owners Manual. Right. You've already got one.
[00:10:10] Anyway the idea here is to find that central question that you can answer in an episode in a discussion with a Guest. Make sure the Guest knows that and, and knows that they can speak to speak to that question. But once you start to think about it in those terms as we'll get onto in a bit, I actually think it makes a lot of the process a lot easier because then to a degree, like a lot of the work is done for you, what you've gotta do then is start digging into the stuff behind that.
[00:10:43] You could phrase the, uh, title of the episode in that question if you wanted to. You could write around it if you want to. That's the, either way, as long as you are pitching a problem that the episode is then going to solve. One of the things I talk about when it comes to show notes is setting tension right at the beginning in that opening sentence, creating a bit of tension in the show, in the, uh, episode.
[00:11:08] So that we grab people's attention and we make them think, oh, you know, there, there's, there's just that slight little, again, tension, that slight little, Ooh, what's, what's, what's this? Let's perk those ears up and then explain in the Descript how the episode is gonna resolve that tension without actually resolving it. But this Guest knows the answer to this, or this is the problem that this Guest was dealing with, and that's what they, they bring to the table. Anything like that.
[00:11:35] thinking about the question first really helps us get rid of that tendency for us to just pile on guests. We're going weekly and we just need guests. We just need father, and we can talk about how inspiring they are. And what a great question. And I'm so appreciative that you were here today and you asked that question and your book is so inspiring and it meant so much and there's so many takeaways and this piece and that piece and all the language that we use, it gets rid of a lot of.
[00:12:06] Because we fundamentally get down to, alright, what's the question that we are here to solve? How do we help the listener today? And that makes your Guest shine because they get to show the knowledge that they have and it makes you shine because you are the, you are the person who ultimately delivered that answer for them.
[00:12:26] So This is an, this is an invitation to you right now to, if you've got some episodes planned, think about it. Are you doing this already? If you're not, have a think about it. What questions can you answer that people are gonna Google effectively or that people really wanna know? Cuz the other thing that this does, which we talked about last week is it builds that body of work. That is part of what, that is. One of the ingredients of the helpful podcast or one of the, the ways it is evidenced is that we are building a library of knowledge. We are building a repository of your experience, your expertise, or even the expertise of the people you have access. It's, it's fine if it's expertise by proxy.
[00:13:10] It's still knowledge that you have that you are able to give to people. It's not just spending time, it's not just checking in. It's not just showing up week by week. I think we make a mistake when we do that. I sometimes worry, or I sometimes think about the amount of work I put into editing episodes for certain shows, not because I don't think you'll be appreci.
[00:13:34] Every now and again, I sort of go, I have to remind myself this is not disposable content. This is something that we can refer back to even. Even if we're just referring to it from another episode. But hopefully over time, like I said last week, we're building this library and that's why it's worth, if you can, sweating some of that small stuff.
[00:13:57] Not to the extent where you don't get the episode out, but it is worth just giving it that little bit of thought because you are building something I I, I wanna try and get out of this mindset of we've just gotta create something to show up this. I know that's very popular or, or perhaps an interpretation of that is very popular.
[00:14:18] I was gonna say, you know, I think Seth Godin talks about merely shipping and I wonder sometimes whether that means to, or, or can be interpreted as just Yeah, just. Hop on the mic and, and say your thing. There are different levels, and I'm not certainly, I'm certainly not saying that I'm gonna bat the same average every week.
[00:14:38] For example, when I come on the microphone, there will be some weeks where I'm a little bit tighter and a little bit more prepared. There'll be other weeks where the weeks got on top of me and I'm doing my best. But with every episode that I try and put. I'm always looking at answering a central question.
[00:14:55] I'm always trying to look at something to help with or to explain or to bring to you the, you know, level to which I do that. And the, uh, concision that I bring will def will differ. But I hope you get the sense that I'm not going to, um, rock up with just, you know, today. Let's talk about. Or whatever's on my mind, you know, I'm, I'm coming with a thing.
[00:15:20] So concision. Um, yes, it is something that, uh, we can always, we can always stand to. Be mindful of, I think especially when just very common for us to have the sort of the intro and the, and and the interview and then the sort of synthesis at the end, the intro, the, those monologues, the intro and the outro, the, the sort of synthesis at the end.
[00:15:44] Those are the two areas where concision, it's very easy for that to start to get a bit floppy. And so I'm a big fan of get in, get out, you know, get in, deliver value, get out. that doesn't mean rushing, but it means not out staying our welcome. You know that feeling when it's come to the end of the night, it's, you know, some people are better at this than others.
[00:16:08] It's come to the end of the night, you've been spending it, spending an evening with friends, and you can sort of feel that sense of we're sort of circling the drain now. It's probably, are they looking at me? Are they ying? Are they ready? You know, oh, you think I'm about ready for bed? You know, and, and is that a hint that you are not taking?
[00:16:25] It's that kind of thing, right? Wanting to make sure that we, we deliver the, the best value we can, and then get out as, as, as quickly as possible so that we don't outstay our welcome. So that's what I mean really by, by concision.
[00:16:37] Next up, a helpful podcast has good show notes, simple show notes, a paragraph or two, like I said, setting up that tension, explaining how the episode sets, uh, um, resolves that tension. And then, Bit of a paragraph, couple of sentences on who the Guest is or a little bit more about the topic that you are talking about, if it's a monologue and then a list of links.
[00:17:02] If it's a, an interview and you've got some takeaways, list those before the links. Uh, and that's fine. That's, that's it because it's gonna be read on a phone and you want those links to be in chronological or chronological order so that the listener can follow along. Now, I'm experimenting at the moment with.
[00:17:21] Something I haven't done for a long time, if ever, it's something that some people do and, and I'm gonna give it a go because I'm I, at the moment, I have the means to be able to do this without taking a huge amount of time, uh, of extra time. But I'm looking at doing a more extended blog post version of the show notes on the.
[00:17:43] And then keeping the show notes as we call them. That, that quick Descript and the links to the handheld version, if you like, of the podcast. That's the one that shows up in the app. The only reason I'm doing that is it's purely an SEO play as, as the kids say, it's purely about helping Google get a better understanding of the content of the podcast episode.
[00:18:04] This comes from, uh, Google's helpful content, um, algorithm. That came out, uh, last year. Um, the idea of this is Google is trying to prioritize good user experience and content that actually answers the question, not just content. That means it's lots of people are linking to it and they're spending a lot of time on there.
[00:18:28] We want people to, Google wants people to feel like yes, uh, or wants to be able to answer those question. . And so it's rewarding the sites that answer those questions, and you can tell that sort of by if the use, if the Googler continues to follow links after they've found a site, that site probably didn't help.
[00:18:52] If they're spent two seconds on the site, it probably didn't help that kind of thing. And so what we're thinking about here is me trying a bit of SEO so that Google can see that there's text on there because it's still not, uh, indexing the, the podcast content that it, and it doesn't really understand the transcript.
[00:19:11] So I want people to spend time on the page sitting there for, you know, five to 10 minutes and I want Google to. Sort of be aware of that and, and maybe marry up the two. So I'm, I'm trying and I'll report back, I'll let you know if it, uh, if it helps. So if you have the means to maybe go a little bit deeper with your show notes on the web, then, then do, by all means.
[00:19:35] But don't present the, the listener with a whole load of text. They actually don't really need it. On the web, uh, especially with, with, um, on, on the phone. Um, in, in a a podcast app, you've got limited stuff anyway. You can only do, uh, paragraphs, the occasional list, uh, some, um, bold or italic text and some links, and that's pretty much it anyway.
[00:20:01] So you're not gonna get that inventive and there's no benefit to having swaths and, and swaths of text there, there just isn't. It actually makes the experience a little bit worse. So couple of paragraphs, list of links, key takeaways, that kind of thing. Um, but make those show notes useful. If you've talked, like I said, many, many times before, if you talk about any proper noun in your episode, link to it.
[00:20:28] Uh, my friend Anya Pearse, uh, and I make a show called the a Z of Happiness. I say, we anda does the work. I sit there and I package you up as an MP3 file. Um, and she's scrupulous and, uh, incredible about her show note collection. Like if there is a noun mentioned , even in passing, she will have a link to it. Uh, and, and that's, uh, you know, with, along with a, a little explanation and, uh, I love it. I really do.
[00:20:55] So we have this, this sort of framework here. We have, or this, this, this definition, a helpful podcaster. A helpful podcast puts the listener first. It answers a central question in each episode. It's clear and concise and has simple show notes and it's forms a body of work.
[00:21:15] So how does all of this benefit you? Because yes, we absolutely wanna make stuff that benefits the listener. That's the whole point. We wanna make helpful stuff. How does this help you? Well, first off, don't underestimate that body of work thing. Again, I know I keep harping on about it, but this is a, this is, this is stuff that is mineable, that is indexable, that's categorizable, that's referable back chewable.
[00:21:40] It's stuff that when you are working with another client, You can say, oh, it's funny you answer, you ask me that question cuz I've got the answer to that. And that's just saved you half an hour in your session. You know, for example, if you, you're a coach, right? Or a, a consultant. You've got an answer to that question.
[00:21:58] You don't have to answer that question. You don't have to go through that same question again on your next Zoom call because you can just say, no worries, I've got an answer to that one. I'll link you to the episode and you can have a listen. And there it is. It's all written up for them. It's already, that kind of stuff is really, really useful because it actually makes your job easier.
[00:22:15] It's marketing, marketing content. It's part of your product as what you do. It's, it's, it's a, it's a double win . That's why I really want you to, to think about this as not just showing up week by week or fortnight by fortnight, but about creating this body of work. Doesn't mean it has to be perfect, but it kind of does mean that it has to help, it has to be helpful.
[00:22:39] Each episode is, is also. It's an invitation to connect with you. It's an invitation for the listener to get in touch to feedback, to disagree, to share their own thoughts. What they took away from this. It doesn't happen all the time, man. It's, you know, it's re it's perhaps more rare for, for when you have a smaller audience, of course, by just the, that's how numbers be, be working, right?
[00:23:05] But is every episode is that opportunity? For you and your listener to build that little, that little relationship and for you to get a little bit closer. It's another excuse for you to reach out to them and say, Hey, do you wanna jump on a Zoom call we've never met before. Do you wanna have 15 minutes and we can have a chat about how I can help you, or what you are struggling with, or whatever.
[00:23:26] It doesn't have to be overtly salesy, but it's a chance for a conversation to happen that maybe wouldn't have have happened other. It's things like pod inbox.com, which will let people record voicemails. You can just ask them to, or encourage them to email you. You know, this is not about joining a mailing list or helping spread the weather or anything.
[00:23:47] It's purely about get in touch, like, what did you think about this? I love that stuff. I'm, I'm a big fan of it. Like I wanna hear what people think, perhaps to a nauseating degree sometimes. It, it also shows that you wanna hear from them, um, and, and get that dialogue going. I think that's, that's useful and important as well.
[00:24:05] It's showing that you actually care about what they think. Again, everything from referring to the listener in the plural, respecting their time. It's all about showing them respect and a little bit of love as well. Which brings us onto building trust. Yes, I, if you're playing the Mark Steadman drinking game, you can take a drink because I'm talking about trust.
[00:24:30] The three sort of pillars, if you like, of trust, positive relationships, expertise, and consistency. Those are the three elements of trust. By doing all the things I've just said by demonstrating the respect for the listener, you are, you are showing, you are demonstrating a, that you are capable of building a positive relationship.
[00:24:50] Every week you get to show up with your, or every fortnight you get to show up with your knowledge as demonstrating your expertise. You get to answer a question or bring on, again, expertise by proxy. Bring on someone who can answer that question. And then, like I said, every week, every fortnight showing up.
[00:25:07] Even when you are busy showing up, even when it's 22 minutes past nine on a Friday, and you just want to go to bed because tomorrow you've got a whole load of other things to do. It's, it's that, that's the , um, purely hypothetically, right? It's that consistency. It's showing up, not just merely showing up, but actually showing up with something and saying, listen, I took the time to do this.
[00:25:33] because it's important to me. It's important to me to be consistent. It's important to me to show up when I said I was gonna show up. And those are the three pillars of trust. So all sounds like a lot of effort. How can this be made a little bit easier? So go back to that central question thing. I think if you actually embrace that as an idea, I do think it makes the process easier. Because you'll come at this in two different ways. You'll either come at this with a whole load of questions and then you can think, who do I know who's gonna be able to answer these questions? And, and of course, you are not precluded from bringing on the same Guest multiple times. If you even wanted to, you could batch two, three episodes with a Guest.
[00:26:20] You know, if they're relatively short, you could batch. Um, A couple of, uh, you know, two, two or three recordings with a Guest. Cuz you don't have to do all the intro and outro with the Guest. You don't have to welcome them each time. Yeah. Maybe you do a quick, a quick thing at the top and a, a quick thank you.
[00:26:40] Take a beat. Grab yourself a drink of water or a bio break and then go and record the next question. And what you've got there is you've got three episodes that you can bank and you can, you can get to on a, a later stage, do that with a few people and now you've got a stew going. Right now you've got lots of of episodes that you can mix and match because you are not thinking so much about, okay, it's a new week, I have to have a new Guest.
[00:27:04] What are they a thought leader in? Instead, it's about going. Here are my list of questions. Who's best to work on these and, and, and to, to solve these? And I wanna make a quick point here that I think, I'm certainly not suggesting that if you don't do this or you ha, if you haven't been doing this, then your episodes are somehow meandering or, uh, or they're not, you know, working on a central point. Absolutely not. What I am suggesting is that it really sharpens the knife. It really focuses things. If you can actually go for a question that is, uh, something that people are actually struggling with, not just, you know, is podcasting good ? Cuz that's, you know, that's, that's too open-ended. Or what is the future of podcasting?
[00:27:54] All right. That's a, that's a great one. Right. What's the future of podcasting? It seems like it's one of those great questions. It's, it's nice and open and there's lots of things we can talk about and explore. No one's like, no. No one's worried about that. Like certainly not the people that I work with. They're not worried about the future of podcasting.
[00:28:13] They might be worried about the future of their podcast and where the people are gonna listen to it, but they're not so much thinking about the future of podcasting or the podcasting. And so while it's a great thing for, for, for a thought leader to do at the beginning of the year and pontificate on and bring on some guests, it's not solving a problem.
[00:28:33] It's, again, it's not, it's, and again I'm saying it's not helpful. I'm not saying that in a negative judgey way. I'm using helpful almost as a capital letter to try and get this idea of something that really the listener can not just benefit from. Cuz even that is a little bit vague. But where we've solved a listener's problem, where we've patched a little hole in their, in their brain or their, or their soul or their, you know, their mind, whatever, we've filled in a hole for them.
[00:29:01] And, and that's the idea here. So either going question first and then thinking about who the guests are that can help solve those questions. Or going the other way, thinking about the guests that you've got and then asking them, sitting down with them. You know, you do this over email, you can have a quick phone call with 'em.
[00:29:20] Um, there's people I work with who will do pre-recording chats if you've got the time, you know, 15 minutes, 20 minutes, just run through a few ideas. If you've never met them before, it's also not a bad idea. Something worth considering as well. Just sit down with them, get that rapport going, but also brainstorm a few different questions.
[00:29:42] And again, it, it could be more than one, but the crucial thing is to record them as, as separate episodes, uh, and, and keep, keep that concision. And when you've done that, what you end up with is this sort of nuggets of information that is per mutable, per mutable that you can change into different formats. Yes, you've got the podcast episode, that's the, the main nucleus, but you've also got, you know, if there are three points to this particular answer, you can post that as a, as a LinkedIn gallery or a bunch of, uh, Instagram images or a tweet thread.
[00:30:20] It's something you could perhaps rewrite as a blog post and post later. there are so many different ways that you can take that. So it makes it, it benefits us. It makes it easier because in many ways we was actually reducing the amount of work we have to do because we don't have to keep reframing it.
[00:30:39] We don't have to keep finding what was the central point in this episode. The amount of times I've edited episodes and they've been really good and really sort of meaty episodes. Some really good stuff in this really good food for thought. But when I come to like, have to write a tweet or a, or a LinkedIn post about them, it's really hard to say, this was a really good discussion and it just felt great.
[00:31:01] And we, we talked about some really interesting meaty topics. That's, that's great. But what was it, you know what I mean? How did it, ah, what, how did it help? And when we start with that central question, It actually makes that a lot easier because, you know, you know what you are selling in that LinkedIn post.
[00:31:23] You know, when you come to tell people about the episode, and this is a story for another day. But I would suggest actually focusing on delivering the answer in the LinkedIn post rather than sort of find the answer, click here and listen to the episode. Don't, don't do that. Um, or avoid it if you can. I think there's, there's a temptation to, to do that, but, You may find in the long run, it's actually better to answer the question in the LinkedIn post.
[00:31:50] And then you can always pop a comment on, or put something at the end to say, listen, we go into greater detail, uh, on this in the episode, in, you know, in our latest episode. That definitely thing you could do. Um, but once you've got that central question, it actually makes the process easier. And again, because we've started right from the beginning, right from that top of who is this for?
[00:32:11] We know exactly who we're gonna be talking to, and that may even help you. When you come to things like LinkedIn, who are you gonna tag to? If you are really at the fairly early stages of your podcast's journey and you are still measuring listeners in the high tens, low hundreds, you might wanna be thinking about those individual episodes, and letting certain people, like tagging them or actually DMing them or WhatsApping them, whatever, and saying, I made this for you. Because when you start with that single person, it might, it becomes much easier to think about the people you know already that are like them, and then it makes things a little bit easier to spread.
[00:32:55] It's that weird thing of if you want stuff to scale, you do the stuff that's not really scalable to begin with. You start with those individual conversations. Having those, those one-to-ones and just saying, I made this thing for you. I had you in mind when I made this. I think you'll appreciate it or you know it it, A couple of months ago you asked me this question and I finally got round to answering it.
[00:33:15] Here it is again. It's so much easier when you've got that avatar in mind.
[00:33:21] So in conclusion then we are putting the listener first. We are creating a central question. We're gonna make our episodes clear and concise, have simple show notes for our episodes. And with all of that, what we're able to do is form a body of work that we. A helpful podcast.
[00:33:51] And with that, I am gonna leave you. Thank you so much for hanging around with me for this episode. I hope you found it helpful or at least gave you, uh, some food for thought. If you wanna have a chat about this or anything else that I've brought up, mark Origin FM is the email address and you'll find links and show notes at podcastownersmanual.com. Chat to you next week.